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  #21   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 05:40 PM
Ed Huntress
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

"Jim Wilson" wrote in message
Ed Huntress wrote...

I see that the latest CNN/Gallup Poll has Kerry ahead of Bush by 53% to


Hey, I've got a question. Does anybody know of a quantitative study on
how accurately the polls predict election day results? Something like,
before election day 2000, the polls said X, and on election day, the
voters said Y. I've never seen something like this.

There are some correlations between polls and results on the Web. But you
have to decide first what you're looking for. If the question is how
accurately do polls taken a month before an election predict the election
results, the answer is, very poorly...because the poll studied opinions a
month before the election, not the morning of election day.

Polls are snapshots that reflect opinions at one instant in time. That's

Ed Huntress

  #22   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 05:43 PM
J. R. Carroll
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
. net...

You won't have to. There is no one farther left than the Kennedy's. g

stuff about Kerry being an extreme lefty is just more bull**** from the
right. They're trying to set up a defense by demonizing Kerry by using the
"L" word. Watch closely: Rove will have a whole list of lies and
misrepresentations cooked up by Super Tuesday, and we'll probably start
seeing "cites" referring to them posted here by you. I think we can count


The thing that's perked up my attention is that it's beginning to look

the old "L"-word trick has lost its steam. It's a 25-year-old trick, and
people are getting sick of it.

Yes Ed, they are. Branding Kerry a liberal won't help Republicans one bit.
Bush has proven himself a liar in the most craven and manipulative sense.
That will be the issue that won't go away. You only need ask the question "
where are the jobs?" or any number of others to grasp the problem Bush
faces. Had Clinton behaved as Bush has on issues more substantial than oral
sex he would certainly have been impeached. People are also tired of the
GOP's revving up of its "Christian" base. They want a President to elect not
a frigging nanny, Deacon or minister. The only thing uglier than the contest
will be the following four years if Bush wins and perhaps enough people
believe this to put an end to it.

John R. Carroll
Machining Solution Software, Inc.
Los Angeles San Francisco

  #23   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 06:03 PM
Ed Huntress
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

"Bray Haven" wrote in message

You forgot a couple:
Currently commander in chief & presided over the most successful military
campaign in history.

And if you weren't impressed with Iraq, wait 'till you see the campaign
against Leichtenstein! g

Ed Huntress

  #24   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 06:31 PM
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

Spehro Pefhany

On Fri, 06 Feb 2004 07:12:46 GMT, the renowned "Ed Huntress"

It ought to be entertaining. One thing I'm seeing out here, which I didn't
expect, is that the animosity toward Bush has moved from a low grumble to a
howl. He'd better get his damage control machine cranked up or he's in big

Ed Huntress

Have you been watching Lou Dobbs' series on CNN? Last night he
featured the pres (Tillman?) of a small mold shop that has just laid
off a bunch of tool and die makers.

He also had a piece that heavily criticized Corning for investing
$600M in Asia to supply glass to LCD panel makers over there (a huge
market and the customers and competitors are ONLY in Taiwan, China,
Japan and S. Korea). They want that Asahi Glass should get the
business instead of a sucessful American company? I'm sure that if all
the LCD makers were in the US they'd be more likely to keep it at
home, but there are ZERO, NADA, not even a kit assembly operation.
Heck, even RCA is foreign owned these days (French). There is going to
be more of this as multinationals move parts of their operations and
investment closer to customers and rapidly growing markets in Asia.

The whole left wing/populist/protectionist appeal of his series seems
quite unfair to Bush and to big business (his corporate blacklist,
especially) as the information is often provided in a misleading
manner, but I can see that it could hurt Bush in November.

The blacklist:


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

What................ walmart didnt make the list

  #25   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 07:06 PM
Spehro Pefhany
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

On Fri, 06 Feb 2004 12:31:18 -0500, the renowned john

What................ walmart didnt make the list

ROTFL, sort of I guess they are *providing* jobs (of a sort). Just
shows you how shallow the analysis really is, as Ed said.

Here's what Bloomberg has to say today on the jobs report, +112,000,
which is short of what is required to keep up with population growth:

"Manufacturers cut 11,000 jobs last month, the 42nd straight decline
since August 2000".

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers:
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers:

  #26   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 07:24 PM
Artemia Salina
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

On Fri, 06 Feb 2004 16:14:54 +0000, Ed Huntress wrote:

When the Internet first made so many news sources available to everyone, I
was hopeful, like many people, that the result would be a much
better-informed populace. I've lost faith in that idea. What it's done,
rather than inform, is to allow polarized partisanship to flower. People
like you select your news on the basis of whether it says something you
like. You're a perfect example. You rarely make any attempt to check it, or
even to discriminate among sources. You can't possibly *know* the quality of
so many sources. But you can pile up an endless mountain of "cites," many of
which are just feeding off of each other's b.s., and then challenge someone
to refute them.

That's a prescription for ignorance. You may recall that I took the time to
check one of your "cites" less than a year ago, and found that all of the
first three "key facts" the piece reported were bogus. Nobody can do that
with all of your sources; no one would even want to try. I just assume that
all of your links are bull****, and it's likely that I'm more than half
right, on the basis of what I have been able to check.

Well put, Ed. On the other hand though, as long as people like Gunner bring
these wild stories into forums (and I still don't consider this forum to be
an appropriate one) where they CAN be refuted then the truth will out,
eventually, at least with respect to the sources that Gunner quotes and his
'tactics' in general. Prior to the Internet it was impossible for the average
person to refute such wild tales to a wide audience. Some people criticize
the Internet for allowing such organizations as the KKK and the neo-nazis
a medium to broadcast their views, but I'm one who is happy to see such
wackos on the net. I figure that most people are smart enough to spot
a kook when they see one, and the spewings of such groups only strengthen
people's opinions against them.

The irony is that the kind of bashing that Gunner and others so energetically
re-post here doesn't make converts of anyone. I've never met a single person
who has voted differently because of what he or she heard on conservative talk
radio or it's print equivalent, the New York Post. And I know some pretty dumb
people! In fact I sometimes wonder whether conservative talk radio is promoted
by the liberal-controlled media in order to discredit conservatives by making
them look like a bunch of gossipy paranoid loons. :-)

The kind of bashing that Gunner and his ilk engage in seems only to strengthen
the beliefs of those who ALREADY believe what they believe. I really have to
wonder why they feel so compelled to do so.

"Please God, help me cleanse the computer of viruses and evil photographs
that disturb and ruin my work ..., so that I shall be able to cleanse
myself." -- Rabbi Shlomo Eliahu

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  #27   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 08:34 PM
jim rozen
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

In article , Gunner says...


Well at least he's not a draft dodger.


please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com

  #28   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 08:49 PM
jim rozen
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

In article , Spehro Pefhany Spehro
Pefhany says...

Heck, even RCA is foreign owned these days (French).

This is especially interesting when one understands
the birth of RCA as a corporation. They were originally
american marconi, and were going to be growing substantially.

The US government stepped in and asked a number of US
companies to take it over and prevent foreign ownership
of such a vital business asset. They were especially
concerned about foreign ownership of the transatlantic
alternator stations on long island. At the time those
were owned by marconi and were the only reliable
communications between US and europe.


please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com

  #29   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 08:50 PM
jim rozen
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

In article , Bray Haven says...

And then he came home & trashed his country and his fellow soldiers

At least he didn't cut veterans benefits, try to close all
the VA hospitals, and cut combat pay for troops overseas.


please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com

  #30   Report Post  
Old February 6th 04, 09:18 PM
Glenn Ashmore
Posts: n/a
Default OT-I ain't No senator's son...

Bray Haven wrote:

Glen Ashmore saysKerry and I were

eating mud in Nam,.........

And then he came home & trashed his country and his fellow soldiers over there
"eating mud" and gave great comfort and inspiration to those who were killing
our troops. Then he proceeded to do everything he could to destroy his
country's millitary & intelligence capability as a senator (job he got with his
wifes money & position). Fortunately he was as inept at legislation as he is
at telling the truth. We would be in much worse trouble with terrorists than
we are now.
BTW, I was one of those over there (1st Lt too) and got a bronze star as well.
But I'm ashamed of Kerry and my service never entitled me to anything in life.
I'm hope he will now be exposed for what he is. I respect your opinion, but we
need a little "fair & balanced" here Glenn )
Greg Sefton

And you are saying that Gunner's original post was "fair and Balanced"?
I am just trying to balance it out a little. If he can sandbag one side
of the scale I can put a finger on the other. :-)

I came home with the same opinion that Kerry did. A whole bunch of us
did. I just didn't have the guts to express it publicly and didn't like
most of the people who did but I would if anybody asked. I think it is
not just a right but a responsibility for citizens to speak up when they
see something being done wrong by the government. Even McNamara now
admits that the war was a mistake. Are we to punish Kerry now for being
right while honoring a man who partied his way through his National
Guard deferment?
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at:
Shameless Commercial Division:

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