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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#281
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 03:22:05 GMT, "Ed Huntress"
wrote: "Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:06:52 -0500, Nick Hull wrote: In article , Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Cliff.. have you figured out how a bowl can have a 10 inch diameter and a 30 inch circumference yet? Is it impossible? 1 Kings chapter 7 verse 23 (Authorised Version): "... and he made a molten sea, ten cubits from one brim to the other : it was round about ... and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about." That's where the nonsense came from. Ed Huntress Ed.. the nonsense isn't in this description from a Jewish History. Book... the nonsense is that some (Cliff for one) have said that this verse and a chapter in another book with a few more details.. state the PI equals 3.00 because a round bowl, etc cannot be made with an outside diameter of 10 units and have an outside circumference of 30 units... Well.. I have a bowl that has an OD of 10 inches and an outside circumference of 30 inches.... And I was hoping Cliff would enlighten us as to how this is possible.. or just state that it is not possible.. I mean he does have a degree in physics, etc..and shouldn't this be child's play to him? Thanks for the reference though. and the extra info on the Clinton quote.. Ed, What do you think about the implications from "peak oil" production? Later, Mike |
#282
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 04:24:27 GMT, BottleBob
wrote: Lewis Hartswick wrote: Nick Hull wrote: In article , Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Cliff.. have you figured out how a bowl can have a 10 inch diameter and a 30 inch circumference yet? Is it impossible? Not if you measure ID diameter and OD circumference Woops Nick. Check that again. :-) ...lew... Lewis: Nick had the right idea but inverted the OD/ID. If you had a bowl with a wall thickness of something like .2255 "cubits" you could check the diameter across the OD and get 10 "cubits". 10 "cubits" minus .451 "cubits" (2 walls) = 9.549 "cubits". 9.549 "cubits" X pi = 29.999 "cubits" on the ID of the bowl. -- BottleBob http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob Bob, lets keep it simple.. 10 units OD and 30 units OD Circumference.. no tricks.. and PI does not equal 3.0 Later, Mike |
#283
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Bob, lets keep it simple.. 10 units OD and 30 units OD Circumference.. no tricks.. and PI does not equal 3.0 Mike: Well, since pottery in ancient times wasn't turned on a lathe I suppose their bowls were not perfect circles but more elliptical. So measuring across the short axis could get you your 10 cubits while measuring the total circumference which includes more material of the long axis might get you to pi. -- BottleBob http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob |
#284
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
BottleBob wrote: Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Bob, lets keep it simple.. 10 units OD and 30 units OD Circumference.. no tricks.. and PI does not equal 3.0 Mike: Well, since pottery in ancient times wasn't turned on a lathe I suppose their bowls were not perfect circles but more elliptical. So measuring across the short axis could get you your 10 cubits while measuring the total circumference which includes more material of the long axis might get you to pi. Did I get the backwards? Sorry, I was already in bed and just got up to get a glass of milk, and couldn't resist stopping by the computer. I should have stayed in bed. g -- BottleBob http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob |
#285
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 05:12:48 GMT, BottleBob
wrote: Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Bob, lets keep it simple.. 10 units OD and 30 units OD Circumference.. no tricks.. and PI does not equal 3.0 Mike: Well, since pottery in ancient times wasn't turned on a lathe I suppose their bowls were not perfect circles but more elliptical. So measuring across the short axis could get you your 10 cubits while measuring the total circumference which includes more material of the long axis might get you to pi. -- BottleBob http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob Bob.. That is a creative explanation.... but we don't need to do that.. you can assume the pot is pretty round.. lets say to .001, LOL.. just for precision's sake.. I know you can figure it out Bob... Working on very large parts makes it easier to visualize for some reason too Bowl, 10 inch outside diameter and 30 inch outside circumference.... and to be consistent.. 5 units deep... 5 inches.. A litlte big for Ruby.. Later, Mike |
#286
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 05:20:37 GMT, BottleBob
wrote: BottleBob wrote: Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Bob, lets keep it simple.. 10 units OD and 30 units OD Circumference.. no tricks.. and PI does not equal 3.0 Mike: Well, since pottery in ancient times wasn't turned on a lathe I suppose their bowls were not perfect circles but more elliptical. So measuring across the short axis could get you your 10 cubits while measuring the total circumference which includes more material of the long axis might get you to pi. Did I get the backwards? Sorry, I was already in bed and just got up to get a glass of milk, and couldn't resist stopping by the computer. I should have stayed in bed. g -- BottleBob http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob I got the point... Mike |
#287
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
"Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message
... On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 03:22:05 GMT, "Ed Huntress" wrote: "Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:06:52 -0500, Nick Hull wrote: In article , Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Cliff.. have you figured out how a bowl can have a 10 inch diameter and a 30 inch circumference yet? Is it impossible? 1 Kings chapter 7 verse 23 (Authorised Version): "... and he made a molten sea, ten cubits from one brim to the other : it was round about ... and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about." That's where the nonsense came from. Ed Huntress Ed.. the nonsense isn't in this description from a Jewish History. Book... the nonsense is that some (Cliff for one) have said that this verse and a chapter in another book with a few more details.. state the PI equals 3.00 because a round bowl, etc cannot be made with an outside diameter of 10 units and have an outside circumference of 30 units... Well.. I have a bowl that has an OD of 10 inches and an outside circumference of 30 inches.... And I was hoping Cliff would enlighten us as to how this is possible.. or just state that it is not possible.. I mean he does have a degree in physics, etc..and shouldn't this be child's play to him? I have no idea where this has gone because I don't read these threads, Mike. But I remember that it started out with an argument over a Biblical reference and I saw that it had gone on intermidably, so I thought I'd interject the reference and help get it over with. g Math historians attribute this error to rounding, and/or to the common and rough approximations that were in use in ancient times. There were much more accurate numbers for pi. The Egyptians and the Babylonians hit it pretty close. So did the Greeks, after they got over their distaste for actually measuring things to find out what they were talking about. Anyway, it seems that this has nothing to do with facts, so I'll pass by to let you guys argue about whatever it is you're arguing about. g Thanks for the reference though. and the extra info on the Clinton quote.. Ed, What do you think about the implications from "peak oil" production? The implications are the end of civilization as we know it. Whether the Peak Oil people are drawing correct implications from the facts is a question I know nothing about. I remember getting worried when the Club of Rome told us we were running dry. I won't get worried again until Republicans tell us we should worry. If they start to show signs of nervousness about it, then it will be time to buy a woodstove and a good bicycle, because it will mean it's already too late to do anything about it. Ed Huntress |
#288
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Clark is correct
Clark Magnuson wrote:
How did someone interested in metalworking turn into a liberal troll? I've got a better question: How did a middle eastern imaginary friend following cult member, turn into a fundie conservative troll? A society that teaches evolution as fact will breed a generation of atheists that will destroy the society. It is Darwinian. A society that teaches the endless lies, bigotry & oppression of middle eastern christian superstitions as fact will breed another generation of murdering fundamentalist terrorist jackals that will destroy the society. It is Talibanian. Gary & Harvey (the one & only "TRUE" GOD) |
#289
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Clark is correct
"strabo" wrote in message
... s Your posts in this thread imply that those who graduate from HS today are brighter and better educated than in 1965. I don't know if they're brighter; I doubt if there's any difference. As for "better educated," they have a better curriculum and better specific content. Compared to the history books my son is using, for example, the ones we used back in '65 were the Classic Comics version. While no one here knows the academic achievements of your kid, he is apparently not representative of the general population of high schoolers. The typical college graduate today knows less of the basics than did the typical high school graduate of 1965. I seriously doubt that, strabo. What's the basis of that assertion? -- Ed Huntress (remove "3" from email address for email reply) |
#290
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Bob.. That is a creative explanation.... but we don't need to do that.. you can assume the pot is pretty round.. lets say to .001, LOL.. just for precision's sake.. I know you can figure it out Bob... Working on very large parts makes it easier to visualize for some reason too Bowl, 10 inch outside diameter and 30 inch outside circumference.... and to be consistent.. 5 units deep... 5 inches.. Mike: Well, let's try this. A lot of bowls have a flared lip or bead at the top edge. So if the diameter of the bowl was measured at the outside of the "bead" and the circumference was measured below the "bead" (the "cubit" string might have kept slipping off the "bead" and the measurer just got lazy since he didn't have have 3 slaves to hold the "cubit" string on the bead), then you might very well get a 10 cubits dia. with a 30 cubits circumference. (remember one side of the bead only needs to be something a little over a quarter inch larger than the main part of a 10" bowl to come up with those measurements). -- BottleBob http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob |
#291
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
Way I heard it was those who cant teach teach teachers.
From my wife who has a M Ed. :-) ...lew... Or write ). Greg Sefton (former writer) |
#292
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
Ed Huntress wrote:
I won't get worried again until Republicans tell us we should worry. If they start to show signs of nervousness about it, then it will be time to buy a woodstove and a good bicycle, because it will mean it's already too late to do anything about it. Invest early in methane hydrate mining. Discover magazine has a rather interesting article on the subject. The oceanic reserves of the stuff dwarf oil reserves. And it's interesting stuff. Nothing quite like a picture of a chunk of ice burning... Jon |
#293
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
In article , Malcolm
Kirkpatrick says... MK. Someone determines which institution shall receive the taxpayers' K-12 education subsidy. The legislature commits the funds. Yes, taxpayers subsidize children with the K-12 subsidy. Politically the issue between school vouchers and the NEA/AFT/AFSCME cartel is whether students, parents, real classroom teachers, and taxpayers, who would all benefit from school vouchers, weigh more, in your legislator's mind, than the public sector unions. OK then, what do you do with the kids who spend their subsidy and then run of voucher money half way through the year? And, how do you handle the entanglement that vouchers are going to cause between state funding and religious schools? Who's driving this thing now, the state or the diocese? Jim ================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================== |
#294
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On 15 Feb 2004 15:15:29 -0800, jim rozen
wrote: Example: the school my daughter was attending was private, and had no facilities that were ADA compliant. They didn't have to. But in the new voucher scheme, there *is* no public school, because it's been run out of town on a rail for being so terrible. So now kids are going to be knocking on the door of private schools, demanding to be let in. But some of them are in wheelchairs, etc. "Hey, this voucher says I can come here. You better make the classrooms ADA compliant." What do they say, 'nope' - the voucher is no good here? A voucher doesn't give you the right to attend any school. Only the ability to pay for it if they accept you. Just like a college. What makes you think that the new breed of schools are going to be any different (better) than the ones we have now? Sounds to me like the same problems are going to keep on cropping up. Why not fix the problem where it is now, rather than making new ones? The difference will be competition. Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get. So please respond to this message through the newsgroup. |
#295
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
In article , John Flanagan says...
A voucher doesn't give you the right to attend any school. Only the ability to pay for it if they accept you. Just like a college. OK, we're going to ignore the voucher proponents who say that public school are so awful that instituting vouchers will mean their certain demise - because then your comment above would be quite *un*true - all vouchered kids have to attend somewhere, so the vouchers really would be an instant in at any school in that case. But agreeing for a moment that public schools will still exist after "V" day, it's apparent that the brighter kids will abandon them instantly and leave only the problem kids behind: the kids who cost more to educate. How does a voucher plan ensure that the left-behinds will still get a decent education? Jim ================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================== |
#296
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
jim rozen wrote:...
MK. Discussion deleted... ...what do you do with the kids who spend their subsidy and then run of voucher money half way through the year? MK. There are a couple of ways to accommodate this objection: 1) the State can pay tuition on a month-by-month basis (and in most school voucher plans, the State pays the tuition subsidy to a school, not to parents), or the State could require that school districts --hire parents--, on personal service contracts to provide for their children's education. Make payment contingent on performance at or above age-level expectations on standardized tests of reading and math. Make payment equal to some fraction 1/2 a/b 1 of the district's per-pupil cost. Test at the end of the school year. I agree that this limits the options of really por parents, but it probides performance and financial accountability, and gives parents a wide range of options. They can homeschool, hire tutors, or send kids to a private of parchial school. And, how do you handle the entanglement that vouchers are going to cause between state funding and religious schools? MK. I don't worry much about them. Just bar schools which advocate criminal activity. Most parents will want their children to grow into responsibility. ...Who's driving this thing now, the state or the diocese? MK. Motivation? There's probably a wide variety. Take care. Homeschool if you can. |
#297
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
You could have monthly or quarterly payments, so that shouldn't be a
big deal. And if the parents get the vouchers whether they send the kids to private school or home school,......... Well I would say that religious schools are private schools. The kids would just have to meet the same standards for what they learn as any other private school ( and public school for that matter ). Math at a Catholic School is pretty much the same as math at a home school. Dan jim rozen wrote in message OK then, what do you do with the kids who spend their subsidy and then run of voucher money half way through the year? And, how do you handle the entanglement that vouchers are going to cause between state funding and religious schools? Who's driving this thing now, the state or the diocese? Jim ================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================== |
#298
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
Good point, Jim.
My objection to the vouchers is that they are easy to manipulate to create an even greater difference in class from those who have cash and those who live paycheck to paycheck. Don't want "those" kind of people in your school? Charge a cost equal to the voucher plus a certain dollar amount and almost all can be kept out. One rule I would impose on vouchers...If you accept them (assuming the voucher is the same amount the public school would get), you accept them as full payment. The goal is get people who can do it MORE efficiently and better, not more costly and exclusive than public schools. Koz jim rozen wrote: In article , John Flanagan says... A voucher doesn't give you the right to attend any school. Only the ability to pay for it if they accept you. Just like a college. OK, we're going to ignore the voucher proponents who say that public school are so awful that instituting vouchers will mean their certain demise - because then your comment above would be quite *un*true - all vouchered kids have to attend somewhere, so the vouchers really would be an instant in at any school in that case. But agreeing for a moment that public schools will still exist after "V" day, it's apparent that the brighter kids will abandon them instantly and leave only the problem kids behind: the kids who cost more to educate. How does a voucher plan ensure that the left-behinds will still get a decent education? Jim ================================================= = please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================= = |
#299
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 04:56:31 GMT, Santa Cruz Mike
wrote: - Ed.. the nonsense isn't in this description from a Jewish History. Book... the nonsense is that some (Cliff for one) have said that this verse and a chapter in another book with a few more details.. state the PI equals 3.00 because a round bowl, etc cannot be made with an outside diameter of 10 units and have an outside circumference of 30 units... Well.. I have a bowl that has an OD of 10 inches and an outside circumference of 30 inches.... And I was hoping Cliff would enlighten us as to how this is possible.. or just state that it is not possible.. I mean he does have a degree in physics, etc..and shouldn't this be child's play to him? Just out of curiosity, You have given the major diameter of the ellipse. What is the minor diameter? Mark Rand RTFM |
#300
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
Guys, think outside of the box. They had rubber yardsticks in those days.
Stretch it to measure bowl diameter, and relax it to measure circumference.. Besides which Microsoft Excel will round pi down to 3 when number of digits of the decimal point are set to zero. Mike Eberlein Mark Rand wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 04:56:31 GMT, Santa Cruz Mike wrote: - Ed.. the nonsense isn't in this description from a Jewish History. Book... the nonsense is that some (Cliff for one) have said that this verse and a chapter in another book with a few more details.. state the PI equals 3.00 because a round bowl, etc cannot be made with an outside diameter of 10 units and have an outside circumference of 30 units... Well.. I have a bowl that has an OD of 10 inches and an outside circumference of 30 inches.... And I was hoping Cliff would enlighten us as to how this is possible.. or just state that it is not possible.. I mean he does have a degree in physics, etc..and shouldn't this be child's play to him? Just out of curiosity, You have given the major diameter of the ellipse. What is the minor diameter? Mark Rand RTFM |
#301
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
In article , Koz says...
One rule I would impose on vouchers...If you accept them (assuming the voucher is the same amount the public school would get), you accept them as full payment. The goal is get people who can do it MORE efficiently and better, not more costly and exclusive than public schools. This would make sense to me. I think one reason why private schools invariably are run at a lower cost than public schools is their ability to operate outside an entire subset of regulations that public schools are required to obey. The ADA thing that I mentioned before, for example. Private schools have one thing that public schools would *love* to be able to boast about, but cannot: the ability to say "no" to some students. One single kid can cause enormous amounts of hassle and disruption in a classroom by misbehaving. I saw that happen in my daugher's school for two or three years running. Then that kid was told "don't come back, we've tried everything." What a difference. Public schools can't do that. That's one more reason they cost more to run. They *have* to take everyone. Jim ================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================== |
#302
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
In article , Malcolm
Kirkpatrick says... ...what do you do with the kids who spend their subsidy and then run of voucher money half way through the year? MK. There are a couple of ways to accommodate this objection: 1) the State can pay tuition on a month-by-month basis (and in most school voucher plans, the State pays the tuition subsidy to a school, not to parents), I think what I was getting at is the idea that the vouchers are not going to cover the full freight at most private schools, so the parents are going to have to handle the remainder. It would be nice if the state simply handed over an 'equal slice' payment (which probably *would* cover most of the tuition in a private school, at least until the exodust of from public schools drove up the price...) but for a variety of reasons that's probably never going to happen. So the question is, once a kid takes a voucher, but the parents can no longer contribute their sha Do You Require the Public School to Take the Kid Back?? And, how do you handle the entanglement that vouchers are going to cause between state funding and religious schools? MK. I don't worry much about them. That's like saying, "I don't care about a teeny little tornado!" Sure *you* don't care but that little thing like the bill of rights *does* care! What are the private schools going to do when the state starts demanding that catholic schools recognize jewish holidays, or that they ban religious displays? State money being funnelled into parochial schools is the first step towards a huge first amendment collision. That collision *will* happen in the courts when vouchers are first tried. It is also one of the biggest reasons why vouchers will be avoided for quite some time to come. Jim ================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================== |
#303
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Clark is correct
"Ed Huntress" wrote in message . net... "strabo" wrote in message ... s Your posts in this thread imply that those who graduate from HS today are brighter and better educated than in 1965. I don't know if they're brighter; I doubt if there's any difference. As for "better educated," they have a better curriculum and better specific content. Compared to the history books my son is using, for example, the ones we used back in '65 were the Classic Comics version. While no one here knows the academic achievements of your kid, he is apparently not representative of the general population of high schoolers. The typical college graduate today knows less of the basics than did the typical high school graduate of 1965. I seriously doubt that, strabo. What's the basis of that assertion? -- Ed Huntress (remove "3" from email address for email reply) I suspect that kids today seem less smart simply because as WE get older our accumulated knowledge that we compare to has gotten much greater. "Kid, I've already forgotten more that you know! That's too bad, because it means I've really forgotten a lot!" The older I get the better I used to be. Gary H. Lucas |
#304
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Clark is correct
"Gary H. Lucas" wrote in message
news "Ed Huntress" wrote in message . net... "strabo" wrote in message ... s Your posts in this thread imply that those who graduate from HS today are brighter and better educated than in 1965. I don't know if they're brighter; I doubt if there's any difference. As for "better educated," they have a better curriculum and better specific content. Compared to the history books my son is using, for example, the ones we used back in '65 were the Classic Comics version. While no one here knows the academic achievements of your kid, he is apparently not representative of the general population of high schoolers. The typical college graduate today knows less of the basics than did the typical high school graduate of 1965. I seriously doubt that, strabo. What's the basis of that assertion? -- Ed Huntress (remove "3" from email address for email reply) I suspect that kids today seem less smart simply because as WE get older our accumulated knowledge that we compare to has gotten much greater. "Kid, I've already forgotten more that you know! That's too bad, because it means I've really forgotten a lot!" The older I get the better I used to be. Gary H. Lucas Haha! Yes, I wonder sometimes how we could have been so smart, and today's kids so dumb, when I read things like the contents of strabo's post. g It's also true that the education in other countries has gotten better a lot faster than ours has. That's the pinch we feel about our education system, which certainly needs a lot of improvement. But it's simply not true that kids are not as smart. For example, the decline in SAT scores that have been reported off and on over the last few decades have been accompanied by a higher *percentage* of kids actually taking the SAT. More kids who are down the line academically take the test. It used to be mostly the top kids who even took it. They don't often mention that. Ed Huntress |
#305
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:26:02 GMT, "Ed Huntress"
wrote: "Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 03:22:05 GMT, "Ed Huntress" wrote: "Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:06:52 -0500, Nick Hull wrote: In article , Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Cliff.. have you figured out how a bowl can have a 10 inch diameter and a 30 inch circumference yet? Is it impossible? 1 Kings chapter 7 verse 23 (Authorised Version): "... and he made a molten sea, ten cubits from one brim to the other : it was round about ... and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about." That's where the nonsense came from. Ed Huntress Ed.. the nonsense isn't in this description from a Jewish History. Book... the nonsense is that some (Cliff for one) have said that this verse and a chapter in another book with a few more details.. state the PI equals 3.00 because a round bowl, etc cannot be made with an outside diameter of 10 units and have an outside circumference of 30 units... Well.. I have a bowl that has an OD of 10 inches and an outside circumference of 30 inches.... And I was hoping Cliff would enlighten us as to how this is possible.. or just state that it is not possible.. I mean he does have a degree in physics, etc..and shouldn't this be child's play to him? I have no idea where this has gone because I don't read these threads, Mike. But I remember that it started out with an argument over a Biblical reference and I saw that it had gone on intermidably, so I thought I'd interject the reference and help get it over with. g Math historians attribute this error to rounding, and/or to the common and rough approximations that were in use in ancient times. There were much more accurate numbers for pi. The Egyptians and the Babylonians hit it pretty close. So did the Greeks, after they got over their distaste for actually measuring things to find out what they were talking about. Anyway, it seems that this has nothing to do with facts, so I'll pass by to let you guys argue about whatever it is you're arguing about. g LOL... Ed.. I don't know why there is even an issue about the math on the is subject.. but Cliff kept bringing it up... .. I can only assume that the people confused about the dimensions have never built or worked on large projects... that is why I built the bowl.. I wanted to see if it was possible to build a bowl with an outside diameter of 10 inches.. and an outside circumference of 30 inches.. and it was.. only accurate to .010 inch.. I was in a big hurry... the point is.. the numbers are not inaccurate.. but there is this big fuss and confusion as though the Jewish writers were trying to claim that PI equals 3.00 , of course they never made such a claim... Well.. anyway Ruby has a big bowl now.. she doesn't understand why it looks so empty with her daily ration... Later, Mike |
#306
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
"Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message
... Anyway, it seems that this has nothing to do with facts, so I'll pass by to let you guys argue about whatever it is you're arguing about. g LOL... Ed.. I don't know why there is even an issue about the math on the is subject.. but Cliff kept bringing it up... .. I can only assume that the people confused about the dimensions have never built or worked on large projects... that is why I built the bowl.. I wanted to see if it was possible to build a bowl with an outside diameter of 10 inches.. and an outside circumference of 30 inches.. and it was.. only accurate to .010 inch.. I was in a big hurry... the point is.. the numbers are not inaccurate.. but there is this big fuss and confusion as though the Jewish writers were trying to claim that PI equals 3.00 , of course they never made such a claim... Well.. anyway Ruby has a big bowl now.. she doesn't understand why it looks so empty with her daily ration... Maybe it leaks? g Ed Huntress |
#307
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:19:32 GMT, BottleBob
wrote: Santa Cruz Mike wrote: Bob.. That is a creative explanation.... but we don't need to do that.. you can assume the pot is pretty round.. lets say to .001, LOL.. just for precision's sake.. I know you can figure it out Bob... Working on very large parts makes it easier to visualize for some reason too Bowl, 10 inch outside diameter and 30 inch outside circumference.... and to be consistent.. 5 units deep... 5 inches.. Mike: Well, let's try this. A lot of bowls have a flared lip or bead at the top edge. So if the diameter of the bowl was measured at the outside of the "bead" and the circumference was measured below the "bead" (the "cubit" string might have kept slipping off the "bead" and the measurer just got lazy since he didn't have have 3 slaves to hold the "cubit" string on the bead), then you might very well get a 10 cubits dia. with a 30 cubits circumference. (remember one side of the bead only needs to be something a little over a quarter inch larger than the main part of a 10" bowl to come up with those measurements). -- BottleBob http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob Bob.. now you are getting creative... and closer... Mike |
#308
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Clark is correct
Gary H. Lucas wrote:
"Ed Huntress" wrote in message . net... "strabo" wrote in message . .. s Your posts in this thread imply that those who graduate from HS today are brighter and better educated than in 1965. I don't know if they're brighter; I doubt if there's any difference. As for "better educated," they have a better curriculum and better specific content. Compared to the history books my son is using, for example, the ones we used back in '65 were the Classic Comics version. While no one here knows the academic achievements of your kid, he is apparently not representative of the general population of high schoolers. The typical college graduate today knows less of the basics than did the typical high school graduate of 1965. I seriously doubt that, strabo. What's the basis of that assertion? -- Ed Huntress (remove "3" from email address for email reply) I suspect that kids today seem less smart simply because as WE get older our accumulated knowledge that we compare to has gotten much greater. "Kid, I've already forgotten more that you know! That's too bad, because it means I've really forgotten a lot!" The older I get the better I used to be. I've had the opportunity to hire several high school kids as materials handlers and engineering aids/interns. I've been very impressed with their abilities. The engineering intern has been very fast and sharp. The materials handlers are more accurate than most of the adults we've used. My 17 year old daughter comes and gets me every night to watch Jeopardy and she holds her own against her old man. I have nothing bad to say about this generation of kids. |
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:44:08 +0000, Mark Rand
wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 04:56:31 GMT, Santa Cruz Mike wrote: - Ed.. the nonsense isn't in this description from a Jewish History. Book... the nonsense is that some (Cliff for one) have said that this verse and a chapter in another book with a few more details.. state the PI equals 3.00 because a round bowl, etc cannot be made with an outside diameter of 10 units and have an outside circumference of 30 units... Well.. I have a bowl that has an OD of 10 inches and an outside circumference of 30 inches.... And I was hoping Cliff would enlighten us as to how this is possible.. or just state that it is not possible.. I mean he does have a degree in physics, etc..and shouldn't this be child's play to him? Just out of curiosity, You have given the major diameter of the ellipse. What is the minor diameter? Mark Rand RTFM Try again mark.. it is round to .001.. no ellips.. how do you spell that.. Later, MIke Cliff's Homework for this year: Cliff's bowl has a 10 unit/inch outside diameter and a 30 unit/inch outer circumference and a 5 unit/inch depth. The diameters have a .005 inch tolerance. And no Virginia PI does not equal 3.00000. So how does Cliff make this bowl? |
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 18:52:27 -0600, mikee wrote:
Guys, think outside of the box. They had rubber yardsticks in those days. Stretch it to measure bowl diameter, and relax it to measure circumference.. Besides which Microsoft Excel will round pi down to 3 when number of digits of the decimal point are set to zero. Mike Eberlein Mike.. good try.. but we have a real problem... that needs to be solved today.. Mike Cliff's Homework for this year: Cliff's bowl has a 10 unit/inch outside diameter and a 30 unit/inch outer circumference and a 5 unit/inch depth. The diameters have a .005 inch tolerance. And no Virginia PI does not equal 3.00000. So how does Cliff make this bowl? |
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:25:01 GMT, "Ed Huntress"
wrote: "Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message .. . Anyway, it seems that this has nothing to do with facts, so I'll pass by to let you guys argue about whatever it is you're arguing about. g LOL... Ed.. I don't know why there is even an issue about the math on the is subject.. but Cliff kept bringing it up... .. I can only assume that the people confused about the dimensions have never built or worked on large projects... that is why I built the bowl.. I wanted to see if it was possible to build a bowl with an outside diameter of 10 inches.. and an outside circumference of 30 inches.. and it was.. only accurate to .010 inch.. I was in a big hurry... the point is.. the numbers are not inaccurate.. but there is this big fuss and confusion as though the Jewish writers were trying to claim that PI equals 3.00 , of course they never made such a claim... Well.. anyway Ruby has a big bowl now.. she doesn't understand why it looks so empty with her daily ration... Maybe it leaks? g Ed Huntress ROFLMAO... Cliff's Homework for this year: Cliff's bowl has a 10 unit/inch outside diameter and a 30 unit/inch outer circumference and a 5 unit/inch depth. The diameters have a .005 inch tolerance. And no Virginia PI does not equal 3.00000. So how does Cliff make this bowl? |
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Clark is correct
Ed Huntress wrote:
"strabo" wrote in message ... The typical college graduate today knows less of the basics than did the typical high school graduate of 1965. I seriously doubt that, strabo. What's the basis of that assertion? Something he read in the bathroom, probably. Sure sounds like something he pulled out of his ass, at any rate. |
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
Santa Cruz Mike wrote:
LOL... Ed.. I don't know why there is even an issue about the math on the is subject.. but Cliff kept bringing it up... .. I can only Poor lil souperstitious Fundie Cruz Mike. After all these many weeks you're still stuck half way through your souperstitious fundie meltdown. Got foorp? Wanna start a bunch more empty fundie meltdown threads? LOL... Poor lil souperstition boy... Fundie Cruz Mike's Homework for this year: TRY to realize that your manipulative ignorant middle eastern christian control freak souperstitions are not "TRUE"... Gary & Harvey (the one & only "TRUE" GOD) |
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
"Santa Cruz Mike" wrote in message
... Cliff's Homework for this year: Cliff's bowl has a 10 unit/inch outside diameter and a 30 unit/inch outer circumference and a 5 unit/inch depth. The diameters have a .005 inch tolerance. And no Virginia PI does not equal 3.00000. So how does Cliff make this bowl? Hmm. Does this have something to do with curved space and the velocity of light? If so, then making the bowl is something you have to do while traveling very fast... Ed Huntress |
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Cliff's Magic Bowl -10 inch OD 30 inch OD Circumference
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:26:02 GMT, "Ed Huntress" wrote:
Ed, What do you think about the implications from "peak oil" production? The implications are the end of civilization as we know it. Whether the Peak Oil people are drawing correct implications from the facts is a question I know nothing about. For those wondering what "Peak Oil" is all about: http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/ You can look at it as yet another doomsday site, but it does raise (and answer) some pretty sobering questions. -- - JN - |
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On 17 Feb 2004 17:32:17 -0800, jim rozen wrote:
Private schools have one thing that public schools would *love* to be able to boast about, but cannot: the ability to say "no" to some students. One single kid can cause enormous amounts of hassle and disruption in a classroom by misbehaving. I saw that happen in my daugher's school for two or three years running. Then that kid was told "don't come back, we've tried everything." What a difference. Public schools can't do that. That's one more reason they cost more to run. They *have* to take everyone. They don't have to keep them in the same classes, though. The school system in this county has an "alternative" school for disruptive students. When the state shut down the infamous "rock quarry" state prison in our county, the school system took it over and turned it into the alternative school. Many of the same staff were retained. It isn't the same place it used to be, but it is still intimidating. Kids don't like being there, and tend to clean up their acts pretty quickly in order to get back to their "regular" school. Those who won't at least aren't disrupting classes at the regular school anymore (and are probably getting good training for their likely futures). Gary |
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On 17 Feb 2004 17:47:51 -0800, jim rozen
wrote: I think what I was getting at is the idea that the vouchers are not going to cover the full freight at most private schools, Actually it will. Catholic schools for example cost around $3500 a year IRRC, where the national average for public schools is around $6500. If there is money to be spent, the private sector will always find a way to provide a service. Gunner "To be civilized is to restrain the ability to commit mayhem. To be incapable of committing mayhem is not the mark of the civilized, merely the domesticated." - Trefor Thomas |
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On 17 Feb 2004 17:47:51 -0800, jim rozen
wrote: Sure *you* don't care but that little thing like the bill of rights *does* care! What are the private schools going to do when the state starts demanding that catholic schools recognize jewish holidays, or that they ban religious displays? State money being funnelled into parochial schools is the first step towards a huge first amendment collision. That collision *will* happen in the courts when vouchers are first tried. It is also one of the biggest reasons why vouchers will be avoided for quite some time to come. Jim Jim..there is no legal injuction. Read the First Amendment again. The Seperation of Church and State Fallacy was from a letter from Jefferson IRRC. Btw..I know several Jewish families whose children attend Catholic schools, simply for the superior education. They simply do not join in the religious activities, and the schools have structured themselves to allow such as this without making the Jewish kids feel left out. Gunner "To be civilized is to restrain the ability to commit mayhem. To be incapable of committing mayhem is not the mark of the civilized, merely the domesticated." - Trefor Thomas |
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the Home Schooled was Clark is correct
On 17 Feb 2004 15:11:12 -0800, jim rozen
wrote: In article , John Flanagan says... A voucher doesn't give you the right to attend any school. Only the ability to pay for it if they accept you. Just like a college. OK, we're going to ignore the voucher proponents who say that public school are so awful that instituting vouchers will mean their certain demise - because then your comment above would be quite *un*true - all vouchered kids have to attend somewhere, so the vouchers really would be an instant in at any school in that case. But agreeing for a moment that public schools will still exist after "V" day, it's apparent that the brighter kids will abandon them instantly and leave only the problem kids behind: the kids who cost more to educate. How does a voucher plan ensure that the left-behinds will still get a decent education? Jim Its obvious. The public schools will finally have to get off their overstuffed dead asses and be competative with the private schools. When they see their tax dollars dribbling away..they will indeed institute improvements. Standardized testing will make sure everyone is working on a level playing field. Those that cannot teach worth a **** will be dumped in favor of those who can actually teach. Administration costs will fall, as they remove the deadwood and streamline. With fewer kids in the public schools, wear and tear on the infrastructure will be reduced and for those children who tear up the place, are "unteachable" etc..they will be finally handled the way they should be. With the proper punishment and expulsion as needed. Im sure there will be Boot Camp type schools that will spring up for problem children that will accept vouchers. It will really suck to be an asshole child who wants to disrupt things. Gunner "To be civilized is to restrain the ability to commit mayhem. To be incapable of committing mayhem is not the mark of the civilized, merely the domesticated." - Trefor Thomas |
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Clark is correct
Clark Magnuson wrote in message ...
Cliff Huprich wrote: I am a pro second amendment poster that was arguing religion with a couple trolls who reacted to my by line. Clark Which you seemingly don't understand the subject matter of and should no doubt change. What does it have to do with your gun collections & sporran? I was just about to assume you were ONLY a Tax-hiking, Government-expanding, Latte-drinking, Sushi-eating, Volvo-driving, New York Times-reading, Body-piercing, Hollywood-loving, Left-wing, Freak show troll, when I looked and you actually have posted some non troll things about metalworking. How did someone interested in metalworking turn into a liberal troll? A society that teaches evolution as fact will breed a generation of atheists that will destroy the society. It is Darwinian. No doubt I already know too much to be a proper conservative fundie G. -- Cliff "Rabbit's clever," said Pooh thoughtfully. "Yes," said Piglet, "Rabbit's clever." "And he has Brain." "Yes," said Piglet, "Rabbit has Brain." There was a long silence. "I suppose," said Pooh, "that that's why he never understands anything." - The House at Pooh Corner by A.A. Milne |
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