Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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  #1   Report Post  
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wrace
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on wheels,
the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target. It is an awkward
beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure the shop. It has angle
iron sticking out each side for legs (like most commercial built H presses).
Any reason I couldn't put a 4" caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how the
casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual forces for
an H press are pretty much contained within the structure on a pretty much
vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the jack handle I
suppose... in which case you are probably not using the right tool for the
job?

Anybody have their H press on casters? Does it work ok?

Wayne


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Rex B
 
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Default Casters on an H press?


wrace wrote:
Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on wheels,
the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target. It is an awkward
beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure the shop. It has angle
iron sticking out each side for legs (like most commercial built H presses).
Any reason I couldn't put a 4" caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how the
casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual forces for
an H press are pretty much contained within the structure on a pretty much
vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the jack handle I
suppose... in which case you are probably not using the right tool for the
job?

Anybody have their H press on casters?


Not yet, but mine will be. HF orange Chinese 20 ton. I don't see a
downside.
Might want to reinforce those angle iron legs (on mine) but probably
will not.
  #3   Report Post  
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Too_Many_Tools
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

I think it is a great idea.

I also think I would extend the legs...H presses can be top heavy and
one needs to anticipate what happens when you are rolling the press and
a caster catches on a floor crack.

TMT

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jerry wass
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Too_Many_Tools wrote:
I think it is a great idea.

I also think I would extend the legs...H presses can be top heavy and
one needs to anticipate what happens when you are rolling the press and
a caster catches on a floor crack.

TMT

Yar gonna put screw jack bolts on each corner ain't chu ? so's you kin
take the wait offen them casters & keep the press from squirmin 'round...
  #5   Report Post  
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Grant Erwin
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

I think it is a great idea.

I also think I would extend the legs...H presses can be top heavy and
one needs to anticipate what happens when you are rolling the press and
a caster catches on a floor crack.


big casters, not bigger legs ..

GWE


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Pete C.
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Grant Erwin wrote:

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

I think it is a great idea.

I also think I would extend the legs...H presses can be top heavy and
one needs to anticipate what happens when you are rolling the press and
a caster catches on a floor crack.


big casters, not bigger legs ..

GWE


Replace the angle iron with some Unistrut so it has some ability to
resist twisting. Use good 4" poly double locking casters such as the
ones sold by Wood Craft. They are rigid poly so they maintain stability,
they are fairly hard so they resist picking up shop debris and the
locking mechanism provides solid locking for both rolling and swiveling.
I use the version with the 1/2" center hole mounting on a roughly 4' x
6' power adjustable height work table that can handle around 1,000# and
they work very well.

Pete C.
  #7   Report Post  
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Ron Moore
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Use a U-shaped piece of heavy gauge wire or small tubing that just fits
under the wheel blocking its forward and backward roll. Makes a great
break, usually only needed on two of four castors.
Respectfully,
Ron Moore

"jerry wass" wrote in message
...
Too_Many_Tools wrote:
I think it is a great idea.

I also think I would extend the legs...H presses can be top heavy and
one needs to anticipate what happens when you are rolling the press and
a caster catches on a floor crack.

TMT

Yar gonna put screw jack bolts on each corner ain't chu ? so's you kin
take the wait offen them casters & keep the press from squirmin 'round...



  #8   Report Post  
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Too_Many_Tools
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Grant is right about bigger casters.

I would still extend the legs to provide a wider base.

Also when you move, if you can lower the center of gravity of the press
by lowering parts of it or removing parts I would.

Some people store all their dies, tooling, etc. on the press which adds
hundreds of pounds to the unit.

TMT

  #9   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Too_Many_Tools
 
Posts: n/a
Default Casters on an H press?

Grant is right about bigger casters.

I would still extend the legs to provide a wider base.

Also when you move, if you can lower the center of gravity of the press
by lowering parts of it or removing parts I would.

Some people store all their dies, tooling, etc. on the press which adds
hundreds of pounds to the unit.

TMT

  #10   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Pete C.
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

Grant is right about bigger casters.

I would still extend the legs to provide a wider base.

Also when you move, if you can lower the center of gravity of the press
by lowering parts of it or removing parts I would.

Some people store all their dies, tooling, etc. on the press which adds
hundreds of pounds to the unit.

TMT


There's an idea, when you replace the flimsy angle iron legs with
Unistrut or square tube so that will resist the twisting forces from the
casters, build a bottom shelf as part of the assembly so you can store
press plates, dies, etc at the bottom. This will keep everything
together as you move it about the shop, and also help with the CG a bit.

Pete C.


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Bruce L. Bergman
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

On 23 Dec 2005 07:31:43 -0800, "Too_Many_Tools"
wrote:

Grant is right about bigger casters.

I would still extend the legs to provide a wider base.


It might be simplest to get a big chunk (3' or 4' square) of heavy
plate to mount it on, if you happen to have one handy - that would
move the wheels out in all four directions. If you just get longer
straight 'foot' channels without putting them at an angle, that still
leaves it less stable side to side. A notch in the front of the plate
for human operator foot clearance might be called for.

Also when you move, if you can lower the center of gravity of the press
by lowering parts of it or removing parts I would.


I like the rigs with the lowering winch that drops the work arm on
two wire ropes. Pull the pins and crank it down to lower the CG.

Some people store all their dies, tooling, etc. on the press which adds
hundreds of pounds to the unit.


Which would be fine if the tooling was sitting down low on the base
plate, or a tray on the channel legs - but I usually see it stacked on
the sides of the work arm, or even worse on the top. Especially when
you live in Earthquake Country, you want to store the really heavy
stuff down as low as possible, so it doesn't have far to fall.

-- Bruce --

--
Bruce L. Bergman, Woodland Hills (Los Angeles) CA - Desktop
Electrician for Westend Electric - CA726700
5737 Kanan Rd. #359, Agoura CA 91301 (818) 889-9545
Spamtrapped address: Remove the python and the invalid, and use a net.
  #12   Report Post  
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Rex B
 
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Default Casters on an H press?


Bruce L. Bergman wrote:



It might be simplest to get a big chunk (3' or 4' square) of heavy
plate to mount it on, if you happen to have one handy - that would
move the wheels out in all four directions. If you just get longer
straight 'foot' channels without putting them at an angle, that still
leaves it less stable side to side. A notch in the front of the plate
for human operator foot clearance might be called for.


I can see some merit in attaching plate to the dimensions of the legs.
Say, 1/8" or better to form a floor without enlarging the bluepint. This
lets you place the dies, plates, bearing splitters on the floor of the
assembly, lowering the CG and adding stable storage area, while not
increasing the footprint. After all, portability is the original goal.
  #13   Report Post  
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Rich Grise
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:35:49 +0000, wrace wrote:

Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on wheels,
the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target. It is an awkward
beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure the shop. It has angle
iron sticking out each side for legs (like most commercial built H presses).
Any reason I couldn't put a 4" caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how the
casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual forces for
an H press are pretty much contained within the structure on a pretty much
vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the jack handle I
suppose... in which case you are probably not using the right tool for the
job?

Anybody have their H press on casters? Does it work ok?

Wayne


Along with all of the other answers, I'd add that I'd "recess" the
casters, i.e., mount them on sort of an L-bracket, so that you only have
to raise the base of the press maybe 1/4" - 1/2", rather than 4 or 5
inches.

________ BASE _________
\_/ | OF | \_/
/ . \ | PRESS | / . \
\ _ / ------------------------ \ _ /
------------------------------------------------- floor


Cheers!
Rich

(or coat the floor with something hard, polish it, and put the press
on a big air bearing. ;-) )


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Grant Erwin
 
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Default Casters on an H press?



Along with all of the other answers, I'd add that I'd "recess" the
casters, i.e., mount them on sort of an L-bracket, so that you only have
to raise the base of the press maybe 1/4" - 1/2", rather than 4 or 5
inches.

________ BASE _________
\_/ | OF | \_/
/ . \ | PRESS | / . \
\ _ / ------------------------ \ _ /
------------------------------------------------- floor


Rich, you clearly don't have to deal with a space-limited shop. The above design
is great for stability but it really burns floor area. I wish my press were
smaller, but it's the size it is, and I don't want it *any* bigger.

GWE
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Rex B
 
Posts: n/a
Default Casters on an H press?


Rich Grise wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:35:49 +0000, wrace wrote:


Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on wheels,
the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target. It is an awkward
beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure the shop. It has angle
iron sticking out each side for legs (like most commercial built H presses).
Any reason I couldn't put a 4" caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how the
casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual forces for
an H press are pretty much contained within the structure on a pretty much
vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the jack handle I
suppose... in which case you are probably not using the right tool for the
job?

Anybody have their H press on casters? Does it work ok?

Wayne



Along with all of the other answers, I'd add that I'd "recess" the
casters, i.e., mount them on sort of an L-bracket, so that you only have
to raise the base of the press maybe 1/4" - 1/2", rather than 4 or 5
inches.

________ BASE _________
\_/ | OF | \_/
/ . \ | PRESS | / . \
\ _ / ------------------------ \ _ /
------------------------------------------------- floor


I dunno, at 6'3" I'd like to raise mine a little.


  #16   Report Post  
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Rex B
 
Posts: n/a
Default Casters on an H press?


Rich Grise wrote:
On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:35:49 +0000, wrace wrote:


Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on wheels,
the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target. It is an awkward
beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure the shop. It has angle
iron sticking out each side for legs (like most commercial built H presses).
Any reason I couldn't put a 4" caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how the
casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual forces for
an H press are pretty much contained within the structure on a pretty much
vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the jack handle I
suppose... in which case you are probably not using the right tool for the
job?

Anybody have their H press on casters? Does it work ok?

Wayne



Along with all of the other answers, I'd add that I'd "recess" the
casters, i.e., mount them on sort of an L-bracket, so that you only have
to raise the base of the press maybe 1/4" - 1/2", rather than 4 or 5
inches.

________ BASE _________
\_/ | OF | \_/
/ . \ | PRESS | / . \
\ _ / ------------------------ \ _ /
------------------------------------------------- floor


I dunno, at 6'3" I'd like to raise mine a little.
  #17   Report Post  
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Stephen Young
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

Rex B wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:

On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:35:49 +0000, wrace wrote:


Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on
wheels, the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target.
It is an awkward beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure
the shop. It has angle iron sticking out each side for legs (like
most commercial built H presses). Any reason I couldn't put a 4"
caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how
the casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual
forces for an H press are pretty much contained within the structure
on a pretty much vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the
jack handle I suppose... in which case you are probably not using the
right tool for the job?

Anybody have their H press on casters? Does it work ok?

Wayne




Along with all of the other answers, I'd add that I'd "recess" the
casters, i.e., mount them on sort of an L-bracket, so that you only have
to raise the base of the press maybe 1/4" - 1/2", rather than 4 or 5
inches.

________ BASE _________
\_/ | OF | \_/
/ . \ | PRESS | / . \
\ _ / ------------------------ \ _ /
------------------------------------------------- floor



I dunno, at 6'3" I'd like to raise mine a little.


At 5'9" I have raised mine. Built a 4x4 H base to go under the press &
attached casters to the 4x4's - lifts the whole thing up about 6" -
easier to use now.
  #18   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
carl mciver
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

"Grant Erwin" wrote in message
...
|
|
| Along with all of the other answers, I'd add that I'd "recess" the
| casters, i.e., mount them on sort of an L-bracket, so that you only have
| to raise the base of the press maybe 1/4" - 1/2", rather than 4 or 5
| inches.
|
| ________ BASE _________
| \_/ | OF | \_/
| / . \ | PRESS | / . \
| \ _ / ------------------------ \ _ /
| ------------------------------------------------- floor
|
| Rich, you clearly don't have to deal with a space-limited shop. The above
design
| is great for stability but it really burns floor area. I wish my press
were
| smaller, but it's the size it is, and I don't want it *any* bigger.
|
| GWE

I can sympathize with that completely. Why not put two fixed casters on
one side mounted so that when it tilts slightly it's supported by the two
wheels? Put a pad or lift point on the opposing side and you can then use a
floor jack or other means to lift that end to move it about.
I have also done a contrivance with casters mounted on a plate attached
to hinges, and an external lever, where you lift the whole thing up by
stepping on a lever, rocking the plate level and lifting it up onto casters
for easy movement. When where you want it to be, lift the levers (sometimes
easier said than done!) to let the device drop back down onto its base.
Depending on how much you move it and the floor condition, you may want to
lock the mechanism in the mobile position, since if I catch something going
the wrong direction on the one I did, the plate and casters would sometimes
pop back into the stowed position.
I had a hard time visualizing this the first time I did it, but take a
long plate and mount it on sturdy hinges, long ways. To the plate end,
attach a lever perpendicular to the plate such that it extends on the
_other_ side of the hinges. Mount swivel casters to each end of the plate.
My item had a flat bottom, and when the plate and lever is "up" the casters
support the plate which then sit flat on the bottom. The distances and
caster size have to be worked out with a bit of simple math so that the
casters will just rest on the floor in the stowed position but raise the
thing when rolled up. Step on the lever, which causes the plate to flatten
out on the bottom and the caster's usable height will lift the item up.
Does this make sense? I wound up using this so since the item (actually a
bingo machine console which spends most of the time in storage) had a
"skirt" to keep stuff out and look immobile, but be easy to move by folks
other than me. The levers stuck out arc shaped slots on the backside.

  #19   Report Post  
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Reed
 
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Default Casters on an H press?

I wrote an article that included wheels on a press. I posted some
of the details in the dropbox.

http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/Press4-DollyWheelDetail.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressBaseLayout-s.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressFrontSidePainted-s.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressWheelLeverSideClose.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressWheelnewText.txt

The text of the above URL is:

On the list, a fellow asked about putting wheels under his
20 ton press. I posted this to share what I did.

This is the dolly Wheel details that is part of the Home
Shop Machinist article I wrote "Build a 50/30 Ton H-Frame
Hydraulic Floor Press". The article is in the May/June
2004 issue. These are detachable and I pull them
off when not moving the press around.

PressWheelLeverSideClose.jpg detail of one wheel
PressBaseLayout-s.jpg early picture with the dolly wheels
PressFrontSidePainted-s.jpg full picture with wheels
Press4-DollyWheelDetail.jpg diagram

Each wheel is on a pipe that serves as a lever, so there are
4 wheel units. 2 have casters and 2 are not. To engage the
wheels, do one side at a time. Attach the wheel unit, one
solid and one caster. The pipes will be about a 45 degree
angle. Push down on both pipes and when you have them pushed
level, slide the latch that is in one pipe into the other pipe
and the press is on wheel for that side. Then do the other side.

I have a lot of weight on this press and thus have taken to
using a piece of pipe that fits between the press's jack and
the floor(vertical) slightly offset to the side that I'm
setting the wheels. Then use the press jack to lift that
side so one does not need to lever up the press with the
wheel pipes. Once you jack it up, simple slide the latch and
do the other side.

Hope that helps,

Reed Streifthau
Raleigh, NC



On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:35:49 GMT, "wrace"
wrote:

Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on wheels,
the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target. It is an awkward
beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure the shop. It has angle
iron sticking out each side for legs (like most commercial built H presses).
Any reason I couldn't put a 4" caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how the
casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual forces for
an H press are pretty much contained within the structure on a pretty much
vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the jack handle I
suppose... in which case you are probably not using the right tool for the
job?

Anybody have their H press on casters? Does it work ok?

Wayne


  #20   Report Post  
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Reed
 
Posts: n/a
Default Casters on an H press?

Fixed the text URL below. I had issues with the dropbox. - Reed

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 15:33:05 -0500, Reed wrote:

I wrote an article that included wheels on a press. I posted some
of the details in the dropbox.

http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/Press4-DollyWheelDetail.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressBaseLayout-s.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressFrontSidePainted-s.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressWheelLeverSideClose.jpg
http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/PressWheelText.txt

The text of the above URL is:

On the list, a fellow asked about putting wheels under his
20 ton press. I posted this to share what I did.

This is the dolly Wheel details that is part of the Home
Shop Machinist article I wrote "Build a 50/30 Ton H-Frame
Hydraulic Floor Press". The article is in the May/June
2004 issue. These are detachable and I pull them
off when not moving the press around.

PressWheelLeverSideClose.jpg detail of one wheel
PressBaseLayout-s.jpg early picture with the dolly wheels
PressFrontSidePainted-s.jpg full picture with wheels
Press4-DollyWheelDetail.jpg diagram

Each wheel is on a pipe that serves as a lever, so there are
4 wheel units. 2 have casters and 2 are not. To engage the
wheels, do one side at a time. Attach the wheel unit, one
solid and one caster. The pipes will be about a 45 degree
angle. Push down on both pipes and when you have them pushed
level, slide the latch that is in one pipe into the other pipe
and the press is on wheel for that side. Then do the other side.

I have a lot of weight on this press and thus have taken to
using a piece of pipe that fits between the press's jack and
the floor(vertical) slightly offset to the side that I'm
setting the wheels. Then use the press jack to lift that
side so one does not need to lever up the press with the
wheel pipes. Once you jack it up, simple slide the latch and
do the other side.

Hope that helps,

Reed Streifthau
Raleigh, NC



On Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:35:49 GMT, "wrace"
wrote:

Speaking of casters. In my ongoing quest to put almost everything on wheels,
the 20ton floor standing H press is the next likely target. It is an awkward
beast to muscle around when I need to reconfigure the shop. It has angle
iron sticking out each side for legs (like most commercial built H presses).
Any reason I couldn't put a 4" caster on each corner?

It would of course make it easier to move around, but I wonder how the
casters would affect it when in actual use? Seems like the usual forces for
an H press are pretty much contained within the structure on a pretty much
vertical basis, unless you are really reefing on the jack handle I
suppose... in which case you are probably not using the right tool for the
job?

Anybody have their H press on casters? Does it work ok?

Wayne


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