I am building a "wrought" iron fence which I expect to make about
10 cuts in 1 -1/4" solid steel bar
100 cuts in 1/2" solid steel bar.

I am wondering what tool I should be buying for this? I have a dewalt
(wood) chop saw and was thinking of getting a metal blade for it.
However I read some threads here that said that this might not be the
best way to go. Givien the number of cuts that I have would it make
sense to buy a blade for this chop saw or to do it another way?

I am trying to figure out if I should
- Buy a blade for my chop saw
- Buy an abbraise cutoff saw $193 or so
- Buy a dry cut metal saw $410 or so
- Buy some kind of band saw

My original plan was to use my chop saw and get a blade for that. But
after reading the forum I read that that the blade speed on my chop was
a little fast for metal so I elimated that idea. But then I saw an
abbrsave cutoff tool for $193 and that speed seems to match my chop
saws speed?

Milwaukee 6180-20 14" Abrasive Cut-Off Machine
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...&s=hi&v=glance

At $193 I would be willing to buy this machine (if it will do this job)
as I think I could use this to cut metal stud stock later for an
addition I am doing next spring but I was wondering how quickly I would
be able to go through the 1 1/4" inch solid square stock and how
quickly I would go through abbrasive blades when cutting the 1 1/4" and
1/2" square stock.

Would this $193 saw be suffienct or should I pony up the extra monday
for the $400 dry cut saw?

Blade life/cost are an issue and to a lesser extent noise as I plan to
cut down in the basement of my house which I have a tennant in. If
all other things are basicly equal spending a little extra money to
make less noise would be worth it..

wrote in message
oups.com...
I am building a "wrought" iron fence which I expect to make about
10 cuts in 1 -1/4" solid steel bar
100 cuts in 1/2" solid steel bar.

..
Why not flame cut? Or do you need precision?

wrote in message
oups.com...

Blade life/cost are an issue and to a lesser extent noise as I plan to
cut down in the basement of my house which I have a tennant in. If
all other things are basicly equal spending a little extra money to
make less noise would be worth it..

I'd recommend a portable bandsaw. I've heard that this one
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=47840
works well. It's sometimes on sale for $79.95.

The Milwaukee version would probably significantly outlast the import. I
can say from experience
that it'll do the cuts you want to do quickly, almost effortlessly, quietly,
and with none of the sparks and stink
you'll get with any abrasive cutoff. I think the 1/2" square stuff would
take about 5 seconds a cut, probably less.

these would be fence pickets. What kind of precision can I get by
flame cutting? Most of the 1 1/4" stock will be used as fence posts
and therefore precision is not critical as one side will be put down in
concrete.

I have a few peices of 1 1/4" stock that will be used for a railing
ends that will be totally visible so some precision is needed.


The 1/2" stock will come fence pickets. I am using a 3/8" thick
punched bottom rail. I would guess there would be at least 1/8" to
play with as I would be tacking it where the 1/2" stock passes through
the hole in the punched rail. I could pass through a little or the
whole 3/8" of an inch before it would be a problem.

Can I get that precision with flame cutting?

How long would the blades last on something like that? Those blades
look small like a jig saw. I know any time I use a jig saw with metal
blades they burn up fast.

wrote:
How long would the blades last on something like that? Those blades
look small like a jig saw. I know any time I use a jig saw with metal
blades they burn up fast.

Even the smallest bandsaw blade is at least 30" long. That is about
TEN times the useful length of a jig saw blade. This gives the blade
time to cool off between passes through the material, too. Also,
the back and forth nature of a jigsaw ruins the cutting edge, then it
just bludgeons its way through. You can actually feel this in the first
5 seconds or less when using a jig saw in metal.

Jon

"Don Foreman" wrote: I'd recommend a portable bandsaw. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I agree with Don. I have both the Milwaukee and the cheapo Harbor Freight
one. The both work, but the sound of the HF one makes me nervous--the gears
are quite noisy. As far as blade life is concerned, I wouldn't worry--I use
mine a lot on all sorts of random cuts, and I very seldom have to change
blades. It's good to have a variable speed model, because if you cut some
tough material, unless you slow the blade down, it will wear out quickly.

"tdmailbox" is worried that the blades resemble jigsaw blades. Not
mine--they are thin, but not too narrow, and they do last unless you abuse
them.

I suggest using tubing for the posts. 1 1/4" steel bar will take longer to
cut; will cost and weigh more. Is there any way you can cap them so you
don't have an open end at the top?

In article 1131727749.665009.184740
@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, says...
I am building a "wrought" iron fence which I expect to make about
10 cuts in 1 -1/4" solid steel bar
100 cuts in 1/2" solid steel bar.


Ask your steel supplier how much they'd charge to precut
the steel. As long as you're buying full bars, the charge
per cut is usually very reasonable. I'd expect to pay less
than $50 for cutting your material.

Ned Simmons

wrote:
I am building a "wrought" iron fence which I expect to make about
10 cuts in 1 -1/4" solid steel bar
100 cuts in 1/2" solid steel bar.

I am wondering what tool I should be buying for this? I have a dewalt

I have one of those (in)famous "$200" bandsaws that you can useually get
for considerably less. I have had mine for several years now and have
replaced the blade maybe four times. I'm using Morse bi-metal blades
and have cut a fair amount of 4130 for my neighbour's airplane.

Have you considered using pipe for the big stuff? It will be _much_
easier to weld than solid. Standard schedule 40 1" pipe is actually
1.315" OD and is almost as strong as solid 1-1/4". If that "almost" is
a problem, use shedule 80 1" pipe. It's actually stronger than the
1-1/4" solid.

While your bandsaw is cutting the big stuff, you can be doing something
else. Make a jig to hold 5 or 10 pieces of the 1/2" stuff in the saw
vice to speed up that process.

Have you considered using re-bar for the 1/2"? Many people, including
me, find the pattern attractive and it's cheap/ :-)

Ted

"Ted Edwards" wrote: (clip) Have you considered using re-bar for the 1/2"?
Many people, including me, find the pattern attractive and it's cheap
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I guess it's all in how you look at it. I have used rusty rebar as part of
a sculpture, where the fact that it was rebar was part of the idea. But
when I see it used as a raw material for things like table legs, the message
I get is: "cheap and makeshift." Just my opinion--what do others think?

Why not try the $49 HF 14" abrasive chop saw ? That's what I use...

I would strongly recommend using it outside, however, and it is quite noisy.

Precision depends a lot on how steady your wrist is through the cutting
process. But for the kind of project you are describing the pros use nothing
but flame cutting with oxy acet tanks and tips.

Hi guys;
I agree about the little $200 import horizontal cutoff bandsaws.
They're a terrific buy, and useful for all kinds of cutoff jobs. I have
one that I bought (for $150?) almost 20 years ago, and I still haven't
worn it out or broken it. I've cut 4" dia steel with it; it's slow, but
it'll do it. 1 1/4" steel or 1" pipe are no problem. These days, I also
have one of the larger 7 x 12 saws, which is definitely faster for the
big stuff. But I still use the little 4 x 6 saw for all the under 1"
work.

I would much rather use a horizontal bandsaw than an abrasive cutoff
saw. Screaming motors and showers of sparks get tiring. The bandsaw may
be slower, but you can get the cut started and walk away while it
finishes and shuts off.

Bruce Johnson

Ignoramus12383 wrote:
On Fri, 11 Nov 2005 17:05:58 -0000, Don Foreman wrote:

wrote in message
groups.com...

Blade life/cost are an issue and to a lesser extent noise as I plan to
cut down in the basement of my house which I have a tennant in. If
all other things are basicly equal spending a little extra money to
make less noise would be worth it..

I'd recommend a portable bandsaw. I've heard that this one
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=47840
works well. It's sometimes on sale for $79.95.

The Milwaukee version would probably significantly outlast the
import. I can say from experience that it'll do the cuts you want
to do quickly, almost effortlessly, quietly, and with none of the
sparks and stink you'll get with any abrasive cutoff. I think the
1/2" square stuff would take about 5 seconds a cut, probably less.


I am curious, just how quiet is that HF bandsaw. I have a very cheap
chop saw, that actually works, but stinks and is very noisy, and makes
sparks and dust. Noise is not a problem for me since I wear hearing
protection, but stink and sparks are very unpleasant.

i


I bought the HF single speed bandsaw about two years ago, and sprang for
a few genu-wine Milwaukee blades for it at the same time. FWIW, It's
still got the original HF Chinese blade on it, it hasn't worn enough to
need changing yet!

No sparks or smells from it so far, and the noise is roughly the same as
a 1/4" electric drill.

For toolish utility, it comes in a close fourth right after my hammers,
pliers and screwdrivers, I'd say it's given me the most sweat saving
value of any small tool I've owned, I wish I'd gotten one years ago.

IIRC HF has their variable speed model on sale for under $70 right now.

I'm sure a Milwaukee is better made, as it should be for roughly four
times the price, but I've got a feeling my HF one will last me the rest
of my active life.

(Hell, at my age I don't even buy green bananas anymore.) G

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia

(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)

"Truth exists; only falsehood has to be invented."

On Fri, 11 Nov 2005 17:05:58 -0000, with neither quill nor qualm, "Don
Foreman" quickly quoth:


wrote in message
roups.com...

Blade life/cost are an issue and to a lesser extent noise as I plan to
cut down in the basement of my house which I have a tennant in. If
all other things are basicly equal spending a little extra money to
make less noise would be worth it..

I'd recommend a portable bandsaw. I've heard that this one

Portable, for ONE HUNDRED AND TEN CUTS? AYOOYFM, Don? For so many
cuts, a stand-type saw would be the only way I'd want to go. Unless
the OP is looking to end up looking like the Governator before he got
into politics.


http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=47840
works well. It's sometimes on sale for $79.95.

It's $99 right now.


The Milwaukee version would probably significantly outlast the import. I

If the Milwaukee is still U.S. made, it might be worth it.
But for $100 less, the HF stand model might be a better choice
for his needs.
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=37151

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Larry Jaques wrote:

Portable, for ONE HUNDRED AND TEN CUTS? AYOOYFM, Don? For so many
cuts, a stand-type saw would be the only way I'd want to go. Unless
the OP is looking to end up looking like the Governator before he got
into politics.


For just 110 cuts, unless he has some further use planned for it, I'd
say it would be hard to justify a power tool of any sort. A good
high-tension hacksaw frame and a couple of bi-metal blades would be my
choice.

Sure, there are easier ways to do it. But buying an expensive tool for
that one job doesn't make any sense to me.

John Martin

"Ned Simmons" wrote in message
...
| In article 1131727749.665009.184740
| @g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, says...
| I am building a "wrought" iron fence which I expect to make about
| 10 cuts in 1 -1/4" solid steel bar
| 100 cuts in 1/2" solid steel bar.
|
|
| Ask your steel supplier how much they'd charge to precut
| the steel. As long as you're buying full bars, the charge
| per cut is usually very reasonable. I'd expect to pay less
| than $50 for cutting your material.
|
| Ned Simmons

My supplier charges $4 a cut, which is fine for small jobs, and
outrageous for larger ones. Have you looked into having a fabrication shop
do it for you? Many have gang mounted OA cutting torches that will cut a
whole bunch at one time, with beautiful results. Some are CNC, some are
manual and even tracers. This sounds like a good job for that application
since all you'd have to do is load up a bunch of bars side by side and let
the machine make a pass for you, cutting all at one shot. Bar and sheet is
what these do best, not tubing or stuff that the torch can't reach around so
well. The machines are fairly simple and not so incredibly expensive, so
perhaps you will get a good price for scale. Help 'em out and it might even
be less!

On 11 Nov 2005 15:47:06 -0800, with neither quill nor qualm, "John
Martin" quickly quoth:


Larry Jaques wrote:

Portable, for ONE HUNDRED AND TEN CUTS? AYOOYFM, Don? For so many
cuts, a stand-type saw would be the only way I'd want to go. Unless
the OP is looking to end up looking like the Governator before he got
into politics.


For just 110 cuts, unless he has some further use planned for it, I'd
say it would be hard to justify a power tool of any sort. A good
high-tension hacksaw frame and a couple of bi-metal blades would be my
choice.

Sure, there are easier ways to do it. But buying an expensive tool for
that one job doesn't make any sense to me.

"Bah humbug" to you, too! Are you not like us, tool collectors
extraordinaire? Besides, shouldn't -every- metal shop have a
metal-cutting bandsaw? And since when have "planned uses" ever
limited the usefulness of a new tool? Have you ever used a tool
for something other than the original project? (Highly unlikely.)

Loosen up, John. It's New Tool Time!


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In article 77edf.719$s14.22
@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net,
says...
"Ned Simmons" wrote in message
...
| In article 1131727749.665009.184740
| @g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, says...
| I am building a "wrought" iron fence which I expect to make about
| 10 cuts in 1 -1/4" solid steel bar
| 100 cuts in 1/2" solid steel bar.
|
|
| Ask your steel supplier how much they'd charge to precut
| the steel. As long as you're buying full bars, the charge
| per cut is usually very reasonable. I'd expect to pay less
| than $50 for cutting your material.
|
| Ned Simmons

My supplier charges $4 a cut, which is fine for small jobs, and
outrageous for larger ones.

For the sake of argument, assume the pieces are 5' long.
That would mean 3 cuts per 20' bar. A halfway decent saw
would have no trouble cutting twenty-five 1/2" bars at a
time, so $12. Same for the 1-1/4" and you're out the door
for $24. You've avoided a boring job done with a less than
ideal tool, and the yard made $24 for 20 minutes of saw
time - everbody's happy.

If your dealer charges $4/cut for a guy to run 1/2" square
bar thru the saw 1 piece at a time, you need to shop for
another steel yard g.

Ned Simmons

Larry Jaques wrote:

"Bah humbug" to you, too! Are you not like us, tool collectors
extraordinaire? Besides, shouldn't -every- metal shop have a
metal-cutting bandsaw? And since when have "planned uses" ever
limited the usefulness of a new tool? Have you ever used a tool
for something other than the original project? (Highly unlikely.)

Loosen up, John. It's New Tool Time!


Larry:

If he really just wanted to justify buying a new tool - whether to
himself or to SWMBO - that's one thing. If what he really wants is a
big new Marvel or DoAll, I'm sure we can give him all the ammunition he
needs. By the way, I saw a really good explanation for that acronym
just yesterday - SWMB Outsmarted.

If, on the other hand, all that he wants to do is what he said - make
110 cuts on steel bars - there are other ways to do it. I don't have a
horizontal bandsaw, or a portable bandsaw or a chop saw and don't feel
any need for any of them. So I'd first turn to my vertical bandsaw, or
maybe to the horizontal mill with a slitting blade. If I couldn't fit
it into either one of those, I'd pick up the hacksaw before I'd
consider another machine. Unless I saw some other use for it. Or
unless maybe it was 1,000 cuts instead...

I'm in the middle of rebuilding a power brush for an old Gravely
tractor. The main shaft, which was badly rusted, was 1.25" diameter
with 8 brush hubs that I had to remove. I cut the shaft with a
hacksaw, once on each side of each hub. Couldn't support it well on
the bandsaw or the mill. The hacksaw worked fine, and didn't take all
that long. I wouldn't consider buying a new machine for that, or for
the 110 cuts. Instead, I'd save the money for something like a TIG
welder...

Sometimes I feel a bit guilty about all the tools and machines I have.
Not as much for having them, as for spending only a few hours a week
using them. Especially when I consider that if my shop were suddenly
transported to Bosnia or someplace like that there might be a
half-dozen families making a living from it. Or when I see pictures of
some Afghani squatting in the dirt making copies of a .45 automatic
with a hacksaw and hand drill and a couple of files. I think you know
what I mean.

Saw a good quote the other day, "If I didn't have a machine shop, I
wouldn't need one".

John Martin

On 12 Nov 2005 09:33:07 -0800, with neither quill nor qualm, "John
Martin" quickly quoth:


Larry Jaques wrote:

"Bah humbug" to you, too! Are you not like us, tool collectors
extraordinaire? Besides, shouldn't -every- metal shop have a
metal-cutting bandsaw? And since when have "planned uses" ever
limited the usefulness of a new tool? Have you ever used a tool
for something other than the original project? (Highly unlikely.)

Loosen up, John. It's New Tool Time!


Larry:

If he really just wanted to justify buying a new tool - whether to
himself or to SWMBO - that's one thing. If what he really wants is a
big new Marvel or DoAll, I'm sure we can give him all the ammunition he
needs. By the way, I saw a really good explanation for that acronym
just yesterday - SWMB Outsmarted.

Good 'un.


If, on the other hand, all that he wants to do is what he said - make
110 cuts on steel bars - there are other ways to do it. I don't have a
horizontal bandsaw, or a portable bandsaw or a chop saw and don't feel
any need for any of them. So I'd first turn to my vertical bandsaw, or
maybe to the horizontal mill with a slitting blade. If I couldn't fit
it into either one of those, I'd pick up the hacksaw before I'd
consider another machine. Unless I saw some other use for it. Or
unless maybe it was 1,000 cuts instead...

If you'd make 100 cuts on 1/2" and 1-1/2" steel bar (not tube) you
obviously have _much_ more energy than I do.


I'm in the middle of rebuilding a power brush for an old Gravely
tractor. The main shaft, which was badly rusted, was 1.25" diameter
with 8 brush hubs that I had to remove. I cut the shaft with a
hacksaw, once on each side of each hub. Couldn't support it well on
the bandsaw or the mill. The hacksaw worked fine, and didn't take all
that long. I wouldn't consider buying a new machine for that, or for
the 110 cuts. Instead, I'd save the money for something like a TIG
welder...

Yeah, I'd probably have used a hacksaw on a couple cuts, but not 100+.
I learned just recently how much a good hacksaw blade is worth in
terms of ease of use and longevity. I had bought the cheapies for
years and finally got some sense, thank goodness. When I think of all
the time, frustration, and effort wasted...


Sometimes I feel a bit guilty about all the tools and machines I have.
Not as much for having them, as for spending only a few hours a week
using them. Especially when I consider that if my shop were suddenly
transported to Bosnia or someplace like that there might be a
half-dozen families making a living from it. Or when I see pictures of
some Afghani squatting in the dirt making copies of a .45 automatic
with a hacksaw and hand drill and a couple of files. I think you know
what I mean.

OTOH, just because you can make a .45 with 3 tools doesn't mean you
should. But I've never felt guilty for owning tools. I put them to use
at some point in their (and my) life; many of them repeatedly. And I'm
damned glad I didn't offload my mechanic's tools when I got out of
wrenchin' for a living. I still return to that toolbox constantly.


Saw a good quote the other day, "If I didn't have a machine shop, I
wouldn't need one".

Bwahahaha! Excellent.


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In article .com,
" wrote:

If you already have a circular saw, look for an abrasive blade to fit
it. I've found 'em at Wal-Mart, so they're not exotic. Works just
fine, and really cheap for a low volume of cuts.

--
B.B. --I am not a goat! thegoat4 at airmail dot net

Be careful with abrasive blades if the bladeguard on your chopsaw is
plastic.

For the number of cuts given I would buy a cheap sawz-all knockoff
(reciprocating saw) with a long metalcuting blade.

wrote:
Be careful with abrasive blades if the bladeguard on your chopsaw is
plastic.

For the number of cuts given I would buy a cheap sawz-all knockoff
(reciprocating saw) with a long metalcuting blade.

If you're going the sawzall route, I'd suggest buying a number of short
metalcutting blades. The long ones are really susceptible to getting a
little bend that turns into a big bend and then they're useless. With
shorter blades, you can extend the guard out and use up the end teeth,
then retract the guard and use the top teeth. I like my Milwaukee Super
Sawzall and have cut a lot of rebar with it.

On the other hand, I bought one of the HF portable bandsaws a few weeks
ago. Found the online price was $59.99, printed the webpage out and took
it into the store. They honored it, so I also bought a package of the
Milwaukee blades.

Pete