I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

I would suggest slacks and a good shirt. Jeans and t-shirt are not
acceptable. If you've only got a 3 piece suit then wear the pants and
shirt. Show them you'll go out of the way to be just a bit better than they
expect. I've interviewed candidates where clothes have made a difference.
I would assume, as an interviewer, that if you didn't care for you looks
then you probably wouldn't care how the parts you made look either.
lg
no neat sig line
"mr electron" wrote in message
ups.com...
I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

mr electron wrote:

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sounds like you don't really have a choice.
Between the two, I'd pick the work pants and
t-shirt. Make sure they are spotless and
nicely pressed.

"mr electron" wrote in
ups.com:

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.


Wear the slacks from your suit along with the tie. I haven't seen anyone
wearing a three piece suit in about 15 years.

When I was in your position I always wore a tie and more often than not
was offered the job. You only get one chance to make a first and lasting
impression. If they get 20 or so applicants that they interview, what are
you going to do to stand out? If nothing else taking the time to dress up
and look your best will show that you are serious.

Will you feel out of place? No doubt. The prospective employer will
almost always comment on the way you're dressed. Often along the lines of
"you're not dressed for working in a machine shop. Are you sure this is
what you want to do?" The best response is "If you want me to start
today, I'll run home and change." "I just figured if you were going to
give me some of your time, I would show you that I respect that." Sounds
corny but it works.

When applying for an apprentice job make sure to ask questions about what
they do and how they do it. Avoid questions along the lines of "What's in
it for me?" Apprentice jobs rarely if ever have negotiable wages and/or
bennies. You also want the employer to know that you have mechanical
ability. If you know how to read a micrometer, have some experience, etc.
make sure they know that as well.

For this type of opening an employer will often ask what your habbies
are. Fixing cars, woodworking, etc. are always good. But don't lie. You
never know if the guy is a gearhead or a woodworker himself. Another
question is what do you want to be doing in ten years? Have an answer
ready. "Right now I plan on being the best journeyman in your shop" is a
pretty good answer. I answered "Your job" once and was offered the job.
The guy laughed and said, "Well at least your honest." I wouldn't use
that as a pat answer but it felt right at the time.

Anyway, good luck and I hope you get it.


--

Dan

I would suggest the shirt and pants from your suit. I would NOT wear a tie
nor would I wear a suit jacket.

If you have a shop apron, I would suggest bringing it (but not wearing it).
If they want you perform an operation on a machine (which is highly
unlikely), you can put it on.

Be sure to take it easy. If you're desperate for a job, they'll smell it
and you won't get it.

Best of luck.

"mr electron" wrote in message
ups.com...
I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

"D Murphy" wrote in message
...
"mr electron" wrote in
ups.com:

Wear the slacks from your suit along with the tie. I haven't seen anyone
wearing a three piece suit in about 15 years.

That's because they haven't sold them in 20 years. Myself I like to get
three piece with 2 pairs of pants. Often I never even don the jacket and
the vest carries the day.

--

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube, then
they come up with this striped stuff.

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.


Slacks of some sort and maybe a nice polo style shirt. I'd go with
the cheapy WallyWorld versions. Throw a pair of overalls/coveralls in
your bag or car in case you're asked to demonstrate your skills.

"mr electron" wrote: (clip) I have no time to purchase any clothing due to
my schedule. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Do you live in an area where no stores are open evenings? I would MAKE the
time if it matters to you. For an interview, I think you should look a
little neater and dressier than the guys working at the machines. Your suit
with a tie might look a little pretentious, so I would settle for an shirt
with an open collar, worn with your suit pants, and some kind of a light
jacket, sport coat or windbreaker. (I'm a slob, but I know when not to look
like one.)

During one interview, I was told, "You will get your hands dirty." My
answer must have been OK, 'cause I got the job. I said, "Good." Hope YOU
get the job.

On 25 Sep 2005 17:26:31 -0700, "mr electron"
wrote:

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

It's a good question.

Neat, clean and understated is far better than "fine raiment".
I'd be more favorably disposed to an apprentice applicant in a clean
pressed cotton or chambray shirt and pressed (yes, pressed) Levi's
or work pants than one in a hotshot suit. If the shirt has pockets
with flaps, button them. He isn't looking for a salesman, but one
who is capable of precision and attention to small details.

I'd recommend wearing a real shirt, not just a tee shirt. You can
shed the shirt if you're asked to demonstrate your skills, but wear
a real shirt for your office visit.

Get a haircut. It needn't and shouldn't be a $40 "do", just a neat,
clean haircut. If you have a beard or moustache, groom it or have
it groomed as in trimmed neatly. Again, attention to details.
(Don't ask how many ways I spelled "moustache" before I got it right.)

If you wear leather shoes, shine them. If you wear workboots, clean
them up and treat them with mink oil or whatever you use so they look
well-maintained. Don't wear Nikes.

You should look as meticulous and functional as the work he wants
done. Skip the aftershave and cologne. If you have any odor at all
it should be eau d'Tapmatic or perhaps a hint of Hoppe's #9.

If I sound "military", it's no accident. "Military" suggests
discipline, particularly to a veteran, and precision metalworking is
definitely a discipline.

Don't ever think you can bull**** an interviewer other than HR pukes
who thrive on bull**** -- but you'll not be dealing with them, I hope.
Experienced managers and foremen have very good bull**** detectors.
They have to. If you don't know the answer to a question, the best
response is "I don't know but I can find out." Be prepared to say
how you'd find out, because that'll be the next question. I always
asked at least one job-relevant question I was pretty sure the
applicant couldn't answer, just to see what he/she would do with it.
If I got a smoke 'n feathers bull**** dance, that was a reject even
if they looked good up until then. I was pinging for integrity.

Answer every question fully and honestly, then shut up and sit still,
look pleasant -- but shut up. Be able to be quiet, let the
interviewer lead. That was another test I used. He or she who can't
be still when they have no material contribution to offer would not
be a good member of my small team.

Expect ambiguous questions. If you don't understand a question, make
it clear what you didn't understand about the question before you
respond. That's another test. A machinist must understand what is
ezpected to get it right. The print should convey that, but
prints don't always convey all relevant details e.g. schedule or what
machines and materials are immediately available for the job.

After he or she is done, it doesn't hurt a bit to ask a polite
intelligent question or two yourself to subtly establish that the
interview is a mating dance that cuts both ways. It can subtly
confirm your presence as competent applicant rather than supplicant.
That can be very effective. It isn't bull****, just good psychology.
It has always worked well for me. It cost me a couple of jobs that
wouldn't have fit me well, and I'm convinced it got me better offers
for the jobs that did fit. Both were good outcomes.

Good luck!

As a fellow who hires 25 part time employees a year, I'd tell you to read
this advise three times. Its spot on.

I continue to be amazed at people who show up for jub interviews with dirty
clothing, too many body rings, smelling of last night's alcohol, and only
interested in what it pays and do I have to work every day.

Karl

In article , Don Foreman says...

I'd recommend wearing a real shirt, not just a tee shirt. You can
shed the shirt if you're asked to demonstrate your skills, but wear
a real shirt for your office visit.

Don's advice is spot-on.

A tie would not be out of place IMO, even without a
suit jacket.

Jim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

"D Murphy" wrote in message
...
"you're not dressed for working in a machine shop. Are you sure this is
what you want to do?" The best response is "If you want me to start
today, I'll run home and change."

Good advice. I'd bring the change of clothes. Leave it in the car, or bring
the rucksack if you're hoofing it.

"I just figured if you were going to
give me some of your time, I would show you that I respect that." Sounds
corny but it works.

Too pat, too corny for my taste. "Shucks darn, you betcha. I even warshed
behind the ears this morning." Or better: "My Daddy taught me to show the
proper respect. I brung me some proper work clothes, right chere, just in
case." Always think, plan, and stay one step ahead. Not just in the
interview, but all through life. It's easy if you're serious about your
work. There's no way to fake it if you're not.

On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 01:44:05 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm, Don
Foreman quickly quoth:

Neat, clean and understated is far better than "fine raiment".

Grok that and concur.


I'd be more favorably disposed to an apprentice applicant in a clean
pressed cotton or chambray shirt and pressed (yes, pressed) Levi's

Your're a truly sick and twisted man, Don Foreman.
Ironing Levis, indeed!


--------------------------------------------------
I survived the D.C. Blizzard of 2003 (from Oregon)
----------------------------
http://diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development
--------------------------------------------------------

On 25 Sep 2005 17:26:31 -0700, "mr electron"
wrote:

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

Ive interviewed hundreds of people, and have been interviewed. Ive
always given credit to those that dressed neat and clean, and in a
fashion that shows that they could leave the chair, and go straight to
work.

Its worked for me also. Shrug.

Gunner

"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire.
Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us)
off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give
them self determination under "play nice" rules.

Think of it as having your older brother knock the **** out of you
for torturing the cat." Gunner

Ignoramus12004 wrote:
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 13:26:30 GMT, Mike Young wrote:

"D Murphy" wrote in message
. ..

"you're not dressed for working in a machine shop. Are you sure this is
what you want to do?" The best response is "If you want me to start
today, I'll run home and change."


I would just answer "I am dressed for interviewing".

That's a good answer. No bull**** to detect there.

Chris

Don Foreman wrote:

On 25 Sep 2005 17:26:31 -0700, "mr electron"
wrote:



I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks



It's a good question.

Neat, clean and understated is far better than "fine raiment".
I'd be more favorably disposed to an apprentice applicant in a clean
pressed cotton or chambray shirt and pressed (yes, pressed) Levi's
or work pants than one in a hotshot suit. If the shirt has pockets
with flaps, button them. He isn't looking for a salesman, but one
who is capable of precision and attention to small details.

I'd recommend wearing a real shirt, not just a tee shirt. You can
shed the shirt if you're asked to demonstrate your skills, but wear
a real shirt for your office visit.

Get a haircut. It needn't and shouldn't be a $40 "do", just a neat,
clean haircut. If you have a beard or moustache, groom it or have
it groomed as in trimmed neatly. Again, attention to details.
(Don't ask how many ways I spelled "moustache" before I got it right.)

If you wear leather shoes, shine them. If you wear workboots, clean
them up and treat them with mink oil or whatever you use so they look
well-maintained. Don't wear Nikes.

You should look as meticulous and functional as the work he wants
done. Skip the aftershave and cologne. If you have any odor at all
it should be eau d'Tapmatic or perhaps a hint of Hoppe's #9.

If I sound "military", it's no accident. "Military" suggests
discipline, particularly to a veteran, and precision metalworking is
definitely a discipline.

Don't ever think you can bull**** an interviewer other than HR pukes
who thrive on bull**** -- but you'll not be dealing with them, I hope.
Experienced managers and foremen have very good bull**** detectors.
They have to. If you don't know the answer to a question, the best
response is "I don't know but I can find out." Be prepared to say
how you'd find out, because that'll be the next question. I always
asked at least one job-relevant question I was pretty sure the
applicant couldn't answer, just to see what he/she would do with it.
If I got a smoke 'n feathers bull**** dance, that was a reject even
if they looked good up until then. I was pinging for integrity.

Answer every question fully and honestly, then shut up and sit still,
look pleasant -- but shut up. Be able to be quiet, let the
interviewer lead. That was another test I used. He or she who can't
be still when they have no material contribution to offer would not
be a good member of my small team.

Expect ambiguous questions. If you don't understand a question, make
it clear what you didn't understand about the question before you
respond. That's another test. A machinist must understand what is
ezpected to get it right. The print should convey that, but
prints don't always convey all relevant details e.g. schedule or what
machines and materials are immediately available for the job.

After he or she is done, it doesn't hurt a bit to ask a polite
intelligent question or two yourself to subtly establish that the
interview is a mating dance that cuts both ways. It can subtly
confirm your presence as competent applicant rather than supplicant.
That can be very effective. It isn't bull****, just good psychology.
It has always worked well for me. It cost me a couple of jobs that
wouldn't have fit me well, and I'm convinced it got me better offers
for the jobs that did fit. Both were good outcomes.

Good luck!



Excellent advice.

With regards to "Level" of attire (suite and tie or t-shirt), dress one
notch better than the highest person you are *likely* to see but not so
much better tht it appears you think you are better then them. Dressing
below the interviewer is often percieved as not taking the interview
seriously and dressing much above is often percieved as thinking you
are "better" than them. Sometimes it's a hard razor blade to walk but
you can rarely go wrong if you shoot for the "one notch" better level.
FYI, the "one notch better" is because interviewers usually think they
are dressed better than they actually are

CLEAN AND NEAT IS EVERYTHING. This includes personal grooming such as
well washed hair, clean shaven, and clean/neat fingernails. Clean and
neat also applies to verbage and speech. Speak clearly and avoid bad
grammer and slang unless it really fits. Anyone who says "he axed
me...." around here is out he door unless they are speaking of a
personal assault with an axe. people often get into lazy speech habits
like "gunna", "wanna", "goin", and similar which are best to avoid.
Nothing wrong with them in casual conversation but they might make the
difference if the interview is "close".

Make sure you have a good pen with you also. Simply having to ask to
borrow a pen can be the death of an interview...it instantly makes you
seem unprepared.


Koz

When I applied for my Aircraft Mechanics job at an airline I wore nicely
pressed pant (dockers) and a ironed collared shirt with a navy blazer.
I would recommend pressed pants and a ironed button down or polo shirt.
If it is going to be cold take the jacket. No tie.
Throw the work clothes in the vehicle in case they want you to do some
shop work.
If the employer is worth working for they will appreciate the clean neat
professional appearance and the being prepared for the a likely
demonstration of your skills.

Michelle (Interviewer and interviewee)

mr electron wrote:

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

I used to hire co-op students from the local college.

The one that still stands out in my mind is the guy who showed up in a
sweatshirt that looked like a tuxedo complete with flower picture in the
fake lapel.

I couldn't stop laughing. And I hired him!


"mr electron" wrote in message
ups.com...
I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 16:44:54 +0000 (UTC), with neither quill nor
qualm, Christopher Tidy quickly quoth:

Ignoramus12004 wrote:
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 13:26:30 GMT, Mike Young wrote:

"D Murphy" wrote in message
...

"you're not dressed for working in a machine shop. Are you sure this is
what you want to do?" The best response is "If you want me to start
today, I'll run home and change."

I would just answer "I am dressed for interviewing".

That's a good answer. No bull**** to detect there.

"I'm dressed for interviewing but I brought work clothes with me.
They're in the truck. Shall I get them? I can start immediately."

--
"Simplicity of life, even the barest, is not misery but
the very foundation of refinement." --William Morris
-----------------------------------
www.diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development

On 25 Sep 2005 17:26:31 -0700, "mr electron"
wrote:

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks

I once worked for a fellow who wouldn't hire anyone until he had taken
them to lunch. His hiring decision hinged on whether a candidate
seasoned their food before taking the first bite to see if it needed
seasoning.

Well I am retired and not really looking for any employment, but they
opened up a Hyundai plant here as well as a heap of supporting other
businesses, and if I happened to stumble on a job that fit my fancey
and hours, I would apply or try for it, but one in partiuclar I heard
about was for a second shift tool room machinist......and it was
located only 3/4 of a mile fromthe house. I swore after 31 years 10
months in the military I would never wear any shoes or boots that
required polish, nor ever get another hair cut.......and wear nothing
but blue jeans and T shirts........and sneakers.........I have held up
that statement since retiring, and dropped in and applied for the
job,, just for the hell of it. I also had my ears repierced since
retiring as well, so in I go with my earings, long hair about to the
middle of my back in a pony tail, a Black T shirt and blue jeans and
Nikes, and desperately in need of a shave as well.......Filled out the
application, handed it in, and left. ABout 5 days later I get a call
for an interview, to which I went. Interview lasted almost 30
minutes.....and the two foks giving the interview were setting there
in white shirts and ties and wingtip shoes.......After the interview I
was thanked for coming in and sort of wrote it off......2 days later I
get a call and was informed the job was mine if I wanted it. I took
it and the pay was really good.........so was conditions and
benefits......all I did was make one of's and make repair parts if
needed for the production lines. Did not have to leave a well equipped
shop for anything.........About 4 months into this job, I get called
into the office, and informed they are wanting to move me to a
production supers job.........if I was interested........I
declined....I preferred to stay in the machine shop. No mention of
clothes, hair or what have you was mentioned ever during my employment
or interviews.. so it goes to show if you have the talent or
capability you'll get the job if your the best qualified for
it.......I am still working there, making some extra money to play
with and its been great so far. I am now in charge of anonther
machinist and the entire 1st shift maintenance crew.........Don;t get
as much time on machines as I used to earlier, but its a good job just
the same and the pay is even better......but I can pretty do much as I
please......

==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o

"Andy Asberry" wrote in message
...
I once worked for a fellow who wouldn't hire anyone until he had taken
them to lunch. His hiring decision hinged on whether a candidate
seasoned their food before taking the first bite to see if it needed
seasoning.

There's probably more to it than you're telling, but he sounds like a bigger
fool than the ones he weeded out.

In article , Andy Asberry says...

I once worked for a fellow who wouldn't hire anyone until he had taken
them to lunch. His hiring decision hinged on whether a candidate
seasoned their food before taking the first bite to see if it needed
seasoning.

I guess it could be worse. At least the candidate got lunch out of
the deal!!

I remember interviewing for my first full time job at GTE Labs in
Waltham, MA - we went down to the cafeteria and I wasn't feeling
terribly well after the plane ride. Made the mistake of getting
the 'mystery chicken' and could hardly eat it.

The engineer I replaced later told me that he wondered how I
survived being so skinny and not eating anything!

Jim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

"Andy Asberry" wrote in message
...
On 25 Sep 2005 17:26:31 -0700, "mr electron"

I once worked for a fellow who wouldn't hire anyone until he had taken
them to lunch. His hiring decision hinged on whether a candidate
seasoned their food before taking the first bite to see if it needed
seasoning.

Did you work for Thomas Edison?

"Whenever Thomas Edison was about to hire a new employee, he would invite
the applicant over for a bowl of soup. If the person salted his soup before
tasting it, Edison would not offer him the job. He did not hire people who
had too many assumptions built into their everyday life. Edison wanted
people who consistently challenged assumptions."

-- From Thinkertoys, by Michael Michalko, Ten Speed Press, 1991


--
Roger Shoaf

If knowledge is power, and power corrupts, what does this say about the
Congress?

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 01:03:38 GMT, (~Roy)
wrote:

shoes or boots that
required polish, nor ever get another hair cut.......and wear nothing
but blue jeans and T shirts........and sneakers.........I have held up
that statement since retiring, and dropped in and applied for the
job,, just for the hell of it. I also had my ears repierced since
retiring as well, so in I go with my earings, long hair about to the
middle of my back in a pony tail, a Black T shirt and blue jeans and
Nikes, and desperately in need of a shave as well.


That sounds like about 65% of the machinists here in California. Big
companies or little.

Gunner

"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire.
Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us)
off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give
them self determination under "play nice" rules.

Think of it as having your older brother knock the **** out of you
for torturing the cat." Gunner

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 01:03:38 GMT, (~Roy)
wrote:

(snip interesting story)

You're not an apprentice, Roy. Huge difference. Good
presentaton suggests potential, but track record and experience
beats potential at least short term. Even a biz with a long-term view
needs short-term performance if there is to be any long-term.

On 25 Sep 2005 17:26:31 -0700, mr electron wrote:

I have applied to a machine shop looking for apprentices. This week I
will have in interview and was wondering the typical attire for this
type of interview. I've always been taught to dress neatly in the
typical attire of the employees working there. Shop attire there is
typically jeans and a t-shirt.

I have no time to purchase any clothing due to my schedule. Would
wearing a pair of work pants and a dark t-shirt be okay? That would be
typical attire of the employees there. The only other option I have is
a 3-piece suit, which I believe would be out of the question for this
type of job.

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question.

Thanks



C'mon! You can only choose bwtn a 3-piece or a T-shirt??

How about a clean pair of Dockers and a shirt with some buttons. Wear a
simple belt with the Dockers and roll the sleeves up off the wrist if the
shirt is a long sleeve.

....my current boss still teases me occasionally about not wearing a tie to
my interview with her two jobs ago!
--
Skuke
Reverse the domain name to send email

On Tue, 27 Sep 2005 20:56:39 -0700, "Roger Shoaf"
wrote:

"Whenever Thomas Edison was about to hire a new employee, he would invite
the applicant over for a bowl of soup. If the person salted his soup before
tasting it, Edison would not offer him the job. He did not hire people who
had too many assumptions built into their everyday life. Edison wanted
people who consistently challenged assumptions."

-- From Thinkertoys, by Michael Michalko, Ten Speed Press, 1991

That's scary! I'd not heard that story before, but I used a similar
test. I took applicants to lunch, let them order whatever they might
like -- and noted what assumptions they made at table before tasting.

I also noted table manners, in the sense of regard for others
regardless of which hand one might grab a spoon or fork or a chicken
wing. I don't mind if a guy jams his face with grub while farting,
but I had customers of more refined sensibilities.

I also condidered the instincts of my VietNamese "secretary", a
teammate who was far more than a "secretary" but that's how I found a
fit in my org that HR couldn't reject though they sure tried. I
wasn't supposed to hire her, only supposed to give her an interview to
check a box. I offered her the job after 15 minutes of interview.
English was and still is a third language for her, but she was and is
an unusually capable person when it came to getting done whatever
needed doing.

She'd organized logistics of feeding Saigon during the fall with a
price of many piasters on her head, made the last plane outta Saigon.
She's an incredibly capable woman with good instincts. I've
been retired for 6 years now, still see her now and then when I
occasionally visit the ol' puzzlepalace to consult.
Politically-incorrect-in-the-workplace hugs happen, oh well.

Roger Shoaf wrote:


"Whenever Thomas Edison was about to hire a new employee, he would invite
the applicant over for a bowl of soup. If the person salted his soup before
tasting it, Edison would not offer him the job. He did not hire people who
had too many assumptions built into their everyday life. Edison wanted
people who consistently challenged assumptions."

How about people who challenged the (foolish) assumption that pre-salting soup
indicated a lack of independent/creative thinking?

Joe (who doesn't care for the taste of salt)

"Joe" wrote in message
...


Roger Shoaf wrote:


"Whenever Thomas Edison was about to hire a new employee, he would
invite
the applicant over for a bowl of soup. If the person salted his soup
before
tasting it, Edison would not offer him the job. He did not hire people
who
had too many assumptions built into their everyday life. Edison wanted
people who consistently challenged assumptions."

How about people who challenged the (foolish) assumption that pre-salting
soup
indicated a lack of independent/creative thinking?

Joe (who doesn't care for the taste of salt)


Yeah, that Edison made some pretty stupid choices, didn't he?

" people who challenged the (foolish) assumption that pre-salting soup
indicated a lack of independent/creative thinking" sounds like a modernist
liberal to me.

Steve

"SteveB" wrote in message
news:5sy_e.83986$DW1.12482@fed1read06...
Yeah, that Edison made some pretty stupid choices, didn't he?

Tell me just what you think you know about Edison, that great man.

"Mike Young" wrote in message
.. .
"SteveB" wrote in message
news:5sy_e.83986$DW1.12482@fed1read06...
Yeah, that Edison made some pretty stupid choices, didn't he?

Tell me just what you think you know about Edison, that great man.


Well as someone that admires Edison, I think one of his biggest bone head
screw-ups was picking the wrong side in the AC vs. DC debate.

But all in all, he does deserve the title Great Man.

--

__
Roger Shoaf

Important factors in selecting a mate:
1] Depth of gene pool
2] Position on the food chain.

"Mike Young" wrote in message
.. .
"SteveB" wrote in message
news:5sy_e.83986$DW1.12482@fed1read06...
Yeah, that Edison made some pretty stupid choices, didn't he?

Tell me just what you think you know about Edison, that great man.


That would be impossible. I could tell you what I DO know about him,
though.

Steve

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 16:25:08 GMT, Mike Young wrote:
"SteveB" wrote in message
news:5sy_e.83986$DW1.12482@fed1read06...
Yeah, that Edison made some pretty stupid choices, didn't he?

Tell me just what you think you know about Edison, that great man.

Edison was a crook who took credit for the work of others, and pulled off
marketing scams which sent the electrical generation industry back a
decade. He was the Bill Gates/Microsoft of his century, and I don't
mean that in anything approaching a good way.

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 09:34:19 -0700, Roger Shoaf wrote:

Well as someone that admires Edison, I think one of his biggest bone head
screw-ups was picking the wrong side in the AC vs. DC debate.

He didn't "pick the wrong side", he picked the side which would result
in immensely more generator sales for his company. He did everything he
could to impede (heh...impede, get it?) AC power and acceptance of same.

But all in all, he does deserve the title Great Man.

In much the same way as other ruthless industrialists who would lie,
cheat, and steal to reach their objectives, I suppose, yeah.

Dave Hinz

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 17:56:57 GMT, Ignoramus26153 wrote:
On 28 Sep 2005 17:55:17 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:

Edison was a crook who took credit for the work of others, and pulled off
marketing scams which sent the electrical generation industry back a
decade. He was the Bill Gates/Microsoft of his century, and I don't
mean that in anything approaching a good way.

Dave, do you know of any book that honestly discusses this? I heard
these allegations and they make some sense, but I want to go a little
in depth.

I've got a new, in the wrapper copy of "Tesla - a man before his time".
email me your address and it's yours. Goes into the specifics of the
AC/DC GE vs. Westinghouse thing in detail. Short version: Tesla
approached Edison with this new thing he invented called AC. Edison
told him he'd pay $30,000 if Tesla would develop it to "usable", Tesla
did. Edison weaseled; Tesla went to Westinghouse. Edison then did
everything possible (including public electrocution of dogs by AC) to
show that his DC was "better".

I will refrain from commenting on my 12 years of experience working
for the company Edison founded.

Dave Hinz

Not only dogs - there is a remarkable film of the electrocution of an
elephant that he tried to use to scare the gullible public about the dangers
of AC...

Edison then did
everything possible (including public electrocution of dogs by AC) to
show that his DC was "better".

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 18:42:00 GMT, Emmo wrote:
Not only dogs - there is a remarkable film of the electrocution of an
elephant that he tried to use to scare the gullible public about the dangers
of AC...

I've also heard, but cannot provide a cite for, claims that Edison
actually pushed for executions to take place in AC-powered electric
chairs, and referred to those so executed as being "Westinghoused".
Actually, if about.com is a credible source, check this:
http://inventors.about.com/od/hstart...tric_Chair.htm

Dave Hinz

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005 01:14:14 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "Mike
Young" quickly quoth:

"Andy Asberry" wrote in message
.. .
I once worked for a fellow who wouldn't hire anyone until he had taken
them to lunch. His hiring decision hinged on whether a candidate
seasoned their food before taking the first bite to see if it needed
seasoning.

There's probably more to it than you're telling,

That's quite likely true.


but he sounds like a bigger fool than the ones he weeded out.

I'd think it would tranlate to a guy who took a cut on the lathe
prior to miking the piece.

We all know it's "Measurement first, condiment second, IF needed."

--
"Simplicity of life, even the barest, is not misery but
the very foundation of refinement." --William Morris
-----------------------------------
www.diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development

On Tue, 27 Sep 2005 20:56:39 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
"Roger Shoaf" quickly quoth:


"Andy Asberry" wrote in message
.. .
On 25 Sep 2005 17:26:31 -0700, "mr electron"

I once worked for a fellow who wouldn't hire anyone until he had taken
them to lunch. His hiring decision hinged on whether a candidate
seasoned their food before taking the first bite to see if it needed
seasoning.

Did you work for Thomas Edison?

"Whenever Thomas Edison was about to hire a new employee, he would invite
the applicant over for a bowl of soup. If the person salted his soup before
tasting it, Edison would not offer him the job. He did not hire people who
had too many assumptions built into their everyday life. Edison wanted
people who consistently challenged assumptions."

-- From Thinkertoys, by Michael Michalko, Ten Speed Press, 1991

Smart man, that Tom guy.


If knowledge is power, and power corrupts, what does this say about the
Congress?

It says that they're totally uncorrupted. They obviously have no
knowledge about anything resembling common sense or anything which
relates to the public they supposedly serve.

My neighbor mentioned some congresswoman who didn't know that many
poor people in LA didn't own cars or drive! She didn't realize they
couldn't afford cars, gas, insurance, repairs, etc.

--
"Simplicity of life, even the barest, is not misery but
the very foundation of refinement." --William Morris
-----------------------------------
www.diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development