5th Wheel Hich Position?
 

A fifth-wheel trailer is one that has a hitch that connects to the
towing vehicle at a point above the rear axle of the towing vehicle -
not at a point on the rear of the vehicle as with a pull-behind trailer.
For example, this is a 5th wheel:
http://www.theironworker.com/Fifth%2...%20Trailer.jpg

My question concerns position of the point of attachment, let's say, the
position of the king pin. For normal pulling of the trailer, where is
the best point to have the king pin? Should it be directly over the axle
of the towing vehicle or should it be ahead of the axle? If ahead, by
how much? In what ways does handling change if the position of the king
pin is changed?

This page http://www.etrailer.com/faq/fifthwheelfaq.asp discusses using
a slider arrangement to move the king pin for maneuverability. It doesn'
t discuss the optimum position for towing.

Instructions that came with a hitch say to mount 0 to 6 inches ahead of
the axle, but provides no further information.

--
|||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||

"Nehmo" wrote in message
...
A fifth-wheel trailer is one that has a hitch that connects to the
towing vehicle at a point above the rear axle of the towing vehicle -
not at a point on the rear of the vehicle as with a pull-behind trailer.
For example, this is a 5th wheel:
http://www.theironworker.com/Fifth%2...%20Trailer.jpg

My question concerns position of the point of attachment, let's say, the
position of the king pin. For normal pulling of the trailer, where is
the best point to have the king pin? Should it be directly over the axle
of the towing vehicle or should it be ahead of the axle? If ahead, by
how much? In what ways does handling change if the position of the king
pin is changed?

Each truck's manufacturer has their own specifications as to the proper
location. Many say to position the center 2" - 4" forward of the rear axle
while others specify a position directly over the axle.

You may wish to peruse the installation instructions on the Reese website
for hitch rails similar to the ones you are interested in on the make and
model truck that you have.

http://www.reeseprod.com/support/sup...shtml#5thwheel will take
you directly to their support page.

The reason for the placement of the hitch centerpoint above or very slightly
ahead of the rear axle is to allow that portion of the weight of the trailer
that rests upon the hitch to be transferred to the rear axle without
disturbing the balance of the truck. If the point of weight transfer falls
behind the rear axle then the front (steering!) wheels are levered upwards
with a corresponding reduction in vehicle control.

Doing a wheelie down the highway while pulling a trailer will attract LOTS
of unwelcome attention! G


This page http://www.etrailer.com/faq/fifthwheelfaq.asp discusses using
a slider arrangement to move the king pin for maneuverability. It doesn'
t discuss the optimum position for towing.

The sliding hitch mount is intended to provide adequate clearance, during
tight turns, between the rear of the cab and the front of the trailer when a
short (6' or less bed) wheelbase truck is used as a tow vehicle.


Instructions that came with a hitch say to mount 0 to 6 inches ahead of
the axle, but provides no further information.

--
|||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||

Greetings,

Different vehicle manufacturers (as well as the hitch manufacturers) will
have varying recommendations. You are going to have to read your owner's
manual as well as the help and installation pages from the hitch
manufacturer's web sites for the best information for the set-up you have.

As for handling, the farther forward the king pin is in front of the rear
axle, the more weight is transfered forward to the front wheels. Admittedly
6" may not sound like a whole lot, but the only way to determine what feels
best to you when towing your particular combination is trial and error,
which is much easier with a sliding set-up.. A change of an inch or two
could make your steering feel heavier or lighter, or give you too much rear
end "squirm". If you go to a newsgroup like alt.rv I can almost guarantee
that the folks there will have more than a few things to say about this!

Depending on the length of the bed it most likely effect your turning radius
as well. This is especially important with a short-bed truck. The last
thing you want is to have the front corner of the trailer crush your back
window and back edge of your roof while you are taking a tight turn. This
is why you see so many forward-offset kingpin setups on the larger 5th wheel
trailers these days.

Cheers - Jonathan

"Nehmo" wrote in message
...
A fifth-wheel trailer is one that has a hitch that connects to the
towing vehicle at a point above the rear axle of the towing vehicle -
not at a point on the rear of the vehicle as with a pull-behind trailer.
For example, this is a 5th wheel:
http://www.theironworker.com/Fifth%2...%20Trailer.jpg

My question concerns position of the point of attachment, let's say, the
position of the king pin. For normal pulling of the trailer, where is
the best point to have the king pin? Should it be directly over the axle
of the towing vehicle or should it be ahead of the axle? If ahead, by
how much? In what ways does handling change if the position of the king
pin is changed?

This page http://www.etrailer.com/faq/fifthwheelfaq.asp discusses using
a slider arrangement to move the king pin for maneuverability. It doesn'
t discuss the optimum position for towing.

Instructions that came with a hitch say to mount 0 to 6 inches ahead of
the axle, but provides no further information.

--
|||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||

My hitch is directly over the rear axle. Vehicle is a '99 F350 CC 4x4
8' bed. Hitch weight is 2300 lbs. Handling is transparent. With the
5th wheel attached, the truck is level. 5th wheel axles have been
reversed to match the truck.


"Nehmo" wrote in message
...
: A fifth-wheel trailer is one that has a hitch that connects to the
: towing vehicle at a point above the rear axle of the towing vehicle -
: not at a point on the rear of the vehicle as with a pull-behind
trailer.
: For example, this is a 5th wheel:
: http://www.theironworker.com/Fifth%2...%20Trailer.jpg
:
: My question concerns position of the point of attachment, let's say,
the
: position of the king pin. For normal pulling of the trailer, where is
: the best point to have the king pin? Should it be directly over the
axle
: of the towing vehicle or should it be ahead of the axle? If ahead, by
: how much? In what ways does handling change if the position of the
king
: pin is changed?
:
: This page http://www.etrailer.com/faq/fifthwheelfaq.asp discusses
using
: a slider arrangement to move the king pin for maneuverability. It
doesn'
: t discuss the optimum position for towing.
:
: Instructions that came with a hitch say to mount 0 to 6 inches ahead
of
: the axle, but provides no further information.
:
: --
: |||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||
:

RAM^3 wrote:
"Nehmo" wrote in message
...

A fifth-wheel trailer is one that has a hitch that connects to the
towing vehicle at a point above the rear axle of the towing vehicle -
not at a point on the rear of the vehicle as with a pull-behind trailer.
For example, this is a 5th wheel:
http://www.theironworker.com/Fifth%2...%20Trailer.jpg

My question concerns position of the point of attachment, let's say, the
position of the king pin. For normal pulling of the trailer, where is
the best point to have the king pin? Should it be directly over the axle
of the towing vehicle or should it be ahead of the axle? If ahead, by
how much? In what ways does handling change if the position of the king
pin is changed?


Each truck's manufacturer has their own specifications as to the proper
location. Many say to position the center 2" - 4" forward of the rear axle
while others specify a position directly over the axle.

You may wish to peruse the installation instructions on the Reese website
for hitch rails similar to the ones you are interested in on the make and
model truck that you have.

http://www.reeseprod.com/support/sup...shtml#5thwheel will take
you directly to their support page.

The reason for the placement of the hitch centerpoint above or very slightly
ahead of the rear axle is to allow that portion of the weight of the trailer
that rests upon the hitch to be transferred to the rear axle without
disturbing the balance of the truck. If the point of weight transfer falls
behind the rear axle then the front (steering!) wheels are levered upwards
with a corresponding reduction in vehicle control.

Doing a wheelie down the highway while pulling a trailer will attract LOTS
of unwelcome attention! G

This page http://www.etrailer.com/faq/fifthwheelfaq.asp discusses using
a slider arrangement to move the king pin for maneuverability. It doesn'
t discuss the optimum position for towing.


The sliding hitch mount is intended to provide adequate clearance, during
tight turns, between the rear of the cab and the front of the trailer when a
short (6' or less bed) wheelbase truck is used as a tow vehicle.


Instructions that came with a hitch say to mount 0 to 6 inches ahead of
the axle, but provides no further information.

--
|||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||




I would think that the weight of the engine would be one of the
considering factors for hitch location. Such as the Ram hitch is over
the axle, but my 94 GMC with a 350 gas engine is 3" forward. Both trucks
are almost the same length and wheel base.
The Ram clearance is 37" (pin to cab) but the 5th wheel is quite a bit
wider. I do not know what the turn angle is, but it will be far less
than 90deg.
I might consider on installing a slider so I can gain cab clearance of
a couple of inches at 90deg, that would be aproximately 11" plus the
desired clearance. My rig is 96" wide, pin location is aproximately 1"
forward of front cap. I know the Cumins engine is heavy but I dont think
I would consider runnig down the road with the pin slid back.

Any suggestions?

--
BILL P.

2004, 2500 SLT Quad Cab, Dodge Ram,
SLT, SWB, 2WD,
5.9 HO Turbo Diesel, 48RE Auto Trans,
Anti-Spin 3.73 Dif.Rhino Liner,
Husky 16K. Voyager Controller
2005, 27RL Wildcat, DT/PC Wi-Fi.
Dual EU2000i Hondas
Just Me and Dog

I towed a 30' fifth wheel with a RAM 2500 with an 8' bed for ten
years. The hitch was positioned so that the king pin was directly
over the rear axle and the handling was great. The trailer weight
was ~8,000 lbs.

--



PcolaPhil


To Reply Remove -SPAMNOT-


24 hours in a day ... 24 beers in a case...coincidence?



"Nehmo" wrote in message
...
|A fifth-wheel trailer is one that has a hitch that connects to the
| towing vehicle at a point above the rear axle of the towing
vehicle -
| not at a point on the rear of the vehicle as with a pull-behind
trailer.
| For example, this is a 5th wheel:
| http://www.theironworker.com/Fifth%2...%20Trailer.jpg
|
| My question concerns position of the point of attachment, let's
say, the
| position of the king pin. For normal pulling of the trailer, where
is
| the best point to have the king pin? Should it be directly over
the axle
| of the towing vehicle or should it be ahead of the axle? If ahead,
by
| how much? In what ways does handling change if the position of the
king
| pin is changed?
|
| This page http://www.etrailer.com/faq/fifthwheelfaq.asp discusses
using
| a slider arrangement to move the king pin for maneuverability. It
doesn'
| t discuss the optimum position for towing.
|
| Instructions that came with a hitch say to mount 0 to 6 inches
ahead of
| the axle, but provides no further information.
|
| --
||||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||
|

There is a formula which can be used to accurately calculate
the position of the fifth wheel, but you need to have a few
details about the trailer and tow vehicle.

You need to know how much weight is transferred onto the
fifth wheel when laden by the trailer.

You need to know the unladen weight of the towing vehicle
and the unladen weight on each axle. You also need to know
the maximum weight allowed on each axle.

You need to know the wheelbase of the towing vehicle.

Loadbase is the distance from the fifth wheel to the front axle

The formula is

weight transferred onto front axle =

(wheelbase / loadbase)* weight transferred onto the fifth wheel

You can the play around with the "loadbase" number to achieve
the optimum weight distribution onto the front and rear axles.
Ideally you want to have weight transferred onto the front and
rear axles in the same ratio as the manufacturer's maximum gross
weights. eg max weight on steer of 3 tonnes and 6 tonnes on
the rear indicates a 1:2 ratio.

We used extensions of this basic formula to achieve maximum
loading on B Double fuel tankers with 8 compartments with
varying fuel density to ensure we max loaded to legal limts every
load.

If you use pounds then use inches, if you use kilogrammes
use centimetres. Dont mix your avoirdupois with your metrics.


"Nehmo" wrote in message
...
A fifth-wheel trailer is one that has a hitch that connects to the
towing vehicle at a point above the rear axle of the towing vehicle -
not at a point on the rear of the vehicle as with a pull-behind trailer.
For example, this is a 5th wheel:
http://www.theironworker.com/Fifth%2...%20Trailer.jpg

My question concerns position of the point of attachment, let's say, the
position of the king pin. For normal pulling of the trailer, where is
the best point to have the king pin? Should it be directly over the axle
of the towing vehicle or should it be ahead of the axle? If ahead, by
how much? In what ways does handling change if the position of the king
pin is changed?

This page http://www.etrailer.com/faq/fifthwheelfaq.asp discusses using
a slider arrangement to move the king pin for maneuverability. It doesn'
t discuss the optimum position for towing.

Instructions that came with a hitch say to mount 0 to 6 inches ahead of
the axle, but provides no further information.

--
|||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||