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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
Gunner wrote:
On Mon, 25 Aug 2003 18:06:37 GMT, ate (JFoster) wrote: Mexicans reproduce at rate that chokes them to death with each other. containing vast marginally inhabitable areas. It seems not in the nature of the corruption, the culture, or the political system to facilitate development and improvement. What is well into fruition is a reconquest and conversion of Is any of the post intelligible? |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
Guido wrote: Gunner wrote: On Mon, 25 Aug 2003 18:06:37 GMT, ate (JFoster) wrote: Mexicans reproduce at rate that chokes them to death with each other. containing vast marginally inhabitable areas. It seems not in the nature of the corruption, the culture, or the political system to facilitate development and improvement. What is well into fruition is a reconquest and conversion of Is any of the post intelligible? Yes, I gather he is suggesting that Mexicans will eventually be greatrer than 50% of the population of the southwest border states, and then they will violently overthrow the rest of the population and governments, and secede from the US and rejoin Mexico. You did say intelligible, rather than intelligent! I think this scenario is pretty ridiculous. Why did they come here? To turn the US into another Mexico? Why work so hard, when they could have just stayed home? That whole ramble, of course, ignores a whole raft of points. First, of course, is that many hispanic-surnemed people in the SW US have NO connection to Mexico, whatever. They have connections to Brazil, Argentina, Chile, etc. Second, many of them (It almost has to be most of them, if they are already approaching or exceeding 50% of the population) are NOT illegal immigrants from Mexico. Probably for most of them, if they have any connection to illegal immigration, it was a grandparent or even further back that was the first to come here. Jon |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
On Mon, 25 Aug 2003 22:41:15 +0100, Guido wrote:
Gunner wrote: On Mon, 25 Aug 2003 18:06:37 GMT, ate (JFoster) wrote: Mexicans reproduce at rate that chokes them to death with each other. containing vast marginally inhabitable areas. It seems not in the nature of the corruption, the culture, or the political system to facilitate development and improvement. What is well into fruition is a reconquest and conversion of Is any of the post intelligible? Its obvious you have never lived in the Southwestern US. Gunner "The French are a smallish, monkey-looking bunch and not dressed any better, on average, than the citizens of Baltimore. True, you can sit outside in Paris and drink little cups of coffee, but why this is more stylish than sitting inside and drinking large glasses of whiskey I don't know." -- P.J O'Rourke (1989) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
In article , Jon Elson says...
... and then they will violently overthrow the rest of the population and governments, and secede from the US and rejoin Mexico. Never happen. Gunner'll be there, heavily armed, and put down the insurrection! Every immigrant population has to contend with the 'they're gonna overrun us!' hypothosis. Hence the "no irish need apply" signs that were popular for quite some time. Jim ================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================== |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
On 25 Aug 2003 18:24:00 -0700, jim rozen
wrote: In article , Jon Elson says... ... and then they will violently overthrow the rest of the population and governments, and secede from the US and rejoin Mexico. Never happen. Gunner'll be there, heavily armed, and put down the insurrection! Every immigrant population has to contend with the 'they're gonna overrun us!' hypothosis. Hence the "no irish need apply" signs that were popular for quite some time. Jim The Irish were legal, and they didnt have any intent on annexing any part of the US back to Erie. Do a web search on the Aztlan movement. Some scarey stuff. Gunner ================================================= = please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ================================================= = "The people who believe that, as a result of industrial development, life is about to become a hell, or may be one already, are guilty, at least, of sloppy pronouncements. On page 8 of Earth in the Balance, Al Gore claims that his study of the arms race gave him "a deeper appreciation for the most horrifying fact in all our lives: civilization is now capable of destroying itself." In the first place, the most horrifying fact in many of our lives is that our ex-spouse has gotten ahold of our ATM card. And civilization has always been able to destroy itself. The Greeks of ancient Athens, who had a civilization remarkable for lack of technological progress during its period of greatest knowledge and power, managed to destroy themselves just fine." -- P.J. O'Rourke, All the trouble in the world. The lighter side of famine, pestilence, destruction and death. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
Gunner wrote:
On Tue, 26 Aug 2003 00:46:44 GMT, SBaer wrote: What does any of this have to do with metalworking. Or is it just that there are are lot of bitter old guys who follow this newsgroup. Bitter? How so? That I posted an interesting article thats pretty right on the money, that helps explain a lot of the illegal emigrant situation that we all have to live with everyday, including may fiscal problems that many states have to face up to? If I posted an article about how the economy is suffering, and how manufacturing is in the toilet.. it would have many of the same roots as what this article pointed out. A heads up is bitter? Get a grip and a life. Get out a bit more. Travel the Southwest. Esa es no problemo, da nada Senior G Gunner Besides, Gunner had the courtesy to put "OT" in the subject line. That means, in case you are not aware, OFF TOPIC. Don't read OT posts if'n ya don't wanna. I can be kinda lame at times, and even I know that.g michael born in California (note the spelling, no Ks in it) and fluent in the American language. und ein bischen Deutsch, um poquito Espanol |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
On Tue, 26 Aug 2003 04:25:10 GMT, Gunner
wrote: Do a web search on the Aztlan movement. Some scarey stuff. Aztlan: Conspiracy To Overthrow The American Southwest By Force! http://debateusa.com/featured/bingman.htm By Russell R. Bingman Publisher - No B.S. News Magazine Copyright 2003 - All Rights Reserved * From both sides of the Mexican-American border of the Southwestern United States, a conspiracy to create a new country, a new nation, is boldly moving ahead, led by Mexico's charismatic President Vicente` Fox and New Mexico's new Governor Bill Richardson, former crony and bagman for former president, Bill Clinton. Richardson has a long history of corruption in New Mexico and American politics, but was easily elected by New Mexico's predominantly left-wing Hispanic constituency, many of them fully aware of Richardson's conspiring with Fox and others, including University of New Mexico Professor Charles Truxillo, age 47, who teaches Chicano studies at the University. Truxillo has been at UNM since 1988, directing various ethnic and social studies programs. From 1992 and 1997, he was an Assistant Professor of History at New Mexico Highlands University, during which time he recruited mostly Hispanic students for annual trips to Mexico, where he held symposiums about how the Southwest United States was "stolen" from Mexico, and has long been a vocal advocate of Mexicans and Hispanic Americans using whatever force necessary to reclaim the Republica del Norte` - Republic of the North. Some other activists refer to this area as Aztlan, which includes California, Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado and Texas, as well as the Mexican states of Baja California, Sonora, Chihuahua, Coahuila, Nuevo León and Tamaulipas. An Internet promotion of Aztlan is found on the website/on-line magazine La Voz de Aztlan, based in Whittier, California, which reprinted an Associated Press story on Professor Charles Truxillo and his Republica del Norte` conspiracy. La Voz is headed by Hector Carreon, a self described publisher and anti-American activist. Any disagreement with Carreon or Truxillo or their fellow conspirators, no matter how polite or factually correct, is always labeled by these terrorists, as "hate speech," and reported to the FBI as such. The website for La Voz is: http://www.aztlan.net/index.html and the URL for the Truxillo story is: http://www.aztlan.net/homeland.htm. But this is only the tip of the iceberg - the plot thickens, considerably! Bill Richardson would have New Mexican's, American's and the world believe that he is as honest and forthright as the legendary stories about George Washington and old Honest Abe Lincoln. The truth is, New Mexico has a legendary history of being one of the most corrupt states in America, beginning with numerous broken treaties with Native Americans, and the notorious Lincoln County war which gave rise to the dubious legend of Billy the Kid. Bill Richardson makes New Mexico's past roster of characters in the Rogues Gallery look like amateurs. For one thing, he is an associate of America's second most disgraced president, William Jefferson Clinton, only the second president to be impeached by Congress. Richardson was a tax & spend liberal when he was in the House of Representatives. And he was always in the company of left-wingers as an Ambassador to the United Nations. But as a Democrat governor, he is trying to masquerade as a tax-cutting Republican. And he is firing every state employee with any type of criminal record, even those who committed petty misdemeanors 20 years ago. Something is definitely rotten in Denmark with all of that. New Mexico leads the nation as a central hub for drug trafficking, and Richardson is responsible for getting the tax dollars, when he was a U.S. Representative for New Mexico, to build the state's largest, un-used airport, at Tucumcari, New Mexico. The air strip there can handle an aircraft the size of a 747 jumbo jet. The facilities most frequent use, was during the time that Bill Clinton was governor of Arkansas and reputed to be running a major drug trafficking operation out of Mena, Arkansas. Numerous direct flights from Mena to Tucumcari took place during this time, and Richardson's story of rags to riches began. According to Richardson, although he has an Anglo surname, he is half Mexican and half Anglo, his genes tending more toward the Latin blood lines in physical appearance, and he speaks fluent Spanish and English. He's also very fluent in political double speak and bureaucratic B.S. He claims he grew up poor, but valued education - studied hard, worked hard, always told the truth and walked 17 miles, barefoot in a blizzard, to repay a debt of two-dollars and 27 cents .. . . . . or something like that. It's too bad that hard work and honesty only pays off for people like Richardson and the Clinton's, and not for the rest of us. Remember, Hillary invested $1,000 on cattle futures in the stock market, and 90 days later, earned a profit of more than $100,000. Today, Richardson's family is worth several hundred million dollars, his family's most dubious earnings being some $390 million dollars from Enron, only two days before the big collapse and scandal broke, according to various low key news stories. In a January 27, 2003 story reported on Albuquerque's KOB-TV 4 news (http://www.kobtv.com/archive/2003/ja.../fox_visit.htm), Richardson and President Vicente` Fox met in Davos, Switzerland on January 25, during the World Economic Forum. After this meeting, Richardson and Fox announced that Fox would making a formal visit to New Mexico sometime in the next few months. The U.S Constitution explicitly prohibits any state's governor or legislature from entering into any treaties or agreements of commerce or war, without the express consent of Congress. While American news media, other than a couple of stories by the Associated Press, has largely ignored the issue of Aztlan, or Republic of the North, Mexican news media has reported dozens of stories in which President Fox repeatedly refers to the American Southwest as belonging to Mexico, and is soon to be reunited. Even several Mexican senators and governors have been making the same statements, and to compound the seriousness of this problem, Mexico's federal legislature has legislation pending, which would authorize a Bay of Pigs type invasion of the American Southwest, supported by limited Mexican Army activity. Here, the plot thickens even more. In early/mid January, Richardson was host to a delegation of North Korean diplomats, who made an "unofficial" visit to him in Santa Fe, supposedly under the auspices of him being a former U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations, and an old friend thereby, to whom they could pour out their hearts and seek wise council, in regard to the escalating tensions between the Bush Administration and North Korea's possible building of nuclear arms. This of course was unprecedented in U.S. diplomatic history, and another violation of the Constitution, made to appear legal, because it was supposedly an "unofficial" pow wow. None-the-less, the whole world, not the least of which was the American news media, still seemed baffled by this bizarre and mysterious series of meetings. And it created a real Catch 22 for the news media, which had been, and continues, to ignore some very frightening stories that are well known on the New Mexico/Mexico border, about a massing of well armed Mexican citizens, as well as a few thousand foreign troops, and anywhere from several hundred to a few thousand Mexican soldiers. For those who find this assertion too incredible to believe, you are excused - you may now tear this story up, toss it in the fireplace and ignore it. It is not intended to convert you. It is however, valuable news for those who pay attention to what is going on in the world, who already have a few leads, and want to know more. The few thousand foreign soldiers reported to be on the Mexican side of the border, have been reported by the U.S Border Patrol, although the Border Patrol refuses to officially acknowledge it. Over the past few weeks, there have been stories, although not widely circulated, reporting that two U.S. Border Patrol agents in the Demming, NM area, have said off-the-record, and with anonymity, that they have personally seen Chinese soldiers in full field uniforms, with weapons and gear, and that these soldiers have been found as far as 15 miles inside of the U.S. border, southeast of Demming, NM. Additionally, they have supposedly reported to have also seen a large unit of U.S. Marines operating in the same vicinity, presumably conducting reconnaissance of the Chinese unit. While the party reporting this information is deemed credible by several sources, he acknowledges that he himself has not seen either the Chinese or the Marines, but is relying upon the two Border Patrol agents who he personally knows. So far, there has not been any official, independent corroboration of this report. However, there are some very strong circumstantial facts that lend credibility, or at least give good reason for people in the Southwest to be highly concerned and suspicious, and area law enforcement officers confirm the large numbers of armed Mexicans. As many Americans are well aware, there is a small border crisis brewing on the Arizona/Mexican border. Amid this crisis are a handful of patriot/militia organizations which have formed citizen border patrols, to help repel illegal immigrants. This has infuriated Hispanic and Latino organizations which have been participating in the conspiracy to overthrow and invade the American Southwest. These culprits are claiming racism against the citizen patrols. The news media has widely reported, that the Border Patrol reports that illegal alien crossings in that sector are nearly four times higher now than a year ago, and that most of the illegal aliens are heavily armed with weapons, carrying extremely large amounts of cash or drugs. And they are becoming more and more violent, even daring to physically assault or shoot at Border Patrol agents on many occasions. From a military stand point, this strongly suggests advanced infiltration of military geographical objectives, and would easily enable forces inside, to not only attack from the rear, but would put heavily armed forces in place to carry out sabotage missions and seizure of vital resources. Certain intelligence organizations, which cannot be identified for security reasons, have acknowledged and verified that some illegal aliens have been found carrying military maps and coded instructions, which have been determined, to be for some future military use in the Southwest. There are an estimated 2.3 million illegal Mexican aliens in the Southwestern United States. In addition to these reports, nearly a year ago, it was reported by many news media sources, that U.S. intelligence agencies had learned that several thousand Chinese soldiers had entered Panama as guests. These soldiers were tracked for several weeks, moving north through Central America and into southern Mexico, where they disappeared from surveillance teams. These Chinese soldiers were well armed and equipped, and had Mexican escorts. North Korea, as one of only a few surviving Communist nations, is a very close ally of Communist China. During the time of the North Korean's visit with Governor Richardson, there was a verified flurry of activity between the Chinese, North Korean and Mexican Embassies in both Mexico and the United States. There was no reason for Bill Richardson meeting with the N. Koreans, and no reason for the Mexican's to be involved in any aspect of this, unless of course the N. Korean's visit to New Mexico had nothing to do with nuclear arms, but rather, something far more covert, if not more sinister. This would naturally have to include the Chinese. One has to ask the obvious: Why did Bill Richardson travel, at great expense to New Mexican taxpayers, to Switzerland, for the World Economic Forum, when he had absolutely no contribution to make at that forum? When one considers that the paramount reason for his being there, was to meet the Mexican President, on neutral soil, something is going on - something very secret, and very wrong! Since the meeting in Switzerland was an arranged meeting, meeting there had to be for "legal" reasons. Richardson flying to Mexico to meet Fox would have been highly suspicious. Meeting him in Switzerland still is. What wasn't reported in American news media, but was reported in the Chinese news media, Fox and Richardson met with the North Koreans and the Chinese in Switzerland. And now the Mexican president is coming to Santa Fe. The head of state of Mexico, meeting the governor of a state which has no industrial or economic benefit to Mexico, at least not legal benefits. There can be no discussion regarding "matters of state" between Richardson and Fox. Remember, the U.S. Constitution prohibits it. That is why all heads of state, go to other heads of state. Mayors in one state don't make deals with governors in another state, and governors don't make deals with presidents or prime ministers of another country. The only purpose of meetings between Richardson and Fox, given all that has been going on regarding Aztlan - Republica del Norte`, is for the advancement of the Republic of the North. To label the organizers and activists of Republica del Norte` and La Voz de Aztlan as terrorists, is highly accurate. On the La Voz website is a photo (http://www.aztlan.net/marcostobush.htm) of Venezuelan guerilla terrorist, Sub-commandante` Marcos, shown giving the commonly known gesture, "flipping the bird." The photo is captioned as "A message to George Bush, Jr. from Subcommandante Marcos, concerning CIA activities in Venezuela." Obviously Carreon has a double standard when it comes to hate speech. He always refers to Anglos as "gringos," or worse, and any disagreement with him or the idea of Aztlan, is viewed as hate speech and racism against Hispanics/Latinos. Carreon spews violent anti-Israel, anti-Jew rhetoric and hatred, even advocating the slaughter of Jews and the destruction of Israel, as well as death to all whites. Perhaps the FBI has taken note of his and Truxillo's speech. The Southwest United States was ceded to America on February 2, 1848. In 1824, after years of failure to settle Texas, the Mexican government gave an invitation to Americans, to come and settle the area, in exchange for land grants, dual citizenship and constitutional guarantees of citizens rights. More than 40,000 Americans flocked into Tejas, and within a few years, had accomplished what Mexico never had. During this time, a Mexican army officer by the name of Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna led a rebellion against the Mexican government, starting wide spread civil war in Mexico. He appointed himself to the rank of general and in 1833, organized a democratic election, in which he was elevated to president. But, believing Mexico not ready for democracy, he soon declared himself dictator and immediately terminated the Mexican constitution and all of the agreements of 1824. He ordered the Texans to either leave Mexico, or submit to his absolute authority and stripped them of the ownership of their property. In October 1835, General Martin Perfecto de Cos arrived at the Alamo with 1,200 troops to enforce Santa Anna's decree. On October 28th, the first skirmish between Texans and Cos' soldiers ended in defeat for Cos. Several more battles were later fought, always defeating the Mexican soldiers. In November 1835, the northern part of the Mexican state of Coahuila-Tejas declared itself in revolt against Mexico's President Antonio López de Santa Anna. On December 5th, a full scale battle erupted between Texan and Mexican forces, resulting in Cos' surrender on December 10th, defeated by less than 100 Texas militia soldiers. Cos and his soldiers were allowed to return to Mexico. In February 1836, Texans declared their territory to be an independent republic and that its border extended to the Rio Grande rather than the Rio Nueces that Mexicans recognized as the dividing line. On February 23rd, General Santa Anna arrived with a disputed force of 2,000 to 5,000 soldiers, attacking the Alamo on March 6th in the pre-dawn. All 189 defenders died in the massacre. On April 21, 1836 the Texans proclaimed themselves citizens of the Independent Republic of Texas following their victory over Santa Anna at the Battle of San Jacinto. Santa Anna, a heavy cocaine user and rampant womanizer, had decided to take the day off, spending the day in his silk pajamas, using large quantities of cocaine and having sex with his mulatto slave, Emily Morgan, known later as the yellow rose of Texas. His soldiers took the day off as well. The sleepy Mexican encampment was surprised by General Sam Houston and his small force, defeating the Mexicans in less than 20 minutes. Santa Anna signed a treaty that day, ending the war, granting the Texans their independence and their claims of Texas. He was allowed to return to Mexico. In December 1845, the U.S. Congress voted to annex the Texas Republic and soon sent troops led by General Zachary Taylor to the Rio Grande to protect its border with Mexico, which had decided that Texas still belonged to Mexico. The clashes between Mexican troops and U.S. forces led to a Congressional declaration of war on May 13, 1846. Fighting continued for the next two years as General Taylor led his troops through to Monterrey, and General Stephen Kearny and his men went to New Mexico, Chihuahua, and California. But it was General Winfield Scott and his army that delivered the decisive blows as they marched from Veracruz to Puebla and finally captured Mexico City itself in August 1847. Mexican officials and President Polk's representative, Nicholas Trist, began discussions for a peace treaty that August. On February 2, 1848 the Treaty was signed in Guadalupe Hidalgo, a city north of the capital where the Mexican government had fled as U.S. troops advanced. Its provisions called for Mexico to cede 55% of its territory (present-day Arizona, California, New Mexico, Texas, and parts of Colorado, Nevada and Utah) in exchange for $15 million dollars, a figure calculated by the Mexicans. All of that brief history is very accurate, and it establishes a firm foundation, that the American Southwest is the rightful and legal property of the United States of America, and not the property of Mexico. Texas and U.S. military forces have repeatedly defeated Mexican aggression, and each time, Mexico's duly elected governments have signed treaties, ceding all claims to the Southwest, and millions of dollars in compensation has been paid to Mexico. But the forces of Republica del Norte` and La Voz de Aztlan, and all of their cohorts and co-conspirators, are declaring that America stole this land from Mexico. Furthermore, Carreon and Truxillo ignore the fact that their Hispanic ancestors are the true, original thieves of Aztlan and Mexico itself, being seized by Spanish explorers, who paid nobody anything for the land they claimed, and in fact, butchered and murdered hundreds of thousands of Incas, Aztecs, Myans and Apache Indians. Some of the most horrific atrocities ever committed against any of the native peoples of North America, were committed by Mexicans and their Spanish ancestors. The legendary Apache Geronimo, after his defeat, frequently recounted to listeners, how Mexican soldiers raped and murdered his wife and young adolescent daughters, as well as hundreds of his fellow Apache's. General Santa Anna, after his victory at the Alamo, marched to Goliad, Texas and defeated Colonel James Fannin and his command. Fannin and some 290 survivors surrendered, and were then systematically tortured and murdered by Santa Anna and his men. The terroristic forces of Aztlan/Republic of the North, have made clear, that they intend to violently overthrow, by force, at least part of the United States of America. They are flooding America's borders with tens of thousands of heavily armed, well financed illegal aliens. A February 2, 2003 article*(see end of this article) in the Denver Post, reported that there is an estimated 7 million illegal aliens in America . That is a very conservative figure. The 2000 census estimated a minimum of 8 million illegals. The U.S. Border Patrol and the Immigration and Naturalization Service agree that more than 69% of illegal aliens are Mexicans. That's more than 5.5 million people. The various Hispanic and Latino advocacy organizations in America, such as LULAC, declare that this focus is an evidence of racism and promotes hate, claiming that the percentage or numbers of illegal Mexicans is irrelevant, because they have an inherent right to be here. Of the more than 5.5 million illegal Mexicans in America, more than a million of them are heavily armed. Colorado, as reported in the Denver Post article, now has the 3rd largest influx of these illegals. Colorado is a key objective in Republica del Norte take-over. They are supported by foreign powers which have made clear that they intend to destroy and defeat America. The greatest threat of terrorism to America is a lot closer than Iraq or North Korea - its already inside of America, and on its southern border. On February 12th, 2003, an announcement by Director George J. Tenet of the CIA was widely reported, in which he stated that North Korea has enough plutonium to make one or two missiles, capable of hitting any part of the western United States, and declared this to be the reason for the heightened security alert status of orange. At the same time as Director Tenet was explaining Alert Status Orange, it was reported that New Mexico National Guard's 720th Transportation Company was preparing for departure to the Middle East. With the absence of 720th from the ranks, New Mexico's National Guard would have no transportation ability to deploy Guard members or troops or equipment in the event of an emergency or border invasion. Arizona, California and Texas are in similar situations. Many believe that the U.S. attack on Iraq will come sometime between March 1st and the 5th, during the dark phase of the moon, which is the most likely scenario. With the N. Korea nuclear threat situation, now being called a "crisis," increasing rapidly, America could very likely be facing a war in the Far East at the same time as a war with Iraq. Saddam Hussein has repeatedly boasted, echoed by other Middle East countries, that President Bush and America are in for a very big surprise when America attacks Iraq. A nuclear attack from N. Korea, and/or a border invasion from Mexico, with heavily armed forces, reinforced by N. Korea or China would indeed be a very big surprise for those failing to see such a possibility. Considering the forces now plotting against America, it seems that May 1st, the Socialist May Day celebration, and Cinco de Mayo, the Mexican celebration of May 5th, could be likely target dates for their attack. However, that does not preclude an earlier or later date. snip -------------------------------------------------------------------- All true? Dont know. Mostly true? Yup. Draw your own conclusions, do your own research. Shrug. Gunner "The people who believe that, as a result of industrial development, life is about to become a hell, or may be one already, are guilty, at least, of sloppy pronouncements. On page 8 of Earth in the Balance, Al Gore claims that his study of the arms race gave him "a deeper appreciation for the most horrifying fact in all our lives: civilization is now capable of destroying itself." In the first place, the most horrifying fact in many of our lives is that our ex-spouse has gotten ahold of our ATM card. And civilization has always been able to destroy itself. The Greeks of ancient Athens, who had a civilization remarkable for lack of technological progress during its period of greatest knowledge and power, managed to destroy themselves just fine." -- P.J. O'Rourke, All the trouble in the world. The lighter side of famine, pestilence, destruction and death. |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
Exactly, we are all from immigrant stock, even my relatives who came
over in the 1600's. Frankly I'd rather have new citizens who were willing to leave wherever they are from and come to the US, work hard, etc. I often suggest (tongue in cheek) that for every illegal immigrant who braves the crossing we should deport some lazy white trash on welfare to cuba, mexico or haiti. The reason the republicans are courting the hispanic/latino vote is because the majority are conservative, not communists. As for language, don't get me started - for those of us who have anglo-quebeckers in our family we know the hardship and discrimination you bear when official language laws are adopted. Nick, only two OT posts this year so far! On 25 Aug 2003 18:24:00 -0700, jim rozen wrote: Every immigrant population has to contend with the 'they're gonna overrun us!' hypothosis. Hence the "no irish need apply" signs that were popular for quite some time. Jim |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
wws wrote in article ... "Jon Elson" wrote in message ... Guido wrote: Gunner wrote: On Mon, 25 Aug 2003 18:06:37 GMT, ate (JFoster) wrote: Mexicans reproduce at rate that chokes them to death with each other. containing vast marginally inhabitable areas. It seems not in the nature of the corruption, the culture, or the political system to facilitate development and improvement. What is well into fruition is a reconquest and conversion of Is any of the post intelligible? Yes, I gather he is suggesting that Mexicans will eventually be greatrer than 50% of the population of the southwest border states, and then they will violently overthrow the rest of the population and governments, and secede from the US and rejoin Mexico. You did say intelligible, rather than intelligent! I think this scenario is pretty ridiculous. Why did they come here? To turn the US into another Mexico? Why work so hard, when they could have just stayed home? That whole ramble, of course, ignores a whole raft of points. First, of course, is that many hispanic-surnemed people in the SW US have NO connection to Mexico, whatever. They have connections to Brazil, Argentina, Chile, etc. Second, many of them (It almost has to be most of them, if they are already approaching or exceeding 50% of the population) are NOT illegal immigrants from Mexico. Probably for most of them, if they have any connection to illegal immigration, it was a grandparent or even further back that was the first to come here. Jon I am the only us citizen in my apartments.only english speaker too Not at all unheard of. How can you sleep with all the 2-3 year old kids runnin and screamin in the hallways from 11:00 pm to 2:00 am while their parents are busy ...uh ...watchin TV with the volumn turned up? Don't ferget each kid is a citizen so maybe you need to do a recount. ...often. |
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OT= Slouching Toward Servitude
Gunner wrote: Chuckle..Dont live in California do you..... You're right - 2000 miles away. I recently took my first trip back to the Washington DC area in 20 years or so, and was astounded that the place looked (and especially sounded) like some other country. NOBODY spoke English as a first language! Wow, what a change! St. Louis is not like that, however. Jon |
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