Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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  #271   Report Post  
Old June 26th 05, 08:41 PM
Morris Dovey
 
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Cliff (in ) said:

| On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 20:47:34 -0500, "Morris Dovey"
| wrote:
|
|| Whirlpool
|
| I once met their engineer that suggested replacing
| all those custom hoses, fittings, pumps, etc. on their
| washing machine models with a single set of standard
| ones. I gather that they did it.

Seems like a "no-brainer to me" - though the no-brainer solutions are
sometimes the most difficult to get approved.

One of the other no-brainers (for CPU-controlled washers) should be to
allow either hose to connect to hot and the other to the cold water
supply. The controllers monitor both temperatures and control the flow
valves independently anyway...

| To this day I wonder how they got the contract for
| the toilet(s) on the International Space Station.

Interesting - I wasn't aware they'd done that.

| BTW, They used to use ComputerVision IIRC.

Ok. My primary software tools were gcc, Visual C, and Excel (in order
of high to low quality) - No CAD/CAM needed for what I was doing. I
did notice that the mechanical engineering types had some pretty nifty
packages for designing gears 'n' stuff, though. One of the guys took
time to teach me a bit about making gear trains quiet - and that was
so fascinating I skipped lunch. (I suppose that makes both he and I
hopeless geeks :-)

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/solar.html



  #272   Report Post  
Old June 26th 05, 11:46 PM
Cliff
 
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On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 14:19:28 -0500, "Morris Dovey"
wrote:

| None of that would give any hint of what actually failed in the
| field and flooded out the end customer or anything similar.
| For that you'd need to know what went wrong, not just
| how to make it cheaper.

Of course. Did the paragraphs following the one you quoted make it to
your server? If not:


They made it but did not seem to be on that issue.
Perhaps you had to be there?
--
Cliff
  #273   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 12:17 AM
Morris Dovey
 
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Cliff (in ) said:

| On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 14:19:28 -0500, "Morris Dovey"
| wrote:
|
||| None of that would give any hint of what actually failed in the
||| field and flooded out the end customer or anything similar.
||| For that you'd need to know what went wrong, not just
||| how to make it cheaper.
||
|| Of course. Did the paragraphs following the one you quoted make it
|| to your server? If not:
|
| They made it but did not seem to be on that issue.
| Perhaps you had to be there?

Oops. Sorry, I may have assumed too much. Customer service call center
operators take calls from customers (and sometimes from dealers) when
there's either a problem or a how-to issue. Maytag's call center had
several hundred people and these operators seemed to have been more
knowledgable than I'd expected, given the number of products and
models supported.

Cost seemed to be a secondary consideration to these people. Their
mission (/their/ mission if not the corporation's) was to resolve any
issues to the satisfaction of the customer. If/when they thought the
issue was a consequence of design, even if the use was unusual, they
weren't bashful about letting the R&D group know about it. I think
part of their motivation was "Golden Rule" and part of it was workload
reduction (fewer future service calls for the same problem). Although
I didn't have a lot of contact with CS, I'm aware that even when the
problem was something the customer had done wrong (there actually
/are/ people who'll put a half box of detergent in with a single load
of clothes!) they tried to make a follow-up call sometime /after/
problem resolution to verify satisfaction.

CS isn't a cost reducing function. More usually it adds cost - since
they provide the information leading to engineering changes for
released products. I'm not aware of any instance where their input
ever led to making the product cheaper. I suppose it could happen, but
I didn't see it.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/solar.html


  #274   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 12:56 AM
wmbjk
 
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On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:31:04 -0400, "John P Bengi" JBengi
(spamm)@(spamm) yahoo,com wrote:

"daestrom" wrote in message
. ..


The subject is 'workshop in an alternate homepower environment', but it

has
degenerated to YAWVGM (yet-another-wayne-versus-george-match).


I am onboard totally with you on this one. Must be the Great Lakes
environment...LOL Hot huh?


What the heck are you talkin' about Gymmy Bob? I count 12 posts from
you so far in this thread. 10 are your usual worthless jackass
comments, and none contain so much as a hint of off-grid workshop
experience. Which is hardly surprising, given that somebody who posts
24-7 hasn't any need for a workshop on or off grid. George has dropped
14 steaming loads so far, with the only off-grid workshop connection
being his resentment of mine. No surprise there either. My posts total
31, half dead on topic (which is sometimes a bit like work), the
others being my reward - getting to skewer both the man of a thousand
IDs, and the Blunder From Down Under. Although frankly, the two of you
are making it so easy, you're taking most of the fun out of it.

Wayne
  #275   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 03:02 AM
Robert Bonomi
 
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In article ,
John P Bengi JBengi (spamm)@(spamm) yahoo,com wrote:
You must live in a tiny town if they sent out an Engineer for that...LOL


depends on how you qualify it. biggest town in the state. pop. circa 250K

Did he have ditch digging caluses on his hands too?


*snicker*

Nice going. Never give up when you know you are right.


You would never get a rebate here for high voltage. power delivered is power
billed.


It was _unexpected_. I hadn't asked for it.

It wasn't big bucks either. 30+ years ago, now, so I don't have any precise
recollection of amount -- but I'm pretty sure it was under $20. An apartment,
in summertime -- without A/C -- and with a gas stove, doesn't use a lot of
power.



  #276   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 03:06 AM
Robert Bonomi
 
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In article ,
Tim Thomson wrote:

As a matter of fact would his metor not run less with some things like his
fridge, vacuum, hair dryer, washing machine, dish washer, etc. What makes a
power metor spin? If voltage goes up does the amp draw go down?


Are you familiar with "Ohm's Law"?

If the _resistance_ is a fixed value, guess what happens to the current (amps)
when the voltage goes up.



  #277   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 03:13 AM
Robert Bonomi
 
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In article ,
Tim Thomson wrote:
Robert Bonomi wrote:


[[.. munch ..]]


I even got a credit on my bill -- where they went back an re-figured what the
kilowatt-hours _should_ have been if they had not been delivering 'too high'
voltage. I'd only lived there a few months, but they back-credited to the
date I moved in. It was about 15% of everything I'd paid.


I call bull**** on the credit! As if..............


I was there. You weren't. Your claim is bullsh*t.

Note: I didn't even _ask_ for that credit. They did it all by themselves.

Note: this was more than 30 years ago. And in a territory with a strong and
active regulatory agency. And a state Attorney General that *really* hated
that particular utility company -- they had previously *sued* him, requesting
that the court grant order him to 'cease and desist harassment', no less.




  #278   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 03:39 AM
John P Bengi
 
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Motor based appliances are not fixed resistances. As the voltage goes down
the current goes up to achieve the same horsepower and the same RPM

"Robert Bonomi" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tim Thomson wrote:

As a matter of fact would his metor not run less with some things like

his
fridge, vacuum, hair dryer, washing machine, dish washer, etc. What makes

a
power metor spin? If voltage goes up does the amp draw go down?


Are you familiar with "Ohm's Law"?

If the _resistance_ is a fixed value, guess what happens to the current

(amps)
when the voltage goes up.





  #279   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 03:48 AM
Too_Many_Tools
 
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"The subject is 'workshop in an alternate homepower environment', but
it has
degenerated to YAWVGM (yet-another-wayne-versus-geor=ADge-match). ..."

I am glad that someone remembers....thanks to all those who contributed
positively to this thread so far.

If you have more to contribute on subject, please feel free to offer
it.

Thanks in advance,

TMT

  #280   Report Post  
Old June 27th 05, 03:47 PM
wmbjk
 
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On 26 Jun 2005 19:48:32 -0700, "Too_Many_Tools"
wrote:


If you have more to contribute on subject, please feel free to offer
it.

Thanks in advance,

TMT


Here's a sample day's work (yesterday's) in an off-grid workshop. The
project was building the last 2 of 5 scissor trusses for a friend's
aircraft hangar. All material was scrap - chords of 2" and 1.5"
schedule 40 pipe. Long braces from T posts, shorter ones from 5/8"
sucker rod. Most of the material was cut a few days ago. I wore out 3
chop saw blades (medium quality ones) which should give you an idea of
run time. The trusses are 40' wide, but built in halves. Each half
took about 30 minutes to lay out and prep, including about 15 minutes
use of a 4" side grinder. Then 26 welds per side, flip, another 26
welds. Layout, prep, and welding - about one hour total per half, with
a long break between each one to cool off. I built 4 halves, about 100
minutes welding for the day. I didn't check the current draw, but the
machine was set at 280 inches per second, 18 Volts, with .035" solid
wire. Perhaps 5kW input. Charging rate was medium, there was good sun,
but almost no wind, which was nice because I could leave the shop
doors open. When I quit for the day, my wife commented that battery
state of charge had dropped 6 Amp hours, and that she'd used the AC in
the office for a couple of hours. On this project, like most others
here, there wasn't any penalty for being off-grid, which is way cool
IMO.

Wayne


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