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  #1   Report Post  
Shawn
 
Posts: n/a
Default Advice needed on putting poly on wood interior doors

I just spent the most frustrating 2 hours ever trying to put fast-drying
Minwax polyurethane on an interior bedroom door. I'm obviously not doing
something right and I need advice from someone who's done this lots, instead
of never, like me.

Here's the situation. I have an unfinished second floor in my home. We are
finally getting around to finishing it, and a month or so ago we bought 4
Masonite pre-hung raised panel wooden doors from Home Depot to put on the 2
bedrooms, the bathroom, and the closet upstairs. My plan was to stain them
and then poly them first before attempting to hang them.

I went away for a week in December for work, and when I got home, all the
doors were up. My wife thought she'd surprise me and hired someone to put
them in, since I had been walking around for a couple weeks saying I wasn't
sure I'd be able to hang these doors properly myself, not having done that
sort of thing before.

Anyways, now the doors are installed, but not stained or poly'd. So, I
stained them a couple weeks ago. That went well. But this morning I
started to poly one, and it took me 2 HOURS to do the frame and only one
side of the door. It was the biggest mess you've ever seen.

I used a 3-inch foam brush (from Home Depot), as it says on the Minwax can
you can use. I had poly dripping off the brush onto the floor, running down
my hand and arms, bits of foam coming off getting stuck in the poly on the
door .... then, just went I thought I'd gotten a good coat on a certain
section, I'd catch it from another angle in the light and see a large area
that didn't have any poly at all on it. The foam brush just didn't seem to
be spreading the poly well and covering the door properly. Am I doing
something wrong ? The Minwax instructions says a foam brush can be used but
it's obviously not doing it well.

I'd like to hear from contractors, carpenters etc out there how they do this
without having it become a fiasco and taking 4 weeks to do 4 doors. I
stopped after the one side. How am I going to 2 sides on 4 doors, 3 times
(coats) over !! It'll take me a year !

Should I spray it ? Should I use a bristle brush ? I thought the foam
would work out better because I could just toss it when I was done and grab
a new one for the next coat. Can't do that with a bristle brush - I'll have
to clean it after each time, and then the next time, the coat won't be as
smooth because the bristle's always stiffen up after cleaning in paint
thinner.

I think I'm going to pull the hinge pins and take the doors down so I can
poly them flat, which should get around the mess caused by the poly running
on the doors, but that won't help with the pre-hung frames.

What I really need to know is the proper technique for applying poly and the
proper tools to use.

Thanks for listening to my rant and hopefully someone out there has some
advice for me.

Shawn


  #2   Report Post  
David Martel
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Shawn,

Did you take the door down and lay it flat on a couple of saw horses? Did
you remove all of the hardware from the frame and mask it before you began
polying it? I've used poly on my doors with a cheap nylon bristle brush
without any problems. Was able to put on 3 coats in a day. A good work space
with adequate lighting will help a lot. I found that with light coats the
door would be dry enough after 20 mins to stand up so you can do the next
door. After an hour the poly was dry enough so you could do the other side.
Watch out for drips along the door edges.

Dave M.


  #3   Report Post  
m Ransley
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Technique takes learning-experiance , it is not a net, reading
education thing. Wake up man , people charge for talent, you have none
....

Opinions-facts, you dont want to take years to learn, or read a book,
to read, or explain you are [worthless] Hire a PRo and shut up....


  #4   Report Post  
toller
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Never done a door, but have done lots of cabinets and they have doors.

Foam brush, argh.
Getting poly on with any brush is difficult without dripping and globbing;
probably impossible with foam.
I use wipe on poly. It is thin, so you need twice as many applications, but
they each take half as long, so you are even there. The important thing
is that it never drips, globs, or skips.
I use rags that come 100/bag; cheaper than foam brushes even.


  #5   Report Post  
Doug Boulter
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Shawn" wrote on 15 Jan 2005:

I used a 3-inch foam brush (from Home Depot), as it says on the
Minwax can you can use.


Determine whether you're using an oil-based poly or a water-based
poly and use the appropriate bristle brush. I prefer a sash brush
for jobs like this.

I had poly dripping off the brush onto the floor, running down my
hand and arms,


That's poor technique, which is easy to make worse with a foam
brush. First, a 3" wide brush is way too wide for a lot of the
work you're doing, especially if you aren't a pro. Don't overload
the brush. Stroke up, not down. Remember to unload the base of
the bristles from time to time by running them over an edge.

then, just went I
thought I'd gotten a good coat on a certain section, I'd catch
it from another angle in the light and see a large area that
didn't have any poly at all on it.


Again, poor technique. Use lots of light and paint systematically.
But you are going to sand lightly and do a second coat, right? If
you miss a few spots on the first coat, hit them first on the
second coat before you start painting the door systematically.

--
Doug Boulter

To reply by e-mail, remove the obvious word from the e-mail address


  #6   Report Post  
Baron
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I'm going to assume that you are using oil based polyurethane. As
you've discovered, polyurethane handles very differently from paint.

Make sure you have properly finish sanded the doors if they need it. I
doubt it is needed as you have Masonite but I don't know how rough they are.

1. Since you don't appear to have the experience, take the doors off the
hinges and lay them flat. This will minimize runs and sags.

2. Dilute the poly about 25% with mineral spirits or paint thinner. Try to
use the odorless kind. The purpose for thinning is to minimize any bubbles
in the dried finish.

3. A foam brush is okay but they hold much less liquid than a brush. While
I have no problem using them, you might want to use a brush. If you do, use
a natural fiber brush (bristle, hog's hair, badger, fitch, etc.) not a
synthetic brush (nylon or polyester). Synthetic bristles clump and splay
with oil making for uneven application. If the foam brush is tearing, you
either have really cheap ones or you are being too aggressive and the foam
is tearing off as it snags on something.
If you dilute the poly enough, you will have made a wiping poly. You
can apply this with a rag but you will need more coats as each one is very
thin.

4. Apply the polyurethane. Work from the inside of the panels out. You
can work the poly into a foam if you like to get it in every nook and
cranny.

5. Work with proper lighting so you can see if you are coating all the
surfaces.

5. Tip off the still wet poly by holding the brush at a 45 degree angle and
LIGHTLY dragging it along the freshly polyed surface. This will remove any
bubbles.

6. Let the surface dry. Do NOT over brush it.

7. You should apply a second coat. You can either do so within the window
of time specified on the can or let it dry overnight and then scuff sand it.

I have placed foam brushes wrapped in foil in the freezer rather than
clean them or use a new one each time. My brushes tend to be expensive so I
treat them better and clean them at the end of each day.

As for the frames, once you get the idea on the doors, you will see how
to handle the frames.

Good Luck.



"Shawn" wrote in message
...
I just spent the most frustrating 2 hours ever trying to put fast-drying
Minwax polyurethane on an interior bedroom door. I'm obviously not doing
something right and I need advice from someone who's done this lots,

instead
of never, like me.

Here's the situation. I have an unfinished second floor in my home. We

are
finally getting around to finishing it, and a month or so ago we bought 4
Masonite pre-hung raised panel wooden doors from Home Depot to put on the

2
bedrooms, the bathroom, and the closet upstairs. My plan was to stain

them
and then poly them first before attempting to hang them.

I went away for a week in December for work, and when I got home, all the
doors were up. My wife thought she'd surprise me and hired someone to put
them in, since I had been walking around for a couple weeks saying I

wasn't
sure I'd be able to hang these doors properly myself, not having done that
sort of thing before.

Anyways, now the doors are installed, but not stained or poly'd. So, I
stained them a couple weeks ago. That went well. But this morning I
started to poly one, and it took me 2 HOURS to do the frame and only one
side of the door. It was the biggest mess you've ever seen.

I used a 3-inch foam brush (from Home Depot), as it says on the Minwax can
you can use. I had poly dripping off the brush onto the floor, running

down
my hand and arms, bits of foam coming off getting stuck in the poly on the
door .... then, just went I thought I'd gotten a good coat on a certain
section, I'd catch it from another angle in the light and see a large area
that didn't have any poly at all on it. The foam brush just didn't seem

to
be spreading the poly well and covering the door properly. Am I doing
something wrong ? The Minwax instructions says a foam brush can be used

but
it's obviously not doing it well.

I'd like to hear from contractors, carpenters etc out there how they do

this
without having it become a fiasco and taking 4 weeks to do 4 doors. I
stopped after the one side. How am I going to 2 sides on 4 doors, 3 times
(coats) over !! It'll take me a year !

Should I spray it ? Should I use a bristle brush ? I thought the foam
would work out better because I could just toss it when I was done and

grab
a new one for the next coat. Can't do that with a bristle brush - I'll

have
to clean it after each time, and then the next time, the coat won't be as
smooth because the bristle's always stiffen up after cleaning in paint
thinner.

I think I'm going to pull the hinge pins and take the doors down so I can
poly them flat, which should get around the mess caused by the poly

running
on the doors, but that won't help with the pre-hung frames.

What I really need to know is the proper technique for applying poly and

the
proper tools to use.

Thanks for listening to my rant and hopefully someone out there has some
advice for me.

Shawn




  #7   Report Post  
Shawn
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I was looking for advice, not abuse. Maybe you should hang out somewhere
else instead of a place where people truly like to exchange ideas for home
repair and help others. Technique is not "talent". Technique can be
learned. People aren't born knowing how to poly something, you idiot.

"m Ransley" wrote in message
...
Technique takes learning-experiance , it is not a net, reading
education thing. Wake up man , people charge for talent, you have none
...

Opinions-facts, you dont want to take years to learn, or read a book,
to read, or explain you are [worthless] Hire a PRo and shut up....




  #8   Report Post  
Shawn
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Wipe on poly. I've seen that but never thought of using that in this
instance. I've never seen it in gallon cans. I assume it's more expensive
overall, but that could be worth the hassle ! Thanks.

"toller" wrote in message
...
Never done a door, but have done lots of cabinets and they have doors.

Foam brush, argh.
Getting poly on with any brush is difficult without dripping and globbing;
probably impossible with foam.
I use wipe on poly. It is thin, so you need twice as many applications,
but they each take half as long, so you are even there. The important
thing is that it never drips, globs, or skips.
I use rags that come 100/bag; cheaper than foam brushes even.



  #9   Report Post  
Shawn
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thanks Doug. Those are the "been there done that" tips I needed. I
appreciate it.

"Doug Boulter" wrote in message
7.142...
"Shawn" wrote on 15 Jan 2005:

I used a 3-inch foam brush (from Home Depot), as it says on the
Minwax can you can use.


Determine whether you're using an oil-based poly or a water-based
poly and use the appropriate bristle brush. I prefer a sash brush
for jobs like this.

I had poly dripping off the brush onto the floor, running down my
hand and arms,


That's poor technique, which is easy to make worse with a foam
brush. First, a 3" wide brush is way too wide for a lot of the
work you're doing, especially if you aren't a pro. Don't overload
the brush. Stroke up, not down. Remember to unload the base of
the bristles from time to time by running them over an edge.

then, just went I
thought I'd gotten a good coat on a certain section, I'd catch
it from another angle in the light and see a large area that
didn't have any poly at all on it.


Again, poor technique. Use lots of light and paint systematically.
But you are going to sand lightly and do a second coat, right? If
you miss a few spots on the first coat, hit them first on the
second coat before you start painting the door systematically.

--
Doug Boulter

To reply by e-mail, remove the obvious word from the e-mail address



  #10   Report Post  
Shawn
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Baron. Thanks so much. I can see that I was doing most everything wrong.
I like the idea of diluting it down to a poly and wiping it on, like someone
else suggested. Other than that, looks like I need to go out and get a good
quality brush.

thanks

"Baron" wrote in message
news:6fcb8$41e9d82b$cf6730ab$15999@allthenewsgroup s.com...
I'm going to assume that you are using oil based polyurethane. As
you've discovered, polyurethane handles very differently from paint.

Make sure you have properly finish sanded the doors if they need it. I
doubt it is needed as you have Masonite but I don't know how rough they
are.

1. Since you don't appear to have the experience, take the doors off the
hinges and lay them flat. This will minimize runs and sags.

2. Dilute the poly about 25% with mineral spirits or paint thinner. Try
to
use the odorless kind. The purpose for thinning is to minimize any
bubbles
in the dried finish.

3. A foam brush is okay but they hold much less liquid than a brush.
While
I have no problem using them, you might want to use a brush. If you do,
use
a natural fiber brush (bristle, hog's hair, badger, fitch, etc.) not a
synthetic brush (nylon or polyester). Synthetic bristles clump and splay
with oil making for uneven application. If the foam brush is tearing, you
either have really cheap ones or you are being too aggressive and the foam
is tearing off as it snags on something.
If you dilute the poly enough, you will have made a wiping poly. You
can apply this with a rag but you will need more coats as each one is very
thin.

4. Apply the polyurethane. Work from the inside of the panels out. You
can work the poly into a foam if you like to get it in every nook and
cranny.

5. Work with proper lighting so you can see if you are coating all the
surfaces.

5. Tip off the still wet poly by holding the brush at a 45 degree angle
and
LIGHTLY dragging it along the freshly polyed surface. This will remove
any
bubbles.

6. Let the surface dry. Do NOT over brush it.

7. You should apply a second coat. You can either do so within the
window
of time specified on the can or let it dry overnight and then scuff sand
it.

I have placed foam brushes wrapped in foil in the freezer rather than
clean them or use a new one each time. My brushes tend to be expensive so
I
treat them better and clean them at the end of each day.

As for the frames, once you get the idea on the doors, you will see how
to handle the frames.

Good Luck.



"Shawn" wrote in message
...
I just spent the most frustrating 2 hours ever trying to put fast-drying
Minwax polyurethane on an interior bedroom door. I'm obviously not doing
something right and I need advice from someone who's done this lots,

instead
of never, like me.

Here's the situation. I have an unfinished second floor in my home. We

are
finally getting around to finishing it, and a month or so ago we bought 4
Masonite pre-hung raised panel wooden doors from Home Depot to put on the

2
bedrooms, the bathroom, and the closet upstairs. My plan was to stain

them
and then poly them first before attempting to hang them.

I went away for a week in December for work, and when I got home, all the
doors were up. My wife thought she'd surprise me and hired someone to
put
them in, since I had been walking around for a couple weeks saying I

wasn't
sure I'd be able to hang these doors properly myself, not having done
that
sort of thing before.

Anyways, now the doors are installed, but not stained or poly'd. So, I
stained them a couple weeks ago. That went well. But this morning I
started to poly one, and it took me 2 HOURS to do the frame and only one
side of the door. It was the biggest mess you've ever seen.

I used a 3-inch foam brush (from Home Depot), as it says on the Minwax
can
you can use. I had poly dripping off the brush onto the floor, running

down
my hand and arms, bits of foam coming off getting stuck in the poly on
the
door .... then, just went I thought I'd gotten a good coat on a certain
section, I'd catch it from another angle in the light and see a large
area
that didn't have any poly at all on it. The foam brush just didn't seem

to
be spreading the poly well and covering the door properly. Am I doing
something wrong ? The Minwax instructions says a foam brush can be used

but
it's obviously not doing it well.

I'd like to hear from contractors, carpenters etc out there how they do

this
without having it become a fiasco and taking 4 weeks to do 4 doors. I
stopped after the one side. How am I going to 2 sides on 4 doors, 3
times
(coats) over !! It'll take me a year !

Should I spray it ? Should I use a bristle brush ? I thought the foam
would work out better because I could just toss it when I was done and

grab
a new one for the next coat. Can't do that with a bristle brush - I'll

have
to clean it after each time, and then the next time, the coat won't be as
smooth because the bristle's always stiffen up after cleaning in paint
thinner.

I think I'm going to pull the hinge pins and take the doors down so I can
poly them flat, which should get around the mess caused by the poly

running
on the doors, but that won't help with the pre-hung frames.

What I really need to know is the proper technique for applying poly and

the
proper tools to use.

Thanks for listening to my rant and hopefully someone out there has some
advice for me.

Shawn








  #11   Report Post  
willshak
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 1/16/2005 9:06 AM US(ET), Shawn took fingers to keys, and typed the
following:

Thanks Doug. Those are the "been there done that" tips I needed. I
appreciate it.


Many have said not to use the foam brushes, but I have used them and
they are not more drippy than regular brushes. The secret is in the
application. Paint in an upward direction with the handle up as much as
possible. When painting overhead or when the handle will be pointing
down, wipe the excess paint or finish from the brush on the side of the
can or tray, and then use smaller amounts of finish on the tip of the brush.
Foam brushes are not all that bad. I've seen 'Norm' use them on
furniture grade projects on "The New Yankee Workshop".

"Doug Boulter" wrote in message
. 97.142...


"Shawn" wrote on 15 Jan 2005:



I used a 3-inch foam brush (from Home Depot), as it says on the
Minwax can you can use.


Determine whether you're using an oil-based poly or a water-based
poly and use the appropriate bristle brush. I prefer a sash brush
for jobs like this.



I had poly dripping off the brush onto the floor, running down my
hand and arms,


That's poor technique, which is easy to make worse with a foam
brush. First, a 3" wide brush is way too wide for a lot of the
work you're doing, especially if you aren't a pro. Don't overload
the brush. Stroke up, not down. Remember to unload the base of
the bristles from time to time by running them over an edge.



then, just went I
thought I'd gotten a good coat on a certain section, I'd catch
it from another angle in the light and see a large area that
didn't have any poly at all on it.


Again, poor technique. Use lots of light and paint systematically.
But you are going to sand lightly and do a second coat, right? If
you miss a few spots on the first coat, hit them first on the
second coat before you start painting the door systematically.

--
Doug Boulter

To reply by e-mail, remove the obvious word from the e-mail address








--
Bill
  #12   Report Post  
 
Posts: n/a
Default

This will also allow coating the top and bottom of the doors. I've
had good results on large slabs like doors using trim pads, little
rectangular pads for trimming along the ceiling. I treat them as
disposable.

On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 21:55:58 -0500, "Baron"
wrote:


1. Since you don't appear to have the experience, take the doors off the
hinges and lay them flat. This will minimize runs and sags.


  #13   Report Post  
 
Posts: n/a
Default

There are gradations in the quality of foam brushes like everything
else. Buy quality instead of price break.

On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 09:19:03 -0500, willshak
wrote:

Many have said not to use the foam brushes, but I have used them and
they are not more drippy than regular brushes.


  #14   Report Post  
toller
 
Posts: n/a
Default

No, it is cheaper. You just add mineral spirits to regular varnish until it
is thin enough to wipe.
I think the last time I made it I used 1 part MS to 2 parts varnish.

"Shawn" wrote in message
...
Wipe on poly. I've seen that but never thought of using that in this
instance. I've never seen it in gallon cans. I assume it's more
expensive overall, but that could be worth the hassle ! Thanks.

"toller" wrote in message
...
Never done a door, but have done lots of cabinets and they have doors.

Foam brush, argh.
Getting poly on with any brush is difficult without dripping and
globbing; probably impossible with foam.
I use wipe on poly. It is thin, so you need twice as many applications,
but they each take half as long, so you are even there. The important
thing is that it never drips, globs, or skips.
I use rags that come 100/bag; cheaper than foam brushes even.





  #15   Report Post  
Mac Cool
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Wipe it on using a clean cotton cloth. Some varnish can be wiped on out of
the can, others need to be thinned with turpentine. Read the label, if it
can be wiped on without thinning it will specifically say so.
http://www.woodcentral.com/russ/finish7.shtml
--
Mac Cool


  #16   Report Post  
Sexytom976
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I hung all the doors (pine) in my home. While staining and sealing
them is
a pain in the ass while their done it can be done.

In my case I used a oil based stain and to seal it I used
Minwax Polycrilic (water based)

The oil stain smelled to high heaven and probably took a few
years off my life. (used a rag to wipe it on (USE GLOVES!)

After a few days I used the polycrilic to seal it up. (good brush)
I really do love that stuff! It dries in 2 hours, dont smell
that bad at all and cleanup is with soap and water.
In addition to that it wont turn yellow like polyurathane
over the years. While I wouldnt recommend it on my oak floors
it looks GREAT on my doors! It was definitly a pleasure to work with.
(I did the polycrilic twice on each door. First coat, light sand, then
second coat 2 hours later, look and admire)


Tom

Shawn wrote:
I just spent the most frustrating 2 hours ever trying to put

fast-drying
Minwax polyurethane on an interior bedroom door. I'm obviously not

doing
something right and I need advice from someone who's done this lots,

instead
of never, like me.

Here's the situation. I have an unfinished second floor in my home.

We are
finally getting around to finishing it, and a month or so ago we

bought 4
Masonite pre-hung raised panel wooden doors from Home Depot to put on

the 2
bedrooms, the bathroom, and the closet upstairs. My plan was to

stain them
and then poly them first before attempting to hang them.

I went away for a week in December for work, and when I got home, all

the
doors were up. My wife thought she'd surprise me and hired someone

to put
them in, since I had been walking around for a couple weeks saying I

wasn't
sure I'd be able to hang these doors properly myself, not having done

that
sort of thing before.

Anyways, now the doors are installed, but not stained or poly'd. So,

I
stained them a couple weeks ago. That went well. But this morning I


started to poly one, and it took me 2 HOURS to do the frame and only

one
side of the door. It was the biggest mess you've ever seen.

I used a 3-inch foam brush (from Home Depot), as it says on the

Minwax can
you can use. I had poly dripping off the brush onto the floor,

running down
my hand and arms, bits of foam coming off getting stuck in the poly

on the
door .... then, just went I thought I'd gotten a good coat on a

certain
section, I'd catch it from another angle in the light and see a large

area
that didn't have any poly at all on it. The foam brush just didn't

seem to
be spreading the poly well and covering the door properly. Am I

doing
something wrong ? The Minwax instructions says a foam brush can be

used but
it's obviously not doing it well.

I'd like to hear from contractors, carpenters etc out there how they

do this
without having it become a fiasco and taking 4 weeks to do 4 doors.

I
stopped after the one side. How am I going to 2 sides on 4 doors, 3

times
(coats) over !! It'll take me a year !

Should I spray it ? Should I use a bristle brush ? I thought the

foam
would work out better because I could just toss it when I was done

and grab
a new one for the next coat. Can't do that with a bristle brush -

I'll have
to clean it after each time, and then the next time, the coat won't

be as
smooth because the bristle's always stiffen up after cleaning in

paint
thinner.

I think I'm going to pull the hinge pins and take the doors down so I

can
poly them flat, which should get around the mess caused by the poly

running
on the doors, but that won't help with the pre-hung frames.

What I really need to know is the proper technique for applying poly

and the
proper tools to use.

Thanks for listening to my rant and hopefully someone out there has

some
advice for me.

Shawn


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