Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall. The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

I have a few questions:
- can I frame with strapping instead of 2x4 because of the clearance between
the wall and the back of the heater - about 2", as you can see by the wood
that is there holding it out
- using construction adhesive with th ewood directly against the concrete,
or do I need to
- do I need to drill the concrete for screws instead (don't want to)

Some points:
- concrete is above grade
- sill on top of concrete is about 2" wide, clearance for pipe is about
2.5-3"
- clearance behind heater is about 2"

It appears that even if you frame with strapping, you will have the 2" for
the strapping plus the thickness of the drywall. If I was doing the job, I
build a frame that tied into the framing above the pony wall and join it to
a footer adhered to the floor using ram or adhesive.

MZ

"Phreak" wrote in message
news:fN8Gd.98622$dv1.25669@edtnps89...
Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall.
The above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us,
the basement was supposed to be unfinished.

I have a few questions:
- can I frame with strapping instead of 2x4 because of the clearance
between the wall and the back of the heater - about 2", as you can see by
the wood that is there holding it out
- using construction adhesive with th ewood directly against the concrete,
or do I need to
- do I need to drill the concrete for screws instead (don't want to)

Some points:
- concrete is above grade
- sill on top of concrete is about 2" wide, clearance for pipe is about
2.5-3"
- clearance behind heater is about 2"

You can use strapping, but make sure the drywall screws aren't too long as
they will contact the concrete before tightening on the drywall.

The only way to do that properly would be to turn off that heater zone,
remove the register and do it with 2x2's, connected to the above framing and
ram set into the floor.
This way everything will be neat and tidy - the first time.

Also, if you go that route, you can also get flexable heating pipes that
would make the re-attachmant easier - except they need to be crimped with a
special tool instead of solder.

Don't forget to insulate and vapor barrier also. Will seem pointless, but
should be done.

T

"Phreak" wrote in message
news:fN8Gd.98622$dv1.25669@edtnps89...
Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall.
The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

I have a few questions:
- can I frame with strapping instead of 2x4 because of the clearance
between
the wall and the back of the heater - about 2", as you can see by the wood
that is there holding it out
- using construction adhesive with th ewood directly against the concrete,
or do I need to
- do I need to drill the concrete for screws instead (don't want to)

Some points:
- concrete is above grade
- sill on top of concrete is about 2" wide, clearance for pipe is about
2.5-3"
- clearance behind heater is about 2"

Salutations:

On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 13:21:15 GMT, Phreak wrote:

Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall.
The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

You need to cut the lower couple of inches off the current drywall and
complete the vapour barrier to the floor. Toe nail/screw a couple of 2x8
out from the existing footer under the drywall to make a step header -
then build a normal frame down to a new floor footer.

I would make sure that I had some thin foam board insulation under the
pipe (you can mount the 2x8 in two sections to get around it).

Basically, you don't have to mount the 2x4 framing to the wall at all -
you mount it to the header and footer - then just tack the footer to the
floor itself extending the vapour barrier under it. This leaves room for
insulation and circulation behind the frame.

--

Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day
Tim Tamashiro - All I do is Dream of You
http://www.dexterdyne.org/888/155.RAM

all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads
no news no phone in - RealAudio 8+ Required - all the Time

Dexter J's fab SAAB 900 for sale:
http://www.dexterdyne.org/310.HTM

Thanks - to do that I would have to bleed the water out of the pipes, and I
haven't a clue as to how to do that. It sounds like a job for a plumber...

I'll definitely vapour barrier and insulate, I just picked up some 3/4" pink
exterior foam board. I also got some short screws.



"boondocks" wrote in message
news:MTaGd.83614$nN6.33523@edtnps84...
You can use strapping, but make sure the drywall screws aren't too long as
they will contact the concrete before tightening on the drywall.

The only way to do that properly would be to turn off that heater zone,
remove the register and do it with 2x2's, connected to the above framing
and
ram set into the floor.
This way everything will be neat and tidy - the first time.

Also, if you go that route, you can also get flexable heating pipes that
would make the re-attachmant easier - except they need to be crimped with
a
special tool instead of solder.

Don't forget to insulate and vapor barrier also. Will seem pointless, but
should be done.

T

"Phreak" wrote in message
news:fN8Gd.98622$dv1.25669@edtnps89...
Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall.
The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

I have a few questions:
- can I frame with strapping instead of 2x4 because of the clearance
between
the wall and the back of the heater - about 2", as you can see by the
wood
that is there holding it out
- using construction adhesive with th ewood directly against the
concrete,
or do I need to
- do I need to drill the concrete for screws instead (don't want to)

Some points:
- concrete is above grade
- sill on top of concrete is about 2" wide, clearance for pipe is about
2.5-3"
- clearance behind heater is about 2"

How important is circulation? Framing with 2x4 is not an option without
bleeding the pipes, which is what I'm trying to avoid.

"Dexter J" wrote in message
news
Salutations:

On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 13:21:15 GMT, Phreak wrote:

Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall.
The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

You need to cut the lower couple of inches off the current drywall and
complete the vapour barrier to the floor. Toe nail/screw a couple of 2x8
out from the existing footer under the drywall to make a step header -
then build a normal frame down to a new floor footer.

I would make sure that I had some thin foam board insulation under the
pipe (you can mount the 2x8 in two sections to get around it).

Basically, you don't have to mount the 2x4 framing to the wall at all -
you mount it to the header and footer - then just tack the footer to the
floor itself extending the vapour barrier under it. This leaves room for
insulation and circulation behind the frame.

--

Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day
Tim Tamashiro - All I do is Dream of You
http://www.dexterdyne.org/888/155.RAM

all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads
no news no phone in - RealAudio 8+ Required - all the Time

Dexter J's fab SAAB 900 for sale:
http://www.dexterdyne.org/310.HTM

Phreak wrote:

How important is circulation? Framing with 2x4 is not an option without
bleeding the pipes, which is what I'm trying to avoid.

"Dexter J" wrote in message
news
Salutations:

On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 13:21:15 GMT, Phreak wrote:

Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall.
The above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

You need to cut the lower couple of inches off the current drywall and
complete the vapour barrier to the floor. Toe nail/screw a couple of 2x8
out from the existing footer under the drywall to make a step header -
then build a normal frame down to a new floor footer.

I would make sure that I had some thin foam board insulation under the
pipe (you can mount the 2x8 in two sections to get around it).

Basically, you don't have to mount the 2x4 framing to the wall at all -
you mount it to the header and footer - then just tack the footer to the
floor itself extending the vapour barrier under it. This leaves room for
insulation and circulation behind the frame.

--

Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day
Tim Tamashiro - All I do is Dream of You
http://www.dexterdyne.org/888/155.RAM

all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads
no news no phone in - RealAudio 8+ Required - all the Time

Dexter J's fab SAAB 900 for sale:
http://www.dexterdyne.org/310.HTM

I would be tempted to glue the insulation panel to the wall and then
attach 1" x 3" strapping with a Ramset or drill and use Rawl cement
nails, vapour barrier and drywall. If the insulation panel will go
behind the pipe, is it possible to leave the pipe in the space created
by the 1 x 3 and under the drywall?

Happy hammering.

Bob

On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 13:21:15 GMT, someone wrote:


I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall. The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

First, do you really have to drywall this area?

Well, if you do, it may be more trouble than you save to work aroundn
that heater.

But if you do - my take on it: (a) start with a PT board on top of
that little concrete shelf, overhanging by just the right amount, this
will be the top plate of the lower wall (tie it into the sole for the
wall that is already above the concrete). (b) bolt or power nail a PT
sill to your floor, rip it to be a "2x2" (1-1/2 by 1-1/2). (c) frame
"on the flat" between the new sill and plate. (d) sheetrock.

Whatever. I'd prefer to remove the heater, do the job, then
re-install.

-v.


Reply to NG only - this e.mail address goes to a kill file.

On 1/15/2005 8:21 AM US(ET), Phreak took fingers to keys, and typed the
following:

Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall. The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

I have a few questions:
- can I frame with strapping instead of 2x4 because of the clearance between
the wall and the back of the heater - about 2", as you can see by the wood
that is there holding it out
- using construction adhesive with th ewood directly against the concrete,
or do I need to
- do I need to drill the concrete for screws instead (don't want to)

Some points:
- concrete is above grade
- sill on top of concrete is about 2" wide, clearance for pipe is about
2.5-3"
- clearance behind heater is about 2"

Do you just want to cover just the concrete portion, so you still have
that 'step' in the wall, or do you want to have a flat wall from floor
to ceiling?
If it were me, I would want a flat wall. If you just want to cover the
concrete, read this and make some adaptations to it that will be
described below this text.
I would lay a 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" plate on the floor along the base of the
wall. You secure it to the floor in a number of ways. Since this is a
non-bearing wall, you just want the base to keep from moving around.
You don't have to use screws, you can use a concrete power nailer, or or
hammered in masonary nails. You can also use a good panel adhesive to
glue them down (I'd still use a nail or two, here and there). Make sure
they are butted flush up to the wall.
You can then nail a 2 x 4 top plate to the ceiling joists, or if covered
by sheetrock, nail through the sheetrock into the joists with 3" nails
(10d). Make sure the front edge of the top plate is plumb with the front
edge of the base plate 1-1/2"s.
Here's where a circular or table saw comes in.
Determine whether you are going to have the studs 16" or 24" on center.
Mark out the locations of the studs on the plates. Make sure you don't
put a stud right where that pipe is.
Measure your stud lengths to fit between the top and bottom plates. Cut
to length, but leave a hair extra so the stud keeps pressure on the
plates. On each stud, measure in 1-1/2" from the front at the bottom and
then another 1-1/2" mark at the height of the concrete shelf.
You are going to cut a notch out of the stud so that it is only 1-1/2"
thick at the base up to the concrete shelf and the part above the shelf
will remain 3-1/2" and will sit on the shelf.
Use the usual toe nailing (8d) at the top of the studs into the top plate.
For the bottom plate, I would use smaller nails and glue to secure the
studs to the plate. You will have to use just glue behind that heater.
You will have to move that outlet (and any others or switch boxes) out
to the new framed wall.
Now, insulate, if you want to. Use rigid foam between the studs in the
concrete area. Use fiberglass above.
Hang sheetrock and nail as usual. You'll have to skip that part behind
the baseboard heater.
Because we cut the floor plate and stud bottoms to 1-1/2", the 1/2"
sheetrock will make 2", which is the amount of space you say you have
behind the heater.
Rough Drawing he
http://www.willshak.com/temp/

Just want to cover the concrete base?
Leave the 1-1/2" base plate on the floor. Drop the 2x4 top plate to the
concrete shelf. Toenail the 2x4 into the wall studs behind. Rip the 2x4s
to get 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" pieces that will fit between the base plate and
shelf plate. Face nail the short pieces through the top plate, and glue
and toenail the bottom as described above.
You can always continue the upper portion with 2x4 studs to get a flat
wall later.
Well, that's what I would do, but it would be my house. Others may have
different opinions for use in other houses.




--
Bill

About 10 years ago I turned a garage into a studio apt. It had the exact
problem that you have. I decided not to frame in the foundation lip. I taped
the upper drywall and textured the entire thing, including the concrete. I
then painted everything and made a piece of 2x2 wood molding that wrapped
around the lip. It turned out much better than I would have thought before
hand. After all of these years I have had no problems with the texture or
paint on the concrete. You could spray texture and paint on the pipe, but I
think that I would make some sort of nice wood box that ties into the heater
to protect the pipe and stain it the same as the molding.
The molding fits tight to the sheet rock but has about 1/4" clearance on the
front of the concrete in some spots due to the run out in the sill plate
where it is bolted to the foundation. You would have to use a mirror to see
it.

It was a very inexpensive fix to the problem and really does look quite
nice.

CR




"Phreak" wrote in message
news:fN8Gd.98622$dv1.25669@edtnps89...
Hi, please see the picture posted at the URL below.

http://www.gosea.com/basement/basement.jpg

I am trying to figure out how to frame the concrete portionof this wall.
The
above portion was drywalled by the builders when they sold it to us, the
basement was supposed to be unfinished.

I have a few questions:
- can I frame with strapping instead of 2x4 because of the clearance
between
the wall and the back of the heater - about 2", as you can see by the wood
that is there holding it out
- using construction adhesive with th ewood directly against the concrete,
or do I need to
- do I need to drill the concrete for screws instead (don't want to)

Some points:
- concrete is above grade
- sill on top of concrete is about 2" wide, clearance for pipe is about
2.5-3"
- clearance behind heater is about 2"

willshak writes:
Here's where a circular or table saw comes in.
Determine whether you are going to have the studs 16" or 24" on
center. Mark out the locations of the studs on the plates. Make sure
you don't put a stud right where that pipe is.
Measure your stud lengths to fit between the top and bottom
plates. Cut to length, but leave a hair extra so the stud keeps
pressure on the plates. On each stud, measure in 1-1/2" from the front
at the bottom and then another 1-1/2" mark at the height of the
concrete shelf.
You are going to cut a notch out of the stud so that it is only 1-1/2"
thick at the base up to the concrete shelf and the part above the
shelf will remain 3-1/2" and will sit on the shelf.

Why not just mount the 2x4's sideways so that you only have 1-1/2" of
depth the whole way. This should be sturdier and much easier than
measuring and notching out half the depth of a 2x4.