Neighbor's Wood-Burning
 

I have a friendly helpful next-door neighbor here in the woods (PA)
where the zoning ordinance does NOT prohibit open burning. This is a
lifelong neighbor (30+) who grew up along with us and with whom we have
up until now been on very good terms. (The good terms do not extend to
neighbor's wife.)

For the past month, our home has REEKED of whatever it is that he has
been burning. We live on a dead-end road, but I don't want to give the
impression this is, like, Deliverance-style territory. It's just a
70's-era development in the Poconos. We're not concerned that he's
burning something necessarily illegal as we are that our home is
becoming uninhabitable because of the smoke.

I phoned two Saturdays ago. Neighbor's gnarly wife answered, claimed
"We've burned twice a week for ten years!" (patently untrue), and that
"*I* don't smell a thing." The response, while not out of character
for this woman, was a bit more unfriendly than we're used to, even for
her.

The smoke got even worse, so we actually phoned neighbor's mom, who
lives in a house out of line of the drifting smoke. Result was that
smoke stopped, and next day, neighbor drives over to apologize and give
me a hug. I thought the problem was solved.

Two days later, the burning started again. Because neighbor is
extremely well-employed, I could see it wasn't a matter of his burning
on yet another Monday mid-morning, and I started to wonder if he
installed some sort of wood-burning device inside his home whose vent
is aimed directly our way.

What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be
like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.

Any advice--mechanical, structural, legal, seasonal (!)--desperately
needed and appreciated.

wrote in message
ups.com...
I have a friendly helpful next-door neighbor here in the woods (PA)
where the zoning ordinance does NOT prohibit open burning. This is a
lifelong neighbor (30+) who grew up along with us and with whom we have
up until now been on very good terms. (The good terms do not extend to
neighbor's wife.)

For the past month, our home has REEKED of whatever it is that he has
been burning. We live on a dead-end road, but I don't want to give the
impression this is, like, Deliverance-style territory. It's just a
70's-era development in the Poconos. We're not concerned that he's
burning something necessarily illegal as we are that our home is
becoming uninhabitable because of the smoke.

I phoned two Saturdays ago. Neighbor's gnarly wife answered, claimed
"We've burned twice a week for ten years!" (patently untrue), and that
"*I* don't smell a thing." The response, while not out of character
for this woman, was a bit more unfriendly than we're used to, even for
her.

The smoke got even worse, so we actually phoned neighbor's mom, who
lives in a house out of line of the drifting smoke. Result was that
smoke stopped, and next day, neighbor drives over to apologize and give
me a hug. I thought the problem was solved.

Two days later, the burning started again. Because neighbor is
extremely well-employed, I could see it wasn't a matter of his burning
on yet another Monday mid-morning, and I started to wonder if he
installed some sort of wood-burning device inside his home whose vent
is aimed directly our way.

What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be
like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.

Any advice--mechanical, structural, legal, seasonal (!)--desperately
needed and appreciated.

I would maybe ask him if he could move his burn pile to amother location on
his property (so you are NOT downwind), or, seriously, move.........

First you have to watch the movie,"Neighbors" to see how good you've got it.
Then I'd probably write him a note to explain how bad the smoke bothers you
and appeal to any sense of compassion he may have. I was in a similar
situation some years back and I did the wrong thing which made matters worse
and ultimately moved.
wrote in message
ups.com...
I have a friendly helpful next-door neighbor here in the woods (PA)
where the zoning ordinance does NOT prohibit open burning. This is a
lifelong neighbor (30+) who grew up along with us and with whom we have
up until now been on very good terms. (The good terms do not extend to
neighbor's wife.)

For the past month, our home has REEKED of whatever it is that he has
been burning. We live on a dead-end road, but I don't want to give the
impression this is, like, Deliverance-style territory. It's just a
70's-era development in the Poconos. We're not concerned that he's
burning something necessarily illegal as we are that our home is
becoming uninhabitable because of the smoke.

I phoned two Saturdays ago. Neighbor's gnarly wife answered, claimed
"We've burned twice a week for ten years!" (patently untrue), and that
"*I* don't smell a thing." The response, while not out of character
for this woman, was a bit more unfriendly than we're used to, even for
her.

The smoke got even worse, so we actually phoned neighbor's mom, who
lives in a house out of line of the drifting smoke. Result was that
smoke stopped, and next day, neighbor drives over to apologize and give
me a hug. I thought the problem was solved.

Two days later, the burning started again. Because neighbor is
extremely well-employed, I could see it wasn't a matter of his burning
on yet another Monday mid-morning, and I started to wonder if he
installed some sort of wood-burning device inside his home whose vent
is aimed directly our way.

What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be
like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.

Any advice--mechanical, structural, legal, seasonal (!)--desperately
needed and appreciated.

RBM wrote:
First you have to watch the movie,"Neighbors" to see how good you've got it.
Then I'd probably write him a note to explain how bad the smoke bothers you
and appeal to any sense of compassion he may have. I was in a similar
situation some years back and I did the wrong thing which made matters worse
and ultimately moved.
wrote in message
ups.com...

I have a friendly helpful next-door neighbor here in the woods (PA)
where the zoning ordinance does NOT prohibit open burning. This is a
lifelong neighbor (30+) who grew up along with us and with whom we have
up until now been on very good terms. (The good terms do not extend to
neighbor's wife.)

For the past month, our home has REEKED of whatever it is that he has
been burning. We live on a dead-end road, but I don't want to give the
impression this is, like, Deliverance-style territory. It's just a
70's-era development in the Poconos. We're not concerned that he's
burning something necessarily illegal as we are that our home is
becoming uninhabitable because of the smoke.

I phoned two Saturdays ago. Neighbor's gnarly wife answered, claimed
"We've burned twice a week for ten years!" (patently untrue), and that
"*I* don't smell a thing." The response, while not out of character
for this woman, was a bit more unfriendly than we're used to, even for
her.

The smoke got even worse, so we actually phoned neighbor's mom, who
lives in a house out of line of the drifting smoke. Result was that
smoke stopped, and next day, neighbor drives over to apologize and give
me a hug. I thought the problem was solved.

Two days later, the burning started again. Because neighbor is
extremely well-employed, I could see it wasn't a matter of his burning
on yet another Monday mid-morning, and I started to wonder if he
installed some sort of wood-burning device inside his home whose vent
is aimed directly our way.

What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be
like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.

Any advice--mechanical, structural, legal, seasonal (!)--desperately
needed and appreciated.



fed EPA does not allow open burning anymore,call them
call fire department, he must have a permit to burn grass or leaves
nothing else is allowed

On 15 Dec 2004 02:45:30 -0800, "
wrote:

I have a friendly helpful next-door neighbor here in the woods (PA)
where the zoning ordinance does NOT prohibit open burning. This is a

It is against the law to create a public disturbance.

lifelong neighbor (30+) who grew up along with us and with whom we have
up until now been on very good terms. (The good terms do not extend to
neighbor's wife.)

For the past month, our home has REEKED of whatever it is that he has
been burning. We live on a dead-end road, but I don't want to give the
impression this is, like, Deliverance-style territory. It's just a
70's-era development in the Poconos. We're not concerned that he's
burning something necessarily illegal as we are that our home is
becoming uninhabitable because of the smoke.

I phoned two Saturdays ago. Neighbor's gnarly wife answered, claimed
"We've burned twice a week for ten years!" (patently untrue), and that

Even the die-hards had to give up painting their houses with lead
paint, tell her to get with the time, it's winter time, don't burn on
stall air days or when you are down wind.

"*I* don't smell a thing." The response, while not out of character
for this woman, was a bit more unfriendly than we're used to, even for
her.

Respond with, from your personal habits, I guess nothing else does
smell to you. :-P JUST Kidding. Document on your calendar this
call, time and date. Keep this calendar into 2005.


The smoke got even worse, so we actually phoned neighbor's mom, who
lives in a house out of line of the drifting smoke. Result was that
smoke stopped, and next day, neighbor drives over to apologize and give
me a hug. I thought the problem was solved.

Two days later, the burning started again. Because neighbor is
extremely well-employed, I could see it wasn't a matter of his burning
on yet another Monday mid-morning, and I started to wonder if he
installed some sort of wood-burning device inside his home whose vent
is aimed directly our way.


If it's a piece of equipment that is installed, it doesn't seem very
well 'drafted' might want to pry and find out if it was under permit
and inspection. If not, and he becomes a problem, give the city and
his insurance company a call. ;) Only if you are truely evil.
muhahahahahah


What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be
like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.

Any advice--mechanical, structural, legal, seasonal (!)--desperately
needed and appreciated.

If you his smoking problems are creating a serious problem, maybe when
you smell the smoke again, call the fire department. A few calls
about you smell something, or it's so much 'smell' it might be out of
control calls, he will be shut down. BUT..... even though he
instigated the problem, and continued after you asked him to stop, you
will be seen as a bad boy. So, you might want to get advice from
adjacent neighbors before you make your decision.

IMHO,

tom @ www.ChopURL.com

wrote:

On 15 Dec 2004 02:45:30 -0800, "
wrote:


I have a friendly helpful next-door neighbor here in the woods (PA)
where the zoning ordinance does NOT prohibit open burning. This is a


It is against the law to create a public disturbance.


lifelong neighbor (30+) who grew up along with us and with whom we have
up until now been on very good terms. (The good terms do not extend to
neighbor's wife.)

For the past month, our home has REEKED of whatever it is that he has
been burning. We live on a dead-end road, but I don't want to give the
impression this is, like, Deliverance-style territory. It's just a
70's-era development in the Poconos. We're not concerned that he's
burning something necessarily illegal as we are that our home is
becoming uninhabitable because of the smoke.

I phoned two Saturdays ago. Neighbor's gnarly wife answered, claimed
"We've burned twice a week for ten years!" (patently untrue), and that


Even the die-hards had to give up painting their houses with lead
paint, tell her to get with the time, it's winter time, don't burn on
stall air days or when you are down wind.


"*I* don't smell a thing." The response, while not out of character
for this woman, was a bit more unfriendly than we're used to, even for
her.


Respond with, from your personal habits, I guess nothing else does
smell to you. :-P JUST Kidding. Document on your calendar this
call, time and date. Keep this calendar into 2005.


The smoke got even worse, so we actually phoned neighbor's mom, who
lives in a house out of line of the drifting smoke. Result was that
smoke stopped, and next day, neighbor drives over to apologize and give
me a hug. I thought the problem was solved.

Two days later, the burning started again. Because neighbor is
extremely well-employed, I could see it wasn't a matter of his burning
on yet another Monday mid-morning, and I started to wonder if he
installed some sort of wood-burning device inside his home whose vent
is aimed directly our way.



If it's a piece of equipment that is installed, it doesn't seem very
well 'drafted' might want to pry and find out if it was under permit
and inspection. If not, and he becomes a problem, give the city and
his insurance company a call. ;) Only if you are truely evil.
muhahahahahah



What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be
like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.

Any advice--mechanical, structural, legal, seasonal (!)--desperately
needed and appreciated.


If you his smoking problems are creating a serious problem, maybe when
you smell the smoke again, call the fire department. A few calls
about you smell something, or it's so much 'smell' it might be out of
control calls, he will be shut down. BUT..... even though he
instigated the problem, and continued after you asked him to stop, you
will be seen as a bad boy. So, you might want to get advice from
adjacent neighbors before you make your decision.

IMHO,

tom @ www.ChopURL.com
back in 1982 i was burning leaves. the fire dept came and said it was
legal and i had a hose there and was doing it fine, but the epa said it
was illegal not the county code. go figure. so i had to stop.

wrote in message
ups.com...
I have a friendly helpful next-door neighbor here in the woods
(PA)
where the zoning ordinance does NOT prohibit open burning.
This is a
lifelong neighbor (30+) who grew up along with us and with whom
we have
up until now been on very good terms. (The good terms do not
extend to
neighbor's wife.)

For the past month, our home has REEKED of whatever it is that
he has
been burning. We live on a dead-end road, but I don't want to
give the
impression this is, like, Deliverance-style territory. It's
just a
70's-era development in the Poconos. We're not concerned that
he's
burning something necessarily illegal as we are that our home
is
becoming uninhabitable because of the smoke.

Invite the neighbor (or his mother) into your house when the
problem is bad. If they experience it, they might help to solve
it.

Bob

Bob wrote:

Invite the neighbor (or his mother) into your house when the
problem is bad. If they experience it, they might help to solve
it.

Bob

I agree with this as a final attempt to get them to respond w/o bringing
authorities into it. If it fails (as it porobably will, given the
history), you'll have to decide which you value more; the "good will" of
this apparent clod, or the air you breath. Seems a no brainer to me.
As someone else mentioned, you WILL be seen as the "unreasonable one" in
the minds at least of this individual & his family. Unless they're
paying your bills my sentiment would be "So what?"

Dan

fsteddie posted for all of us....

call fire department, he must have a permit to burn grass or leaves
nothing else is allowed

Not necessarily local laws dictate. EPA is withholding grant money to force
municipalities into "their" thinking.

I'm not clear on this problem; is it a burn 'pile' or a wood burning stove
giving off the odor?
--
Tekkie

Tekkie wrote:
fsteddie posted for all of us....


call fire department, he must have a permit to burn grass or leaves
nothing else is allowed


Not necessarily local laws dictate. EPA is withholding grant money to force
municipalities into "their" thinking.

I'm not clear on this problem; is it a burn 'pile' or a wood burning stove
giving off the odor?


It sounds like he's burning styrofoam, vinyl siding, and old tires in a
solid fuel (wood-burning or coal-burning) stove.

Bob

zxcvbob wrote:

Tekkie wrote:

fsteddie posted for all of us....

call fire department, he must have a permit to burn grass or leaves
nothing else is allowed


Not necessarily local laws dictate. EPA is withholding grant money to
force municipalities into "their" thinking.

I'm not clear on this problem; is it a burn 'pile' or a wood burning
stove giving off the odor?



It sounds like he's burning styrofoam, vinyl siding, and old tires in a
solid fuel (wood-burning or coal-burning) stove.

Bob


Actually, it could just be household garbage and he's not mixing enough
cardboard and dry wood with it to get it to burn cleanly.

Bob

wrote in message
ups.com...
What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be
like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.

What would happen if you called the local fire department to come and check
out a possible structure fire? Maybe if the local FD came out with the
sirens going thinking that the house was on fire he might stop?

On 12/15/2004 10:06 PM US(ET), Tracey took fingers to keys, and typed
the following:

wrote in message
oups.com...


What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be


like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.



What would happen if you called the local fire department to come and check
out a possible structure fire? Maybe if the local FD came out with the
sirens going thinking that the house was on fire he might stop?


In NYS, that would be 'falsely reporting an incident'.

On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 07:37:06 -0500, willshak
wrote:

On 12/15/2004 10:06 PM US(ET), Tracey took fingers to keys, and typed
the following:

wrote in message
roups.com...


What if anything can we do to settle this nightmare? This would be


like something from Seinfeld if it wasn't causing such pain. If we
contact him again (and we'll have to do it when we're sure we won't
instead get wife-from-Hades), we'll 1) "take back" the friendly
reception of our complaint to his Mom, or 2) show that we don't believe
his explanation of "just extra wood left over from chopped trees." He
would have had to cut down half his lot in order for the burning to be
going on this long.



What would happen if you called the local fire department to come and check
out a possible structure fire? Maybe if the local FD came out with the
sirens going thinking that the house was on fire he might stop?


In NYS, that would be 'falsely reporting an incident'.


IMHO:

If you report it as such yes, but if you report a smoke condition, and
explain your neighbors burns stuff, but there's so much smoke you
think it might have gotten out of control..... basicly as long as you
aren't saying anything with false facts, how can they cite you?

later,

Tom @ www.BookmarkAdmin.com

P.S. I am nieve, I actually trust my city officials most of the time.
;)

wrote in message
...
:

If you report it as such yes, but if you report a smoke condition, and
explain your neighbors burns stuff, but there's so much smoke you
think it might have gotten out of control..... basicly as long as you
aren't saying anything with false facts, how can they cite you?


Well, this is more what I meant, I just didn't state it as clearly.

On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 15:16:19 GMT, "Tracey"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
:

If you report it as such yes, but if you report a smoke condition, and
explain your neighbors burns stuff, but there's so much smoke you
think it might have gotten out of control..... basicly as long as you
aren't saying anything with false facts, how can they cite you?


Well, this is more what I meant, I just didn't state it as clearly.



Ah I understand. Then I didn't understand at first.

thanks,

tom @ www.WorkAtHomePlans.com

That's what I was thinking, it sounds like burning garbage. I hate
that smell with a passion.

Does your neighbor have stuff out by the road on trash pickup day?

The folks that owned our place before us didn't think it was worth
paying for trash removal when they could just pile it up and burn it in
the pasture...same pasture the horses were in no less. We spent a lot
of time cleaning that and other junk up to make it safe for horses and
cattle.

Tracey posted for all of us....

What would happen if you called the local fire department to come and check
out a possible structure fire? Maybe if the local FD came out with the
sirens going thinking that the house was on fire he might stop?



That sir/madam is exactly the WRONG action to take. That is called a
malicious false alarm.
--
Tekkie

wrote in message
ups.com...
Update-- Zoning Officer came (the most useless piece of humanity I
ever met in my life, a decrepit tax-sucking hypocrite) and agreed smell
was "real bad, but there's nuttin' I can do. Call D.E.P."

Called DEP-- Was told by woman smoke from excessive burning is an
"unregulated problem" and agency can do nothing. "Go to the
magistrates."

I left voice message on neighbor's phone, thanks to brilliant idea from
mom, currently in Florida. I said "Mom wants to know if this situation
is temporary or permanent, because if it's permanent, she will not
return to her home." Mom's 75 and handicapped.

Last night, the smoke seemed less. The tragedy of this--and it IS a
tragedy--is the good relations we've always had with the *husband*.
The situation didn't improve until he came home from work. The gnarly
wife... I don't think she's going to let peace on earth, if you know
what I mean.

Mom will probably dance on my grave, she's a tough old lady. She said
if we have to sell the house because of them, we'll sell privately and
bring in the LOUDEST, PARTY-HARDYEST family of thirty and cram 'em into
this three bedroom ranch.

Thanks, everybody. Just reading the posts encouraged me and made me
laugh.


soundem like wife make much smoke while hubbyman at work

mebbe do nothing

mebbe getem hubbyman and wife in you house at same time while smoke bad

mebbe givem wife electric blankey to replace smoke while hubbyman at work

mebbe have em wife holyman/woman visit you house while smoke beum in air
much

mebbe move into house upwind

mebbe install "stop the smoke" protest signs

mebbe some, all, or none of the above

but in you title, you call them neighbor, so mebbe bottom line
be nice

twstanley wrote:

Does your neighbor have stuff out by the road on trash pickup day?

The folks that owned our place before us didn't think it was worth
paying for trash removal when they could just pile it up and burn it
in
the pasture...same pasture the horses were in no less. We spent a
lot
of time cleaning that and other junk up to make it safe for horses
and
cattle.

THAT'S IT! Thanks to you and Gino, I figured out what it was, because
when I called Gnarly Wife, she said "We've been burning garbage twice a
week for the last ten years." They're the richest people on the road,
but they are the only ones who don't have garbage pick-up.
Oh, now I'm REALLY foamin'.

I HATE the smell of burning garbage. There are a few folks around us,
not next door but near enough to smell, that still burn garbage on
occasion. It isn't all the time, but it still reeks.

I spent 8 months last year in Baghdad with my national guard unit, the
smell of raw sewage and burning garbage will always remind me of that
place.

Just put up with it..at least its US garbage..or would you rather
be back in Baghdad?

On Mon, 20 Dec 2004 19:19:23 -0600, wrote:

On 20 Dec 2004 07:08:10 -0800, "twstanley"
wrote:

I HATE the smell of burning garbage. There are a few folks around us,
not next door but near enough to smell, that still burn garbage on
occasion. It isn't all the time, but it still reeks.

I spent 8 months last year in Baghdad with my national guard unit, the
smell of raw sewage and burning garbage will always remind me of that
place.


If you were in Bagdad, you should know how to deal with the neighbor.
Just toss a hand gernade in the window and say "bye". While you're at
it, burn the whole neighborhood so nobody bothers you anymore. You;ll
only smell the garbage (neighbors bodies) burning till the fire dept
put out all the fires and hauls the dead bodys to the morgue.

I was just remarking to the original poster who had the complaints
about neighbors burning something which was later determined to be
garbage. The folks who do burn garbage around here do it rarely and it
is quite a ways away so I don't have a problem with it.
And no, I REALLY would not rather be in Baghdad. haha.

wrote
THAT'S IT! Thanks to you and Gino, I figured out what it was, because
when I called Gnarly Wife, she said "We've been burning garbage twice a
week for the last ten years." They're the richest people on the road,
but they are the only ones who don't have garbage pick-up.
Oh, now I'm REALLY foamin'.

Hey, I think you said this guy is an old friend, and this is worth a lot to
have a friend as a neighbor, even if you don't get along so well with the
wife.

If it's not a huge cost, maybe ask them if they'd do garbage pick up if you
paid 1/2, 1/3 whatever. Might be worth the cost of keeping a friend and
good neighbor.

These seemingly petty problems can really sour a neighbor relationship
beyond repair and are worth trying to solve in a friendly fashion.

Camilo