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#1
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How to quiet a home generator?
I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night
when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, if so what type or suggestions on how to quiet this thing. Thanks |
#2
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Haas writes:
I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, ... No. It's a 10+ HP engine with ONE CYLINDER running at 3600 rpm. No muffler is going to stop the rattle, hum, and vibration. |
#3
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Haas wrote:
I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, if so what type or suggestions on how to quiet this thing. Thanks What you may want to try is building an enclosure that will house the generator. The enclosure would be insulated, to dampen the noise. The enclosure would have to be large enough to have at least a few inches of room all around the generator. You'd also want to leave open one side of the enclosure so that the exhaust had a place to go and also to prevent a fire. You could then staple either insulation on the walls and cieling of the enclosure or find egg-shell type sound proofing material to use. It will not dampen the sound totally but could help. -TheKidd |
#4
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I went to the auto parts store and asked for their smallest car muffler.
The generator exhaust port is a pipe thread. I connected a piece of pipe and an elbow to go into the muffler. The muffler came with an adapter which allowed a snug fit over the pipe. A clamp then held it tight to the pipe. As for quiet, is isn't, however, it is much, much quieter than before. Friends have said that this will put back pressure on the engine and cause problems. It probably does, however, it seems to run just fine .... maybe because the car muffler is for a much larger engine than in the generator. TheKidd wrote: Haas wrote: I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, if so what type or suggestions on how to quiet this thing. Thanks What you may want to try is building an enclosure that will house the generator. The enclosure would be insulated, to dampen the noise. The enclosure would have to be large enough to have at least a few inches of room all around the generator. You'd also want to leave open one side of the enclosure so that the exhaust had a place to go and also to prevent a fire. You could then staple either insulation on the walls and cieling of the enclosure or find egg-shell type sound proofing material to use. It will not dampen the sound totally but could help. -TheKidd |
#5
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Reducing noise will reduce your power out put. Talk to the
manufacturer . But so what , it is an emergency generator. Right ? Noise should be expected in emergencys. maybe you worry to much, offer your neighbor Free Power in an outage. I would not worry, either way. |
#6
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I personally would like to thank you for your consideration. Year before
last during the big Northeast blackout, four of my neighbors fired up their generators. It sounded like pole position around here, and it was tough enough trying to sleep without any AC or fans, let alone the noise. "Haas" jentra wrote in message ink.net... I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, if so what type or suggestions on how to quiet this thing. Thanks |
#7
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On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 01:54:44 GMT, "NokNokMan" wrote: I personally would like to thank you for your consideration. Year before last during the big Northeast blackout, four of my neighbors fired up their generators. It sounded like pole position around here, and it was tough enough trying to sleep without any AC or fans, let alone the noise. "Haas" jentra wrote in message link.net... I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, if so what type or suggestions on how to quiet this thing. Thanks I have wondered (and worried) about the noise and my neighbors also. Here I am sitting watching baseball with my lights on while they were sitting around in the dark. Anyhow, I think I remember Home Depot selling a sound proof box with exhaust during the Y2K scare. It wasmade with the sound dampening type metal with holes, etc., like they use on the big air compressors at construction sites. Does anyone remember more? Mike |
#8
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Last April we had a blackout. From the foot of my driveway I could hear
someones generator at the end of the street (about a quarter mile away) but I couldn't hear my Honda in my garage. If someone near me ran one of those monsters at night... well, lets just say that it is not necessary. |
#9
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When Ivan passed through Atlanta, we lost power for 3 days. ONE neighbor
fired up a generator every night and the rest of us were ready to lynch them. It sounded like a huge aircraft engine was running. Finally found out who it was and said that their noise was unbearable. She slunk away saying the family had allergies and had to run the dehumidifier. (And also the tv, microwave, stove, hair dryer...) More power (literally) to the genny people, but if you could just make them quieter it would take the sting out of the cold and dark for the rest of us. toller wrote: Last April we had a blackout. From the foot of my driveway I could hear someones generator at the end of the street (about a quarter mile away) but I couldn't hear my Honda in my garage. If someone near me ran one of those monsters at night... well, lets just say that it is not necessary. |
#10
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"Sterling" wrote in message ... When Ivan passed through Atlanta, we lost power for 3 days. ONE neighbor fired up a generator every night and the rest of us were ready to lynch them. It sounded like a huge aircraft engine was running. Finally found out who it was and said that their noise was unbearable. She slunk away saying the family had allergies and had to run the dehumidifier. (And also the tv, microwave, stove, hair dryer...) More power (literally) to the genny people, but if you could just make them quieter it would take the sting out of the cold and dark for the rest of us. But that is my point exactly. The Honda is dead quiet; sometimes I have to check to see if it is still running because I can't hear it inside the house. Okay, I can't run a hairdryer or oven, but who needs that stuff in an emergency anyhow. |
#11
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"Ish" wrote in message ... I have wondered (and worried) about the noise and my neighbors also. Here I am sitting watching baseball with my lights on while they were sitting around in the dark. Anyhow, I think I remember Home Depot selling a sound proof box with exhaust during the Y2K scare. It wasmade with the sound dampening type metal with holes, etc., like they use on the big air compressors at construction sites. It takes a lot more than a "sound proof box" to address noise from a cheap 3,600 rpm set. Even those packaged generator units they sell at home cheepo are really noisy. Does anyone remember more? Mike |
#12
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"Sterling" wrote in message ... toller wrote: Last April we had a blackout. From the foot of my driveway I could hear someones generator at the end of the street (about a quarter mile away) but I couldn't hear my Honda in my garage. If someone near me ran one of those monsters at night... well, lets just say that it is not necessary. They do make them quieter but people buy the home depot class machines. There is a 30kw generator where I work and you can hardly tell when it is running. |
#13
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During the last power cut, I was careful to run my generator only during
"waking" hours. I live in a trailer park, and don't want to do that to my neighbors. My thoughts with the original poster's generator is to get a longer cord, and put it out in some bushes. Auto muffler won't do much good. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org www.mormons.com "NokNokMan" wrote in message t... I personally would like to thank you for your consideration. Year before last during the big Northeast blackout, four of my neighbors fired up their generators. It sounded like pole position around here, and it was tough enough trying to sleep without any AC or fans, let alone the noise. "Haas" jentra wrote in message ink.net... I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, if so what type or suggestions on how to quiet this thing. Thanks |
#14
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Yes, definitely don't want to be the only light on the block.
Sorry, don't know anything about a specific sound enclosure. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org www.mormons.com "Ish" wrote in message ... I have wondered (and worried) about the noise and my neighbors also. Here I am sitting watching baseball with my lights on while they were sitting around in the dark. Mike |
#15
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Did you tell her to put the generator in the cellar? After a half hour of
cabon monoxide, she wouldn't care about the dehum. And then call the morgue truck. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org www.mormons.com "Sterling" wrote in message ... When Ivan passed through Atlanta, we lost power for 3 days. ONE neighbor fired up a generator every night and the rest of us were ready to lynch them. It sounded like a huge aircraft engine was running. Finally found out who it was and said that their noise was unbearable. She slunk away saying the family had allergies and had to run the dehumidifier. (And also the tv, microwave, stove, hair dryer...) More power (literally) to the genny people, but if you could just make them quieter it would take the sting out of the cold and dark for the rest of us. |
#16
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I hope your garage isn't attached to your house. You're running the risk of CO poisoning. On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 03:35:27 GMT, "toller" wrote: Last April we had a blackout. From the foot of my driveway I could hear someones generator at the end of the street (about a quarter mile away) but I couldn't hear my Honda in my garage. If someone near me ran one of those monsters at night... well, lets just say that it is not necessary. |
#17
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I hope your garage isn't attached to your house. You're running the risk of CO poisoning. It is connected, but I leave the front and rear garage door open a foot for ventilation. I have tried a battery powered CO detector on the floor a few feet from the genny, but it shows nothing. The Honda runs 8 hours on a gallon of gas. How much CO could it produce? |
#18
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I definitely produces enough CO to kill somone, because there are incidents
every year where people die after running them in their basements. A typical car can probably idle for 8 hours on a gallon of gas ... but it sure doesn't take that long for someone to kill themself that way! I wouldn't take any chances - why not just build a little box with a roof for it and stick it outside when you need to run it? "toller" wrote in message ... I hope your garage isn't attached to your house. You're running the risk of CO poisoning. It is connected, but I leave the front and rear garage door open a foot for ventilation. I have tried a battery powered CO detector on the floor a few feet from the genny, but it shows nothing. The Honda runs 8 hours on a gallon of gas. How much CO could it produce? |
#19
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According to TheKidd :
What you may want to try is building an enclosure that will house the generator. The enclosure would be insulated, to dampen the noise. The enclosure would have to be large enough to have at least a few inches of room all around the generator. You'd also want to leave open one side of the enclosure so that the exhaust had a place to go and also to prevent a fire. You could then staple either insulation on the walls and cieling of the enclosure or find egg-shell type sound proofing material to use. It will not dampen the sound totally but could help. To amplify a bit mo a recommended approach is to build a small enclosure, with a couple of inches open at the bottom (all the way around), and a vent at the top. Then line the enclosure with insulation. Make sure you have SEVERAL inches of clearance all the way around the unit, and the bottom and top vents are clear. -- Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#20
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Jamie wrote: I definitely produces enough CO to kill somone, because there are incidents every year where people die after running them in their basements. A typical car can probably idle for 8 hours on a gallon of gas ... but it sure doesn't take that long for someone to kill themself that way! I wouldn't take any chances - why not just build a little box with a roof for it and stick it outside when you need to run it? Or just hook up a vent for the damn thing... |
#21
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Jamie writes:
A typical car can probably idle for 8 hours on a gallon of gas. A car consumes more like 1 gallon/hour idling. but it sure doesn't take that long for someone to kill themself that way! Only in Hollywood. It's not a "big nod" like in the movies. CO emissions from cars are typically near zero. The CO2 will displace air and suffocate you. But neither is particularly fast, and survival instincts are hard to countermand. |
#22
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but it sure
doesn't take that long for someone to kill themself that way! Only in Hollywood. It's not a "big nod" like in the movies. CO emissions from cars are typically near zero. The CO2 will displace air and suffocate you. But neither is particularly fast, and survival instincts are hard to countermand. 3 people died after the Charley storm in exactly this way, two separate incidents. The gennys were in the garage |
#23
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My car consumes only about 2 gallons/hour driving 60 miles per hour (at
roughly 30 miles per gallon), with the engine at about 2800 RPM under load. I would certainly expect it would do a lot better than 1 gallon per hour at 600 RPM with no load. Maybe you're driving a Ford Expedition. CO doesn't exactly suffocate you. You make it sound like you'd need there to be more CO than oxygen in order for it to kill you. According to this, you body will always use CO before oxygen when both are inhaled. And yes - it can kill you very quickly. http://www.extension.iastate.edu/Pag...CO/co_car.html "Richard J Kinch" wrote in message . .. Jamie writes: A typical car can probably idle for 8 hours on a gallon of gas. A car consumes more like 1 gallon/hour idling. but it sure doesn't take that long for someone to kill themself that way! Only in Hollywood. It's not a "big nod" like in the movies. CO emissions from cars are typically near zero. The CO2 will displace air and suffocate you. But neither is particularly fast, and survival instincts are hard to countermand. |
#24
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According to Jamie :
CO doesn't exactly suffocate you. You make it sound like you'd need there to be more CO than oxygen in order for it to kill you. According to this, you body will always use CO before oxygen when both are inhaled. And yes - it can kill you very quickly. Very small amounts of CO can kill you quickly. "Near zero" CO emissions from cars can kill you if you're not ventilating well enough. Starting a car in a closed garage and sitting in the car to read a book is about the easiest and gentlest ways to die there is. There are no "survival instincts" triggered by CO. CO2 triggers a physiological reaction (you _know_ you're not getting enough to breathe, because that's part of the active feedback of how your breathing system works). CO does not. It has no smell. You have no way of knowing it's happening _unless_ it's accompanied by something else (like smoke). If you're _expecting_ the smoke ("well, gosh darn it, there is a generator running in the bathroom!"), well... Your blood stream simply starts carrying less and less oxygen and you fall asleep (if you aren't already). Then die. More people died in the great ice storm from CO than any other cause. Many of those were inadequately ventilated generators. CO kills by preferentially binding to the haemoglobin in your red blood cells _instead_ of O2, but your cells aren't interested in using CO. It binds tightly enough that you do not get rid of it very fast. Which is why a short exposure to CO can lead to a long recovery on pure O2. [In severe cases, they can resort to pure O2 in hyberbaric chambers. Above about 30PSI, you don't _need_ haemoglobin in your blood stream to carry enough O2 to stay alive long enough for the CO to eventually go away.] -- Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#25
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Jamie writes:
CO doesn't exactly suffocate you. You make it sound like you'd need there to be more CO than oxygen in order for it to kill you. You didn't follow what I said, CO vs CO2. |
#26
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Sorry, my mistake. But regardless, CO can kill you very quickly... even from
a car, with a catalytic converter, and certainly from a generator which probably doesn't have one. The risk should never be understated. "Richard J Kinch" wrote in message . .. Jamie writes: CO doesn't exactly suffocate you. You make it sound like you'd need there to be more CO than oxygen in order for it to kill you. You didn't follow what I said, CO vs CO2. |
#27
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Chris Lewis writes:
"Near zero" CO emissions from cars can kill you if you're not ventilating well enough. Starting a car in a closed garage and sitting in the car to read a book is about the easiest and gentlest ways to die there is. Bunk. The pCO2 respiratory stimulation will kick in long before integrated pCO is enough to affect anything. Car exhaust is nearly pure CO2 and steam, plus very tiny amounts of things like CO. As a suicide method, it's absolutely stupid, because the mostly likely outcome is a brain-damaged but still-alive subject. The dose makes the poison. Your swell ideas about what happens given a lethal dose of CO doesn't mean inhaling car exhaust will administer a lethal dose. Citing unusual cases where it has happened is to commit the fallacy of selection. |
#28
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Jamie writes:
Sorry, my mistake. But regardless, CO can kill you very quickly... even from a car, with a catalytic converter, and certainly from a generator which probably doesn't have one. Yes, a 1-cylinder B&S/Tecumseh/Kohler/etc is typically far worse than a modern auto engine as regards emissions. The risk should never be understated. I disagree. That philosophy leads to those user manuals that start with 10 pages of warnings that nobody reads. Rear-view mirrors that warn you about things appearing smaller. Caution should be proportioned to risk. Cf the boy who cried wolf. Probability, hazards, and risks are about the hardest intellectual concepts going; we ought not to be burdening people with any more than they need. |
#29
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Heck, I'd do it one better, save my pennies and buy a bigger , louder unit that
will get the point across.. just like SUV owners More power (literally) to the genny people, but if you could just make them quieter it would take the sting out of the cold and dark for the |
#30
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Richard J Kinch wrote:
Jamie writes: Sorry, my mistake. But regardless, CO can kill you very quickly... even from a car, with a catalytic converter, and certainly from a generator which probably doesn't have one. Yes, a 1-cylinder B&S/Tecumseh/Kohler/etc is typically far worse than a modern auto engine as regards emissions. The risk should never be understated. I disagree. That philosophy leads to those user manuals that start with 10 pages of warnings that nobody reads. Rear-view mirrors that warn you about things appearing smaller. You mean the ones that say: "Caution: Assholes in mirror are smaller than they appear"? Caution should be proportioned to risk. Cf the boy who cried wolf. Probability, hazards, and risks are about the hardest intellectual concepts going; we ought not to be burdening people with any more than they need. |
#31
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"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ...
During the last power cut, I was careful to run my generator only during "waking" hours. I live in a trailer park, and don't want to do that to my neighbors. My thoughts with the original poster's generator is to get a longer cord, and put it out in some bushes. Auto muffler won't do much good. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org www.mormons.com "NokNokMan" wrote in message t... I personally would like to thank you for your consideration. Year before last during the big Northeast blackout, four of my neighbors fired up their generators. It sounded like pole position around here, and it was tough enough trying to sleep without any AC or fans, let alone the noise. "Haas" jentra wrote in message ink.net... I have a 7KW generator that makes a hell of a racket on a cold frozen night when the power is out. Is there a muffler kit that can be used on an air cooled engine, if so what type or suggestions on how to quiet this thing. Thanks You can make a generator "bunker" with sandbags around the generator to absorb and deflect sound away. A larger muffler as mentioned previously would most likely help to reduce exhaust noise, some type of enclosure could reduce the mechanical noise. |
#32
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I agree with your sentiment. But I think it is irresponsible to (basically)
tell people that it's OK to run your car in the garage with the door shut because the emissions are virtually zero. Did you read the link I posted earlier, which contained a very revealing analysis of the amount of CO produced by a car started in an enclosed garage? It does not support your position that this is a negligible risk. "Richard J Kinch" wrote in message . .. The risk should never be understated. I disagree. That philosophy leads to those user manuals that start with 10 pages of warnings that nobody reads. Rear-view mirrors that warn you about things appearing smaller. Caution should be proportioned to risk. Cf the boy who cried wolf. Probability, hazards, and risks are about the hardest intellectual concepts going; we ought not to be burdening people with any more than they need. |
#33
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In article , "Jamie" wrote:
I agree with your sentiment. But I think it is irresponsible to (basically) tell people that it's OK to run your car in the garage with the door shut because the emissions are virtually zero. Did you read the link I posted earlier, which contained a very revealing analysis of the amount of CO produced by a car started in an enclosed garage? It does not support your position that this is a negligible risk. Jamie, you have to remember that Richard comes from a planet where it's safe to drink gasoline, but borax is a deadly poison. Just Google some of his previous posts in this ng and you'll see. |
#34
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Enclosures can be built but need to be designed right and need more
than a few inches of airspace. The heat from the motor and exuast will ignite wood. I use an 8x8 shed with some insulation at the roof and leave the doors open and run a fan inside. Contacting a pro or the mnfg is best. Mufflers will work but will reduce power. Sure Honda is the best but at 2.5-3x the price. But you do get what you pay for, in voltage stability, reliability and quietness. |
#35
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I ran my 7500w gen ten ft outside my house, my Co alarm tripped as the
wind was blowing fumes back in. Running it in an attached space is high risk even with doors open. Best is a sepatate shed- garage with 20 -30+ ft proper cable. Generators are inneficent engines and can at full load consume the same 15 hp it takes to power a small car at 55mph. Also most homeowner gens run at a less efficient 3600 rpm rather than a cars, apx 1800 at 55 mph. |
#36
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Jamie writes:
I agree with your sentiment. But I think it is irresponsible to (basically) tell people that it's OK to run your car in the garage with the door shut because the emissions are virtually zero. It would be irresponsible to twist my words to that effect. |
#37
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Doug Miller writes:
Jamie, you have to remember that Richard comes from a planet where it's safe to drink gasoline, but borax is a deadly poison. I explained how both are hazardous but by different routes, and not so hazardous by others. A mocking response to this rather simple concept betrays a childish habit of mind. |
#38
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According to Richard J Kinch :
Chris Lewis writes: "Near zero" CO emissions from cars can kill you if you're not ventilating well enough. Starting a car in a closed garage and sitting in the car to read a book is about the easiest and gentlest ways to die there is. Bunk. The pCO2 respiratory stimulation will kick in long before integrated pCO is enough to affect anything. Car exhaust is nearly pure CO2 and steam, plus very tiny amounts of things like CO. As a suicide method, it's absolutely stupid, because the mostly likely outcome is a brain-damaged but still-alive subject. [Okay, I won't quote the only suicide that I'm personally aware of.] Bunk still. You're missing a critical difference between how CO2 and CO affects the body. CO2 _primarily_ works by simple displacement of O2, and at high enough levels suppression of breathing (at mid levels it encourages breathing, at very high levels it suppresses it). If you remove someone from a CO2 situation short of brain damage occuring, they recover pretty instantly. In other words, CO2 in == CO2 out (more or less). The body is designed to expell CO2. In contrast, CO inhibits O2 transfer no matter how much O2 is in your lungs. Not only that, it's expelled very slowly. It "bioaccumulates" at any exposure level above a very low threshold. Once you've been CO-poisoned, you have to have breathing support (ie: pure O2 or hyperbaric) long enough for your body to have a chance to get rid of the CO. Thus, in anything short of a perfectly sealed environment, it's VERY common for the CO2 levels to never reach hazardous levels and being able to survive it indefinately, but the CO level in the blood starts to rise. Thus, operating a gas generator for a long period of time (hours) when there's the slightest exhaust leak to living areas is _extremely_ hazardous. Because the CO2 concentration (and smell) may never get strong enough to do something about. But the CO level in your blood is going up and up and ... even tho you're getting plenty of O2, your blood doesn't want it. You die without even noticing, because you're breathing acceptable levels of CO2. Take careful note of the MSDS's and descriptions of CO2 and CO poisoning. Notice how "shortness of breath" is _not_ a symptom of CO poisoning? That's why it's so dangerous. -- Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#39
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In article , Richard J Kinch wrote:
Doug Miller writes: Jamie, you have to remember that Richard comes from a planet where it's safe to drink gasoline, but borax is a deadly poison. I explained how both are hazardous but by different routes, and not so hazardous by others. A mocking response to this rather simple concept betrays a childish habit of mind. It is a fact that you once stated in this ng that the hydrocarbons in gasoline are safe to drink. It is also a fact that you claimed that borax is a deadly poison. It is likewise a fact that when I posted LD50 figures that showed otherwise, you claimed I was wrong, but never responded when challenged to provide the correct figures. In this thread you have claimed that the levels of CO in automobile exhaust are not particularly harmful (I admit I'm paraphrasing, but I think I've captured the gist of it). If anything, your statements seem to deserve much more mocking than they have received so far. |
#40
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"Richard J Kinch" wrote in message . .. Chris Lewis writes: "Near zero" CO emissions from cars can kill you if you're not ventilating well enough. Starting a car in a closed garage and sitting in the car to read a book is about the easiest and gentlest ways to die there is. Bunk. The pCO2 respiratory stimulation will kick in long before integrated pCO is enough to affect anything. Car exhaust is nearly pure CO2 and steam, plus very tiny amounts of things like CO. As a suicide method, it's absolutely stupid, because the mostly likely outcome is a brain-damaged but still-alive subject. The dose makes the poison. Your swell ideas about what happens given a lethal dose of CO doesn't mean inhaling car exhaust will administer a lethal dose. Citing unusual cases where it has happened is to commit the fallacy of selection. So in other words, a few years ago when I was working on a car, in a closed shop, exhaust hose attached, but unaware of a hole in the exhaust, I should have known sooner I was poisoning myself?? I realized that I was feeling faint and headed out the door. I don't remembering even getting outside, don't remember opening the heavy shop door. All I remember is a buddy that happened to stop by, finding me sitting, passed out in a snow bank along side the shop. If I had not caught myself feeling faint, or the shop door was farther away, I would not be here today. I noticed nothing untill I felt dizzy. Greg |
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