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I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy
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On 2/14/20 4:58 PM, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy


1. Can't you "unbundle"/cancel the landline from the DSL ? DSL only
needs the wires, not the dialtone, etc to work.

2. Are there no other Internet providers in your area ?
Search here based on Zip Code: https://broadbandnow.com/
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On 2/14/2020 4:58 PM, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy

Depends on where you live. Chances are the cable company will give you
a much faster internet for that or less, especially the first year.

Fastest I ever got was 18 Mbs from DSL but Spectrum gives me 200 Mbs and
the first year it was $44. Land line is another $10 or so with free
NoMoRobo.
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On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 4:58:48 PM UTC-5, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy


I assume by landline, you mean VOIP over the internet, not copper wires?
But it doesn't matter. You can likely drop the phone part of Frontier,
just use them for internet and use any of the VOIP companies. I've used
Ooma, for example. You buy the VOIP box, about $50, then the service
is just about $5 a month, which is to cover the taxes and fees. It's
worked great for me. The only thing stopping you would be if Frontier
won't unbundle the phone and internet or charge you just as much without
phone, but they probably can't do that.
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On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:27:04 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 2/14/2020 4:58 PM, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.
My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.
That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!
I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.
I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.
Are there any cheaper options?
Thanks,
Andy


Depends on where you live. Chances are the cable company will give you
a much faster internet for that or less, especially the first year.
Fastest I ever got was 18 Mbs from DSL but Spectrum gives me 200 Mbs and
the first year it was $44. Land line is another $10 or so with free
NoMoRobo.


Wow - you live well !
I thought I'd died-and-gone-to-heaven when they ran
fiber to our tiny rural hamlet - no complaints at all about the
service, speed, or reliability but it's ~ $ 150. per month
for phone, TV, internet. Plus it's a small local company
to deal with - rather than a faceless mega-company.
We have very poor rural cellular - hence the fiber phone service.
... and it's part of a " bundle " package.
Prior to fiber, we had various separate sevices -
- cellular internet being the most expensive -
- forced into it when dial-up became totally useless.
.. but I still use that free ~ 12 year old router !
John T.



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On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 4:05:53 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On 2/14/20 4:58 PM, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy


1. Can't you "unbundle"/cancel the landline from the DSL ? DSL only
needs the wires, not the dialtone, etc to work.

2. Are there no other Internet providers in your area ?
Search here based on Zip Code: https://broadbandnow.com/


Thanks for the idea.

I talked with Frontier.

I can not cancel my land line because the DSL requires it.
At least that is what they said.

I had call waiting which I did not know I had.
Frontier does not break down a bill like they should.

I cancelled call waiting and reduced my bill from $90 - $77.

I am happy with that.

They told me I am on a "promotion" for 12 months.

So in a year, I get the fun of going thru this again. :-)

Andy
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On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 5:00:55 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 4:58:48 PM UTC-5, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy


I assume by landline, you mean VOIP over the internet, not copper wires?
But it doesn't matter. You can likely drop the phone part of Frontier,
just use them for internet and use any of the VOIP companies. I've used
Ooma, for example. You buy the VOIP box, about $50, then the service
is just about $5 a month, which is to cover the taxes and fees. It's
worked great for me. The only thing stopping you would be if Frontier
won't unbundle the phone and internet or charge you just as much without
phone, but they probably can't do that.


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

I found out that Frontier charges $6 each month for when they have to repair a phone line that someone digging cuts.

I told the lady, "You mean customers have to pay when someone damages the phone line ?"

I am praying for peace. :-)

Andy


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On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.


Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.
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On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 8:30:16 PM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 5:00:55 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 4:58:48 PM UTC-5, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service..

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy


I assume by landline, you mean VOIP over the internet, not copper wires?
But it doesn't matter. You can likely drop the phone part of Frontier,
just use them for internet and use any of the VOIP companies. I've used
Ooma, for example. You buy the VOIP box, about $50, then the service
is just about $5 a month, which is to cover the taxes and fees. It's
worked great for me. The only thing stopping you would be if Frontier
won't unbundle the phone and internet or charge you just as much without
phone, but they probably can't do that.


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

I found out that Frontier charges $6 each month for when they have to repair a phone line that someone digging cuts.

I told the lady, "You mean customers have to pay when someone damages the phone line ?"

I am praying for peace. :-)

Andy


Sorry, I screwed that up. I missed the dsl part. So, I assume no other internet service, eg cable is available? If not, then I guess you're stuck. Kind of surprised that you can't get just dsl internet without voice phone service. I would think regulators would require them to unbundled. You might want to check about that.

Most people would have voice over copper, with dsl added, but no technical reason you can't have dsl without phone service.


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On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 01:34:12 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 14 Feb 2020 22:55:14 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.


Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.


So the box has a jack on the outside, or it's not even locked?


It opens with a 5/16 socket.
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In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 15 Feb 2020 02:25:00 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 01:34:12 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 14 Feb 2020 22:55:14 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.


So the box has a jack on the outside, or it's not even locked?


It opens with a 5/16 socket.


I wish I could remember numbers.

BTW, we don't have batteries here, outside of the local exchange, which
is a building with a lock on the door.

Once in Chicago I watched while the guy punched in the code to open the
door, and I wanted to go in and wander around, and maybe connect another
line to where I lived, but I figured they would really dislike my coming
in. That's when I was 20. Now I'm too old to get away with anything,
until I learn how to pretend that I'm senile.
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On 2/14/2020 8:30 PM, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 5:00:55 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 4:58:48 PM UTC-5, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Andy


I assume by landline, you mean VOIP over the internet, not copper wires?
But it doesn't matter. You can likely drop the phone part of Frontier,
just use them for internet and use any of the VOIP companies. I've used
Ooma, for example. You buy the VOIP box, about $50, then the service
is just about $5 a month, which is to cover the taxes and fees. It's
worked great for me. The only thing stopping you would be if Frontier
won't unbundle the phone and internet or charge you just as much without
phone, but they probably can't do that.


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

I found out that Frontier charges $6 each month for when they have to repair a phone line that someone digging cuts.

I told the lady, "You mean customers have to pay when someone damages the phone line ?"

I am praying for peace. :-)

Andy


Ditto here in western NC. No cable, although it is at the base of the
mountain where I live. So, the only thing is slow DSL from Frontier.
I'm beyond the 14000 foot limit, so they only allow 3meg, however,
because I'm just outside and my line it clean, they allow it to .....
wait for it ..... 6meg. Woopie! The town has gotten some federal
money to give high speed all over. I'm hoping it will come this way.
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On 2/15/2020 8:46 AM, Art Todesco wrote:
On 2/14/2020 8:30 PM, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 5:00:55 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 4:58:48 PM UTC-5, A K wrote:
I have a landline and internet from Frontier.

My bill is $70 plus $18 more of taxes.

That's around a 25 % tax rate !!!!

I am also not happy that Frontier has a monopoly on land line service.

I could live without the landline, but I have to have it because I have
DSL.

Are there any cheaper options?

Thanks,
Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Andy

I assume by landline, you mean VOIP over the internet, not copper wires?
But it doesn't matter. You can likely drop the phone part of Frontier,
just use them for internet and use any of the VOIP companies.Â* I've used
Ooma, for example.Â* You buy the VOIP box, about $50, then the service
is just about $5 a month, which is to cover the taxes and fees.Â* It's
worked great for me.Â* The only thing stopping you would be if Frontier
won't unbundle the phone and internet or charge you just as much without
phone, but they probably can't do that.


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits
which can knock out cell towers.

I found out that Frontier charges $6 each month for when they have to
repair a phone line that someone digging cuts.

I told the lady, "You mean customers have to pay when someone damages
the phone line ?"

I am praying for peace. :-)

Andy


Ditto here in western NC.Â* No cable, although it is at the base of the
mountain where I live.Â* So, the only thing is slow DSL from Frontier.
I'm beyond the 14000 foot limit, so they only allow 3meg, however,
because I'm just outside and my line it clean, they allow it toÂ* .....
wait for it ..... 6meg.Â*Â* Woopie!Â* The town has gotten some federal
money to give high speed all over.Â* I'm hoping it will come this way.


We are lucky and I have choice of Comcast or Verizon FIOS. My Comcast
triple play give me up to a gig. Wife complains about cost but will not
do what neighbor across the street does and switch back and forth when
initial offer expires and price goes up.

I have both services to my house but gave up the FIOS telephone lines.
Since I only had one business phone on it the charged me land line
prices which did not include long distance, caller id, etc.


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On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.


Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.


I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy
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On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.


Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.


I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy


Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?
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On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 06:34:03 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 15 Feb 2020 02:25:00 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 01:34:12 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 14 Feb 2020 22:55:14 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

So the box has a jack on the outside, or it's not even locked?


It opens with a 5/16 socket.


I wish I could remember numbers.

BTW, we don't have batteries here, outside of the local exchange, which
is a building with a lock on the door.

Once in Chicago I watched while the guy punched in the code to open the
door, and I wanted to go in and wander around, and maybe connect another
line to where I lived, but I figured they would really dislike my coming
in. That's when I was 20. Now I'm too old to get away with anything,
until I learn how to pretend that I'm senile.


The days of the big 48v battery bank in the basement of a phone
exchange with 3 floors of clicking relays and originating registers
and your own dedicated pair going all the way there are long gone. The
local phone company here was United Telephone with a #5 system in Ft
Myers and an old "stepper" in Naples. They were my customer. When
Sprint bought them the whole thing disappeared and they just had a
computer console, a couple racks and the wire bays where the wires
come in. Most of the wires coming in gave way to fiber. A lot of that
switching was redistributed out to those little boxes I was talking
about in neighborhoods, connected to the fiber. That was what allowed
people to get DSL. You can only run DSL on copper for about a half
mile or so. Then it has to get up on the fiber via a DSLAM. They call
that "the central office" when they talk about DSL although it is
really just the link to fiber. Those little boxes have their own 48v
power supply and a battery. Next time I see the guys working on it I
will try to get a picture of the insides.
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On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 08:50:47 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:

On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.


Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.


I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy


You should be able to get 100mb DSL then. We are still served by
Century link/Sprint and there is only one office per county. Both are
about 15 miles from me.
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On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 09:05:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.


I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy


Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?


Once 5G rolls out I expect big mobile players to try to get everyone
on it and abandon any copper that is still left out there.


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On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 1:04:09 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 06:34:03 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 15 Feb 2020 02:25:00 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 01:34:12 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 14 Feb 2020 22:55:14 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

So the box has a jack on the outside, or it's not even locked?

It opens with a 5/16 socket.


I wish I could remember numbers.

BTW, we don't have batteries here, outside of the local exchange, which
is a building with a lock on the door.

Once in Chicago I watched while the guy punched in the code to open the
door, and I wanted to go in and wander around, and maybe connect another
line to where I lived, but I figured they would really dislike my coming
in. That's when I was 20. Now I'm too old to get away with anything,
until I learn how to pretend that I'm senile.


The days of the big 48v battery bank in the basement of a phone
exchange with 3 floors of clicking relays and originating registers
and your own dedicated pair going all the way there are long gone. The
local phone company here was United Telephone with a #5 system in Ft
Myers and an old "stepper" in Naples. They were my customer. When
Sprint bought them the whole thing disappeared and they just had a
computer console, a couple racks and the wire bays where the wires
come in. Most of the wires coming in gave way to fiber. A lot of that
switching was redistributed out to those little boxes I was talking
about in neighborhoods, connected to the fiber. That was what allowed
people to get DSL. You can only run DSL on copper for about a half
mile or so. Then it has to get up on the fiber via a DSLAM. They call
that "the central office" when they talk about DSL although it is
really just the link to fiber. Those little boxes have their own 48v
power supply and a battery. Next time I see the guys working on it I
will try to get a picture of the insides.


Generally agree. You can get a lot greater distance with DSL though.
It is highly dependent on the actual wiring. If it's a straight run,
that's good and will support higher speeds/longer distance. It it has
bridged taps, gauge changes, is degraded wire, etc, then you're limited
to shorter distances and/or lower speeds. Overall, it's only viable
if you don't have something better for internet.

  #22   Report Post  
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Default Phone service

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 10:37:41 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 1:04:09 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 06:34:03 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 15 Feb 2020 02:25:00 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 01:34:12 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 14 Feb 2020 22:55:14 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

So the box has a jack on the outside, or it's not even locked?

It opens with a 5/16 socket.

I wish I could remember numbers.

BTW, we don't have batteries here, outside of the local exchange, which
is a building with a lock on the door.

Once in Chicago I watched while the guy punched in the code to open the
door, and I wanted to go in and wander around, and maybe connect another
line to where I lived, but I figured they would really dislike my coming
in. That's when I was 20. Now I'm too old to get away with anything,
until I learn how to pretend that I'm senile.


The days of the big 48v battery bank in the basement of a phone
exchange with 3 floors of clicking relays and originating registers
and your own dedicated pair going all the way there are long gone. The
local phone company here was United Telephone with a #5 system in Ft
Myers and an old "stepper" in Naples. They were my customer. When
Sprint bought them the whole thing disappeared and they just had a
computer console, a couple racks and the wire bays where the wires
come in. Most of the wires coming in gave way to fiber. A lot of that
switching was redistributed out to those little boxes I was talking
about in neighborhoods, connected to the fiber. That was what allowed
people to get DSL. You can only run DSL on copper for about a half
mile or so. Then it has to get up on the fiber via a DSLAM. They call
that "the central office" when they talk about DSL although it is
really just the link to fiber. Those little boxes have their own 48v
power supply and a battery. Next time I see the guys working on it I
will try to get a picture of the insides.


Generally agree. You can get a lot greater distance with DSL though.
It is highly dependent on the actual wiring. If it's a straight run,
that's good and will support higher speeds/longer distance. It it has
bridged taps, gauge changes, is degraded wire, etc, then you're limited
to shorter distances and/or lower speeds. Overall, it's only viable
if you don't have something better for internet.


If Comcast could stay up more than 24 hours at a time, I might think
of taking them back but my FIL still uses them and they suck. It
wasn't really apparent to him until he got his echo. He wasn't on the
computer that often but now the echo will have a red ring in top when
the network is down and he sees it at least once a day. Their TV
service is a little better but I am still over there every couple of
weeks to "fix" his TV, to find out it is Comcast. Now I have him call
them first and he usually gets the recorded message. "Yes we are
sorry, we know we suck but what are you going to do? We hope to
restore service in an hour or so". (or words to that effect).
DSL may be slow (10mb) but it is reliable. We are just waiting for
Hotwire to extend their fiber down here. It is a mile away now.
  #23   Report Post  
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Default Phone service

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 13:03:09 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 06:34:03 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 15 Feb 2020 02:25:00 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 01:34:12 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 14 Feb 2020 22:55:14 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

So the box has a jack on the outside, or it's not even locked?

It opens with a 5/16 socket.


I wish I could remember numbers.

BTW, we don't have batteries here, outside of the local exchange, which
is a building with a lock on the door.

Once in Chicago I watched while the guy punched in the code to open the
door, and I wanted to go in and wander around, and maybe connect another
line to where I lived, but I figured they would really dislike my coming
in. That's when I was 20. Now I'm too old to get away with anything,
until I learn how to pretend that I'm senile.


The days of the big 48v battery bank in the basement of a phone
exchange with 3 floors of clicking relays and originating registers
and your own dedicated pair going all the way there are long gone. The
local phone company here was United Telephone with a #5 system in Ft
Myers and an old "stepper" in Naples. They were my customer. When
Sprint bought them the whole thing disappeared and they just had a
computer console, a couple racks and the wire bays where the wires
come in. Most of the wires coming in gave way to fiber. A lot of that
switching was redistributed out to those little boxes I was talking
about in neighborhoods, connected to the fiber. That was what allowed
people to get DSL. You can only run DSL on copper for about a half
mile or so.

Actually the limit is 5.5Km (roughly 3 miles) without a "repeater"

Then it has to get up on the fiber via a DSLAM. They call
that "the central office" when they talk about DSL although it is
really just the link to fiber. Those little boxes have their own 48v
power supply and a battery. Next time I see the guys working on it I
will try to get a picture of the insides.

The "central office" CAN be a fiber link - or it can be a repeater on
copper
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On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 13:08:52 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 09:05:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy


Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?


Once 5G rolls out I expect big mobile players to try to get everyone
on it and abandon any copper that is still left out there.

Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line". The phone was noisy and DSL was as low as 1MB so I switched to
Rogers (cable) and an OOMA box. Would have used the cheaper Magic Jack
but I could not port my existing phone number.
  #25   Report Post  
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Posts: 15,279
Default Phone service

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 3:22:21 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 10:37:41 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 1:04:09 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 06:34:03 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 15 Feb 2020 02:25:00 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 01:34:12 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 14 Feb 2020 22:55:14 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

So the box has a jack on the outside, or it's not even locked?

It opens with a 5/16 socket.

I wish I could remember numbers.

BTW, we don't have batteries here, outside of the local exchange, which
is a building with a lock on the door.

Once in Chicago I watched while the guy punched in the code to open the
door, and I wanted to go in and wander around, and maybe connect another
line to where I lived, but I figured they would really dislike my coming
in. That's when I was 20. Now I'm too old to get away with anything,
until I learn how to pretend that I'm senile.

The days of the big 48v battery bank in the basement of a phone
exchange with 3 floors of clicking relays and originating registers
and your own dedicated pair going all the way there are long gone. The
local phone company here was United Telephone with a #5 system in Ft
Myers and an old "stepper" in Naples. They were my customer. When
Sprint bought them the whole thing disappeared and they just had a
computer console, a couple racks and the wire bays where the wires
come in. Most of the wires coming in gave way to fiber. A lot of that
switching was redistributed out to those little boxes I was talking
about in neighborhoods, connected to the fiber. That was what allowed
people to get DSL. You can only run DSL on copper for about a half
mile or so. Then it has to get up on the fiber via a DSLAM. They call
that "the central office" when they talk about DSL although it is
really just the link to fiber. Those little boxes have their own 48v
power supply and a battery. Next time I see the guys working on it I
will try to get a picture of the insides.


Generally agree. You can get a lot greater distance with DSL though.
It is highly dependent on the actual wiring. If it's a straight run,
that's good and will support higher speeds/longer distance. It it has
bridged taps, gauge changes, is degraded wire, etc, then you're limited
to shorter distances and/or lower speeds. Overall, it's only viable
if you don't have something better for internet.


If Comcast could stay up more than 24 hours at a time, I might think
of taking them back but my FIL still uses them and they suck. It
wasn't really apparent to him until he got his echo. He wasn't on the
computer that often but now the echo will have a red ring in top when
the network is down and he sees it at least once a day. Their TV
service is a little better but I am still over there every couple of
weeks to "fix" his TV, to find out it is Comcast. Now I have him call
them first and he usually gets the recorded message. "Yes we are
sorry, we know we suck but what are you going to do? We hope to
restore service in an hour or so". (or words to that effect).
DSL may be slow (10mb) but it is reliable. We are just waiting for
Hotwire to extend their fiber down here. It is a mile away now.


All depends on the system. Here in NJ cable is fast, reliable, and the
best bang for the buck. That's the only choice I have. Some places
have choices, eg Verizon Fios as an option. That got close to where
I am, but then they curtailed the deployment. That was maybe ten years
ago, IDK what they are doing now, just that it ain't here. I had
DSL briefly, before the cable company upgraded and had internet available.
It cost more and was a few hundred Kbps.


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In article ,
says...

All depends on the system. Here in NJ cable is fast, reliable, and the
best bang for the buck. That's the only choice I have. Some places
have choices, eg Verizon Fios as an option. That got close to where
I am, but then they curtailed the deployment. That was maybe ten years
ago, IDK what they are doing now, just that it ain't here. I had
DSL briefly, before the cable company upgraded and had internet available.
It cost more and was a few hundred Kbps.



It must depend on the system, and maybe where you are at in the system.

I am well pleased with Spectrum for the internet. I get the 200 mb
service and it is almost never down. About 3 miles up the road and
closer to the main equipment several are complaing about bad and poor
service and being out much of the time.

I also have the phone over the cable by their modem. Sometimes it
breaks up vrey badly, but unpluging it for about 30 seconds and it is
good to go for another week or more.

Before that about 3 years ago the service would go down here about every
6 months and I would have to get a man out and most of the time they
said a fuse had blown up the line. Once they did replace the cable from
my house which is under ground to the above line at the pole that is
about 200 feet away from the house.

A few days ago we had a lot of rain (been that way for months) and some
wind. There was no snow or ice. I think the temperture was in the 60's.
The power went out, but when I got the generator up and running the
internet was up. The power stayed out for an hour after I got the
generator going, but the internet stayed going.

I am out in the country so it is either cable or whatever Windstream
(the telephone company ) offers. If I lived in the city I could get
the fiber. It is a small town of maybe 30,000 people . The local
government got on the band wagon at the start and the system is very
fast or can be if you want to pay for it, the fastest in the state. I
got a tour of the fiber building and it is impressive inside. They also
have 2 big generators that can power not only their equipment, but if
needed the emergency services of the county.

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Default Phone service

On 2/15/2020 6:01 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:


It must depend on the system, and maybe where you are at in the system.

I am well pleased with Spectrum for the internet. I get the 200 mb
service and it is almost never down. About 3 miles up the road and
closer to the main equipment several are complaing about bad and poor
service and being out much of the time.

I also have the phone over the cable by their modem. Sometimes it
breaks up vrey badly, but unpluging it for about 30 seconds and it is
good to go for another week or more.


I got Spectrum when we moved here 14 months ago. I was not happy for
the first few weeks and three visits, but one properly set up, it has
been perfect. When I wanted to swap out equipment I was amazed at how
fast and easy it was too.

Have you seen their commercials for cell phone service? I feel bad for
Joey going for the pineapples.
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I am out in the country so it is either cable or whatever Windstream
(the telephone company ) offers. If I lived in the city I could get
the fiber. It is a small town of maybe 30,000 people . The local
government got on the band wagon at the start and the system is very
fast or can be if you want to pay for it, the fastest in the state. I
got a tour of the fiber building and it is impressive inside. They also
have 2 big generators that can power not only their equipment, but if
needed the emergency services of the county.



... small town of 30,000 ? Huh ?

We got fiber ~ 2 years ago - ~ 75 homes ..
en route to the town of 5,000. Yep.

John T.

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Default Phone service

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 16:42:09 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 13:08:52 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 09:05:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy

Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?


Once 5G rolls out I expect big mobile players to try to get everyone
on it and abandon any copper that is still left out there.

Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line". The phone was noisy and DSL was as low as 1MB so I switched to
Rogers (cable) and an OOMA box. Would have used the cheaper Magic Jack
but I could not port my existing phone number.


Ours are generally in the utility and road right of way and the
utilities generally deforest that whole 66' swath here in Florida.
There was a rumor 30 years ago that Sprint dropped fiber in the hole
in front of my house with the copper but these days they only mark two
lines. They used to mark 3 on a locate so I suspect the fiber may have
been damaged or simply abandoned. They bored the line to my house 30
years ago when the overhead drop was removed. It is a 3 pair flooded
cable.
  #30   Report Post  
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On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 21:16:01 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 16:42:09 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 13:08:52 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 09:05:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy

Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?

Once 5G rolls out I expect big mobile players to try to get everyone
on it and abandon any copper that is still left out there.

Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line". The phone was noisy and DSL was as low as 1MB so I switched to
Rogers (cable) and an OOMA box. Would have used the cheaper Magic Jack
but I could not port my existing phone number.


Ours are generally in the utility and road right of way and the
utilities generally deforest that whole 66' swath here in Florida.
There was a rumor 30 years ago that Sprint dropped fiber in the hole
in front of my house with the copper but these days they only mark two
lines. They used to mark 3 on a locate so I suspect the fiber may have
been damaged or simply abandoned. They bored the line to my house 30
years ago when the overhead drop was removed. It is a 3 pair flooded
cable.

We have the gas, hydro, and water underground in the boulevard and
first 3 feet of lawn. The telephone and cable run along the rear
property line. Ours is all burried. In some areas it runs above ground
-(even in some with burried power) - while where the power is overhead
on the street, phone and cable sometimes share the poles. The power
goes up to the house under the edge of the driveway- about 2 or 3 feet
from the grass, while the water goes about 3 feet out from the other
side of the driveway (with the drainage/sewer) and the gas is about 15
to 20 feet farther over - in line with the corner of the house. Gas
meter on one end of the house, electric on the other end (on garage
wall) and water meter in the center of the house undeer the front step
(in the cold room)


  #31   Report Post  
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On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:25:16 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 21:16:01 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 16:42:09 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 13:08:52 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 09:05:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy

Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?

Once 5G rolls out I expect big mobile players to try to get everyone
on it and abandon any copper that is still left out there.
Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line". The phone was noisy and DSL was as low as 1MB so I switched to
Rogers (cable) and an OOMA box. Would have used the cheaper Magic Jack
but I could not port my existing phone number.


Ours are generally in the utility and road right of way and the
utilities generally deforest that whole 66' swath here in Florida.
There was a rumor 30 years ago that Sprint dropped fiber in the hole
in front of my house with the copper but these days they only mark two
lines. They used to mark 3 on a locate so I suspect the fiber may have
been damaged or simply abandoned. They bored the line to my house 30
years ago when the overhead drop was removed. It is a 3 pair flooded
cable.

We have the gas, hydro, and water underground in the boulevard and
first 3 feet of lawn. The telephone and cable run along the rear
property line. Ours is all burried. In some areas it runs above ground
-(even in some with burried power) - while where the power is overhead
on the street, phone and cable sometimes share the poles. The power
goes up to the house under the edge of the driveway- about 2 or 3 feet
from the grass, while the water goes about 3 feet out from the other
side of the driveway (with the drainage/sewer) and the gas is about 15
to 20 feet farther over - in line with the corner of the house. Gas
meter on one end of the house, electric on the other end (on garage
wall) and water meter in the center of the house undeer the front step
(in the cold room)


The county owned right of way is 66 feet wide in front of my house,
typical for a Florida residential street. 24 feet on each side of the
18' road is grass and that is where the utilities go. A lot of people
are shocked to find out they don't own the first 24 feet of their
yard. This is not an easement, the county just owns it. They can cut
down "your" trees, dig up "your" grass and generally tell you what you
are allowed to do there. Lawn sprinklers are always an issue. If they
dig them up, tough ****. Legally all you can have is a mailbox and
with a permit, a driveway across it.

OTOH, you can make them mow it if you want. Just don't expect it to
happen often or get a very good job.
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Default Phone service

On 2/15/20 3:42 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:

[snip]

Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line".


A noisy phone line was why I switched to phone service from the cable
company.

The phone was noisy and DSL was as low as 1MB so I switched to
Rogers (cable) and an OOMA box. Would have used the cheaper Magic Jack
but I could not port my existing phone number.



--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"I can't activate two neurons simultaneously, and I vote" -- The
theistic majority
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Default Phone service

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:42:50 -0500, wrote:

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:25:16 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 21:16:01 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 16:42:09 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 13:08:52 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 09:05:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy

Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?

Once 5G rolls out I expect big mobile players to try to get everyone
on it and abandon any copper that is still left out there.
Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line". The phone was noisy and DSL was as low as 1MB so I switched to
Rogers (cable) and an OOMA box. Would have used the cheaper Magic Jack
but I could not port my existing phone number.

Ours are generally in the utility and road right of way and the
utilities generally deforest that whole 66' swath here in Florida.
There was a rumor 30 years ago that Sprint dropped fiber in the hole
in front of my house with the copper but these days they only mark two
lines. They used to mark 3 on a locate so I suspect the fiber may have
been damaged or simply abandoned. They bored the line to my house 30
years ago when the overhead drop was removed. It is a 3 pair flooded
cable.

We have the gas, hydro, and water underground in the boulevard and
first 3 feet of lawn. The telephone and cable run along the rear
property line. Ours is all burried. In some areas it runs above ground
-(even in some with burried power) - while where the power is overhead
on the street, phone and cable sometimes share the poles. The power
goes up to the house under the edge of the driveway- about 2 or 3 feet
from the grass, while the water goes about 3 feet out from the other
side of the driveway (with the drainage/sewer) and the gas is about 15
to 20 feet farther over - in line with the corner of the house. Gas
meter on one end of the house, electric on the other end (on garage
wall) and water meter in the center of the house undeer the front step
(in the cold room)


The county owned right of way is 66 feet wide in front of my house,
typical for a Florida residential street. 24 feet on each side of the
18' road is grass and that is where the utilities go. A lot of people
are shocked to find out they don't own the first 24 feet of their
yard. This is not an easement, the county just owns it. They can cut
down "your" trees, dig up "your" grass and generally tell you what you
are allowed to do there. Lawn sprinklers are always an issue. If they
dig them up, tough ****. Legally all you can have is a mailbox and
with a permit, a driveway across it.

OTOH, you can make them mow it if you want. Just don't expect it to
happen often or get a very good job.

Here it's about 3.5 feet in from the sidewalk - about 15 feetfrom
the kerb where there is both a sidewalk and boulevard. Hewre if you
don't mow it they will - and add it to your tax bill- - - - -
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On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:47:00 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On 2/15/20 3:42 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:

[snip]

Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line".


A noisy phone line was why I switched to phone service from the cable
company.


When sprint took over the mom and pop phone company here they replaced
the whole "plant" and our lines were clean. I also knew the "data"
guys well at the telco and had a way of getting a clean line if I made
enough "noise" even on the old system. At the end of the day they are
still a government regulated utility and you can push down from the
top if you have to. It helped that I had better tools to assess their
line quality than they did tho.
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Default Phone service

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 17:22:20 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:42:50 -0500, wrote:

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:25:16 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 21:16:01 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 16:42:09 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 13:08:52 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 09:05:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 11:50:50 AM UTC-5, A K wrote:
On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 9:56:12 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 17:30:09 -0800 (PST), A K
wrote:


My landline is copper wires.

I like having a landline because it still works when a hurricane hits which can knock out cell towers.

Don't be too sanguine about that. I found out after Irma that my
"central office" a mile from the house, that allows me to have DSL is
a little battery operated box on the side of the road and you get
about 30 hours out of that battery. Then your phone and DSL is dead.
If they are kind enough to drop a generator there you are back ion
business but that took them almost a week. Some folks who knew the
score around here dragged a cord from their generator out to their box
and recharged the battery every day. (It is just a regular NEMA 5-15)
If it happens again, I am going to go up there and ask around.
Unfortunately, the places around that box are usually abandoned all
summer.

I live 200 feet from a Verizon brick and mortar "main office."

Andy

Then aren't they an alternative for DSL/phone or just DSL and use OOma
or similar for phone?

Once 5G rolls out I expect big mobile players to try to get everyone
on it and abandon any copper that is still left out there.
Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line". The phone was noisy and DSL was as low as 1MB so I switched to
Rogers (cable) and an OOMA box. Would have used the cheaper Magic Jack
but I could not port my existing phone number.

Ours are generally in the utility and road right of way and the
utilities generally deforest that whole 66' swath here in Florida.
There was a rumor 30 years ago that Sprint dropped fiber in the hole
in front of my house with the copper but these days they only mark two
lines. They used to mark 3 on a locate so I suspect the fiber may have
been damaged or simply abandoned. They bored the line to my house 30
years ago when the overhead drop was removed. It is a 3 pair flooded
cable.
We have the gas, hydro, and water underground in the boulevard and
first 3 feet of lawn. The telephone and cable run along the rear
property line. Ours is all burried. In some areas it runs above ground
-(even in some with burried power) - while where the power is overhead
on the street, phone and cable sometimes share the poles. The power
goes up to the house under the edge of the driveway- about 2 or 3 feet
from the grass, while the water goes about 3 feet out from the other
side of the driveway (with the drainage/sewer) and the gas is about 15
to 20 feet farther over - in line with the corner of the house. Gas
meter on one end of the house, electric on the other end (on garage
wall) and water meter in the center of the house undeer the front step
(in the cold room)


The county owned right of way is 66 feet wide in front of my house,
typical for a Florida residential street. 24 feet on each side of the
18' road is grass and that is where the utilities go. A lot of people
are shocked to find out they don't own the first 24 feet of their
yard. This is not an easement, the county just owns it. They can cut
down "your" trees, dig up "your" grass and generally tell you what you
are allowed to do there. Lawn sprinklers are always an issue. If they
dig them up, tough ****. Legally all you can have is a mailbox and
with a permit, a driveway across it.

OTOH, you can make them mow it if you want. Just don't expect it to
happen often or get a very good job.

Here it's about 3.5 feet in from the sidewalk - about 15 feetfrom
the kerb where there is both a sidewalk and boulevard. Hewre if you
don't mow it they will - and add it to your tax bill- - - - -


Sounds like communism. Why should I have to mow a government lot for
free? People do it here, and maintain the grass, just for the illusion
that their yard is bigger than it is. I do too but I also maintain
about an acre of FPL right of way behind my house, just for my own
enjoyment of having a good off leash place for my dog to run. It is
also a sort of wildlife preserve for me.

In real life if I didn't I could complain and they would have to do
some minimal level of maintenance themselves. I don't because the
resulting jungle north of me makes my little acre a private park, only
I can get to.


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On 2/16/2020 2:47 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 2/15/20 3:42 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:

[snip]

Â* Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line".


A noisy phone line was why I switched to phone service from the cable company.



It was a fantastic day when I kicked the AT$T noisy phone line to the curb.

These clowns are still trying to sell 6 Mb pewverse service that was barely adequate 20 years ago.

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On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 22:14:38 -0500, Grumpy Old White Guy
wrote:

On 2/16/2020 2:47 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 2/15/20 3:42 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:

[snip]

* Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line".


A noisy phone line was why I switched to phone service from the cable company.



It was a fantastic day when I kicked the AT$T noisy phone line to the curb.

These clowns are still trying to sell 6 Mb pewverse service that was barely adequate 20 years ago.

Up here Bell is "selling" high speed internet, TV and home phone -
not saying what they are "delivering"
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On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 22:36:55 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 22:14:38 -0500, Grumpy Old White Guy
wrote:

On 2/16/2020 2:47 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 2/15/20 3:42 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:

[snip]

Â* Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line".

A noisy phone line was why I switched to phone service from the cable company.



It was a fantastic day when I kicked the AT$T noisy phone line to the curb.

These clowns are still trying to sell 6 Mb pewverse service that was barely adequate 20 years ago.

Up here Bell is "selling" high speed internet, TV and home phone -
not saying what they are "delivering"


The Telco does OK here if you are on fiber but copper is pretty much
stuck with 10-25mb internet only plus a POTS line that is virtually
free ($15) and has all of the calling services. (free LD, call
waiting, conferencing, caller ID, voice mail and a bunch of other
stuff I never use) If you like to talk long distance a lot I suppose
it is a great deal.
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On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:42:50 -0500, wrote:

The county owned right of way is 66 feet wide in front of my house,
typical for a Florida residential street. 24 feet on each side of the
18' road is grass and that is where the utilities go. A lot of people
are shocked to find out they don't own the first 24 feet of their
yard. This is not an easement, the county just owns it. They can cut


"Not an easement, the county just owns it"...is that a Florida thing? I ask
because I'll be moving there eventually. Everyone does.

I've owned homes in Mississippi, Texas, Kansas, Nebraska, and Montana, not
all at the same time, and my property line has always been the curb. The
sidewalks cross my property but are owned and maintained by the city,
except for snow removal which was my responsibility, and there is always a
utility easement of about 15 feet, but it's just an easement.

down "your" trees, dig up "your" grass and generally tell you what you
are allowed to do there. Lawn sprinklers are always an issue. If they
dig them up, tough ****. Legally all you can have is a mailbox and
with a permit, a driveway across it.

OTOH, you can make them mow it if you want. Just don't expect it to
happen often or get a very good job.


One of the utility companies here has a high voltage line running along the
back of my property with a 100-foot easement, 50 feet of which is on my
side and 50 feet on the next guy's property. In the fine print, though, it
says that they've agreed to repair any fences that have to come down in
case they need access to their lines. They don't have to replace trees,
shrubs, or outbuildings of any kind. It really shouldn't be an issue,
though. They have at least 3 ways to get back there without crossing any
private property.

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On 2/16/2020 10:14 PM, Grumpy Old White Guy wrote:
On 2/16/2020 2:47 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 2/15/20 3:42 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:

[snip]

Â* Most have "effectivel abandoned" all the copper already. The "main
trunk" runs along the back of my property and to replace it would
require tunnelling through a LOT of tree roots (almost a mile, end to
end across numeous properties) All the "spare pairs" have been used
and they cannot provide me (along with numerous others) a "clean
line".


A noisy phone line was why I switched to phone service from the cable
company.



It was a fantastic day when I kicked the AT$T noisy phone line to the curb.

These clowns are still trying to sell 6 Mb pewverse service that was
barely adequate 20 years ago.


I have a long term dislike for them too. Several years ago I had a
billing dispute with them and it got so bad I almost took them to court.
When it got resolved I dropped their long distance service and dropped
their credit card.

I did continue with them with a business land line replaced by fiber.
In spite of it being a VoIP line they charged old land line prices
without long distance service, caller ID etc which required extra charges.

Verizon today with their FIOS internet still retains traces today of the
old AT&T telephone company mentality of being the only game in town.
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