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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton 3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models- but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

--
When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald
the end of the republic.
- Benjamin Franklin
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Saturday, September 14, 2019 at 11:13:17 AM UTC-4, Wade Gattett wrote:
Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton 3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models- but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

--
When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald
the end of the republic.
- Benjamin Franklin




I believe the answer is that the switch is sized to the load, not the
breaker. So 15A is OK. It's hard to imagine a fault condition where
a 15A switch is going to create a safety hazard in that application.
As to whether a 15A switch contributed to your switch failure, I'd say
yes and no, mostly no. Your small fan load is nowhere near the limit
of either a 15A or 20A switch. But a 20A switch may be built a bit
heftier, might take more openings and closing, etc than a 15A one,
so a 20A one might have lasted longer. There are also differences
among 15A switches, ie a cheap chinese one or a better spec grade one,
(probably from China too

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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

Wade Gattett wrote:

Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan
on a 20 amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton
3-ways.


Why would a ceiling can need a 20-amp switch?

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of
the 15A ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same
33 years ago, maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.


Why would a sub use a switch that's twice the price - just because it
costs more?

Why would he not use a switch that would work just fine (a 15 amp
switch) and put the difference in his pocket?

On a side note -

When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

In article , says...

On a side note -

When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?




In the US what is normally referred to as a '3 way switch' in a building
is a single pole double throw. They do no thave a middle off, but just
an off/on position like any light switch would normally have. From the
outside of the switch you could not tell the difference. They are most
often used for lights. You have a room with 2 doors. You put one
switch at each door. Then you can turn the light off and on from either
switch. That is you could walk in one door, turn the light on, walk out
the other door and turn the light off.



http://www.electrical101.com/3way-sw...-nm-cable.html

There is also a '4 way switch' . That is for more than 2 places to turn
on/off a light (or anything else). You usually put a 3 way switch at
each end of the circuit and as many 4 way switches in the middle as you
need.

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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 12:59:29 -0400, Home Guy wrote:

Wade Gattett wrote:

Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan
on a 20 amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton
3-ways.


Why would a ceiling can need a 20-amp switch?

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of
the 15A ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same
33 years ago, maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.


Why would a sub use a switch that's twice the price - just because it
costs more?

Why would he not use a switch that would work just fine (a 15 amp
switch) and put the difference in his pocket?

On a side note -

When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?

A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in Canada
- the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way for off
for low voltage remote control - or this one:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...6-GY/301447158
Which is an "industrial grade" switch - can't think offhand where one
would use one in a house - - - -


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 14 Sep 2019 11:13:12 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:


At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.


Maybe, but it seems to have lasted 33 years.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

--
When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald
the end of the republic.
- Benjamin Franklin


This is one of a series of conservative sentiments attributed to the US
founding fathers or other great historical figures that they never said.

And which were actually first said by conservatives in the 2nd half of
the 20th century or later.

https://fakefoundersquotes.tumblr.co...ote-themselves

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistoria..._that/d2r6lhl/

One screen down on this page, a sentence with the same meaning is
attributed to De Toqueville, but he never said it either. Nor did
Alexander Hamilton, another one to whom it's attributed.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ection/321393/

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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 20:31:22 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 12:59:29 -0400, Home Guy wrote:

Wade Gattett wrote:

Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan
on a 20 amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton
3-ways.


Why would a ceiling can need a 20-amp switch?

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of
the 15A ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same
33 years ago, maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.


Why would a sub use a switch that's twice the price - just because it
costs more?

Why would he not use a switch that would work just fine (a 15 amp
switch) and put the difference in his pocket?

On a side note -

When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?

A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in Canada
- the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way for off
for low voltage remote control - or this one:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...6-GY/301447158
Which is an "industrial grade" switch - can't think offhand where one
would use one in a house - - - -


I have seen them but they are god awful expensive and only in decora.
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 21:00:29 -0400, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 14 Sep 2019 11:13:12 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:


At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.


Maybe, but it seems to have lasted 33 years.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

--
When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald
the end of the republic.
- Benjamin Franklin


This is one of a series of conservative sentiments attributed to the US
founding fathers or other great historical figures that they never said.

And which were actually first said by conservatives in the 2nd half of
the 20th century or later.

https://fakefoundersquotes.tumblr.co...ote-themselves

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistoria..._that/d2r6lhl/

One screen down on this page, a sentence with the same meaning is
attributed to De Toqueville, but he never said it either. Nor did
Alexander Hamilton, another one to whom it's attributed.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ection/321393/



This is another one bouncing around on the interweb with dubious
citation

"About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new
constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at
the University of Edinburgh, had this to say about the fall of the
Athenian Republic some 2,000 years earlier:

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as
a permanent form of government."

"A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters
discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public
treasury."

"From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates who
promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result
that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy,
which is always followed by a dictatorship."

"The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the
beginning of history, has been about 200 years"

"During those 200 years, those nations always progressed through the
following sequence:

1. from bondage to spiritual faith;

2. from spiritual faith to great courage;

3. from courage to liberty;

4. from liberty to abundance;

5. from abundance to complacency;

6. from complacency to apathy;

7. from apathy to dependence;

8. from dependence back into bondage"





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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

Clare Snyder wrote:

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with
center off) but they're not available at home despot (canada)
but they are in the US, and they're like $50. I seem to
remember them being more common years ago (and not so expensive)?


A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in
Canada the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way
for off for low voltage remote control - or this one:
Single-Pole-Double-Throw-Center-Off-Momentary-Contact


There is a leviton constant-contact (not momentary contact) center off
and like I said home despot US has them ($50 - $60 if I recall).

can't think offhand where one would use one in a house - - - -


I wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On 9/14/19 1:49 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:

[snip]

There is also a '4 way switch' . That is for more than 2 places to turn
on/off a light (or anything else). You usually put a 3 way switch at
each end of the circuit and as many 4 way switches in the middle as you
need.


It is essentially a DPDT (double pole, double throw) switch with 2 pairs
of terminals connected internally, so switching exchanges 2 connections.

[SPAM snipped]


--
101 days until the winter celebration (Wed, Dec 25, 2019 12:00:00 AM for
1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"One man's theology is another man's belly laugh." [Robert Heinlein,
"Notebooks of Lazarus Long"]


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches


When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?


What I heard is that its called "3-way" because wires are run to 3
locations (2 switches and light/fan). If you have three switches, its 4-way.

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?


A double-throw switch does have center off, although it can be difficult
to get the switch into that position (a spring tries to pull it away
from the center). I have had this happen accidentally, one switch in
this (center) position means the light can't be turned on at the other
location.

--
101 days until the winter celebration (Wed, Dec 25, 2019 12:00:00 AM for
1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"One man's theology is another man's belly laugh." [Robert Heinlein,
"Notebooks of Lazarus Long"]
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sunday, September 15, 2019 at 12:12:43 PM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?


What I heard is that its called "3-way" because wires are run to 3
locations (2 switches and light/fan). If you have three switches, its 4-way.


+1



I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?


A double-throw switch does have center off, although it can be difficult
to get the switch into that position (a spring tries to pull it away
from the center). I have had this happen accidentally, one switch in
this (center) position means the light can't be turned on at the other
location.


That's not really true. Sounds like you had a particular switch that
could be positioned in between, in an unstable position. Some switches
have a center-off and if they do, it's clearly a detent position and
the switch is spec's as having a center off. If they don't then I guess
it depends on the design, how easy it is to get it into a position it's
not really meant to be in.





--
101 days until the winter celebration (Wed, Dec 25, 2019 12:00:00 AM for
1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"One man's theology is another man's belly laugh." [Robert Heinlein,
"Notebooks of Lazarus Long"]


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On 9/15/2019 11:30 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, September 15, 2019 at 12:12:43 PM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?


What I heard is that its called "3-way" because wires are run to 3
locations (2 switches and light/fan). If you have three switches, its 4-way.


+1

....

But if there are four or more switches, they're not "N-way"...

--

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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sunday, September 15, 2019 at 2:21:45 PM UTC-4, dpb wrote:
On 9/15/2019 11:30 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, September 15, 2019 at 12:12:43 PM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?

What I heard is that its called "3-way" because wires are run to 3
locations (2 switches and light/fan). If you have three switches, its 4-way.


+1

...

But if there are four or more switches, they're not "N-way"...

--


Seems to me that they are all N-way. We come up with a definition for
the N-way case and uniformly apply it. And like Mark said, N was
determined by how many locations the wires had to be run to, eg
one light, two switches is 3 way. Which then leads to what really
is a light with one switch? I'd say that if you analyze it, apply
a uniform definition, then it's two ways, though for whatever reason,
it's not commonly referred to as that.
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 08:36:57 -0400, Home Guy wrote:

Clare Snyder wrote:

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with
center off) but they're not available at home despot (canada)
but they are in the US, and they're like $50. I seem to
remember them being more common years ago (and not so expensive)?


A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in
Canada the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way
for off for low voltage remote control - or this one:
Single-Pole-Double-Throw-Center-Off-Momentary-Contact


There is a leviton constant-contact (not momentary contact) center off
and like I said home despot US has them ($50 - $60 if I recall).

can't think offhand where one would use one in a house - - - -


I wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).

My deal was a two speed ceiling fan (whole house deal). It was common,
hi, lo. so a 3 way was a natural for speed (SPDT) but you still need
an off. I had a 4" box there anyway so I went with 2 switches. Being a
motor load I did go for spec grade, motor rated switches but I was
still out the door for $5 or so for two (a regular 3 way and an SPST)
snap switches in Decora.


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 09:30:41 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, September 15, 2019 at 12:12:43 PM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?


What I heard is that its called "3-way" because wires are run to 3
locations (2 switches and light/fan). If you have three switches, its 4-way.


+1



I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?


A double-throw switch does have center off, although it can be difficult
to get the switch into that position (a spring tries to pull it away
from the center). I have had this happen accidentally, one switch in
this (center) position means the light can't be turned on at the other
location.


That's not really true. Sounds like you had a particular switch that
could be positioned in between, in an unstable position. Some switches
have a center-off and if they do, it's clearly a detent position and
the switch is spec's as having a center off. If they don't then I guess
it depends on the design, how easy it is to get it into a position it's
not really meant to be in.


When they are 59 cents in a barrel on the end cap, who would think it
could just be bad? Or part of batch of a 1000 bad ones because even
the Chinese have trouble finding good help.
Mass production = Mass mistakes.
(See any recall)



--
101 days until the winter celebration (Wed, Dec 25, 2019 12:00:00 AM for
1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"One man's theology is another man's belly laugh." [Robert Heinlein,
"Notebooks of Lazarus Long"]


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 21:00:29 -0400, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 14 Sep 2019 11:13:12 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:


At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.


Maybe, but it seems to have lasted 33 years.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

--
When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald
the end of the republic.
- Benjamin Franklin


This is one of a series of conservative sentiments attributed to the US
founding fathers or other great historical figures that they never said.

And which were actually first said by conservatives in the 2nd half of
the 20th century or later.

https://fakefoundersquotes.tumblr.co...ote-themselves

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistoria..._that/d2r6lhl/

One screen down on this page, a sentence with the same meaning is
attributed to De Toqueville, but he never said it either. Nor did
Alexander Hamilton, another one to whom it's attributed.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ection/321393/

At least not that has been recorded - any or all MAY have said it
some time or other "off the record"
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 22:14:30 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 20:31:22 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 12:59:29 -0400, Home Guy wrote:

Wade Gattett wrote:

Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan
on a 20 amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton
3-ways.

Why would a ceiling can need a 20-amp switch?

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of
the 15A ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same
33 years ago, maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

Why would a sub use a switch that's twice the price - just because it
costs more?

Why would he not use a switch that would work just fine (a 15 amp
switch) and put the difference in his pocket?

On a side note -

When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?

A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in Canada
- the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way for off
for low voltage remote control - or this one:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...6-GY/301447158
Which is an "industrial grade" switch - can't think offhand where one
would use one in a house - - - -


I have seen them but they are god awful expensive and only in decora.

What would you use such a switch for??? I can think of many
industrial uses.
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 08:36:57 -0400, Home Guy wrote:

Clare Snyder wrote:

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with
center off) but they're not available at home despot (canada)
but they are in the US, and they're like $50. I seem to
remember them being more common years ago (and not so expensive)?


A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in
Canada the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way
for off for low voltage remote control - or this one:
Single-Pole-Double-Throw-Center-Off-Momentary-Contact


There is a leviton constant-contact (not momentary contact) center off
and like I said home despot US has them ($50 - $60 if I recall).

can't think offhand where one would use one in a house - - - -


I wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).

Generally that would be accomplished using a bat-handle type switch
supplied by the fan manufacturer or the control manufacturer - but 2
switches in parallel would do the job too
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 17:27:12 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 22:14:30 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 20:31:22 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 12:59:29 -0400, Home Guy wrote:

Wade Gattett wrote:

Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan
on a 20 amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton
3-ways.

Why would a ceiling can need a 20-amp switch?

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of
the 15A ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same
33 years ago, maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

Why would a sub use a switch that's twice the price - just because it
costs more?

Why would he not use a switch that would work just fine (a 15 amp
switch) and put the difference in his pocket?

On a side note -

When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with center
off) but they're not available at home despot (canada) but they are in
the US, and they're like $50. I seem to remember them being more common
years ago (and not so expensive) - ?
A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in Canada
- the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way for off
for low voltage remote control - or this one:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...6-GY/301447158
Which is an "industrial grade" switch - can't think offhand where one
would use one in a house - - - -


I have seen them but they are god awful expensive and only in decora.

What would you use such a switch for??? I can think of many
industrial uses.


I gave you one, switching a single phase 3 wire multi speed motor.


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 17:30:52 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 08:36:57 -0400, Home Guy wrote:

Clare Snyder wrote:

I was looking for either a paddle or decora-style 3-way (with
center off) but they're not available at home despot (canada)
but they are in the US, and they're like $50. I seem to
remember them being more common years ago (and not so expensive)?

A "three way" switch is a SPDT switch used in pairs to switch a
device from 2 different locations.

Have never seen a center off SPDT switch in paddle or decora in
Canada the odd momemtary contact (click one way for on and one way
for off for low voltage remote control - or this one:
Single-Pole-Double-Throw-Center-Off-Momentary-Contact


There is a leviton constant-contact (not momentary contact) center off
and like I said home despot US has them ($50 - $60 if I recall).

can't think offhand where one would use one in a house - - - -


I wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).

Generally that would be accomplished using a bat-handle type switch
supplied by the fan manufacturer or the control manufacturer - but 2
switches in parallel would do the job too


Most people (wives) don't want a bat handle switch in their hall.
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On 9/15/2019 4:01 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, September 15, 2019 at 2:21:45 PM UTC-4, dpb wrote:
On 9/15/2019 11:30 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, September 15, 2019 at 12:12:43 PM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
When you say "3-way" - do you mean 2-pole center thow - with center
off? A switch that can be set to 3 different physical positions?
What I heard is that its called "3-way" because wires are run to 3
locations (2 switches and light/fan). If you have three switches, its 4-way.
+1

...

But if there are four or more switches, they're not "N-way"...

--

Seems to me that they are all N-way. We come up with a definition for
the N-way case and uniformly apply it. And like Mark said, N was
determined by how many locations the wires had to be run to, eg
one light, two switches is 3 way. Which then leads to what really
is a light with one switch? I'd say that if you analyze it, apply
a uniform definition, then it's two ways, though for whatever reason,
it's not commonly referred to as that.


If you have two-phase power, you can also use a 3-way switch as a phase switch.

Connect L1 to one of the traveler screws.

Connect L2 to the remaining traveler screw.

Connect the load's black wire to the third screw.

Connect the load's white wire to neutral.

Now just toggle the switch to switch the load between the two phases.

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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 23:40:48 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...
wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).
Generally that would be accomplished using a bat-handle type switch
supplied by the fan manufacturer or the control manufacturer - but 2
switches in parallel would do the job too


Most people (wives) don't want a bat handle switch in their hall.



The attic fan where I used to live had a switch for 'on, off, timer'.
You turned it on all the time , cut it off, or there was a timer next to
the switch. It was on a flat plate about the size of most light
switches, but the switch was large and almost flat. You pushed it in
toward the wall for off or timer and it stayed in the middle for off.


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

For a timer many just have the time rand a "bypass" switch, Don.t
need anything more - the timer is on (timed) or off. The bypass is on
or off. If the bypass is on it doesn't matter what the timer is set to
- it is ON. With timer off and bypass off, it is OFF. both fit in a
tandem box
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 15 Sep 2019 23:40:48 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...
wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).
Generally that would be accomplished using a bat-handle type switch
supplied by the fan manufacturer or the control manufacturer - but 2
switches in parallel would do the job too


Most people (wives) don't want a bat handle switch in their hall.



The attic fan where I used to live had a switch for 'on, off, timer'.
You turned it on all the time , cut it off, or there was a timer next to
the switch. It was on a flat plate about the size of most light
switches, but the switch was large and almost flat. You pushed it in
toward the wall for off or timer and it stayed in the middle for off.


In addition to the thermostatic switch, my roof fan has two switches in
one box, mounted sideways.

One switch turns it On when it would be off. This was recommended for
use after a hot shower which fills the attic with humidity, but I don't
take hot showers.

One switch turns on Off when it would be on. I use this in late fall
and early spring to let the sun heat the house and save on fuel to heat
it. Or when it's so hot out that the fan would run all night (but
then I usually forget to turn it on the next morning.)

Normally the first switch if off and the second On. With a line on each
one whose parts are in-ine when they are set normally.

But what I should have put in is a timer, because sometimes it is so hot
out at night that the attic never cools off enough to stop the fan, and
it runs from about 11 in the morning to at least 9PM the following day.
There is no point to the fan's running if it's as hot outside as it is
in the attic. It only happens a few days a year but it annoys me. So I
may put in a timer wall switch. I think it will have to be one that
doesn't need a neutral, because I don't think I ran a neutral (from the
fan to these two switches). It would have been easier if I'd done it in
the first place. So maybe I won't do it.


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 15 Sep 2019 17:26:08 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 21:00:29 -0400, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 14 Sep 2019 11:13:12 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:


At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.


Maybe, but it seems to have lasted 33 years.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

--
When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald
the end of the republic.
- Benjamin Franklin


This is one of a series of conservative sentiments attributed to the US
founding fathers or other great historical figures that they never said.

And which were actually first said by conservatives in the 2nd half of
the 20th century or later.

https://fakefoundersquotes.tumblr.co...ote-themselves

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistoria..._that/d2r6lhl/

One screen down on this page, a sentence with the same meaning is
attributed to De Toqueville, but he never said it either. Nor did
Alexander Hamilton, another one to whom it's attributed.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ection/321393/


At least not that has been recorded - any or all MAY have said it
some time or other "off the record"


If it wasn't recorded, how did the conservatives mannage to find a
version attributed to the various people they attributed it to. Face
it, they made up the quote.


The otherwise almost unknown Scot who said something similar, who was
cited in another post, was pessimistic about democracy in general. He
thought all democracies were doomed and this was just one stage each
would go through. Maybe he's right, maybe he's wrong. He has no history
of being a great man.

But more importantly, almost no one has heard of him. To attribute
something to him wouldn't give it the status that they hope to get who
attribute it to someone famous who did NOT say it. That's the purpose
of a forgery.


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On 9/14/19 11:13 AM, Wade Gattett wrote:
Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton 3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models- but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

OP here- Umm, interesting bunch of posts.

I didn't see any answers, though, to my original questions about using a
15A switch on a 20A circuit and might that usage have contributed to the
switch's failure...

--
Somewhere along the line, politicians discovered it's more fun to tell
people how to live than it is to fix potholes.
- @patsajak
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Monday, September 16, 2019 at 8:13:11 AM UTC-4, Wade Gattett wrote:
On 9/14/19 11:13 AM, Wade Gattett wrote:
Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton 3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models- but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

OP here- Umm, interesting bunch of posts.

I didn't see any answers, though, to my original questions about using a
15A switch on a 20A circuit and might that usage have contributed to the
switch's failure...

--
Somewhere along the line, politicians discovered it's more fun to tell
people how to live than it is to fix potholes.
- @patsajak


Missed this? I made the first response.

'I believe the answer is that the switch is sized to the load, not the
breaker. So 15A is OK. It's hard to imagine a fault condition where
a 15A switch is going to create a safety hazard in that application.
As to whether a 15A switch contributed to your switch failure, I'd say
yes and no, mostly no. Your small fan load is nowhere near the limit
of either a 15A or 20A switch. But a 20A switch may be built a bit
heftier, might take more openings and closing, etc than a 15A one,
so a 20A one might have lasted longer. There are also differences
among 15A switches, ie a cheap chinese one or a better spec grade one,
(probably from China too "


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Monday, September 16, 2019 at 3:29:31 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 15 Sep 2019 23:40:48 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...
wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).
Generally that would be accomplished using a bat-handle type switch
supplied by the fan manufacturer or the control manufacturer - but 2
switches in parallel would do the job too

Most people (wives) don't want a bat handle switch in their hall.



The attic fan where I used to live had a switch for 'on, off, timer'.
You turned it on all the time , cut it off, or there was a timer next to
the switch. It was on a flat plate about the size of most light
switches, but the switch was large and almost flat. You pushed it in
toward the wall for off or timer and it stayed in the middle for off.


In addition to the thermostatic switch, my roof fan has two switches in
one box, mounted sideways.

One switch turns it On when it would be off. This was recommended for
use after a hot shower which fills the attic with humidity, but I don't
take hot showers.


Why does taking a shower fill the attic with humidity? Bathroom fan
venting into the attic instead of outside? Something is very wrong
there.





One switch turns on Off when it would be on. I use this in late fall
and early spring to let the sun heat the house and save on fuel to heat
it. Or when it's so hot out that the fan would run all night (but
then I usually forget to turn it on the next morning.)

Normally the first switch if off and the second On. With a line on each
one whose parts are in-ine when they are set normally.

But what I should have put in is a timer, because sometimes it is so hot
out at night that the attic never cools off enough to stop the fan, and
it runs from about 11 in the morning to at least 9PM the following day.
There is no point to the fan's running if it's as hot outside as it is
in the attic. It only happens a few days a year but it annoys me. So I
may put in a timer wall switch. I think it will have to be one that
doesn't need a neutral, because I don't think I ran a neutral (from the
fan to these two switches). It would have been easier if I'd done it in
the first place. So maybe I won't do it.



The attic fan switch is set too low. And adequate natural ventilation,
eg ridge vent with soffit venting is better. I'll bet you could turn
it off from about 8PM until the next morning and not see any difference
with the temperature inside. And if you do, something else is wrong,
eg inadequate insulation.


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches


[snip]

That's not really true. Sounds like you had a particular switch that
could be positioned in between, in an unstable position. Some switches
have a center-off and if they do, it's clearly a detent position and
the switch is spec's as having a center off. If they don't then I guess
it depends on the design, how easy it is to get it into a position it's
not really meant to be in.

Why consider "unstable" to mean not there? An OFF position is a
necessary consequence of the switch breaking one connection before
establishing the other connection.

--
100 days until the winter celebration (Wed, Dec 25, 2019 12:00:00 AM for
1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"WARNING! Literal belief in this book may endanger your health and your
life."


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Monday, September 16, 2019 at 9:53:46 AM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
[snip]

That's not really true. Sounds like you had a particular switch that
could be positioned in between, in an unstable position. Some switches
have a center-off and if they do, it's clearly a detent position and
the switch is spec's as having a center off. If they don't then I guess
it depends on the design, how easy it is to get it into a position it's
not really meant to be in.

Why consider "unstable" to mean not there? An OFF position is a
necessary consequence of the switch breaking one connection before
establishing the other connection.


This is what you described:


"A double-throw switch does have center off, although it can be difficult
to get the switch into that position (a spring tries to pull it away
from the center). I have had this happen accidentally, one switch in
this (center) position means the light can't be turned on at the other
location. "


That is unstable, it's not what the switch was designed to do, it's not
reliable. Suppose it's a switch for a mixer or similar, you put the
switch in the middle position, assuming that's off, and go to work on it?
A switch with a center off position has a detent so it goes into the off
position and stays there, it doesn't have a spring trying to pull
it from an unstable position to one of it's stable positions.

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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 08:13:03 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:

On 9/14/19 11:13 AM, Wade Gattett wrote:
Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton 3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models- but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

OP here- Umm, interesting bunch of posts.

I didn't see any answers, though, to my original questions about using a
15A switch on a 20A circuit and might that usage have contributed to the
switch's failure...



Simple answer. Switch is sized for the LOAD. If the fan draws less
than the rating of the switch it is not a problem. For example, a
standard Leviton 15 amp toggle switch is motor rated for 1/2 HP on 120
volts AC and 2HP on 240 volts AC, and 15 amps (1800 watts) of
incandescent lighting load.

On a 15 amp circuit one 1800 watt load would max out the circuit - or
3 600 watt loads. A 20 amp circuit would allow 4 600 watt lighting
loads. I chose 600 watts rather arbitrarily as most lighting dimmer
switches are rated at 600watts incandescent.
SO - unless the fan is more than 1/2 HP a 15 amp switchis just fine -
assuming it was a "motor rated" switch - which MOST are. A 20 amp
switch is motor rated for 3/4 HP on 120 volts.
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 08:53:41 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:


[snip]

That's not really true. Sounds like you had a particular switch that
could be positioned in between, in an unstable position. Some switches
have a center-off and if they do, it's clearly a detent position and
the switch is spec's as having a center off. If they don't then I guess
it depends on the design, how easy it is to get it into a position it's
not really meant to be in.

Why consider "unstable" to mean not there? An OFF position is a
necessary consequence of the switch breaking one connection before
establishing the other connection.

On a "snap action" switch remaining in the off position would
constitute a switch failure.
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 05:47:39 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Monday, September 16, 2019 at 3:29:31 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 15 Sep 2019 23:40:48 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...
wanted to control an attic fan. I wanted 3 options: Off, On, and
Auto. Auto means the fan is controlled by the thermostat in the attic.
A SPDT with center off would do this, but none are available. I ended
up using one of those double switches (2 SPST single-gang). Available
in paddle and decora, and relatively cheap (I think $17).
Generally that would be accomplished using a bat-handle type switch
supplied by the fan manufacturer or the control manufacturer - but 2
switches in parallel would do the job too

Most people (wives) don't want a bat handle switch in their hall.



The attic fan where I used to live had a switch for 'on, off, timer'.
You turned it on all the time , cut it off, or there was a timer next to
the switch. It was on a flat plate about the size of most light
switches, but the switch was large and almost flat. You pushed it in
toward the wall for off or timer and it stayed in the middle for off.


In addition to the thermostatic switch, my roof fan has two switches in
one box, mounted sideways.

One switch turns it On when it would be off. This was recommended for
use after a hot shower which fills the attic with humidity, but I don't
take hot showers.


Why does taking a shower fill the attic with humidity? Bathroom fan
venting into the attic instead of outside? Something is very wrong
there.


It was pretty common to vent fart fans into the attic until the
mechanical codes caught up with the problem.


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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On 9/16/19 10:45 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 08:13:03 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:

On 9/14/19 11:13 AM, Wade Gattett wrote:
Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton 3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models- but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

OP here- Umm, interesting bunch of posts.

I didn't see any answers, though, to my original questions about using a
15A switch on a 20A circuit and might that usage have contributed to the
switch's failure...



Simple answer. Switch is sized for the LOAD. If the fan draws less
than the rating of the switch it is not a problem. For example, a
standard Leviton 15 amp toggle switch is motor rated for 1/2 HP on 120
volts AC and 2HP on 240 volts AC, and 15 amps (1800 watts) of
incandescent lighting load.

On a 15 amp circuit one 1800 watt load would max out the circuit - or
3 600 watt loads. A 20 amp circuit would allow 4 600 watt lighting
loads. I chose 600 watts rather arbitrarily as most lighting dimmer
switches are rated at 600watts incandescent.
SO - unless the fan is more than 1/2 HP a 15 amp switchis just fine -
assuming it was a "motor rated" switch - which MOST are. A 20 amp
switch is motor rated for 3/4 HP on 120 volts.

Ah, thanks.

The switches only control the 85 watt ceiling fan.

But also on that circuit, there's two floor lamps (LED bulbs now) and
the entertainment corner: two year old big honkin' 7.1 home theater
receiver with 5 speakers plus a 12" powered subwoofer, 10 year old
plasma TV, cable box.

So I'm thinking the switch failure nothing to do with it being rated 15A....

--
If the government gives you a free college education youll have to be
fitted with a catalytic converter....true story, look it up.
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 13:26:30 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:

On 9/16/19 10:45 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 08:13:03 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:

On 9/14/19 11:13 AM, Wade Gattett wrote:
Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton 3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models- but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the 15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not so hot?

OP here- Umm, interesting bunch of posts.

I didn't see any answers, though, to my original questions about using a
15A switch on a 20A circuit and might that usage have contributed to the
switch's failure...



Simple answer. Switch is sized for the LOAD. If the fan draws less
than the rating of the switch it is not a problem. For example, a
standard Leviton 15 amp toggle switch is motor rated for 1/2 HP on 120
volts AC and 2HP on 240 volts AC, and 15 amps (1800 watts) of
incandescent lighting load.

On a 15 amp circuit one 1800 watt load would max out the circuit - or
3 600 watt loads. A 20 amp circuit would allow 4 600 watt lighting
loads. I chose 600 watts rather arbitrarily as most lighting dimmer
switches are rated at 600watts incandescent.
SO - unless the fan is more than 1/2 HP a 15 amp switchis just fine -
assuming it was a "motor rated" switch - which MOST are. A 20 amp
switch is motor rated for 3/4 HP on 120 volts.

Ah, thanks.

The switches only control the 85 watt ceiling fan.

But also on that circuit, there's two floor lamps (LED bulbs now) and
the entertainment corner: two year old big honkin' 7.1 home theater
receiver with 5 speakers plus a 12" powered subwoofer, 10 year old
plasma TV, cable box.

So I'm thinking the switch failure nothing to do with it being rated 15A....

Absolutely
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On 2019-09-16 10:26 a.m., Wade Gattett wrote:
On 9/16/19 10:45 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 08:13:03 -0400, Wade Gattett
wrote:

On 9/14/19 11:13 AM, Wade Gattett wrote:
Two 3-way switches controlling a big Hunter Original ceiling fan on
a 20
amp circuit worked fine for 33 years of occasional use. A week or two
back, they quit working properly...both had to be "on" for the fan
to run.

I decided to replace both switches and picked up two 20A Leviton
3-ways.
When I pulled the old switches, they were slightly different models-
but
both were marked "Slater 15 amp".

One of them had what looked like the beginnings of some mild surface
corrosion on its metal support bracket- though I guess it could have
just been a scuzzy-looking mill finish. The other one was bright and
looked fine. Unfortunately, I didn't test them and just tossed them
out.

With the new switches installed, the fan is working right.

At the local Home Depot, the 20A switches were twice the cost of the
15A
ones. I'm thinking if the price difference was the same 33 years ago,
maybe that's why the electrical sub used them.

We ended up having a lot of problems with the general contractor for
the
room addition where the fan was installed. What do they say about
apples
not falling far from the tree?

So- is it OK to use a 15A switch on a 20A circuit? Could that have had
anything to do with the switch failure? Or are Slater switches not
so hot?

OP here- Umm, interesting bunch of posts.

I didn't see any answers, though, to my original questions about using a
15A switch on a 20A circuit and might that usage have contributed to the
switch's failure...



Â* Simple answer. Switch is sized for the LOAD. If the fan draws less
than the rating of the switch it is not a problem. For example, a
standard Leviton 15 amp toggle switch is motor rated for 1/2 HP on 120
volts AC and 2HP on 240 volts AC, and 15 amps (1800 watts) of
incandescent lighting load.

On a 15 amp circuit one 1800 watt load would max out the circuit - or
3 600 watt loads. A 20 amp circuit would allow 4 600 watt lighting
loads. I chose 600 watts rather arbitrarily as most lighting dimmer
switches are rated at 600watts incandescent.
Â* SO - unless the fan is more than 1/2 HP a 15 amp switchis just fine -
assuming it was a "motor rated" switch - which MOST are. A 20 amp
switch is motor rated for 3/4 HP on 120 volts.

Ah, thanks.

The switches only control the 85 watt ceiling fan.

But also on that circuit, there's two floor lamps (LED bulbs now) and
the entertainment corner:Â* two year old big honkin' 7.1 home theater
receiver with 5 speakers plus a 12" powered subwoofer, 10 year old
plasma TV, cable box.

So I'm thinking the switch failure nothing to do with it being rated
15A....

what happened to your nym i used to lol every time i saw it
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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 16 Sep 2019 10:58:00 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Why does taking a shower fill the attic with humidity? Bathroom fan
venting into the attic instead of outside? Something is very wrong
there.




Seems that was the way it was done at one time. I bought a house that
was built about 1965. The vent in the bath was just to the attic. Also


In my case, the tube from the bathroom fan ends right below the ridge
vent.

FTR I didn't say the attic was filled with humidity. I said it was
recommended for that reason. I don't take hot showers and I don't go to
the attic afterwards to see if it's humid there. I put the switch in so
the next owner of the house would have it.

very little insulation which was that shreaded paper type. What was it
called, something like blown celulease. There were about a dozen houses
in the neighborhood on a similar floor plan.


Pink fiberglass.

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Default 15 vs. 20 Amp 3-Way Wall Switches

On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 19:40:02 -0400, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 16 Sep 2019 10:58:00 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Why does taking a shower fill the attic with humidity? Bathroom fan
venting into the attic instead of outside? Something is very wrong
there.




Seems that was the way it was done at one time. I bought a house that
was built about 1965. The vent in the bath was just to the attic. Also


In my case, the tube from the bathroom fan ends right below the ridge
vent.

FTR I didn't say the attic was filled with humidity. I said it was
recommended for that reason. I don't take hot showers and I don't go to
the attic afterwards to see if it's humid there. I put the switch in so
the next owner of the house would have it.

very little insulation which was that shreaded paper type. What was it
called, something like blown celulease. There were about a dozen houses
in the neighborhood on a similar floor plan.


Pink fiberglass.

Blown cellulose was the common insulation back in the sixties.
Shredded newspaper with borax? (Borate) flame retardent.
It is still actually pretty widely used in some places.
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