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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - saving over $400

On Sat, 4 May 2019 20:17:55 +1000, Xeno wrote:

Seen it in new cars under factory warranty - when warranty was 12/12
and/or 12/20.


Hi Xeno,

I'm allergic to bull****, Xeno.

Kids talk about Santa Claus all the time, Xeno, as if he exists
o Where their beliefs are (just as yours are), based on their "experience".

Is the end result just what I predicted from you Xeno, after all?

Can you, or can you not cite a _single_ reliable reference that backs up
your claims, Xeno?

I can claim I climbed mount everest, Xeno.
o In fact, I can claim I climbed mount everest just last week, Xeno,
o Without oxygen
o And in sneakers.

Those claims are just as reliable as your claims, Xeno.
o Which is to say that they're not.

Just like kids own imaginary belief systems on how the Easter Bunny works
o You appear to own an imaginary belief system backed up by 0 facts

The fact is that people who own completely imaginary belief systems
always fail the simplest of the simplest of simple adult tests.

Name just _one_ reliable cite that backs up your beliefs, Xeno.
o Name just one
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On Saturday, May 4, 2019 at 12:16:35 PM UTC-4, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
On Sat, 4 May 2019 20:17:55 +1000, Xeno wrote:

Seen it in new cars under factory warranty - when warranty was 12/12
and/or 12/20.


Hi Xeno,

I'm allergic to bull****, Xeno.

Kids talk about Santa Claus all the time, Xeno, as if he exists
o Where their beliefs are (just as yours are), based on their "experience".

Is the end result just what I predicted from you Xeno, after all?

Can you, or can you not cite a _single_ reliable reference that backs up
your claims, Xeno?

I can claim I climbed mount everest, Xeno.
o In fact, I can claim I climbed mount everest just last week, Xeno,
o Without oxygen
o And in sneakers.

Those claims are just as reliable as your claims, Xeno.
o Which is to say that they're not.


Wow, what BS and false comparison. Xeno spent a lot of time giving an
excellent explanation of the physics involved, it's not some fairy tale.







Just like kids own imaginary belief systems on how the Easter Bunny works
o You appear to own an imaginary belief system backed up by 0 facts

The fact is that people who own completely imaginary belief systems
always fail the simplest of the simplest of simple adult tests.

Name just _one_ reliable cite that backs up your beliefs, Xeno.
o Name just one



That's a foolish challenge to issue. Do you really think there isn't even
ONE reliable source, eg tire manufacturers or auto authorities, that say
that tires should be dynamically balanced? Really?
I'll give you one. Michelin

https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/help/faq.html


Should my tires be balanced?

Proper balancing is critical for optimal vehicle performance, especially at today's higher highway speeds. When tire and wheel assemblies are unbalanced, a vibration can result from wheel and assembly shimmy (shaking from side to side) or wheel assembly tramp (tire and wheel hopping up and down). Therefore, it is important that these assemblies are in both static and dynamic balance

And just for you:

Can I mount my own tire on the wheel?

Never try to mount your own tires. Tire mounting is a job for the people who have the proper equipment and experience. If you try to do it yourself, you run the risk of serious injury to yourself as well as possible damage to the tire and rim.


Try Google, they are there by the dozens.


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On Sat, 4 May 2019 09:48:33 -0700 (PDT), trader_4 wrote:

Wow, what BS and false comparison. Xeno spent a lot of time giving an
excellent explanation of the physics involved, it's not some fairy tale.


Hi Trader,

Let's act like adults please.
o Adults should be capable of separating bull****, from the facts

Where the main thing we need to know is the answer to the question
o What percentage of US passenger tires _need_ dynamic balance
o Particularly after a home DIY of matchmount/static balancing, plus
o A doublecheck of that static balancing with a dynamic drive

Let's act like adults, Trader...

Nobody ever said that a dynamic imbalance can't occur.
o Even after a good match mount & static balance
o And, particularly even after a doublecheck at speed

I repeat: Nobody ever said that dynamic balance can't occur
o Just like nobody said that shopping cart imbalances can't occur

But for Xeno to make those wide emphatic sweeping claims he made
o Is sort of like saying that all shopping carts need dynamic balancing

Sure, _some_ shopping cards need dynamic balancing
o But not all of them, Trader.

Perhaps not even most of them, Trader.
o Some of them do, but the question is how many need dynamic balancing
o After they've been match mounted, statically balanced, & checked at speed

Adults can handle concepts that have a bit of complexity to them.

If you don't comprehend this concept, then re-read my initial responses to
Xeno where your cite (see below) implies that you appear to own the
comprehension of a child, Trader.

Xeno's claim was a sweeping claim, based on pure bull****, Trader.
o All you're seeing from me is my allergic response to bull****

It's like me claiming that all shopping carts need dynamic balancing
o Simply because my experience is that they're wobbly once in a while

Name just _one_ reliable cite that backs up your beliefs, Xeno.
o Name just one

That's a foolish challenge to issue. Do you really think there isn't even
ONE reliable source, eg tire manufacturers or auto authorities, that say
that tires should be dynamically balanced? Really?


Trader,

Do you own the comprehensive brain of an adult, or of a small child?

Nobody ever said that tires can't be dynamically unbalanced for Christ's
sake, even after match mounting at home, and even after subsequent static
balance at home, and even after subsequent dynamic tests at speed.

Just like nobody said that shopping carts can by dynamically unbalanced.
o The question is WHAT PERCENTAGE of mounts are dynamically unbalanced.
o After match mounting, static balancing, & dynamic tests at speed.

I'm allergic to unsubstantiated bull****, Clare.
o If Xeno's belief system is based on facts, he can pass this simple test:

Name Just One.

I'll give you one. Michelin
https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/help/faq.html
Should my tires be balanced?
Proper balancing is critical for optimal vehicle performance,
especially at today's higher highway speeds.


Do you own the comprehensive mind of an _adult_ Trader?
o Do you even comprehend the stated problem set, Trader?

Nobody even once said that 'proper balancing' isn't what we're after.

When tire and wheel assemblies are unbalanced, a vibration can result
from wheel and assembly shimmy (shaking from side to side)
or wheel assembly tramp (tire and wheel hopping up and down).
Therefore, it is important that these assemblies are in both
static and dynamic balance


Um... Trader. Everything you post is from the brain of a child.
o Nobody ever said that balancing wasn't important.


And just for you:
Can I mount my own tire on the wheel?
Never try to mount your own tires.
Tire mounting is a job for the people who have the proper equipment
and experience. If you try to do it yourself, you run the risk of
serious injury to yourself as well as possible damage to the tire
and rim.


Um, Trader, do you even realize what you're proving?
HINT: You apparently own the mind of a child, Trader.

If Michelin says don't do what the pros do because you
"run the risk" of (whatever), then, well, then YOU won't do it.
o That's because you appear to own the mind of a child, Trader.

But adults can see that quote for what it actually is.
o Where adults can handle basic facts better than can small children.

Try Google, they are there by the dozens.


Hi Trader,

Sigh. (This never ends)

That statement, just like _every_ statement from you, is terrifying in that
it clearly proves not only that you appear to own the cognitive skills of a
small child, but that you actually _believe_ that because Michelin said you
shouldn't do it, that you shouldn't do it.

Guess what.
o By the same logic, you shouldn't do many DIYs that pros do all the time.

In summary, every post from you, sadly, appears to indicate only that you
don't comprehend even the slightest bit of what the problem set entails.

Since the problem set is patently simple,
o The fact you don't comprehend it, is a bit terrifying.

Please try to comprehend the problem set:
o The question is what percentage of wheels _need_ dynamic balance
o After a good match mount, static balance, & pass on perceptible vibration

I don't think _anyone_ knows the answer to _that_ adult question, Trader.
o I admit, I don't know the answer either.

But it's pure bull****, IMHO, if someone claims it's _all_ wheels.
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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years -saving over $400

On 5/4/2019 12:16 PM, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
On Sat, 4 May 2019 20:17:55 +1000, Xeno wrote:

Seen it in new cars under factory warranty - when warranty was 12/12
and/or 12/20.


Hi Xeno,

I'm allergic to bull****, Xeno.


Xeno posted some very sensible information and he evidently has a lot of
experience. Your credibility keeps going down.
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On Saturday, May 4, 2019 at 2:27:49 PM UTC-4, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 5/4/2019 12:16 PM, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
On Sat, 4 May 2019 20:17:55 +1000, Xeno wrote:

Seen it in new cars under factory warranty - when warranty was 12/12
and/or 12/20.


Hi Xeno,

I'm allergic to bull****, Xeno.


Xeno posted some very sensible information and he evidently has a lot of
experience. Your credibility keeps going down.


And Arlen made this foolish challenge:



"Name just _one_ reliable cite that backs up your beliefs, Xeno.
o Name just one "


Xeno wasn't around and I couldn't let that easy one go, so I gave
him one good example, Michelin:


https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/help/faq.html


Should my tires be balanced?

Proper balancing is critical for optimal vehicle performance, especially at today's higher highway speeds. When tire and wheel assemblies are unbalanced, a vibration can result from wheel and assembly shimmy (shaking from side to side) or wheel assembly tramp (tire and wheel hopping up and down). Therefore, it is important that these assemblies are in both static and dynamic balance


Can I mount my own tire on the wheel?

Never try to mount your own tires. Tire mounting is a job for the people who have the proper equipment and experience. If you try to do it yourself, you run the risk of serious injury to yourself as well as possible damage to the tire and rim. "


Endless other similar sources saying the same thing about balancing.


Of course no surprise, Arlen didn't much like that. A whole page of BS,
Trader this, child that.....







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"Xeno" wrote in message
...
On 4/5/19 7:18 pm, Rod Speed wrote:


"Xeno" wrote in message
...
On 4/5/19 1:05 am, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
On Fri, 3 May 2019 20:02:29 +1000, Xeno wrote:

On a modern car it's a waste of time.

Hi Xeno,

Most people who posted to this thread, IMHO, have proven that they own
completely imaginary belief systems, where the logical proof is that
their
ludicrous excuses instantly failed the simplest of the simple tests of
any
belief system, which is the three words when someone declares an opion
o Name just one FACT from which that belief system is based upon.

Given these vehicles I'm working on are all about two decades old (give
or
take), can you name just one FACT that supports your belief system
stated
above?

I'm not saying your belief system is correct, nor am I saying it's not
correct, since you stated your belief system clearly, but you didn't
state
even a single fact that backs up that strongly held belief system.

What FACT is your strongly held belief system actually based upon?

A number of *facts* prime among them being my training and involvement
in the automotive industry as a mechanic since the 60s. First and
foremost, it's clear from what you have written that you do not
understand the concept of *dynamic unbalance* and the ramifications it
has for anyone doing a *static* balance. You make too many assumptions
based on your *limited* experience and minimal training.

First, assume a tyre with a heavy spot central to the centreline of the
tread. this tyre is only in static unbalance. This will cause only wheel
tramp, ie. the bouncing of the wheel and tyre assembly up and down and
should not have any effect on the steering (shimmy). This type of
imbalance can be statically balanced but it requires a little common
sense when applying balance weights. If you apply balance weights
incorrectly you can remove static unbalance but create dynamic
unbalance.


Not something likely to be seen with a new tire and no ****ed wheel.


Seen on new tyres including those fitted to new vehicles.

Second, assume the same tyre but with the heavy spot over to one side of
the tread and away from the centreline. This tyre is not only in static
unbalance but it is also in *dynamic unbalance*. It will cause wheel
tramp but also steering shimmy.


Again, not something likely to be seen with a new tire and no ****ed
wheel.


Seen on new tyres including those fitted to new vehicles.


Bull****.

The issue here is that a static balancer will not tell you which side of
the tread area the heavy spot is, only that it is on that side of the
wheel/tyre assembly. That means that when you add balance weights to the
opposite side of the rim, you need to add weights to both sides. You
look at the counterweight needed, then halve it and add half to each
side of the rim opposite the heavy spot. Might add, when carrying out a
static balance you need to always use balance weights on both sides of
the rim at the light spot, even in cases that are clearly only
statically unbalanced, else you will potentially end up with a
dynamically unbalanced wheel. This type of dynamic unbalance can only be
reduced, on average, by 50% even if the static balance is corrected
100%. The point here is that your steering joints will be affected by
the unbalance


Third, now assume a wheel that has two heavy spots, one each at opposite
points on the wheel diameter.


Again, not something likely to be seen with a new tire and no ****ed
wheel.


Seen on new tyres including those fitted to new vehicles.


Bull****.

To a static balancer, this wheel assy. will be balanced producing no
wheel tramp. However, assume one heavy spot is located at the *outside*
of the tread centreline and the other on the opposite side located on
the *inside* of the tread centreline. The wheel is, if both heavy spots
are of the same mass, will evince no tramp but will show up as steering
shimmy, the severity of which will depend on the amount of imbalance and
the distance it is located from the tread centreline. It is caused by
the two masses attempting to alternately get to the centreline. Note too
that the type of suspension system and the steering geometry can play a
significant role in the sensitivity to unbalanced wheels.


So, of the 3 imbalance situations, a static balancer can fully address
the first and only partially address the second depending on the mass
location.


But not something likely to be seen with a new tire and no ****ed wheel.


Seen on new tyres including those fitted to new vehicles.


Bull****.

In the case of the third imbalance situation, the static balancer is
totally useless. So, to ensure correct balancing over all situations, a
dynamic balancer is the only choice to be made.


As to the situation where, in the past, static balancers covered most
bases, what has changed today? It's simple really, older cars had narrow
tyres fitted to large diameter rims so less prone to dynamic unbalance
effects. Today's cars have much wider tyres so accentuating the
possibility of dynamic imbalance.


In theory. In reality even the cheapest new tires are unlikely to be a
problem.


Seen on new tyres including those fitted to new vehicles.


Bull****.

Road speed with respect to wheel assy. diameter plays a role in this.
That brings me to truck wheel balancing.


He is talking about car tires, not trucks.


Balance a car wheel or a truck wheel, it's all pretty much the same deal.
The exact same principles are involved.


But the next stuff isnt.

Given the large diameter and relatively narrow section width of truck
wheels, static balancing is Ok for most cases. In these cases, on
vehicle balancing, usually of front wheels only, is carried out using
equipment like this;
https://www.bigwheels.net.au/on-vehicle-wheel-balancer


I have done this task many times since the late 60s when I first entered
the trade and I can attest to the efficiacy of this type of balancing
for truck wheels. That, however, was in the past and trucks now travel
at relatively high speeds so dynamic unbalance with consequent steering
shimmy has become an issue with truck wheel balancing. In this case you
*need* an off vehicle dynamic balancer like this;
https://www.bigwheels.net.au/off-vehicle-wheel-balancer


I must add too, just because you feel no vibration or shimmy from the
wheels doesn't mean no imbalance exists. What it means is that the
effect is not being transmitted through to you, the driver. The steering
and suspension may well be feeling the effects and this could cause
aggravated wear in suspension and steering joints. Power steering, for
instance, has an effect on nullifying road feedback. After all,
manufacturers adopted power steering on FWD vehicles in order to reduce
or nullify the effects of unwanted feedback, in this case torque steer.


They actually did it to make the parking forces less of a problem.


They actually did it to make torque steer less of a problem with the
universality of PS on all FWD cars.


Bull****.

What would you do if you had a vehicle that had a vibration in the front
through the suspension akin to wheel tramp?


Not something likely to be seen with a new tire and no ****ed wheel.


Seen it in new cars under factory warranty


Seen on sweet **** all new cars in fact. Just another manufacturing ****up.

- when warranty was 12/12 and/or 12/20. The dealership in which I was
working at the time had a specific diagnosis method for it which isolated
the issue immediately.

Let's assume you static balanced the wheels with no luck. You checked
the tyre for runout, the rim for runout and the tyre to rim
concentricity - all perfect. A spin up on the dynamic balancer shows the
wheels are perfectly balanced both statically and dynamically yet that
vibration in harmony with road speed persists. Where do you go now?
Balance is perfect, runout is perfect, concentricity is perfect, what
is left?


Not something likely to be seen with a new tire and no ****ed wheel.

Seen it in new cars under factory warranty - when warranty was 12/12
and/or 12/20.


Seen on sweet **** all new cars in fact. Just another manufacturing ****up.

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Default Lonely Psychopathic Senile Ozzie Troll Alert!

On Sun, 5 May 2019 05:36:28 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH more of the pathological idiot's troll****

....and nothing's left!

--
"Anonymous" to trolling senile Rodent Speed:
"You can **** off as you know less than pig **** you sad
little ignorant ****."
MID:
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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years -saving over $400

On 5/5/19 3:46 am, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
On Sat, 4 May 2019 09:48:33 -0700 (PDT), trader_4 wrote:

Wow, what BS and false comparison. Xeno spent a lot of time giving an
excellent explanation of the physics involved, it's not some fairy tale.


Hi Trader,

Let's act like adults please.
o Adults should be capable of separating bull****, from the facts

Where the main thing we need to know is the answer to the question
o What percentage of US passenger tires _need_ dynamic balance
o Particularly after a home DIY of matchmount/static balancing, plus
o A doublecheck of that static balancing with a dynamic drive

Let's act like adults, Trader...


Would be helpful if you followed you own recommendation.

Nobody ever said that a dynamic imbalance can't occur.
o Even after a good match mount & static balance
o And, particularly even after a doublecheck at speed

I repeat: Nobody ever said that dynamic balance can't occur
o Just like nobody said that shopping cart imbalances can't occur

But for Xeno to make those wide emphatic sweeping claims he made
o Is sort of like saying that all shopping carts need dynamic balancing

Sure, _some_ shopping cards need dynamic balancing
o But not all of them, Trader.


Shopping cart wheel wobble has *nothing* to do with wheel balance and
everything to do with geometry, in particular caster trail. If you
understood car steering geometry you would realise this.

Perhaps not even most of them, Trader.
o Some of them do, but the question is how many need dynamic balancing
o After they've been match mounted, statically balanced, & checked at speed

Adults can handle concepts that have a bit of complexity to them.


Guess that's too much for you by the look of it.

If you don't comprehend this concept, then re-read my initial responses to
Xeno where your cite (see below) implies that you appear to own the
comprehension of a child, Trader.

Xeno's claim was a sweeping claim, based on pure bull****, Trader.
o All you're seeing from me is my allergic response to bull****


My claim was based on a working lifetime in the motor industry, a claim
you cannot make since the sum total of your experience is 30 tyres and
that only with a static balancer.

It's like me claiming that all shopping carts need dynamic balancing
o Simply because my experience is that they're wobbly once in a while


See my *sweeping statement* above!

Name just _one_ reliable cite that backs up your beliefs, Xeno.
o Name just one

That's a foolish challenge to issue. Do you really think there isn't even
ONE reliable source, eg tire manufacturers or auto authorities, that say
that tires should be dynamically balanced? Really?


Trader,

Do you own the comprehensive brain of an adult, or of a small child?


Why do you ask that question when it is you who is being argumentative here?

Nobody ever said that tires can't be dynamically unbalanced for Christ's
sake, even after match mounting at home, and even after subsequent static
balance at home, and even after subsequent dynamic tests at speed.


So why waste time static balancing when you will do it right first time
with a dynamic balance? No trial and error required.

Just like nobody said that shopping carts can by dynamically unbalanced.
o The question is WHAT PERCENTAGE of mounts are dynamically unbalanced.
o After match mounting, static balancing, & dynamic tests at speed.


Most of them if the weights required to correct the imbalance is any guide.

I'm allergic to unsubstantiated bull****, Clare.
o If Xeno's belief system is based on facts, he can pass this simple test:

Name Just One.

I'll give you one. Michelin
https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/help/faq.html
Should my tires be balanced?
Proper balancing is critical for optimal vehicle performance,
especially at today's higher highway speeds.


Do you own the comprehensive mind of an _adult_ Trader?


He does, you do not.

o Do you even comprehend the stated problem set, Trader?


He does, you do not.

Nobody even once said that 'proper balancing' isn't what we're after.


Dynamic balancing *is* proper balancing. My point was that static
balancing is a waste of time because it cannot guarantee proper
balancing 100% of the time. It cannot guarantee it 50% of the time. I
have balanced more tyres on a dynamic balancer than I care to recall and
pretty much all required *dynamic balancing* due to unbalanced masses
being offset from the tread centreline. Had you *any* experience in the
industry with a dynamic wheel balancer you would know this to be true.

When tire and wheel assemblies are unbalanced, a vibration can result
from wheel and assembly shimmy (shaking from side to side)
or wheel assembly tramp (tire and wheel hopping up and down).
Therefore, it is important that these assemblies are in both
static and dynamic balance


Um... Trader. Everything you post is from the brain of a child.
o Nobody ever said that balancing wasn't important.


Balancing is important, dynamic balancing is the only way to do it properly.


And just for you:
Can I mount my own tire on the wheel?
Never try to mount your own tires.
Tire mounting is a job for the people who have the proper equipment
and experience. If you try to do it yourself, you run the risk of
serious injury to yourself as well as possible damage to the tire
and rim.


Um, Trader, do you even realize what you're proving?
HINT: You apparently own the mind of a child, Trader.


He is making a statement that I would make having seen *idiots* do more
damage to their tyres/wheels through a lack of understanding of the
principles involved and a lack of the requisite training.

If Michelin says don't do what the pros do because you
"run the risk" of (whatever), then, well, then YOU won't do it.
o That's because you appear to own the mind of a child, Trader.


The pros have been trained and have experience. That's what makes them
pros and why what they do *looks easy*.

But adults can see that quote for what it actually is.
o Where adults can handle basic facts better than can small children.

Try Google, they are there by the dozens.


Hi Trader,

Sigh. (This never ends)

That statement, just like _every_ statement from you, is terrifying in that
it clearly proves not only that you appear to own the cognitive skills of a
small child, but that you actually _believe_ that because Michelin said you
shouldn't do it, that you shouldn't do it.

Guess what.
o By the same logic, you shouldn't do many DIYs that pros do all the time.


The differences between a DIYer and a pro are training and experience.

In summary, every post from you, sadly, appears to indicate only that you
don't comprehend even the slightest bit of what the problem set entails.

Since the problem set is patently simple,
o The fact you don't comprehend it, is a bit terrifying.

Please try to comprehend the problem set:
o The question is what percentage of wheels _need_ dynamic balance
o After a good match mount, static balance, & pass on perceptible vibration


It's the *imperceptible vibration* that causes issues, imperceptible
because modern cars are designed to isolate vehicle occupants from such
things. Because they are *imperceptible* to humans does not mean they do
not exist.

I don't think _anyone_ knows the answer to _that_ adult question, Trader.
o I admit, I don't know the answer either.

But it's pure bull****, IMHO, if someone claims it's _all_ wheels.



--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
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On 5/5/19 2:16 am, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
On Sat, 4 May 2019 20:17:55 +1000, Xeno wrote:

Seen it in new cars under factory warranty - when warranty was 12/12
and/or 12/20.


Hi Xeno,

I'm allergic to bull****, Xeno.


Then you should stop spouting it. Proximity and all that!

Kids talk about Santa Claus all the time, Xeno, as if he exists
o Where their beliefs are (just as yours are), based on their "experience".

Is the end result just what I predicted from you Xeno, after all?

Can you, or can you not cite a _single_ reliable reference that backs up
your claims, Xeno?

I can claim I climbed mount everest, Xeno.
o In fact, I can claim I climbed mount everest just last week, Xeno,
o Without oxygen
o And in sneakers.

Those claims are just as reliable as your claims, Xeno.
o Which is to say that they're not.

Just like kids own imaginary belief systems on how the Easter Bunny works
o You appear to own an imaginary belief system backed up by 0 facts

The fact is that people who own completely imaginary belief systems
always fail the simplest of the simplest of simple adult tests.

Name just _one_ reliable cite that backs up your beliefs, Xeno.
o Name just one



--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - saving over $400

On Sun, 5 May 2019 13:04:14 +1000, Xeno wrote:

On 5/5/19 3:46 am, Arlen G. Holder wrote:



Nobody even once said that 'proper balancing' isn't what we're after.


Dynamic balancing *is* proper balancing. My point was that static
balancing is a waste of time because it cannot guarantee proper
balancing 100% of the time. It cannot guarantee it 50% of the time. I
have balanced more tyres on a dynamic balancer than I care to recall and
pretty much all required *dynamic balancing* due to unbalanced masses
being offset from the tread centreline. Had you *any* experience in the
industry with a dynamic wheel balancer you would know this to be true.


Well, then. Arlen can just buy a dynamic tire balancer. In the meantime he can eat crow.


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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - Hey Clare

Xeno posted for all of us...



It's the *imperceptible vibration* that causes issues, imperceptible
because modern cars are designed to isolate vehicle occupants from such
things. Because they are *imperceptible* to humans does not mean they do
not exist.


Remember the on the car balancers with the strobe lights?

--
Tekkie
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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - Hey Clare

On Mon, 6 May 2019 15:34:31 -0400, Tekkie® wrote:

Xeno posted for all of us...



It's the *imperceptible vibration* that causes issues, imperceptible
because modern cars are designed to isolate vehicle occupants from such
things. Because they are *imperceptible* to humans does not mean they do
not exist.


Remember the on the car balancers with the strobe lights?

Yes, I used a Hunter for years
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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years -Hey Clare

On 7/5/19 5:34 am, Tekkie® wrote:
Xeno posted for all of us...



It's the *imperceptible vibration* that causes issues, imperceptible
because modern cars are designed to isolate vehicle occupants from such
things. Because they are *imperceptible* to humans does not mean they do
not exist.


Remember the on the car balancers with the strobe lights?

Only ever used them on large truck wheels a very long time ago. I'm
presuming you mean the type where you have an electric motor with a drum
whereby you spin the wheel up to speed.

--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
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On Tue, 7 May 2019 08:53:30 +1000, Xeno
wrote:

On 7/5/19 5:34 am, Tekkie® wrote:
Xeno posted for all of us...



It's the *imperceptible vibration* that causes issues, imperceptible
because modern cars are designed to isolate vehicle occupants from such
things. Because they are *imperceptible* to humans does not mean they do
not exist.


Remember the on the car balancers with the strobe lights?

Only ever used them on large truck wheels a very long time ago. I'm
presuming you mean the type where you have an electric motor with a drum
whereby you spin the wheel up to speed.

The Hunter Tune-in (or it's Alemite clone) was THE balancer for many
years - had them at the first 5 places I worked and I balanced
hundreds of wheels with them. They were OK when they were properly
calibrated but nasty (and expensive) to get calibrated. Had to be 100%
sure the adapter was properly mounted or you'd end up chasingthe
balance across the lot (and sending it out for recalibration)
The "Hoffman" off-car balancer pretty much replaced them - making
them virtually obsolete virtually over-night.(except for the VERY odd
vehicle with drum/axle balance issues)
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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years -saving over $400

On 4/29/2019 1:48 AM, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
UPDATE:

Today I mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years, where
each time I do this easy job, I learn new tricks to make it even easier.


snip

Several issues with DIY static balancing.

First, it's static balancing when you really want dynamic balancing for
proper balance at high speeds.

Second, for tread warranty you need proof of tire rotation which you'll
get when you go in for any rebalancing (if necessary)

Third, Costco, where most people buy their tires, often has 1¢/tire
mounting and balancing offers. I ordered tires during their last sale. I
have an appointment next week. With Costco you can make an appointment,
drop off your car, and by the time you're done shopping the car is ready.

OTOH, I am one of the few people in my city that still does their own
oil changes. As I explained to the spousal unit, who was complaining
that I could spend that time doing something more productive, I can
change the oil in an hour, for $20-25 including an OEM filter and drain
plug gasket. The used oil gets picked up by our garbage service
provider. To take the car into the dealer, driving both ways, and
waiting, would be two hours and cost $35-50 (depending on regular or
synthetic oil and whatever service specials they've mailed out). I don't
trust any of the quick-lube places, the one closest to me was caught in
a sting operation by the Bureau of Automotive Repair, plus they are
about the same price as a dealer and they use low-quality jobber filters.

The newer Toyotas with the cartridge filter are a bit of a pain because
the filter housing is extremely tight. You really need one of the
special cartridge filter wrenches to avoid screwing things up,
https://www.motivxtools.com/collections/oil-filter-wrenches/products/toyota-2-5l-5-7l-oil-filter-wrench?variant=15321139142
https://www.motivxtools.com/collections/oil-filter-wrenches/products/toyota-1-8l-oil-filter-wrench?variant=15323279238


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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - saving over $400

On Tue, 7 May 2019 13:40:24 -0700, sms wrote:

On 4/29/2019 1:48 AM, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
UPDATE:

Today I mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years, where
each time I do this easy job, I learn new tricks to make it even easier.


snip

Several issues with DIY static balancing.

First, it's static balancing when you really want dynamic balancing for
proper balance at high speeds.

Second, for tread warranty you need proof of tire rotation which you'll
get when you go in for any rebalancing (if necessary)

Third, Costco, where most people buy their tires, often has 1¢/tire
mounting and balancing offers.


Whoa. I never bought a tire at Costco, and I know nobody who has bought a tire at Costco.
I'm sure Costco sells a lot of tires, but most people do NOT buy their tires from Costco.
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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years -saving over $400

On Tuesday, May 7, 2019 at 4:40:32 PM UTC-4, sms wrote:
On 4/29/2019 1:48 AM, Arlen G. Holder wrote:
UPDATE:

Today I mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years, where
each time I do this easy job, I learn new tricks to make it even easier..


snip

Several issues with DIY static balancing.

First, it's static balancing when you really want dynamic balancing for
proper balance at high speeds.

Second, for tread warranty you need proof of tire rotation which you'll
get when you go in for any rebalancing (if necessary)


And many places, like Costco, tire rotation is free if you buy the tires
there and have them balanced.




Third, Costco, where most people buy their tires, often has 1¢/tire
mounting and balancing offers.


And even if you buy your tires online, Costco will mount them for $15
a tire. But thankfully most people don't buy their tires at Costco
or the line would be forever. Most people don't even have a Costco
membership and when needing tires, there can be better deals elsewhere.


I ordered tires during their last sale. I
have an appointment next week. With Costco you can make an appointment,
drop off your car, and by the time you're done shopping the car is ready.


But you don't get it. That's no good. There was discussion that it takes
too long, that spending the time shopping and having a piece of pizza for
$1.50, is unacceptable and it's better to drop your wheels off, have them
mounted, and then pick them up. (that's what you're dealing with here)



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Default Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - Hey Clare

Xeno posted for all of us...



On 7/5/19 5:34 am, Tekkie® wrote:
Xeno posted for all of us...



It's the *imperceptible vibration* that causes issues, imperceptible
because modern cars are designed to isolate vehicle occupants from such
things. Because they are *imperceptible* to humans does not mean they do
not exist.


Remember the on the car balancers with the strobe lights?

Only ever used them on large truck wheels a very long time ago. I'm
presuming you mean the type where you have an electric motor with a drum
whereby you spin the wheel up to speed.


Yup

--
Tekkie
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