On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 04:41:46 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
k.net...
In article ,
says...

So, all this is for ICE cars. If you have one of those electric cars
and you are out of juice, at the side of the road, what do they do?
You can't just jump start it, you have to put enough charge it it
to get it somewhere to plug in. So, what do they do? Like if you
have such a car and call AAA what do they do? I expect it's tow you
to someplace to plug in.



You pull out the portable wind generator and solar cell and wait for the
sun to come out or the wind to blow. Just one of the green solutions of
AOC.


Those electric cars may be ok for those that never get out of the city
and only go 10 or 20 miles at a time. Now if they ever get them where
you can recharge them at many places like all the gas service stations
and pumps and in the time it takes to gas up an ICE car they may have
something for me.

Wouldn't work for me, I normally do the long distance trips in the
middle of the night because the event I am going to often starts
at 7am

ROTFLOL!!!!!!!!! Which "event" would that be, you abnormal trolling senile
psychopath? Your daily trolling on these groups? You OBVIOUSLY get up
between 1 and 4 am, EVERY DAY, just to be able to continue with your
trolling without too long a break, sick asshole!

--
FredXX to Rot Speed:
"You are still an idiot and an embarrassment to your country. No wonder
we shipped the likes of you out of the British Isles. Perhaps stupidity
and criminality is inherited after all?"
Message-ID:

On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 04:28:35 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

So, all this is for ICE cars. If you have one of those electric cars
and you are out of juice, at the side of the road, what do they do?

You get it towed to where it can be charged,

Senile asshole Rot has ALL the answers, ALWAYS! I mean, ALWAYS! LMAO

--
dennis@home to retarded senile Rot:
"sod off rod you don't have a clue about anything."
Message-ID:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 06:00:53 +0000 (UTC), Hugh Byrne
wrote:

Today the car wouldn't start at a friend's house who had no jumper cables.
He had some electrical wire though.
We were just starting to jury rig something when his wife showed up with
cables in her trunk.

If we did jury rig electrical wires, we were unsure of what size would
work.

How can we determine what size electrical wire would work to jump a typical
sedan in an emergency?

Ex cable guy here. We'd jump the service trucks with 10 gauge solid
insulated copper used to bond cable to ground. It would get warm but
was enough to start a run down battery.

"Hugh Byrne" wrote in message
...
Ed Pawlowski wrote on Wed, 10 Apr 2019 10:15:09 -0400

I don't recall the last time I needed to use them, but I always carry a
set. I bet you do now too. You can get them for as little at $10.

Thank you everyone.
I will get 6 gauge or 4 gauge or even smaller (lower numbers being better
especially for longer distances).

I found a lot to choose from at home depot online
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Automoti...s/N-5yc1vZc8mb
Not so many at Lowes online and much higher prices
https://www.lowes.com/search?searchT...priceLowToHigh

What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk &
usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?

Last time I needed to use one on a mate's wife's car, the car
was in a parking lot at the hospital nose in where it wasnt
possible to park beside it. I fudged it by driving mine over
the grass at the side of the parking lot and got away with
that because it was after the chemotherapy place had
closed and there was no one around. So the longer
the better if you want to handle all situations easily.
16 feet doesnt really take up much more space than
10 feet given it lies pretty flat.

And for the mindless nit pickers, it wasnt feasible to push
the car out of the parking place, there was just me and her
ancient mother and her ancient mother's mate there. He
was 70 miles away and rang me to get me to help her.

I'm kind of leaning toward buying three sets, one for each car.

Yeah, can be handy at times. Tho one of those Li ion power bank
starters is even more convenient at times because you dont need
another car to jump start to;. Cost more tho.

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 1:52:47 PM UTC-4, Rod Speed wrote:

But in some situations the problem is that the car that wont
start will turn the engine over fine but the voltage sags enough
so that the ignition cant supply a good enough spark to get
the engine to fire and all the car that is helping to start it
needs to do is supply enough voltage to get the engine
to actually fire and that doesnt require much current.

I'm throwing the bull**** flag on this. It has always taken more power to turn an engine over mechanically than to get a spark plug to fire.

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 1:46:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:
The connection at the clamps is probably the weak link.

+1

On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 05:51:01 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk &
usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?

Last time I needed

Nobody gives a ****, you obnoxious senile Ozzie troll!

--
Richard addressing Rot Speed:
"**** you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID:

TimR wrote
Rod Speed wrote

But in some situations the problem is that the car that wont
start will turn the engine over fine but the voltage sags enough
so that the ignition cant supply a good enough spark to get
the engine to fire and all the car that is helping to start it
needs to do is supply enough voltage to get the engine
to actually fire and that doesnt require much current.

I'm throwing the bull**** flag on this.

Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
have always were that terminal a pig ignorant ****wit.

It has always taken more power to turn an engine
over mechanically than to get a spark plug to fire.

Yes, but the difference is that with a flat or sulphated
battery, the engine can still be cranked over, albeit
very slowly, but the battery may well be producing
a much lower than normal voltage that isnt enough
to produce a decent spark to get the engine firing
in the worst weather conditions in a car with an
old well ****ed distributor and plug leads and
spark plugs.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 13:22:49 -0700 (PDT), TimR
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 1:46:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:
The connection at the clamps is probably the weak link.

+1

.... clean the wire and use vise grips

Yes, but the difference is that with a flat or sulphated
battery, the engine can still be cranked over, albeit
very slowly, but the battery may well be producing
a much lower than normal voltage that isnt enough
to produce a decent spark to get the engine firing
in the worst weather conditions in a car with an
old well ****ed distributor and plug leads and
spark plugs.



.. made me wonder how old the car would be
- if it has a distributor - early 1990's ?
or even older ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributor

John T.

On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 06:41:10 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH more of the senile asshole's troll****

--
dennis@home to retarded senile Rot:
"sod off rod you don't have a clue about anything."
Message-ID:

In article ,
says...

Thank you everyone.
I will get 6 gauge or 4 gauge or even smaller (lower numbers being better
especially for longer distances).

I found a lot to choose from at home depot online
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Automoti...s/N-5yc1vZc8mb
Not so many at Lowes online and much higher prices
https://www.lowes.com/search?searchT...priceLowToHigh

What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk & usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?
I'm kind of leaning toward buying three sets, one for each car.



I have a set in my car and another in my truck.

For 10 feet 6 may be ok, for longer, go larger wire.

When buying the cables, make sure they are all copper wire. Some wire
has been showing up that is copper covered aluminum. The wire is
probably ok, but the aluminum is only rated about 60% the capacity of
copper. Rule of thumb used to be go up (down in numbers) 3 sizes.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 15:10:50 -0400, Hugh Byrne wrote:

Ed Pawlowski wrote on Wed, 10 Apr 2019 10:15:09 -0400

I don't recall the last time I needed to use them, but I always carry a
set. I bet you do now too. You can get them for as little at $10.

Thank you everyone.
I will get 6 gauge or 4 gauge or even smaller (lower numbers being better
especially for longer distances).

I found a lot to choose from at home depot online
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Automoti...s/N-5yc1vZc8mb
Not so many at Lowes online and much higher prices
https://www.lowes.com/search?searchT...priceLowToHigh

What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk & usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?
I'm kind of leaning toward buying three sets, one for each car.

20 foot 2 gauge will never fail you. Probably overkill, but I still have 2 sets.
They are good for conducting enough current to start most cars in sub-zero conditions,
even with a dead battery. If it's got engine problems all bet are off.
Here a couple tips. You must hear a load on the alternator of the charging car when you
connect the cables. It's very noticeable. If you don't hear it you don't have a good
connection. Especially with thin cable, once you know your connection is good, wait a
minute or three before you try to start the dead car. If it barely cranks, wait longer.
Longer cables make for easier good connections, but longer also means thicker.

On 4/10/19 4:27 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Thank you everyone.
I will get 6 gauge or 4 gauge or even smaller (lower numbers being better
especially for longer distances).

I found a lot to choose from at home depot online
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Automoti...s/N-5yc1vZc8mb
Not so many at Lowes online and much higher prices
https://www.lowes.com/search?searchT...priceLowToHigh

What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk & usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?
I'm kind of leaning toward buying three sets, one for each car.



I have a set in my car and another in my truck.

For 10 feet 6 may be ok, for longer, go larger wire.

When buying the cables, make sure they are all copper wire. Some wire
has been showing up that is copper covered aluminum. The wire is
probably ok, but the aluminum is only rated about 60% the capacity of
copper. Rule of thumb used to be go up (down in numbers) 3 sizes.


And aluminum doesn't bend well.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 10:15:09 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 4/10/2019 2:00 AM, Hugh Byrne wrote:
Today the car wouldn't start at a friend's house who had no jumper cables.
He had some electrical wire though.
We were just starting to jury rig something when his wife showed up with
cables in her trunk.

If we did jury rig electrical wires, we were unsure of what size would
work.

How can we determine what size electrical wire would work to jump a typical
sedan in an emergency?

Most cables are about a 6 gauge wire, better ones are 4 gauge. You
could double up a thinner wire. You also have to figure out how to
connect for good contact too.


I don't recall the last time I needed to use them, but I always carry a
set. I bet you do now too. You can get them for as little at $10.
The boosters I had on my Ramcharger were 00 welding cable and 25
feet long - so 50 feet of cable. Were good for pulling in a driveway
behind a dead car and jumping it to life. They plugged into welding
machine sockets on the left front fender.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 17:21:49 +0200, Roberto Deboni DMIsr
wrote:

On 10/04/19 08:00, Hugh Byrne wrote:
Today the car wouldn't start at a friend's house who had no jumper cables.
He had some electrical wire though.
We were just starting to jury rig something when his wife showed up with
cables in her trunk.

If we did jury rig electrical wires, we were unsure of what size would
work.

How can we determine what size electrical wire would work to jump a typical
sedan in an emergency?

I would start with a 5 AWG if less than 10 ft length.
Climb to 4 AWG size at least for a 12 ft length.

I made up 12 ft cables with 0 AWG size that always work.

The problem with small size jumper cables is not the
overheating, but the voltage drop. If your source is low
of power, it drops alone to 8-9 volts or less under strain,
and adding a drop of 3 volts gives you only 5-6 volts at the
receiving side ... useless.

Resistance of a cable:

R = rho * length / section

where rho is the electrical resistivity. If rho(copper)
is given as

rho(copper) = 1,68 * 10^(-8) ohm*meter

the length should be in meters and the section in squaremeters.
Cable can be made with aluminium (less weight):

rho(aluminium) = 2,65 * 10^(-8) omh*meter

For copper calculated values:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_wire_gauge#Tables_of_AWG_wire_sizes

The suggested 5 AWG for 10 feet length would read as:

0,3133 m?/ft * 10 ft = 3,133 m? per cable

You need to sum up both cables resistance, that si

3,133 * 2 = 6,266 m? = 0,006266 ohms

From Ohm's law, the voltage drop would be:

V = R * I = 0,006266 * I

At I = 100 A you have only a 0,63 voltage drop.
But if I climbs to 500 A you have up to 3,15 volts.


The suggested 4 AWG for 12 feet length would read as:

0,2485 m?/ft * 12 ft = 2,982 m? per cable

almost as above with the smaller, but shorter cable.


My 0 AWG 12 feet cables read as:

0.09827 m?/ft * 12 ft = 1,179 m? per cable

and take up to:

I = V / R = 1 / 0,001179 = 848 amperes

before dropping 1 volt.

The trick with the Li-ion power bank cables is that
they are very short, a couple of feet.
Mine are 8 inches long, for a total of 16 inches.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 12:37:44 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

It takes from about 300 amps or more to start the small engines and much
more for the large engines.

It don't think it takes anywhere near that. Typical car starter is
~1200 watts which is ~1.5 hp, so 100 amps is more in the ball park.







Sure the starter is rated for 100 or less amps while running in the
small cars. As with most all electric motors I know of, it takes 2 to
10 times the running curent to get them to start turning, especially
under load. Most in the 2 to 4 times current. Then add to that a cold
engine in the winter time will take more current to start than one in
the summer time.

The wire has to stand that 200 plus amps with out dropping too much
voltage (including the resistance of the jumper clamps).

Most of the better jumpers will use atleast # 6 copper wire, The real
good ones will be even larger wire. It just gets to a point of how big
and bulkey and expensive one wants to go.


I'd never buy anything less than a #4

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 13:22:23 -0700 (PDT), TimR
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 1:52:47 PM UTC-4, Rod Speed wrote:

But in some situations the problem is that the car that wont
start will turn the engine over fine but the voltage sags enough
so that the ignition cant supply a good enough spark to get
the engine to fire and all the car that is helping to start it
needs to do is supply enough voltage to get the engine
to actually fire and that doesn’t require much current.

I'm throwing the bull**** flag on this. It has always taken more power to turn an engine over mechanically than to get a spark plug to fire.



Yes, that is true - but you can run the flag down the pole. If the
battery "sags" from the cranking current there is not enough VOLTAGE
left to make a good spark. That's why on Kettering ignition (typical
points and condenser type of years gone by) there was often a ballast
residtor that ewas shunted out of the circuit for starting. The coil
was designed to run on 7 or 8 volts - about the voltage available from
the battery when cranking a cold engine. Once running the resistor in
the circuit limited the coil current to what it would be at 8 volts.

This was done because a 12 volt coil running on 8 volts coukld not
fire the plugs reliably.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 13:22:49 -0700 (PDT), TimR
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 1:46:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:
The connection at the clamps is probably the weak link.

+1
On cheap cables, for sure. On a good set of heavy duty cables the
clamps are easily good for 600 amps.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 17:11:32 -0400, wrote:



Yes, but the difference is that with a flat or sulphated
battery, the engine can still be cranked over, albeit
very slowly, but the battery may well be producing
a much lower than normal voltage that isnt enough
to produce a decent spark to get the engine firing
in the worst weather conditions in a car with an
old well ****ed distributor and plug leads and
spark plugs.



.. made me wonder how old the car would be
- if it has a distributor - early 1990's ?
or even older ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributor

John T.
Computerized electronic ignition is even fussier. Many will not
provide a spark (oe fire the injectors) below 9 volts - and some will
not produce a spark below about 600 rpm cranking speed (ones with
inductive pickup instead of hall effect)

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 18:39:18 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 15:10:50 -0400, Hugh Byrne wrote:

Ed Pawlowski wrote on Wed, 10 Apr 2019 10:15:09 -0400

I don't recall the last time I needed to use them, but I always carry a
set. I bet you do now too. You can get them for as little at $10.

Thank you everyone.
I will get 6 gauge or 4 gauge or even smaller (lower numbers being better
especially for longer distances).

I found a lot to choose from at home depot online
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Automoti...s/N-5yc1vZc8mb
Not so many at Lowes online and much higher prices
https://www.lowes.com/search?searchT...priceLowToHigh

What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk & usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?
I'm kind of leaning toward buying three sets, one for each car.

20 foot 2 gauge will never fail you. Probably overkill, but I still have 2 sets.
They are good for conducting enough current to start most cars in sub-zero conditions,
even with a dead battery. If it's got engine problems all bet are off.
Here a couple tips. You must hear a load on the alternator of the charging car when you
connect the cables. It's very noticeable. If you don't hear it you don't have a good
connection. Especially with thin cable, once you know your connection is good, wait a
minute or three before you try to start the dead car. If it barely cranks, wait longer.
Longer cables make for easier good connections, but longer also means thicker.


The 00 cables I had on the Ramcharger would start a diesel truck or
tractor as long as it was 12 volts, not 24. - from 25 feet away.

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 19:32:27 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 4/10/19 4:27 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Thank you everyone.
I will get 6 gauge or 4 gauge or even smaller (lower numbers being better
especially for longer distances).

I found a lot to choose from at home depot online
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Automoti...s/N-5yc1vZc8mb
Not so many at Lowes online and much higher prices
https://www.lowes.com/search?searchT...priceLowToHigh

What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk & usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?
I'm kind of leaning toward buying three sets, one for each car.



I have a set in my car and another in my truck.

For 10 feet 6 may be ok, for longer, go larger wire.

When buying the cables, make sure they are all copper wire. Some wire
has been showing up that is copper covered aluminum. The wire is
probably ok, but the aluminum is only rated about 60% the capacity of
copper. Rule of thumb used to be go up (down in numbers) 3 sizes.


And aluminum doesn't bend well.
Nor does thick strand copper - which is why I like welding cables

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 5:10:20 PM UTC-4, wrote:

Yes, but the difference is that with a flat or sulphated
battery, the engine can still be cranked over, albeit
very slowly, but the battery may well be producing
a much lower than normal voltage that isnt enough
to produce a decent spark to get the engine firing
in the worst weather conditions in a car with an
old well ****ed distributor and plug leads and
spark plugs.



.. made me wonder how old the car would be
- if it has a distributor - early 1990's ?
or even older ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributor

John T.

Yes, indeed. Another example of the kangaroo's ass not knowing
what he's talking about. He thinks cars still use distributors.
Like you say, those were gone in cars decades ago.

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 2:16:11 PM UTC-4, Ernestine wrote:
On 4/10/19 1:43 PM, Rod Speed wrote:
Not viable either given that plenty of them have
much thinner gauge wire than the best of them.
And what matters much more with the worst of
the jumper cables is how the clamps are done
because that limits their performance much
more than the cable gauge in the situation
where high current is needed over the cable
because the battery in the car that wont start
is so ****ed that it wont even turn the engine
over and so needs to deliver the full current
needed to turn the engine over at a decent rate.


Use some telephone station wire then, dingaling!

+1

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 1:24:49 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

So, all this is for ICE cars. If you have one of those electric cars
and you are out of juice, at the side of the road, what do they do?
You can't just jump start it, you have to put enough charge it it
to get it somewhere to plug in. So, what do they do? Like if you
have such a car and call AAA what do they do? I expect it's tow you
to someplace to plug in.



You pull out the portable wind generator and solar cell and wait for the
sun to come out or the wind to blow. Just one of the green solutions of
AOC.


Those electric cars may be ok for those that never get out of the city
and only go 10 or 20 miles at a time. Now if they ever get them where
you can recharge them at many places like all the gas service stations
and pumps and in the time it takes to gas up an ICE car they may have
something for me. The battery better last 10 years or more also.

Yes, they would be fine for a car that you use mostly for commuting
to work each day that's within range, a second car that you use around
the area you live in, etc. The serious problem is that they are not
practical for trips that are at or beyond the range limit. Even more
limited if you're coming back the same day and have to do it roundtrip.
Hybrids don't have that problem.

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 3:10:53 PM UTC-4, Hugh Byrne wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote on Wed, 10 Apr 2019 10:15:09 -0400

I don't recall the last time I needed to use them, but I always carry a
set. I bet you do now too. You can get them for as little at $10.

Thank you everyone.
I will get 6 gauge or 4 gauge or even smaller (lower numbers being better
especially for longer distances).

I found a lot to choose from at home depot online
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Automoti...s/N-5yc1vZc8mb
Not so many at Lowes online and much higher prices
https://www.lowes.com/search?searchT...priceLowToHigh

What LENGTH is a good compromise between packing in the trunk & usefulness?
10 feet?
12 feet?
16 feet?
I'm kind of leaning toward buying three sets, one for each car.

I'd size it like this. Suppose the car is parked head in to a wall
with parking spaces on either side. Assume your battery is in the
engine compartment and the other car has a battery on the opposite
side. So, you should be able to go about two car widths plus whatever
typical space is ~3 ft?, between cars. That would certainly cover
the vast majority of situations you might need to use it in. I'd
say that most times you would need much less. I'm sure there are
other situations where longer would be needed, but most of those
cases you could push the car to where you could use shorter cables.
IDK how long mine are, but I suspect it's more like 12 ft than 16.

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 9:51:40 PM UTC-4, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 13:22:23 -0700 (PDT), TimR
wrote:
I'm throwing the bull**** flag on this. It has always taken more power to turn an engine over mechanically than to get a spark plug to fire.



Yes, that is true - but you can run the flag down the pole. If the
battery "sags" from the cranking current there is not enough VOLTAGE
left to make a good spark. That's why on Kettering ignition (typical
points and condenser type of years gone by) there was often a ballast
residtor that ewas shunted out of the circuit for starting. The coil
was designed to run on 7 or 8 volts - about the voltage available from
the battery when cranking a cold engine. Once running the resistor in
the circuit limited the coil current to what it would be at 8 volts.

This was done because a 12 volt coil running on 8 volts coukld not
fire the plugs reliably.

Huh. I spoke too soon. I can see how cranking could drop the voltage enough to cause other problems, I hadn't thought of that.

I will fold that flag and save it for later. Shouldn't need to wait long, with this crowd.

Some gutless drunken drug crazed ****wit desperately cowering behind
trader_4 mindlessly nit picked, just like it always
does when its got done like a ****ing dinner, as it always is.

Some gutless drunken drug crazed ****wit desperately cowering behind
trader_4 mindlessly nit picked, just like it always
does when its got done like a ****ing dinner, as it always is.

Some gutless drunken drug crazed ****wit desperately cowering behind
trader_4 mindlessly nit picked, just like it always
does when its got done like a ****ing dinner, as it always is.

"trader_4" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 1:24:49 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

So, all this is for ICE cars. If you have one of those electric cars
and you are out of juice, at the side of the road, what do they do?
You can't just jump start it, you have to put enough charge it it
to get it somewhere to plug in. So, what do they do? Like if you
have such a car and call AAA what do they do? I expect it's tow you
to someplace to plug in.



You pull out the portable wind generator and solar cell and wait for the
sun to come out or the wind to blow. Just one of the green solutions of
AOC.


Those electric cars may be ok for those that never get out of the city
and only go 10 or 20 miles at a time. Now if they ever get them where
you can recharge them at many places like all the gas service stations
and pumps and in the time it takes to gas up an ICE car they may have
something for me. The battery better last 10 years or more also.

Yes, they would be fine for a car that you use mostly
for commuting to work each day that's within range,

Not if you do that over any distance in the
depths of winter or the peak of summer.

a second car that you use around the area you live in, etc.

Again, depends on the weather and distance.

The serious problem is that they are not practical
for trips that are at or beyond the range limit.

Or in the depths of winder or the peak of summer in many places either.

Even more limited if you're coming back
the same day and have to do it roundtrip.
Hybrids don't have that problem.

On Fri, 12 Apr 2019 04:22:10 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the senile psychopath's latest troll****

....and much better air in here again!

--
Richard addressing Rot Speed:
"**** you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID:

On Fri, 12 Apr 2019 04:20:55 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the senile asshole's latest troll****

04:20 am today? Are you sick or what? Or why did you attempt to "sleep in"
today, you abnormal 85-year-old trolling senile pest? LOL

--
dennis@home to retarded senile Rot:
"sod off rod you don't have a clue about anything."
Message-ID:

On Fri, 12 Apr 2019 04:22:35 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

Some gutless drunken drug crazed ****wit desperately cowering behind
trader_4 mindlessly nit picked, just like it always
does when its got done like a ****ing dinner, as it always is.

Lost yet another argument, you totally ****ed up 85-year-old trolling senile
asshole?

--
"Anonymous" to trolling senile Rot Speed:
"You can **** off as you know less than pig **** you sad
little ignorant ****."
MID:

On Fri, 12 Apr 2019 04:25:29 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the senile idiot's latest senile blather

--
Bill Wright addressing senile Ozzie cretin Rot Speed:
"Well you make up a lot of stuff and it's total ******** most of it."
MID:

Some gutless drunken drug crazed ****wit desperately cowering behind
trader_4 wrote just the pathetic excuse for bull****
that
you'd expect from a desperately cowering drunken drug crazed gutless
****wit.

On Fri, 12 Apr 2019 06:05:28 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

Some gutless drunken drug crazed ****wit desperately cowering behind
trader_4 wrote just the pathetic excuse for bull****
that
you'd expect from a desperately cowering drunken drug crazed gutless
****wit.

Lost yet another argument, you demented 85-year-old senile pest? LOL

--
Richard addressing Rot Speed:
"**** you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll."
MID:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 21:55:38 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 17:11:32 -0400, wrote:



Yes, but the difference is that with a flat or sulphated
battery, the engine can still be cranked over, albeit
very slowly, but the battery may well be producing
a much lower than normal voltage that isnt enough
to produce a decent spark to get the engine firing
in the worst weather conditions in a car with an
old well ****ed distributor and plug leads and
spark plugs.



.. made me wonder how old the car would be
- if it has a distributor - early 1990's ?
or even older ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributor

John T.

Computerized electronic ignition is even fussier. Many will not
provide a spark (oe fire the injectors) below 9 volts - and some will
not produce a spark below about 600 rpm cranking speed (ones with
inductive pickup instead of hall effect)


Yep . but how old for a distributor ?
... my old memory banks are asking ..
My 1980 F100 had one ;
I think my 1990 B2200 had one .. not sure.
.. after that dunno.
John T.

On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 18:12:30 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 21:55:38 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 17:11:32 -0400, wrote:



Yes, but the difference is that with a flat or sulphated
battery, the engine can still be cranked over, albeit
very slowly, but the battery may well be producing
a much lower than normal voltage that isnt enough
to produce a decent spark to get the engine firing
in the worst weather conditions in a car with an
old well ****ed distributor and plug leads and
spark plugs.



.. made me wonder how old the car would be
- if it has a distributor - early 1990's ?
or even older ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributor

John T.

Computerized electronic ignition is even fussier. Many will not
provide a spark (oe fire the injectors) below 9 volts - and some will
not produce a spark below about 600 rpm cranking speed (ones with
inductive pickup instead of hall effect)


Yep . but how old for a distributor ?
.. my old memory banks are asking ..
My 1980 F100 had one ;
I think my 1990 B2200 had one .. not sure.
.. after that dunno.
John T.
Distributor?or points? By 1975 all American manufacturers had
switched to electronic triggers from points. It took untill the late
90s for didtributorless ignition to virtually take over from
distributor ignition. Not sure exactly which car was the last to loose
the rotary distribution spark system

On Thursday, April 11, 2019 at 8:44:14 PM UTC-4, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2019 18:12:30 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 21:55:38 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 10 Apr 2019 17:11:32 -0400, wrote:



Yes, but the difference is that with a flat or sulphated
battery, the engine can still be cranked over, albeit
very slowly, but the battery may well be producing
a much lower than normal voltage that isnt enough
to produce a decent spark to get the engine firing
in the worst weather conditions in a car with an
old well ****ed distributor and plug leads and
spark plugs.



.. made me wonder how old the car would be
- if it has a distributor - early 1990's ?
or even older ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributor

John T.

Computerized electronic ignition is even fussier. Many will not
provide a spark (oe fire the injectors) below 9 volts - and some will
not produce a spark below about 600 rpm cranking speed (ones with
inductive pickup instead of hall effect)


Yep . but how old for a distributor ?
.. my old memory banks are asking ..
My 1980 F100 had one ;
I think my 1990 B2200 had one .. not sure.
.. after that dunno.
John T.
Distributor?or points? By 1975 all American manufacturers had
switched to electronic triggers from points. It took untill the late
90s for didtributorless ignition to virtually take over from
distributor ignition. Not sure exactly which car was the last to loose
the rotary distribution spark system


The last one was Rod's kangaroo car.