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HvacTech2
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner



Hi Bob, hope you are having a nice day

On 26-Jun-04 At About 05:01:54, Bob wrote to All
Subject: 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

B From: Bob

B On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
ffdina@ma wrote:

B Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity
B than a 220 VAC u Thanks in advance

B Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
B approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss
B in the wiring.

Sorry but you are mistaken here. what you pay for is power as in watts not
amperage.


-= HvacTech2 =-


... "I wrote a few children's books... Not on purpose." - s.w.

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Faustino Dina
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance
--
Faustino Dina
--------------------------------------------------------
If my email address starts with two 'f'
drop the first 'f' when mailing me.


  #3   Report Post  
Tony Hwang
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Faustino Dina wrote:
Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance

Hi,
220V one is more efficient.
Tony

  #4   Report Post  
Steve B.
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:

Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance


If comparing apples to apples they are both equally efficient. In
reality though it seems that the 220v models are better designed and
have higher efficiency ratings. Probably because they tend to be
larger units and in a higher price category.

Steve B.
  #7   Report Post  
Joseph Meehan
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Faustino Dina wrote:
Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than
a 220 VAC unit?

Thanks in advance


All else being equal the 220 will be very slightly more efficient, but
not enough to worry about. However all things are never equal. Most 110
units are just not built as efficient.

--
Joseph E. Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math



  #8   Report Post  
zxcvbob
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Faustino Dina wrote:
Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance



No. Check the "EER" rating to determine the efficiency. Even a small
difference in the EER will overwhelm the slight inherent advantage the
220V unit has due to lower percent voltage drop in its supply wires.

Bob
  #9   Report Post  
Bob
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:

Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance


Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss in
the wiring.



  #10   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"Faustino Dina" wrote in message ...
Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance
--
Faustino Dina
--------------------------------------------------------
If my email address starts with two 'f'
drop the first 'f' when mailing me.


This is Turtle.

You can buy a 12K BTU Whirlpool Window unit with 220 volt or 120 volt service and you will see the EER is exactly the same on both.
If there is any savings it will be in the manufactor who makes it and there will be no difference if it was 220 volt or 120 volt.

Another example here. We have some blower motor that can be run on 120 volt or 220 volt service. The amp rating if run on 220 volt
service will be 4.5 amps. If you took this same motor and wire it up to run on 120 volt service. It will have a amp rating of 9
amps. This sounds like a savings here by the 220 volt service only pulling 4.5 amps but you are paying for two 120 volt power wires
which is being pulled trough your electric meter and paying for double on two 120 volt wires which the 120 volt would pull on one
wire from the meter service. So.

220 volt service you will pay for wire one 4.5 amps + wire two 4.5 amps = 9 amps total of two wires.
120 volt service you will pay for 9 amps = 9 amps total of the one wire.

Now to say as to it is cheaper to run on 220 volt service is only left up to the manufactor and the EER rating being the same or you
have poor electric service like in too small of wire. The 220 volt service could help out in a low voltage problem or poor electric
service.

Yes Electric company want to talk in KWH and not in amps. You can covert amp to KWH if you like for they are directly convertiable.

So I see no difference in the cost being lower for 220 volt service verses 120 volt service.

TURTLE


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  #11   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"Bob" wrote in message ...
On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:

Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance


Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss in
the wiring.


This is Turtle.

But only if the wires are too small [ at upper limit of the NEC code], too long, or defective. Heat lost as you speak of it is only
present [ in a measuriable amount ] when the wires are not big enough or at the upper limit of the power draw of the wires but still
inside the upper limits of the NEC code.

What the original poster is thinking about is not the heat lost of the wire , but is the 220 volt service pulling 4.5 amps and the
120 volt service pulling 9 amps. The ideal of paying for two hot wires is the problem as people think 220 volt service cost less.

TURTLE


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  #12   Report Post  
Arthur
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Look at a spec & see what the wattage consumption of each maybe.

Don't tell me what I can understand, tell me what I can't mis-understand
(Gen. Douglas McArthur)!
No matter what you do you are a problem solver....what do you do?
Arthur, Website: www.arthurhewett.com
Email:

"Faustino Dina" wrote in message
...
Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance
--
Faustino Dina
--------------------------------------------------------
If my email address starts with two 'f'
drop the first 'f' when mailing me.




  #13   Report Post  
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

HvacTech2 wrote:

...what you pay for is power as in watts not amperage.


No. We pay for energy in kWh vs power in watts.

But maybe it's all Btus to you.

Nick

  #14   Report Post  
Jake
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

kWh is power in Thousands of Watts, expressed over time.

I.E. 10 one hundred watt light bulbs consumes 1,000 watts. If you leave them
on an hour, you will pay for 1 kWh.

Watts are expressed as Amps x Volts.(for single phase, but let's not
complicate it further).

IE An air conditioner consuming 10 amps at 120 volts consumes 1,200 watts.
If you leave it on for an hour, you pay for 1.2 kWh.

The term "Watts" defines "True Power", and Turtle's explanation is correct.

5 amps x 240 volts = 1,200 watts
10 amps x 120 volts = 1,200 watts.

Same power input. If the circuit is designed correctly, the heat loss will
be nearly identical.

Hooking up a 240 volt unit should be less expensive, since it takes smaller
wire to do so. Yes, it takes smaller wire at 240 volts for the same "True
Power" to be delivered.

If, however, you're thinking about buying a window unit and just plugging
it into the nearest 120 volt outlet, please don't!!! You should have a
dedicated circuit for all but the smallest window air conditioner units. In
any event, please don't ever, ever, ever use an extension cord without
talking to an electrician first.

Hope this helps,

Jake


wrote in message
...
HvacTech2 wrote:

...what you pay for is power as in watts not amperage.


No. We pay for energy in kWh vs power in watts.

But maybe it's all Btus to you.

Nick



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Raymond Koonce
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Bob wrote:

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:



Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance



Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss in
the wiring.


Correct me if I'm wrong here, but as I understand it (told by a power
company employee) the speed of the meter spin depends on the leg with
the heaviest current draw. So if you have 60 amps on one leg and 20 on
the other, you pay for the 60 amp leg. Another reason to balance your
loads between legs.



  #16   Report Post  
HVAC fella
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Amp draw is cut in half by using 240 v. vs. 120 v for the same capacity
appliance.

_____________________________________________

Have you hugged your A/C Tech today ?

_____________________________________________

  #17   Report Post  
Jake
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner




Correct me if I'm wrong here, but as I understand it (told by a power
company employee) the speed of the meter spin depends on the leg with
the heaviest current draw. So if you have 60 amps on one leg and 20 on
the other, you pay for the 60 amp leg. Another reason to balance your
loads between legs.


You're wrong, here.

The meter is measuring the total energy consumed... not just one leg.

Some utilities will add an EXTRA charge on top of kWh, which would show up
on your bill as kVar. kVar is the difference in draw between the two legs.

Jake


  #18   Report Post  
Jake
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

So what, you dumb jerk !! Explain why this is an advantage?

Jake

"HVAC fella" wrote in message
...
Amp draw is cut in half by using 240 v. vs. 120 v for the same capacity
appliance.

_____________________________________________

Have you hugged your A/C Tech today ?

_____________________________________________



  #19   Report Post  
CBHVAC
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"HVAC fella" wrote in message
...
Amp draw is cut in half by using 240 v. vs. 120 v for the same capacity
appliance.

_____________________________________________

Have you hugged your A/C Tech today ?

_____________________________________________


Can you post some numbers to prove this? I would like to see if you know
half as much as you claim..


Seriously.....do the math for us on here


  #20   Report Post  
Tony Hwang
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Jake wrote:
kWh is power in Thousands of Watts, expressed over time.

I.E. 10 one hundred watt light bulbs consumes 1,000 watts. If you leave them
on an hour, you will pay for 1 kWh.

Watts are expressed as Amps x Volts.(for single phase, but let's not
complicate it further).

IE An air conditioner consuming 10 amps at 120 volts consumes 1,200 watts.
If you leave it on for an hour, you pay for 1.2 kWh.

The term "Watts" defines "True Power", and Turtle's explanation is correct.

5 amps x 240 volts = 1,200 watts
10 amps x 120 volts = 1,200 watts.

Same power input. If the circuit is designed correctly, the heat loss will
be nearly identical.

Hooking up a 240 volt unit should be less expensive, since it takes smaller
wire to do so. Yes, it takes smaller wire at 240 volts for the same "True
Power" to be delivered.

If, however, you're thinking about buying a window unit and just plugging
it into the nearest 120 volt outlet, please don't!!! You should have a
dedicated circuit for all but the smallest window air conditioner units. In
any event, please don't ever, ever, ever use an extension cord without
talking to an electrician first.

Hope this helps,

Jake


wrote in message
...

HvacTech2 wrote:


...what you pay for is power as in watts not amperage.


No. We pay for energy in kWh vs power in watts.

But maybe it's all Btus to you.

Nick




Hi,
Knit picking. True power is Watts x cosine Phi(power factor which is
always less than 1). You were talking about Volt x Amp. = Watts = True
power which produces energy + false power which is wasted. In real world
there is no electrical load which has power factor of 1.
The closer to 1, the higher efficiency.
Again the cosine Phi is the phase angle difference between V and I.
V is usually leading the I in real world inductive load.
Tony



  #21   Report Post  
Jake
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Tony,

Yes, you are knit picking. Let's not get into PF and such here. The
audience is not a bunch of engineers, just people looking for answers.

Which of these people do you think will pull their unit apart, look at the
motors inside, and compute the TP including PF. None, I'd venture.

Let's just keep it simple and be satisfied that we know the formulae.

Jake


  #22   Report Post  
m Ransley
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Dave do math ! BWAAAAAAAAHHHHHHAAAAAAAHHHHHAAAA
Dave back up a claim ! BWAAAAAAAAAHHHAAAAHHHHAAAAAAAAAA
Dave Liscensed !
BBWWWAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHAAAAAAAAAHHHHAAAAA
Dave run and hide BWAAAAAAAAAAHHHHAAAAAAAHHHHAAAAAA

  #23   Report Post  
CBHVAC
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"m Ransley" wrote in message
...
Dave do math ! BWAAAAAAAAHHHHHHAAAAAAAHHHHHAAAA
Dave back up a claim ! BWAAAAAAAAAHHHAAAAHHHHAAAAAAAAAA
Dave Liscensed !
BBWWWAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHAAAAAAAAAHHHHAAAAA
Dave run and hide BWAAAAAAAAAAHHHHAAAAAAAHHHHAAAAAA



Mark..man...Dave aint hiding. Hes posted his information all over, and when
you ask him about it, he says thats the wrong addy....
Funny thing tho...use the 800 toll free, and he answers...



  #24   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"Raymond Koonce" wrote in message ...
Bob wrote:

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:



Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance



Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss in
the wiring.


Correct me if I'm wrong here, but as I understand it (told by a power
company employee) the speed of the meter spin depends on the leg with
the heaviest current draw. So if you have 60 amps on one leg and 20 on
the other, you pay for the 60 amp leg. Another reason to balance your
loads between legs.


This is Turtle.

Electric meter average the load on each leg of the service. If you have 500 watts draw on one leg and a 1,000 watts draw on the
other. the meter will see 750 watt draw . So it will record 750 watts as the two are averaged by the meter.

The ideal of balancing the load is out of not getting one leg too loaded up to cause low voltage drop or a over load on that one
circuit. The Electic Meter does not care about a out of balance circuits.

TURTLE


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  #25   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"HVAC fella" wrote in message ...
Amp draw is cut in half by using 240 v. vs. 120 v for the same capacity
appliance.


This is Turtle.

That a Boy Dave, Tell them about it. Stick to your guns here for the world is tring to get you to stop being stupit. I'm behind you
all the way because you are more fun than a barrel of monkeys.

Go Go Go Go Go for it Dave.

TURTLE


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  #26   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"Jake" wrote in message news:EdoDc.116327$HG.9377@attbi_s53...
So what, you dumb jerk !! Explain why this is an advantage?

Jake


This is Turtle.

The only referrence Dave can refer to this is in the Hacker's Almanic 2004 edition . Jake do you subscribe to the Hacker's Almanic
like Dave does ? I had to give up my subscription because of the every year when your fee / cost comes due you have to send in
something stupit you did and the fee is wavered. I was not going to lie to making me not pay. Dave can lie and be straight faced
about it and gets it free.

TURTLE


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m Ransley
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

I thought Dave was the Editor and founder of the Hackers Almanac.

  #28   Report Post  
Bob
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 15:01:54 -0500, Bob wrote:

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:

Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a 220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance


Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss in
the wiring.


Turtle is right again.

Buy the highest EER unit you can afford. There will be no
measurable difference in electricity use just because it is 220.



  #29   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"m Ransley" wrote in message ...
I thought Dave was the Editor and founder of the Hackers Almanac.


This is Turtle.

Dave is the best Hack I know and he could very well be the Founder and Editor but the name of the President now is Dave Blows and
not Dave Brown. Maybe that is his Stage name.

TURTLE


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jriegle
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

"TURTLE" wrote in message
...

"Raymond Koonce" wrote in message

...
Bob wrote:

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:



Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a

220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance



Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss in
the wiring.


Correct me if I'm wrong here, but as I understand it (told by a power
company employee) the speed of the meter spin depends on the leg with
the heaviest current draw. So if you have 60 amps on one leg and 20 on
the other, you pay for the 60 amp leg. Another reason to balance your
loads between legs.


This is Turtle.

Electric meter average the load on each leg of the service. If you have

500 watts draw on one leg and a 1,000 watts draw on the
other. the meter will see 750 watt draw . So it will record 750 watts as

the two are averaged by the meter.

The ideal of balancing the load is out of not getting one leg too loaded

up to cause low voltage drop or a over load on that one
circuit. The Electic Meter does not care about a out of balance circuits.

TURTLE


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.708 / Virus Database: 464 - Release Date: 6/18/2004


That can't be true. If I'm drawing 1000 watts of one leg and nothing off the
other, the average is 500 watts. Free power! If this is true, a 120 volt
load is always more economical because only half the power is registered.
This is not the case. If you are use 1000w off of one leg and 500 of the
other, the meter registeres 1500w of usage.

John




  #31   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"jriegle" wrote in message ...
"TURTLE" wrote in message
...

"Raymond Koonce" wrote in message

...
Bob wrote:

On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 11:42:54 -0500, "Faustino Dina"
wrote:



Is it true that 110 VAC air conditioners waste more electricity than a

220
VAC unit?

Thanks in advance



Yes - assuming everything else is equal, the 110VAC unit has
approximately double the current flow and thus a greater heat loss in
the wiring.


Correct me if I'm wrong here, but as I understand it (told by a power
company employee) the speed of the meter spin depends on the leg with
the heaviest current draw. So if you have 60 amps on one leg and 20 on
the other, you pay for the 60 amp leg. Another reason to balance your
loads between legs.


This is Turtle.

Electric meter average the load on each leg of the service. If you have

500 watts draw on one leg and a 1,000 watts draw on the
other. the meter will see 750 watt draw . So it will record 750 watts as

the two are averaged by the meter.

The ideal of balancing the load is out of not getting one leg too loaded

up to cause low voltage drop or a over load on that one
circuit. The Electic Meter does not care about a out of balance circuits.

TURTLE


That can't be true. If I'm drawing 1000 watts of one leg and nothing off the
other, the average is 500 watts. Free power! If this is true, a 120 volt
load is always more economical because only half the power is registered.
This is not the case. If you are use 1000w off of one leg and 500 of the
other, the meter registeres 1500w of usage.

John


This is Turtle.

I assumed too much here when I was speaking here. I was thinking I was talking to the Knowing person of the meter and not the Home
Owners. Sorry .

The meter will average the load of each leg and record the average on each leg and will be a total of the two averages it will put
on the read out digital meter. So with 1000 on one leg and 500 on the other. It will read a average of 750 watts on both legs and
then record 1,500 watts which is a total watt used. So if you have 1000 watts on one leg and zero on the other it will read a
average of 500 watts on each leg and record 1,000 watt because of reading a average of 500 watts on each leg.

A Electric meter is hard to fool unless you turn it up side down and read backwards through it.

No there is no free Lesstricity for out of balance circuits.

TURTLE


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  #32   Report Post  
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Jake wrote:

kWh is power in Thousands of Watts, expressed over time.


That might work, if "expressed over" means "multiplied by" :-)
But I don't like the first part ("kWh is power..."), since
kilowatt-hours (and Btus) are a measure of energy, not power.

Watts are expressed as Amps x Volts.(for single phase, but let's not
complicate it further).


watts = amps x volts x power factor. This can make a big difference.
Some undercounter fluorescent fixtures have a power factor of 0.4.

IE An air conditioner consuming 10 amps at 120 volts consumes 1,200 watts.


Only if the power factor is 1.0.

The term "Watts" defines "True Power", and Turtle's explanation is correct.

5 amps x 240 volts = 1,200 watts
10 amps x 120 volts = 1,200 watts.


Only if the power factor is 1.0.

...please don't ever, ever, ever use an extension cord without
talking to an electrician first.


Would you be an electrician, by chance? :-)

Nick

  #34   Report Post  
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

HvacTech2 wrote:

...you pay on the power used not the amperage.


No. You pay on the energy used. Power is just a number,
the rate of energy transferred. Energy (power times time)
is the stuff we pay for.

Nick

It's a snap to save energy in this country. As soon as more people
become involved in the basic math of heat transfer and get a gut-level,
as well as intellectual, grasp on how a house works, solution after
solution will appear.
Tom Smith, 1980

  #36   Report Post  
Jake
 
Posts: n/a
Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

Look, Guys,

If the original poster was an electrical engineer, they would not have asked
the question to begin with.

I was trying to answer the question in general terms for them. If you want
to get hyper-technical, ask the question over at sci.engr.control.


That might work, if "expressed over" means "multiplied by" :-)
But I don't like the first part ("kWh is power..."), since
kilowatt-hours (and Btus) are a measure of energy, not power.


You took this out of context. I said "kWh is power in thousands of watts"
comma "expressed over time." kW is power in thousands of watts.


Also, on the issue of how to compute watts, I found this on the US
Department of Energy's website. Here's the link :
http://www.eere.energy.gov/consumeri...heets/ec7.html

Here's the pertinent clip:

If the wattage is not listed on the appliance, you can still estimate it by
finding the current draw (in amperes) and multiplying that by the voltage
used by the appliance. Most appliances in the United States use 120 volts.
Larger appliances, such as clothes dryers and electric cooktops, use 240
volts. The amperes might be stamped on the unit in place of the wattage. If
not, find a clamp-on ammeter-an electrician's tool that clamps around one of
the two wires on the appliance-to measure the current flowing through it.
You can obtain this type of ammeter in stores that sell electrical and
electronic equipment. Take a reading while the device is running; this is
the actual amount of current being used at that instant

Would you be an electrician, by chance? :-)

Yes... and one that hates electrical fires.

Jake


  #38   Report Post  
TURTLE
 
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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner


"Tony Hwang" wrote in message news:l5CDc.909871$oR5.99416@pd7tw3no...
wrote:

Jake wrote:


kWh is power in Thousands of Watts, expressed over time.



That might work, if "expressed over" means "multiplied by" :-)
But I don't like the first part ("kWh is power..."), since
kilowatt-hours (and Btus) are a measure of energy, not power.


Watts are expressed as Amps x Volts.(for single phase, but let's not
complicate it further).



watts = amps x volts x power factor. This can make a big difference.
Some undercounter fluorescent fixtures have a power factor of 0.4.


IE An air conditioner consuming 10 amps at 120 volts consumes 1,200 watts.



Only if the power factor is 1.0.


The term "Watts" defines "True Power", and Turtle's explanation is correct.

5 amps x 240 volts = 1,200 watts
10 amps x 120 volts = 1,200 watts.



Only if the power factor is 1.0.


...please don't ever, ever, ever use an extension cord without
talking to an electrician first.



Would you be an electrician, by chance? :-)

Nick

Hi,
Again Volt x Amp and Watt is two different thing. Watt rating is always
less than Volt x Amp.
This is such a basic thing in theory, Sigh!
Tony


This is Turtle.

Tony You lost the Battle here with your theory. Theory only is good in Estimates and not in Readings from the Equipment it is really
drawing. If a Motor has a Name Tag estimated Amp draw of 5 amps per hour at 120 volts or it has a estimate of 600 watts per hour
rating. You can use the estimates but they will never be that high but will be less but will be exactly in direct proportion of the
estimate amp or watt draw of the motor.

Volt X Amps = Watts will never change in my life time but you can deal in estimate as to the amp or watt rating of motors which will
be stated on the motor or you can take the amp readings from the motor with a clamp meter and use the real amp reading to compare
with. Most all people here on the group does not have the tools to get the real reading from the motor to get the amp draw and
convert to watt hours. So the general public without getting all the equipment to work with can go by the Name tag amp or watt
estimate stated on the motor. The ideal of not getting all balled up with a bunch of calculation. they can just go by the stated Amp
or watt draw to compare motors as to cost to operate.

So You can use the Volt X Amp = Watts rating from the name tag and get the watt or amp draw or you can get the real reading and use
the Volt X amps = watts to get the real reading from the motor. The Name tag amp or watt rating will alway be higher but you can
alway just use the name tag amps rating to compare to another motor but just using name tag amps or watts as to compare them. To
compare motor I would want to use the factory set reading or rating of the motor rather than tring to take all the reading from your
motor which could have some errors in them by having to manually take all the readings. So I would say alway use the Manufactors set
readings of the motor being run at 100% of the motors ability. These Manufactors are always better at setting the amp draw of a
motor at 100% of it's ability that you or I can get. For a set point , Use the Manufactors Reading to compare with.

TURTLE


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Default 110 vs 220 VAC air conditioner

clifto wrote:

IE An air conditioner consuming 10 amps at 120 volts consumes 1,200 watts.


Only if the power factor is 1.0.


...and the resistance of all the wires and connections between the
electric meter and the air conditioner is zero (which it obviously
isn't).


If the AC consumed 10 amps at 120 V with a power factor of 1,
it would "consume" 1200 W, no matter how much the wires "consume."
Then again, a watt is just a rate of energy flow, so it can't be "consumed."

5 amps x 1 ohm = 5 watts per unit time wasted in wiring
10 amps x 1 ohm = 10 watts per unit time wasted in wiring


As in "watts per hour," like miles per hour per hour? :-)

As in "I have to go to the store now. It's 3 miles per hour
from here. On the way, I'll be driving 30 miles per hour per hour." :-)
That's a slow drag. You'd arrive at a speed of sqrt(2x3x30) = 13.4 mph...
Does everyone in your cargo cult talk like this? :-)

TURTLE wrote:

If a Motor has a Name Tag estimated Amp draw of 5 amps per hour...


Jeez. Have you ever seen a name tag that specifies "amps per hour"? :-)

It's just amps. A coulomb is an amount of charge, eg a quantity of
electrons. Amps are coulombs per second. Amps per hour would be
"coulombs per second per hour," which makes less sense than
miles per hour per hour, in this context.

Nick

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