Larry Caldwell posted for all of us....

About a year and a half ago I had my old rotting steel septic tank
replaced with a new 1500 gallon 2-chamber tank. Everything worked out
well, except I started getting a horrible stench out of the plumbing
vents that made it really unpleasant to be outside unless a wind was
blowing.

I talked to the installer, who seemed fairly knowledgeable, and he said
it is a common problem, but tanks eventually "flip over" and quit
stinking. The Department of Environmental Quality came out to do a dye
test to assure that the old drain field was working right. The inspector
just shrugged and said it was a common problem. Posting questions here
provided suggestions for activated charcoal filters on the plumbing
stacks, which seemed like it would work, but I have never needed them
before. I tried various yeast and bacterial additives with no success,
and even tried the dead chicken trick.

Last week, I finally found the solution. I poured a gallon of vegetable
oil down the drain. Like all rural people I had avoided any kind of
grease going down the drain because it forms a scum layer and doesn't
digest. Well, it turns out you need a little scum to keep the tank from
stinking. The odors stopped immediately!

Thanks to all who shared their experience. I hope this solution makes
life more pleasant for lots of country folk. Enjoy the rest of the
summer.

Larry


Heh heh no drain field left but he got rid of the stink heh heh
--
Tekkie

Emulated configuration and simulated tests confirmed hypothetical
predictions.

"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

(Me too.) writes:

"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

Hey, it's a brand new 1500 gallon tank with brand new PVC baffles. What
could it hurt? A gallon of oil probably put about 1/4" of scum on top of
the septage.

Still no smells, BTW.

--
http://home.teleport.com/~larryc

Just curious, what's the dead chicken trick?


Gary

You've just rewritten the last chapter in the septic tank book, I
think!!
SueK

Larry Caldwell wrote:

(John Klausner) writes:

Dumb question here.....you _knew_ you weren't supposed to put fat/oil
down the drain, you've avoided it assiduously.......but you poured a
_gallon_ of the stuff down. Now why the heck did you do that??? I
think it's great that it did the trick, but whatever possessed you???

There's a story there. Three people within a mile have had new septic
tanks installed, mine the replacement and two new systems. All three
stunk, but one quit stinking. Interestingly, the one that quit stinking
belongs to a clueless single woman who knows nothing about taking care of
septics. The facts just perked around in my brain for about a month, and
the grease solution popped out. One of those things.

--
http://home.teleport.com/~larryc

"Lou Scannon" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 01:52:29 GMT, "Me too." wrote:

"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

So, what's the downside of that?

A tank with air cut off from the bacteria and no digesting taking place equals
plugged lines and a tank that has to be pumped out on a regular basis.

Tom J

I was told by a rural resident that when you put a new tank in, the
anaerobic digestion is not started yet so you add shredded cabbage to start
the process and of course fill all your sink and shower traps with water if
they are new or dried out.
He said that the cabbage works!! That sounds better than oil.
I have never tried it, but he swears by it. I use Roebic Cesspool treatment
and pour it down the toilet and then not use the toilet for a hour or so.
This seems to help keep my drain lines clear to the tank, although I have a
Septic tank not a cesspool.

Hope this helps I have had the house with the septic system for about 4
years and I have finally got the thing working pretty good. The one thing I
did on the East tank was put a "T" on the intake pipe of the tank with a 2
foot extension into the tank. The level of the water kept blocking up the
intake (waste from the house) and the sewer man that came out to empty the
tank said that the county was requiring it on all tanks and it would help my
problem. I double check that with a friend who is a plumber and he agreed.
It has eliminated the problem of the blockage at the water surface. The west
tank does not have the problem but it looks newer. It might be that the
east tank is a bit old and needs a new leach field. I may just be prolonging
the replacement..not sure.

any comments?


"Larry Caldwell" wrote in message
k.net...
About a year and a half ago I had my old rotting steel septic tank
replaced with a new 1500 gallon 2-chamber tank. Everything worked out
well, except I started getting a horrible stench out of the plumbing
vents that made it really unpleasant to be outside unless a wind was
blowing.

I talked to the installer, who seemed fairly knowledgeable, and he said
it is a common problem, but tanks eventually "flip over" and quit
stinking. The Department of Environmental Quality came out to do a dye
test to assure that the old drain field was working right. The inspector
just shrugged and said it was a common problem. Posting questions here
provided suggestions for activated charcoal filters on the plumbing
stacks, which seemed like it would work, but I have never needed them
before. I tried various yeast and bacterial additives with no success,
and even tried the dead chicken trick.

Last week, I finally found the solution. I poured a gallon of vegetable
oil down the drain. Like all rural people I had avoided any kind of
grease going down the drain because it forms a scum layer and doesn't
digest. Well, it turns out you need a little scum to keep the tank from
stinking. The odors stopped immediately!

Thanks to all who shared their experience. I hope this solution makes
life more pleasant for lots of country folk. Enjoy the rest of the
summer.

Larry

--
http://home.teleport.com/~larryc

"Tom J" wrote in message
...

"Lou Scannon" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 01:52:29 GMT, "Me too." wrote:

"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

So, what's the downside of that?

A tank with air cut off from the bacteria and no digesting taking place
equals
plugged lines and a tank that has to be pumped out on a regular basis.

Tom J

I wonder if he tried getting a pound of brewers or bakers yeast and adding
it
to the tank?

Sue

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 15:04:32 -0400, "Tom J" wrote:

"John Gilmer" wrote in message
...


Heh heh no drain field left but he got rid of the stink heh heh

Really? A single gallon of vegetable oil will wipe out a drain field?

I don't think so.

I don't think so either, but he now has the idea that every time he gets a
whiff it's got to have a gallon of oil dumped in. That's where the problem
comes in - gallon after gallon after gallon - like his neighbor up the road
that gave him the idea. She wasn't dumping oil in by the gallon, but used
no
reasonable care in what did go down the drain, including used cooking oil.
That's the reason many people have to have their tanks pumped out every 2
to 5
years.

The original post did not indicate what you are inferring, if I recall
correctly (can't find it now). He said that in his NEW field there
was a stench, and he dumped the oil down there to provide a layer of
scum to keep the stench contained in the field. Nowhere did he
indicate that he planned to do this regularly. He said he did this
simply as a starter move, not as a routine maintenance strategy.

What I said was for other people reading this thread that are like his
neighbor up the road "without a clue" that caused him to have this idea that
he needed to dump a gallon of oil down the drain. We don't need everyone in
the country thinking a gallon of oil will cure their septic system odors with
no harm done.

Tom J

not meaning to change the subject of oil , but i have an old system that
is fine and it doesnt have vents, why are they needed

"mark Ransley" wrote in message
...
not meaning to change the subject of oil , but i have an old system that
is fine and it doesnt have vents, why are they needed


Are you sure you don't have a 4 inch pipe going through the roof or up the
side of the house? I've never seen a sewer system, whether on septic or sewer
line, that didn't have a vent pipe. Sewer gasses have to have some way of
escaping or there could be an explosion.

Tom J

charlie dick wrote:

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 16:38:23 -0400, "Tom J" wrote:

We don't need everyone in
the country thinking a gallon of oil will cure their septic system odors with
no harm done.

You know it! Pretty soon you'll have folks crappin' in their oil tanks.

The seeds clog up the filters.

Lou Scannon wrote:

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 05:13:52 GMT, Bill Vajk
wrote:

OTOH anaerobic digestion has the advantage of creating plenty
of methane. In some parts of the world denuded of trees,
concrete anaerobic digesters are used for human excrement and
wasted food products to generate methane for cooking and heating
water. As it turns out, the amount of gas produced is approximately
correctly proportional to the number of persons whose waste
feeds the digester.

I find it odd that we in the US completely waste this renewable
resource.

That's a real interesting idea. Are there units available? or would
you have to rig something?

google "methane digester" 9790 hits

I don't know if anyone is manufacturing them, they're
plenty easy to build.

John Gilmer wrote:

While on the topic of rural waste treatment: Is there anything "New Under
the Sun?" Many, many otherwise perfect home sites (great views,.existing
roads, etc) can't be used because their isn't room for the conventional
approached to getting and disposing of water. (The "safe separation"
between field and well and offsets from other properties.)

John, over the years I've seen commercially available
incinerating toilets and others that use some form
of oil based flush and reclamation system that I
don't remember enough about other than to mention
that they exist(ed).

"Grey water" from showers and kitchen sinks is dumped
out on the open ground untreated in many places. The
phosphates are helpful to some garden crops.

to TOM J Yess you are right , through the attic, But why at the
tank ? now and not on old systems

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 22:32:33 GMT, Bill Vajk
wrote:

Lou Scannon wrote:

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 05:13:52 GMT, Bill Vajk
wrote:

OTOH anaerobic digestion has the advantage of creating plenty
of methane. In some parts of the world denuded of trees,
concrete anaerobic digesters are used for human excrement and
wasted food products to generate methane for cooking and heating
water. As it turns out, the amount of gas produced is approximately
correctly proportional to the number of persons whose waste
feeds the digester.

I find it odd that we in the US completely waste this renewable
resource.

That's a real interesting idea. Are there units available? or would
you have to rig something?

google "methane digester" 9790 hits

I don't know if anyone is manufacturing them, they're
plenty easy to build.


they do have the problem that they only produce about 60% methane,
with the rest of the *non odorous* components being primarily carbon
dioxide.

IIRC (from the Second Earth Day, when I was taking an eco class, and
had the bright idea of making a demo digester for our group's class
project), the digester are fairly sensitive to the ratio of carbon to
nitrogen, as well as needing a good seal...we had a lot of fun loading
that wet manure into the 55 gal drum...and then the safety folks for
the exhibition made us take the water trap off so we couldn't even
show bubbles...

ck
country doc in louisiana
(no fancy sayings right now)

I am guessing that he is talking about venting between the toilet/whatever
and the tank. Septic tanks are anaerobic (cesspools are aerobic).

Lou Scannon wrote:


On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 22:32:33 GMT, Bill Vajk
wrote:

google "methane digester" 9790 hits

I don't know if anyone is manufacturing them, they're
plenty easy to build.

Good ol' google to the rescue. I'm still digging through all of the
hits. So far, it looks like these units are geared towards large dairy
concerns or land fill uses. I'm more interested in something that
would work on a smaller (ie; home) scale.
Thanks for the help

I first ran across the idea in National Geographic
some years back. The units they built were concrete
and small, single family sized. Perhaps your local
public library can help you find the information
which, in the usual Natl Geo fashion, had lots
of pictures. I'll bet the sponsoring organization
could provide you with complete plans once you can
find their name which is likely mentioned in the
Natl Geo article. I do recall they were built in
place using concrete. I recall a short hose to
a small gas burner used for cooking.

Best of luck!

Lou Scannon wrote:


On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 22:32:33 GMT, Bill Vajk
wrote:

google "methane digester" 9790 hits

I don't know if anyone is manufacturing them, they're
plenty easy to build.

Good ol' google to the rescue. I'm still digging through all of the
hits. So far, it looks like these units are geared towards large dairy
concerns or land fill uses. I'm more interested in something that
would work on a smaller (ie; home) scale.
Thanks for the help

I first ran across the idea in National Geographic
some years back. The units they built were concrete
and small, single family sized. Perhaps your local
public library can help you find the information
which, in the usual Natl Geo fashion, had lots
of pictures. I'll bet the sponsoring organization
could provide you with complete plans once you can
find their name which is likely mentioned in the
Natl Geo article. I do recall they were built in
place using concrete. I recall a short hose to
a small gas burner used for cooking.

Best of luck!

to rottn@thecore [Spoiler} hows the wife,,
well she is fine Ara ............... hows the kid
.......... fine ................as long as U stay away..........

to rottn@thecore [Spoiler} hows the wife,,
well she is fine Ara ............... hows the kid
.......... fine ................as long as U stay away..........

"Me too." wrote in message .net...
"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

If pouring a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain worked, good, no
harm done. That is a new one to me (23 years experience in septic
systems) but it makes sense. I imagine the oil forms a thin layer on
the surface of the tank and helps keep the gases from getting into the
airspace and venting out through the "stack" (vent pipe) on the roof.
The vegetable oil will stay floating in the tank and should not harm
the drainfield. If you don't have to do this too often (e.g. more
than once a year), I can't see any problem. In fact, I may recommend
this procedure to others who call me with the same problem.

Here is another remedy for the same problem: It is based on the same
principal; keeping the gases in the tank rather than letting them flow
out into the house plumbing (through the inlet pipe). Modern septic
tanks are designed to do just that. There is an airspace above the
liquid level in the tank, and it is vented through a "tee" in the
inlet, to allow septic tanks gases such as hydrogen sulfide (rotten
egg smell) to pass out of the tank through the open top of the tee and
upward into the household plumbing, and out of the "stack" in the
roof. Then the odours may downdraft into the yard. So here's the
solution: cap off the top of the inlet tee inside the tank. This
keeps the gases in the tank and allows them to dissipate into the
drainfield where they are absorbed into the soil. You don't smell
them. I have recommended this to many people and they report
overnight success. I know this circumvents the venting design of the
septic tank, but it seems to work, and seems to do no harm

If you have any questions, e-mail me at .

Phil J.

"Me too." wrote in message .net...
"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

If pouring a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain worked, good, no
harm done. That is a new one to me (23 years experience in septic
systems) but it makes sense. I imagine the oil forms a thin layer on
the surface of the tank and helps keep the gases from getting into the
airspace and venting out through the "stack" (vent pipe) on the roof.
The vegetable oil will stay floating in the tank and should not harm
the drainfield. If you don't have to do this too often (e.g. more
than once a year), I can't see any problem. In fact, I may recommend
this procedure to others who call me with the same problem.

Here is another remedy for the same problem: It is based on the same
principal; keeping the gases in the tank rather than letting them flow
out into the house plumbing (through the inlet pipe). Modern septic
tanks are designed to do just that. There is an airspace above the
liquid level in the tank, and it is vented through a "tee" in the
inlet, to allow septic tanks gases such as hydrogen sulfide (rotten
egg smell) to pass out of the tank through the open top of the tee and
upward into the household plumbing, and out of the "stack" in the
roof. Then the odours may downdraft into the yard. So here's the
solution: cap off the top of the inlet tee inside the tank. This
keeps the gases in the tank and allows them to dissipate into the
drainfield where they are absorbed into the soil. You don't smell
them. I have recommended this to many people and they report
overnight success. I know this circumvents the venting design of the
septic tank, but it seems to work, and seems to do no harm

If you have any questions, e-mail me at .

Phil J.

Lou Scannon spaketh...

google "methane digester" 9790 hits

Good ol' google to the rescue. I'm still digging through all of the
hits. So far, it looks like these units are geared towards large dairy
concerns or land fill uses. I'm more interested in something that
would work on a smaller (ie; home) scale.

this was 4th
http://library.melbournewater.com.au...rtual_tour/res
ources/resource_21.pdf

for convenience
http://tinyurl.com/hw2h
--
McQualude

Lou Scannon spaketh...

google "methane digester" 9790 hits

Good ol' google to the rescue. I'm still digging through all of the
hits. So far, it looks like these units are geared towards large dairy
concerns or land fill uses. I'm more interested in something that
would work on a smaller (ie; home) scale.

this was 4th
http://library.melbournewater.com.au...rtual_tour/res
ources/resource_21.pdf

for convenience
http://tinyurl.com/hw2h
--
McQualude

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 18:45:03 -0500 (CDT), (mark
Ransley) wrote (with possible editing):

to TOM J Yess you are right , through the attic, But why at the
tank ? now and not on old systems

FWIW, I think (as Bill said earlier) that new systems are based on
aerobic bacteria which produce less methane and carbon dioxide - or
perhaps none at all. The older ones were vented only at the stack and
use anaerobic digestion. This might be considered more
environmentally friendly, but I have to admit that my old system has
been running properly for 30 years now without pumping. Three years
ago, I added a new (second) system (because we expanded the size of
the house) and had it designed without vents (both types are accepted
in New Hampshire in the US) for the same reason: no stink.

Our only provision is to keep gray water out of them, and that is to
keep out phosphates.

--
Larry

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 18:45:03 -0500 (CDT), (mark
Ransley) wrote (with possible editing):

to TOM J Yess you are right , through the attic, But why at the
tank ? now and not on old systems

FWIW, I think (as Bill said earlier) that new systems are based on
aerobic bacteria which produce less methane and carbon dioxide - or
perhaps none at all. The older ones were vented only at the stack and
use anaerobic digestion. This might be considered more
environmentally friendly, but I have to admit that my old system has
been running properly for 30 years now without pumping. Three years
ago, I added a new (second) system (because we expanded the size of
the house) and had it designed without vents (both types are accepted
in New Hampshire in the US) for the same reason: no stink.

Our only provision is to keep gray water out of them, and that is to
keep out phosphates.

--
Larry

As I read the posts on this subject I'm amazed at the assumptions some have. Isn't it the number one rule
that you try to keep all oils out of your septic system? If the system is going to work, there is going
to be gas ordors released. All septic systems I've seen have at least two chambers, the incoming chamber
where the digestion and settlement takes place with gas formed (allowed to escape through roof vents) and
the outlet chamber that drains to the drain field. The two are divided by a downward baffle(various types
used) which allows only liquid to flow into the drainfield. I dont see how the gas is going to be
released in the drainfield as it must drain downward and gas rises upward.

Then at last thought, I've ran into those that believe theirs doesn't smell.

Jack


Phil J wrote:

"Me too." wrote in message .net...
"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

If pouring a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain worked, good, no
harm done. That is a new one to me (23 years experience in septic
systems) but it makes sense. I imagine the oil forms a thin layer on
the surface of the tank and helps keep the gases from getting into the
airspace and venting out through the "stack" (vent pipe) on the roof.
The vegetable oil will stay floating in the tank and should not harm
the drainfield. If you don't have to do this too often (e.g. more
than once a year), I can't see any problem. In fact, I may recommend
this procedure to others who call me with the same problem.

Here is another remedy for the same problem: It is based on the same
principal; keeping the gases in the tank rather than letting them flow
out into the house plumbing (through the inlet pipe). Modern septic
tanks are designed to do just that. There is an airspace above the
liquid level in the tank, and it is vented through a "tee" in the
inlet, to allow septic tanks gases such as hydrogen sulfide (rotten
egg smell) to pass out of the tank through the open top of the tee and
upward into the household plumbing, and out of the "stack" in the
roof. Then the odours may downdraft into the yard. So here's the
solution: cap off the top of the inlet tee inside the tank. This
keeps the gases in the tank and allows them to dissipate into the
drainfield where they are absorbed into the soil. You don't smell
them. I have recommended this to many people and they report
overnight success. I know this circumvents the venting design of the
septic tank, but it seems to work, and seems to do no harm

If you have any questions, e-mail me at .

Phil J.

As I read the posts on this subject I'm amazed at the assumptions some have. Isn't it the number one rule
that you try to keep all oils out of your septic system? If the system is going to work, there is going
to be gas ordors released. All septic systems I've seen have at least two chambers, the incoming chamber
where the digestion and settlement takes place with gas formed (allowed to escape through roof vents) and
the outlet chamber that drains to the drain field. The two are divided by a downward baffle(various types
used) which allows only liquid to flow into the drainfield. I dont see how the gas is going to be
released in the drainfield as it must drain downward and gas rises upward.

Then at last thought, I've ran into those that believe theirs doesn't smell.

Jack


Phil J wrote:

"Me too." wrote in message .net...
"I poured a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain."

Damn, you're braver than me...

If pouring a gallon of vegetable oil down the drain worked, good, no
harm done. That is a new one to me (23 years experience in septic
systems) but it makes sense. I imagine the oil forms a thin layer on
the surface of the tank and helps keep the gases from getting into the
airspace and venting out through the "stack" (vent pipe) on the roof.
The vegetable oil will stay floating in the tank and should not harm
the drainfield. If you don't have to do this too often (e.g. more
than once a year), I can't see any problem. In fact, I may recommend
this procedure to others who call me with the same problem.

Here is another remedy for the same problem: It is based on the same
principal; keeping the gases in the tank rather than letting them flow
out into the house plumbing (through the inlet pipe). Modern septic
tanks are designed to do just that. There is an airspace above the
liquid level in the tank, and it is vented through a "tee" in the
inlet, to allow septic tanks gases such as hydrogen sulfide (rotten
egg smell) to pass out of the tank through the open top of the tee and
upward into the household plumbing, and out of the "stack" in the
roof. Then the odours may downdraft into the yard. So here's the
solution: cap off the top of the inlet tee inside the tank. This
keeps the gases in the tank and allows them to dissipate into the
drainfield where they are absorbed into the soil. You don't smell
them. I have recommended this to many people and they report
overnight success. I know this circumvents the venting design of the
septic tank, but it seems to work, and seems to do no harm

If you have any questions, e-mail me at .

Phil J.

(R&SB) writes:

I wonder if he tried getting a pound of brewers or bakers yeast and adding
it
to the tank?

Sure. Yeast. Rid-X. Roebic. A dead chicken. All the traditional
remedies. I have been smelling this stink for a year and a half.

--
http://home.teleport.com/~larryc

(R&SB) writes:

I wonder if he tried getting a pound of brewers or bakers yeast and adding
it
to the tank?

Sure. Yeast. Rid-X. Roebic. A dead chicken. All the traditional
remedies. I have been smelling this stink for a year and a half.

--
http://home.teleport.com/~larryc

Have read about several dumps installing resources to collect gas.

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 21:22:59 -0400, Tekkie wrote:

I find it odd that we in the US completely waste this renewable
resource.


Really?? Think $$$$ and who would not profit...
--

Have read about several dumps installing resources to collect gas.

On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 21:22:59 -0400, Tekkie wrote:

I find it odd that we in the US completely waste this renewable
resource.


Really?? Think $$$$ and who would not profit...
--