Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week. This resulted in a mess inside the house from
backing up after a few weeks. The second winter I decided to skip
having him run any water in the house to avoid a repeat situation. What
I did not realize was the furnace gave off condensation (about 3 gal per
24 hours) and goes through the waste water pipes under the garage floor
through the U shaped pipe and out towards the sewer. This amount of
water also froze over time. The 2 feet depth on each side of the U freeze
solid. I am not 100% sure but it may start in the section of pipe under
ground just outside the wall of the garage. It took 4 hours of umbels
time and 1 hour of time from a guy with a steam jenny (sp?) to thaw it
out.

I have no idea how to keep underground pipes from freezing. This is a
townhouse built on a slab. I know of 2 other homes on the street with no
one home for an extended period of time during this cold period that did
not have any issues. Any suggestions on a solution?

--

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Sep 2015 03:44:01 +0000, GMC
wrote:

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week.

Why? Do you mean that when he came over he wanted a drink of water
and needed to use the toilet?

Because I was going to suggest while your away you turn off the water,
drain the pipes, and pour winnebago antifreeze in your traps, sinks,
toilets, and maybe even dishwasher? In case the heat goes out.

Is this only a problem when you're away, 6 days at a time, or also when
your home, using the toilet every day, twice a day. Can it freeze if
you sleep for 8 hours and go out for 8 more?

This resulted in a mess inside the house from
backing up after a few weeks. The second winter I decided to skip
having him run any water in the house to avoid a repeat situation. What
I did not realize was the furnace gave off condensation (about 3 gal per
24 hours) and goes through the waste water pipes under the garage floor
through the U shaped pipe and out towards the sewer. This amount of
water also froze over time. The 2 feet depth on each side of the U freeze
solid. I am not 100% sure but it may start in the section of pipe under
ground just outside the wall of the garage. It took 4 hours of umbels
time and 1 hour of time from a guy with a steam jenny (sp?) to thaw it
out.

I have no idea how to keep underground pipes from freezing. This is a
townhouse built on a slab. I know of 2 other homes on the street with no
one home for an extended period of time during this cold period that did
not have any issues.

Go talk to the owners.

Redirect the condensation from your furnace, at least when you are not
home. Even if you have to run it out through a tube through a hole in
the wall. And

Any suggestions on a solution?


--

Stumpy Strumpet
the bimbus
for dogcatcher

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

On 9/6/2015 11:56 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Sep 2015 03:44:01 +0000, GMC
wrote:

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week.

Why? Do you mean that when he came over he wanted a drink of water
and needed to use the toilet?

In ten weeks the water would dry up and sewer gasses would get in the
house. This can be prevented by pouring cooking oil to prevent
evaporation.




Redirect the condensation from your furnace, at least when you are not
home. Even if you have to run it out through a tube through a hole in
the wall. And

Any suggestions on a solution?


Make sure it does not freeze going through the wall though.

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 9/6/2015 11:56 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Sep 2015 03:44:01 +0000, GMC
wrote:

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week.

Why? Do you mean that when he came over he wanted a drink of water
and needed to use the toilet?

In ten weeks the water would dry up and sewer gasses would get in the
house. This can be prevented by pouring cooking oil to prevent
evaporation.




Redirect the condensation from your furnace, at least when you are not
home. Even if you have to run it out through a tube through a hole in
the wall. And

Any suggestions on a solution?


Make sure it does not freeze going through the wall though.


Sounds like something is not right.
What is frost line there? Hard to believe
P trap freezes if every thing is done right.

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 12:26:47 AM UTC-5, Tony Hwang wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 9/6/2015 11:56 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Sep 2015 03:44:01 +0000, GMC
wrote:

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week.

Why? Do you mean that when he came over he wanted a drink of water
and needed to use the toilet?

In ten weeks the water would dry up and sewer gasses would get in the
house. This can be prevented by pouring cooking oil to prevent
evaporation.


Redirect the condensation from your furnace, at least when you are not
home. Even if you have to run it out through a tube through a hole in
the wall. And

Any suggestions on a solution?


Make sure it does not freeze going through the wall though.


Sounds like something is not right.
What is frost line there? Hard to believe
P trap freezes if every thing is done right.

It's Global Warming, err, I mean Global Cooling, err, I know! Climate Chaos! ^_^

[8~{} Uncle Climate Monster

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 1:26:47 AM UTC-4, Tony Hwang wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 9/6/2015 11:56 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Sep 2015 03:44:01 +0000, GMC
wrote:

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week.

Why? Do you mean that when he came over he wanted a drink of water
and needed to use the toilet?

In ten weeks the water would dry up and sewer gasses would get in the
house. This can be prevented by pouring cooking oil to prevent
evaporation.




Redirect the condensation from your furnace, at least when you are not
home. Even if you have to run it out through a tube through a hole in
the wall. And

Any suggestions on a solution?


Make sure it does not freeze going through the wall though.


Sounds like something is not right.
What is frost line there? Hard to believe
P trap freezes if every thing is done right.

RV/non-toxic antifreeze would be one solution. Or maybe a heat
pad or similar over the area.

What is the purpose of this "U" which is apparently a P trap?
Is it a garage floor drain? But from the description it sounds
like maybe it's in the main sewer path? That would be unusual.
If it's a floor drain, once it has antifreeze it will stay full
unless someone uses it.

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 22:44:01 -0500, GMC
wrote:

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week. This resulted in a mess inside the house
from
backing up after a few weeks. The second winter I decided to skip
having him run any water in the house to avoid a repeat situation. What
I did not realize was the furnace gave off condensation (about 3 gal per
24 hours) and goes through the waste water pipes under the garage floor
through the U shaped pipe and out towards the sewer. This amount of
water also froze over time. The 2 feet depth on each side of the U
freeze
solid. I am not 100% sure but it may start in the section of pipe under
ground just outside the wall of the garage. It took 4 hours of umbels
time and 1 hour of time from a guy with a steam jenny (sp?) to thaw it
out. I have no idea how to keep underground pipes from freezing.
This is a
townhouse built on a slab. I know of 2 other homes on the street with no
one home for an extended period of time during this cold period that did
not have any issues. Any suggestions on a solution?

Farmers in times past would've put square straw bales over the area
of the suspected freeze up. Would the insulation blankets used by
concrete workers be any help?
My second thought was to constantly run RV antifreeze into the
pipes. Irrigation wells have oil drippers to constantly oil them.
A couple pictures: http://preview.tinyurl.com/okzaw63
The brass knob adjusts the flow rate. It's typically a few drops/minute.
The black piece is an automatic shutoff. It can be set to run constantly.
Another pictu http://preview.tinyurl.com/nqnumh4



--
Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

On Mon, 7 Sep 2015 04:42:27 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:


Sounds like something is not right.
What is frost line there? Hard to believe
P trap freezes if every thing is done right.

RV/non-toxic antifreeze would be one solution.

+1

OP could search for winterizing his home during a hard winter vacancy.
Plenty of information out there.

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

Oren wrote:
On Mon, 7 Sep 2015 04:42:27 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:


Sounds like something is not right.
What is frost line there? Hard to believe
P trap freezes if every thing is done right.

RV/non-toxic antifreeze would be one solution.

+1

OP could search for winterizing his home during a hard winter vacancy.
Plenty of information out there.

Freezing only occured once out at our cabin. Because I forgot to replace
batteries for thermostat. Since I ran extra wire between furnace and
'stat. Batteries are only back up power now lasting LONGER.

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

trader_4 wrote:
On Monday, September 7, 2015 at 1:26:47 AM UTC-4, Tony Hwang wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 9/6/2015 11:56 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 07 Sep 2015 03:44:01 +0000, GMC
wrote:

The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells. I have been away for 10 weeks each of
the last 2 winters. The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week.

Why? Do you mean that when he came over he wanted a drink of water
and needed to use the toilet?

In ten weeks the water would dry up and sewer gasses would get in the
house. This can be prevented by pouring cooking oil to prevent
evaporation.




Redirect the condensation from your furnace, at least when you are not
home. Even if you have to run it out through a tube through a hole in
the wall. And

Any suggestions on a solution?


Make sure it does not freeze going through the wall though.


Sounds like something is not right.
What is frost line there? Hard to believe
P trap freezes if every thing is done right.

RV/non-toxic antifreeze would be one solution. Or maybe a heat
pad or similar over the area.

What is the purpose of this "U" which is apparently a P trap?
Is it a garage floor drain? But from the description it sounds
like maybe it's in the main sewer path? That would be unusual.
If it's a floor drain, once it has antifreeze it will stay full
unless someone uses it.

As long as water does not run into it. Otherwise antifreeze will run away.

Frozen pipes under ground in upstate NY cold winter
 

On 9/6/2015 8:44 PM, GMC wrote:
The U shaped pipe under my garage floor has frozen the last 2 winters in
the lengthy extreme cold spells.

How do you *know* it is a "U shaped pipe"? Do you have visual access to it?
Have you probed it with a snake, etc.? Or, has someone just told you
that it is U shaped and that it is under your garage floor?

I have been away for 10 weeks each of the last 2 winters.

Don't you LIKE the cold weather? :

The first winter my house watcher flushed toilets
and ran water once a week. This resulted in a mess inside the house from
backing up after a few weeks.

Why did it back up? Did the house-watcher not notice that the pipe
was blocked/frozen? Or, did this happen in his absence?

The second winter I decided to skip
having him run any water in the house to avoid a repeat situation. What
I did not realize was the furnace gave off condensation (about 3 gal per
24 hours) and goes through the waste water pipes under the garage floor
through the U shaped pipe and out towards the sewer. This amount of
water also froze over time. The 2 feet depth on each side of the U freeze

Again, how do you *know* this? I assume your garage floor is a concrete slab?

solid. I am not 100% sure but it may start in the section of pipe under
ground just outside the wall of the garage. It took 4 hours of umbels
time and 1 hour of time from a guy with a steam jenny (sp?) to thaw it
out.
I have no idea how to keep underground pipes from freezing. This is a

You could "shade"/insulate the pipe before burying it! I.e., put it in
a material that is less of a thermal conductor.

You could also wrap them with a heating element and deliberately keep them
warm.

You could ensure an adequate flow of "room temperature" water is flowing
through them to keep ice from forming.

townhouse built on a slab. I know of 2 other homes on the street with no
one home for an extended period of time during this cold period that did
not have any issues.

So, what's different between your property and theirs? Sun exposure?
Soil composition? Different construction techniques??

Any suggestions on a solution?

What is the diameter of the pipe in question? Is it a typical 4" drain?
Or, something that *feeds* the drain pipe?