A couple minutes ago, I got a call from a
man I know from church. He said a company
came out to do the annual AC check over.
They say that the system had all the freon
leaked out, and the system is shot. They want
to replace the entire system.

He knows I do some refrigeration work, and
wants me to come out Saturday and look over
the system, and see what I find. Wants to know
if I am qualified to replace the entire system
if it needs it.

Yes, I'll go out Saturday and have a look see.
And yes, I can replace it if needed. I am now
taking entries for what I will find as the real
problem, or if I will find any real problems.

I'll let you all know on Saturday evening, after
I get back from the job.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

Stormin Mormon wrote:

They say that the system had all the freon leaked out, and the
system is shot. They want to replace the entire system.

I am now taking entries for what I will find as the real problem,
or if I will find any real problems.

The freon did not leak out.

It was stolen.

Church A/C units in the USA are prime targets for theft. I'm surprised
they didn't steal the entire unit for scrap value, but stealing the
freon is probably more lucrative.

And no, it's not shot. But HVAC industry is full of criminals that want
to sell you a new system when the real problem is you need to change the
air filter.

If the sysem is depressurized when you get there, do you have some way to pressurize it and then using soapy water look for leaks?

I have heard that there are non-flammable gasses that you can use for this purpose, you pressurize the system with this special mystery gas and then use a hand-held toch and scan around the pipes and if the mystery gas is leaking out, it will change the color of the flame of the torch.

Is this true, or just someone's happy dream?

Nowadays, Air Conditioning techs use an electronic leak detector to check for refrigerant leaks. It's far more sensitive than looking for bubbles or comparing the colour of a flame.

leak detection

On 5/15/2014 12:09 AM, wrote:
If the sysem is depressurized when you get there, do
you have some way to pressurize it and then using soapy
water look for leaks?

I have heard that there are non-flammable gasses that
you can use for this purpose, you pressurize the system
with this special mystery gas and then use a hand-held
toch and scan around the pipes and if the mystery gas is
leaking out, it will change the color of the flame of the
torch.

Is this true, or just someone's happy dream?


1) Yes, use a little R22, which is legal for leak checking.
Soapy water works, and can help locate a leak. Also used,
are leak detectors, which use a sniffer, and make a beeping
noise.

2) Propane flame halide leak detectors can still be found,
though they are a bit "old school" and don't detect some
of the new refrigerants. The chlorine content in the older
refrigerants turns the flame green.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 5/15/2014 12:48 AM, wrote:
And no, it's not shot. But HVAC industry is full of criminals that want
to sell you a new system when the real problem is you need to change the
air filter.

That assumes the A/C company didn't ice pick the system themselves.
Was it blowing cold air before the clean and check?


I neglected to ask if he'd tried it this year. The
HO said he called for yearly maint on the system,
and they told him it was out.... and he needed to
replace the entire system. I suspect they want a
pile of money to replace a system that still can be
made to work.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Wednesday, May 14, 2014 9:33:08 PM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
A couple minutes ago, I got a call from a

man I know from church. He said a company

came out to do the annual AC check over.

They say that the system had all the freon

leaked out, and the system is shot. They want

to replace the entire system.



He knows I do some refrigeration work, and

wants me to come out Saturday and look over

the system, and see what I find. Wants to know

if I am qualified to replace the entire system

if it needs it.



Yes, I'll go out Saturday and have a look see.

And yes, I can replace it if needed. I am now

taking entries for what I will find as the real

problem, or if I will find any real problems.



I'll let you all know on Saturday evening, after

I get back from the job.




I saw Dateline do a sting like that in Phoenix maybe 10 years ago.
They had a reputable AC service guy come out and verify that a
system was working perfectly. It was like 10 years old, but there was
nothing wrong with it. Then they removed one fuse and called 3 repair
companies, with a lady making the call as the homeowner. Two of them
checked the system, spending some time doing so, eg VOM being used, etc.
Both of those guys told them the system was shot and needed to be replaced.
The third guy was so honest that he not only told them the real problem
and put the fuse back in, he didn't even want to accept payment for the visit.

I'll be interested to see your findings. My guess is that the percentage
of cheats out there is substantial. How substantial, who knows.
Any idea how old the system is? I think for these cheats, if a system is
10+ years old, the odds of them scamming increase.

On 5/15/2014 8:09 AM, trader_4 wrote:
I saw Dateline do a sting like that in Phoenix maybe 10 years ago.
They had a reputable AC service guy come out and verify that a
system was working perfectly. It was like 10 years old, but there was
nothing wrong with it. Then they removed one fuse and called 3 repair
companies, with a lady making the call as the homeowner. Two of them
checked the system, spending some time doing so, eg VOM being used, etc.
Both of those guys told them the system was shot and needed to be replaced.
The third guy was so honest that he not only told them the real problem
and put the fuse back in, he didn't even want to accept payment for the visit.

I'll be interested to see your findings. My guess is that the percentage
of cheats out there is substantial. How substantial, who knows.
Any idea how old the system is? I think for these cheats, if a system is
10+ years old, the odds of them scamming increase.


I may have seen a similar show. Yes, and that's my memory
of how things went. One company, the tech used a pair of
diags, and snipped the coil wire of the contactor, so
that had to be replaced before they could call the next
place. The show I watched, they took a wire nut off of
the low voltage wire to the contactor. Same concept,
easy fix. The estimates were all outrageous.

Don't know the age of the system. I concur, doctor, I
suspect a money grabbing scheme to replace otherwise
good equipment. I'll write when I find out.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Thursday, May 15, 2014 9:37:50 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 5/15/2014 8:09 AM, trader_4 wrote:

I saw Dateline do a sting like that in Phoenix maybe 10 years ago.

They had a reputable AC service guy come out and verify that a

system was working perfectly. It was like 10 years old, but there was

nothing wrong with it. Then they removed one fuse and called 3 repair

companies, with a lady making the call as the homeowner. Two of them

checked the system, spending some time doing so, eg VOM being used, etc.

Both of those guys told them the system was shot and needed to be replaced.

The third guy was so honest that he not only told them the real problem

and put the fuse back in, he didn't even want to accept payment for the visit.



I'll be interested to see your findings. My guess is that the percentage

of cheats out there is substantial. How substantial, who knows.

Any idea how old the system is? I think for these cheats, if a system is

10+ years old, the odds of them scamming increase.





I may have seen a similar show. Yes, and that's my memory

of how things went. One company, the tech used a pair of

diags, and snipped the coil wire of the contactor, so

that had to be replaced before they could call the next

place. The show I watched, they took a wire nut off of

the low voltage wire to the contactor. Same concept,

easy fix. The estimates were all outrageous.



Don't know the age of the system. I concur, doctor, I

suspect a money grabbing scheme to replace otherwise

good equipment. I'll write when I find out.



The cops should run this sting occasionally, on HVAC, auto repair,
etc. You would think that the fines collected could help pay
for the cost of some, or all of it. And it would help keep businesses
honest.

About 10 years ago, I obtained an exec car for my gf at the time.
One of my friends at a high tech company had a Pontiac that was coming
off lease. She needed a car, so I arranged for her to buy it. It
was 3 years old, maybe 70K miles.
Less than a year later, the ABS warning light came on. She also told
me that the power steering was making noise. I drove the car and
the only noise from the PS was the typical noise you get if you turn
it all the way to the stops, left or right.

So, she took it to the local Pontiac dealer for those two problems.
They told here that the ABS computer was shot and the power steering
was leaking and needed to be replaced. I asked her if there was any
fluid on the garage floor, and she said no. I looked underneath and
saw no evidence of anything leaking either. The ABS computer was
like $900 for just the part, total repair cost would have been like
$1600.

I called up my buddy and he said he'd had the ABS light go on and
had taken it to a dealer near him and it was a wheel sensor. So,
I told her to take it back to them. The only problem they found
was..... a bad wheel sensor. Total cost $160. And you know that
it wasn't a case of mis-daignosis either. That ABS computer has a
long list of fault codes, things like "open sensor circuit RR wheel",
"no ground RR wheel", etc. And it for sure has a diagnostic code
that says the ABS computer itself is shot. It's not going to say
the puter is shot, when it's just missing a signal from one wheel
sensor.

Now, the interesting thing here, that I couldn't figure out until
recently, is how can this be going on? I'm thinking it's the dealer
running the scam, but what dealer would be dumb enough to do this and how
long can they get away with it? If you have a bunch your employees doing
this, all it takes is one ****ed off employee that your fire, whatever,
that knows about it, to go running to the cops. They could even just
send an anonymous letter to the cops.

More recently, I became aware that it's not necessarily the dealer
that's behind it. For example, in many dealerships, the service
advisors are getting compensated on the cost of the tickets they
write. I'm not sure exactly what incentives a mechanic has, but
I would not be surprised to find that they have some compensation
involved in jacking up the bill. So, it doesn't have to be a grand
conspiracy, but potentially just one or two dishonest employees.
And that's probably not hard to find at any repair place.

On Wed, 14 May 2014 21:09:43 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

If the sysem is depressurized when you get there, do you have some way to pressurize it and then using soapy water look for leaks?

I have heard that there are non-flammable gasses that you can use for this purpose, you pressurize the system with this special mystery gas and then use a hand-held toch and scan around the pipes and if the mystery gas is leaking out, it will change the color of the flame of the torch.

Is this true, or just someone's happy dream?
It's no mystery gas - nitrogen is the most common but you can use co2
or argon if you have it on hand and no nitrogen.

On Thu, 15 May 2014 06:47:16 +0200, nestork
wrote:


;3235749 Wrote:

Is this true, or just someone's happy dream?

Nowadays, Air Conditioning techs use an electronic leak detector to
check for refrigerant leaks. It's far more sensitive than looking for
bubbles or comparing the colour of a flame.

'leak detection'
(http://www.cpsproducts.com/site/prod...detection.html)
But if the system is empty they are, by law, not allowed to regas it
without leak checking it first - generally they draw it down and
charge with nitrogen to leak test. Ultrasonic leak detector works just
as well with nitrogen as with "freon"

Saturday was cold, about 50F. Not cold enough
to need AC. I had a call in the other direction,
so I didn't get out to the house to look at
the central AC. I'll let you all know what I
find.

When I get there.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 5/15/2014 6:29 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 5/15/2014 12:48 AM, wrote:
And no, it's not shot. But HVAC industry is full of criminals that want
to sell you a new system when the real problem is you need to change the
air filter.

That assumes the A/C company didn't ice pick the system themselves.
Was it blowing cold air before the clean and check?


I neglected to ask if he'd tried it this year. The
HO said he called for yearly maint on the system,
and they told him it was out.... and he needed to
replace the entire system. I suspect they want a
pile of money to replace a system that still can be
made to work.


After rescheduling from Saturday to Wednesday I did get
out to the house. The outdoor fan and compressor did
run, so I put a gage on the low side. Find 10" mercury.
About 4 or 5 PSI with the system not running.

I put in 20 PSI and beeped, found no obvious leaks. After
half hour or so, down to 18 PSI.

The condensor is a three ton Trane with christmas tree
coils, and filthy packed with a massive layer of dust.
Cottonwood, and what looks like pet fur. Made 9/95, so
most likely a recip compressor.

The plan for now is to clean the condensor, and try a
pound to pound and a half of R22 (system charge is 5
pounds 12 ounces) to see how it runs. Of course the
superheat will be way off the scale. But, if it doesn't
leak out, we'll consider put some more in.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 5/21/2014 8:49 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

On 5/15/2014 6:29 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 5/15/2014 12:48 AM, wrote:
And no, it's not shot. But HVAC industry is full of criminals
that want to sell you a new system when the real problem is you
need to change the air filter.

That assumes the A/C company didn't ice pick the system
themselves. Was it blowing cold air before the clean and check?


I neglected to ask if he'd tried it this year. The HO said he
called for yearly maint on the system, and they told him it was
out.... and he needed to replace the entire system. I suspect they
want a pile of money to replace a system that still can be made to
work.


After rescheduling from Saturday to Wednesday I did get out to the
house. The outdoor fan and compressor did run, so I put a gage on
the low side. Find 10" mercury. About 4 or 5 PSI with the system not
running.

I put in 20 PSI and beeped, found no obvious leaks. After half hour
or so, down to 18 PSI.

The condensor is a three ton Trane with christmas tree coils, and
filthy packed with a massive layer of dust. Cottonwood, and what
looks like pet fur. Made 9/95, so most likely a recip compressor.

The plan for now is to clean the condensor, and try a pound to pound
and a half of R22 (system charge is 5 pounds 12 ounces) to see how it
runs. Of course the superheat will be way off the scale. But, if it
doesn't leak out, we'll consider put some more in.

Trane and American Standard are like Chevy and GMC. I like them because
they're tough high quality systems with interchangeable parts. The
compressors are very good. Those Christmas tree tinsel coils can be
difficult to clean but if you spray them with foaming cleaner and allow
it to soak for 10-15 minutes, you should be able to gently, very gently
rinse the condenser coil with a fan spray from your garden hose. Like
shampoo for your hair, you might have to repeat the process. In warm
weather and the system not running, the static pressure will be around
100psi for R-22. One thing you should check is the crankcase heater
which will keep the compressor warm and help prevent liquid refrigerant
from collecting in the crankcase and causing damage to the compressor
when liquid refrigerant hits the valves and pistons which can cause
breakage. I've actually seen liquid slugging break connecting rods and
the only sound you'll hear is the whine of the motor running free under
no load inside the compressor can. ^_^

http://preview.tinyurl.com/oq5xxzp

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crankcase_heater

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9glGeGaOsE

If your Trane compressor does not have an external wraparound crankcase
heater it will probably have a ceramic cartridge heater that slips into
a well in the side of the lower section of the compressor. The heater is
like the one in the link below.

http://www.johnstonesupply.com/store...ep?pID=B11-868

TDD

On 5/22/2014 1:50 AM, The Daring Dufas wrote:

The condensor is a three ton Trane with christmas tree coils, and
filthy packed with a massive layer of dust. Cottonwood, and what
looks like pet fur. Made 9/95, so most likely a recip compressor.

The plan for now is to clean the condensor, and try a pound to pound
and a half of R22 (system charge is 5 pounds 12 ounces) to see how it
runs. Of course the superheat will be way off the scale. But, if it
doesn't leak out, we'll consider put some more in.

Trane and American Standard are like Chevy and GMC. I like them because
they're tough high quality systems with interchangeable parts. The
compressors are very good.

SM: Might be worth knowing. Thanks.

Those Christmas tree tinsel coils can be
difficult to clean but if you spray them with foaming cleaner and allow
it to soak for 10-15 minutes, you should be able to gently, very gently
rinse the condenser coil with a fan spray from your garden hose. Like
shampoo for your hair, you might have to repeat the process.

SM: I'm goinig to start with shop vac and brush. And then alki foam and
garden hose.


In warm
weather and the system not running, the static pressure will be around
100psi for R-22. One thing you should check is the crankcase heater
which will keep the compressor warm and help prevent liquid refrigerant
from collecting in the crankcase and causing damage to the compressor
when liquid refrigerant hits the valves and pistons which can cause
breakage. I've actually seen liquid slugging break connecting rods and
the only sound you'll hear is the whine of the motor running free under
no load inside the compressor can. ^_^

SM: Yes, that's a good idea. Thanks.


http://preview.tinyurl.com/oq5xxzp

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crankcase_heater

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9glGeGaOsE

If your Trane compressor does not have an external wraparound crankcase
heater it will probably have a ceramic cartridge heater that slips into
a well in the side of the lower section of the compressor. The heater is
like the one in the link below.

http://www.johnstonesupply.com/store...ep?pID=B11-868

TDD

Return to the house. Brought my brushes, shop
vac, cleaning chemicals. HO provided electricity
through a window and around. And garden hose.

Pull the unit apart. Brush and vacuum the dry coils.
Apply coil cleaner, and wait. Rinse, repeat.

Set thermostat for cooling, and weigh in 1# 8z
of R22. Suction pressure about 19 PSIG. Didn't
read the high side.

Indoors ambient 73, vents about 64.

They will run for a couple days, and see if the
freon holds. I suspect it will.

Advised customer, that's not really enough R22 to
be proper, but we'll test it for a couple days and
see if it all leaks out. Yes, I beeped for leaks.
No, I didn't find any leaks.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Thursday, May 22, 2014 10:02:51 PM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Return to the house. Brought my brushes, shop

vac, cleaning chemicals. HO provided electricity

through a window and around. And garden hose.



Pull the unit apart. Brush and vacuum the dry coils.

Apply coil cleaner, and wait. Rinse, repeat.



Set thermostat for cooling, and weigh in 1# 8z

of R22. Suction pressure about 19 PSIG. Didn't

read the high side.



Indoors ambient 73, vents about 64.



They will run for a couple days, and see if the

freon holds. I suspect it will.



Advised customer, that's not really enough R22 to

be proper, but we'll test it for a couple days and

see if it all leaks out. Yes, I beeped for leaks.

No, I didn't find any leaks.



If there are no leaks, where did all the freon go?

On 5/22/2014 10:31 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, May 22, 2014 10:02:51 PM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:

see if it all leaks out. Yes, I beeped for leaks.

No, I didn't find any leaks.



If there are no leaks, where did all the freon go?


Same place as socks in the clothes dryer,
and my ball point pens.

Since the system says on it, manufacture date
of 9/95, I suspect a slow leak some where. It's
also possible that neighborhood kids have been
huffing, or that an earlier tech let it all out.
Then, there is the leprechaun theory.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

trader_4 posted for all of us...

And I know how to SNIP


On Thursday, May 22, 2014 10:02:51 PM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Return to the house. Brought my brushes, shop

vac, cleaning chemicals. HO provided electricity

through a window and around. And garden hose.



Pull the unit apart. Brush and vacuum the dry coils.

Apply coil cleaner, and wait. Rinse, repeat.



Set thermostat for cooling, and weigh in 1# 8z

of R22. Suction pressure about 19 PSIG. Didn't

read the high side.



Indoors ambient 73, vents about 64.



They will run for a couple days, and see if the

freon holds. I suspect it will.



Advised customer, that's not really enough R22 to

be proper, but we'll test it for a couple days and

see if it all leaks out. Yes, I beeped for leaks.

No, I didn't find any leaks.



If there are no leaks, where did all the freon go?

Stormy sucked out the freezone to use in his system or sell...

--
Tekkie

On 5/15/2014 6:29 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 5/15/2014 12:48 AM, wrote:
And no, it's not shot. But HVAC industry is full of criminals that want
to sell you a new system when the real problem is you need to change the
air filter.

That assumes the A/C company didn't ice pick the system themselves.
Was it blowing cold air before the clean and check?


I neglected to ask if he'd tried it this year. The
HO said he called for yearly maint on the system,
and they told him it was out.... and he needed to
replace the entire system. I suspect they want a
pile of money to replace a system that still can be
made to work.


It's been about 10 days since I worked on the system,
and not heard from the fellow. I will call one of these
days and ask if things are well.

..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

Still running on the partial charge you put in?

On 6/3/2014 11:33 PM, wrote:
Still running on the partial charge you put in?

Not heard a word. In most cases, that means it's
fine. People usually only phone if there is a problem.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Wednesday, June 4, 2014 6:52:30 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 6/3/2014 11:33 PM, wrote:

Still running on the partial charge you put in?



Not heard a word. In most cases, that means it's

fine. People usually only phone if there is a problem.



IDK where it;s located, but many places there hasn't been
a real need for AC yet. I haven't had mine on yet this year. So, maybe they haven't run it since you left.

On 6/4/2014 9:24 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Wednesday, June 4, 2014 6:52:30 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Not heard a word. In most cases, that means it's
fine. People usually only phone if there is a problem.

IDK where it;s located, but many places there hasn't been
a real need for AC yet. I haven't had mine on yet this year. So, maybe they haven't run it since you left.


Friday June 6, 2014, I called to ask. I got a reply voice mail saying it
wasn't working all that well.

Saturday June 7, I went out and put the gages on.
The low side was six inches mercury below atmospheric.
This means the refrigerant leaked out, and it's a
high pressure side leak. I'm going to return monday
and put a little in. Close the service valves. Return
Wednesday to see if it's leaking from the indoor or
outdoor portion. Decide where to go from there.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

From that information, how could you tell the leak was on the high pressure side?

Mark

Wednesday June 11, 2014

Call the HO on phone. They (married couple) discussed,
decided to take no action at present. Roof might need
repairs, funds are short. "air conditioning is just a
comfort".


--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Wednesday, June 11, 2014 1:02:18 PM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Wednesday June 11, 2014



Call the HO on phone. They (married couple) discussed,

decided to take no action at present. Roof might need

repairs, funds are short. "air conditioning is just a

comfort".



So, I guess bottom line is the first service company wasn't scamming
and the system does have a real leak, somewhere. Didn't first company
tell the HO where the leak was, what all the problems were that lead
them to recommend a new system?

On 6/11/2014 1:15 PM, trader_4 wrote:
So, I guess bottom line is the first service company wasn't scamming
and the system does have a real leak, somewhere. Didn't first company
tell the HO where the leak was, what all the problems were that lead
them to recommend a new system?


While the system does have a leak, they were
paid to do the maintenance, and they did not
clean the outdoor unit. The HO (neither man
nor wife) said anything about finding the leak.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Wednesday, June 11, 2014 6:32:42 PM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 6/11/2014 1:15 PM, trader_4 wrote:

So, I guess bottom line is the first service company wasn't scamming

and the system does have a real leak, somewhere. Didn't first company

tell the HO where the leak was, what all the problems were that lead

them to recommend a new system?





While the system does have a leak, they were

paid to do the maintenance, and they did not

clean the outdoor unit.

Seems logical, since the system was non-operational,
they spent their time doing the investigation/diagnosis and
their opinion was that the best course of action was to replace it.


The HO (neither man

nor wife) said anything about finding the leak.


Did you ask? Maybe they were told, but they don't want
to tell the next guy to see if they get the same answer....

again,

what makes you think the leak is on the high pressure side?

I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply asking how you can tell.

Mark

On 6/12/2014 8:50 AM, trader_4 wrote:
The HO (neither man

nor wife) said anything about finding the leak.


Did you ask? Maybe they were told, but they don't want
to tell the next guy to see if they get the same answer....

Don't remember, off hand. I don't think I asked
what the first company found. HO just said the
company said it was shot and all needed replace.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 6/12/2014 9:03 AM, wrote:
what makes you think the leak is on the high pressure side?
I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply asking how you can tell.

Mark

I returned a couple days later, and put a low
side gage on. With the compressor running, the
gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a
low side leak, it would have read zero.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Thursday, June 12, 2014 11:38:46 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 6/12/2014 9:03 AM, wrote:

what makes you think the leak is on the high pressure side?

I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply asking how you can tell.



Mark



I returned a couple days later, and put a low

side gage on. With the compressor running, the

gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a

low side leak, it would have read zero.



even if it was a very slow leak?

Mark

On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 11:38:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/12/2014 9:03 AM, wrote:
what makes you think the leak is on the high pressure side?
I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply asking how you can tell.

Mark

I returned a couple days later, and put a low
side gage on. With the compressor running, the
gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a
low side leak, it would have read zero.
If it was just a tiny leak???? Don't think so.

On 6/12/2014 5:19 PM, wrote:
On Thursday, June 12, 2014 11:38:46 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 6/12/2014 9:03 AM, wrote:

what makes you think the leak is on the high pressure side?
I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply asking how you can tell.
Mark



I returned a couple days later, and put a low
side gage on. With the compressor running, the
gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a
low side leak, it would have read zero.

even if it was a very slow leak?

Mark

Yes, even if.


--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 6/12/2014 8:15 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 11:38:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/12/2014 9:03 AM, wrote:
what makes you think the leak is on the high pressure side?
I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply asking how you can tell.

Mark

I returned a couple days later, and put a low
side gage on. With the compressor running, the
gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a
low side leak, it would have read zero.
If it was just a tiny leak???? Don't think so.


OK, prove it....

I've only been servicing HVAC/R for 15 years. Maybe
I missed something?

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 20:28:47 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/12/2014 8:15 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 11:38:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/12/2014 9:03 AM, wrote:
what makes you think the leak is on the high pressure side?
I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply asking how you can tell.

Mark

I returned a couple days later, and put a low
side gage on. With the compressor running, the
gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a
low side leak, it would have read zero.
If it was just a tiny leak???? Don't think so.


OK, prove it....

I've only been servicing HVAC/R for 15 years. Maybe
I missed something?
Well, I've done a fair bit of automotive A/C repair and testing and
I've had LOTS of evaporator leaks that sure didn't produce a zero psi
reading on the low side. Not even CLOSE to zero. If they did,
troubleshooting would be a BREEZE.

On 6/12/2014 9:48 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 20:28:47 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a
low side leak, it would have read zero.
If it was just a tiny leak???? Don't think so.


OK, prove it....

I've only been servicing HVAC/R for 15 years. Maybe
I missed something?
Well, I've done a fair bit of automotive A/C repair and testing and
I've had LOTS of evaporator leaks that sure didn't produce a zero psi
reading on the low side. Not even CLOSE to zero. If they did,
troubleshooting would be a BREEZE.


I've found low side leaks end up being zero,
low side, while the compressor is running.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 22:07:39 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/12/2014 9:48 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 20:28:47 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

gage read about 8 inches mercury. If it was a
low side leak, it would have read zero.
If it was just a tiny leak???? Don't think so.


OK, prove it....

I've only been servicing HVAC/R for 15 years. Maybe
I missed something?
Well, I've done a fair bit of automotive A/C repair and testing and
I've had LOTS of evaporator leaks that sure didn't produce a zero psi
reading on the low side. Not even CLOSE to zero. If they did,
troubleshooting would be a BREEZE.


I've found low side leaks end up being zero,
low side, while the compressor is running.
With a big leak, yes - but I've found many "seepers" that read
perfect when running. Leaks so small the old halide torch couldn't
find them and electronic leak detectors have a hard time, but when you
open up the heater box and expose the evaporator, the bottom corner is
covered with oily dirt. Clean it up and squirt some soapy water on it,
and you have bubbles. 1 pound a year leaks- sometimes half a pound -
but leaks

On 6/12/2014 10:33 PM, wrote:
Well, I've done a fair bit of automotive A/C repair and testing and
I've had LOTS of evaporator leaks that sure didn't produce a zero psi
reading on the low side. Not even CLOSE to zero. If they did,
troubleshooting would be a BREEZE.


I've found low side leaks end up being zero,
low side, while the compressor is running.
With a big leak, yes - but I've found many "seepers" that read
perfect when running. Leaks so small the old halide torch couldn't
find them and electronic leak detectors have a hard time, but when you
open up the heater box and expose the evaporator, the bottom corner is
covered with oily dirt. Clean it up and squirt some soapy water on it,
and you have bubbles. 1 pound a year leaks- sometimes half a pound -
but leaks


And, eventually, the low side will read zero while
the compressor is running. Except that car AC have
a low side pressure switch.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..