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#1
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how long will old boiler last?
Here's my question stated simply:
How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? Here are the details: I've got a Utica oil-fired boiler with radiators, in a single family home. It's a Utica O.U. Series. I'd guess the boiler is roughly 35 years old. The burner on it was replaced, I think in 1995. The boiler also has copper tubes running inside it to heat the home's hot water. When a boiler fails, does it usually fail suddenly or can I limp through a season with a small leak by simply refilling the water? It doesn't seem to leak now, judging by the water level in the glass tube. I have to manually operate a valve to add water, so I'd know if the water level was noticeably declining. What happens with a sudden big leak? Does the burner then just not come on because of some overheat-sensor? If it does develop a leak, can a leak be plugged? There's one other consideration: I had it shut down from May to December of 2008. When I started it back up, all seemed fine but later I noticed a rust colored stain on the concrete floor. I believe that happened because of the sudden change in temperature. There has not been a single drop of visible leakage since that one time. When I do empty the low water shutoff every other week or so, the water that comes out is never is rusty. It is either black if the boiler's been run a lot, or else it's pretty clear otherwise. So, what should I do to try and figure if it will be good through this winter, in PA? Thanks. |
#2
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how long will old boiler last?
On Oct 25, 2:26*pm, Tom wrote:
Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? Here are the details: I've got a Utica oil-fired boiler with radiators, in a single family home.. It's a Utica O.U. Series. I'd guess the boiler is roughly 35 years old. The burner on it was replaced, I think in 1995. The boiler also has copper tubes running inside it to heat the home's hot water. When a boiler fails, does it usually fail suddenly or can I limp through a season with a small leak by simply refilling the water? It doesn't seem to leak now, judging by the water level in the glass tube. I have to manually operate a valve to add water, so I'd know if the water level was noticeably declining. What happens with a sudden big leak? Does the burner then just not come on because of some overheat-sensor? If it does develop a leak, can a leak be plugged? There's one other consideration: I had it shut down from May to December of 2008. When I started it back up, all seemed fine but later I noticed a rust colored stain on the concrete floor. I believe that happened because of the sudden change in temperature. There has not been a single drop of visible leakage since that one time. When I do empty the low water shutoff every other week or so, the water that comes out is never is rusty. It is either black if the boiler's been run a lot, or else it's pretty clear otherwise. So, what should I do to try and figure if it will be good through this winter, in PA? Thanks. Sounds like you have a steam boiler which is more forgiving with leaks as opposed to a hot water baseboard boiler which is always under 10-15 PSI of water pressure from the regulator. Generally if you have a leak below the water line, you'll know because you'll see water on the floor. And if the leak is above the water line, you'll see steam leaking out, and thus the boiler can never get up to pressure. I have seen boiler last 50 years, and I had a steam boiler that only lasted 15 years. Just turn it on and see if the pipes get hot and check for leaks. If everything checks out, your good to go |
#3
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how long will old boiler last?
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#4
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how long will old boiler last?
Tom wrote:
Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? Here are the details: I've got a Utica oil-fired boiler with radiators, in a single family home. It's a Utica O.U. Series. I'd guess the boiler is roughly 35 years old. The burner on it was replaced, I think in 1995. The boiler also has copper tubes running inside it to heat the home's hot water. When a boiler fails, does it usually fail suddenly or can I limp through a season with a small leak by simply refilling the water? It doesn't seem to leak now, judging by the water level in the glass tube. I have to manually operate a valve to add water, so I'd know if the water level was noticeably declining. What happens with a sudden big leak? Does the burner then just not come on because of some overheat-sensor? If it does develop a leak, can a leak be plugged? There's one other consideration: I had it shut down from May to December of 2008. When I started it back up, all seemed fine but later I noticed a rust colored stain on the concrete floor. I believe that happened because of the sudden change in temperature. There has not been a single drop of visible leakage since that one time. When I do empty the low water shutoff every other week or so, the water that comes out is never is rusty. It is either black if the boiler's been run a lot, or else it's pretty clear otherwise. So, what should I do to try and figure if it will be good through this winter, in PA? Thanks. It'll probably be okay. The steamboat S.S. Sultana, during it's life, had multiple leaks in its boilers. They were patched with iron plating and bolted in place. The Sultana continued serving commerce on the river with little interruption. Until three of its boilers blew up, killing an estimated 1,800 returning Civil War Union Soldiers and sinking near Memphis. |
#5
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how long will old boiler last?
On Mon, 25 Oct 2010 14:26:46 -0400, Tom wrote:
Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? No way to check unless you're a chimney shaker. If you are you, see how hard it is to drill a hole in it. Not something I'd worry about. Worse thing that can happen is you have to buy a kerosene heater or 2 until you get a new one in. Hot water boilers last a looong time. My ma replaced one because she went from coal to oil. It was maybe 50 years old. I replaced that one for her when it was 20 years old to go to NG. The one in my old house is still working and is probably 60 years old. If the water is dosed with a rust inhibitor and the fire sides are cleaned once in a while cast iron lasts a long time. The water heater part I don't know about. And I'm assuming you're talking about a boiler with cast iron water jacket, which is the only kind I've had. Hot water boilers are normally replaced to put something more efficient in, not because they leak. --Vic |
#6
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how long will old boiler last?
On Oct 25, 1:26*pm, Tom wrote:
Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? Here are the details: I've got a Utica oil-fired boiler with radiators, in a single family home.. It's a Utica O.U. Series. I'd guess the boiler is roughly 35 years old. The burner on it was replaced, I think in 1995. The boiler also has copper tubes running inside it to heat the home's hot water. When a boiler fails, does it usually fail suddenly or can I limp through a season with a small leak by simply refilling the water? It doesn't seem to leak now, judging by the water level in the glass tube. I have to manually operate a valve to add water, so I'd know if the water level was noticeably declining. What happens with a sudden big leak? Does the burner then just not come on because of some overheat-sensor? If it does develop a leak, can a leak be plugged? There's one other consideration: I had it shut down from May to December of 2008. When I started it back up, all seemed fine but later I noticed a rust colored stain on the concrete floor. I believe that happened because of the sudden change in temperature. There has not been a single drop of visible leakage since that one time. When I do empty the low water shutoff every other week or so, the water that comes out is never is rusty. It is either black if the boiler's been run a lot, or else it's pretty clear otherwise. So, what should I do to try and figure if it will be good through this winter, in PA? Thanks. For just boiler pros post at www.heatinghelp.com I have a 55yr old Kewanee that is now looking shot, but it has been flooded in summer many times. Old Kewanee commercial boilers were made to be repaired but I have no idea on the construction of your unit. If its hot water heat you might save 20-35% on a new condensing boiler, if its steam savings will be less but you could sav e 20% easily, so energy savings should be something you should look into, not just how long will it last. |
#7
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how long will old boiler last?
"Tom" wrote in message ... Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? Here are the details: I've got a Utica oil-fired boiler with radiators, in a single family home. It's a Utica O.U. Series. I'd guess the boiler is roughly 35 years old. The burner on it was replaced, I think in 1995. The boiler also has copper tubes running inside it to heat the home's hot water. When a boiler fails, does it usually fail suddenly or can I limp through a season with a small leak by simply refilling the water? It doesn't seem to leak now, judging by the water level in the glass tube. I have to manually operate a valve to add water, so I'd know if the water level was noticeably declining. What happens with a sudden big leak? Does the burner then just not come on because of some overheat-sensor? If it does develop a leak, can a leak be plugged? There's one other consideration: I had it shut down from May to December of 2008. When I started it back up, all seemed fine but later I noticed a rust colored stain on the concrete floor. I believe that happened because of the sudden change in temperature. There has not been a single drop of visible leakage since that one time. When I do empty the low water shutoff every other week or so, the water that comes out is never is rusty. It is either black if the boiler's been run a lot, or else it's pretty clear otherwise. So, what should I do to try and figure if it will be good through this winter, in PA? Thanks. The only thing on it with moving parts is the burner, and you've replaced that. It's 35 years old, no autofill, probably no low water cutoff, it's really unlikely to suddenly have a catastrophic crack. I certainly wouldn't lose sleep over it. |
#8
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how long will old boiler last?
Vic Smith wrote: On Mon, 25 Oct 2010 14:26:46 -0400, Tom wrote: Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? No way to check unless you're a chimney shaker. If you are you, see how hard it is to drill a hole in it. Not something I'd worry about. Worse thing that can happen is you have to buy a kerosene heater or 2 until you get a new one in. Hot water boilers last a looong time. My ma replaced one because she went from coal to oil. It was maybe 50 years old. I replaced that one for her when it was 20 years old to go to NG. The one in my old house is still working and is probably 60 years old. If the water is dosed with a rust inhibitor and the fire sides are cleaned once in a while cast iron lasts a long time. The water heater part I don't know about. And I'm assuming you're talking about a boiler with cast iron water jacket, which is the only kind I've had. It's the common tankless DHW coil inside the boiler jacket. When those die, typically due to hard water deposits and corrosion in them, you either replace them if the part is available or switch to an indirect fired DHW tank setup. Hot water boilers are normally replaced to put something more efficient in, not because they leak. Yes, and if it is a good quality boiler and already had a burner replacement in 1995 it's going to be running pretty close to the efficiency of a new until already if it's in proper tune. |
#9
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how long will old boiler last?
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#10
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how long will old boiler last?
On 10/26/2010 8:25 AM, Pete C. wrote:
Vic Smith wrote: On Mon, 25 Oct 2010 14:26:46 -0400, Tom wrote: Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? [snipped] It's the common tankless DHW coil inside the boiler jacket. When those die, typically due to hard water deposits and corrosion in them, you either replace them if the part is available or switch to an indirect fired DHW tank setup. First off, thanks to everybody for all the great replies. I'll probably see if I make it through this season and then maybe switch to a gas boiler next year. Yes, it is steam heat here. I'm getting frazzled looking at pages for "indirect DHW setup" quoted above, even this brochu http://www.amtrol.com/pdf/BoilermateMC10009low.pdf but nobody explains what exactly it is. It's apparently a separate tank, rather than having the coils right in the boiler primary water - but where does it go? How does it attach to or connect with the boiler? Thanks again, I learned a lot. |
#11
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how long will old boiler last?
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#12
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how long will old boiler last?
Tom wrote: On 10/26/2010 8:25 AM, Pete C. wrote: Vic Smith wrote: On Mon, 25 Oct 2010 14:26:46 -0400, Tom wrote: Here's my question stated simply: How long do boilers generally last? I'm trying to determine if the one in my home will last through this coming heating season. Is there any way to check besides looking for leaks? [snipped] It's the common tankless DHW coil inside the boiler jacket. When those die, typically due to hard water deposits and corrosion in them, you either replace them if the part is available or switch to an indirect fired DHW tank setup. First off, thanks to everybody for all the great replies. I'll probably see if I make it through this season and then maybe switch to a gas boiler next year. Yes, it is steam heat here. I'm getting frazzled looking at pages for "indirect DHW setup" quoted above, even this brochu http://www.amtrol.com/pdf/BoilermateMC10009low.pdf but nobody explains what exactly it is. It's apparently a separate tank, rather than having the coils right in the boiler primary water - but where does it go? How does it attach to or connect with the boiler? Thanks again, I learned a lot. Indirect fired DHW tanks are separate highly insulated hot water tanks, much like a standalone water heater. Instead of having a burner or electric heater, they have a heat exchanger coil which is plumbed into the existing boiler like an additional zone. They work quite well, but the tankless DHW coils are common, cheaper and also work pretty well. If you are looking to replace the boiler, be sure to do an accurate comparison of your options. Don't fall for the common ploy of comparing a new gas boiler to an obsolete oil boiler. Compare apples to apples, i.e. a new gas boiler of a given quality level to a new oil boiler of a given quality level. Also include in your comparison items such as monthly service charges for gas service, annual maintenance costs, etc. along with the cost per BTU for each fuel. If you're looking at a system replacement you should also look at the big picture and include in your comparison a change to a heat pump (air or ground source as appropriate) which would give you both heating and cooling. Installing ductwork is an added expense, but there are some decent options there depending on the structure, and in replacing a boiler you might well switch to hydronic instead of steam which would entail replacing radiators. You certainly don't appear to have any time pressure, so you have plenty of time to research the options and if you decide to make a change, make it during the cheaper off season. |
#13
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how long will old boiler last?
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#14
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how long will old boiler last?
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#15
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how long will old boiler last?
"Tom" wrote in message Does anybody make an indirect DHW that uses the boiler to heat the DHW during the cold season, but has a secondary heater (electric or gas) for the warm weather when the boiler isn't being used? NO, because it is not needed. New boilers are very efficient and even in summer will be cheap to operate for DHW. My boiler is oil and is much cheaper than electric and has more capacity than a stand alone gas heater. If no water is needed, it will not run at all for days since the storage tank is well insulated. A heat exchanger moves the heat to the water tank. An efficient system moves virtually all the heat from the boiler to the tank too. . Here's another wrinkle regarding gas vs oil: two years ago, the oil burner one afternoon just didn't come on, even though the thermostat was calling for heat. It did fire up again once I'd hit the reset - but what if I was away for a few days? That could have been the nightmare scenario of a burst pipe (even in the short section between where the water supply enters the house and the house's main shutoff valve). Btw, the service guy that came a week later didn't have any explanation as to how/why the burner failed to light. But he did say that oil was less reliable in that way than gas. My old boiler used to do that at time, the new one not at all, at least not yet. Oil is more prone to go out on the reset than gas from my experience. If you don't get ignition for any one a a myriad of reasons, it trips for safety. Pump did not pump enough, igniter did not spark well enough, a piece of carbon got across the tip of the igniter, etc. That said, any heater with any fuel has the potential to break. |
#16
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how long will old boiler last?
On 11/8/2010 11:16 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
Here's another wrinkle regarding gas vs oil: two years ago, the oil burner one afternoon just didn't come on, even though the thermostat was calling for heat. It did fire up again once I'd hit the reset - but what if I was away for a few days? That could have been the nightmare scenario of a burst pipe (even in the short section between where the water supply enters the house and the house's main shutoff valve). Btw, the service guy that came a week later didn't have any explanation as to how/why the burner failed to light. But he did say that oil was less reliable in that way than gas. My old boiler used to do that at time, the new one not at all, at least not yet. Oil is more prone to go out on the reset than gas from my experience. If you don't get ignition for any one a a myriad of reasons, it trips for safety. Pump did not pump enough, igniter did not spark well enough, a piece of carbon got across the tip of the igniter, etc. Thanks. One thing I hadn't mentioned was that there was no smell of oil after the failure to ignite incident. (I did swivel open the hatch at the time, and I'd suppose it'd take a while for fuel oil to evaporate from the closed chamber up the chimney.) So I'd guess that tends to argue against lack of spark. Yet why would it not pump oil during the failed instance, but then start right up later? I suppose it's possible that the burner motor wasn't getting electricity momentarily, but the sensing-controlling circuits were... There had been one occasion a couple of years previous, where the burner wouldn't run at all until I'd removed certain wires and re-attached them to their terminals. It is a damp cellar, too. |
#17
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how long will old boiler last?
"Tom" wrote Thanks. One thing I hadn't mentioned was that there was no smell of oil after the failure to ignite incident. (I did swivel open the hatch at the time, and I'd suppose it'd take a while for fuel oil to evaporate from the closed chamber up the chimney.) So I'd guess that tends to argue against lack of spark. It may not smell, especially if there was a time lag before you noticed it. If it happens again, just reach in and rub the electrode with your finger and it may start. All it takes is a hairline piece of carbon from tip to ground to stop it from firing. |
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