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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

Hello,

I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.

Photos he

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that (if
indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?

Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit? (There
were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today). My hope is
that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.

Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

Chris.
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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

Hello,

I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.

Photos he

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that (if
indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?

Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit? (There
were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today). My hope is
that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.

Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.



*If you have water dripping from the ceiling it sounds as though there are
other issues going on that need to be addressed first. Maybe you have a
roof leak which is causing the ceiling to flex and thus causing the crack.

There is at least one hand tool available for removing grout. Dremel has a
grout removal attachment for their tools.

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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

On Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:26:37 -0700 (PDT), rank beginner
wrote:

Hello,

I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.

Photos he

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that (if
indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?

Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit? (There
were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today). My hope is
that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.

Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

Chris.



Correct the moisture issue before doing anything with the crack.
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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

On Jul 28, 10:26*pm, rank beginner wrote:

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg

Should I regrout the whole cracked area?


Probably.

If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first?


Or the greatest portion of it.

What would be the best way to do that (if
indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?


The Dremel. The grout removal tool/bit works great.

Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit?


Probably not.

You could just patch it with caulk, with or without "real" prep.

The underlying issue is what caused it to crack, probably related to
the substrate material/installation but maybe also what goes on in the
room overhead (if any).

If they're practicing martial arts up there, etc., enough flex may
have been induced to cause the crack.
-----

- gpsman
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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

rank beginner wrote:
Hello,

I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.

Photos he

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that (if
indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?

Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit? (There
were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today). My hope is
that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.

Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.


The grout is cracked because the ceiling is moving; could be moving
laterally, could be moving down.

If you had drips from the ceiling tile, moisture *has* entered the
ceiling...those drips didn't get there from the shower (unless you are an
extremely frenetic showerer). It is most likely the water that is causing
the ceiling to move.

The first thing to do is locate the source of the water. If an attic is
above the shower, check the roof; if not or if you have plumbing above the
shower, check it too.

Next, fix the source of the leak.

Next, you need to make the ceiling that is under the tile sound once again.
I assume it is drywall? Drywall - even "moisture resistant" drywall - and
water do not play nice together. If it were me, I'd remove all ceiling tile
and replace the drywall. Again, if it were me, I'd not replace tile on the
ceiling...the tile isn't all that heavy but it is pulling the drywall
downward against the screw/nail heads. Drywall isn't all that strong to
begin with and - especially with a bit of moisture - the weight of the tile
would tend to pull the fastener head further into the drywall causing the
ceiling to sag slightly, sag cracking grout.



--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico





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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

dadiOH wrote:
rank beginner wrote:
Hello,

I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.

Photos he

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that
(if indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?

Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit?
(There were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today).
My hope is that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.

Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.


The grout is cracked because the ceiling is moving; could be moving
laterally, could be moving down.

If you had drips from the ceiling tile, moisture *has* entered the
ceiling...those drips didn't get there from the shower (unless you
are an extremely frenetic showerer). It is most likely the water
that is causing the ceiling to move.

The first thing to do is locate the source of the water. If an attic
is above the shower, check the roof; if not or if you have plumbing
above the shower, check it too.

Next, fix the source of the leak.

Next, you need to make the ceiling that is under the tile sound once
again. I assume it is drywall? Drywall - even "moisture resistant"
drywall - and water do not play nice together. If it were me, I'd
remove all ceiling tile and replace the drywall. Again, if it were
me, I'd not replace tile on the ceiling...the tile isn't all that
heavy but it is pulling the drywall downward against the screw/nail
heads. Drywall isn't all that strong to begin with and - especially
with a bit of moisture - the weight of the tile would tend to pull
the fastener head further into the drywall causing the ceiling to sag
slightly, sag cracking grout.


Yes, for a gap that big something is moving, either sideways to open the
gap -- not likely, or vertically. Lay a straightedge on the ceiling and you
will probably see that the ceiling is sagging -- the lowest point at the
crack. Do you know what material was used for the ceiling, as mentioned
above drywall or even any other gypsum product is bad news anywhere in a
shower. I would wager that there is also a seam in the backing material very
close and parallel to the crack. You may have to drop the ceiling and re-do
it with cement board and some new tiles.

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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

On Jul 29, 11:51*am, "EXT" wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
rank beginner wrote:
Hello,


I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.


Photos he


http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg


http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that
(if indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?


Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit?
(There were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today).
My hope is that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.


Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.


The grout is cracked because the ceiling is moving; could be moving
laterally, could be moving down.


If you had drips from the ceiling tile, moisture *has* entered the
ceiling...those drips didn't get there from the shower (unless you
are an extremely frenetic showerer). *It is most likely the water
that is causing the ceiling to move.


The first thing to do is locate the source of the water. *If an attic
is above the shower, check the roof; if not or if you have plumbing
above the shower, check it too.


Next, fix the source of the leak.


Next, you need to make the ceiling that is under the tile sound once
again. I assume it is drywall? *Drywall - even "moisture resistant"
drywall - and water do not play nice together. *If it were me, I'd
remove all ceiling tile and replace the drywall. *Again, if it were
me, I'd not replace tile on the ceiling...the tile isn't all that
heavy but it is pulling the drywall downward against the screw/nail
heads. *Drywall isn't all that strong to begin with and - especially
with a bit of moisture - the weight of the tile would tend to pull
the fastener head further into the drywall causing the ceiling to sag
slightly, sag cracking grout.


Yes, for a gap that big something is moving, either sideways to open the
gap -- not likely, or vertically. Lay a straightedge on the ceiling and you
will probably see that the ceiling is sagging -- the lowest point at the
crack. Do you know what material was used for the ceiling, as mentioned
above drywall or even any other gypsum product is bad news anywhere in a
shower. I would wager that there is also a seam in the backing material very
close and parallel to the crack. You may have to drop the ceiling and re-do
it with cement board and some new tiles.



Thank you to everyone for your suggestions.
They have helped considerably in finding a solution
to this.

A few things I'd like to point out/mention, though:

• I'm almost certain the water I saw dripping out
was not because of a roof leak. First, the bathroom is
on the ground level of the house (we expanded a
half-bath to a full bath in the dwonstairs rec room),
so there is no roof to the exterior anywhere near
the ceiling of the bathroom. Immediately above
the shower is the subfloor of the kitchen.

• The water probably got into the cracks in the grout and started
dripping perhaps through steam from the hot water when showering.
Since the shower ceiling is quite low (little over 6 ft.), the water/
steam
does not have far to travel. It's possible that the steam penetrated
the crack
in the grout, and then later, cooled down and condensed back into
water.
The drip-drip only lasted for a minute or two, and it started several
hours after
I had showered in it. This fact is what leads me to think that steam
is getting
behind the tiles in the ceiling and then later condensing once the
temperature drops.

• Yes, there is drywall behind
the tiled walls and ceiling of the shower.

• As far as lateral or vertical movement
above the shower ceiling maybe being the cause - this is where I've
deduced, thanks to your helpful replies, the root of the problem:
New hardwood floors were installed 2 years ago, and the old floor tile
was ripped out, and other significant
construction was done in the kitchen during the summer of '07,
including installing cabinets
against the wall right above where the downstairs shower is. The new
cabinets
that replaced the old ones now house a pretty heavy microwave and
regular
oven built into the cabinetry. Before the kitchen renovation, by that
wall (which is right above
the shower), there was an old refrigerator that was leaky. At one
point, before I got rid
of it, it would leak water onto the carpet and at one point it seeped
down into the subflooring. I subsequently had
to replace a section of the sublfoor with new plywood, but that's
another story. To sum up, that section of the
kitchen floor was never quite the same, even with the new plywood.
While they were doing the kitchen reno, I had a chance
to check out the repair job I did with the subfloor (about a 2 sq. ft.
area). Well, it was holding up, but the floor still "gave" a bit and
had some sag, especially if you walked over it and put your weight a
bit over it. So, I've come to the conclusion that this is
the cause of the drywall sagging and the grout cracking.

• What gives even more support to this is the fact that I took a
straightedge to the tiled ceiling and indeed
the lowest point of the sag is exactly where the cracked grout runs.
So I think this adds further weight
to the theory that the compromised subfloor and all the activity in
the kitchen is what has made
the drywall move and the grout crack.

• Fixing this is the right way, i.e., taking the ceiling tile out,
replacing the drywall with cement board
and replacing with new tile, is beyond my $$ means, as well beyond my
own skill level. I'll just have
to settle for redoing the grout. I don't have a dremel, so I will
consider getting a hold of one with
the appropriate attachment, if you think it's worth it. I wonder how
much a secondhand dremel
with the attachment can be had for? I'll check eBay for one.

Whew...got some work to do.

Thanks again for your quick replies and excellent suggestions/advice.

Chris
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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower


"rank beginner" wrote in message
...
On Jul 29, 11:51 am, "EXT" wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
rank beginner wrote:
Hello,


I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.


Photos he


http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_01.jpg


http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...alltile_02.jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that
(if indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?


Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit?
(There were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today).
My hope is that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.


Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.


The grout is cracked because the ceiling is moving; could be moving
laterally, could be moving down.


If you had drips from the ceiling tile, moisture *has* entered the
ceiling...those drips didn't get there from the shower (unless you
are an extremely frenetic showerer). It is most likely the water
that is causing the ceiling to move.


The first thing to do is locate the source of the water. If an attic
is above the shower, check the roof; if not or if you have plumbing
above the shower, check it too.


Next, fix the source of the leak.


Next, you need to make the ceiling that is under the tile sound once
again. I assume it is drywall? Drywall - even "moisture resistant"
drywall - and water do not play nice together. If it were me, I'd
remove all ceiling tile and replace the drywall. Again, if it were
me, I'd not replace tile on the ceiling...the tile isn't all that
heavy but it is pulling the drywall downward against the screw/nail
heads. Drywall isn't all that strong to begin with and - especially
with a bit of moisture - the weight of the tile would tend to pull
the fastener head further into the drywall causing the ceiling to sag
slightly, sag cracking grout.


Yes, for a gap that big something is moving, either sideways to open the
gap -- not likely, or vertically. Lay a straightedge on the ceiling and
you
will probably see that the ceiling is sagging -- the lowest point at the
crack. Do you know what material was used for the ceiling, as mentioned
above drywall or even any other gypsum product is bad news anywhere in a
shower. I would wager that there is also a seam in the backing material
very
close and parallel to the crack. You may have to drop the ceiling and
re-do
it with cement board and some new tiles.



Thank you to everyone for your suggestions.
They have helped considerably in finding a solution
to this.

A few things I'd like to point out/mention, though:

• I'm almost certain the water I saw dripping out
was not because of a roof leak. First, the bathroom is
on the ground level of the house (we expanded a
half-bath to a full bath in the dwonstairs rec room),
so there is no roof to the exterior anywhere near
the ceiling of the bathroom. Immediately above
the shower is the subfloor of the kitchen.

• The water probably got into the cracks in the grout and started
dripping perhaps through steam from the hot water when showering.
Since the shower ceiling is quite low (little over 6 ft.), the water/
steam
does not have far to travel. It's possible that the steam penetrated
the crack
in the grout, and then later, cooled down and condensed back into
water.
The drip-drip only lasted for a minute or two, and it started several
hours after
I had showered in it. This fact is what leads me to think that steam
is getting
behind the tiles in the ceiling and then later condensing once the
temperature drops.

• Yes, there is drywall behind
the tiled walls and ceiling of the shower.

• As far as lateral or vertical movement
above the shower ceiling maybe being the cause - this is where I've
deduced, thanks to your helpful replies, the root of the problem:
New hardwood floors were installed 2 years ago, and the old floor tile
was ripped out, and other significant
construction was done in the kitchen during the summer of '07,
including installing cabinets
against the wall right above where the downstairs shower is. The new
cabinets
that replaced the old ones now house a pretty heavy microwave and
regular
oven built into the cabinetry. Before the kitchen renovation, by that
wall (which is right above
the shower), there was an old refrigerator that was leaky. At one
point, before I got rid
of it, it would leak water onto the carpet and at one point it seeped
down into the subflooring. I subsequently had
to replace a section of the sublfoor with new plywood, but that's
another story. To sum up, that section of the
kitchen floor was never quite the same, even with the new plywood.
While they were doing the kitchen reno, I had a chance
to check out the repair job I did with the subfloor (about a 2 sq. ft.
area). Well, it was holding up, but the floor still "gave" a bit and
had some sag, especially if you walked over it and put your weight a
bit over it. So, I've come to the conclusion that this is
the cause of the drywall sagging and the grout cracking.

• What gives even more support to this is the fact that I took a
straightedge to the tiled ceiling and indeed
the lowest point of the sag is exactly where the cracked grout runs.
So I think this adds further weight
to the theory that the compromised subfloor and all the activity in
the kitchen is what has made
the drywall move and the grout crack.

• Fixing this is the right way, i.e., taking the ceiling tile out,
replacing the drywall with cement board
and replacing with new tile, is beyond my $$ means, as well beyond my
own skill level. I'll just have
to settle for redoing the grout. I don't have a dremel, so I will
consider getting a hold of one with
the appropriate attachment, if you think it's worth it. I wonder how
much a secondhand dremel
with the attachment can be had for? I'll check eBay for one.

Whew...got some work to do.

Thanks again for your quick replies and excellent suggestions/advice.

Chris

That being the case , I'd just caulk it with colored caulk to match the
grout or use clear silicon caulk untill you can fix it right...Trying to get
the old grout out re-grouting or other wise messing with it will probably
make it worse and may even knock some tiles off....Even if your very
carefull and do re-grout it without making it worse it will just crack
again....Start saving your pennies.....I bet the "leaky fridg" was the start
of it all....

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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

rank beginner wrote:

• I'm almost certain the water I saw dripping out
was not because of a roof leak. First, the bathroom is
on the ground level of the house (we expanded a
half-bath to a full bath in the dwonstairs rec room),
so there is no roof to the exterior anywhere near
the ceiling of the bathroom. Immediately above
the shower is the subfloor of the kitchen.


OK, forget the roof
___________

• The water probably got into the cracks in the grout and started
dripping perhaps through steam from the hot water when showering.
Since the shower ceiling is quite low (little over 6 ft.), the water/
steam
does not have far to travel. It's possible that the steam penetrated
the crack
in the grout, and then later, cooled down and condensed back into
water.
The drip-drip only lasted for a minute or two, and it started several
hours after
I had showered in it. This fact is what leads me to think that steam
is getting
behind the tiles in the ceiling and then later condensing once the
temperature drops.


The water isn't from steam.

Check your kitchen for leaks...sink, dishwasher, fridge ice maker supply
line, etc.

Check the plumbing that comes to the shower. The unseen, plumbing, that is.
May come from the kitchen which means it would be in the shower overhead
space. Also, check all drains - the hidden part - in the kitchen. You
really need a plumber.
________________

• What gives even more support to this is the fact that I took a
straightedge to the tiled ceiling and indeed
the lowest point of the sag is exactly where the cracked grout runs.
So I think this adds further weight
to the theory that the compromised subfloor and all the activity in
the kitchen is what has made
the drywall move and the grout crack.


Your kitchen subfloor isn't affecting the ceiling of your shower below the
kitchen as that subfloor is supported by the structure to which it and the
shower ceiling are attached. If that structure is sagging/moving/rotted you
have problems W A Y Y Y Y beyond cracked grout in your shower.
____________

• Fixing this is the right way, i.e., taking the ceiling tile out,
replacing the drywall with cement board
and replacing with new tile, is beyond my $$ means, as well beyond my
own skill level. I'll just have
to settle for redoing the grout.


Your choice but it won't last. Nothing will last until you first find and
repair the source of the leak.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico



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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

dadiOH wrote:
rank beginner wrote:

• I'm almost certain the water I saw dripping out
was not because of a roof leak. First, the bathroom is
on the ground level of the house (we expanded a
half-bath to a full bath in the dwonstairs rec room),
so there is no roof to the exterior anywhere near
the ceiling of the bathroom. Immediately above
the shower is the subfloor of the kitchen.


OK, forget the roof
___________

• The water probably got into the cracks in the grout and started
dripping perhaps through steam from the hot water when showering.
Since the shower ceiling is quite low (little over 6 ft.), the
water/ steam
does not have far to travel. It's possible that the steam penetrated
the crack
in the grout, and then later, cooled down and condensed back into
water.
The drip-drip only lasted for a minute or two, and it started several
hours after
I had showered in it. This fact is what leads me to think that steam
is getting
behind the tiles in the ceiling and then later condensing once the
temperature drops.


The water isn't from steam.


Here's a way you could check...

1. Tape a few layers of newspaper over all the grout crack
2. Tape a piece of plastic or aluminum foil over the newspaper so it is
completely sealed.
3. Don't use the shower for a week. You need a fairly lengthy period of
non-useage as the leak appears to be small and intermittent and may occur
only under a particular set of circumstances...using both dishwasher and
sink at the same time, for example. If there should be a leak in the drain
line, it might only occur when the line is totally filled with water.
4. Remove plastic and newspaper. Is the newspaper damp? Then you
*know* the leak is overhead of the shower...either from kitchen supply or
drain lines or from shower supply line to the mixing valve; if the paper is
bone dry, you can be reasonably - but not totally - sure none of those are
leaking.

If no moisture from above, tape up paper and plastic again and run the
shower - both hot and cold - for 10 minutes or so; keep the temperature
minimal so you don't get steam. Check the paper again after another 15
minutes or so. Damp? If so, the leak is in the shower supply line between
mixing valve and outlet.

If the paper is still dry, run the shower again for 10 minutes or so but run
it hot so you get lots of steam then quickly wipe down the shower ceiling so
it is dry and tape up paper & plastic again. Wait a couple of hours then
remove the paper. Dry? I thought so and that means that stem isn't wafting
up into lord knows where and then later condensing.

If you do all of the above and the paper is never damp it probably means you
have no leaks but do have rodents with uncontrollable bladders

--

dadiOH
____________________________

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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower



• Fixing this is the right way, i.e., taking the ceiling tile out,
replacing the drywall with cement board
and replacing with new tile, is beyond my $$ means, as well beyond my
own skill level. I'll just have
to settle for redoing the grout.

It is quite simple and cheap to just fix the ceiling. If you can re-grout
you can install tiles. A sheet of cement board is under $20.00, screws
$5.00, tiles: well you can spend lots but also get some very reasonably
priced ones on sale at $1.00 to $2.00 per square foot. Adhesive (but
thin-set mortar is better, and grout will cost under $30.00. Of course,
there are the hidden costs that you find when you remove the ceiling and
examine what is behind the problem.

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Default what to do with cracked grout on ceiling in shower

On Jul 29, 9:30*pm, rank beginner wrote:
On Jul 29, 11:51*am, "EXT" wrote:



dadiOH wrote:
rank beginner wrote:
Hello,


I had a new shower with tiled walls and ceiling put in about 5 years
ago. This year the grout in one specific row of tiles on the ceiling
is really starting to crack. This started last year as a hairline
crack in the grout along the entire length of the row of tiles. Now
the crack has widened and I must do something to repair it ASAP. The
thing is, I'm not sure what it is that should be done.


Photos he


http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...lltile_01..jpg


http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/b...lltile_02..jpg


Should I regrout the whole cracked area? If so, should all the old
grout be scraped out first? What would be the best way to do that
(if indeed that is what I should do)? Tools?


Also, is it a problem if water has seeped into the crack a bit?
(There were drips from the ceiling tile where the crack is today).
My hope is that no permanent moisture has entered the ceiling.


Any and all help or advice is greatly appreciated.


The grout is cracked because the ceiling is moving; could be moving
laterally, could be moving down.


If you had drips from the ceiling tile, moisture *has* entered the
ceiling...those drips didn't get there from the shower (unless you
are an extremely frenetic showerer). *It is most likely the water
that is causing the ceiling to move.


The first thing to do is locate the source of the water. *If an attic
is above the shower, check the roof; if not or if you have plumbing
above the shower, check it too.


Next, fix the source of the leak.


Next, you need to make the ceiling that is under the tile sound once
again. I assume it is drywall? *Drywall - even "moisture resistant"
drywall - and water do not play nice together. *If it were me, I'd
remove all ceiling tile and replace the drywall. *Again, if it were
me, I'd not replace tile on the ceiling...the tile isn't all that
heavy but it is pulling the drywall downward against the screw/nail
heads. *Drywall isn't all that strong to begin with and - especially
with a bit of moisture - the weight of the tile would tend to pull
the fastener head further into the drywall causing the ceiling to sag
slightly, sag cracking grout.


Yes, for a gap that big something is moving, either sideways to open the
gap -- not likely, or vertically. Lay a straightedge on the ceiling and you
will probably see that the ceiling is sagging -- the lowest point at the
crack. Do you know what material was used for the ceiling, as mentioned
above drywall or even any other gypsum product is bad news anywhere in a
shower. I would wager that there is also a seam in the backing material very
close and parallel to the crack. You may have to drop the ceiling and re-do
it with cement board and some new tiles.


Thank you to everyone for your suggestions.
They have helped considerably in finding a solution
to this.

A few things I'd like to point out/mention, though:

• *I'm almost certain the water I saw dripping out
was not because of a roof leak. First, the bathroom is
on the ground level of the house (we expanded a
half-bath to a full bath in the dwonstairs rec room),
so there is no roof to the exterior anywhere near
the ceiling of the bathroom. Immediately above
the shower is the subfloor of the kitchen.

• The water probably got into the cracks in the grout and started
dripping perhaps through steam from the hot water when showering.
Since the shower ceiling is quite low (little over *6 ft.), the water/
steam
does not have far to travel. It's possible that the steam penetrated
the crack
in the grout, and then later, cooled down and condensed back into
water.
The drip-drip only lasted for a minute or two, and it started several
hours after
I had showered in it. This fact is what leads me to think that steam
is getting
behind the tiles in the ceiling and then later condensing once the
temperature drops.

• Yes, there is drywall behind
the tiled walls and ceiling of the shower.

• As far as lateral or vertical movement
above the shower ceiling maybe being the cause - this is where I've
deduced, thanks to your helpful replies, the root of the problem:
New hardwood floors were installed 2 years ago, and the old floor tile
was ripped out, and other significant
construction was done in the kitchen during the summer of '07,
including installing cabinets
against the wall right above where the downstairs shower is. The new
cabinets
that replaced the old ones now house a pretty heavy microwave and
regular
oven built into the cabinetry. Before the kitchen renovation, by that
wall (which is right above
the shower), there was an old refrigerator that was leaky. At one
point, before I got rid
of it, it would leak water onto the carpet and at one point it seeped
down into the subflooring. I subsequently had
to replace a section of the sublfoor with new plywood, but that's
another story. To sum up, that section of the
kitchen floor was never quite the same, even with the new plywood.
While they were doing the kitchen reno, I had a chance
to check out the repair job I did with the subfloor (about a 2 sq. ft.
area). Well, it was holding up, but the floor still "gave" a bit and
had some sag, especially if you walked over it and put your weight a
bit over it. So, I've come to the conclusion that this is
the cause of the drywall sagging and the grout cracking.

• What gives even more support to this is the fact that I took a
straightedge to the tiled ceiling and indeed
the lowest point of the sag is exactly where the cracked grout runs.
So I think this adds further weight
to the theory that the compromised subfloor and all the activity in
the kitchen is what has made
the drywall move and the grout crack.

• Fixing this is the right way, i.e., taking the ceiling tile out,
replacing the drywall with cement board
and replacing with new tile, is beyond my $$ means, as well beyond my
own skill level. I'll just have
to settle for redoing the grout. I don't have a dremel, so I will
consider getting a hold of one with
the appropriate attachment, if you think it's worth it. I wonder how
much a secondhand dremel
with the attachment can be had for? I'll check eBay for one.

Whew...got some work to do.

Thanks again for your quick replies and excellent suggestions/advice.


When you mention money in connection with doing it the right way,
that's a bit misleading. You should be thinking "doing it the safe
way".

Tile on a drywall ceiling in a shower is a bad situation to start
with. You have a very substantial crack in the grout and it's obvious
that you lost a fair bit of grout there. This leads me to believe
that the grout job is faulty as well.

You have heavy and hard material suspended overhead, place on an
unsuitable substrate and with questionable installation. The most
likely time for that tile to fall would be while the shower is in use
- shower door opening and closing and more moisture being absorbed by
the drywall. That is not a safe situation.

Do not put a bandaid on something that needs surgery. Tiling a
ceiling is not the thing I'd want a beginner to learn tiling on, but
it is doable. Check out the John Bridge tile forums - they're very
knowledgeable and will be able to walk you though the work if you
decide to do it yourself.

At the very least you should pick up the phone and get a couple of
prices from some qualified contractors, not your run-of-the-mill
handyman who may or may not know tile work all that well.

R
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