The patient: GE Profile side-by-side, about a dozen years old, no fancy
electronic controls that I am aware of

The symptoms: Nice and cold on the freezer side. Barely cooling on the
refrigerator side

Direct Cause: Poor air flow. The control damper appears open and no
connecting vents are blocked.

Previously based on reading some online advice I was given to suspecting
that the defrost system (timer, heater, kill-thermostat) may have been
faulty and allowed the evap to fill with ice and block airflow.

I finally was able to clear out all the food from the freezer side,
remove the shelves, shelf rails, and various rear covers. Bottome line
is that the evaporator is *not* plugged with ice so that was a dead end.

However I did notice that the circulating fan inside the rear of the
freezer sometimes doesn't come on when the compressor and condensor fan
do. I presume these always run together. Also sometimes it seems to
spin sluggishly.

So now I am definitely on to something. When it wasn't turning I could
get it going by giving it a push by hand.

But here is where I am still a little puzzled and may need advice:

So far as I could tell by turning it, the fan turns completely freely.
So it's not like it's bound up. It spins freely and you can feel a
little "cogging" effect from magnetic interaction. This is one of those
small induction motors where there is a single coil offset to one side in
the magnetic structure and has just a simple rotor. And you could feel
that the power was on.

So why would it not start or run sluggishly? It's getting power and it's
able to spin freely...what more is there? If friction was high I should
be able to feel it. And if power wasn't there or the coil was
intermittent that would be apparent too. I don't get this sluggish
business.

So I wonder if replacing the motor would even cure it. Before I do that
I wonder if it's not getting full voltage for some reason. As I said so
far as I know this fridge has no electronics. Could there be some
provision for regulating fan speed? This isn't the kind of motor that
you'd do that via controlling the voltage anyway. And if it's turned on
via the same thermostat switch contacts that turn on the compressor then
it can't be that some contacts somewhere are bad giving it poor voltage.

I think before I go ordering a new fan I should see if I can connect it
directly to AC and eliminate any issues with the power getting to it.

Speaking of fans I temporarily put a muffin fan inside the fridge side
under the inlet damper to pull more air in (I cable-tied it in place) so
I can maintain proper temp on that side until this is all resolved.
That's working well for now but I still need to fix this thing.

"Steve Kraus" wrote in message

However I did notice that the circulating fan inside the rear of the
freezer sometimes doesn't come on when the compressor and condensor fan
do. I presume these always run together. Also sometimes it seems to
spin sluggishly.


BINGO, we have a winner.


So now I am definitely on to something. When it wasn't turning I could
get it going by giving it a push by hand.

But here is where I am still a little puzzled and may need advice:

So far as I could tell by turning it, the fan turns completely freely.
So it's not like it's bound up. It spins freely and you can feel a
little "cogging" effect from magnetic interaction. This is one of those
small induction motors where there is a single coil offset to one side in
the magnetic structure and has just a simple rotor. And you could feel
that the power was on.

So why would it not start or run sluggishly? It's getting power and it's
able to spin freely...what more is there? If friction was high I should
be able to feel it. And if power wasn't there or the coil was
intermittent that would be apparent too. I don't get this sluggish
business.

So I wonder if replacing the motor would even cure it.


DUH, if the motor does not turn it is defective. Period. It has very low
power and if the bearings are going bad, it will not run feely. You can stop
those thing with the pinky finger of a 1 year old.
BTDT a few times.






Speaking of fans I temporarily put a muffin fan inside the fridge side
under the inlet damper to pull more air in (I cable-tied it in place) so
I can maintain proper temp on that side until this is all resolved.
That's working well for now but I still need to fix this thing.


So again you proved the fan is not working and is needed. Replace it and be
done with it. Should be readily available at any appliance parts place or
www.repairclinic.com

Steve Kraus wrote:
The patient: GE Profile side-by-side, about a dozen years old, no fancy
electronic controls that I am aware of

The symptoms: Nice and cold on the freezer side. Barely cooling on the
refrigerator side

Direct Cause: Poor air flow. The control damper appears open and no
connecting vents are blocked.

Previously based on reading some online advice I was given to suspecting
that the defrost system (timer, heater, kill-thermostat) may have been
faulty and allowed the evap to fill with ice and block airflow.

I finally was able to clear out all the food from the freezer side,
remove the shelves, shelf rails, and various rear covers. Bottome line
is that the evaporator is *not* plugged with ice so that was a dead end.

However I did notice that the circulating fan inside the rear of the
freezer sometimes doesn't come on when the compressor and condensor fan
do. I presume these always run together. Also sometimes it seems to
spin sluggishly.

So now I am definitely on to something. When it wasn't turning I could
get it going by giving it a push by hand.

But here is where I am still a little puzzled and may need advice:

So far as I could tell by turning it, the fan turns completely freely.
So it's not like it's bound up. It spins freely and you can feel a
little "cogging" effect from magnetic interaction. This is one of those
small induction motors where there is a single coil offset to one side in
the magnetic structure and has just a simple rotor. And you could feel
that the power was on.

So why would it not start or run sluggishly? It's getting power and it's
able to spin freely...what more is there? If friction was high I should
be able to feel it. And if power wasn't there or the coil was
intermittent that would be apparent too. I don't get this sluggish
business.

So I wonder if replacing the motor would even cure it. Before I do that
I wonder if it's not getting full voltage for some reason. As I said so
far as I know this fridge has no electronics. Could there be some
provision for regulating fan speed? This isn't the kind of motor that
you'd do that via controlling the voltage anyway. And if it's turned on
via the same thermostat switch contacts that turn on the compressor then
it can't be that some contacts somewhere are bad giving it poor voltage.

I think before I go ordering a new fan I should see if I can connect it
directly to AC and eliminate any issues with the power getting to it.

Speaking of fans I temporarily put a muffin fan inside the fridge side
under the inlet damper to pull more air in (I cable-tied it in place) so
I can maintain proper temp on that side until this is all resolved.
That's working well for now but I still need to fix this thing.


That type of fan motor should offer no mechanical resistance
at all with the power leads disconnected. I just pulled one
out of an old 'frige and simply re-oiled the bearings and
saturated the felt reservoirs with oil and the thing is running
fine now.

TDD

These fans are well under $20 at an appliance parts house. Let's
think about a fan expected to run in sub zero or low digit
temperatures. I can't imagine any reason for the lubricants to
become sluggish, can you?

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"Steve Kraus" wrote in message
m...
The patient: GE Profile side-by-side, about a dozen years old,
no fancy
electronic controls that I am aware of

The symptoms: Nice and cold on the freezer side. Barely
cooling on the
refrigerator side

Direct Cause: Poor air flow. The control damper appears open
and no
connecting vents are blocked.

Previously based on reading some online advice I was given to
suspecting
that the defrost system (timer, heater, kill-thermostat) may
have been
faulty and allowed the evap to fill with ice and block airflow.

I finally was able to clear out all the food from the freezer
side,
remove the shelves, shelf rails, and various rear covers.
Bottome line
is that the evaporator is *not* plugged with ice so that was a
dead end.

However I did notice that the circulating fan inside the rear of
the
freezer sometimes doesn't come on when the compressor and
condensor fan
do. I presume these always run together. Also sometimes it
seems to
spin sluggishly.

So now I am definitely on to something. When it wasn't turning
I could
get it going by giving it a push by hand.

But here is where I am still a little puzzled and may need
advice:

So far as I could tell by turning it, the fan turns completely
freely.
So it's not like it's bound up. It spins freely and you can
feel a
little "cogging" effect from magnetic interaction. This is one
of those
small induction motors where there is a single coil offset to
one side in
the magnetic structure and has just a simple rotor. And you
could feel
that the power was on.

So why would it not start or run sluggishly? It's getting power
and it's
able to spin freely...what more is there? If friction was high
I should
be able to feel it. And if power wasn't there or the coil was
intermittent that would be apparent too. I don't get this
sluggish
business.

So I wonder if replacing the motor would even cure it. Before I
do that
I wonder if it's not getting full voltage for some reason. As I
said so
far as I know this fridge has no electronics. Could there be
some
provision for regulating fan speed? This isn't the kind of
motor that
you'd do that via controlling the voltage anyway. And if it's
turned on
via the same thermostat switch contacts that turn on the
compressor then
it can't be that some contacts somewhere are bad giving it poor
voltage.

I think before I go ordering a new fan I should see if I can
connect it
directly to AC and eliminate any issues with the power getting
to it.

Speaking of fans I temporarily put a muffin fan inside the
fridge side
under the inlet damper to pull more air in (I cable-tied it in
place) so
I can maintain proper temp on that side until this is all
resolved.
That's working well for now but I still need to fix this thing.

I've done a couple like that. Such as my own refrig. Often,
it's easier to just put in a new fan, and know it's good for
years.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

That type of fan motor should offer no mechanical resistance
at all with the power leads disconnected. I just pulled one
out of an old 'frige and simply re-oiled the bearings and
saturated the felt reservoirs with oil and the thing is
running
fine now.

TDD

Since you seem to have a source of parts, replace the fan
motor. And it will give you years of good service.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
...

Hi,
Your motor is worn out. Even if cleaning lubricating, etc.
won't make it
last longer. It's not worth the effort. Replace it. Time is
money.
Fiddling it takes time.

DanG wrote:
These fans are well under $20 at an appliance parts house. Let's
think about a fan expected to run in sub zero or low digit
temperatures. I can't imagine any reason for the lubricants to
become sluggish, can you?

Actually it's $120-130 based on two online sources.

Just to be sure, this is not the kind of motor that uses a capacitor,
right? I don't want to buy a new motor and find out that the problem was
really a 5 dollar cap that's gone bad.

No cap. Evaporator motors, I've never seen a cap.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Steve Kraus" wrote in
message
m...
DanG wrote:
These fans are well under $20 at an appliance parts house.
Let's
think about a fan expected to run in sub zero or low digit
temperatures. I can't imagine any reason for the
lubricants to
become sluggish, can you?

Actually it's $120-130 based on two online sources.

Just to be sure, this is not the kind of motor that uses a
capacitor,
right? I don't want to buy a new motor and find out that
the problem was
really a 5 dollar cap that's gone bad.

Stormin Mormon wrote:

No cap. Evaporator motors, I've never seen a cap.

I just wanted to follow up in case it can be of help to someone.

In fact despite the fact that this refrigerator (about a dozen years old)
has no electronic controls there *is* actually a bit of circuitry with
the evaporator motor. If I had to guess I'd say that maybe they drive
the actual motor at a higher frequency to go faster while retaining the
general simplicity of an induction motor.

It could be that the circuitry rather than the motor itself was the
failure point since it sure didn't seem like the bearings were bad and
there really isn't much else to the motor...just the one coil. On the
old motor I could stop it easily by grasping the shaft with my fingers
and while you can do that on the new one the difference is that the old
one could stay stopped when you let go and sometimes needs a push to get
going again. It does spin freely and did even while cold so the drive
circuit could be the issue.

Now that it's out I'll play with it and see what freq is going to the
motor coil. The label says it's supposed to turn at 2600 RPM. My strobe
says more like 2500 but either way that's not the 60 Hz multiple I would
expect of a directly driven motor.

As for the repair, it was far more complex than it needed to be thanks to
GE's design. While everything comes apart and unplugs nicely the fact
that the entire evap coil assembly is clipped to and is held by the
plastic bracket that holds the fan motor is, IMHO, ridiculous. I suppose
a pro might not worry about it and just let it hang of its own accord but
I could not take a chance like that so after all the other covers and
shelf rails etc. were out I got some bailing wire and tied some support
lines between holes in the evap coil frame and the shelf rail screws,
then had to struggle to get the thing that holds the motor out past them.
At least I didn't have to worry I was stressing the refrigerant lines.
Other than that it's pretty straightforward.

It's all back together now and temp is coming down nicely. I won't know
if the actual problem (too warm on the fridge side) is actually solved
for a few days I guess. However for now as soon as the freezer temp is
back down where it should I'll resume powering the muffin fan I put on
the fridge side to pull more cold air in. Once the fridge temp is down
where it should be I'll pull the supplemental fan out and we shall see if
the new fan motor on the freezer side has cured the problem.