I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

I know the Honda generators have a parallel cord, but think that is for the
inverter type. The ones I have are made by two differant companies and just
the inexpensive kind that sell for around $ 600 to $ 800 at most stores.

On Jan 29, 6:53*pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. *I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. *The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

Probably not. Their outputs are too variable. A little load on one leg
will drop the RPMs a bit for a moment on one generator, then BAM,
they're out of sync.

On Jan 29, 6:57�pm, wrote:
On Jan 29, 6:53�pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:

I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. �I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. �The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

Probably not. Their outputs are too variable. A little load on one leg
will drop the RPMs a bit for a moment on one generator, then BAM,
they're out of sync.

nope sorry it wouldnt work

you can use one generator for some loads, and the other for different
loads.

call one essential and one nice to have luxuries.

Ralph Mowery wrote:

I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

I know the Honda generators have a parallel cord, but think that is for the
inverter type. The ones I have are made by two differant companies and just
the inexpensive kind that sell for around $ 600 to $ 800 at most stores.

Once paralleled they should stay in synch unless there is a failure like
a tripped breaker. Ping Neon John on alt.energy.homepower for more
paralleling advice.

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
m...
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. The question is will they
stay in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

I know the Honda generators have a parallel cord, but think that is for
the inverter type. The ones I have are made by two differant companies
and just the inexpensive kind that sell for around $ 600 to $ 800 at most
stores.


The generators can be paralled but the governors are not adequate for load
sharing. They will cause uncontrollable surging as both try to control the
speed of the locked together rotors.

Don Young

On Jan 29, 6:53*pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. *I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. *

Really?
How are you going to get them in phase and stay in phase?

Mark

On Jan 29, 5:53*pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. *I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. *The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

I know the Honda generators have a parallel cord, but think that is for the
inverter type. *The ones I have are made by two differant companies and just
the inexpensive kind that sell for around $ 600 *to $ 800 at most stores.

I dont think you can do it safely knowing how the govenors are not
very good on 5000w gasolene units. Hondas EU have minimal V swing so
its a different animal. Maybe 1v vs 3-15 v swing from Honda EU to
regular cheap units.

wrote in message
...
On Jan 29, 6:53 pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running.

Really?
How are you going to get them in phase and stay in phase?

Mark

It is easy to get them in phase and running together. I have done that many
times at work with 3 phase motor generator sets with 50 horsepower or so
setups. We have varitable speed equipment that can not be stopped and to
work on the motor generator sets we parallel a spare set long enough to take
the running set off line. Simplest way is to hook up a voltmeter between
them and when the meter goes to zero you throw the switch to put them in
parallel. In simple terms the generators become electric motors and one
will try to drive the other to the same speed after the electricl
connection is made.

My question is really has anyone done this and will it work with the simple
home generators.

On Jan 30, 10:08*am, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:
wrote in message

...
On Jan 29, 6:53 pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:

I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running.

Really?
How are you going to get them in phase and stay in phase?

Mark

It is easy to get them in phase and running together. *I have done that many
times at work with 3 phase motor generator sets with 50 horsepower or so
setups. *We have varitable speed equipment that can not be stopped and to
work on the motor generator sets we parallel a spare set long enough to take
the running set off line. *Simplest way is to hook up a voltmeter between
them and when the meter goes to zero *you throw the switch to put them in
parallel. *In simple terms the generators become electric motors and one
will try to drive the other *to the same speed after the electricl
connection is made.

My question is really has anyone done this and will it work with the simple
home generators.

I understand how you intend to MEASURE the phase with a voltmeter, ok
but....

1) how do you propose to vary the speed of a home generator to get it
in phase with another?

2) once in phase and you throw the switch to connect them and they
lock together, how do you control the throttle settings of both so
that they share the load instead of one driving the other...

each home generator has a crude speed control governor on the throttle
and if they are not set to ___exactly___ the same speed, the "faster
one" will take all the load and the "slower one" will be driven as a
motor like you described.... as another poster said, the whole system
will probably "hunt" like crazy...

it is an interesting problem but unless you re-design the throttle
governors I don't see how you can get this to work..

sounds like a fun thing to try though...

Mark

On Jan 30, 10:08*am, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:
It is easy to get them in phase and running together. *I have done that many
times at work with 3 phase motor generator sets with 50 horsepower or so
setups. *We have varitable speed equipment that can not be stopped and to
work on the motor generator sets we parallel a spare set long enough to take
the running set off line. *Simplest way is to hook up a voltmeter between
them and when the meter goes to zero *you throw the switch to put them in
parallel. *In simple terms the generators become electric motors and one
will try to drive the other *to the same speed after the electricl
connection is made.

There's a huge difference between two cheap Chinese home generators
and two precision industrial units.

Ralph Mowery wrote:

wrote in message
...
On Jan 29, 6:53 pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running.

Really?
How are you going to get them in phase and stay in phase?

Mark

It is easy to get them in phase and running together. I have done that many
times at work with 3 phase motor generator sets with 50 horsepower or so
setups. We have varitable speed equipment that can not be stopped and to
work on the motor generator sets we parallel a spare set long enough to take
the running set off line. Simplest way is to hook up a voltmeter between
them and when the meter goes to zero you throw the switch to put them in
parallel. In simple terms the generators become electric motors and one
will try to drive the other to the same speed after the electricl
connection is made.

My question is really has anyone done this and will it work with the simple
home generators.

Neon John on alt.energy.homepower has reportedly regularly paralleled
two of the $100 1kW 2cycle chinese generators without issues.

On Jan 30, 10:33*am, "Pete C." wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:

wrote in message
....
On Jan 29, 6:53 pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running.

Really?
How are you going to get them in phase and stay in phase?

Mark

It is easy to get them in phase and running together. *I have done that many
times at work with 3 phase motor generator sets with 50 horsepower or so
setups. *We have varitable speed equipment that can not be stopped and to
work on the motor generator sets we parallel a spare set long enough to take
the running set off line. *Simplest way is to hook up a voltmeter between
them and when the meter goes to zero *you throw the switch to put them in
parallel. *In simple terms the generators become electric motors and one
will try to drive the other *to the same speed after the electricl
connection is made.

My question is really has anyone done this and will it work with the simple
home generators.

Neon John on alt.energy.homepower has reportedly regularly paralleled
two of the $100 1kW 2cycle chinese generators without issues.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I tested a cheap chinese gen, its stability was as good as my 1200.00
unit. Aparently they have good govenors and oversized gen heads, I was
impressed.

wrote in message
...
On Jan 30, 10:08 am, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:
wrote in message

...
.....

1) how do you propose to vary the speed of a home generator to get it
in phase with another?

2) once in phase and you throw the switch to connect them and they
lock together, how do you control the throttle settings of both so
that they share the load instead of one driving the other...

each home generator has a crude speed control governor on the throttle
and if they are not set to ___exactly___ the same speed, the "faster
one" will take all the load and the "slower one" will be driven as a
motor like you described.... as another poster said, the whole system
will probably "hunt" like crazy...

it is an interesting problem but unless you re-design the throttle
governors I don't see how you can get this to work..

sounds like a fun thing to try though...

Mark

The getting them paralled is no problem. They have adjustments for the
speed. Just not too user adjustable unless you know where and how.

The answer to your # 2 is sort of what I was looking for. They will try to
stay in sync for a while, but it may only be a few seconds, or they may stay
that way for a long time. I was trying to find out if anyone had ever tried
it and if it worked or not. I don't intend to sit and adjust the speed
after they are connected but want to rely on the governers to mantain the
speed.
I hate to blow about $ 1500 if they burn each other up just to be the first
one to try it....
Especially now that I just cleaned out the fuel system of one of them due to
not running it for a long time and leaving the old fuel in it.

Not that way but you CAN connect one generator to one leg of your 220
volt supply and the other one to the other side. Using 110 volts from
each generator for each half of the house and it should work fine.



Yes maybe if you are using only 110 Volt loads, (and ignoring the fact
that you can overlaod the neutral wires.) But I don't think that
will work at all if you have 220 Volt loads.

Have you actually done this?

Mark

Van Chocstraw wrote:

Ralph Mowery wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

I know the Honda generators have a parallel cord, but think that is for the
inverter type. The ones I have are made by two differant companies and just
the inexpensive kind that sell for around $ 600 to $ 800 at most stores.


Not that way but you CAN connect one generator to one leg of your 220
volt supply and the other one to the other side. Using 110 volts from
each generator for each half of the house and it should work fine.

That would not work for any 240V loads as the two sources would be
drifting in and out of phase and 240V devices would see wildly varying
voltages.

Yes, it is possible to parallel generators and not just the inverter
based ones, it has been done daily since the beginning of electric
power. It has just been uncommon to parallel small generators.

On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 16:22:07 -0500, Van Chocstraw wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

I know the Honda generators have a parallel cord, but think that is for the
inverter type. The ones I have are made by two differant companies and just
the inexpensive kind that sell for around $ 600 to $ 800 at most stores.


Not that way but you CAN connect one generator to one leg of your 220
volt supply and the other one to the other side. Using 110 volts from
each generator for each half of the house and it should work fine.

Have you actually tried your own advice?

If you have any 220V appliances, they'll be seriously ****ed up.
You'll also have the sum/difference hums in the house as the two
frequencies beat against each other -- 120hz (sum) +/- the difference in
generator frequencies modulated at 0-1hz (the difference))

In article .com, "Pete C."
wrote:

Ralph Mowery wrote:

I have two generators rated at 5 KW each. I know how to phase and put the
two in parallel while they are both running. The question is will they stay
in sync and put out 10 kw if needed ?

I know the Honda generators have a parallel cord, but think that is for the
inverter type. The ones I have are made by two differant companies and just
the inexpensive kind that sell for around $ 600 to $ 800 at most stores.

Once paralleled they should stay in synch unless there is a failure like
a tripped breaker.

As Monty Python would say... "explain the logic underlying *that* conclusion!"

On Jan 30, 1:10*pm, "Ralph Mowery" wrote:
wrote in message

...
On Jan 30, 10:08 am, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote: wrote in message

....

....

1) how do you propose to vary the speed of a home generator to get it
in phase with another?
2) once in phase and you throw the switch to connect them and they
lock together, how do you control the throttle settings *of both so
that they share the load instead of one driving the other...
each home generator has a crude speed control governor on the throttle
and if they are not set to ___exactly___ the same speed, *the "faster
one" will take all the load and the "slower one" will be driven as a
motor like you described.... *as another poster said, the whole system
will probably "hunt" like crazy...
it is an interesting problem but unless you re-design the throttle
governors I don't see how you can get this to work..
sounds like a fun thing to try though...
Mark

The getting them paralled is no problem. *They have adjustments for the
speed. *Just not too user adjustable unless you know where and how.

The answer to your # 2 is sort of what I was looking for. *They will try to
stay in sync for a while, but it may only be a few seconds, or they may stay
that way for a long time. *I was trying to find out if anyone had ever tried
it and if it worked or not. *I don't intend to sit and adjust the speed
after they are connected but want to rely on the governers to mantain the
speed.
I hate to blow about $ 1500 if they burn each other up just to be the first
one to try it....
Especially now that I just cleaned out the fuel system of one of them due to
not running it for a long time and leaving the old fuel in it.

I think your best bet would be to check at youtube.com If it DOES
work, someone will have a video showing how to do it. If it DOESN''T
work, someone will have a pretty exciting video of that, too.
Gasoline, electricity and the possibility of a spark -- it sounds like
it's made for youtube.