Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just missed
all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and citizenship? In the
United States of America, your rights *end* where the other guy's
nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that that concept applies to
BOTH parties. That principle is one of key foundations of
civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at least some
of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land
or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is
immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime...

"HeyBub" wrote in
m:

Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just missed
all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and citizenship? In the
United States of America, your rights *end* where the other guy's
nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that that concept applies to
BOTH parties. That principle is one of key foundations of
civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at least
some of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect
land or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is
immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime...




and a knock on the door and a verbal complaint is NOT any of those
reasons,even at 3AM.

Use of or just a threat to use deadly force is not warranted nor justified
in this case.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

On Apr 16, 10:45*pm, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 20:05:30 -0700 (PDT), Harry K





wrote:
On Apr 16, 6:40*pm, "DGDevin" wrote:
Major D. wrote:
What would you do?

Document it. *Seriously, get it on paper in a form you can introduce in
court. *Take date-stamped photos of his clutter, get signed statements from
neighbors, report him for code violations and so on. *If push comes to shove
you need to be the one who can convince a judge that you aren't the one
being unreasonable and a bad neighbor, otherwise it can end up being your
word against his.

Add on: *Make a recording of your "coming home" sounds to use if
needed.

Harry K

As worthy of the Nixon tapes, imo. You now need expert testimony that
the tapes are not fabricated.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yep, and some way to _prove_ the time and date taken.

Harry P

On Apr 17, 6:50*am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just missed
all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and citizenship? In the
United States of America, your rights *end* where the other guy's
nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that that concept applies to
BOTH parties. That principle is one of key foundations of
civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at least some
of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land
or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is
immediately necessary:
* (A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime...

And Texas is one of the few ?the only? state to have such a liberal
policy, deadly force to protect property, In any case, the happenings
mentioned in the OP don't even come close to meeting those criteria.

Harry K

On Apr 17, 8:57*am, "SteveB" wrote:
"Oren" wrote in message

...





On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 21:42:28 -0800, "SteveB"
wrote:

Handle it like a man. *You're minding your own business on your own
property
at three AM and this wack job comes over. *That's enough right there.

The OP did not indicate the complaint was at 3AM on his property;
unless I missed it.

Read about Confrontational Avoidance.

When the threat escalates, so does the amount of force.

No threat - no force!

What I read:

My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet
when I come home.

In my language, that would mean they came to my house.

Steve- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yep, but at what time? You have done two things.

1. Made a totally unwarrant assumption.

2. Gave some **** poor advice.

Harry K

On Apr 17, 11:56*am, "SteveB" wrote:
"Oren" wrote in message

...

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 21:42:28 -0800, "SteveB"
wrote:

Handle it like a man. *You're minding your own business on your own
property
at three AM and this wack job comes over. *That's enough right there.

The OP did not indicate the complaint was at 3AM on his property;
unless I missed it.

Read about Confrontational Avoidance.

When the threat escalates, so does the amount of force.

No threat - no force!

Whether or not the person came on my property, I'd tell them to buzz off.
If they ever were stupid enough to come on my property and complain, I'd
handle it. *It's that simple. *Some situations are best handled by force,
confrontation and violence.

Steve

Yes, that's what some fools believe. Somebody insulted their
girlfriend, so to prove what a man they are, they go find the guy, hit
him and the one blow managed to kill him or leave him brain injured.
Or they bring a gun, go challenge the guy and wind up using it. Most
of these idiots wind up serving time.

Thankfully, there is no state in the USA where you can shoot a
neighbor for simply walking over to your property or knocking on the
door. The TX stature doesn't even come close to saying any such
action is warranted.

What kind of person are you and what kind of moral values can you have
that you think it's justified taking someone's life for simply coming
onto your property? At most, this is a tresspass case.

Harry K wrote:

As worthy of the Nixon tapes, imo. You now need expert testimony that
the tapes are not fabricated.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yep, and some way to _prove_ the time and date taken.

Harry P

Depends on the court, if it were small claims for example then the judges
can use a lot more common sense. In any case if one guy has a boxful of
evidence and backup from neighbors and the other guy doesn't, who is more
likely to prevail?

"Oren" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 21:42:28 -0800, "SteveB"
wrote:

Handle it like a man. You're minding your own business on your own
property
at three AM and this wack job comes over. That's enough right there.

The OP did not indicate the complaint was at 3AM on his property;
unless I missed it.

Read about Confrontational Avoidance.

When the threat escalates, so does the amount of force.

No threat - no force!

Whether or not the person came on my property, I'd tell them to buzz off.
If they ever were stupid enough to come on my property and complain, I'd
handle it. It's that simple. Some situations are best handled by force,
confrontation and violence.

Steve

"Oren" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 21:42:28 -0800, "SteveB"
wrote:

Handle it like a man. You're minding your own business on your own
property
at three AM and this wack job comes over. That's enough right there.

The OP did not indicate the complaint was at 3AM on his property;
unless I missed it.

Read about Confrontational Avoidance.

When the threat escalates, so does the amount of force.

No threat - no force!


What I read:

My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet
when I come home.

In my language, that would mean they came to my house.

Steve

Harry K wrote:
On Apr 17, 6:50 am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just missed
all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and citizenship? In the
United States of America, your rights *end* where the other guy's
nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that that concept applies to
BOTH parties. That principle is one of key foundations of
civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at
least some of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to
protect land or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is
immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime...

And Texas is one of the few ?the only? state to have such a liberal
policy, deadly force to protect property, In any case, the happenings
mentioned in the OP don't even come close to meeting those criteria.


"Officer, when he came to my door, his fly was open (like it is now), and
his equipment was sticking out (like it is now), and he had this hatchet in
his hand, and he screamed 'I'm gonna kill you and **** your dead
eye-socket', and I, in fear of my life, discharged by weapon in an effort to
stop the attack."

HeyBub wrote:

Red Green wrote:

How can he be anymore quiet with a stock exhaust and garage door?

Park down the block.

Jeeze! Why do I have to think of everything?



Because you're such a smart ass :-)


I offered that solution in case the resident is more concerned with the
happiness of his neighbor than his own convenience.

But should the emphasis be reversed - - -

"BUCHAREST, Romania - Romanian media say a man was rearing a lion in his
back garden until neighbors decided they had heard enough roaring and called
police."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080416/...lion_in_garden



Which reminds me of something I've heard enough times recently to believe.

That there are about two to three times as many "pet" tigers (about
12,000 total) in the USA than remain in the wild worldwide.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger#As_pets

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10^12 furlongs per fortnight.

Jeff Wisnia wrote in
news[email protected] munications:

HeyBub wrote:

Red Green wrote:

How can he be anymore quiet with a stock exhaust and garage door?

Park down the block.

Jeeze! Why do I have to think of everything?



Because you're such a smart ass :-)


I offered that solution in case the resident is more concerned with
the happiness of his neighbor than his own convenience.

But should the emphasis be reversed - - -

"BUCHAREST, Romania - Romanian media say a man was rearing a lion in
his back garden until neighbors decided they had heard enough roaring
and called police."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080416/...nia_lion_in_ga
rden



Which reminds me of something I've heard enough times recently to
believe.

That there are about two to three times as many "pet" tigers (about
12,000 total) in the USA than remain in the wild worldwide.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger#As_pets

Jeff


did you see the recent TV video of the cougar roaming the streets in north
Chicago?
Police had to shoot it.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

"SteveB" wrote in
:


"Major D." wrote in message
...
My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet
when I come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my vehicle
coming up the drive, or the garage door opening and closing. I get
home about 3 in the morning, I drive a car with a quiet muffler, and
there's absolutely nothing wrong with my garage door!

This coming from a guy with a stack of lawnmowers in his back yard,
tarps all over the place, plywood laying around. Basically, he has a
dump! I know one of the neighbors called the city on him.

Besides holding myself back from punching this idiot in the face, I'm
about to join the rest of the neighbors, in an effort to run this
jerk out of town.

What would you do?

Go about your business as usual.

Unless you live in California, or some other state with highly
restrictive gun laws, if he comes over again at 3 AM, draw a weapon
and tell him that if he EVER comes over again, you will shoot him,
kick his sorry ass, pepper spray him, or all three. And mean it.
Immediately call the police and inform them what happened so that they
will not get a call from him shrieking and screaming. When they come
to respond, leave the weapon inside, and calmly explain what happened.
It's even better if he knocks on the door, and the exchange of words
happens while you're standing totally inside your house. They will
explain to the idiot that you DO AND DID have the right to shoot holes
in his sorry ass.

If he's on your property, you got him. Just be sure to tell the
policeperson that he has made threats before and you were in fear of
your life. In some states, you can just shoot him.

All a little serious? No. You want to take care of the problem or
dance around it? The police can't/won't do anything. The justice
system can't/won't do anything about it.

Handle it like a man. You're minding your own business on your own
property at three AM and this wack job comes over. That's enough
right there.

I live in rural Utah, previously, Nevada. Concealed weapon laws and
"castle laws" are pretty lenient here when it comes to defending your
home and family from people roaming around YOUR property at 3 AM.

Steve



I lived in VT for many years. It is legal to walk down the street with a
loaded gun in a holster anytime. And during hunting season, no one robs a
convenience store. Who would pull a gun on a clerk when 20 people behind
you are openly armed?

"HeyBub" wrote in
:

Harry K wrote:
On Apr 17, 6:50 am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just missed
all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and citizenship? In the
United States of America, your rights *end* where the other guy's
nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that that concept applies
to BOTH parties. That principle is one of key foundations of
civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at
least some of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to
protect land or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force
is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime...

And Texas is one of the few ?the only? state to have such a liberal
policy, deadly force to protect property, In any case, the
happenings mentioned in the OP don't even come close to meeting those
criteria.


"Officer, when he came to my door, his fly was open (like it is now),
and his equipment was sticking out (like it is now), and he had this
hatchet in his hand, and he screamed 'I'm gonna kill you and **** your
dead eye-socket', and I, in fear of my life, discharged by weapon in
an effort to stop the attack."




'I'm gonna kill you and **** your dead eye-socket'

Man, that's better than Mike Tyson threatening to eat your children.

Jeff Wisnia wrote in
news[email protected] munications:

HeyBub wrote:

Red Green wrote:

How can he be anymore quiet with a stock exhaust and garage door?

Park down the block.

Jeeze! Why do I have to think of everything?



Because you're such a smart ass :-)


I offered that solution in case the resident is more concerned with
the happiness of his neighbor than his own convenience.

But should the emphasis be reversed - - -

"BUCHAREST, Romania - Romanian media say a man was rearing a lion in
his back garden until neighbors decided they had heard enough roaring
and called police."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080416/...nia_lion_in_ga
rden



Which reminds me of something I've heard enough times recently to
believe.

That there are about two to three times as many "pet" tigers (about
12,000 total) in the USA than remain in the wild worldwide.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger#As_pets

Jeff



I'd like to have one...or at least rent it. Got all these bad-asses around
here in NC city with pitt bulls they've made miserable. Like to walk
streets with em playing "Look at me.I'm bad.". Make a funny bark with head
sliced up like ham steaks.

On Apr 17, 12:55*pm, "HeyBub" wrote:
Harry K wrote:
On Apr 17, 6:50 am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just missed
all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and citizenship? In the
United States of America, your rights *end* where the other guy's
nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that that concept applies to
BOTH parties. That principle is one of key foundations of
civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at
least some of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to
protect land or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is
immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime...

And Texas is one of the few ?the only? state to have such a liberal
policy, deadly force to protect property, *In any case, the happenings
mentioned in the OP don't even come close to meeting those criteria.

"Officer, when he came to my door, his fly was open (like it is now), and
his equipment was sticking out (like it is now), and he had this hatchet in
his hand, and he screamed 'I'm gonna kill you and **** your dead
eye-socket', and I, in fear of my life, discharged by weapon in an effort to
stop the attack."- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Which would be an "interesting" defense which just _might_ get you
acquited, not likely, but _might_. Meanwhile you will either be in
jail awaiting trial or out on bond.

Harry K

Jeff Wisnia wrote:


I offered that solution in case the resident is more concerned with
the happiness of his neighbor than his own convenience.

But should the emphasis be reversed - - -

"BUCHAREST, Romania - Romanian media say a man was rearing a lion in
his back garden until neighbors decided they had heard enough
roaring and called police."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080416/...lion_in_garden



Which reminds me of something I've heard enough times recently to
believe.
That there are about two to three times as many "pet" tigers (about
12,000 total) in the USA than remain in the wild worldwide.


Heh! There's a lot of truth to the notion that God created kitty-cats so
man could pet the tiger.

"SteveB" wrote in
:


"Red Green" wrote in message
...
"SteveB" wrote in
:


"Major D." wrote in message
...
My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet
when I come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my
vehicle coming up the drive, or the garage door opening and
closing. I get home about 3 in the morning, I drive a car with a
quiet muffler, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with my garage
door!

This coming from a guy with a stack of lawnmowers in his back yard,
tarps all over the place, plywood laying around. Basically, he has
a dump! I know one of the neighbors called the city on him.

Besides holding myself back from punching this idiot in the face,
I'm about to join the rest of the neighbors, in an effort to run
this jerk out of town.

What would you do?

Go about your business as usual.

Unless you live in California, or some other state with highly
restrictive gun laws, if he comes over again at 3 AM, draw a weapon
and tell him that if he EVER comes over again, you will shoot him,
kick his sorry ass, pepper spray him, or all three. And mean it.
Immediately call the police and inform them what happened so that
they will not get a call from him shrieking and screaming. When
they come to respond, leave the weapon inside, and calmly explain
what happened.
It's even better if he knocks on the door, and the exchange of
words
happens while you're standing totally inside your house. They will
explain to the idiot that you DO AND DID have the right to shoot
holes in his sorry ass.

If he's on your property, you got him. Just be sure to tell the
policeperson that he has made threats before and you were in fear of
your life. In some states, you can just shoot him.

All a little serious? No. You want to take care of the problem or
dance around it? The police can't/won't do anything. The justice
system can't/won't do anything about it.

Handle it like a man. You're minding your own business on your own
property at three AM and this wack job comes over. That's enough
right there.

I live in rural Utah, previously, Nevada. Concealed weapon laws and
"castle laws" are pretty lenient here when it comes to defending
your home and family from people roaming around YOUR property at 3
AM.

Steve



I lived in VT for many years. It is legal to walk down the street
with a loaded gun in a holster anytime. And during hunting season, no
one robs a convenience store. Who would pull a gun on a clerk when 20
people behind you are openly armed?

I have Utah, Nevada and Florida CCF permits. With reciprocity, that
totals a lot of states. Yet, Vermont has the best CCF laws in the US
bar none. And it's all based on common sense, something seriously
lacking in today's world.

Steve





Cow tipping can be very unhealthy.

Harry K wrote:

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to
protect land or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force
is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or
criminal mischief during the nighttime...

And Texas is one of the few ?the only? state to have such a liberal
policy, deadly force to protect property, In any case, the
happenings mentioned in the OP don't even come close to meeting
those criteria.

"Officer, when he came to my door, his fly was open (like it is
now), and his equipment was sticking out (like it is now), and he
had this hatchet in his hand, and he screamed 'I'm gonna kill you
and **** your dead eye-socket', and I, in fear of my life,
discharged by weapon in an effort to stop the attack."- Hide quoted
text -

- Show quoted text -

Which would be an "interesting" defense which just _might_ get you
acquited, not likely, but _might_. Meanwhile you will either be in
jail awaiting trial or out on bond.


Nah. Here in Texas we have the "But yer honor, he needin' killin'! "
defense. Check this recent story:

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se...cal&id=5766452

Five months and Joe Horn has not been arrested, charged, or indicted.

In Texas, if someone enters your home, your neighbor's home, prepares to
enter, thinks about entering, or just smells funny, they're dead meat. Or
not. The choice is yours.

We understand that when seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

Red Green wrote:

I lived in VT for many years. It is legal to walk down the street
with a loaded gun in a holster anytime. And during hunting season, no
one robs a convenience store. Who would pull a gun on a clerk when 20
people behind you are openly armed?

I'm sure there were once some, but the herd got culled long ago.

"SteveB" wrote in
:


"Red Green" wrote in message
...
"SteveB" wrote in
:


"Major D." wrote in message
...
My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet
when I come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my
vehicle coming up the drive, or the garage door opening and
closing. I get home about 3 in the morning, I drive a car with a
quiet muffler, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with my garage
door!

This coming from a guy with a stack of lawnmowers in his back yard,
tarps all over the place, plywood laying around. Basically, he has
a dump! I know one of the neighbors called the city on him.

Besides holding myself back from punching this idiot in the face,
I'm about to join the rest of the neighbors, in an effort to run
this jerk out of town.

What would you do?

Go about your business as usual.

Unless you live in California, or some other state with highly
restrictive gun laws, if he comes over again at 3 AM, draw a weapon
and tell him that if he EVER comes over again, you will shoot him,
kick his sorry ass, pepper spray him, or all three. And mean it.
Immediately call the police and inform them what happened so that
they will not get a call from him shrieking and screaming. When
they come to respond, leave the weapon inside, and calmly explain
what happened.
It's even better if he knocks on the door, and the exchange of
words
happens while you're standing totally inside your house. They will
explain to the idiot that you DO AND DID have the right to shoot
holes in his sorry ass.

If he's on your property, you got him. Just be sure to tell the
policeperson that he has made threats before and you were in fear of
your life. In some states, you can just shoot him.

All a little serious? No. You want to take care of the problem or
dance around it? The police can't/won't do anything. The justice
system can't/won't do anything about it.

Handle it like a man. You're minding your own business on your own
property at three AM and this wack job comes over. That's enough
right there.

I live in rural Utah, previously, Nevada. Concealed weapon laws and
"castle laws" are pretty lenient here when it comes to defending
your home and family from people roaming around YOUR property at 3
AM.

Steve



I lived in VT for many years. It is legal to walk down the street
with a loaded gun in a holster anytime. And during hunting season, no
one robs a convenience store. Who would pull a gun on a clerk when 20
people behind you are openly armed?

I have Utah, Nevada and Florida CCF permits. With reciprocity, that
totals a lot of states. Yet, Vermont has the best CCF laws in the US
bar none.

Yea, you don't need a permit.

And it's all based on common sense, something seriously
lacking in today's world.

Steve

On Thu, 17 Apr 2008 14:55:11 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

Harry K wrote:
On Apr 17, 6:50 am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just missed
all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and citizenship? In the
United States of America, your rights *end* where the other guy's
nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that that concept applies to
BOTH parties. That principle is one of key foundations of
civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at
least some of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to
protect land or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is
immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime...

And Texas is one of the few ?the only? state to have such a liberal
policy, deadly force to protect property, In any case, the happenings
mentioned in the OP don't even come close to meeting those criteria.


"Officer, when he came to my door, his fly was open (like it is now), and
his equipment was sticking out (like it is now), and he had this hatchet in
his hand, and he screamed 'I'm gonna kill you and **** your dead
eye-socket', and I, in fear of my life, discharged by weapon in an effort to
stop the attack."


Now if the guy was a door to door hatchet salesman and you shot him;
opened his fly and adjusted his equipment, you would go to jail.

Dead men do testify now. If they find your DNA on his equipment,
you're in a heap of trouble.

"Red Green" wrote in message
...
"SteveB" wrote in
:


"Major D." wrote in message
...
My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet
when I come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my vehicle
coming up the drive, or the garage door opening and closing. I get
home about 3 in the morning, I drive a car with a quiet muffler, and
there's absolutely nothing wrong with my garage door!

This coming from a guy with a stack of lawnmowers in his back yard,
tarps all over the place, plywood laying around. Basically, he has a
dump! I know one of the neighbors called the city on him.

Besides holding myself back from punching this idiot in the face, I'm
about to join the rest of the neighbors, in an effort to run this
jerk out of town.

What would you do?

Go about your business as usual.

Unless you live in California, or some other state with highly
restrictive gun laws, if he comes over again at 3 AM, draw a weapon
and tell him that if he EVER comes over again, you will shoot him,
kick his sorry ass, pepper spray him, or all three. And mean it.
Immediately call the police and inform them what happened so that they
will not get a call from him shrieking and screaming. When they come
to respond, leave the weapon inside, and calmly explain what happened.
It's even better if he knocks on the door, and the exchange of words
happens while you're standing totally inside your house. They will
explain to the idiot that you DO AND DID have the right to shoot holes
in his sorry ass.

If he's on your property, you got him. Just be sure to tell the
policeperson that he has made threats before and you were in fear of
your life. In some states, you can just shoot him.

All a little serious? No. You want to take care of the problem or
dance around it? The police can't/won't do anything. The justice
system can't/won't do anything about it.

Handle it like a man. You're minding your own business on your own
property at three AM and this wack job comes over. That's enough
right there.

I live in rural Utah, previously, Nevada. Concealed weapon laws and
"castle laws" are pretty lenient here when it comes to defending your
home and family from people roaming around YOUR property at 3 AM.

Steve



I lived in VT for many years. It is legal to walk down the street with a
loaded gun in a holster anytime. And during hunting season, no one robs a
convenience store. Who would pull a gun on a clerk when 20 people behind
you are openly armed?

I have Utah, Nevada and Florida CCF permits. With reciprocity, that totals
a lot of states. Yet, Vermont has the best CCF laws in the US bar none.
And it's all based on common sense, something seriously lacking in today's
world.

Steve

My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet when
I come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my vehicle coming
up the drive, or the garage door opening and closing. I get home about 3
in the morning, I drive a car with a quiet muffler, and there's
absolutely nothing wrong with my garage door!
--------------------------------------

I would put a load set of mufflers on my motorcycle, turn up the radio
and set outside drinking beer !! Then invite him & his old lady over for
a party, you might get lucky. LOL

in the bonds of the old south

Michael Lane

Life is NOT a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving
safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather, skid in
sideways, throttle in one hand, beer in the other, body thoroughly used
up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO , WHAT A RIDE "

Oren wrote in
:

On Thu, 17 Apr 2008 14:55:11 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

Harry K wrote:
On Apr 17, 6:50 am, "HeyBub" wrote:
Smitty Two wrote:

You really do hate everyone, don't you Steve? Or have I just
missed all your posts where you advocate diplomacy and
citizenship? In the United States of America, your rights *end*
where the other guy's nose begins. Somehow you seem to forget that
that concept applies to BOTH parties. That principle is one of key
foundations of civilization.

Ah, no. The other guy's rights end where my property begins (at
least some of them):

Texas Penal Code 9.42 DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to
protect land or tangible, movable property:
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force
is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or
criminal mischief during the nighttime...

And Texas is one of the few ?the only? state to have such a liberal
policy, deadly force to protect property, In any case, the
happenings mentioned in the OP don't even come close to meeting
those criteria.


"Officer, when he came to my door, his fly was open (like it is now),
and his equipment was sticking out (like it is now), and he had this
hatchet in his hand, and he screamed 'I'm gonna kill you and **** your
dead eye-socket', and I, in fear of my life, discharged by weapon in
an effort to stop the attack."


Now if the guy was a door to door hatchet salesman and you shot him;
opened his fly and adjusted his equipment, you would go to jail.

Dead men do testify now. If they find your DNA on his equipment,
you're in a heap of trouble.


amazing how some would lie to the police and falsify a crime scene after
murdering someone.
(murder:the wrongful killing of another person)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Oren wrote:

"Officer, when he came to my door, his fly was open (like it is
now), and his equipment was sticking out (like it is now), and he
had this hatchet in his hand, and he screamed 'I'm gonna kill you
and **** your dead eye-socket', and I, in fear of my life,
discharged by weapon in an effort to stop the attack."


Now if the guy was a door to door hatchet salesman and you shot him;
opened his fly and adjusted his equipment, you would go to jail.

Dead men do testify now. If they find your DNA on his equipment,
you're in a heap of trouble.

I agree that dead men do tell tales.

But, nah, I was trying to move a weapon from his reach so he couldn't use it
against me. I considered the hatchet, but...

There was a report, just today, where a man wakes up in a strange motel room
with another man doing unspeakable things to the man's private parts:

Australian "victim" goes all hammer on opportunistic lover. (Why he HAD a
hammer is not explained.)

Convicted nevertheless, probably because he had the abuser's false teeth in
his pocket.

http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story...005940,00.html

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 19:34:43 -0400, "Major D."
wrote:

:My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet when I
:come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my vehicle coming up
:the drive, or the garage door opening and closing. I get home about 3 in
:the morning, I drive a car with a quiet muffler, and there's absolutely
:nothing wrong with my garage door!
:
:This coming from a guy with a stack of lawnmowers in his back yard, tarps
:all over the place, plywood laying around. Basically, he has a dump! I know
ne of the neighbors called the city on him.
:
:Besides holding myself back from punching this idiot in the face, I'm about
:to join the rest of the neighbors, in an effort to run this jerk out of
:town.
:
:What would you do?

Honestly, I wouldn't punch him out. In fact I wouldn't act angry with
him. I'd just tell him that "yeah, at 3:00 in the morning it's a good
idea to not make much noise" and that you will try to do that. You say
you already do that, so what skin is it off your ass to say that? He's
within his rights to ask you. You think he's being a jerk or showing the
crevices in his brain by asking you, and so be it. You won't solve
either of your problems by going off on the guy about this.

In article , Jim Yanik wrote:
"Em" wrote in
:

Just treat him the way I treat my nutso ex-wife -- listen to idle
rants for a minute or two, and then have a confused look on your face,
and then walk away and don't ever reply one way or the other.

That reminds me of a Two and a Half Men episode(CBS) where Charlie says the
phrase "I understand." in a sincere voice to everybody's complaints,and
totally ignores what the people are saying.It pacifies them,they think they
have solved their problem,and they don't realize Charlie is just ignoring
them.(even after he explains it to his brother Allen)

It may be the best way for dealing with some people! ;-)

Or, instead of "I understand", how about "I feel your pain" ?

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter
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In article , Jim Yanik wrote:

did you see the recent TV video of the cougar roaming the streets in north
Chicago?
Police had to shoot it.

Yes, and did you see the brief interview with the idiot from the Humane
Society, describing cougars as "meek, gentle, timid" creatures? She claimed
that there hasn't been a case of a cougar attacking a human in "over a hundred
years".

What a moron.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

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In article , "SteveB" wrote:


I have Utah, Nevada and Florida CCF permits. With reciprocity, that totals
a lot of states. Yet, Vermont has the best CCF laws in the US bar none.
And it's all based on common sense, something seriously lacking in today's
world.

And your posts are the best evidence of that. If you ever acted, even once, as
you have stupidly advised the OP to do, you'd lose all three of those CCF
permits.

If in fact you even have them.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

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On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 16:51:08 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:

In article , Jim Yanik wrote:

did you see the recent TV video of the cougar roaming the streets in north
Chicago?
Police had to shoot it.

Yes, and did you see the brief interview with the idiot from the Humane
Society, describing cougars as "meek, gentle, timid" creatures? She claimed
that there hasn't been a case of a cougar attacking a human in "over a hundred
years".

What a moron.

yep.

The Police Chief (??) was right, Had someone been injured; and the
police had not shot the animal, the city would be sued!

On Apr 16, 6:34*pm, "Major D." wrote:
My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet when I
come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my vehicle coming up
the drive, or the garage door opening and closing. I get home about 3 in
the morning, I drive a car with a quiet muffler, and there's absolutely
nothing wrong with my garage door!

This coming from a guy with a stack of lawnmowers in his back yard, tarps
all over the place, plywood laying around. Basically, he has a dump! I know
one of the neighbors called the city on him.

Besides holding myself back from punching this idiot in the face, I'm about
to join the rest of the neighbors, in an effort to run this jerk out of
town.

What would you do?

Quit trollin and move on

On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:03:45 -0700, Harry K wrote:

Go about your business as usual.

Unless you live in California, or some other state with highly
restrictive gun laws, if he comes over again at 3 AM, draw a weapon
and tell him that if he EVER comes over again, you will shoot him,
kick his sorry ass, pepper spray him, or all three. Â*And mean it.
Immediately call the police and inform them what happened so that
they will not get a call from him shrieking and screaming. Â*When they
come to respond, leave the weapon inside, and calmly explain what
happened.
Â*It's even better if he knocks on the door, and the exchange of
Â*words
happens while you're standing totally inside your house. Â*They will
explain to the idiot that you DO AND DID have the right to shoot
holes in his sorry ass.

Wow.

So, I just have a couple of questions:

1) did the OP try talking to the guy and explaining his point of view to
him in a rational manner? I understand not being able to do so on the
spur of the moment, since it's obviously a surprising and obnoxious
complaint, but I would recommend popping over and attempting a rational
discussion with the guy before pulling a gun on him.

2) What does this have to do with home repair?

On Apr 20, 7:15*am, glen stark wrote:
On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:03:45 -0700, Harry K wrote:
Go about your business as usual.

Unless you live in California, or some other state with highly
restrictive gun laws, if he comes over again at 3 AM, draw a weapon
and tell him that if he EVER comes over again, you will shoot him,
kick his sorry ass, pepper spray him, or all three. *And mean it.
Immediately call the police and inform them what happened so that
they will not get a call from him shrieking and screaming. *When they
come to respond, leave the weapon inside, and calmly explain what
happened.
*It's even better if he knocks on the door, and the exchange of
*words
happens while you're standing totally inside your house. *They will
explain to the idiot that you DO AND DID have the right to shoot
holes in his sorry ass.

Wow.

So, I just have a couple of questions:

1) did the OP try talking to the guy and explaining his point of view to
him in a rational manner? *I understand not being able to do so on the
spur of the moment, since it's obviously a surprising and obnoxious
complaint, but I would recommend popping over and attempting a rational
discussion with the guy before pulling a gun on him.

2) What does this have to do with home repair?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Errm...that wasn't my post. I think you are replying to the same guy
I replied to.

Harry K

"Doug Miller" wrote
And your posts are the best evidence of that. If you ever acted, even
once, as
you have stupidly advised the OP to do, you'd lose all three of those CCF
permits.

If in fact you even have them.

Huh? Telling him to be a man on his own property?

Steve

Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "SteveB" wrote:

I have Utah, Nevada and Florida CCF permits. With reciprocity, that totals
a lot of states. Yet, Vermont has the best CCF laws in the US bar none.
And it's all based on common sense, something seriously lacking in today's
world.

And your posts are the best evidence of that. If you ever acted, even once, as
you have stupidly advised the OP to do, you'd lose all three of those CCF
permits.

If in fact you even have them.

Amen to that. People like him give the 99% of gun owners who are
rational and not trying to prove something, a bad name. Real men don't
need to talk about how tough they are.

--
aem sends....

In article , "SteveB" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote
And your posts are the best evidence of that. If you ever acted, even
once, as
you have stupidly advised the OP to do, you'd lose all three of those CCF
permits.

If in fact you even have them.

Huh? Telling him to be a man on his own property?

A *man* doesn't need to draw a deadly weapon to deal with a neighbor who came
over to talk to him about a complaint.

Only a fool draws a deadly weapon in response to a conversation.

And only a complete idiot would publicly advise others to do so; perhaps
you'll recognize yourself in this category, but probably you won't.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

Join the UseNet Improvement Project: killfile Google Groups.
http://www.improve-usenet.org

Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter
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You must use your REAL email address to get a response.

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Major D. wrote:
My neighbor came over to ask me, if I could be a little more quiet when I
come home. Apparently, he doesn't like the sound of my vehicle coming up
the drive, or the garage door opening and closing. I get home about 3 in
the morning, I drive a car with a quiet muffler, and there's absolutely
nothing wrong with my garage door!

This coming from a guy with a stack of lawnmowers in his back yard, tarps
all over the place, plywood laying around. Basically, he has a dump! I know
one of the neighbors called the city on him.

Besides holding myself back from punching this idiot in the face, I'm about
to join the rest of the neighbors, in an effort to run this jerk out of
town.

What would you do?



Calm down, smile and nod, and just ignore the idiot.

a

aemeijers wrote in
:

Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "SteveB"
wrote:

I have Utah, Nevada and Florida CCF permits. With reciprocity, that
totals a lot of states. Yet, Vermont has the best CCF laws in the
US bar none. And it's all based on common sense, something seriously
lacking in today's world.

And your posts are the best evidence of that. If you ever acted, even
once, as you have stupidly advised the OP to do, you'd lose all three
of those CCF permits.

If in fact you even have them.

Amen to that. People like him give the 99% of gun owners who are
rational and not trying to prove something, a bad name. Real men don't
need to talk about how tough they are.

--
aem sends....


real men can control their tempers,too.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
...
In article , "SteveB"
wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote
And your posts are the best evidence of that. If you ever acted, even
once, as
you have stupidly advised the OP to do, you'd lose all three of those
CCF
permits.

If in fact you even have them.

Huh? Telling him to be a man on his own property?

A *man* doesn't need to draw a deadly weapon to deal with a neighbor who
came
over to talk to him about a complaint.

Only a fool draws a deadly weapon in response to a conversation.

And only a complete idiot would publicly advise others to do so; perhaps
you'll recognize yourself in this category, but probably you won't.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

In case you didn't notice also, I'm not writing in asking what to do when
some nitwit mother****er comes on my property and gives me a ration of
unwarranted ****.

Things must be different at your house.

Steve