Anybody try this stuff with the sprinkles?

I'm a little hesitant. A guy here at work says that it peels off in
the high traffic areas, and he also claims that he followed the
directions, cleaned it with the provided muratic acid, and ensured it
was dust free.

Could it be that this Rust-o-Leum stuff doesn't cross-link (at the
molecular level) with the garage floor's substrate? That is my theory.

On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 13:04:53 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

Anybody try this stuff with the sprinkles?

I'm a little hesitant. A guy here at work says that it peels off in
the high traffic areas, and he also claims that he followed the
directions, cleaned it with the provided muratic acid, and ensured it
was dust free.

Could it be that this Rust-o-Leum stuff doesn't cross-link (at the
molecular level) with the garage floor's substrate? That is my theory.

What does cross-link at the molecular level?

On Mar 20, 4:19*pm, mm wrote:

snip

Could it be that this Rust-o-Leum stuff doesn't cross-link (at the
molecular level) with the garage floor's substrate? *That is my theory.

What does cross-link at the molecular level?

Cross linking is what happens between polymer chains to make them into
rubber(y) or thermoset. It has little to do with adhesion. Other
reactions or forces are at work that make one kind of stuff stick to
another.
As Mr. Meehan points out, a dirty substrate is a guaranteed failure.
You can slop on muriatic acid all day long on a greasy floor and
nothing will stick to it when you try to paint. Some of the new water-
based epoxies like Sears don't need acid treating, but instead come
with a fairly hairy precleaner. Older solvent-based two part epoxies
are still available at Sherwin-Williams stores and others. They have
the advantage of four or more decades of proven durabiilty and
performance, but need careful planning to get the best application.
The sprinkle goodies are IMO a matter of fashion like granite
countertops. A non slid additive actually makes more sense, so ask
about such at the paint store or a good boat shop.
Regarding concerns about RustOleum products...I would use any of their
paints without a second thought. They have achieved their success in
the marketplace with top notch products for more than half a century.
I have always had good results with the brand. HTH

Joe

On Mar 20, 6:30�pm, Joe wrote:
On Mar 20, 4:19�pm, mm wrote:

snip

�Could it be that this Rust-o-Leum stuff doesn't cross-link (at the

molecular level) with the garage floor's substrate? �That is my theory.

What does cross-link at the molecular level?

Cross linking is what happens between polymer chains to make them into
rubber(y) or thermoset. It has little to do with adhesion. Other
reactions or forces are at work that make one kind of stuff stick to
another.
�As Mr. Meehan points out, a dirty substrate is a guaranteed failure.
You can slop on muriatic acid all day long on a greasy floor and
nothing will stick to it when you try to paint. Some of the new water-
based epoxies like Sears don't need acid treating, but instead come
with a fairly hairy precleaner. Older solvent-based two part epoxies
are still available at Sherwin-Williams stores and others. They have
the advantage of four or more decades of proven durabiilty and
performance, but need careful planning to get the best application.
The sprinkle goodies are IMO a matter of fashion like granite
countertops. A non slid additive actually makes more sense, so ask
about such at the paint store or a good boat shop.
Regarding concerns about RustOleum products...I would use any of their
paints without a second thought. They have achieved their success in
the marketplace with top notch products for more than half a century.
I have always had good results with the brand. �HTH

Joe

concrete looks best as concrete........

all coatings fail and then you have a forever maintence issue

I put this stuff on 2 years ago on NEW concrete. The only place I've
had trouble is where the front wheels "skid," and it seems to have
come off in a couple of small places. The "sprinkles" cover a
multitude of sins. DO prep well, and DON'T put on in cold weather.
Nice warm day works great. I have a double garage, so needed two kits.
Also had to move stuff from one side of the garage to the other, so
total time was around a week, including prep and cure time. It sure is
easy to keep clean. I can simply hose it down, or use a push broom.
Grease dropping from my Jeep (it seems to be marking its territory)
come up easily. Can't beat it! NO idea what would happen if you were
putting it on over old/dirty concrete -- if you could get it clean
enough for good bonding. I also had about 1 pint left, so used that to
paint a small wood/chipboard bench top. Good for that as well.

On Mar 20, 6:49*pm, " wrote:

snip


concrete looks best as concrete........

You're quite correct if it is a sidewalk or pavement.

all coatings fail and then you have a forever maintence issue

That may have been the case in 1950, but not in this century. Google
is your friend and some simple research will give you more insight on
concrete treatments. The industry has many proprietary systems widely
used in factories today that run heavy forklifts 24/7 with minimal
maintenance. Machine shops and repair shops commonly use epoxy paints
today almost universally. Of course heavy traffic will affect any
paint or even concrete but the cost of keeping a concrete floor clean
is far higher than a painted floor, especially with grease and oil
spills. If you have to pay the bills or do the work, then a nice
painted floor is a no-brainer.
Cheers,

Joe

On Mar 21, 7:27�pm, Joe wrote:
On Mar 20, 6:49�pm, " wrote:

snip

concrete looks best as concrete........

You're quite correct if it is a sidewalk or pavement.

all coatings fail and then you have a forever maintence issue

That may have been the case in 1950, but not in this century. Google
is your friend and some simple research will give you more insight on
concrete treatments. The industry has many proprietary systems widely
used in factories today that run heavy forklifts 24/7 with minimal
maintenance. Machine shops and repair shops commonly use epoxy paints
today almost universally. Of course heavy traffic will affect any
paint or even concrete but the cost of keeping a concrete floor clean
is far higher than a painted floor, especially with grease and oil
spills. If you have to pay the bills or do the work, then a nice
painted floor is a no-brainer.
Cheers,

Joe

for a personal garage? now a car mechanic garage is different and the
garage looks more professional.

but a persons private garage? plain concrete or a matt is better
unless you want to redo it every year

On Mar 21, 10:32*pm, " wrote:

snip

but a persons private garage? plain concrete or a matt is better
unless you want to redo it every year

One thing you absolutely can't do is clean concrete free of oil and
grease. And one of the things that kills a house sale real quick is a
crummy concrete garage floor. As a matter of pride, many of us prefer
clean surroundings, hence the epoxy coated concrete in the garage. The
idea that it needs an annual recoating is absurd. My three year old
garage floor still looks like new. It may need some touch up in ten or
fifteen years, but then, maybe not. YMMV

Joe

On Mar 22, 1:45�pm, Joe wrote:
On Mar 21, 10:32�pm, " wrote:

snip
but a persons private garage? plain concrete or a matt is better
unless you want to redo it every year

One thing you absolutely can't do is clean concrete free of oil and
grease. And one of the things that kills a house sale real quick is a
crummy concrete garage floor. As a matter of pride, many of us prefer
clean surroundings, hence the epoxy coated concrete in the garage. The
idea that it needs an annual recoating is absurd. My three year old
garage floor still looks like new. It may need some touch up in ten or
fifteen years, but then, maybe not. YMMV

Joe
coating concrete is like painting brick A one time decision that
causes endless work.

at home resale time have it coated, even the epoxies fail probably
from high heat tires sitting.

but hey if you want to do the job over and over have fun enjoy
yourself

wrote:
....
at home resale time have it coated, even the epoxies fail probably
from high heat tires sitting.
...
That's just complete nonsense...you've obviously never used any of the
newer coatings.

--

"Joseph Meehan" wrote:

Well I did mine about 8 or 10 years ago and it still looks great.

If you buy second rate materials or don't prep it properly or don't
apply it properly, it will fail. Done right with the right materials, it
will give good service.

Same here. I've done two garage floors now with two part industrial epoxy in a
medium gray, concrete like color and about to do my third. Both floors lasted
well over 10 years without chipping or fading and was a key selling point when
it came time to sell the houses. You don't have to do gray though, there's
several canned colors to choose from or you can request a custom color.

I would not by a consumer brand finish from a big box store. Go to a real paint
dealer and get a real industrial coating.

A good two part epoxy won't absorb any spills and is a breeze to clean with a
damp mop or hose. I prefer a high gloss finish, but that can be a bit dicey if
you live where there's a lot of snow or rain. In those circumstances, a small
amount of the specified grit might be useful.

Putting the coating down is about 10% of the job. Skimp on the prep and you'll
regret it.

" wrote:

even the epoxies fail probably from high heat tires sitting.

Paint? Yes. Concrete stain? Yes. Two part epoxy applied properly and allowed to
cure for a week? Not in your lifetime.