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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

Hi;

Often I need to extract broken bolts / screws and am thinking about
picking up some left handed drill bits. Usually I have to extract
broken steel bolts and screws from aluminum heads and manifolds. Most
often they are broke off clean and need to be drilled. When looking at
drill bits to purchase, I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw


"komobu" wrote in message
...

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting
methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat


My favorite method is to center up an oversize hex nut (3/8
nut on a 1/4 bolt etc.) over
the broken remains, use a mig welder to weld the nut to the
broken stud/bolt.
Give it a shot of Kroil and unscrew. For small stuff drill
a hole in some sheet metal,
weld it to the screw, and weld a hex nut to the sheet metal.
Lots of Kroil, maybe run
it through a couple of heat/cool cycles, be patient. Works
90% + of the time.

Bill


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

Thanks Bill;

I had intended to say in the initial post that welding wasnt an option
for me, but I failed to do so!!! I want to learn how to weld but that
is another subject. My main question is on the composition of the
drill bits. What material should I look for in the drill bits?

Thanks Again
Pat
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

komobu wrote:
Hi;

Often I need to extract broken bolts / screws and am thinking about
picking up some left handed drill bits. Usually I have to extract
broken steel bolts and screws from aluminum heads and manifolds. Most
often they are broke off clean and need to be drilled. When looking at
drill bits to purchase, I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat


I use quality HSS bits because a) I don't need to do this very often and
b) HSS bits can be resharpened.

I haven't found an ez-out yet that works reliably. I usually end up
drilling out the bolt almost to the threads and busting the swarf out
with a bottom tap.

nate

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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

BillM wrote:
"komobu" wrote in message
...

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting
methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat



My favorite method is to center up an oversize hex nut (3/8
nut on a 1/4 bolt etc.) over
the broken remains, use a mig welder to weld the nut to the
broken stud/bolt.
Give it a shot of Kroil and unscrew. For small stuff drill
a hole in some sheet metal,
weld it to the screw, and weld a hex nut to the sheet metal.
Lots of Kroil, maybe run
it through a couple of heat/cool cycles, be patient. Works
90% + of the time.

Bill


Last time I tried that I found that the busted bolts I had to remove
were unhardened, and of some alloy that my MIG welder wouldn't penetrate
it worth a damn! let that be a lesson to you, always use Grade 5!

nate


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

On Dec 30, 2:39*pm, komobu wrote:
Hi;

Often I need to extract broken bolts / screws and am thinking about
picking up some left handed drill bits. Usually I have to extract
broken steel bolts and screws from aluminum heads and manifolds. Most
often they are broke off clean and need to be drilled. When looking at
drill bits to purchase, *I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat


Cobalt is a step up from regular HSS. Titanium is actually titanium
nitride, TiN, which is just a coating. It's the steel underneath that
is important.

Lots of ways to remove broken studs and screws without welding.

You're on the right track with the LH drills.

I've had fairly good luck with Easy-Outs. The trick is to use the
right size. Too small and it will snap. Too large and the remaining
screw will be thin enough that the Easy-Out will expand it.

Kroil, PB Blaster and the other penetrants are a must.

A hot alum solution will dissolve a steel screw without hurting the
aluminum head. Eventually. It works better on taps, because the
flutes allow it to work on the threads.

EDM is great if you can get the part to a shop that has the equipment.

John Martin
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw


"Nate Nagel" wrote: (clip) I haven't found an ez-out yet that works
reliably. I usually end up
drilling out the bolt almost to the threads and busting the swarf out with
a bottom tap.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The drill and tap method works for me, too. I HAVE found that Snap-on
extractors work well. They are not tapered. You drill with a drill that
they provide, and then drive in a splined shaft. Then slip on a nut with a
matching internal spline, that they also provide. Tapered easy-outs grip
only at the top of the drilled hole. Snap-ons grip all the way to the
bottom.


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

Any tool for extraction will work but it's the setup that counts.

For the highest success rate it is beset to follow this procedure,
especially when removing a hard bolt from a softer surrounding
material like aluminum.

1. If broken bolt is above surface grab it with vise grips, use a
engraving tool to buzz it out, or turn it with a sharp punch.

2. If this doesn't work grind the surface perpendicular to the
bolt.

3. With a magnifying glass if you need one, punch the
exact center of the bolt. Re-punch if you are off a bit.

4. Take a small drill and carefully without breaking the bit, drill
a pilot hole.

5. Step up to a larger drill that you feel you will not break
and adjust the drill location if necessary to make the
hole exactly in the center. Drill all the way through the
bolt if possible.

6. Now pick the correct size left hand drill, or drill/EZ out
combination.

If the bolt is bellow surface and uneven use steps three through
six. Pay great attention to step three, four and five.
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

I didn't have a lot of faith in the "GRABIT" system till someone gave me
a set of them .. .. worked great.

komobu wrote:
Hi;

Often I need to extract broken bolts / screws and am thinking about
picking up some left handed drill bits. Usually I have to extract
broken steel bolts and screws from aluminum heads and manifolds. Most
often they are broke off clean and need to be drilled. When looking at
drill bits to purchase, I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat

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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 15:37:54 -0500, Nate Nagel
wrote:

komobu wrote:
Hi;

Often I need to extract broken bolts / screws and am thinking about
picking up some left handed drill bits. Usually I have to extract
broken steel bolts and screws from aluminum heads and manifolds. Most
often they are broke off clean and need to be drilled. When looking at
drill bits to purchase, I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat


I use quality HSS bits because a) I don't need to do this very often and
b) HSS bits can be resharpened.

I haven't found an ez-out yet that works reliably. I usually end up
drilling out the bolt almost to the threads and busting the swarf out
with a bottom tap.

nate



Saw an ad on the TV the other night....Gator something. A set of
drill points on one end, and a matching easy out on the other. It was
used to drill a conical cavity in screw heads, and the matching spiral
easy out on the other end to remove the screwed up fastener.

Anyone know if these are worth a ****?

Gunner
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http://www.bubbadeals.com/prograbit.html

This is what I saw on TV. That one seemed IRRC to have either 4 or 5
extractors in the set.

Gunner
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw


Good post. I've never heard of the engraving tool trick.

By "buzz it out", do you mean the vibration helps the bolt to turn
easier?
Oren


It takes the place of a punch. Orient the engraver so
that it pushes the perimeter, or whatever is available in a
counterclockwise direction. This will only work if the bolt is
not completely seized but just inaccessible.
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

BillM wrote:
"komobu" wrote in message
...

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting
methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat



My favorite method is to center up an oversize hex nut (3/8
nut on a 1/4 bolt etc.) over
the broken remains, use a mig welder to weld the nut to the
broken stud/bolt.
Give it a shot of Kroil and unscrew. For small stuff drill
a hole in some sheet metal,
weld it to the screw, and weld a hex nut to the sheet metal.
Lots of Kroil, maybe run
it through a couple of heat/cool cycles, be patient. Works
90% + of the time.

Bill


Komobu said:

"I had intended to say in the initial post that welding wasnt an option
for me...I want to learn how to weld..."

*If* you have access to an oxy-acetylene torch with a cutting head, but
do not know how to weld, here is another handy-andy "hot wrench" trick.
It won't work in every situation, it can be quite messy, and gooey gobs
of red-hot sparks may fly in every direction. But sometimes it really
works well and may be the only way and/or last resort. In general, the
larger the diameter of the broken bolt, the better this works -- and not
just for broken bolts, but for broken or seized fasteners of all kinds.

Using a cutting torch head, adjust the oxygen and acetylene pressures as
you would to cut a piece of flat steel of roughly the same thickness, or
less, as the broken bolt's diameter. Heat the exposed area of the broken
bolt as rapidly as possible. Speed is of the essence here, or you may
end up welding the broken bolt to the surrounding material (which I have
done, thank you). The thing to keep in mind is to prevent the broken
bolt's surrounding material from approaching welding temperature. Once
this surrounding material begins to glow, it is time to remove the
torch, pause, and allow everything to cool down. Then, resume.

When the broken bolt end is red-hot, blast away with the oxygen. This
will vaporize the molten metal -- look out for red-hot molten metal
blowback upon your person. Repeat as needed until all of the broken bolt
has been vaporized. If the bolt was in a blind hole, you will have some
slag to clean out. If the bolt hole goes through, you can chase out the
larger bits of broken bolt by getting them red-hot also, and blasting
away with the cutting torch head's oxygen. In either case, *remember to
not allow the surrounding material to attain welding temperature*.
Finally, run a tap in and out and the bolt hole should be as good as
new. Well, almost as good as new...


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

Lots of helpful ways here to do many types of bolts and screws. I have
found that each one is different. And even two of the same types of, say,
bolts, the experience will be different.

But I have found a few things that apply straight across the board, and I
learned this at HKU.

First: Look at the situation. Don't be in a rush. Sometimes the best way
is the simplest. I have a lot of tools, and sometimes, I tend to
overengineer. And sometimes the simplest is the fastest. If it don't work,
you won't spend a lot of time on it before going to another strategy.

Second: You will probably get one chance. It will screw up or it will come
out. You'll fix it or you will ruin it. Make it a good shot.

Third: LET PENETRANTS WORK. I recently had a turnbuckle that was frozen.
I twisted the rod off in my hurry to get it off. Then I heated it with a
MAPP torch, applied some 3 in 1 oil and turned off the light. Next day, I
bought something like "Blaster" and hit it with some. About five minutes, I
wiggled the Vise Grips that was clamped to the stump, and it moved freely.
I don't think it was the Blaster, but letting the oil do its work and get
sucked in. So, if you use penetrants, let them soak long enough to do their
work.

Last: Pay attention to your gut when it says, "It feels like if I twist
this any farther, it will snap." 99% of the time, my gut was right.

Steve


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

Gunner Asch wrote:
http://www.bubbadeals.com/prograbit.html

This is what I saw on TV. That one seemed IRRC to have either 4 or 5
extractors in the set.

Gunner


Saw that too! Looked pretty good.
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

YUP .. . got a set .. .. works great and comes with a lifetime warranty
against breakage .. .. ..

Gunner Asch wrote:
http://www.bubbadeals.com/prograbit.html

This is what I saw on TV. That one seemed IRRC to have either 4 or 5
extractors in the set.

Gunner



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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

maxodyne wrote:
BillM wrote:

"komobu" wrote in message
...

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat




My favorite method is to center up an oversize hex nut (3/8 nut on a
1/4 bolt etc.) over
the broken remains, use a mig welder to weld the nut to the broken
stud/bolt.
Give it a shot of Kroil and unscrew. For small stuff drill a hole in
some sheet metal,
weld it to the screw, and weld a hex nut to the sheet metal. Lots of
Kroil, maybe run
it through a couple of heat/cool cycles, be patient. Works 90% + of
the time.

Bill

Komobu said:

"I had intended to say in the initial post that welding wasnt an option
for me...I want to learn how to weld..."

*If* you have access to an oxy-acetylene torch with a cutting head, but
do not know how to weld, here is another handy-andy "hot wrench" trick.
It won't work in every situation, it can be quite messy, and gooey gobs
of red-hot sparks may fly in every direction. But sometimes it really
works well and may be the only way and/or last resort. In general, the
larger the diameter of the broken bolt, the better this works -- and not
just for broken bolts, but for broken or seized fasteners of all kinds.

Using a cutting torch head, adjust the oxygen and acetylene pressures as
you would to cut a piece of flat steel of roughly the same thickness, or
less, as the broken bolt's diameter. Heat the exposed area of the broken
bolt as rapidly as possible. Speed is of the essence here, or you may
end up welding the broken bolt to the surrounding material (which I have
done, thank you). The thing to keep in mind is to prevent the broken
bolt's surrounding material from approaching welding temperature. Once
this surrounding material begins to glow, it is time to remove the
torch, pause, and allow everything to cool down. Then, resume.

When the broken bolt end is red-hot, blast away with the oxygen. This
will vaporize the molten metal -- look out for red-hot molten metal
blowback upon your person. Repeat as needed until all of the broken bolt
has been vaporized. If the bolt was in a blind hole, you will have some
slag to clean out. If the bolt hole goes through, you can chase out the
larger bits of broken bolt by getting them red-hot also, and blasting
away with the cutting torch head's oxygen. In either case, *remember to
not allow the surrounding material to attain welding temperature*.
Finally, run a tap in and out and the bolt hole should be as good as
new. Well, almost as good as new...


This method takes "a touch" that I don't have... got a lovely Studebaker
exhaust manifold with a melted flange to show for trying it guess I
need to find something consumable to practice on, but drilling really
isn't so bad.

nate

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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

Note that all the replies that suggest a Easy-out solution assume the
threads are not seized. Extractors are only usable if the bolt head is
sheared or fatigue broken. If the bolt head broke off because the
threads are seized,(and in Al with steel bolt, that's usually the case)
attempting to extract will only result in breaking off an extremely hard
extractor in the shank. If the threads are NOT seized, drilling all the
way through the shank to the space behind it with a pilot bit will allow
you to squirt a penatrant behind the threads, so it can work from both
sides. Snap-On's straight flute extractors work the best of the lot. The
most sure method, and the one I use the most ,if your skill level is up
to it, is to drill the shank dead nuts on center to the thread's minor
dia, and chase it out with a tap.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

komobu wrote:

Hi;

Often I need to extract broken bolts / screws and am thinking about
picking up some left handed drill bits. Usually I have to extract
broken steel bolts and screws from aluminum heads and manifolds. Most
often they are broke off clean and need to be drilled. When looking at
drill bits to purchase, I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?

Thanks for any advice
Pat



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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw


"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
...

"Nate Nagel" wrote: (clip) I haven't found an ez-out yet that works
reliably. I usually end up
drilling out the bolt almost to the threads and busting the swarf out
with a bottom tap.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The drill and tap method works for me, too. I HAVE found that Snap-on
extractors work well. They are not tapered. You drill with a drill that
they provide, and then drive in a splined shaft. Then slip on a nut with
a matching internal spline, that they also provide. Tapered easy-outs
grip only at the top of the drilled hole. Snap-ons grip all the way to
the bottom.

I have used those extractors for about 55 years with very good results. They
don't get them all out but I don't try any other type of extractor if the
bolt is so tight that it has twisted off. Ridgid also sells the same type of
extractor. I consider the tapered spiral extractors pretty useless. Some of
the newer short spline extractors look pretty promising but I have not used
them.

Don Young


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

Some bolts ain't gonna come out. Ever. For those, you may need to get
creative about drilling and tapping another hole nearby.

When I twist off a fastener head, leaving a small stub sticking out, I
have learned to NOT instantly grab the Vise-Grips. Because most of the
time what happens when I do is that I crush the stub and it breaks off
below the surface. Rather, I start with penetrating oil and I let it
soak while I get out the MIG welder and cut up a piece of sheet steel
about the size of a postage stamp as well as the No. 5 hand punch.
I punch a hole in the sheet steel just large enough so the stub will
fit through, then I use the MIG welder to weld the piece of sheet
steel to the sheared-off fastener. Then I weld a nut to the piece
of sheet steel, and use a wrench to gain a purchase. The combination
of the penetrating oil, the heating/cooling of the welding, and the
well-coupled torque via the welded nut will generally get it out
if it's coming out.

If I shear off the nut/sheet steel, then I start thinking about
alternative holes. If it's an aluminum workpiece and steel fastener,
then I can get out the product called "Tap Out" (which I buy at my
local machine shop supply and have never been able to find online)
which is a kit containing material to build a dam and a solution
which will dissolve the steel fastener.

If I'm going to try drilling down the axis of the stuck fastener,
I'll use a left hand drill. I got a set of those in the easyout type
kit I got from Craftsman. Of course, a left hand drill is rotating
in the direction where if it binds up in the fastener the drill's
torque might spin the fastener out.

But some fasteners ain't coming out. Ever. Get over it.

Grant

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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

On Dec 30, 11:39 am, komobu wrote:
I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?


Basically, Cobalt is the best, but you'll pay for it. Titanium is
actually Titanium Nitride, which is a coating applied to regular HSS
bits. Your best bet is to buy a complete screw extraction set from a
quality manufacturer. In my autoshop, we do a lot of drilling out of
all sorts of bolts, screws, and studs snapped off in engine blocks,
rear axles, transmissions, and other parts. We have a set from Irwin
with left hand cobalt drill bits from 1/16-1/2" by 1/64", 5 spiral
screw extractors (the long ones that you use with a tap handle), and
about 16 multispline extractors (the ones that are only about 1.5-2
diameters long, used with a 1/2" socket) New it cost about $250, but
it has saved us thousands in scrapped parts.

As an aside, if you don't have a close quarters drill that can be
reversed, you should buy one. I find that many of the bolts that are
snapped off are that way specifically because they are in close
quarters or are awkward to reach, and therefore were pulled from the
side, bent, etc. I have a 3/8" air drill that's less than 3" wide
(the chuck is at right angles to the body of the tool), but it can't
reverse to use the left hand drill bits. I use a close quarters
electric drill that is reversible for my LH bits.

Hope that helps
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

On Dec 30, 2:03*pm, komobu wrote:
Thanks Bill;

I had intended to say in the initial post that welding wasnt an option
for me, but I failed to do so!!! I want to learn how to weld but that
is another subject.


What are you afraid of? It isn't neurosurgery. Harbor Freight has
entry level MIG's at decent prices, and for the $$ you spend on one
you'll save hours and hours of time that you would otherwise waste
screwing around with drills, guide bushings 'easy (not) outs', busted
taps and all the other hassles.
Bill M is dead right on the technique. Personally, I have quite a few
decades of auto repair work involving cylinder heads both high
performance and stock. The oxyacetylene torch and the MIG rig are your
friends, and you will find, as I did, that the time saving and quality
of work is worth more than you realize. HTH

Joe
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On 2007-12-30, komobu wrote:
Hi;

Often I need to extract broken bolts / screws and am thinking about
picking up some left handed drill bits. Usually I have to extract
broken steel bolts and screws from aluminum heads and manifolds. Most
often they are broke off clean and need to be drilled. When looking at
drill bits to purchase, I see they are made of HSS, Cobalt and
Titanium. What drill bit material is the best for staying sharp and
long lasting life?


Well ... first off -- they are *not* made of titanium, though
some may list them as so made.

What those are are (hopefully) HSS or Cobalt steel coated with
Titanium Nitride (TiN) for longer wear life.

I, personally, would go for the Cobalt steel, probably in screw
machine length, and with split points.

I don't see the TiN coating being any help in this -- it is more of a
help in production machining of specific materials. *And* -- it often
is used to try to make people think that poor steel bits are better than
they really are. You can get TiN coatings on both excellent steel and
total junk steel. (With some experience, you may become able to tell
the difference by sight in many cases.)

You'll be drilling tough bolts (thus the Cobalt steel) -- it is a bit
better at cutting tough steels than plain HSS in my experience.

You'll probably be drilling with a hand held electric drill motor, so
the split points will offer two benefits:

1) It will be easier to start the holes without the bits
walking.

2) It will reduce the force which you will need to apply
to drill through, making it easier to control the drill
and keep it properly aligned with the hole.

Now the one thing which might argue for HSS instead of Cobalt steel is
that for the smaller sizes, MSC wants to sell the bits in packages of
12, and in cobalt steel they get expensive rather rapidly. (It has been
some time since I bought left-handed bits, but I recently bought some
right-handed screw-machine length cobalts steel with split points to
replace some lost out of an index of similar bits. (I found most of
them on the floor, but about three seem to have run under the drill
press and hidden with the swarf which has made its way there. :-(
Anyway -- we were talking about $20.00 per size. -- Ouch!

Also, please comment on grabit and other extracting methods. What do
you think is the easiest way to remove a broken bolt?


No experience with the grabit. The usual broken screw
extractors work sometimes -- but are more likely to break in the screw,
leaving you with something even harder to drill out -- which will
probably need solid carbide bits. :-)

Good Luck,
DoN.

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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw


"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Dec 30, 2:03 pm, komobu wrote:
Thanks Bill;

I had intended to say in the initial post that welding wasnt an option
for me, but I failed to do so!!! I want to learn how to weld but that
is another subject.


What are you afraid of? It isn't neurosurgery. Harbor Freight has
entry level MIG's at decent prices, and for the $$ you spend on one
you'll save hours and hours of time that you would otherwise waste
screwing around with drills, guide bushings 'easy (not) outs', busted
taps and all the other hassles.
Bill M is dead right on the technique. Personally, I have quite a few
decades of auto repair work involving cylinder heads both high
performance and stock. The oxyacetylene torch and the MIG rig are your
friends, and you will find, as I did, that the time saving and quality
of work is worth more than you realize. HTH

Joe

HF welders make good boat anchors. If you're serious about learning to
weld, you can find a used Lincoln or Miller for the same price and have a
REAL welder.

Steve




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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw


"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...
On 2007-12-30, Oren wrote:
On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 16:18:19 -0500, wrote:

Any tool for extraction will work but it's the setup that counts.


[ ... ]

1. If broken bolt is above surface grab it with vise grips, use a
engraving tool to buzz it out, or turn it with a sharp punch.


[ ... ]

Good post. I've never heard of the engraving tool trick.

By "buzz it out", do you mean the vibration helps the bolt to turn
easier?


This is (I think) the kind of engraving tool which has a carbide
point in an adjustable vibrator Something like a "Burgess Vibro-Graver".
You place the point on an area away from the center of the broken bolt,
but not too close to the threads, and angle it so is is driving both
down into the bolt and CCW. This is likely to get the bolt out --
though to be honest, I've never tried it.

I'll have to remember to try that next time I have that
problem. :-)

Enjoy -- and now "Happy New Year",
DoN.


I have had several bolts break off flush, and could still be turned with
just the point of an ice pick, or one of those little dental tools. A
"buzzer" would impart a little force on there. Putting penetrant on there
and leaving it sit surely wouldn't hurt. Critical points is that the
threads are not boogered up, and that you put the point on the broken piece
and keep it towards the center away from the threads. A lot of times, the
break leaves a slight "shoulder" that the point can be pushed against.

Steve


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

SteveB wrote:
"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...
On 2007-12-30, Oren wrote:
On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 16:18:19 -0500, wrote:

Any tool for extraction will work but it's the setup that counts.

[ ... ]

1. If broken bolt is above surface grab it with vise grips, use a
engraving tool to buzz it out, or turn it with a sharp punch.

[ ... ]

Good post. I've never heard of the engraving tool trick.

By "buzz it out", do you mean the vibration helps the bolt to turn
easier?

This is (I think) the kind of engraving tool which has a carbide
point in an adjustable vibrator Something like a "Burgess Vibro-Graver".
You place the point on an area away from the center of the broken bolt,
but not too close to the threads, and angle it so is is driving both
down into the bolt and CCW. This is likely to get the bolt out --
though to be honest, I've never tried it.

I'll have to remember to try that next time I have that
problem. :-)

Enjoy -- and now "Happy New Year",
DoN.


I have had several bolts break off flush, and could still be turned with
just the point of an ice pick, or one of those little dental tools. A
"buzzer" would impart a little force on there. Putting penetrant on there
and leaving it sit surely wouldn't hurt. Critical points is that the
threads are not boogered up, and that you put the point on the broken piece
and keep it towards the center away from the threads. A lot of times, the
break leaves a slight "shoulder" that the point can be pushed against.

Steve


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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw


"dpb" wrote in message ...
DoN. Nichols wrote:
On 2007-12-30, Oren wrote:
On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 16:18:19 -0500, wrote:

Any tool for extraction will work but it's the setup that counts.


[ ... ]

1. If broken bolt is above surface grab it with vise grips, use a
engraving tool to buzz it out, or turn it with a sharp punch.


[ ... ]

Good post. I've never heard of the engraving tool trick.

By "buzz it out", do you mean the vibration helps the bolt to turn
easier?


This is (I think) the kind of engraving tool which has a carbide
point in an adjustable vibrator Something like a "Burgess Vibro-Graver".
You place the point on an area away from the center of the broken bolt,
but not too close to the threads, and angle it so is is driving both
down into the bolt and CCW. This is likely to get the bolt out --
though to be honest, I've never tried it.


In that case, what's the point of the vise grips?

This suggestion needs more explanation to make any sense to me -- if the
bolt is so bound as to have caused it to twist off in place, seems
unlikely this is going to work -- although I've no such engraving tool,
either.

I'm the heat cycle kinda' guy, meself...

I do like the idea of the tack-weld a new nut on -- now if I only had a
MIG or wire-feed unit instead of (or in addition to) the stick...


Sometimes a bolt head will shear off because of sideways forces, and not be
in the threads hard. Sometimes there is not enough sticking up to get a
vise grip on there. I have had several that once you got it turned a couple
of turns with an ice pick, you could get it the rest of the way out with
your fingers.

They're all different.

Steve


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SteveB wrote:
"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...

On 2007-12-30, Oren wrote:

On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 16:18:19 -0500, wrote:


Any tool for extraction will work but it's the setup that counts.


[ ... ]


1. If broken bolt is above surface grab it with vise grips, use a
engraving tool to buzz it out, or turn it with a sharp punch.


[ ... ]


Good post. I've never heard of the engraving tool trick.

By "buzz it out", do you mean the vibration helps the bolt to turn
easier?


This is (I think) the kind of engraving tool which has a carbide
point in an adjustable vibrator Something like a "Burgess Vibro-Graver".
You place the point on an area away from the center of the broken bolt,
but not too close to the threads, and angle it so is is driving both
down into the bolt and CCW. This is likely to get the bolt out --
though to be honest, I've never tried it.

I'll have to remember to try that next time I have that
problem. :-)

Enjoy -- and now "Happy New Year",
DoN.



I have had several bolts break off flush, and could still be turned with
just the point of an ice pick, or one of those little dental tools. A
"buzzer" would impart a little force on there. Putting penetrant on there
and leaving it sit surely wouldn't hurt. Critical points is that the
threads are not boogered up, and that you put the point on the broken piece
and keep it towards the center away from the threads. A lot of times, the
break leaves a slight "shoulder" that the point can be pushed against.

Steve


Yup, I've done that many times, usually using a piece of hardened steel
shaft (actually often a broken "knockout pin" from a cold heading
machine, because that was the type of machinery I was working on) ground
to a fine point on a bench grinder and a 3 lb. hammer. A nail might
work in a pinch although you'll undoubtedly ruin it - the modified
knockout punch was reusable, so I only had to make one every couple
months or so. That only works on bolts that have broken due to fatigue
or overtightening though, not ones that snapped when loosening due to
threads being seized.

nate

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In that case, what's the point of the vise grips?

This suggestion needs more explanation to make any sense to me -- if the
bolt is so bound as to have caused it to twist off in place, seems
unlikely this is going to work -- although I've no such engraving tool,
either.


Who's to say the bolt broke because of torque?
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

I have 3 broken taps in aluminum that I need to get out.

Could someone please expand on this advice? "A hot alum solution will
dissolve a steel screw without hurting the
aluminum head. Eventually. It works better on taps"

So all I need to do is hop down to my local grocery store and buy some
Alum, heat it up with water and let it sit over the broken taps?

Any other advice is appreciated. Since these are taps made of
hardended metal I don't think I can drill them out. I thought about
taking a dreml tool and a sand off disk to notch them and try to use a
flat headed screw driver to extract them.

Thanks, Rolland
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Default Extracting broken bolt / screw

On 2008-01-01, dpb wrote:
DoN. Nichols wrote:
On 2007-12-30, Oren wrote:


[ ... ]

Good post. I've never heard of the engraving tool trick.

By "buzz it out", do you mean the vibration helps the bolt to turn
easier?


This is (I think) the kind of engraving tool which has a carbide
point in an adjustable vibrator Something like a "Burgess Vibro-Graver".
You place the point on an area away from the center of the broken bolt,
but not too close to the threads, and angle it so is is driving both
down into the bolt and CCW. This is likely to get the bolt out --
though to be honest, I've never tried it.


In that case, what's the point of the vise grips?


Certainly not for gripping a screw or bolt which has broken off
flush. :-)

This suggestion needs more explanation to make any sense to me -- if the
bolt is so bound as to have caused it to twist off in place, seems
unlikely this is going to work -- although I've no such engraving tool,
either.


*But* -- if the bolt has been overtorqued and broken from
tension -- or what was bolted down got levered up to overtension the
bolt, it would be likely to break off at the first thread outside the
threaded hole -- since there would be no support there. Those bolts are
more likely to work with the "buzzing out" approach.

Certainly if it has rusted into its hole, and then broken off
from torque when someone is trying to *remove* it, then the heat approach
is more likely to work.

I'm the heat cycle kinda' guy, meself...


But I don't have a welder, so it is unlikely to work for *me*. :-)

I do like the idea of the tack-weld a new nut on -- now if I only had a
MIG or wire-feed unit instead of (or in addition to) the stick...


Whenever I finally get a welder, I'm thinking of the Maxstar
140, which is both stick and Tig. I don't think that I'll need to weld
anything larger than that. And the problem simply is finding one which
I can afford at the moment. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

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