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#1
Posted to alt.home.repair, pdaxs.services.plumbing, sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve
mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. |
#2
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 04:27:17 -0800 (PST), Doc
wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. I'd use muriatic acid on just the element. If you can't get the element out due to corrosion, then put some acid in a spray bottle and cut the lime with that until it is out. Then put a couple cups in a capped pvc pipe and dunk/rinse. You can get the acid at a pool place if your local borg doesn't carry it. Use goggles, gloves & a respirator- and wear your old jeans. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. I'd rather replace the tank than remove/fill/rinse/rinse/rinse, & roll around in between each rinse. Jim |
#3
Posted to alt.home.repair, pdaxs.services.plumbing, sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
Doc wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. Two hings come to mind. (1) Fill it with a cider vinegar solution and let it set for awhile should work and is pretty safe.. (2) would be a muratic acid solution, which would do the trick, but is much more potent and so, harder to determine strength of solution and time to let work. So I would try the vinegar first. a gallon of vinegar is realitive inexpensive and fairly safe to use. As actually you could taste the solution to determine how stong it was without any danger. Not so with muratic acid! |
#4
Posted to alt.home.repair, pdaxs.services.plumbing, sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 9:32�am, Jack wrote:
Doc wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. Two hings come to mind. (1) �Fill it with a cider vinegar solution and let it set for awhile should work and is pretty safe.. (2) would be a muratic acid solution, which would do the trick, but is much more potent and so, harder to determine strength of solution and time to let work. So I would try the vinegar first. a gallon of vinegar is realitive inexpensive and fairly safe to use. As actually you could taste the solution to determine how stong it was without any danger. Not so with muratic acid! is the tank old? probably Its a bad investment in time and money. the crud you clean will likely cause a leak either short term or long term. besides a new hot water tank will reward you in greater capacity and overall lower operating expenses. new tanks are foam lined and much more efficent than old ones. to prevent this from reoccuring buy a new tank and add a water conditioner, no more crud in tank. whats a nice new warrantied 12 year tank cost installed? around 500 bucks. but think in 12 years thats less than 42 bucks a year. geez that isnt even the cost of a candy bar a week. disturbing old tanks results in leaks............ |
#5
Posted to alt.home.repair, pdaxs.services.plumbing, sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 8:32 am, Jack wrote:
Doc wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. Two hings come to mind. (1) Fill it with a cider vinegar solution and let it set for awhile should work and is pretty safe.. (2) would be a muratic acid solution, which would do the trick, but is much more potent and so, harder to determine strength of solution and time to let work. So I would try the vinegar first. a gallon of vinegar is realitive inexpensive and fairly safe to use. As actually you could taste the solution to determine how stong it was without any danger. Not so with muratic acid! I think anything strong enough would damage the parts of the tank like where the drain valve is, I dought its 100% glass lined, call the manufacturer. |
#6
Posted to alt.home.repair,pdaxs.services.plumbing,sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 04:27:17 -0800 (PST), Doc
wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. Absolutely not. |
#7
Posted to alt.home.repair,pdaxs.services.plumbing,sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
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#8
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 06:32:27 -0800 (PST), Jack
wrote: Doc wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. Two hings come to mind. (1) Fill it with a cider vinegar solution and let it set for awhile should work and is pretty safe.. (2) would be a muratic acid solution, which would do the trick, but is much more potent and so, harder to determine strength of solution and time to let work. So I would try the vinegar first. a gallon of vinegar is realitive inexpensive and fairly safe to use. As actually you could taste the solution to determine how stong it was without any danger. Not so with muratic acid! I can't imagine anyone using muratic acid. Even diluted, it will attack metal because it is a strong acid, unlike acetic acid (vinegar) which is a weak acid. High-school chemistry. |
#9
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
"Phisherman" wrote in message I can't imagine anyone using muratic acid. Even diluted, it will attack metal because it is a strong acid, unlike acetic acid (vinegar) which is a weak acid. High-school chemistry. If not properly rinsed out and diluted, it will also be on your face in the shower. I'd rather not risk it. |
#10
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 10:36�am, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
"Phisherman" wrote in message I can't imagine anyone using muratic acid. �Even diluted, it will attack metal because it is a strong acid, unlike acetic acid (vinegar) which is a weak acid. �High-school chemistry. If not properly rinsed out and diluted, it will also be on your face in the shower. �I'd rather not risk it. ask this old house had a piece on this, rich flushed the tank, fixed a minor leak but warned it might not work. 2 months later the tank failed, and they did a autopsey Although he had repeatedly flushed with powerful streams of water the tank was half full of gunk, they had cut a hole in it. thats why he always recoimmends replacing tanks full of junk, because they are near their end of life and will soon fail. trying to flush with enough vinegar to do much will likely cost 50 bucks, have you priced vinegar lately? just pouring a gallon or two in will be ineffective |
#11
Posted to alt.home.repair,pdaxs.services.plumbing,sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
... On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 04:27:17 -0800 (PST), Doc wrote: .... I'd rather replace the tank than remove/fill/rinse/rinse/rinse, & roll around in between each rinse. I second that motion. The metal of the tank is not impervious to most anything used that will attack "stone". Better to run your hot water fill through an RO unit... or at least some of its makeup. David A. Smith |
#12
Posted to alt.home.repair, pdaxs.services.plumbing, sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 5:27 am, Doc wrote:
Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Here in Tucson, the mineral content is high, but instead of forming hard scale, the deposits are thin and soupy and easy to flush out. If the deposits are muddy, I'd recommend backflushing first. This will involve disconnecting some pipes. When removing scale by any means, be sure to drain water from the heater valve and don't run it forward through the household system, or you may end up with bigger problems if chunks and pebbles of dislodged minerals run into the pipes, and a monster plumbing bill. . You can use any acid, or citric acid, and let it sit in the heater for some time without heat. Then drain or backflush. Don't expect success, though, it's a tough, nasty job and some scale just won't budge. Dangerous Bill |
#13
Posted to alt.home.repair, pdaxs.services.plumbing, sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 6:27 am, Doc wrote:
Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. If you absolutely must experiment with a scale dissolving acid, use oxalic acid, which you can buy as automotive radiator flush. It is more potent than acetic acid, and far less harmful than muriatic (hydrochloric) acid. $$-wise it will be less costly, but you're still going to spend a fair amount, since the capacity of a typical automotive system (one package) is 1/10th or less of a water heater. HTH Joe |
#14
Posted to alt.home.repair,pdaxs.services.plumbing,sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
"Bill Penrose" wrote in message ... On Dec 8, 5:27 am, Doc wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Here in Tucson, the mineral content is high, but instead of forming hard scale, the deposits are thin and soupy and easy to flush out. If the deposits are muddy, I'd recommend backflushing first. This will involve disconnecting some pipes. When removing scale by any means, be sure to drain water from the heater valve and don't run it forward through the household system, or you may end up with bigger problems if chunks and pebbles of dislodged minerals run into the pipes, and a monster plumbing bill. . You can use any acid, or citric acid, and let it sit in the heater for some time without heat. Then drain or backflush. Don't expect success, though, it's a tough, nasty job and some scale just won't budge. Dangerous Bill Bill, Is your water softened? If so, the stuff you're removing isn't the same as the typical hard water build up. IIRC, the softener converts calcium carbonate (hard stuff) to sodium bicarbonate which is flaky when dry but mushy (thin and soupy?) when wet. Flushing or dissolving sodium bicarbonate is relatively easy. Just remember the "IIRC" I qualified my chemistry with : ) |
#15
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
clipped
Bill, Is your water softened? If so, the stuff you're removing isn't the same as the typical hard water build up. IIRC, the softener converts calcium carbonate (hard stuff) to sodium bicarbonate which is flaky when dry but mushy (thin and soupy?) when wet. Flushing or dissolving sodium bicarbonate is relatively easy. Just remember the "IIRC" I qualified my chemistry with : ) And adding a strong acid to that will do what? Got a pressure valve? |
#16
Posted to alt.home.repair, pdaxs.services.plumbing, sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 11:15 am, "DonC" wrote:
Is your water softened? If so, the stuff you're removing isn't the same as the typical hard water build up. IIRC, the softener converts calcium carbonate (hard stuff) to sodium bicarbonate which is flaky when dry but mushy (thin and soupy?) when wet. Nobody around here softens their water because the mineral content is so high a softener would be exhausted almost immediately. Evaporation forms black rings inside the toilet bowl that won't come off without chemical help. A water softener contains cation and anion exchangers that replace calcium and magnesium with sodium, and carbonates and sulfates with chloride. Again, because water is scarce here in the Sonoran Desert, the backwashing needed to regenerate the filter would be an unconscionable waste. DB |
#17
Posted to alt.home.repair,pdaxs.services.plumbing,sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
"Bill Penrose" wrote in message ... On Dec 8, 11:15 am, "DonC" wrote: Is your water softened? If so, the stuff you're removing isn't the same as the typical hard water build up. IIRC, the softener converts calcium carbonate (hard stuff) to sodium bicarbonate which is flaky when dry but mushy (thin and soupy?) when wet. Nobody around here softens their water because the mineral content is so high a softener would be exhausted almost immediately. Evaporation forms black rings inside the toilet bowl that won't come off without chemical help. A water softener contains cation and anion exchangers that replace calcium and magnesium with sodium, and carbonates and sulfates with chloride. Again, because water is scarce here in the Sonoran Desert, the backwashing needed to regenerate the filter would be an unconscionable waste. DB I'm 25 miles south of Tucson in Green Valley so my water quality must be close to yours. Very hard! I'd guess that over half the people here have softeners. We don't yet because there's no iron in the water to discolor things. I'm sure we'd have one if we had a basement like everywhere else we've lived. It's hard to redo the plumbing when everything's buried under the slab. So the options are 100% softened which we don't want. Or only hot water softened which doesn't work out well since the cold water is so warm. |
#18
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 06:32:27 -0800 (PST), Jack
wrote: Doc wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. Two hings come to mind. (1) Fill it with a cider vinegar solution and let it set for awhile should work and is pretty safe.. (2) would be a muratic acid solution, which would do the trick, but is much more potent and so, harder to determine strength of solution and time to let work. So I would try the vinegar first. a gallon of vinegar is realitive inexpensive and fairly safe to use. As actually you could taste the solution to determine how stong it was without any danger. Not so with muratic acid! I'll second the vinegar method. I would NOT use any acid or chemicals in a device that provides fresh water. Personally, I'd just open the drain valve and flush it for a half hour, then shut off the cold water supply valve and drain the tank, refill and repeat once again. When you drain the tank, open at least one hot water faucet in the house to allow air to enter into the tank. To those who suggest replacing a (working) tank, you got way too much money. I'd be happy to take some off your hands. |
#19
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
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#20
Posted to alt.home.repair,pdaxs.services.plumbing,sci.chem
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
replace it. period.
you also have a Mg anode rod in it to contend with. once that is gone, you get electrolytic corrosion that makes a blowout a matter of time. its not a question of "if". its a matter of "when." as far as softening goes, (the quality of the rest of the pipes in your house (especially the hot water pipes) can be just as suspect as your hot water heater) it's cheap insurance. it preserves your pipes and your hot water tank. and it doesn't use that much water on recharge. it exchanges out Ca, Mg, preferentially, and Fe and Mn if you add a calcium chloride pretreatment tank. they are sized based on how much water you use and how much and what kind of hardness you have. adding on a softener now can bring your pipes back over time, if they've narrowed from deposits. you'll find that your soaps do a MUCH better job cleaning. at a much lower usage rate. no. i don't work for culligan or kinetico. i lived with unbelievably hard water in IN and CT before i went the softened water route here in NH. there's no going back..... |
#21
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 9:41 am, " wrote:
is the tank old? probably I installed new maybe 5 - 6 months ago. I figure I should drain & clean it out at least twice a year, lots of minerals in the water around here - central Florida. The "stuff" in the bottom of the tank seems to build up quick. I used to do the old one maybe every year and a half or so but that seemed like too long an interval. I got about 19 years out of it. |
#22
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolvedeposits?
On Dec 8, 10:50 pm, wrote:
I think that they are suggesting that he not waste time and money and replace the tank. Obviously the tank is not working right or the op would not have posted the inquiry. Not at all the case, it's about 6 months old, I'm just looking at preventative maintenance. On the old one that was replaced, I used to drain it with a hose, then remove the bottom element, go through the hole and break up the mineral buildup inside with a long stiff wire, suck the stuff out with a wet/dry vac, adding more water as I went with curved piece of automotive hose with the end cut at an angle and duct-taped to the end of the vac - this allowed me to get all around inside the tank. Then flushed it out again and then reinstalled the bottom element. I was just wondering if there was anything I could use to chemically break up the sediment without manually going in there and breaking it up as described above, maybe hitting when the sediment buildup wasn't as advanced. |
#23
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
Dear Doc:
"Doc" wrote in message ... On Dec 8, 10:50 pm, wrote: .... I installed new maybe 5 - 6 months ago. I figure I should drain & clean it out at least twice a year, lots of minerals in the water around here - central Florida. And how. Not at all the case, it's about 6 months old, I'm just looking at preventative maintenance. .... I was just wondering if there was anything I could use to chemically break up the sediment without manually going in there and breaking it up as described above, maybe hitting when the sediment buildup wasn't as advanced. http://www.approvedarticles.com/Arti...r-heaters/2818 http://www.floridasof****er.com/facts.cfm Some sales blurb on softeners: http://www.waterfilter-usa.com/page....78dd827af9f971 David A. Smith |
#24
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 04:27:17 -0800 (PST), Doc
wrote: Is there anything I can pour into a water heater that will dissolve mineral deposits and definitely not damage anything inside the tank? Hopefuly something that will work in a somewhat diluted solution since buying enough Lime-Away etc. to fill far enough to reach the lower element obviously isn't practical. The tank is installed in such a way that once drained it would be simple to detach it and move it around so rinsing and draining several times shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Thanks for all input. Whirlpool recommends: turn the power off; close both valves; disconnect the hot water pipe; drain a little more than a gallon of water; pour one gallon of cider vinegar into the hot water fitting; let it set for 6 hours; drain/refill/flush 3 times; put back in service. --Andy Asberry-- ------Texas----- |
#25
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
replying to Doc, Toodlesbug wrote:
I can't understand why a bottle of Lime-Away wouldn't work. I'd dump it in when the tank was about 1/4 full and leave it overnight. Lime-Away sure works to dissolve crud in a pan I've been adding water to on the stove to humidify the house in the winter, and it does NOT dissolve metal or glass or plastic. Just the crud. -- posted from http://www.homeownershub.com/plumbin...-dep-2612-.htm |
#26
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
On Saturday, April 9, 2016 at 5:29:03 PM UTC-4, Toodlesbug wrote:
replying to Doc, Toodlesbug wrote: I can't understand why a bottle of Lime-Away wouldn't work. I'd dump it in when the tank was about 1/4 full and leave it overnight. Lime-Away sure works to dissolve crud in a pan I've been adding water to on the stove to humidify the house in the winter, and it does NOT dissolve metal or glass or plastic. Just the crud. -- posted from http://www.homeownershub.com/plumbin...-dep-2612-.htm the crud is likely plugging leakes in the tank. so messing with it will likely require replacing the tank really soon BTW this discussion was originally from 2007. i sure hope google self driving cars are better than their news group software |
#27
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
replying to Jack, packrat wrote:
You can certainly taste dilute Muriatic (Hydrochloric) acid.(1%)Your stomach acid is stronger. -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/plumbi...-dep-2612-.htm |
#28
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Anything I can pour into water heater that will dissolve deposits?
replying to do_see, Kelly Knight wrote:
Muriatic acid is perfectly safe if used properly. Do not use it in your house the fumes will overwhelm anybody around. Turn the electric & water to the tank. If gas shut off gas & disconnect at the union. If electric turn off power disconnect the 3 wires usually in a cover plate on top and any other electric or gas connectors. Take the tank outside. I use an appliance dolly. If there are hot and cold water shutoff and unions take them apart before you try to move it. Most should if installed correctly. If cut off etc... To break it free. Once outside pour about 8 ounces of muriatic in the fill tube.wearing rubber gloves safety glasses face shield maybe a shop apron. The acid will cause a reaction like a volcano depending on how bad it is . keep a garden hose ready to spray down the overflow on the tank. Always start this in small increments of acid until it starts foaming out of the tank fill tube or drain. The anode tube will need replacing which costs a few bucks available just about anywhere. The elements will likely need replacing and difficult to get out if they're bent . there is a tool specifically made just to remove the electric heating elements. Flush with water and vinegar solution a few times and you should be good to go. Sounds like a lot but your bigges6cost is time this shouldn't cost more than 25 to 50 bucks after you reinstall anything that had to be cut like pc which is very cheap. You just saved yourself around$500. Without paying a plumber which could easily cost 2- $500. More. -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/plumbi...-dep-2612-.htm |
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