Per an earlier discussion, I have been trying to ensure that I will
not have a future problem with T&P valves in my house... bought a
pressure gauge at the Despot last night on my way home from work
(there's a rant in there, but not pertinent) hooked it up, system
pressure is about 68-70 PSI falling to 60 PSI with a faucet open and
momentarily spiking to maybe 78 PSI. This is measured in the
basement, at about the level of the T&P valves. I left the gauge
connected overnight and the hot water heater went through at least two
cycles and the telltale did not rise.

Everything I've read says that pressure should be regulated to 60 PSI
or less, I am guessing since I did not experience a rise in pressure
when the water heater cycled that I don't have a BFP on the main water
line (actually, the weird thing is I don't even know if I have a
meter, I can't see one unless it is buried underground) so "by the
book" I should install a pressure reducer set for 60 PSI but since a
pressure reducer would also act as a BFP I would then need to add an
expansion tank as well.

Question is, is this really necessary or is 70 PSI OK? I'm not
looking to spend a lot of money on plumbing but if the high pressure
could potentially cause an issue I guess I should take care of it.

thanks,

nate

PS - the Home Despot rant. Found a Watts brand "test gauge" at the
Despot on my way home from work (pressure gauge with telltale, screwed
into a female garden hose fitting) bought it, took it home, found that
the telltale was bent so that it didn't catch the gauge needle. Went
to a different Despot near my house, they didn't have a gauge to
exchange it. Drove back the other direction to go to the original
store, told the guy I wanted to exchange the gauge, well either he
didn't speak English well enough to understand or just didn't know
that you could do a straight exchange, so he refunded my money and I
had to buy another one, meaning I had to stand in line again for 20
minutes to check out... grr... probably wasted a good two hours on
this whole exercise. And then I had to run out again to get matches
(see my other post from this morning) so I didn't even get home until
close to 9 PM. I'm really starting to get sick of plumbing stuff.

"N8N" wrote in message
ups.com...
Per an earlier discussion, I have been trying to ensure that I will
not have a future problem with T&P valves in my house... bought a
pressure gauge at the Despot last night on my way home from work
(there's a rant in there, but not pertinent) hooked it up, system
pressure is about 68-70 PSI falling to 60 PSI with a faucet open and
momentarily spiking to maybe 78 PSI. This is measured in the
basement, at about the level of the T&P valves. I left the gauge
connected overnight and the hot water heater went through at least two
cycles and the telltale did not rise.

Everything I've read says that pressure should be regulated to 60 PSI
or less, I am guessing since I did not experience a rise in pressure
when the water heater cycled that I don't have a BFP on the main water
line (actually, the weird thing is I don't even know if I have a
meter, I can't see one unless it is buried underground) so "by the
book" I should install a pressure reducer set for 60 PSI but since a
pressure reducer would also act as a BFP I would then need to add an
expansion tank as well.

Question is, is this really necessary or is 70 PSI OK? I'm not
looking to spend a lot of money on plumbing but if the high pressure
could potentially cause an issue I guess I should take care of it.

thanks,

nate

PS - the Home Despot rant. Found a Watts brand "test gauge" at the
Despot on my way home from work (pressure gauge with telltale, screwed
into a female garden hose fitting) bought it, took it home, found that
the telltale was bent so that it didn't catch the gauge needle. Went
to a different Despot near my house, they didn't have a gauge to
exchange it. Drove back the other direction to go to the original
store, told the guy I wanted to exchange the gauge, well either he
didn't speak English well enough to understand or just didn't know
that you could do a straight exchange, so he refunded my money and I
had to buy another one, meaning I had to stand in line again for 20
minutes to check out... grr... probably wasted a good two hours on
this whole exercise. And then I had to run out again to get matches
(see my other post from this morning) so I didn't even get home until
close to 9 PM. I'm really starting to get sick of plumbing stuff.


Sounds like it's time to stop shopping at HD, and find a plumbing specialty
store, which will end up costing you less in the long run, especially when
you factor in the price of gasoline, and the legal fees you'll pay after you
strangle the next HD moron. :-)

N8N wrote:


PS - the Home Despot rant. Found a Watts brand "test gauge" at the
Despot on my way home from work (pressure gauge with telltale, screwed
into a female garden hose fitting) bought it, took it home, found that
the telltale was bent so that it didn't catch the gauge needle. Went
to a different Despot near my house, they didn't have a gauge to
exchange it. Drove back the other direction to go to the original
store, told the guy I wanted to exchange the gauge, well either he
didn't speak English well enough to understand or just didn't know
that you could do a straight exchange, so he refunded my money and I
had to buy another one, meaning I had to stand in line again for 20
minutes to check out... grr... probably wasted a good two hours on
this whole exercise. And then I had to run out again to get matches
(see my other post from this morning) so I didn't even get home until
close to 9 PM. I'm really starting to get sick of plumbing stuff.

Then think outside the bigbox. We have a local real supply house just
one town over. It is owned and operated by a knowledgeable family. They
have a huge selection compared to the big box and I am in and out in
minutes for something like you described.

"Abe" wrote in message
...
"N8N" wrote in message
Per an earlier discussion, I have been trying to ensure that I will
not have a future problem with T&P valves in my house... bought a
pressure gauge at the Despot last night on my way home from work
(there's a rant in there, but not pertinent) hooked it up, system
pressure is about 68-70 PSI falling to 60 PSI with a faucet open and
momentarily spiking to maybe 78 PSI. This is measured in the
basement, at about the level of the T&P valves. I left the gauge
connected overnight and the hot water heater went through at least two
cycles and the telltale did not rise.

Everything I've read says that pressure should be regulated to 60 PSI
or less, I am guessing since I did not experience a rise in pressure
when the water heater cycled that I don't have a BFP on the main water
line (actually, the weird thing is I don't even know if I have a
meter, I can't see one unless it is buried underground) so "by the
book" I should install a pressure reducer set for 60 PSI but since a
pressure reducer would also act as a BFP I would then need to add an
expansion tank as well.

Question is, is this really necessary or is 70 PSI OK? I'm not
looking to spend a lot of money on plumbing but if the high pressure
could potentially cause an issue I guess I should take care of it.

thanks,

nate
70 PSI won't hurt a thing. An expansion tank over the water heater is
still a good idea though.

Agreed. I love my 70 psi.

Without something to prevent backflow from the house, the only reason I can see
for an expansion tank would be to prevent seepage when the water to the house or
heater gets shut off.

Bob

On Oct 30, 11:38 am, George wrote:
N8N wrote:

PS - the Home Despot rant. Found a Watts brand "test gauge" at the
Despot on my way home from work (pressure gauge with telltale, screwed
into a female garden hose fitting) bought it, took it home, found that
the telltale was bent so that it didn't catch the gauge needle. Went
to a different Despot near my house, they didn't have a gauge to
exchange it. Drove back the other direction to go to the original
store, told the guy I wanted to exchange the gauge, well either he
didn't speak English well enough to understand or just didn't know
that you could do a straight exchange, so he refunded my money and I
had to buy another one, meaning I had to stand in line again for 20
minutes to check out... grr... probably wasted a good two hours on
this whole exercise. And then I had to run out again to get matches
(see my other post from this morning) so I didn't even get home until
close to 9 PM. I'm really starting to get sick of plumbing stuff.

Then think outside the bigbox. We have a local real supply house just
one town over. It is owned and operated by a knowledgeable family. They
have a huge selection compared to the big box and I am in and out in
minutes for something like you described.

I hear ya. Problem is places like that tend to be open strictly
during contractor's hours, when I'm on the clock for my Real Job(tm)

There actually is a plumbing supply place even closer than either HD
but I have never managed to drive by there while they're open.

nate

I've run a s high a 90 psi static pressure for years with no problem.

On Oct 30, 3:13 pm, wrote:
I've run a s high a 90 psi static pressure for years with no problem.

Yeah, 70psi should be fine and with no back flow preventer, no need
for an expansion tank, which is just one more thing to eventually have
problems with.

On Oct 30, 8:23 am, N8N wrote:
Per an earlier discussion, I have been trying to ensure that I will
not have a future problem with T&P valves in my house... bought a
pressure gauge at the Despot last night on my way home from work
(there's a rant in there, but not pertinent) hooked it up, system
pressure is about 68-70 PSI falling to 60 PSI with a faucet open and
momentarily spiking to maybe 78 PSI. This is measured in the
basement, at about the level of the T&P valves. I left the gauge
connected overnight and the hot water heater went through at least two
cycles and the telltale did not rise.

Everything I've read says that pressure should be regulated to 60 PSI
or less, I am guessing since I did not experience a rise in pressure
when the water heater cycled that I don't have a BFP on the main water
line (actually, the weird thing is I don't even know if I have a
meter, I can't see one unless it is buried underground) so "by the
book" I should install a pressure reducer set for 60 PSI but since a
pressure reducer would also act as a BFP I would then need to add an
expansion tank as well.

Question is, is this really necessary or is 70 PSI OK? I'm not
looking to spend a lot of money on plumbing but if the high pressure
could potentially cause an issue I guess I should take care of it.

thanks,

nate

PS - the Home Despot rant. Found a Watts brand "test gauge" at the
Despot on my way home from work (pressure gauge with telltale, screwed
into a female garden hose fitting) bought it, took it home, found that
the telltale was bent so that it didn't catch the gauge needle. Went
to a different Despot near my house, they didn't have a gauge to
exchange it. Drove back the other direction to go to the original
store, told the guy I wanted to exchange the gauge, well either he
didn't speak English well enough to understand or just didn't know
that you could do a straight exchange, so he refunded my money and I
had to buy another one, meaning I had to stand in line again for 20
minutes to check out... grr... probably wasted a good two hours on
this whole exercise. And then I had to run out again to get matches
(see my other post from this morning) so I didn't even get home until
close to 9 PM. I'm really starting to get sick of plumbing stuff.

The general rule is that 60 psi is the recommnded high point for
residences. Above that 'can' cause premature wear on fixtures,
particularly appliance valves. That is probably a very consevative
view.
I doubt that your 70 is going to do so.

Your meter (if you have one) is probably buried out at the curb line.
If so, you will find a cover approximately flush with the ground.

Harry K

On Oct 30, 10:09 pm, Harry K wrote:
On Oct 30, 8:23 am, N8N wrote:





Per an earlier discussion, I have been trying to ensure that I will
not have a future problem with T&P valves in my house... bought a
pressure gauge at the Despot last night on my way home from work
(there's a rant in there, but not pertinent) hooked it up, system
pressure is about 68-70 PSI falling to 60 PSI with a faucet open and
momentarily spiking to maybe 78 PSI. This is measured in the
basement, at about the level of the T&P valves. I left the gauge
connected overnight and the hot water heater went through at least two
cycles and the telltale did not rise.

Everything I've read says that pressure should be regulated to 60 PSI
or less, I am guessing since I did not experience a rise in pressure
when the water heater cycled that I don't have a BFP on the main water
line (actually, the weird thing is I don't even know if I have a
meter, I can't see one unless it is buried underground) so "by the
book" I should install a pressure reducer set for 60 PSI but since a
pressure reducer would also act as a BFP I would then need to add an
expansion tank as well.

Question is, is this really necessary or is 70 PSI OK? I'm not
looking to spend a lot of money on plumbing but if the high pressure
could potentially cause an issue I guess I should take care of it.

thanks,

nate

PS - the Home Despot rant. Found a Watts brand "test gauge" at the
Despot on my way home from work (pressure gauge with telltale, screwed
into a female garden hose fitting) bought it, took it home, found that
the telltale was bent so that it didn't catch the gauge needle. Went
to a different Despot near my house, they didn't have a gauge to
exchange it. Drove back the other direction to go to the original
store, told the guy I wanted to exchange the gauge, well either he
didn't speak English well enough to understand or just didn't know
that you could do a straight exchange, so he refunded my money and I
had to buy another one, meaning I had to stand in line again for 20
minutes to check out... grr... probably wasted a good two hours on
this whole exercise. And then I had to run out again to get matches
(see my other post from this morning) so I didn't even get home until
close to 9 PM. I'm really starting to get sick of plumbing stuff.

The general rule is that 60 psi is the recommnded high point for
residences. Above that 'can' cause premature wear on fixtures,
particularly appliance valves. That is probably a very consevative
view.
I doubt that your 70 is going to do so.

Your meter (if you have one) is probably buried out at the curb line.
If so, you will find a cover approximately flush with the ground.

Harry K

I did call local water authority and they confirmed that meter is
buried below a cover in the front yard and that I have no BFP or
pressure reducer (at least installed by them.) So it sounds like I'll
just keep an eye on it (possibly mount gauge permanently near one of
the water heaters so I can see if it ever gets above 80 PSI) and not
worry about it too much.

I do need to rebuild one toilet but other than that I have no problems
evident that could conceivably be caused by high pressure (reason for
initial inquiry was old T&P valve was occasionally tripping, but it is
rated at 150 PSI and apparently pressure never goes above 80, so it
seems like simply a bad valve - new valve hasn't tripped at all in a
week and a half, and water heater is set hotter than ever) is one
toilet that has a bad fill valve that needs to be replaced, other than
that no issues. I can deal with that...

I suppose one possible factor in the old T&P valve's early demise is
that apparently the house's plumbing had been left full of water for
probably the entire duration of the previous owner's residence -
something like 18 years - and all of the little expansion pipes had
lost their air. I have noticed a marked decrease in water hammer
since I drained the system down and refilled it. Possibly related?

nate

I did call local water authority and they confirmed that meter is
buried below a cover in the front yard and that I have no BFP or
pressure reducer (at least installed by them.) So it sounds like I'll
just keep an eye on it (possibly mount gauge permanently near one of
the water heaters so I can see if it ever gets above 80 PSI) and not
worry about it too much.

Your biggest potential concern would be your washing machines inlet
valve. If this doesn't shut you'll flood the room. High pressures can
make these valves fail when they get older.

On Oct 31, 3:56 pm, wrote:
I did call local water authority and they confirmed that meter is
buried below a cover in the front yard and that I have no BFP or
pressure reducer (at least installed by them.) So it sounds like I'll
just keep an eye on it (possibly mount gauge permanently near one of
the water heaters so I can see if it ever gets above 80 PSI) and not
worry about it too much.

Your biggest potential concern would be your washing machines inlet
valve. If this doesn't shut you'll flood the room. High pressures can
make these valves fail when they get older.

Both the PO and I are in the habit of turning off the supply spigots
to the washing machine when it is not in use. I was thinking of
adding a single-handle ball valve unit to make it even easier to do
and harder to forget. You do make a good point though.

nate

On Oct 31, 1:01 pm, N8N wrote:
On Oct 31, 3:56 pm, wrote:

I did call local water authority and they confirmed that meter is
buried below a cover in the front yard and that I have no BFP or
pressure reducer (at least installed by them.) So it sounds like I'll
just keep an eye on it (possibly mount gauge permanently near one of
the water heaters so I can see if it ever gets above 80 PSI) and not
worry about it too much.

Your biggest potential concern would be your washing machines inlet
valve. If this doesn't shut you'll flood the room. High pressures can
make these valves fail when they get older.

Both the PO and I are in the habit of turning off the supply spigots
to the washing machine when it is not in use. I was thinking of
adding a single-handle ball valve unit to make it even easier to do
and harder to forget. You do make a good point though.

nate

I haven't priced PRs in spite of havign to install one in my mother's
house. I don't think they are all that expensive and the installation
is not that big a deal.

Harry K

"Harry K" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Oct 31, 1:01 pm, N8N wrote:
On Oct 31, 3:56 pm, wrote:

I did call local water authority and they confirmed that meter is
buried below a cover in the front yard and that I have no BFP or
pressure reducer (at least installed by them.) So it sounds like I'll
just keep an eye on it (possibly mount gauge permanently near one of
the water heaters so I can see if it ever gets above 80 PSI) and not
worry about it too much.

Your biggest potential concern would be your washing machines inlet
valve. If this doesn't shut you'll flood the room. High pressures can
make these valves fail when they get older.

Both the PO and I are in the habit of turning off the supply spigots
to the washing machine when it is not in use. I was thinking of
adding a single-handle ball valve unit to make it even easier to do
and harder to forget. You do make a good point though.

nate

I haven't priced PRs in spite of havign to install one in my mother's
house. I don't think they are all that expensive and the installation
is not that big a deal.

Harry K


Per a plumber I recently talked to, $50-$60, plus installation, or the cost
of your favorite 6-pack if you do it yourself.

On Oct 31, 12:51 pm, N8N wrote:
On Oct 30, 10:09 pm, Harry K wrote:





On Oct 30, 8:23 am, N8N wrote:

Per an earlier discussion, I have been trying to ensure that I will
not have a future problem with T&P valves in my house... bought a
pressure gauge at the Despot last night on my way home from work
(there's a rant in there, but not pertinent) hooked it up, system
pressure is about 68-70 PSI falling to 60 PSI with a faucet open and
momentarily spiking to maybe 78 PSI. This is measured in the
basement, at about the level of the T&P valves. I left the gauge
connected overnight and the hot water heater went through at least two
cycles and the telltale did not rise.

Everything I've read says that pressure should be regulated to 60 PSI
or less, I am guessing since I did not experience a rise in pressure
when the water heater cycled that I don't have a BFP on the main water
line (actually, the weird thing is I don't even know if I have a
meter, I can't see one unless it is buried underground) so "by the
book" I should install a pressure reducer set for 60 PSI but since a
pressure reducer would also act as a BFP I would then need to add an
expansion tank as well.

Question is, is this really necessary or is 70 PSI OK? I'm not
looking to spend a lot of money on plumbing but if the high pressure
could potentially cause an issue I guess I should take care of it.

thanks,

nate

PS - the Home Despot rant. Found a Watts brand "test gauge" at the
Despot on my way home from work (pressure gauge with telltale, screwed
into a female garden hose fitting) bought it, took it home, found that
the telltale was bent so that it didn't catch the gauge needle. Went
to a different Despot near my house, they didn't have a gauge to
exchange it. Drove back the other direction to go to the original
store, told the guy I wanted to exchange the gauge, well either he
didn't speak English well enough to understand or just didn't know
that you could do a straight exchange, so he refunded my money and I
had to buy another one, meaning I had to stand in line again for 20
minutes to check out... grr... probably wasted a good two hours on
this whole exercise. And then I had to run out again to get matches
(see my other post from this morning) so I didn't even get home until
close to 9 PM. I'm really starting to get sick of plumbing stuff.

The general rule is that 60 psi is the recommnded high point for
residences. Above that 'can' cause premature wear on fixtures,
particularly appliance valves. That is probably a very consevative
view.
I doubt that your 70 is going to do so.

Your meter (if you have one) is probably buried out at the curb line.
If so, you will find a cover approximately flush with the ground.

Harry K

I did call local water authority and they confirmed that meter is
buried below a cover in the front yard and that I have no BFP or
pressure reducer (at least installed by them.) So it sounds like I'll
just keep an eye on it (possibly mount gauge permanently near one of
the water heaters so I can see if it ever gets above 80 PSI) and not
worry about it too much.

I do need to rebuild one toilet but other than that I have no problems
evident that could conceivably be caused by high pressure (reason for
initial inquiry was old T&P valve was occasionally tripping, but it is
rated at 150 PSI and apparently pressure never goes above 80, so it
seems like simply a bad valve - new valve hasn't tripped at all in a
week and a half, and water heater is set hotter than ever) is one
toilet that has a bad fill valve that needs to be replaced, other than
that no issues. I can deal with that...

I suppose one possible factor in the old T&P valve's early demise is
that apparently the house's plumbing had been left full of water for
probably the entire duration of the previous owner's residence -
something like 18 years - and all of the little expansion pipes had
lost their air. I have noticed a marked decrease in water hammer
since I drained the system down and refilled it. Possibly related?

nate- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

My house has a pressure regulator, and I notice that the front outside
faucet is plumbed before the regulator, to get the high pressure,
while the back outside faucet is plumbed into the regulated side, and
I have to say the extra presure for the lawn sprinkler is quite an
improvement. In fact, i'm thinking of rerouting some tubing from the
back faucet to the unregulated side.