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I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they could
"lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up a
bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...



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On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 08:44:29 -0700, "Bill"
wrote:

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


or for a new roof!
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"Bill" wrote in message
...
I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up
a bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...



I agree. Is that the show which sometimes goes to a "regular person's" house
to help out with a project, and it ends up being a custom carved teak mantle
found at an antique dealer in Tuscany, shipped by private yacht? :-)

Every time I look at my bathroom sink, whose replacement will involve 400
steps because of the stupid counter design, I think about writing to
whatever show it is and telling them I have a budget of $702.18, and not a
penny more.


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On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Bill" wrote in message

...

I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.


I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.


I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up
a bit, etc.)


Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


I agree. Is that the show which sometimes goes to a "regular person's" house
to help out with a project, and it ends up being a custom carved teak mantle
found at an antique dealer in Tuscany, shipped by private yacht? :-)

Every time I look at my bathroom sink, whose replacement will involve 400
steps because of the stupid counter design, I think about writing to
whatever show it is and telling them I have a budget of $702.18, and not a
penny more.


There are two different parts to the This Old House show: The
"regular" This Old House, in which they come in and redo a house, and
the on the road part where they help someone with a single project.

The first one is necessarily expensive, because they only do houses
that need a lot of work and have a lot of potential, for owners who
have the budget to do it. After all, it would be pretty boring show
if it was This Old House: For the next several weeks, we'll follow
Joe Shmo as he repaints his front porch the quickest way with the
cheapest paint and supplies he can find.

I find the on the road segment often has ideas that I can use, such as
how to repair a squeeky floor without lifting or damaging the carpet.
Yeah, it takes the purchase of a special tool, but so do lots of home
repair projects. Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips about why it
had to be done the way it was done and something I might very well
face in my own house someday. And trust me, I don't think anyone is
more low-budget (or less handy) than I am when it comes to home
repair!

Jo Ann

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on 10/19/2007 11:44 AM Bill said the following:
I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they could
"lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up a
bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


A lot of the stuff is provided free. Just say "Thanks to xxxxx Plumbing
Supplies" etc., in the credits.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @


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The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is usually for
a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on their new mansion?


---MIKE---
In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')


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hillacc at yahoo.com wrote:

On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:

"Bill" wrote in message

...


I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.


I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.


I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up
a bit, etc.)


Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


I agree. Is that the show which sometimes goes to a "regular person's" house
to help out with a project, and it ends up being a custom carved teak mantle
found at an antique dealer in Tuscany, shipped by private yacht? :-)

Every time I look at my bathroom sink, whose replacement will involve 400
steps because of the stupid counter design, I think about writing to
whatever show it is and telling them I have a budget of $702.18, and not a
penny more.



There are two different parts to the This Old House show: The
"regular" This Old House, in which they come in and redo a house, and
the on the road part where they help someone with a single project.

The first one is necessarily expensive, because they only do houses
that need a lot of work and have a lot of potential, for owners who
have the budget to do it. After all, it would be pretty boring show
if it was This Old House: For the next several weeks, we'll follow
Joe Shmo as he repaints his front porch the quickest way with the
cheapest paint and supplies he can find.

I find the on the road segment often has ideas that I can use, such as
how to repair a squeeky floor without lifting or damaging the carpet.
Yeah, it takes the purchase of a special tool, but so do lots of home
repair projects. Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips about why it
had to be done the way it was done and something I might very well
face in my own house someday. And trust me, I don't think anyone is
more low-budget (or less handy) than I am when it comes to home
repair!

Jo Ann


When TOH first started 30 plus years ago, Russ Morash was not so
greedy, and
WGBH was a simple local public tv station in the Brighton neighborhood
of Boston,
not a mega provider of content to PBS.

The first TOH project was a smple house in Dorchester, Mass., not far
from where
I lived, and it was a simple and do able budget.

TOH has evolved and not for the better.

The Ask TOH spin off is the only thing from the franchise worth watching.

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"---MIKE---" wrote in message
...
The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is usually for
a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on their new mansion?


---MIKE---
In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')


I saw on one show where the taxes were paid in advanced, but don't know for
how many years. I my area, if you don't do a complete new construction but
just a major remodel, its taxed at a much lower rate. That's why on one of
the shows where everything were demo except the garage just to qualify as a
remodel.


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willshak wrote:

on 10/19/2007 11:44 AM Bill said the following:

I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY
beyond my budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and
my budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the
place up a bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand
dollars for home projects...



A lot of the stuff is provided free. Just say "Thanks to xxxxx Plumbing
Supplies" etc., in the credits.

AIUI, the companies providing stuff have to provide a *LOT* of
product, far more than
actually gets used on the project in the TOH show, and pay a hefty cash
fee for
the products to be shown on the TOH show.

Morash's production company is, again AIUI, *not* a non profit
educational outfit,
and sure doesn't operate like one.

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On 19 Oct, 12:33, "hillacc at yahoo.com" wrote:
On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:





"Bill" wrote in message


...


I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.


I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.


I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up
a bit, etc.)


Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


I agree. Is that the show which sometimes goes to a "regular person's" house
to help out with a project, and it ends up being a custom carved teak mantle
found at an antique dealer in Tuscany, shipped by private yacht? :-)


Every time I look at my bathroom sink, whose replacement will involve 400
steps because of the stupid counter design, I think about writing to
whatever show it is and telling them I have a budget of $702.18, and not a
penny more.


There are two different parts to the This Old House show: The
"regular" This Old House, in which they come in and redo a house, and
the on the road part where they help someone with a single project.

The first one is necessarily expensive, because they only do houses
that need a lot of work and have a lot of potential, for owners who
have the budget to do it. After all, it would be pretty boring show
if it was This Old House: For the next several weeks, we'll follow
Joe Shmo as he repaints his front porch the quickest way with the
cheapest paint and supplies he can find.

I find the on the road segment often has ideas that I can use, such as
how to repair a squeeky floor without lifting or damaging the carpet.
Yeah, it takes the purchase of a special tool, but so do lots of home
repair projects. Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips about why it
had to be done the way it was done and something I might very well
face in my own house someday. And trust me, I don't think anyone is
more low-budget (or less handy) than I am when it comes to home
repair!

Jo Ann- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


There are two different parts to the This Old House show

Actually, there are two different shows: "This Old House" and "Ask
This Old House". "Ask This Old House" is the road-show you speak of.

I don't know how old you are, but I believe the point that the OP was
making is the difference between today's "This Old House" and the one
many of us grew up with. No, they didn't paint Joe Shmo's porch, but
they did do projects that showed what an average to above-average
homeowner could do to improve their home. The projects were somewhere
between the small repair projects of "Ask This Old House" and the
multi-million dollar projects shown on "This Old House" today. And
yes, they did take a few weeks to finish, not three days like the DIY
To The Rescue shows on now.

IIRC it was just after Bob Villa left TOH that the projects began to
move away from the "I can do that!" style to "Meet Guisppe Guardalino,
Master Plasterer who is going to hand plaster this 6000 sq ft guest
house right after we raise the barn 2 ft off the foundation and turn
it 90 degrees"



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"Bill" wrote in message
...
I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up
a bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...




$30k complete kitchen remodel is actually cheap. $30k may just barely cover
high end appliances. $100K kitchen madeover is not that unusual.
http://remodeling.hw.net/industry-ne...&sectionID=251

The trick is to spend $30K and have it look like $100K. DIY, layout
planning, material selection and smart shopping helps a lot.


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On Oct 19, 1:39 pm, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On 19 Oct, 12:33, "hillacc at yahoo.com" wrote:





On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:


"Bill" wrote in message


...


I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.


I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.


I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up
a bit, etc.)


Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


I agree. Is that the show which sometimes goes to a "regular person's" house
to help out with a project, and it ends up being a custom carved teak mantle
found at an antique dealer in Tuscany, shipped by private yacht? :-)


Every time I look at my bathroom sink, whose replacement will involve 400
steps because of the stupid counter design, I think about writing to
whatever show it is and telling them I have a budget of $702.18, and not a
penny more.


There are two different parts to the This Old House show: The
"regular" This Old House, in which they come in and redo a house, and
the on the road part where they help someone with a single project.


The first one is necessarily expensive, because they only do houses
that need a lot of work and have a lot of potential, for owners who
have the budget to do it. After all, it would be pretty boring show
if it was This Old House: For the next several weeks, we'll follow
Joe Shmo as he repaints his front porch the quickest way with the
cheapest paint and supplies he can find.


I find the on the road segment often has ideas that I can use, such as
how to repair a squeeky floor without lifting or damaging the carpet.
Yeah, it takes the purchase of a special tool, but so do lots of home
repair projects. Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips about why it
had to be done the way it was done and something I might very well
face in my own house someday. And trust me, I don't think anyone is
more low-budget (or less handy) than I am when it comes to home
repair!


Jo Ann- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


There are two different parts to the This Old House show

Actually, there are two different shows: "This Old House" and "Ask
This Old House". "Ask This Old House" is the road-show you speak of.

I don't know how old you are, but I believe the point that the OP was
making is the difference between today's "This Old House" and the one
many of us grew up with. No, they didn't paint Joe Shmo's porch, but
they did do projects that showed what an average to above-average
homeowner could do to improve their home. The projects were somewhere
between the small repair projects of "Ask This Old House" and the
multi-million dollar projects shown on "This Old House" today. And
yes, they did take a few weeks to finish, not three days like the DIY
To The Rescue shows on now.

IIRC it was just after Bob Villa left TOH that the projects began to
move away from the "I can do that!" style to "Meet Guisppe Guardalino,
Master Plasterer who is going to hand plaster this 6000 sq ft guest
house right after we raise the barn 2 ft off the foundation and turn
it 90 degrees"- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Point taken ;-)

Jo Ann
(Pretty old, but a recent first-time homeowner)

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"** Frank **" wrote in message ...
$30k complete kitchen remodel is actually cheap. $30k may just barely cover high end appliances. $100K kitchen madeover is
not that unusual. http://remodeling.hw.net/industry-ne...&sectionID=251

The trick is to spend $30K and have it look like $100K. DIY, layout planning, material selection and smart shopping helps a
lot.


"Smart shopping"... starting with skipping the high end appliances! :^)

My $350 GE dishwasher washes dishes (that's its job, right?) as well as any fancy model with a stainless front panel.

Eric Law


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On Oct 19, 1:57?pm, (---MIKE---) wrote:
The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is usually for
a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on their new mansion?

---MIKE---In the White Mountains of New Hampshire

(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')


a florida family had no choice but sell their new home to pay all the
taxes, ongoing property taxes, the show built a mansion n a poor area
but income taxes too.

i lost interst in extreme home makeover after that, and identify with
folks walking thru their home the last time before its leveled.

sure it may be in bad shape but they lived there for many years

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on 10/19/2007 2:39 PM DerbyDad03 said the following:
On 19 Oct, 12:33, "hillacc at yahoo.com" wrote:

On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:






"Bill" wrote in message

...

I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they
could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up
a bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...

I agree. Is that the show which sometimes goes to a "regular person's" house
to help out with a project, and it ends up being a custom carved teak mantle
found at an antique dealer in Tuscany, shipped by private yacht? :-)

Every time I look at my bathroom sink, whose replacement will involve 400
steps because of the stupid counter design, I think about writing to
whatever show it is and telling them I have a budget of $702.18, and not a
penny more.

There are two different parts to the This Old House show: The
"regular" This Old House, in which they come in and redo a house, and
the on the road part where they help someone with a single project.

The first one is necessarily expensive, because they only do houses
that need a lot of work and have a lot of potential, for owners who
have the budget to do it. After all, it would be pretty boring show
if it was This Old House: For the next several weeks, we'll follow
Joe Shmo as he repaints his front porch the quickest way with the
cheapest paint and supplies he can find.

I find the on the road segment often has ideas that I can use, such as
how to repair a squeeky floor without lifting or damaging the carpet.
Yeah, it takes the purchase of a special tool, but so do lots of home
repair projects. Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips about why it
had to be done the way it was done and something I might very well
face in my own house someday. And trust me, I don't think anyone is
more low-budget (or less handy) than I am when it comes to home
repair!

Jo Ann- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


There are two different parts to the This Old House show

Actually, there are two different shows: "This Old House" and "Ask
This Old House". "Ask This Old House" is the road-show you speak of.

I don't know how old you are, but I believe the point that the OP was
making is the difference between today's "This Old House" and the one
many of us grew up with. No, they didn't paint Joe Shmo's porch, but
they did do projects that showed what an average to above-average
homeowner could do to improve their home. The projects were somewhere
between the small repair projects of "Ask This Old House" and the
multi-million dollar projects shown on "This Old House" today. And
yes, they did take a few weeks to finish, not three days like the DIY
To The Rescue shows on now.

IIRC it was just after Bob Villa left TOH that the projects began to
move away from the "I can do that!" style to "Meet Guisppe Guardalino,
Master Plasterer who is going to hand plaster this 6000 sq ft guest
house right after we raise the barn 2 ft off the foundation and turn
it 90 degrees"



I like the exterior restoration of old houses. What happens on the
inside doesn't impress me as much. Except maybe the plumbing.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @


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"Eric" wrote in message
g.com...
"** Frank **" wrote in message
...
$30k complete kitchen remodel is actually cheap. $30k may just barely
cover high end appliances. $100K kitchen madeover is not that unusual.
http://remodeling.hw.net/industry-ne...&sectionID=251

The trick is to spend $30K and have it look like $100K. DIY, layout
planning, material selection and smart shopping helps a lot.


"Smart shopping"... starting with skipping the high end appliances! :^)

My $350 GE dishwasher washes dishes (that's its job, right?) as well as
any fancy model with a stainless front panel.

Eric Law


Yeah...I don't understand this high end appliance thing. I know someone who
remodeled their kitchen and installed a $4000.00 Viking range. My son hung
out at the kid's house often over a period of 5 years. He said the fanciest
food he ever saw made was Stouffer's frozen mac & cheese. On a typical day,
it was take out pizza or Chinese food.


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On 19 Oct, 11:44, "Bill" wrote:
I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they could
"lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up a
bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


Another problem with TOH and many of the other shows on the DIY
Network is that the original shows ran once a week. Now they are re-
running them every day, multiple times a day. Unfortunately there just
wasn't enough eposides written for their to be enough unique shows and
they show the same projects over and over again. Add to that the fact
that aren't running any of the Bob Villa shows (contractual issues?)
so that limits the TOH projects to the limited number that prep-boy
Steve hosted.

A sure sign that they have flooded the market with DIY shows is the
new show "The Inside Job". This "behind the scenes" show keeps the
cameras rolling after the taped portions are over to show you how a
home improvement show is made. It also shows the show being taped by
using extra cameras to get the production crew on camera. What's next?
Cameras to film the cameramen who are filming the cameramen who are
filming the show? "Inside the Inside Job"

http://www.diynetwork.com/diy/shows_disj/

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on 10/19/2007 3:28 PM DerbyDad03 said the following:
On 19 Oct, 11:44, "Bill" wrote:

I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they could
"lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up a
bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


Another problem with TOH and many of the other shows on the DIY
Network is that the original shows ran once a week. Now they are re-
running them every day, multiple times a day. Unfortunately there just
wasn't enough eposides written for their to be enough unique shows and
they show the same projects over and over again. Add to that the fact
that aren't running any of the Bob Villa shows (contractual issues?)
so that limits the TOH projects to the limited number that prep-boy
Steve hosted.

A sure sign that they have flooded the market with DIY shows is the
new show "The Inside Job". This "behind the scenes" show keeps the
cameras rolling after the taped portions are over to show you how a
home improvement show is made. It also shows the show being taped by
using extra cameras to get the production crew on camera. What's next?
Cameras to film the cameramen who are filming the cameramen who are
filming the show? "Inside the Inside Job"

http://www.diynetwork.com/diy/shows_disj/


I hated Bob Vila. Did you ever notice that he has to touch everything?
Besides, I think that it was mandatory for everyone to say his name when
responding.
I don't think he knew much about home building, other than what the
script had written down..

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @


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Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
Red Green wrote:


(---MIKE---) wrote in
:


The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is usually
for a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on their new
mansion?


---MIKE---

In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')

Why do you think they are all bawling their eyes out? Before they had a
place they could afford. Now they are short timers in the place before
they get evicted.



And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the new
stuff.


No.

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In article ,
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:

And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the new
stuff.


Property tax.


Income, too. Improvements you don't pay for (or are paid by others)
are income for tax purposes. Had a situation a couple years where the
IRS came after the owners of one of the "Show Houses" for the local
hospital. Said the improvements were income and they had to pay taxes on
it pronto, Tonto.
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"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eric" wrote in message
g.com...
"** Frank **" wrote in message
...
$30k complete kitchen remodel is actually cheap. $30k may just barely
cover high end appliances. $100K kitchen madeover is not that unusual.
http://remodeling.hw.net/industry-ne...&sectionID=251

The trick is to spend $30K and have it look like $100K. DIY, layout
planning, material selection and smart shopping helps a lot.


"Smart shopping"... starting with skipping the high end appliances! :^)

My $350 GE dishwasher washes dishes (that's its job, right?) as well as
any fancy model with a stainless front panel.

Eric Law


Yeah...I don't understand this high end appliance thing.


Status, increase property value and sometimes you find someone who really
use all of it to cook up a storm. Some exclusive neighborhoods demand high
end components or you're stuck not able to sell the house or sell at a much
reduced price.

Wife was a professional cook so she could use every bit of it. You need to
make the distinction that high end that has the looks but is not really
commercial restaurant quality. Restaurant components in some cases could
even be much cheaper than the imitations.

See that Asian lady on TV cooking something like 20 main dishes for a
special feast with just one burner? She needs no stinking high end
appliances, she doesn't even have a refrigerator. I better not remind my
wife about that or I'll get frozen dinners for the next month.


I know someone who
remodeled their kitchen and installed a $4000.00 Viking range. My son hung
out at the kid's house often over a period of 5 years. He said the
fanciest food he ever saw made was Stouffer's frozen mac & cheese. On a
typical day, it was take out pizza or Chinese food.



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"Kurt Ullman" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:

And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the new
stuff.


Property tax.


Income, too. Improvements you don't pay for (or are paid by others)
are income for tax purposes. Had a situation a couple years where the
IRS came after the owners of one of the "Show Houses" for the local
hospital. Said the improvements were income and they had to pay taxes on
it pronto, Tonto.


OK - that makes sense. This reminds me - I have to figure out a way to give
someone $100,000.00 when I win the lottery next week, without their having
to pay taxes on it.




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"** Frank **" wrote in message
. ..

"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in message
...
"Eric" wrote in message
g.com...
"** Frank **" wrote in message
...
$30k complete kitchen remodel is actually cheap. $30k may just barely
cover high end appliances. $100K kitchen madeover is not that unusual.
http://remodeling.hw.net/industry-ne...&sectionID=251

The trick is to spend $30K and have it look like $100K. DIY, layout
planning, material selection and smart shopping helps a lot.

"Smart shopping"... starting with skipping the high end appliances! :^)

My $350 GE dishwasher washes dishes (that's its job, right?) as well as
any fancy model with a stainless front panel.

Eric Law


Yeah...I don't understand this high end appliance thing.


Status, increase property value and sometimes you find someone who really
use all of it to cook up a storm. Some exclusive neighborhoods demand high
end components or you're stuck not able to sell the house or sell at a
much reduced price.

Wife was a professional cook so she could use every bit of it. You need to
make the distinction that high end that has the looks but is not really
commercial restaurant quality. Restaurant components in some cases could
even be much cheaper than the imitations.

See that Asian lady on TV cooking something like 20 main dishes for a
special feast with just one burner? She needs no stinking high end
appliances, she doesn't even have a refrigerator. I better not remind my
wife about that or I'll get frozen dinners for the next month.


I'm using a 12 year old electric range that's in perfect shape, and has only
needed the burner sockets replaced due to corrosion. I'd rather have a
decent gas stove, but this thing works beautifully.


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On 19 Oct, 15:34, willshak wrote:
on 10/19/2007 3:28 PM DerbyDad03 said the following:





On 19 Oct, 11:44, "Bill" wrote:


I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY beyond my
budget lately.


I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00 plus
consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So they could
"lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty penny.


I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes and my
budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix the place up a
bit, etc.)


Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand dollars
for home projects...


Another problem with TOH and many of the other shows on the DIY
Network is that the original shows ran once a week. Now they are re-
running them every day, multiple times a day. Unfortunately there just
wasn't enough eposides written for their to be enough unique shows and
they show the same projects over and over again. Add to that the fact
that aren't running any of the Bob Villa shows (contractual issues?)
so that limits the TOH projects to the limited number that prep-boy
Steve hosted.


A sure sign that they have flooded the market with DIY shows is the
new show "The Inside Job". This "behind the scenes" show keeps the
cameras rolling after the taped portions are over to show you how a
home improvement show is made. It also shows the show being taped by
using extra cameras to get the production crew on camera. What's next?
Cameras to film the cameramen who are filming the cameramen who are
filming the show? "Inside the Inside Job"


http://www.diynetwork.com/diy/shows_disj/


I hated Bob Vila. Did you ever notice that he has to touch everything?
Besides, I think that it was mandatory for everyone to say his name when
responding.
I don't think he knew much about home building, other than what the
script had written down..

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


I don't think he knew much about home building, other than what
the script had written down..

I was watching his painfully boring latest show - Home Again - the
other day.

A crew was cleaning an aluminum sliding door that was pitted by the
salt air in Florida.

Bob: So tell us, what are you using to clean the door?
Worker: Well, Bob, it's basically a chemical compound that stops the
corrosion and shines the aluminum.
Bob: So it's basically a chemical compound that stops the corrosion
and shines the aluminum?
Puzzled Worker: Uh....yes.
Me: Arrrggghhhh!
Remote Control: Click!

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willshak wrote in
:

on 10/19/2007 3:28 PM DerbyDad03 said the following:
On 19 Oct, 11:44, "Bill" wrote:

I don't know about you, but these home improvement shows are WAY
beyond my budget lately.

I was watching This Old House last night and they had a $3000.00
plus consultant hired in to study backyard water drainage and give
recommendations. Then they hired a crane to cut down a tree! (So
they could "lower" it down gently.) I'm sure that cost a pretty
penny.

I just can't relate to these shows anymore so far as my home goes
and my budget. ($30,000.00 for a kitchen remodel, $60,000.00 to fix
the place up a bit, etc.)

Most people I know are hard pressed to come up with a few thousand
dollars for home projects...


Another problem with TOH and many of the other shows on the DIY
Network is that the original shows ran once a week. Now they are re-
running them every day, multiple times a day. Unfortunately there
just wasn't enough eposides written for their to be enough unique
shows and they show the same projects over and over again. Add to
that the fact that aren't running any of the Bob Villa shows
(contractual issues?) so that limits the TOH projects to the limited
number that prep-boy Steve hosted.

A sure sign that they have flooded the market with DIY shows is the
new show "The Inside Job". This "behind the scenes" show keeps the
cameras rolling after the taped portions are over to show you how a
home improvement show is made. It also shows the show being taped by
using extra cameras to get the production crew on camera. What's
next? Cameras to film the cameramen who are filming the cameramen who
are filming the show? "Inside the Inside Job"

http://www.diynetwork.com/diy/shows_disj/


I hated Bob Vila.


Ovwer time, I did too. That Sears whore would always cut people off when
they were talking. I hear he became a HSN whore.

Did you ever notice that he has to touch everything?
Besides, I think that it was mandatory for everyone to say his name
when responding.
I don't think he knew much about home building, other than what the
script had written down..




--
Red...

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy."

http://www.RedGreen.com/index.cfm?app=cart&a=menu
http://www.RedGreen.com/files/layout...rg_gal_028.jpg

http://www.pbs.org/redgreen/about.html
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In article ,
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:

"Kurt Ullman" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:

And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the new
stuff.

Property tax.


Income, too. Improvements you don't pay for (or are paid by others)
are income for tax purposes. Had a situation a couple years where the
IRS came after the owners of one of the "Show Houses" for the local
hospital. Said the improvements were income and they had to pay taxes on
it pronto, Tonto.


OK - that makes sense. This reminds me - I have to figure out a way to give
someone $100,000.00 when I win the lottery next week, without their having
to pay taxes on it.


Gift you pay taxes, subject to all sorts of weird stuff, of course,
we are talking about the IRS.
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jJim McLaughlin wrote in
:

Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
Red Green wrote:


(---MIKE---) wrote in
:


The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is usually
for a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on their new
mansion?


---MIKE---

In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')

Why do you think they are all bawling their eyes out? Before they had
a place they could afford. Now they are short timers in the place
before they get evicted.



And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the
new
stuff.


No.


I'm not a tax pro Jim but I've done a bit of them. Generally, I would
guess they would get a 1099. I have seen a few, very few, exceptions.
That's why places that "give" stuff away, raffles, etc. jack the max
retail value way up if they can. This they can partially write off.

You win some tickets on the radio and come the end of the year don't be
surprised if you get a 1099. They don't care if you report it or not.
CYA so they can write off a percentage. Saw that personally with a
relative.

Just my .02, and that may be an inflated amount :-)

--
Red...

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy."

http://www.RedGreen.com/index.cfm?app=cart&a=menu
http://www.RedGreen.com/files/layout...rg_gal_028.jpg

http://www.pbs.org/redgreen/about.html


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hillacc at yahoo.com wrote:
On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Bill" wrote in message

....
... Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips ...


Actually, the part I saw that was pretty kewl was the plaster wall
repair w/ the adhesive behind the wall to stick it to the lath again and
the plastic-washer screws into the lath to bring the section back into
solid contact. Hadn't seen that before.

The real advantage of it imo, being in a small market area where new
technology is slow to arrive (if ever) is the number of products they
demonstrate that are clever solutions that are new (at least to me)...

--
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On Oct 19, 3:13 pm, dpb wrote:
hillacc at yahoo.com wrote:
On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Bill" wrote in message


...
... Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips ...


Actually, the part I saw that was pretty kewl was the plaster wall
repair w/ the adhesive behind the wall to stick it to the lath again and
the plastic-washer screws into the lath to bring the section back into
solid contact. Hadn't seen that before.

The real advantage of it imo, being in a small market area where new
technology is slow to arrive (if ever) is the number of products they
demonstrate that are clever solutions that are new (at least to me)...

--


Yes, I thought that was pretty remarkable, too. Holy cow, the
patience it would take to do that over a very extensive area,
though...wow.

Jo Ann

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On 19 Oct, 16:09, Red Green wrote:
jJim McLaughlin wrote m:





Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
Red Green wrote:


(---MIKE---) wrote in
:


The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is usually
for a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on their new
mansion?


---MIKE---


In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')


Why do you think they are all bawling their eyes out? Before they had
a place they could afford. Now they are short timers in the place
before they get evicted.


And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the
new
stuff.


No.


I'm not a tax pro Jim but I've done a bit of them. Generally, I would
guess they would get a 1099. I have seen a few, very few, exceptions.
That's why places that "give" stuff away, raffles, etc. jack the max
retail value way up if they can. This they can partially write off.

You win some tickets on the radio and come the end of the year don't be
surprised if you get a 1099. They don't care if you report it or not.
CYA so they can write off a percentage. Saw that personally with a
relative.

Just my .02, and that may be an inflated amount :-)

--
Red...

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy."

http://www.RedGreen.com/index.cfm?app=cart&a=menu
http://www.RedGreen.com/files/layout...rg_gal_028.jpg

http://www.pbs.org/redgreen/about.html- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


You win some tickets on the radio and come the end of the year
don't be surprised if you get a 1099.

Many years ago I worked part time at a bank - 1 day a week. The
branch won an all-inclusive 4-day trip to Aruba for each employee and
a guest.

At the end of the year, I got a 1099. When I did my taxes, the value
of the trip accounted for almost 2/3 of my gross income for the year.

I guess it was worth it - I walked a girl to her class at college, I
took her to lunch, and then I took her to Aruba. Our third "date". 4
kids and 24 tax returns later, we're still together.

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on 10/19/2007 4:50 PM DerbyDad03 said the following:
On 19 Oct, 16:09, Red Green wrote:

jJim McLaughlin wrote m:






Kurt Ullman wrote:

In article ,
Red Green wrote:

(---MIKE---) wrote in
:

The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is usually
for a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on their new
mansion?

---MIKE---

In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')

Why do you think they are all bawling their eyes out? Before they had
a place they could afford. Now they are short timers in the place
before they get evicted.

And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the
new
stuff.

No.

I'm not a tax pro Jim but I've done a bit of them. Generally, I would
guess they would get a 1099. I have seen a few, very few, exceptions.
That's why places that "give" stuff away, raffles, etc. jack the max
retail value way up if they can. This they can partially write off.

You win some tickets on the radio and come the end of the year don't be
surprised if you get a 1099. They don't care if you report it or not.
CYA so they can write off a percentage. Saw that personally with a
relative.

Just my .02, and that may be an inflated amount :-)

--
Red...

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy."

http://www.RedGreen.com/index.cfm?app=cart&a=menu
http://www.RedGreen.com/files/layout...rg_gal_028.jpg

http://www.pbs.org/redgreen/about.html- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


You win some tickets on the radio and come the end of the year
don't be surprised if you get a 1099.

Many years ago I worked part time at a bank - 1 day a week. The
branch won an all-inclusive 4-day trip to Aruba for each employee and
a guest.

At the end of the year, I got a 1099. When I did my taxes, the value
of the trip accounted for almost 2/3 of my gross income for the year.

I guess it was worth it - I walked a girl to her class at college, I
took her to lunch, and then I took her to Aruba. Our third "date". 4
kids and 24 tax returns later, we're still together.



Good for you! :-) I love love stories.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @
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On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 11:32:29 -0700, jJim McLaughlin
wrote:


When TOH first started 30 plus years ago, Russ Morash was not so
greedy, and
WGBH was a simple local public tv station in the Brighton neighborhood
of Boston,
not a mega provider of content to PBS.

The first TOH project was a smple house in Dorchester, Mass., not far
from where
I lived, and it was a simple and do able budget.


I remember watching Bob V. making kitchen cabinet boxes with a table saw (yup,
Sears) on one of the earlier shows. Bob actually got his hands dirty (Gasp!).
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Retired Shop Rat: 14,647 days in a GM plant.
Now I can do what I enjoy: Large Format Photography

Web Site: www.destarr.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


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"dpb" wrote in message ...
hillacc at yahoo.com wrote:
On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Bill" wrote in message

...
... Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips ...


Actually, the part I saw that was pretty kewl was the plaster wall repair w/
the adhesive behind the wall to stick it to the lath again and the
plastic-washer screws into the lath to bring the section back into solid
contact. Hadn't seen that before.


Can you describe this in any more detail? This sounds like something I could
use.

Bob


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On Oct 19, 5:13 pm, "Bob F" wrote:
"dpb" wrote in ...
hillacc at yahoo.com wrote:
On Oct 19, 11:03 am, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Bill" wrote in message


...
... Last night, they showed how to replace an old cast
iron toilet flange so the toilet won't rock on a newly installed
floor. Not very glamorous or expensive, but lots of tips ...


Actually, the part I saw that was pretty kewl was the plaster wall repair w/
the adhesive behind the wall to stick it to the lath again and the
plastic-washer screws into the lath to bring the section back into solid
contact. Hadn't seen that before.


Can you describe this in any more detail? This sounds like something I could
use.

Bob


I imagine it will be on the TOH website. In essence, they drilled
many small holes in the wall all along the areas of plaster cracking,
then injected an adhesive into the holes (with a caulk gun). Then,
they drilled in screws with attached large, round, plastic washers,
which pulled the lath and plaster into contact with each other. You
could see the adhesive squirt out the holes as the plaster and lath
were pulled together. After allowing the adhesive to dry, they
removed the screws/washers, skim coated the wall (is that the right
term?), and when dry, it was perfect and ready to paint.

Jo Ann

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DerbyDad03 wrote in
oups.com:

On 19 Oct, 16:09, Red Green wrote:
jJim McLaughlin wrote
innews:buednZbE098Pl4T

:





Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,
Red Green wrote:


(---MIKE---) wrote in
:


The real question is regarding the "Extreme Makeover" show. They
completely dismantle a wreck and put up a mansion. This is
usually for a destitute family. How can they afford the taxes on
their new mansion?


---MIKE---


In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
(44 15' N - Elevation 1580')


Why do you think they are all bawling their eyes out? Before they
had a place they could afford. Now they are short timers in the
place before they get evicted.


And of course they have to pay income taxes on the value of the
new
stuff.


No.


I'm not a tax pro Jim but I've done a bit of them. Generally, I would
guess they would get a 1099. I have seen a few, very few, exceptions.
That's why places that "give" stuff away, raffles, etc. jack the max
retail value way up if they can. This they can partially write off.

You win some tickets on the radio and come the end of the year don't
be surprised if you get a 1099. They don't care if you report it or
not. CYA so they can write off a percentage. Saw that personally with
a relative.

Just my .02, and that may be an inflated amount :-)

--
Red...

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you
handy."

http://www.RedGreen.com/index.cfm?app=cart&a=menu
http://www.RedGreen.com/files/layout...rg_gal_028.jpg

http://www.pbs.org/redgreen/about.html- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


You win some tickets on the radio and come the end of the year
don't be surprised if you get a 1099.

Many years ago I worked part time at a bank - 1 day a week. The
branch won an all-inclusive 4-day trip to Aruba for each employee and
a guest.

At the end of the year, I got a 1099. When I did my taxes, the value
of the trip accounted for almost 2/3 of my gross income for the year.

I guess it was worth it - I walked a girl to her class at college, I
took her to lunch, and then I took her to Aruba. Our third "date". 4
kids and 24 tax returns later, we're still together.




I guess it was worth it


"Guess"????? Boy I sure hope she doesn't read this NG! :-)

Hope you make 25 tax returns and many more.

--
Red...

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy."

http://www.RedGreen.com/index.cfm?app=cart&a=menu
http://www.RedGreen.com/files/layout...rg_gal_028.jpg

http://www.pbs.org/redgreen/about.html
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David Starr wrote in
:

On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 11:32:29 -0700, jJim McLaughlin
wrote:


When TOH first started 30 plus years ago, Russ Morash was not so
greedy, and
WGBH was a simple local public tv station in the Brighton neighborhood
of Boston,
not a mega provider of content to PBS.

The first TOH project was a smple house in Dorchester, Mass., not far
from where
I lived, and it was a simple and do able budget.


I remember watching Bob V. making kitchen cabinet boxes with a table
saw (yup, Sears) on one of the earlier shows. Bob actually got his
hands dirty (Gasp!). - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - Retired Shop Rat: 14,647 days in a GM plant.
Now I can do what I enjoy: Large Format Photography

Web Site: www.destarr.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -



Bob actually got his hands dirty


Running them through a sawblade?
(Norm pulls a funny on Bob and told him it was a "Hot Dog" saw. Yuk yuk.)


--
Red...

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy."

http://www.RedGreen.com/index.cfm?app=cart&a=menu
http://www.RedGreen.com/files/layout...rg_gal_028.jpg

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Default This Old [millionaires] House

on 10/19/2007 6:44 PM Red Green said the following:
David Starr wrote in
:


On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 11:32:29 -0700, jJim McLaughlin
wrote:


When TOH first started 30 plus years ago, Russ Morash was not so
greedy, and
WGBH was a simple local public tv station in the Brighton neighborhood
of Boston,
not a mega provider of content to PBS.

The first TOH project was a smple house in Dorchester, Mass., not far

from where


I lived, and it was a simple and do able budget.


I remember watching Bob V. making kitchen cabinet boxes with a table
saw (yup, Sears) on one of the earlier shows. Bob actually got his
hands dirty (Gasp!). - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - Retired Shop Rat: 14,647 days in a GM plant.
Now I can do what I enjoy: Large Format Photography

Web Site: www.destarr.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -





Bob actually got his hands dirty


Running them through a sawblade?
(Norm pulls a funny on Bob and told him it was a "Hot Dog" saw. Yuk yuk.)


Norm was a craftsman. Vila was just an emcee.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
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