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In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook" wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.


You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.


You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?


Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!


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"Bill" wrote in message
...
Fine, so they still make it. When was the last time you saw a
machine sold with memory in something other than 512mb
increments. I just checked all of the desktops being sold at
Walmart and they all have 512mb, 1gb or 2gb. I have not seen a
machine sold with an odd amount like 768mb in a long time.


Maybe not 'sold' that way, but that is quite a common configuration,
especially for older machines. I have one with 640MB (256MB + 256MB +
128MB) running Windows 2000, and one with 768MB (512MB + 128MB) running XP
Pro. I just upgraded a clients Compaq Laptop to 768MB (128MB +512MB) as
well.


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In article , "HeyBub" wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.


You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?


Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!


You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is finite?

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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On Sep 4, 7:52 pm, Terry wrote:
A friend of mine just bought a new computer at WalMart. The computer
is a complete set with speakers, mouse, keyboard and monitor. It was
advertised with 1G of memory and the system reports that it is 768K.

She contacted WalMart and Walmart acknowledges that it is a mistake.
Now she has to unplug everything, pack it up and take it back for a
swap.

This is a lot of work. What, if anything, extra should she expect for
her troubles from Walmart or Acer (brand)?


Good luck with that idea. No merchant has ever reimbursed me in any
way for time/gas/trouble, when I've purchased a defective product. If
they're interested in customer relations, they will apologize for the
trouble, and that's about as good as it gets around here, when you
shop at a chain store.

Shop locally, and your experience will be a lot better.

N.



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Terry wrote in
oups.com:

They are just padding the numbers. It is a good thing she found this
information before she packed it up and took it back for nothing.



While I agree that the advertising is misleading it is common practice
to report installed memory as opposed to 'usable' memory.

Likewise for hard disks, where the size is often reported as unformatted,
which is completely useless, of course. Then depending on what file
system it is formatted in (NTFS for example) you get a big chunk devoted
to the file system and not available for your stuff.

Same thing could be said for FSB (front side bus) speeds and the like.

Once consumers became more computer literate and learned what 'numbers'
to shop for, manufactures built machines that 'looked' good.

Celeron. Need I say more?

So in this case I don't blame wally world.



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"Doug Miller" wrote in message
...
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"

wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.


You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?


Not a bit in this case. Espcially when we are talking 2 inches.

Paul


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"Doug Miller" wrote in message
...
In article , "HeyBub"

wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?


Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!


You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is finite?



First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can only be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ therefore we are not dealing with theoretical limits we
are dealing with practical limits i.e. the duration of each clock cycle. So
in the case of a 2 inch wire trace, it would not matter if the trace were 1
inch because you can't get the data into the CPU any faster than it already
is.

Paul


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In article o2EDi.7076$3R5.943@trnddc05, "Paul M. Cook" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article , "HeyBub"

wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!


You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is finite?


First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can only be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ


You think so, do you?

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose light
moves in a nanosecond?

therefore we are not dealing with theoretical limits we
are dealing with practical limits i.e. the duration of each clock cycle. So
in the case of a 2 inch wire trace, it would not matter if the trace were 1
inch because you can't get the data into the CPU any faster than it already
is.


I won't argue that the difference between one inch and two doesn't matter at
all -- YET -- but I'll leave it as an exercise for you to compute the
approximate clock speed at which the difference between two inches and three
*does*, and then invite you to explore the availability of existing processors
in that range.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "HeyBub"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with
speed?


Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!


You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is
finite?


Yes. And has nothing to do with the signal path.

Whether it's a 1/4 mile drag strip or the Indy 500, the top speed of my '57
VW Bug is the same. The length of the track or, as you put it, the signal
path, has nothing to do with the speed.




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Gunner wrote:

"Steve Pope" wrote in message


Paul M. Cook wrote:


"Steve Pope" wrote in message


Are you sure about your arithmetic there?


1024 - 256 = 768. 1 GB = 1024 megabytes.


Now I agree with that version.


Steve


You certainly answered my questions about weaseling credentials


Precision, my man, precision. It's important.

Steve
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"Doug Miller" wrote in message
. net...
In article o2EDi.7076$3R5.943@trnddc05, "Paul M. Cook"

wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article , "HeyBub"

wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with

speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is

finite?

First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can only

be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ


You think so, do you?

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose light
moves in a nanosecond?

therefore we are not dealing with theoretical limits we
are dealing with practical limits i.e. the duration of each clock cycle.

So
in the case of a 2 inch wire trace, it would not matter if the trace were

1
inch because you can't get the data into the CPU any faster than it

already
is.


I won't argue that the difference between one inch and two doesn't matter

at
all -- YET -- but I'll leave it as an exercise for you to compute the
approximate clock speed at which the difference between two inches and

three
*does*, and then invite you to explore the availability of existing

processors
in that range.



Doug, you lost the argument. You claimed that the shorter bus length made
for a faster data transfer. If we were talking photon switches (a
theoretical possibility) then you'd be right. Someday, someday - you will
be right. For today, you are wrong. The bottleneck in any computer is the
CPUs ability to stay cool while you ramp up the clock speed. Silicon melts
into a puddle of molten glass at the temperature generated by just the
speeds we are talking about today. Try running your computer without a heat
sink and cooling fan and you'll see what I mean.

We are nowhere near, not even close, to being able to run CPUs so fast they
can run at the speed of light *per* channel. Think of 186,000 mps raised to
the 32nd power then raise it by factors of 5286. That's faster than a horny
Republican denying he's gay on national TV.

Paul


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Nancy2 wrote:

Shop locally, and your experience will be a lot better.



Some people can't shop locally. Poor people.

There are no WalMarts in New York, D.C., Chicago, Seattle, San Francisco,
Detroit, Boston, and a few other union-dominated places. There are two
WalMarts in Philadelphia, three in Atlanta and Miami, one in Los Angeles,
and one in St Louis.

That's why there's www.walmart.com.

I'm in Houston - we have 17 WalMarts. (Nine in Dallas, seven in Austin, and
fourteen in San Antonio - there's even one in Pflugerville, Texas)


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on 9/5/2007 5:08 PM HeyBub said the following:
Nancy2 wrote:

Shop locally, and your experience will be a lot better.




Some people can't shop locally. Poor people.

There are no WalMarts in New York, D.C., Chicago, Seattle, San Francisco,
Detroit, Boston, and a few other union-dominated places. There are two
WalMarts in Philadelphia, three in Atlanta and Miami, one in Los Angeles,
and one in St Louis.


There is no room for a store the size of Wal-Mart in NYC (just in case
you hadn't noticed, there is more to NY than NYC), and it would be too
expensive to tear down existing buildings to build one in NYC. There are
tons of Wal-Marts in NYS.
That's why there's www.walmart.com.

I'm in Houston - we have 17 WalMarts. (Nine in Dallas, seven in Austin, and
fourteen in San Antonio - there's even one in Pflugerville, Texas)





--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @
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In article , "HeyBub" wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "HeyBub"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with
speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!


You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is
finite?


Yes. And has nothing to do with the signal path.

Whether it's a 1/4 mile drag strip or the Indy 500, the top speed of my '57
VW Bug is the same. The length of the track or, as you put it, the signal
path, has nothing to do with the speed.


Length of path x speed = time required to traverse the path.
Since the propagation speed of electrical signals has an inherent physical
upper limit, the length of the signal path places an upper limit on the speed
of any device that is depending on those signals.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.


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In article INEDi.12859$sf1.7349@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
.net...
In article o2EDi.7076$3R5.943@trnddc05, "Paul M. Cook"

wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article , "HeyBub"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with

speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is

finite?

First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can only

be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ


You think so, do you?

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose light
moves in a nanosecond?


[Lack of response noted]

therefore we are not dealing with theoretical limits we
are dealing with practical limits i.e. the duration of each clock cycle.

So
in the case of a 2 inch wire trace, it would not matter if the trace were

1
inch because you can't get the data into the CPU any faster than it

already
is.


I won't argue that the difference between one inch and two doesn't matter

at
all -- YET -- but I'll leave it as an exercise for you to compute the
approximate clock speed at which the difference between two inches and

three
*does*, and then invite you to explore the availability of existing

processors
in that range.


[Lack of substantive response noted]


Doug, you lost the argument. You claimed that the shorter bus length made
for a faster data transfer.


No, I didn't. I disagreed -- and still do -- with your claim that "shortness
means nothing".

If we were talking photon switches (a
theoretical possibility) then you'd be right. Someday, someday - you will
be right. For today, you are wrong. The bottleneck in any computer is the
CPUs ability to stay cool while you ramp up the clock speed. Silicon melts
into a puddle of molten glass at the temperature generated by just the
speeds we are talking about today. Try running your computer without a heat
sink and cooling fan and you'll see what I mean.

We are nowhere near, not even close, to being able to run CPUs so fast they
can run at the speed of light *per* channel. Think of 186,000 mps raised to
the 32nd power then raise it by factors of 5286.


Again:

How far do you suppose light moves in a nanosecond?

At what clock speed, approximately, does the difference between a two-inch and
three-inch signal path make a difference?

What is the clock speed of the fastest processor on the market today?

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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Doug Miller wrote:
Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means
everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with
speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is
finite?


Yes. And has nothing to do with the signal path.

Whether it's a 1/4 mile drag strip or the Indy 500, the top speed of
my '57 VW Bug is the same. The length of the track or, as you put
it, the signal path, has nothing to do with the speed.


Length of path x speed = time required to traverse the path.
Since the propagation speed of electrical signals has an inherent
physical
upper limit, the length of the signal path places an upper limit on
the speed
of any device that is depending on those signals.


Right. But speed is independent of the route, the length, or number of beers
per mile.

The length of the signal path has no bearing on the speed of the signal. The
length affects the time it takes for the signal to transverse the path, but
"speed" is independent of both time and distance. V = dx/dt as dt - 0


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In article , "HeyBub" wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means
everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with
speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is
finite?

Yes. And has nothing to do with the signal path.

Whether it's a 1/4 mile drag strip or the Indy 500, the top speed of
my '57 VW Bug is the same. The length of the track or, as you put
it, the signal path, has nothing to do with the speed.


Length of path x speed = time required to traverse the path.
Since the propagation speed of electrical signals has an inherent
physical
upper limit, the length of the signal path places an upper limit on
the speed
of any device that is depending on those signals.


Right. But speed is independent of the route, the length, or number of beers
per mile.

The length of the signal path has no bearing on the speed of the signal.


Of course not -- but it *does* have bearing on the throughput ["speed"] of the
device that's *processing* that signal.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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willshak wrote:
on 9/5/2007 5:08 PM HeyBub said the following:
Nancy2 wrote:

Shop locally, and your experience will be a lot better.




Some people can't shop locally. Poor people.

There are no WalMarts in New York, D.C., Chicago, Seattle, San
Francisco, Detroit, Boston, and a few other union-dominated places.
There are two WalMarts in Philadelphia, three in Atlanta and Miami,
one in Los Angeles, and one in St Louis.


There is no room for a store the size of Wal-Mart in NYC (just in case
you hadn't noticed, there is more to NY than NYC), and it would be too
expensive to tear down existing buildings to build one in NYC. There
are tons of Wal-Marts in NYS.


Right. There's one in Albany. None in Brooklyn, Bronx, Buffalo, and One in
Niagra Falls. One each in Cheektowaga, Hamburg, Amherst, Clarence, Lockport,
Batavia, and Fredonia. Among others.


New York is lip-deep in Walmarts.



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Peter A wrote:

Another reason to stay away from texas.

I refuse to shop at walmart or sams club for moral reasons. Their well
documented mistreatment of employees, discrimination against women,
union busting, and disrespect for the environment drive me away. They
also have been the prime mover in exporting hundreds of thousands of
US jobs to China and other countries where workers are mistreated and
poorly paid. Their spying on employees is another problem. Yet another
is the fact that state and local governments have to spend hundreds of
millions of dollars annually to provide health benefits to walmart
employees. The waltons rake in their billions while the taxpayers foot
the bill for the employees' health insurance - wonderful.

I have too much self respect to shop at these places just to save a
few bucks.


I'll put you down as undecided.

According to Walmart, the "save a few bucks" is much more. The company,
again according to them, has saved lower-income Americans more money than
all the welfare programs combined (Social Security, Medicare, food stamps,
WIC, etc.).

As for mistreating employees, we did away with slavery in the Second War of
Independence - employees are certainly permitted to find better places to
work.

When a WalMart store opened in Jaunary of last year, across the street from
Chicago, the store advertised for 325 positions. They got 25,000
applications, 90% from Chicago ZIP codes (Chicago itself doesn't allow
Walmart stores). Must be a lot of masochists in the Chicago area if Walmart
is as Draconian as some believe.

Disrespect for the environment? Walmart is committed to selling 100 million
CFLs this year and has several other programs in the works (fuel efficiency
for its trucks, recycling, re-use, etc.), including demonstration stores in
McKinney, Texas, Lawrence, Kansas, and Oklahoma and California.

The store I visit (140,000 sq ft) has skylights and use almost no electric
lighting during the day. Do you have any large retail stores in your area
that do the same? Any?

The percentage of Walmart employees availing themselves of Walmart's health
insurance plan is slightly better than retailing as a whole (48% vs 45%).
Those employees that do use public health insurance (mainly Medicare) are
part-timers who are wholly eligible.

I understand your complaint about moving manufacturing to China, but Adam
Smith settled this complaint in the 18th Century with "The Wealth of
Nations."

Some people just don't keep up.




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On Sep 4, 10:53 pm, Tony Hwang wrote:
Terry wrote:
A friend of mine just bought a new computer at WalMart. The computer
is a complete set with speakers, mouse, keyboard and monitor. It was
advertised with 1G of memory and the system reports that it is 768K.


She contacted WalMart and Walmart acknowledges that it is a mistake.
Now she has to unplug everything, pack it up and take it back for a
swap.


This is a lot of work. What, if anything, extra should she expect for
her troubles from Walmart or Acer (brand)?


Hi,
Maybe it has 1GB of main memory but the video card maybe sharing the
memory taking away 256MB. Look at the spec. of video chip. Cheap PCs
are built that way instead of having video memory separate.


Run full Vista, it takes 1GB ram.

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In article , Peter A wrote:

Perhaps you high-school physics "C" students will do us the great favor
of taking your moronic twaddle off the cooking newsgroup.

Gravity has an extensive kill-filter functionality...

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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Peter A wrote:

According to Walmart, the "save a few bucks" is much more. The
company, again according to them, has saved lower-income Americans
more money than all the welfare programs combined (Social Security,
Medicare, food stamps, WIC, etc.).


"According to WalMart." Gee, the font of truth. But I agree, WalMart
has provided lower prices to many Americans. At the same time it has
lowered wages and forced a lot of people into a situation where they
have no choice but to scrounge for the very lowest prices. Often,
because their jobs have vanished thanks to WalMart.


Possibly. 95% of Walmart employees shop at Walmart.


Not masochists, but desperate people who have nowhere else to work
because WalMart has driven other retail stores out of business and has
pushed manufacturing overseas.


The more manufacturing we can push overseas, the better for all of us. As
Adam Smith said (I mentioned him earlier), each country should do what it
does best and when that happens each country prospers.



Disrespect for the environment? Walmart is committed to selling 100
million CFLs this year and has several other programs in the works
(fuel efficiency for its trucks, recycling, re-use, etc.), including
demonstration stores in McKinney, Texas, Lawrence, Kansas, and
Oklahoma and California.


WalMart has indeed done various things that are good for the
environment. You miss my point, however. They do these things for one
and only one reason - to reduce costs and increase profits. All well
and good, but it's still a corporation motivated solely by greed and
not by public good. When it helps the bottom line, the environment
can go to hell. Of course, WalMart is hardly alone in this, but they
seem particularly venal and insensitive.


As for "increasing profits," every one of their demonstration stores runs at
a loss for the enviornmental test. For example, they are attempting to heat
the stores with reclaimed grease/oil/something. There is no way, according
to them, they can recover the cost of installing the system. But it's a
learning test.

By the way, greed is good. The poor cannot donate to charity.


The percentage of Walmart employees availing themselves of Walmart's
health insurance plan is slightly better than retailing as a whole
(48% vs 45%). Those employees that do use public health insurance
(mainly Medicare) are part-timers who are wholly eligible.


Medicare is for old folks, perhaps you mean Medicaid.


Ah, you've not been to Walmart.


Your stats may be true, but so what? No other company comes remotely
close to WalMart in terms of the drain on the public treasury to
provide health care for its employees. It's shameful that I and other
taxpayers have to pay many millions to provide health care for
workers who are helping WalMart to rake in billions in profits.


I agree that no other company comes close. Walmart is the largest employer
in the country.


Look at the way Target treats its employees. Look at CostCo. Both are
popular and profitable companies, not without their faults, but way
ahead of WalMart in every way.


You recall that Target evicted the Salvation Army kettle people. Walmart not
only welcomes them but often donates an employee to ring the bell if the
Army is short-handed.


Frankly, you sound like a WalMart stooge. Perhaps you are just trying
to justify your shopping there.


Frankly, you sound like a union goon. Perhaps you resent people working for
an honest day's pay.

(See, I can insult with the best of them.)


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Default UPDATE: New York Walmarts

HeyBub wrote:

There is no room for a store the size of Wal-Mart in NYC (just in
case you hadn't noticed, there is more to NY than NYC), and it would
be too expensive to tear down existing buildings to build one in
NYC. There are tons of Wal-Marts in NYS.


Right. There's one in Albany. None in Brooklyn, Bronx, Buffalo, and
One in Niagra Falls. One each in Cheektowaga, Hamburg, Amherst,
Clarence, Lockport, Batavia, and Fredonia. Among others.


New York is lip-deep in Walmarts.


I found a page listing state ranking.

New York has 37 WalMart SuperCenters, slightly behind Kansas and Iowa, each
with 39. But way ahead of New Mexico (28). Texas has 259.

But Texas has more people who need bargains than does New York.

http://www.statemaster.com/graph/lif...r-supercenters


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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

In article ,
says...
In article o2EDi.7076$3R5.943@trnddc05, "Paul M. Cook" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article , "HeyBub"

wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is finite?


First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can only be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ


You think so, do you?

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose light
moves in a nanosecond?


On a motherboard, about eight inches (a foot in air). Not that that
fact has anything to do with the maximum clock frequency achievable.

therefore we are not dealing with theoretical limits we
are dealing with practical limits i.e. the duration of each clock cycle. So
in the case of a 2 inch wire trace, it would not matter if the trace were 1
inch because you can't get the data into the CPU any faster than it already
is.


I won't argue that the difference between one inch and two doesn't matter at
all -- YET -- but I'll leave it as an exercise for you to compute the
approximate clock speed at which the difference between two inches and three
*does*, and then invite you to explore the availability of existing processors
in that range.


The difference does matter. The length of a PCI clock on a plug-in
card, for instance, has to be within .1" (2.5" +/- .1", IIRC). The
*difference* in trace lengths is more important than length.

--
Keith


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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

HeyBub wrote:

willshak wrote:

There is no room for a store the size of Wal-Mart in NYC (just in case
you hadn't noticed, there is more to NY than NYC), and it would be too
expensive to tear down existing buildings to build one in NYC. There
are tons of Wal-Marts in NYS.


Right. There's one in Albany. None in Brooklyn, Bronx, Buffalo, and One in
Niagra Falls. One each in Cheektowaga, Hamburg, Amherst, Clarence, Lockport,
Batavia, and Fredonia. Among others.

New York is lip-deep in Walmarts.


There are plenty of Walmart's lots closer to NYC than Albany and
the other cities you mentioned. There are several on Long Island
and a couple in Westchester.

Also, there are Home Depot's and Costco's in NYC (including
Manhattan), so the excuse of not having enough room to build one
is bogus. They may not be willing to pay the price for the real
estate but that doesn't mean it can't be done.

Bill
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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

Travis Jordan wrote:

"Bill" wrote in message
...
Fine, so they still make it. When was the last time you saw a
machine sold with memory in something other than 512mb
increments. I just checked all of the desktops being sold at
Walmart and they all have 512mb, 1gb or 2gb. I have not seen a
machine sold with an odd amount like 768mb in a long time.


Maybe not 'sold' that way, but that is quite a common configuration,
especially for older machines. I have one with 640MB (256MB + 256MB +
128MB) running Windows 2000, and one with 768MB (512MB + 128MB) running XP
Pro. I just upgraded a clients Compaq Laptop to 768MB (128MB +512MB) as
well.


Right, for older machines 256mb was very common. But not for
current desktops, which is what we are discussing here.

Bill
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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

Nancy2 wrote:

Shop locally, and your experience will be a lot better.

N.


What makes you think it wasn't local?

Bill
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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

In article says...
There are no WalMarts in New York, D.C., Chicago,


There is one in Chicago now.

I'm in Houston - we have 17 WalMarts. (Nine in Dallas, seven in Austin, and
fourteen in San Antonio - there's even one in Pflugerville, Texas)


WalMart is selling out America allowing the Chinese to dump goods into
this market crippling our manufacturing base. Once we can't manufacture
anything we are dependent upon foreign nations, such as China, to build
anything. One of America's greatest strengths post WWII came from its
ability to build lots and lots of ****.

China refuses to float its currency thus making its goods cheaper than
they really are. Dumping is technically illegal in this country in that
it eliminates competition destroying a free market but somehow no one in
Congress can do anything about China now -- thanks to WalMart. China
plans decades and centuries ahead. Wall Street plans for the next
quarter. By owning so much US Debt and US dollars China already can
cripple this nation economically more than any terrorist or 1000
terrorists could do in any attack or coordinated attacks.

That hillbillies from Texas are fanboys of Walmart because they save a
few dollars on whatever useless crap they're too stupid not to buy does
not surprise me. Ironically WalMart started out selling only US made
goods and marketed itself as the ultimate American company. Too many
people probably think this is still true when in reality, WalMart's
pursuit of profits by allowing itself to be a conduit for cheap Chinese
goods could one day destroy our economy.


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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

Bill wrote:
Terry wrote:

I guess not buying at Walmart is good advice.


I'd be willing to bet that most computers you'd find at Circuit
City or Best Buy have the exact same issue (I am surprised at
some higher-end spec computers that use integrated video cards).


The UMA graphics is fine unless you're doing CAD/CAM or high-powered
gaming. However it does mean that you're going to want to go to 1.5GB or
2GB even for Vista Home once you subtract the memory that the video card
is using.
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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications


"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article INEDi.12859$sf1.7349@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
y.net...
In article o2EDi.7076$3R5.943@trnddc05, "Paul M. Cook"

wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article , "HeyBub"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means
everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with

speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is

finite?

First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All
computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can
only

be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ

You think so, do you?

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose
light
moves in a nanosecond?


[Lack of response noted]


11.8 inches I happen to have one of Grace Hoppers nanoseconds. It is a
length of wire 11.8 inches long. I got it from her when I attended a speech
she gave at the DODARPA office I worked at in 1985.



therefore we are not dealing with theoretical limits we
are dealing with practical limits i.e. the duration of each clock
cycle.

So
in the case of a 2 inch wire trace, it would not matter if the trace
were

1
inch because you can't get the data into the CPU any faster than it

already
is.

I won't argue that the difference between one inch and two doesn't
matter

at
all -- YET -- but I'll leave it as an exercise for you to compute the
approximate clock speed at which the difference between two inches and

three
*does*, and then invite you to explore the availability of existing

processors
in that range.


[Lack of substantive response noted]


What you should not is that you do not understand what I am saying because
you do not know what you are talking about. Did I mention I studied
computer science in college? We learned all kinds of stuff.


Doug, you lost the argument. You claimed that the shorter bus length made
for a faster data transfer.


No, I didn't. I disagreed -- and still do -- with your claim that
"shortness
means nothing".


You lost the argument. Your claim is patently incorrect. It is wrong. It
sufferes from a dearth of correctnes. It is truth challenged. It is
factually insufficient. It's BS. You made a statement that was just plain
wrong.

If we were talking photon switches (a
theoretical possibility) then you'd be right. Someday, someday - you will
be right. For today, you are wrong. The bottleneck in any computer is
the
CPUs ability to stay cool while you ramp up the clock speed. Silicon
melts
into a puddle of molten glass at the temperature generated by just the
speeds we are talking about today. Try running your computer without a
heat
sink and cooling fan and you'll see what I mean.

We are nowhere near, not even close, to being able to run CPUs so fast
they
can run at the speed of light *per* channel. Think of 186,000 mps raised
to
the 32nd power then raise it by factors of 5286.


Again:

How far do you suppose light moves in a nanosecond?


11.8 inches

At what clock speed, approximately, does the difference between a two-inch
and
three-inch signal path make a difference?


186,000 *2^(-32) That should get close enough.

What is the clock speed of the fastest processor on the market today?


Which manufacturer? AMD and Intel are not the only manufacturers, you
know?

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)


Doug, I'm done with your game. You made a claim that was wrong. Get over
it.

Paul


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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

"Paul M. Cook" writes:

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose
light
moves in a nanosecond?


11.8 inches I happen to have one of Grace Hoppers nanoseconds. It is a
length of wire 11.8 inches long. I got it from her when I attended a speech
she gave at the DODARPA office I worked at in 1985.


Of course, this was done for illustration purposes. That length is
correct for an electromagnetic signal travelling in a vacuum (or air,
which is nearly identical) only. In real computers, signals are carried
in microstrip transmission lines (signal trace on one face of a PC board
with an internal ground plane, or ground on the other face), or
twisted-pair transmission lines, or even coaxial cable transmission
lines. In those, the velocity is somewhat lower, and a nanosecond takes
you a shorter distance - about 60-80% of the distance in a vacuum.

Dave
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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications


"Mark Anderson" wrote in message
That hillbillies from Texas are fanboys of Walmart because they save a
few dollars on whatever useless crap they're too stupid not to buy does
not surprise me. Ironically WalMart started out selling only US made
goods and marketed itself as the ultimate American company. Too many
people probably think this is still true when in reality, WalMart's
pursuit of profits by allowing itself to be a conduit for cheap Chinese
goods could one day destroy our economy.


You may be right, but the American consumer is complicit in this. WalMart
would not have any success unless the consumer bought the stuff. We used to
have a choice but there is not much made in USA left.




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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

In article LyLDi.1770$s06.155@trnddc04, "Paul M. Cook" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
et...
In article INEDi.12859$sf1.7349@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
gy.net...
In article o2EDi.7076$3R5.943@trnddc05, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article , "HeyBub"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means
everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with
speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is
finite?

First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All
computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can
only
be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ

You think so, do you?

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose
light
moves in a nanosecond?


[Lack of response noted]


11.8 inches I happen to have one of Grace Hoppers nanoseconds. It is a
length of wire 11.8 inches long. I got it from her when I attended a speech
she gave at the DODARPA office I worked at in 1985.



therefore we are not dealing with theoretical limits we
are dealing with practical limits i.e. the duration of each clock
cycle.
So
in the case of a 2 inch wire trace, it would not matter if the trace
were
1
inch because you can't get the data into the CPU any faster than it
already
is.

I won't argue that the difference between one inch and two doesn't
matter
at
all -- YET -- but I'll leave it as an exercise for you to compute the
approximate clock speed at which the difference between two inches and
three
*does*, and then invite you to explore the availability of existing
processors
in that range.


[Lack of substantive response noted]


What you should not is that you do not understand what I am saying because
you do not know what you are talking about. Did I mention I studied
computer science in college? We learned all kinds of stuff.


Oh, the old "argument from authority" fallacy. Too bad that formal logic
wasn't part of *your* computer science curriculum; it was in *mine*.


Doug, you lost the argument. You claimed that the shorter bus length made
for a faster data transfer.


No, I didn't. I disagreed -- and still do -- with your claim that
"shortness means nothing".


You lost the argument. Your claim is patently incorrect. It is wrong. It
sufferes from a dearth of correctnes. It is truth challenged. It is
factually insufficient. It's BS. You made a statement that was just plain
wrong.


So say you. You've provided nothing to back that up, though.

If we were talking photon switches (a
theoretical possibility) then you'd be right. Someday, someday - you will
be right. For today, you are wrong. The bottleneck in any computer is
the
CPUs ability to stay cool while you ramp up the clock speed. Silicon
melts
into a puddle of molten glass at the temperature generated by just the
speeds we are talking about today. Try running your computer without a
heat
sink and cooling fan and you'll see what I mean.

We are nowhere near, not even close, to being able to run CPUs so fast
they
can run at the speed of light *per* channel. Think of 186,000 mps raised
to
the 32nd power then raise it by factors of 5286.


Again:

How far do you suppose light moves in a nanosecond?


11.8 inches

At what clock speed, approximately, does the difference between a two-inch
and
three-inch signal path make a difference?


186,000 *2^(-32) That should get close enough.


Lack of accurate response noted.

What is the clock speed of the fastest processor on the market today?


Which manufacturer? AMD and Intel are not the only manufacturers, you
know?


Lack of response noted.

Give it up, Paul. You've lost the argument.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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Default OT Wrong advertised specifications

In article , krw wrote:
In article ,
says...
In article o2EDi.7076$3R5.943@trnddc05, "Paul M. Cook"

wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
t...
In article , "HeyBub"
wrote:
Doug Miller wrote:
In article ORxDi.12718$sf1.3859@trnddc01, "Paul M. Cook"
wrote:

Nope. It is not. Shortness means nothing, speed means everything.

You think the length of the signal path has nothing to do with speed?

Waves hand!

I do! I do! Pick me!

You are aware, aren't you, that the speed of signal propagation is finite?

First, you have something called a clock in the computer. All computers
have a clock, they cannot run without one. Second, the signals can only be
passed during a clock cycle. The speed of light is far faster than any
clock we can employ


You think so, do you?

1GHz clock rate = 1 nanosecond cycle length. How far do you suppose light
moves in a nanosecond?


On a motherboard, about eight inches (a foot in air). Not that that
fact has anything to do with the maximum clock frequency achievable.


You might want to rethink that notion...

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
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Posts: 3,482
Default UPDATE: New York Walmarts

on 9/5/2007 9:26 PM HeyBub said the following:
HeyBub wrote:

There is no room for a store the size of Wal-Mart in NYC (just in
case you hadn't noticed, there is more to NY than NYC), and it would
be too expensive to tear down existing buildings to build one in
NYC. There are tons of Wal-Marts in NYS.

Right. There's one in Albany. None in Brooklyn, Bronx, Buffalo, and
One in Niagra Falls. One each in Cheektowaga, Hamburg, Amherst,
Clarence, Lockport, Batavia, and Fredonia. Among others.


New York is lip-deep in Walmarts.


I found a page listing state ranking.

New York has 37 WalMart SuperCenters, slightly behind Kansas and Iowa, each
with 39. But way ahead of New Mexico (28). Texas has 259.


Those are just the SuperCenters, which also sell food and have garden
and vision centers, lube and tire service, and photo studios. Regular
WalMarts have none of the extras.
But Texas has more people who need bargains than does New York.

http://www.statemaster.com/graph/lif...r-supercenters





--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
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