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Default tapcon hell

Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.

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Default tapcon hell

On Jun 29, 12:45 pm, wrote:
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


I've had better luck by cleaning the hole that's drilled _very_ well.
Tom

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Default tapcon hell

On Jun 29, 3:45 pm, wrote:
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


They work much better with impact drivers. You may also have one of
_those_ slabs that are harder than hell. In that case there are
better fasteners. http://www.itw-redhead.com/redidrive_prod01.asp

R

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Default tapcon hell


wrote in message
ups.com...
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


I have the problem the other way around where the concrete breaks off when I
torque it down. Did you use the drill bit that came in the box? Sounds like
you need a slightly larger drill bit.


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Default tapcon hell


"tom" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Jun 29, 12:45 pm, wrote:
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


I've had better luck by cleaning the hole that's drilled _very_ well.
Tom


To add a little to what Tom said, holes in floors do not allow the dust to
be pulled out with the bit. A once over with a shop vac and crevice tool
helps a lot.

You are using the bit made for tapcons? It is a custom size.

Colbyt




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Default tapcon hell

Colbyt wrote:
"tom" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Jun 29, 12:45 pm, wrote:
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my
weight on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they
put such a low profile hex head on something that needs this much
force is beyond me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm
sure. Then I move on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my
strength and weight to turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and
then the slot is chewed open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp
it and start turning, the head snaps off within a few turns, it's
not even an inch in. I drill the holes an extra inch deeper and
blow it out with compressed air, makes no difference. I'm using the
bit that came with the screws. WTF? Am I missing something? This is run
of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver
to sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several
holes with snapped off anchors now.


I've had better luck by cleaning the hole that's drilled _very_ well.
Tom


To add a little to what Tom said, holes in floors do not allow the
dust to be pulled out with the bit. A once over with a shop vac and
crevice tool helps a lot.


He stated that he blew out the hole with compressed air, which works just
fine.

You are using the bit made for tapcons? It is a custom size.


He stated that he used the bit that came with the Tapcons.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com


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Default tapcon hell

wrote:
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my
weight on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they
put such a low profile hex head on something that needs this much
force is beyond me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm
sure. Then I move on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my
strength and weight to turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and
then the slot is chewed open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp
it and start turning, the head snaps off within a few turns, it's
not even an inch in. I drill the holes an extra inch deeper and
blow it out with compressed air, makes no difference. I'm using the
bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver
to sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several
holes with snapped off anchors now.


I've never had one break but I've had a few that were hard to drive IF
I STOPPED DRIVING BEFORE THEY WERE ALL THE WAY IN. I generally use a
3/8 drill to drive them, apply a *lot* of down pressure and let the
square drive bit cam out.

You might try lubricating them but not with oil...cake soap or
beeswax.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at
http://mysite.verizon.net/xico



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Default tapcon hell

They are meant to be power driven it one continuous stroke if you stop it
can seize up and when you try to start again it can snap.

For the 1/4 head screws you need a power drive bit in a cordless screw
driver. I find cordless screwdrivers work better for driving screws because
I think it doesn't spin up as fast or has more torque at slower speeds.

I've never used an cordless impact driver but it probably work great.

One other thing to consider is the length of the screws. you don't need that
much in the concrete.



wrote in message
ups.com...
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.



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Default tapcon hell

On Jun 29, 2:45 pm, wrote:
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in.


snip

My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


For small screws like that it is a whole lot easier to just drill a
hole and set a regular Grade 5 threaded stud in the clean hole with a
dollop of 2-part epoxy. The bond to concrete is tremendous. Tapcons
and redheads are great products, but in smaller sizes and low strength
concrete epoxy is superior. HTH

Joe




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Default tapcon hell

I also had a lot of problems. The hardware guy said that they work best in
new concrete and that my 30 year old concrete was "too hard". Go figure!

Smarty


"dicko" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:45:16 -0700, wrote:

Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.



Thats pretty much the same experience I had. I bought the drill bit,
I cleaned out the holes and I couldnt drive them in if my life
depended on it.

I finally gave up and just used normal mollies and I've never even
looked at a Tapcon since.

-dickm



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Default tapcon hell

On Jun 29, 3:45 pm, wrote:
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


-- the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to sink
it in

My package of ProCons (just another brand) says to drill a damn hole
and *power drive* them. I can't imagine trying to install them by
hand.

-- Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure

Actually, if I understand the concept correctly, it is this blue
coating that makes them work. As you power drive in one steady motion,
the blue coating heats up and bonds with the concrete. I think this is
why you can't stop when driving them (they jam up) and you can't use
them in the same hole if you remove one (it strips the hole).

Once they're in, they're in for good, but once you mess one up, it's
time for a new hole.



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Default tapcon hell

On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:39:07 -0400, "Smarty"
wrote:

I also had a lot of problems. The hardware guy said that they work best in
new concrete and that my 30 year old concrete was "too hard". Go figure!


Concrete gets harder every year.

Smarty


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On Jun 30, 12:20 am, mm wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:39:07 -0400, "Smarty"
wrote:

I also had a lot of problems. The hardware guy said that they work best in
new concrete and that my 30 year old concrete was "too hard". Go figure!


Concrete gets harder every year.


More expensive too.

R

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On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:45:16 -0700, wrote:

Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


What are you anchoring to the floor? Two inches sounds long. I just
anchored some shelving tracts in a wall that was form poured HARD concrete,
and they went in like a breeze. The geek at HD (of all places) told me to
use the 1 1/2" ones. I woulda used the 2" ones if he hadn't told me. After
reading the f - ing directions, the pullout rating on the 1 1/2" is about
what the 2" is. The tracks sit 1/2" off the wall, so it only uses 1 " of
grip. If I was anchoring to soft grouted masonry, I'd use longer ones, but
then, if it was soft grouted masonry, I'd be using sleeve anchors.

Something's wrong at your house. Shorten up on the fasteners, blow out the
hole, chase the drill a time or two extra, make sure you are using the right
drill, and if it still don't work, just get the right fastener.

Steve




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Default tapcon hell

In article ,
mm wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:39:07 -0400, "Smarty"
wrote:

I also had a lot of problems. The hardware guy said that they work best in
new concrete and that my 30 year old concrete was "too hard". Go figure!


Concrete gets harder every year.

Smarty


Only for the first hundred years, then it stays about the same. I did
have a devil of a time putting nails into the floor of my parent's
basement, back in '73, and the concrete was only about fifty years old
then.
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wrote in message
ups.com...
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips.


I have the reverse problem often.

I do EVERYTHING right (even used the $22 "kit" sold to drill and install the
screws. My problem is that about 1/3rd of them "spin out". Even the
screws the "work" sometimes strip when I tighten them.

I still use them but depending upon the application I used the hardened
"concrete nails" or just put in a plastic insert rather than the Tapcon
system.

The problem, as I see it is that especially when drilling old concrete, the
"hard bits" in the concrete cause the drill bit to "wander" and effectively
the hole is oversized. You can salvage the oversize hole by using the next
size fastener (you should also ream out the hole with the next size larger
bit) or by injecting epoxy and effectly convert to another system.

If you are twisting off the heads as compared to spinning out from female
thread failure you effectively have an undersized hole. Clean out the hole
with air or even just a pipe cleaner (thin wire with "fuzz") before you use
the screw. Use a new drill bit as an old bit may lose diameter from side
wear.

If you MUST use those screws (you need the strength over plastic inserts,
you need "pullout" resistance, or you don't want the vibration from
hammering in concrete nails) then buy their installation kit. It grips the
hex heads well and stops driving when the head is driven below the surface
of the wood.



Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


In a garage floor I believe your first choice should be concrete nails.
They fail also but not in ways that end up with partly inserted fasteners
you can't get out.




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Default tapcon hell

On Jun 30, 10:06 am, dpb wrote:
George wrote:
wrote:


...

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


Time to review the instructions. You are supposed to power drive them
with the suggested driver tool.


Hammer-drill/driver may help, too.

Me? I'd go w/ powder-actuated myself and toss the tapcon's in the "nice
theory, no good in practice" pile along w/ the various other things over
the years...

imo, ymmv, $0.02, etc., ...


If you're driving Tapcons with a hammer drill, that might be why you
haven't had much success with them. Try an impact driver.

R



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Default tapcon hell

On Jun 30, 11:26 am, RicodJour wrote:
On Jun 30, 10:06 am, dpb wrote:



George wrote:
wrote:


...


WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.


Time to review the instructions. You are supposed to power drive them
with the suggested driver tool.


Hammer-drill/driver may help, too.


Me? I'd go w/ powder-actuated myself and toss the tapcon's in the "nice
theory, no good in practice" pile along w/ the various other things over
the years...


imo, ymmv, $0.02, etc., ...


If you're driving Tapcons with a hammer drill, that might be why you
haven't had much success with them. Try an impact driver.

R


Another thing that helps is when you are drilling the hole, run the
drill up and down a few times to ream out the hole a bit. Tapcons
have always worked fine for me--I've tossed a powder actuated gun in
the dumpster in a fit of rage before, so they sure aren't a panacea--
jams, spalling, underdriven fasteners are all problems. (unless you
spend the money and get a Hilti). For instances where you are
primarily concerned about shear, I like drive in pegs or rawls for
ease of use and low tech simplicity.. Using a manual screwdriver on a
tapcon sounds like a hard way to serve the Lord.


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"Smarty" wrote in message
...
I also had a lot of problems. The hardware guy said that they work best in
new concrete and that my 30 year old concrete was "too hard". Go figure!

Smarty



Guys, I don't understand all these posts. I don't recall ever having a
problem with tapcons in concrete. Hard fired brick I have experienced some
problems.

Are you following the directions? The screw should only penetrate the
concrete by 3/4", an absolute 1" maximum.

Don't mean to insult anyone with that question.

Colbyt


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If you're driving Tapcons with a hammer drill, that might be why you
haven't had much success with them. Try an impact driver.


I don't have the box in front of me, but I seem to remember that the
instructions said: "Hammer Drill."

The "kit" they sell is designed to use the same drill for drilling and
driving.



R



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On Jul 1, 12:49 am, "John Gilmer" wrote:
If you're driving Tapcons with a hammer drill, that might be why you
haven't had much success with them. Try an impact driver.


I don't have the box in front of me, but I seem to remember that the
instructions said: "Hammer Drill."

The "kit" they sell is designed to use the same drill for drilling and
driving.


A hammer drill to drill the hole, and an impact driver to drive the
the Tapcons. Very different tools.

R

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wrote in message
ups.com...
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.

Are you sure you're using the right size bit to make the holes? If you've
(a) used the right size drill bit and (b) drilled the hole deep enough,
there shouldn't be any problem, in my experience. I do rub the threads
across a bar of paraffin before installing them, (as I do with almost any
concrete or wood screw) but I usually just put Tapcons in by hand using a
nut driver or by using a socket on my cordless drill.




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"JimR" wrote in message
ink.net...

wrote in message
ups.com...
Anyone have experience with small tapcon concrete screws? 1/4" head,
about 2" length. I can't get them in. I tried a socket, all my weight
on it, I'm lucky to get 2 turns before it strips. Why they put such a
low profile hex head on something that needs this much force is beyond
me. Whatever this blue coating is doesn't help I'm sure. Then I move
on to a flat head screwdriver, takes all my strength and weight to
turn it, 5 minutes later it's 1/2" in and then the slot is chewed
open. So then I grab the vice grips, clamp it and start turning, the
head snaps off within a few turns, it's not even an inch in. I drill
the holes an extra inch deeper and blow it out with compressed air,
makes no difference. I'm using the bit that came with the screws.

WTF? Am I missing something? This is run of the mill garage floor
concrete, the direction say drill a damn hole and use a screwdriver to
sink it in? Should I try oil lubrication? My floor has several holes
with snapped off anchors now.

Are you sure you're using the right size bit to make the holes? If you've
(a) used the right size drill bit and (b) drilled the hole deep enough,
there shouldn't be any problem, in my experience. I do rub the threads
across a bar of paraffin before installing them, (as I do with almost any
concrete or wood screw) but I usually just put Tapcons in by hand using a
nut driver or by using a socket on my cordless drill.

Try using a rawl pin sometimes called a split ring?
drill a hole and pound it in


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