Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair



Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present it
is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture barrier,
put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high water table.
The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever ideas on how to
drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side the house and can
access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas of how to
pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of the house and
drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a little so maybe roller
conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and pull my pan back to where
I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a tarp and winch it out?



Any clever ideas greatly appreciated.



Ivan Vegvary

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in
news:CBSLh.11343$el3.1563@trndny01:

Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present
it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture
barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high
water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever
ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side
the house and can access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas
of how to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of
the house and drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a
little so maybe roller conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and
pull my pan back to where I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a
tarp and winch it out?
Any clever ideas greatly appreciated.

Shop vac

I would second a good shop vac. (rather big one)

I removed a sandy mess when I excavated when putting in a
bathroom in my basement. Worked surprising well.
I had a 20" hose through a window and had the vacuum
(with no filter) outside. It took a little while but worked out
all right.




On Mar 20, 10:55 am, "Ivan Vegvary" wrote:
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair

Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present it
is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture barrier,
put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high water table.
The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever ideas on how to
drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side the house and can
access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas of how to
pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of the house and
drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a little so maybe roller
conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and pull my pan back to where
I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a tarp and winch it out?

Any clever ideas greatly appreciated.

Ivan Vegvary

I third the shop vac idea. If you want you can get a few sheets of plywood
and build a larger dump box that the shop vac just clamps onto.


"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
news:CBSLh.11343$el3.1563@trndny01...
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair



Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present
it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture
barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high
water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever
ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side the
house and can access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas of how
to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of the house
and drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a little so maybe
roller conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and pull my pan back
to where I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a tarp and winch it out?



Any clever ideas greatly appreciated.



Ivan Vegvary

Ivan Vegvary wrote:
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair



Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At
present it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a
moisture barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper
due to high water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I
need clever ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8
feet along side the house and can access it with my small
tractor/loader. I need ideas of how to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all
of this dirt over to the edge of the house and drop it down to my
waiting tractor. Wife can help a little so maybe roller conveyers
with ropes so I can send her a load and pull my pan back to where I
am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a tarp and winch it out?


Any clever ideas greatly appreciated.



Ivan Vegvary

That is what teenage neighborhood boys are for. These days you can also
find neighborhood girls for those kind of jobs. My uncle hired the
neighborhood boys to did out his craw space and make it a basement during
the depression. Some years later when I bought the house, I was often
stopped and told what a great guy my uncle was for helping all those kids
out when they needed a few $$. Of course they were all older them me. My
uncle was a good guy, but a little crazy as well.

In any case, remind them that it is good exercise for (fill in the blank
with the name of the appropriate sport) off season training.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia 's Muire duit

Ivan Vegvary wrote:

Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present it
is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42"...

Like, 30x50x42/12 = 5250 cubic feet of soil?

... I need clever ideas on how to drag the dirt out.

How about a 5-gallon bucket (about 8000 trips) hanging from
a roller attached to a movable overhead rail?

A friend of mine deepened his crawlspace with dynamite.

You might try a shaped charge :-)

Nick

Isn't it possible to install a rented belt-conveyor?

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
news:CBSLh.11343$el3.1563@trndny01...
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair



Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present
it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture
barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high
water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever
ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side the
house and can access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas of how
to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of the house
and drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a little so maybe
roller conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and pull my pan back
to where I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a tarp and winch it out?



Any clever ideas greatly appreciated.



Ivan Vegvary

"jan siepelstad" wrote in message
...
Isn't it possible to install a rented belt-conveyor?

It probably is. I would need to rent it for 2-3 weeks and it needs to be
light enough so I can relocate it as I dig. Also I would initially have to
dig a trough etc. so I have room to install the conveyor.

Thanks for the ideas.

Ivan

"jan siepelstad" wrote in message
...
Isn't it possible to install a rented belt-conveyor?

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
news:CBSLh.11343$el3.1563@trndny01...
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair



Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present
it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture
barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high
water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever
ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side the
house and can access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas of
how to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of the
house and drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a little so
maybe roller conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and pull my
pan back to where I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a tarp and
winch it out?


After the first week, you'll curse yourself- this is a massive amount of
hand labor. Do you have a good engineering design for the new foundation? If
the dirt is that soft, you'll have to hold back from the existing walls a
couple of feet to keep existing foundation from collapsing.

Proper approach to this project would have been to jack the house, even just
a little bit, and support it on needle beams and external cribbing. Then you
could put in a proper foundation footer system and 42" crawl, or even a real
raised basement with proper drains to handle high water table. If your
8-foot-deep access pit isn't holding 4 feet of water in the spring thaw,
water table problem might not be bad as you think.

Bottom line- you need a qualified engineer to do a site survey. If you just
seat-of-pants it, you could easily end up with a worthless house.

aem sends....

"aemeijers" wrote in message
...

"jan siepelstad" wrote in message
...
Isn't it possible to install a rented belt-conveyor?

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
news:CBSLh.11343$el3.1563@trndny01...
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair



Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present
it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture
barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high
water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever
ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side
the house and can access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas
of how to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of
the house and drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a
little so maybe roller conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and
pull my pan back to where I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a
tarp and winch it out?


After the first week, you'll curse yourself- this is a massive amount of
hand labor. Do you have a good engineering design for the new foundation?
If the dirt is that soft, you'll have to hold back from the existing walls
a couple of feet to keep existing foundation from collapsing.

Proper approach to this project would have been to jack the house, even
just a little bit, and support it on needle beams and external cribbing.
Then you could put in a proper foundation footer system and 42" crawl, or
even a real raised basement with proper drains to handle high water table.
If your 8-foot-deep access pit isn't holding 4 feet of water in the spring
thaw, water table problem might not be bad as you think.

Bottom line- you need a qualified engineer to do a site survey. If you
just seat-of-pants it, you could easily end up with a worthless house.

aem sends....
Thanks for the advice. I am a licensed Civil Engineer. I have already dug
around the entire perimeter and installed 24" reinforced concrete footings.
Wish I could jack the house up but there is another 1200 square feet
attached that is on slab. Would be very labor intensive to alter the stair
cases and separate the two halves of the house. Easier to dig in situ.

Thanks

You'd play hell getting a kid to do any such thing now a days. I'll bet you
couldn't get them to do it for 20 buck a hour.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:
www.lightsout.org




"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message
...

That is what teenage neighborhood boys are for. These days you can
also find neighborhood girls for those kind of jobs. My uncle hired the
neighborhood boys to did out his craw space and make it a basement during
the depression. Some years later when I bought the house, I was often
stopped and told what a great guy my uncle was for helping all those kids
out when they needed a few $$. Of course they were all older them me. My
uncle was a good guy, but a little crazy as well.

In any case, remind them that it is good exercise for (fill in the
blank with the name of the appropriate sport) off season training.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia 's Muire duit

On Mar 20, 7:19�pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
You'd play hell getting a kid to do any such thing now a days. *I'll bet you
couldn't get them to do it for 20 buck a hour.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message

...





* *That is what teenage neighborhood boys are for. *These days you can
also find neighborhood girls for those kind of jobs. *My uncle hired the
neighborhood boys to did out his craw space and make it a basement during
the depression. *Some years later when I bought the house, I was often
stopped and told what a great guy my uncle was for helping all those kids
out when they needed a few $$. *Of course they were all older them me.. My
uncle was a good guy, but a little crazy as well.

* *In any case, remind them that it is good exercise for (fill in the
blank with the name of the appropriate sport) off season training.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia 's Muire duit- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

yeah kids dont want to work, I had a truckload of topsoil to move, and
no one would take the job at any price. I had hurt my back, and it
ended up taking a month.

of course if there are mexicans in your area you are all set, illegals
work cheap and hard for cash.........

On Mar 20, 4:58 pm, "Ivan Vegvary" wrote:
"aemeijers" wrote in message

...



"jan siepelstad" wrote in message
...
Isn't it possible to install a rented belt-conveyor?

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
news:CBSLh.11343$el3.1563@trndny01...
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair

Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present
it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture
barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high
water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever
ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side
the house and can access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas
of how to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of
the house and drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a
little so maybe roller conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and
pull my pan back to where I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a
tarp and winch it out?

After the first week, you'll curse yourself- this is a massive amount of
hand labor. Do you have a good engineering design for the new foundation?
If the dirt is that soft, you'll have to hold back from the existing walls
a couple of feet to keep existing foundation from collapsing.

Proper approach to this project would have been to jack the house, even
just a little bit, and support it on needle beams and external cribbing.
Then you could put in a proper foundation footer system and 42" crawl, or
even a real raised basement with proper drains to handle high water table.
If your 8-foot-deep access pit isn't holding 4 feet of water in the spring
thaw, water table problem might not be bad as you think.

Bottom line- you need a qualified engineer to do a site survey. If you
just seat-of-pants it, you could easily end up with a worthless house.

aem sends....

Thanks for the advice. I am a licensed Civil Engineer. I have already dug
around the entire perimeter and installed 24" reinforced concrete footings.
Wish I could jack the house up but there is another 1200 square feet
attached that is on slab. Would be very labor intensive to alter the stair
cases and separate the two halves of the house. Easier to dig in situ.

Thanks

Good to see you're a CE but what do you plan to do with the ~200 yds
of dirt?

~ 3000 tons

That's ~8 "double dumps"

btw I've done the shop vac "moving sandy soil / damp sand" experiment

medium sized shop vac ~10 gallon........ soil removal rate ~ 1gpm

so you've got something on the order of 650 hours of vacuum
time.....not including time to empty & dispose of the dirt.

We're taking about ~100 days of vacuuming (if you can keep at it for 6
hours per day) Even if I'm high by 2x .....still 50 days of
vacuuming!

Consider contracting with a vacuum excavator.

Your new footings are 24" wide? How deep?

I hope they go below your intended excavation depth.

cheers
Bob

A yard of dirt is only about a ton damp, and he's only talking about roughly
166 yards. So it's considerably less than your mistaken math.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:
www.lightsout.org




"BobK207" wrote in message
ups.com...

Good to see you're a CE but what do you plan to do with the ~200 yds
of dirt?

~ 3000 tons

That's ~8 "double dumps"

btw I've done the shop vac "moving sandy soil / damp sand" experiment

medium sized shop vac ~10 gallon........ soil removal rate ~ 1gpm

so you've got something on the order of 650 hours of vacuum
time.....not including time to empty & dispose of the dirt.

We're taking about ~100 days of vacuuming (if you can keep at it for 6
hours per day) Even if I'm high by 2x .....still 50 days of
vacuuming!

Consider contracting with a vacuum excavator.

Your new footings are 24" wide? How deep?

I hope they go below your intended excavation depth.

cheers
Bob

On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 23:58:29 GMT, "Ivan Vegvary"
wrote:


Thanks for the advice. I am a licensed Civil Engineer. I have already dug

This topic is beyond me, but I do know the saying, A lawyer who
represents himself has a fool for a client.

Run this by a co-worker or two.

around the entire perimeter and installed 24" reinforced concrete footings.
Wish I could jack the house up but there is another 1200 square feet
attached that is on slab. Would be very labor intensive to alter the stair
cases and separate the two halves of the house. Easier to dig in situ.

Thanks

I have used sleds made out of car hoods and trunk lids. I have also used
hot water tanks cut in half. Two people. One underneath to fill. One
outside to pull it out and empty. The hot water tank would empty by pulling
it sideways with a tractor. Kid could run the tractor and empty. Dig
deeper (basement) and you could use your tractor for digging.

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
news:CBSLh.11343$el3.1563@trndny01...
Sorry, also cross posted to alt.home.repair



Need to dig out crawl space. Approximately 30' by 50' area. At present
it is about 4" deep. Want to dig down to 42" and lay down a moisture
barrier, put in vents, level house etc. Can't go any deeper due to high
water table. The digging is very easy (sandy loam), but I need clever
ideas on how to drag the dirt out. I have dug down 8 feet along side the
house and can access it with my small tractor/loader. I need ideas of how
to pull/push/drag/roll etc. all of this dirt over to the edge of the house
and drop it down to my waiting tractor. Wife can help a little so maybe
roller conveyers with ropes so I can send her a load and pull my pan back
to where I am digging? Maybe throw the slough on a tarp and winch it out?



Any clever ideas greatly appreciated.



Ivan Vegvary

wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 20, 7:19?pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
You'd play hell getting a kid to do any such thing now a days. I'll
bet you
couldn't get them to do it for 20 buck a hour.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"Joseph Meehan" wrote in message

...





That is what teenage neighborhood boys are for. These days you can
also find neighborhood girls for those kind of jobs. My uncle hired
the
neighborhood boys to did out his craw space and make it a basement
during
the depression. Some years later when I bought the house, I was
often
stopped and told what a great guy my uncle was for helping all those
kids
out when they needed a few $$. Of course they were all older them
me. My
uncle was a good guy, but a little crazy as well.

In any case, remind them that it is good exercise for (fill in the
blank with the name of the appropriate sport) off season training.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia 's Muire duit- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

yeah kids dont want to work, I had a truckload of topsoil to move, and
no one would take the job at any price. I had hurt my back, and it
ended up taking a month.

of course if there are mexicans in your area you are all set, illegals
work cheap and hard for cash.........


I hear there are over 300 immigrants in Mass. needing work
or are they in Texas now waiting for deployment?

On Mar 20, 6:44 pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
A yard of dirt is only about a ton damp, and he's only talking about roughly
166 yards. So it's considerably less than your mistaken math.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"BobK207" wrote in message

ups.com...



Good to see you're a CE but what do you plan to do with the ~200 yds
of dirt?

~ 3000 tons

That's ~8 "double dumps"

btw I've done the shop vac "moving sandy soil / damp sand" experiment

medium sized shop vac ~10 gallon........ soil removal rate ~ 1gpm

so you've got something on the order of 650 hours of vacuum
time.....not including time to empty & dispose of the dirt.

We're taking about ~100 days of vacuuming (if you can keep at it for 6
hours per day) Even if I'm high by 2x .....still 50 days of
vacuuming!

Consider contracting with a vacuum excavator.

Your new footings are 24" wide? How deep?

I hope they go below your intended excavation depth.

cheers
Bob

Steve-

Oops!

My arithmetic is fine but my reading needs a little work.........

I read he was digging another 42" but he's digging down to 42", which
is really only another 38".

So I calc'd 194 yds & rounded up to 200.......at 38" additional dig
its 175 yd

the ~3000 tons was a slip on the keyboard (an extra zero) & no proof
reading should have been 300 tons

clearly 3000 tons cannot fit in 8 double dumps!

I used a guessed estimate of 100 pcf for soil weight (2700lb / yd)

Researching density of sandy loam gives 80 to 90 pcf. I think your
number of 74 pcf is a little light.

So my arithmetic is fine, its the input assumptions & my typing that
need a little work.

Independent of the exact (real) numbers ~200 tons he's still facing a
job that will take many days if done hand.

cheers
Bob

"BobK207" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 20, 6:44 pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
A yard of dirt is only about a ton damp, and he's only talking about
roughly
166 yards. So it's considerably less than your mistaken math.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"BobK207" wrote in message

ups.com...



Good to see you're a CE but what do you plan to do with the ~200 yds
of dirt?

~ 3000 tons

That's ~8 "double dumps"

btw I've done the shop vac "moving sandy soil / damp sand" experiment

medium sized shop vac ~10 gallon........ soil removal rate ~ 1gpm

so you've got something on the order of 650 hours of vacuum
time.....not including time to empty & dispose of the dirt.

We're taking about ~100 days of vacuuming (if you can keep at it for 6
hours per day) Even if I'm high by 2x .....still 50 days of
vacuuming!

Consider contracting with a vacuum excavator.

Your new footings are 24" wide? How deep?

I hope they go below your intended excavation depth.

cheers
Bob

Steve-

Oops!

My arithmetic is fine but my reading needs a little work.........

I read he was digging another 42" but he's digging down to 42", which
is really only another 38".

So I calc'd 194 yds & rounded up to 200.......at 38" additional dig
its 175 yd

the ~3000 tons was a slip on the keyboard (an extra zero) & no proof
reading should have been 300 tons

clearly 3000 tons cannot fit in 8 double dumps!

I used a guessed estimate of 100 pcf for soil weight (2700lb / yd)

Researching density of sandy loam gives 80 to 90 pcf. I think your
number of 74 pcf is a little light.

So my arithmetic is fine, its the input assumptions & my typing that
need a little work.

Independent of the exact (real) numbers ~200 tons he's still facing a
job that will take many days if done hand.

cheers
Bob

Old, old Mechanical Engineering textbooks indicate that one man can load 1
cubic yard of loose dirt in about 45 minutes on a continuous basis. Because
of my constraints I am assuming it will take about 2 hours per cubic yard.
That includes running the Kubota to the back acreage for disposal. Maybe I
can lose most of my excess weight?

Thanks,
Ivan

On Mar 21, 2:26 pm, "Ivan Vegvary" wrote:
"BobK207" wrote in message

ups.com...

On Mar 20, 6:44 pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
A yard of dirt is only about a ton damp, and he's only talking about
roughly
166 yards. So it's considerably less than your mistaken math.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"BobK207" wrote in message

roups.com...

Good to see you're a CE but what do you plan to do with the ~200 yds
of dirt?

~ 3000 tons

That's ~8 "double dumps"

btw I've done the shop vac "moving sandy soil / damp sand" experiment

medium sized shop vac ~10 gallon........ soil removal rate ~ 1gpm

so you've got something on the order of 650 hours of vacuum
time.....not including time to empty & dispose of the dirt.

We're taking about ~100 days of vacuuming (if you can keep at it for 6
hours per day) Even if I'm high by 2x .....still 50 days of
vacuuming!

Consider contracting with a vacuum excavator.

Your new footings are 24" wide? How deep?

I hope they go below your intended excavation depth.

cheers
Bob

Steve-

Oops!

My arithmetic is fine but my reading needs a little work.........

I read he was digging another 42" but he's digging down to 42", which
is really only another 38".

So I calc'd 194 yds & rounded up to 200.......at 38" additional dig
its 175 yd

the ~3000 tons was a slip on the keyboard (an extra zero) & no proof
reading should have been 300 tons

clearly 3000 tons cannot fit in 8 double dumps!

I used a guessed estimate of 100 pcf for soil weight (2700lb / yd)

Researching density of sandy loam gives 80 to 90 pcf. I think your
number of 74 pcf is a little light.

So my arithmetic is fine, its the input assumptions & my typing that
need a little work.

Independent of the exact (real) numbers ~200 tons he's still facing a
job that will take many days if done hand.

cheers
Bob

Old, old Mechanical Engineering textbooks indicate that one man can load 1
cubic yard of loose dirt in about 45 minutes on a continuous basis. Because
of my constraints I am assuming it will take about 2 hours per cubic yard.
That includes running the Kubota to the back acreage for disposal. Maybe I
can lose most of my excess weight?

Thanks,
Ivan

Ivan-

I'm not disputing that this project is doable.....it is.

But it is a non-trivial undertaking. The fact that you have a Kubota
AND back acreage for disposal will really help out. If you've got
even as little as a half acre you can make this dirt disappear easily
but for me living in an urban / suburban area getting rid of more
than a few yds is a pain.

Check my calcs but 175 yards at 2 hrs per yd ........that's about 2
man months, if you can do it 8 hrs per day.


The final answer isn't going to be 10 work days or 200 work days.

I know of a guy who dug a basement by hand.....weekends & a few hours
here & there after work......took him 3 1/2 years (calender years)

let us know how it works out so we can update our "by hand" dirt
removal rates.

cheers
Bob

I don't go by "pcf's" or books. I go by real life. In the landscaping
business we load trucks with dirt daily. Somewhat moist pulverized topsoil
is 1 ton per yard. No matter what some pencil pushing geek book writer
says.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:
www.lightsout.org




"BobK207" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 20, 6:44 pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
A yard of dirt is only about a ton damp, and he's only talking about
roughly
166 yards. So it's considerably less than your mistaken math.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"BobK207" wrote in message

ups.com...



Good to see you're a CE but what do you plan to do with the ~200 yds
of dirt?

~ 3000 tons

That's ~8 "double dumps"

btw I've done the shop vac "moving sandy soil / damp sand" experiment

medium sized shop vac ~10 gallon........ soil removal rate ~ 1gpm

so you've got something on the order of 650 hours of vacuum
time.....not including time to empty & dispose of the dirt.

We're taking about ~100 days of vacuuming (if you can keep at it for 6
hours per day) Even if I'm high by 2x .....still 50 days of
vacuuming!

Consider contracting with a vacuum excavator.

Your new footings are 24" wide? How deep?

I hope they go below your intended excavation depth.

cheers
Bob

Steve-

Oops!

My arithmetic is fine but my reading needs a little work.........

I read he was digging another 42" but he's digging down to 42", which
is really only another 38".

So I calc'd 194 yds & rounded up to 200.......at 38" additional dig
its 175 yd

the ~3000 tons was a slip on the keyboard (an extra zero) & no proof
reading should have been 300 tons

clearly 3000 tons cannot fit in 8 double dumps!

I used a guessed estimate of 100 pcf for soil weight (2700lb / yd)

Researching density of sandy loam gives 80 to 90 pcf. I think your
number of 74 pcf is a little light.

So my arithmetic is fine, its the input assumptions & my typing that
need a little work.

Independent of the exact (real) numbers ~200 tons he's still facing a
job that will take many days if done hand.

cheers
Bob

On Mar 21, 6:54 pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
I don't go by "pcf's" or books. I go by real life. In the landscaping
business we load trucks with dirt daily. Somewhat moist pulverized topsoil
is 1 ton per yard. No matter what some pencil pushing geek book writer
says.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"BobK207" wrote in message

ups.com...

On Mar 20, 6:44 pm, "Steve Barker"
wrote:
A yard of dirt is only about a ton damp, and he's only talking about
roughly
166 yards. So it's considerably less than your mistaken math.

--
Steve Barker

YOU should be the one
controlling YOUR car.
Check out:www.lightsout.org

"BobK207" wrote in message

roups.com...

Good to see you're a CE but what do you plan to do with the ~200 yds
of dirt?

~ 3000 tons

That's ~8 "double dumps"

btw I've done the shop vac "moving sandy soil / damp sand" experiment

medium sized shop vac ~10 gallon........ soil removal rate ~ 1gpm

so you've got something on the order of 650 hours of vacuum
time.....not including time to empty & dispose of the dirt.

We're taking about ~100 days of vacuuming (if you can keep at it for 6
hours per day) Even if I'm high by 2x .....still 50 days of
vacuuming!

Consider contracting with a vacuum excavator.

Your new footings are 24" wide? How deep?

I hope they go below your intended excavation depth.

cheers
Bob

Steve-

Oops!

My arithmetic is fine but my reading needs a little work.........

I read he was digging another 42" but he's digging down to 42", which
is really only another 38".

So I calc'd 194 yds & rounded up to 200.......at 38" additional dig
its 175 yd

the ~3000 tons was a slip on the keyboard (an extra zero) & no proof
reading should have been 300 tons

clearly 3000 tons cannot fit in 8 double dumps!

I used a guessed estimate of 100 pcf for soil weight (2700lb / yd)

Researching density of sandy loam gives 80 to 90 pcf. I think your
number of 74 pcf is a little light.

So my arithmetic is fine, its the input assumptions & my typing that
need a little work.

Independent of the exact (real) numbers ~200 tons he's still facing a
job that will take many days if done hand.

cheers
Bob

I guess we should just close all the libraries, publishing houses,
research activities & pencil manufacturers.

I checked with my field guys (who remove TONS soil) they also think
your number is low for soil to be excavated.

Perhaps in situ soil (the stuff the OP's got in his crawlspace) is in
fact denser than the moist "pulverized topsoil".

When you dig it up it loses compaction & density but when you start
with undisturbed soil, its denser.

btw OP doesn't have "moist pulverized topsoil"....he has sandy loam.

Also tell me me how you got 166 yds? I get 176.

cheers
Bob