Red Wire in Cileing light
 

Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any suggestions?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

The red wire is coming from a three switch box(wall installed) by the
front door - one for the entry, one for the porch light, one for a
light by the garage. The switch for the entry has the black power wire
and then a red wire into the ceiling box. The previous light was
connected to the Black wire and the red wire (granted it was an old
light) for the new fixture I connected the black to the black, the
white to the white - the light turned on but the switch would not turn
it on and off. when I connect the red to the white on the fixture the
light does not work at all.
propman wrote:
wrote in news:1164948413.649072.89190
@h54g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:

Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any suggestions?




Are the wires you mentioned coming into the ceiling electrical box or are
you talking about wires that came attached to the fixture? Also, what kind
of switch are you refering to......wall installed or integral to the
lighting unit you are installing?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

wrote:
The red wire is coming from a three switch box(wall installed) by the
front door - one for the entry, one for the porch light, one for a
light by the garage. The switch for the entry has the black power wire
and then a red wire into the ceiling box. The previous light was
connected to the Black wire and the red wire (granted it was an old
light) for the new fixture I connected the black to the black, the
white to the white - the light turned on but the switch would not turn
it on and off. when I connect the red to the white on the fixture the
light does not work at all.


Suggest you try connecting it as old one was- what made you decide not
to? Is there another switch controlling this light? If so, it needs
a switched hot, that's why it was connected to black and red. This is
common in hall (or staircase) fixtures, so they can be switched from
either end of hall.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

I did connect as the old one was, the light did not turn on, when I
connect it to as most are the light will not turn off.

Sev wrote:
wrote:
The red wire is coming from a three switch box(wall installed) by the
front door - one for the entry, one for the porch light, one for a
light by the garage. The switch for the entry has the black power wire
and then a red wire into the ceiling box. The previous light was
connected to the Black wire and the red wire (granted it was an old
light) for the new fixture I connected the black to the black, the
white to the white - the light turned on but the switch would not turn
it on and off. when I connect the red to the white on the fixture the
light does not work at all.


Suggest you try connecting it as old one was- what made you decide not
to? Is there another switch controlling this light? If so, it needs
a switched hot, that's why it was connected to black and red. This is
common in hall (or staircase) fixtures, so they can be switched from
either end of hall.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

wrote:
I did connect as the old one was, the light did not turn on, when I
connect it to as most are the light will not turn off.

.. The previous light was
connected to the Black wire and the red wire


But this isn't what you said you did with new fixture. Is there
another switch which controlled the old light?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

Sev wrote:
wrote:
I did connect as the old one was, the light did not turn on, when I
connect it to as most are the light will not turn off.

. The previous light was
connected to the Black wire and the red wire


But this isn't what you said you did with new fixture. Is there
another switch which controlled the old light?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

It is how the light is currently connected, black to black, white to
red. the light does not turn on and there is no other switch to power
the light

Sev wrote:
wrote:
I did connect as the old one was, the light did not turn on, when I
connect it to as most are the light will not turn off.

. The previous light was
connected to the Black wire and the red wire


But this isn't what you said you did with new fixture. Is there
another switch which controlled the old light?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

How was it wired when you started dicking with it?

--
Steve Barker



wrote in message
ups.com...
Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any suggestions?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

It was wired to a light fixture (circa 1973) that had nither black nor
white nor red wires, the black wires went to ine and the red to the
other. So from the new fixture (circa 2006) I hooked the black to the
black and the white to the red - no light - So i switched the white to
the white wire that was previously hanging from the electrical box and
had light but no switch control.

Steve Barker LT wrote:
How was it wired when you started dicking with it?

--
Steve Barker



wrote in message
ups.com...
Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any suggestions?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

I am very confuse now.

Please, how many wires are available at the ceiling box where the
fixture is?

What colors are they?


It would also help if you would pull the switch out enough to
identify the colors on the 2 terminals on the switch.





___________________________
Keep the whole world singing. . . .
DanG


wrote in message
ups.com...
Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in
my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a
white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on
the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any
suggestions?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

OK
Light Switch - Black on one terminal red on the other

Electrical Box - Black, White, Red, Ground

Old fixture was connected to black and red with two copper wires from
the fixture.

New fixture connected black to black ad white to red - no light
New fixture connected black to black and white to white - light but no
switch control

DanG wrote:
I am very confuse now.

Please, how many wires are available at the ceiling box where the
fixture is?

What colors are they?


It would also help if you would pull the switch out enough to
identify the colors on the 2 terminals on the switch.





___________________________
Keep the whole world singing. . . .
DanG


wrote in message
ups.com...
Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in
my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a
white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on
the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any
suggestions?

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

see if black(fixture) to red (house) and white to white works. that is
what I would expect in your situation. white is always neutral, green
is always ground, most other colors are hot. when you have a black and
a red in the same box black is usually always hot and red is switched hot.

nate

wrote:
OK
Light Switch - Black on one terminal red on the other

Electrical Box - Black, White, Red, Ground

Old fixture was connected to black and red with two copper wires from
the fixture.

New fixture connected black to black ad white to red - no light
New fixture connected black to black and white to white - light but no
switch control

DanG wrote:

I am very confuse now.

Please, how many wires are available at the ceiling box where the
fixture is?

What colors are they?


It would also help if you would pull the switch out enough to
identify the colors on the 2 terminals on the switch.





___________________________
Keep the whole world singing. . . .
DanG


wrote in message
roups.com...

Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in
my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a
white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on
the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any
suggestions?





--
replace "fly" with "com" to reply.
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

wrote:
It was wired to a light fixture (circa 1973) that had nither black nor
white nor red wires, the black wires went to ine and the red to the
other. So from the new fixture (circa 2006) I hooked the black to the
black and the white to the red - no light - So i switched the white to
the white wire that was previously hanging from the electrical box and
had light but no switch control.

Then remove the light fixture black wire from the black wire(s) and
connect it to the red wire. Leave the light fixture white wire
connected to the white wire from the box.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

In article .com, wrote:
OK
Light Switch - Black on one terminal red on the other

Electrical Box - Black, White, Red, Ground

Old fixture was connected to black and red with two copper wires from
the fixture.

I doubt that very much. Probably it was connected to white and red, and you
forgot -- it seems that you didn't take note of what was connected to what,
before you took the old one out.

New fixture connected black to black ad white to red - no light

No surprise the you've connected both sides of the light fixture to hot
wires. No current can flow between two points that are at the same voltage.

New fixture connected black to black and white to white - light but no
switch control

No surprise there either: you have the neutral side of the fixture connected
properly, and the hot side connected to a wire that's hot all the time, and
not controlled by the switch.

Try connecting white to white, and black to red -- and next time, pay
attention to what's connected where, and label them, before you disconnect
anything.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

wrote:
Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any suggestions?

if the light was working when you disconnected it there are only two
combinations , unless it was miswired in the first place.

Black and white

Red and white

If you have a voltage tester of some sort that would help.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

Sounds like you need someone in there that knows what they are doing.

--
Steve Barker



wrote in message
oups.com...
It was wired to a light fixture (circa 1973) that had nither black nor
white nor red wires, the black wires went to ine and the red to the
other. So from the new fixture (circa 2006) I hooked the black to the
black and the white to the red - no light - So i switched the white to
the white wire that was previously hanging from the electrical box and
had light but no switch control.

Steve Barker LT wrote:
How was it wired when you started dicking with it?

--
Steve Barker

Red Wire in Ceiling light
 

Steve Barker LT wrote:

Sounds like you need someone in there that knows what they are doing.


Ceiling light. [Ceiling] at least get the spelling close.
Take Steve's advice above.
Quote: "No current can flow between two points that are at the same
voltage. Doug"
That is true of 115-volt coming off the same power leg; not true of
230-volt without a proper load between those two conductors = BANG, a
direct short!
Of course, Doug knows that.
- udarrell

--
PROPER A/C UNIT & DUCTWORK Sizing is over 70% of Operating Efficiency
http://www.udarrell.com/proper_cfm_b...syste ms.html

Air Conditioning Installations Now Produce 95% Failure Rate
http://www.eeba.org/conference/2004/...s/Proctor1.pdf

Solving - External Static Pressure (ESP)
http://www.udarrell.com/udarrell-air-conditioning.html

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

On 30 Nov 2006 22:24:39 -0800, wrote:

OK
Light Switch - Black on one terminal red on the other

Electrical Box - Black, White, Red, Ground

Old fixture was connected to black and red with two copper wires from
the fixture.

New fixture connected black to black ad white to red - no light
New fixture connected black to black and white to white - light but no
switch control


You haven't described enough wires.
Is there no white or ground in the switch-box?
If there's a red and a black in the switch-box,
and a red and a black in the light fixture-box,
where is your power coming from?

I suppose suggesting that you buy or borrow a book on home electrical
wiring and read the damn thing is going to be totally wasted.

If you disconnect everything, either one wire in the
light fixture box OR one wire in the switch box should
be hot all the time, but not both.

Figure that out, and then get back to us.

--goedjn

Red Wire in Ceiling light
 

On Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:02:25 GMT, udarrell
wrote:

Steve Barker LT wrote:

Sounds like you need someone in there that knows what they are doing.


Ceiling light. [Ceiling] at least get the spelling close.
Take Steve's advice above.
Quote: "No current can flow between two points that are at the same
voltage. Doug"
That is true of 115-volt coming off the same power leg; not true of
230-volt without a proper load between those two conductors = BANG, a
direct short!
Of course, Doug knows that.
- udarrell

For purposes of that rule (No current can flow between two points that
are at the same voltage) the 2 legs of 230V are NOT the same voltage.
They are opposite (180 degrees out of phase). That's like +10 and -10
aren't the same number.
--
24 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Unlike biological evolution. 'intelligent design' is
not a genuine scientific theory and, therefore, has
no place in the curriculum of our nation's public
school classes." -- Ted Kennedy

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

wrote:
wrote:
Hi,

I am in the process of replacing all of my ceiling fixtures in my
house. I am currently replacing one in the hall, there is a white,
black, red and ground. The only way the light will work is on the black
and white but it can not be controlled by the switch. Any suggestions?

if the light was working when you disconnected it there are only two
combinations , unless it was miswired in the first place.

Black and white

Red and white

If you have a voltage tester of some sort that would help.
..
Forty plus postings!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Suggest this is waste of time; and possibly dangerous or non code?
Trying to advise someone who hasn't clue about how to wire what 'sounds
like' a simple single wall switch to one light, that was working before
the existing light was disconnected.
All this about the red wire being connected to ....................
etc. is not the way to UNDERSTAND and do a safe job. He/she may get it
working but will it be safe. Very worrying!
An electrician or even someone competent could probably sort that out
in less than half an hour even though there now seems to be no record
of what the connections previuosly were. Not making a note of them is
negligent IMHO.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

terry wrote:

snipped

Red Wire in Ceiling light
 

Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:02:25 GMT, udarrell
wrote:


Steve Barker LT wrote:


Sounds like you need someone in there that knows what they are doing.


Ceiling light. [Ceiling] at least get the spelling close.
Take Steve's advice above.
Quote: "No current can flow between two points that are at the same
voltage. Doug"
That is true of 115-volt coming off the same power leg; not true of
230-volt without a proper load between those two conductors = BANG, a
direct short!
Of course, Doug knows that.
- udarrell



For purposes of that rule (No current can flow between two points that
are at the same voltage [& phase]) the 2 legs of 230V are NOT the same [phase] voltage.
They are opposite [phase] (180 degrees out of phase). That's like +10 and -10
aren't the same number.


Excellent description, the opposite legs [phase] of power are
180-degrees out of phase -
Therefore, due to being 180-degrees out of phase, the same 115-volts
potential each possesses is doubled to 230-volts.
However, either leg will deliver 115-volts across a load to neutral or
ground.
I am sure Doug knew that.

--
PROPER A/C UNIT & DUCTWORK Sizing is over 70% of Operating Efficiency
http://www.udarrell.com/proper_cfm_b...syste ms.html

Air Conditioning Installations Now Produce 95% Failure Rate
http://www.eeba.org/conference/2004/...s/Proctor1.pdf

Solving - External Static Pressure (ESP)
http://www.udarrell.com/udarrell-air-conditioning.html

Red Wire in Ceiling light
 

On Sat, 02 Dec 2006 00:09:57 GMT, udarrell
wrote:

Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:02:25 GMT, udarrell
wrote:


Steve Barker LT wrote:


Sounds like you need someone in there that knows what they are doing.


Ceiling light. [Ceiling] at least get the spelling close.
Take Steve's advice above.
Quote: "No current can flow between two points that are at the same
voltage. Doug"
That is true of 115-volt coming off the same power leg; not true of
230-volt without a proper load between those two conductors = BANG, a
direct short!
Of course, Doug knows that.
- udarrell



For purposes of that rule (No current can flow between two points that
are at the same voltage [& phase])

Please don't edit my quotes. If you have anything to say, please be
honest and say it yourself.

the 2 legs of 230V are NOT the same [phase] voltage.
They are opposite [phase] (180 degrees out of phase).

Notice that here I already said "phase".

That's like +10 and -10
aren't the same number.


Excellent description, the opposite legs [phase] of power are
180-degrees out of phase -
Therefore, due to being 180-degrees out of phase, the same 115-volts
potential each possesses is doubled to 230-volts.
However, either leg will deliver 115-volts across a load to neutral or
ground.
I am sure Doug knew that.
--
24 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Unlike biological evolution. 'intelligent design' is
not a genuine scientific theory and, therefore, has
no place in the curriculum of our nation's public
school classes." -- Ted Kennedy

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

Jeff Wisnia wrote:
terry wrote:

snipped


.
Forty plus postings!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Suggest this is waste of time; and possibly dangerous or non code?
Trying to advise someone who hasn't clue about how to wire what 'sounds
like' a simple single wall switch to one light, that was working before
the existing light was disconnected.
All this about the red wire being connected to ....................
etc. is not the way to UNDERSTAND and do a safe job. He/she may get it
working but will it be safe. Very worrying!\


I was reaching your view myself....

An electrician or even someone competent could probably sort that out
in less than half an hour even though there now seems to be no record
of what the connections previuosly were. Not making a note of them is
negligent IMHO.

Particularly since practically EVERBODY has a digital camera now, and a
couple of quick shots will save the "before" conditions in "living color".

So, the red wire gets connected to the camera !?

Red Wire in Ceiling light
 

On Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:02:25 GMT, udarrell
wrote:




Damn, if you have a RED wire, your house is bugged. Red wires are
only allowed if they are connected to the Federal Government. Anyone
who has red wires is on the FBIs 10 most wanted lists or are under
survilance. I'd pack up and leave quickly, use the rear door and
leave during the night. Do not say a word to anyone about this. That
red wire sees and hears everything you do.

Red Wire in Ceiling light
 

Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Sat, 02 Dec 2006 00:09:57 GMT, udarrell
wrote:



Mark Lloyd wrote:



On Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:02:25 GMT, udarrell
wrote:




Steve Barker LT wrote:


Ceiling light. [Ceiling] at least get the spelling close.
Take Steve's advice above.
Quote: "No current can flow between two points that are at the same
voltage. Doug"
That is true of 115-volt coming off the same [phase] power leg; not true of
230-volt without a proper load between those two conductors = BANG, a
direct short!
Of course, Doug knows that.
- udarrell


For purposes of that rule (No current can flow between two points that
are at the same voltage [& phase])



Please don't edit my quotes. If you have anything to say, please be
honest and say it yourself.



the 2 legs of 230V are NOT the same [phase] voltage.
They are opposite [phase] (180 degrees out of phase).



Notice that here I already said "phase".



That's like +10 and -10
aren't the same number.


Excellent description, the opposite legs [phase] of power are
180-degrees out of phase -
Therefore, due to being 180-degrees out of phase, the same 115-volts
potential each possesses is doubled to 230-volts.
However, either leg will deliver 115-volts across a load to neutral or
ground.
I am sure Doug knew that.


I apologize Mark for the [edits], I was merely clarifying that you were
correct in your statements.

--
PROPER A/C UNIT & DUCTWORK Sizing is over 70% of Operating Efficiency
http://www.udarrell.com/proper_cfm_b...syste ms.html

Air Conditioning Installations Now Produce 95% Failure Rate
http://www.eeba.org/conference/2004/...s/Proctor1.pdf

Solving - External Static Pressure (ESP)
http://www.udarrell.com/udarrell-air-conditioning.html

Red Wire in Ceiling light
 

On Sat, 02 Dec 2006 15:13:26 GMT, udarrell
wrote:

Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Sat, 02 Dec 2006 00:09:57 GMT, udarrell
wrote:



Mark Lloyd wrote:



On Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:02:25 GMT, udarrell
wrote:




Steve Barker LT wrote:


Ceiling light. [Ceiling] at least get the spelling close.
Take Steve's advice above.
Quote: "No current can flow between two points that are at the same
voltage. Doug"
That is true of 115-volt coming off the same [phase] power leg; not true of
230-volt without a proper load between those two conductors = BANG, a
direct short!
Of course, Doug knows that.
- udarrell


For purposes of that rule (No current can flow between two points that
are at the same voltage [& phase])



Please don't edit my quotes. If you have anything to say, please be
honest and say it yourself.



the 2 legs of 230V are NOT the same [phase] voltage.
They are opposite [phase] (180 degrees out of phase).



Notice that here I already said "phase".



That's like +10 and -10
aren't the same number.


Excellent description, the opposite legs [phase] of power are
180-degrees out of phase -
Therefore, due to being 180-degrees out of phase, the same 115-volts
potential each possesses is doubled to 230-volts.
However, either leg will deliver 115-volts across a load to neutral or
ground.
I am sure Doug knew that.


I apologize Mark for the [edits], I was merely clarifying that you were
correct in your statements.

And I still recognize that the legs of a 230V circuit are not the
same.

I once had trouble because I knew more that I was supposed to. In my
NEC class, one question on a test was "True or false: the currents in
each leg of a 3-phase wye motor are equal". The "correct" answer in
that class was "true". I knew it was false. The sum of all currents in
a node is zero (and can't be anything else, considering what current
is). The only time you can have 3 equal numbers that add up to zero is
when they're all zero. In this case, you have something like:

40A @ 0 deg + 40A @ 120 deg + 40A @ 240 deg = 0

Those numbers are definitely NOT equal to each other.


--
23 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Unlike biological evolution. 'intelligent design' is
not a genuine scientific theory and, therefore, has
no place in the curriculum of our nation's public
school classes." -- Ted Kennedy

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

I came for help, not some super electrical geek boy smart ass answer.
but thanks


Doug Miller wrote:
In article .com, wrote:
OK
Light Switch - Black on one terminal red on the other

Electrical Box - Black, White, Red, Ground

Old fixture was connected to black and red with two copper wires from
the fixture.

I doubt that very much. Probably it was connected to white and red, and you
forgot -- it seems that you didn't take note of what was connected to what,
before you took the old one out.

New fixture connected black to black ad white to red - no light

No surprise the you've connected both sides of the light fixture to hot
wires. No current can flow between two points that are at the same voltage.

New fixture connected black to black and white to white - light but no
switch control

No surprise there either: you have the neutral side of the fixture connected
properly, and the hot side connected to a wire that's hot all the time, and
not controlled by the switch.

Try connecting white to white, and black to red -- and next time, pay
attention to what's connected where, and label them, before you disconnect
anything.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

He sounds 100% right. It is hard us tell from here, but if you take a
voltage tester and check, the black should be hot all the time and the
red should be controlled by the switched.

I think you were mistaken about the original connection.

The fan should have the same 3 colors. Do red/red black/black
white/white.


On 2 Dec 2006 16:18:45 -0800, wrote:

I came for help, not some super electrical geek boy smart ass answer.
but thanks


Doug Miller wrote:
In article .com, wrote:
OK
Light Switch - Black on one terminal red on the other

Electrical Box - Black, White, Red, Ground

Old fixture was connected to black and red with two copper wires from
the fixture.

I doubt that very much. Probably it was connected to white and red, and you
forgot -- it seems that you didn't take note of what was connected to what,
before you took the old one out.

New fixture connected black to black ad white to red - no light

No surprise the you've connected both sides of the light fixture to hot
wires. No current can flow between two points that are at the same voltage.

New fixture connected black to black and white to white - light but no
switch control

No surprise there either: you have the neutral side of the fixture connected
properly, and the hot side connected to a wire that's hot all the time, and
not controlled by the switch.

Try connecting white to white, and black to red -- and next time, pay
attention to what's connected where, and label them, before you disconnect
anything.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

In article .com, wrote:
I came for help, not some super electrical geek boy smart ass answer.
but thanks

I gave you help -- apparently you failed to notice this part:

Try connecting white to white, and black to red -- and next time, pay
attention to what's connected where, and label them, before you disconnect
anything.

From your description of the light's behavior, it's quite obvious that you do
not have the wires connected the same way they were before.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

Red Wire in Cileing light
 

In article .com,
says...
I came for help, not some super electrical geek boy smart ass answer.
but thanks

You ever figure this out yet?

Doug Miller wrote:
In article .com, wrote:
OK
Light Switch - Black on one terminal red on the other

Electrical Box - Black, White, Red, Ground

Old fixture was connected to black and red with two copper wires from
the fixture.

I doubt that very much. Probably it was connected to white and red, and you
forgot -- it seems that you didn't take note of what was connected to what,
before you took the old one out.

New fixture connected black to black ad white to red - no light

No surprise the you've connected both sides of the light fixture to hot
wires. No current can flow between two points that are at the same voltage.

New fixture connected black to black and white to white - light but no
switch control

No surprise there either: you have the neutral side of the fixture connected
properly, and the hot side connected to a wire that's hot all the time, and
not controlled by the switch.

Try connecting white to white, and black to red -- and next time, pay
attention to what's connected where, and label them, before you disconnect
anything.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.