Home Repair (alt.home.repair) For all homeowners and DIYers with many experienced tradesmen. Solve your toughest home fix-it problems.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1   Report Post  
Dave
 
Posts: n/a
Default Thermostat wiring question (Heil heatpump and White-Rodgers stat)

Hello all,
I'm hoping someone here can help.

I am attempting to replace my current thermostat (mercury type) with a
White-Rodgers 1f82-261. The current stat is wired with 4 wires; red-'r',
green-'g', yellow-'y' and orange-'o'. The new stat requires 24v power
from the system which means I need to get the common side of the trans back
to the stat. The cable at the wall has 7 wires in it. When I put a meter
on the red and blue wires I show 24vac. I opened the panel on the heatpump
(Heil) and the blue wire is not connected to anything so I'm left wondering
how the circuit is being completed.

Do the control wires typically connect to something else (transformer?)
between the heatpump and thermostat? I had assumed the transformer is
located within the heatpump and the 24vac is supplied via the red wire to
the stat which then determines which path it returns on. Is that correct?
If so, I was thinking I could just connect the common side of the
transformer to the blue wire and violla. Since I'm already showing a
circuit with the blue and red, and the blue is not connected at the
heatpump side, I'm stumped.

Any help is appreciated!
  #2   Report Post  
Travis Jordan
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dave wrote:
I am attempting to replace my current thermostat (mercury type) with a
White-Rodgers 1f82-261. The current stat is wired with 4 wires;
red-'r', green-'g', yellow-'y' and orange-'o'. The new stat
requires 24v power from the system which means I need to get the
common side of the trans back to the stat. The cable at the wall has
7 wires in it. When I put a meter on the red and blue wires I show
24vac. I opened the panel on the heatpump (Heil) and the blue wire
is not connected to anything so I'm left wondering how the circuit is
being completed.


Obviously, it is a different blue wire.

You are over your head and may be better off calling a professional
before you let the magic smoke out of something.


  #3   Report Post  
Dave
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Travis Jordan" wrote in news:05Lme.56391$Yr4.9283
@fe07.news.easynews.com:


Obviously, it is a different blue wire.


Yes, obviously, but I guess I didn't make it clear that I had already
figured that out. My question was:

"Do the control wires typically connect to something else (transformer?)
between the heatpump and thermostat? I had assumed the transformer is
located within the heatpump and the 24vac is supplied via the red wire to
the stat which then determines which path it returns on. Is that correct?"

What I'm getting at is do I need to start looking for a transformer outside
of the heatpump that feeds the 24vac or are my assumptions correct about
thermostat wiring in general and it's just that the wiring on this set-up
completely jacked?
  #4   Report Post  
Travis Jordan
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dave wrote:
"Do the control wires typically connect to something else
(transformer?) between the heatpump and thermostat? I had assumed
the transformer is located within the heatpump


No.

and the 24vac is
supplied via the red wire to the stat which then determines which
path it returns on. Is that correct?"


Yes.

What I'm getting at is do I need to start looking for a transformer
outside of the heatpump that feeds the 24vac or are my assumptions
correct about thermostat wiring in general and it's just that the
wiring on this set-up completely jacked?


Your wiring sounds fine, but you're looking in the wrong place. If the
solution isn't obvious, please call a professional.


  #5   Report Post  
RP
 
Posts: n/a
Default



Dave wrote:

Hello all,
I'm hoping someone here can help.

I am attempting to replace my current thermostat (mercury type) with a
White-Rodgers 1f82-261. The current stat is wired with 4 wires; red-'r',
green-'g', yellow-'y' and orange-'o'. The new stat requires 24v power
from the system which means I need to get the common side of the trans back
to the stat. The cable at the wall has 7 wires in it. When I put a meter
on the red and blue wires I show 24vac. I opened the panel on the heatpump
(Heil) and the blue wire is not connected to anything so I'm left wondering
how the circuit is being completed.

Do the control wires typically connect to something else (transformer?)
between the heatpump and thermostat? I had assumed the transformer is
located within the heatpump and the 24vac is supplied via the red wire to
the stat which then determines which path it returns on. Is that correct?
If so, I was thinking I could just connect the common side of the
transformer to the blue wire and violla. Since I'm already showing a
circuit with the blue and red, and the blue is not connected at the
heatpump side, I'm stumped.

Any help is appreciated!


The transformer is located in the air handler. The open end of the
unused blue is probably just touching some sheet metal in the control
section, thus grounding it. It shouldn't be tied in at the t-stat until
it has been confirmed that it's connected to the transformer common. If
the house burns because of your negligence your HO insurance may not
cover it.

hvacrmedic




  #6   Report Post  
Tony Hwang
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dave wrote:

Hello all,
I'm hoping someone here can help.

I am attempting to replace my current thermostat (mercury type) with a
White-Rodgers 1f82-261. The current stat is wired with 4 wires; red-'r',
green-'g', yellow-'y' and orange-'o'. The new stat requires 24v power
from the system which means I need to get the common side of the trans back
to the stat. The cable at the wall has 7 wires in it. When I put a meter
on the red and blue wires I show 24vac. I opened the panel on the heatpump
(Heil) and the blue wire is not connected to anything so I'm left wondering
how the circuit is being completed.

Do the control wires typically connect to something else (transformer?)



Hi,
Reading this line, I think you need pro's help.
Don't do it yourself.
Tony

between the heatpump and thermostat? I had assumed the transformer is
located within the heatpump and the 24vac is supplied via the red wire to
the stat which then determines which path it returns on. Is that correct?
If so, I was thinking I could just connect the common side of the
transformer to the blue wire and violla. Since I'm already showing a
circuit with the blue and red, and the blue is not connected at the
heatpump side, I'm stumped.

Any help is appreciated!

  #7   Report Post  
Dave
 
Posts: n/a
Default

RP wrote in
:


The transformer is located in the air handler. The open end of the
unused blue is probably just touching some sheet metal in the control
section, thus grounding it. It shouldn't be tied in at the t-stat
until it has been confirmed that it's connected to the transformer
common. If the house burns because of your negligence your HO
insurance may not cover it.


Understood.

You're the only one here to inform me that the transformer is in the air
handler. I had the same idea that the wire was grounding out somewhere and
I capped it when I was looking at the heat pump end just to be sure. Since
I was still showing a circuit, I knew there was a connection somewhere
else, but didn't know where.

I ended up getting a non-power stealing stat, so I've managed a work
around. I appreciate the info as it will come in handy if I ever come
across this again.
  #8   Report Post  
Dave
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Tony Hwang wrote in


Do the control wires typically connect to something else
(transformer?)



Hi,
Reading this line, I think you need pro's help.
Don't do it yourself.


Why are people so reluctant to answer a question? "Don't do it yourself"
is not an answer to my question. At least explain why you think I
shouldn't do it myself. Otherwise, why bother replying? I already know
that calling a pro is an option so I'm no more enlightened about my
situation than I was before I read your post.

Regardless, I ended up getting a stat that uses battery power. It's a
Robertshaw 8600 and while it's not the most quality product I've ever
handled, for $35 I can't complain. It works, is programmable (5/2) and has
a backlight.

Thanks to those that offered help and information.
  #9   Report Post  
Stretch
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dave
Not all brands use the same control system for heat pumps. Many have
special wiring requirements. The common is often blue, but some use
brown or black. The electrons don't really care what color insulation
is on the wire, it just makes it easier to service.

R=red=24 Volts Hot
Y=Yellow=Compressor Contactor
W=White=Strip Heat
G=Green=Indoor Blower
O=Orange=Reversing Valve Energised in Cool Mode
B=Blue=24 Volts Common

There may be other wires for service lites, but that is normal wiring
for Heil.

R,W,G,B connect at the indoor unit, All 6 connect to the thermostat,
All but G connect to the outdoor unit. If yoy don't keep the color
code consistant, you could fry something. If there is a splice in the
cable where there is a color change, you will most likely need a meter
anf know how to use it.

Other brands like Rheem/Ruud, Amana, Weather King use completely
different systems.

Setback thermostats work best when equipment is too big. If your heat
pump is properly sized, you will not have enough capacity to do
recovery, especially in heat mode.

How you heated your home without strips in extremely cold weather I
don't know. You must live in a mild climate.

Stretch

  #10   Report Post  
Dave
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Stretch" wrote in news:1117683951.619712.94360
@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com:

special wiring requirements. The common is often blue, but some use
brown or black. The electrons don't really care what color insulation
is on the wire, it just makes it easier to service.


Right. I assume you are being facetious here. I'm familiar with
electrical systems in general so I grasp the basic connection part. I've
never delved into HVAC systems except for a prior stat replacement which
worked right out of the gate. I haven't had to troubleshoot them or track
their wiring down.

How you heated your home without strips in extremely cold weather I
don't know. You must live in a mild climate.


One word - Phoenix.
I used the heat about 5 times over the "winter" here, so a heat pump is
mostly sufficient for the task. The problem I ran into is I wouldn't turn
it on until it was about 60 inside and 30 outside, so it would have to run
forever before it would start blowing something resembling tepid air.

Thanks for the informative reply!
Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:20 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 DIYbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about DIY & home improvement"