Home Ownership (misc.consumers.house)

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John/Charleston
 
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Default oil tank(with oil) in the back yard...

I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John
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John A. Weeks III
 
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In article ,
John/Charleston wrote:

I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?


I would try to cover up what you just did, and try to sell the
thing to someone else is even more naive that you might have
been. The problem with contamination like this is that you,
as the owner, have unlimited liability. If this oil has
leaked under the house, you may have to tear down the house
and clean up the soil. If the oil has migrated to a neighboring
property, you have to pay to clean that up, too. And if the
oil has hit the water table, there isn't enough tea in China
to pay what it is going to cost you.

Now that you know about this problem, you have to disclose
it. No one in their right mind would ever buy this due to
the unlimited liability. You should look into this with an
attorney. If the seller did not disclose it to you, and they
knew about it, perhaps you can sue them and get out from under
this dead fish.

You also want to talk with an attorney before you notify
anyone of the problem. Since you are likely to lose
hundreds of thousands of dollars on this fiasco, you are
probably headed towards bankruptcy. You may want to try
to plan this crash so you can save your household goods and
maybe a car.

There is one out for this problem that I know of. If you
stop paying taxes, someone just might take over the property
for the cost of back taxes. When they do this, they also
take over the responsibility for the contamination. You have
no need to disclose anything in this situation. This might
be your best way out.

-john-

--
================================================== ====================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications
http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ====================
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Speedy Jim
 
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John/Charleston wrote:
I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John


Maybe start with a call to a local fuel oil supplier.
Ask what local practice is.
The co. may even offer a de-commissioning service
or know who to call.
  #4   Report Post  
Doc
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"John A. Weeks III" wrote
I would try to cover up what you just did, and try to sell the
thing to someone else is even more naive that you might have
been. The problem with contamination like this is that you,
as the owner, have unlimited liability. If this oil has
leaked under the house, you may have to tear down the house
and clean up the soil. If the oil has migrated to a neighboring
property, you have to pay to clean that up, too. And if the
oil has hit the water table, there isn't enough tea in China
to pay what it is going to cost you.

Now that you know about this problem, you have to disclose
it. No one in their right mind would ever buy this due to
the unlimited liability. You should look into this with an
attorney. If the seller did not disclose it to you, and they
knew about it, perhaps you can sue them and get out from under
this dead fish.

You also want to talk with an attorney before you notify
anyone of the problem. Since you are likely to lose
hundreds of thousands of dollars on this fiasco, you are
probably headed towards bankruptcy. You may want to try
to plan this crash so you can save your household goods and
maybe a car.

There is one out for this problem that I know of. If you
stop paying taxes, someone just might take over the property
for the cost of back taxes. When they do this, they also
take over the responsibility for the contamination. You have
no need to disclose anything in this situation. This might
be your best way out.

-john-


LOL, Good Grief. Get a grip.

  #5   Report Post  
Robert Morien
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article ,
John/Charleston wrote:

I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John


I'd immediately fill out the paperwork to apply as a superfund site.


  #6   Report Post  
John/Charleston
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:10:08 -0600, "John A. Weeks III"
wrote:

In article ,
John/Charleston wrote:

I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?


I would try to cover up what you just did, and try to sell the
thing to someone else is even more naive that you might have
been. The problem with contamination like this is that you,
as the owner, have unlimited liability. If this oil has
leaked under the house, you may have to tear down the house
and clean up the soil. If the oil has migrated to a neighboring
property, you have to pay to clean that up, too. And if the
oil has hit the water table, there isn't enough tea in China
to pay what it is going to cost you.

Now that you know about this problem, you have to disclose
it. No one in their right mind would ever buy this due to
the unlimited liability. You should look into this with an
attorney. If the seller did not disclose it to you, and they
knew about it, perhaps you can sue them and get out from under
this dead fish.

You also want to talk with an attorney before you notify
anyone of the problem. Since you are likely to lose
hundreds of thousands of dollars on this fiasco, you are
probably headed towards bankruptcy. You may want to try
to plan this crash so you can save your household goods and
maybe a car.

There is one out for this problem that I know of. If you
stop paying taxes, someone just might take over the property
for the cost of back taxes. When they do this, they also
take over the responsibility for the contamination. You have
no need to disclose anything in this situation. This might
be your best way out.

-john-


Gee I think I'll just commit suicide right now!
  #7   Report Post  
John/Charleston
 
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Default

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 17:15:37 -0500, Speedy Jim wrote:

John/Charleston wrote:
I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John


Maybe start with a call to a local fuel oil supplier.
Ask what local practice is.
The co. may even offer a de-commissioning service
or know who to call.


That's a good idea...there's got to be a simple way to pump whatever
remaining oil out of the tank and dispose of it properly. I can't
imagine I'm the only one with an oil tank in the backyard.

Thanks again,
John
  #8   Report Post  
Harry K
 
Posts: n/a
Default


John/Charleston wrote:
On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 17:15:37 -0500, Speedy Jim wrote:

John/Charleston wrote:
I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an

oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil

furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was

coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea

of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this

represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to

call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John


Maybe start with a call to a local fuel oil supplier.
Ask what local practice is.
The co. may even offer a de-commissioning service
or know who to call.


That's a good idea...there's got to be a simple way to pump whatever
remaining oil out of the tank and dispose of it properly. I can't
imagine I'm the only one with an oil tank in the backyard.

Thanks again,
John


You will find that you also have to decommission the tank. Just
getting rid of the oil isn't enough. May have to dig it up or fill
with some inert substance.

Harry K

  #9   Report Post  
Bill
 
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Default

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:10:08 -0600, "John A. Weeks III"
wrote:

I would try to cover up what you just did, and try to sell the
thing to someone else is even more naive that you might have
been. The problem with contamination like this is that you,
as the owner, have unlimited liability. If this oil has
leaked under the house, you may have to tear down the house
and clean up the soil. If the oil has migrated to a neighboring
property, you have to pay to clean that up, too. And if the
oil has hit the water table, there isn't enough tea in China
to pay what it is going to cost you.


This whole story is bull****! This man is not EXXON sitting there in
Charleston selling gasoline to the public...he is a homeowner with a
fuel oil storage tank in his yard! These stupid assed horror stories
are urban myths promulgated by angry former gasoline station owners
who have had to clean up their property after leaking fuel into the
ground for years and years selling gasoline to the public.

Bill



  #10   Report Post  
Bill
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 17:15:37 -0500, Speedy Jim wrote:

John/Charleston wrote:
I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John


Maybe start with a call to a local fuel oil supplier.
Ask what local practice is.
The co. may even offer a de-commissioning service
or know who to call.


(I agree, this is a reasonable option...)

Bill





  #11   Report Post  
Bill
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 25 Feb 2005 18:41:38 -0800, "Harry K"
wrote:

John/Charleston wrote:
On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 17:15:37 -0500, Speedy Jim wrote:

John/Charleston wrote:
I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an

oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil

furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was

coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea

of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this

represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to

call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John

Maybe start with a call to a local fuel oil supplier.
Ask what local practice is.
The co. may even offer a de-commissioning service
or know who to call.


That's a good idea...there's got to be a simple way to pump whatever
remaining oil out of the tank and dispose of it properly. I can't
imagine I'm the only one with an oil tank in the backyard.

Thanks again,
John


You will find that you also have to decommission the tank. Just
getting rid of the oil isn't enough. May have to dig it up or fill
with some inert substance.

Harry K


In Charleston, the decommissioning was complete the day that homeowner
decided to stop using the fuel oil in that tank. Now maybe in upstate
New York, especially in the towns surrounding the Love Canal, I'll bet
the local governments have created laws forcing homeowners to dispose
of their old fuel oil storage tanks.

Bill




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Bill
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 13:23:13 -0500, John/Charleston
wrote:

I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John


Hey John!
It just so happens that this person responding to your post, has been
working in the construction industry...specifically fuel storage and
dispensing for over ten years. I know the regulations regarding your
tank!

You are a homeowner with an underground fuel oil storage tank buried
in your yard. You are not in business selling fuel to the public like
a convenience store. Your tank does not fall under the same US
Environmental Protection Agency or South Carolina DEHEC guidelines
pertaining to underground fuel storage tanks.

You don't have to do anything to your tank! If anybody tells you
otherwise they are ignorant and they are just spouting out ignorance
of the facts. Since the tank was originally installed in the late
50's, chances are good that alot of corrosion has been happening on
the outside walls of your tank. There are probably pin hole leaks in
the wall of the tank or it may have corroded to the point where it
could begin to cave in. I would suggest you contact your local fuel
storage and dispensing contractor and have him pump your tank dry just
to satisfy you that no more fuel resides in the tank. If there are pin
hole leaks in the tank wall, ground water could be seeping into the
tank. That may be the case now. Maybe its just sitting there full of
ground water. Are you worried about building something on top of the
tank that could be undermined by the old tank...such as a patio or
garage foundation being built...or putting in a swimming pool...if so
you may want to dig it up. If not, and you don't like it sitting there
full of ground water, you can have a company drop a hose down in the
tank and fill the tank with liquid expanding foam insulation. That way
the tank would not be sitting there full of water.

Either way, you have a tank that was only used to store fuel oil for
your house and it was not used in commerce, therefore you are not
legally required to do anything to it.

Regards,
Bill

  #13   Report Post  
George
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Bill" wrote in message
...

This whole story is bull****! This man is not EXXON sitting there in
Charleston selling gasoline to the public...he is a homeowner with a
fuel oil storage tank in his yard! These stupid assed horror stories
are urban myths promulgated by angry former gasoline station owners
who have had to clean up their property after leaking fuel into the
ground for years and years selling gasoline to the public.

Bill


You don't need to sell gasoline to the public or even have a large tank for
it to be a problem. My buddy bought a small building for an office. There
was a underground tank that was used only for heating oil just for the
building. There were no other tanks or any sort of manufacturing done on the
property. The tank was leaking and by the time he paid for all of the
remediation expense he had spent ~$280,000. Often the previous owner can be
held responsible but they were bankrupt so my buddy had to pay for
everything.


  #14   Report Post  
George
 
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Default


"Harry K" wrote in message
ups.com...

You will find that you also have to decommission the tank. Just

getting rid of the oil isn't enough. May have to dig it up or fill
with some inert substance.

Harry K


Tanks must be removed. It is no longer permissable to fill them (sand was
commonly used).


  #15   Report Post  
v
 
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On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:29:01 -0500, someone wrote:

You don't need to sell gasoline to the public or even have a large tank for
it to be a problem. My buddy bought a small building for an office. There
was a underground tank that was used only for heating oil just for the
building. There were no other tanks or any sort of manufacturing done on the
property. The tank was leaking and by the time he paid for all of the
remediation expense he had spent ~$280,000.

While this stuff does happen ( a buddy of mine spent about $100k, also
on a commerical property), it is also quite routine for tanks to be OK
and taken out for a few thousand dollars, or only a little more costly
if its the tank and a limited amount of nearby soil. An attempt to
coverup will be criminal as well as still carrying civil liability.

First find out how bad the problem is before trying to sue everybody,
plan bankruptcy or suicide, etc.

Get the contents pumped out and exploratory work done to get the tank
removed, which will ID if it is anything more than a very limited
problem
..




Reply to NG only - this e.mail address goes to a kill file.


  #16   Report Post  
John/Charleston
 
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On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:21:36 GMT, Bill
wrote:

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 13:23:13 -0500, John/Charleston
wrote:

I have a 1959 house that I'm fixing up and there seems to be an oil
tank buried in the back yard. The house no longer has an oil furnace,
but I poked a stick down the fill tube in the yard and it was coated
with 12" or so of oil when I brought it back up. I have no idea of
the capacity or shape of the tank so I don't know if this represents
20 or 200 gals of oil! What can I do with this? Do I need to call
a toxic waste disposal co and pay big$$$ or should I apply for a
federal grant as a superfund site?
Located in Charleston, SC

Thanks,
John


Hey John!
It just so happens that this person responding to your post, has been
working in the construction industry...specifically fuel storage and
dispensing for over ten years. I know the regulations regarding your
tank!

You are a homeowner with an underground fuel oil storage tank buried
in your yard. You are not in business selling fuel to the public like
a convenience store. Your tank does not fall under the same US
Environmental Protection Agency or South Carolina DEHEC guidelines
pertaining to underground fuel storage tanks.

You don't have to do anything to your tank! If anybody tells you
otherwise they are ignorant and they are just spouting out ignorance
of the facts. Since the tank was originally installed in the late
50's, chances are good that alot of corrosion has been happening on
the outside walls of your tank. There are probably pin hole leaks in
the wall of the tank or it may have corroded to the point where it
could begin to cave in .Iwouldsuggestyoucontactyourlocalfuel
storage and dispensing contractor and have him pump your tank dry just
to satisfy you that no more fuel resides in the tank. If there are pin
hole leaks in the tank wall, ground water could be seeping into the
tank. That may be the case now. Maybe its just sitting there full of
ground water. Are you worried about building something on top of the
tank that could be undermined by the old tank...such as a patio or
garage foundation being built...or putting in a swimming pool...if so
you may want to dig it up. If not, and you don't like it sitting there
full of ground water, you can have a company drop a hose down in the
tank and fill the tank with liquid expanding foam insulation. That way
the tank would not be sitting there full of water.

Either way, you have a tank that was only used to store fuel oil for
your house and it was not used in commerce, therefore you are not
legally required to do anything to it.

Regards,
Bill


Thanks Bill,
that's good to know. I'd just as soon as pump whatever oil is left
out of the tank rather than let it seep into the local aquifer but
once that's done I'd just as soon leave the empty tank where it is.
I've already built my new porch so there won't be anything else going
on there. I could probably buy a simple pump with some aquarium
tubing and pump it out but I'll call a heating oil co for suggestions.

Thanks again,
John
  #17   Report Post  
Rich Greenberg
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article ,
John/Charleston wrote:

that's good to know. I'd just as soon as pump whatever oil is left
out of the tank rather than let it seep into the local aquifer but
once that's done I'd just as soon leave the empty tank where it is.
I've already built my new porch so there won't be anything else going
on there. I could probably buy a simple pump with some aquarium
tubing and pump it out but I'll call a heating oil co for suggestions.


Not a good idea to leave the empty tank there. It will eventually rust
out and the back yard will collapse in, probably while someone (like
you) is walking over it. After the oil is removed, look into filling
the tank with foam or sand, or even better dig it up and remove it.

--
Rich Greenberg Marietta, GA, USA richgr atsign panix.com + 1 770 321 6507
Eastern time. N6LRT I speak for myself & my dogs only. VM'er since CP-67
Canines:Val, Red & Shasta (RIP),Red, husky Owner:Chinook-L
Atlanta Siberian Husky Rescue. www.panix.com/~richgr/ Asst Owner:Sibernet-L
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