Home Ownership (misc.consumers.house)

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Default Fireplace / Chimney Question

The other week I had a fire going in my family room fireplace. Shortly
after starting the fire, I noticed the smoke was backing up in the
chimney - and the whole downstairs was quickly flooded with smoke.
This is the second time in a year this has happened. After the 1st
time, we suspected it might be a negative pressure situation, so I have
been sure to crack a nearby window every time I start a fire ... guess
that doesn't help.

I decided to have a CSIA certified chimeny sweep come out to clean the
chimney and inspect the chimney for safety. He offered to install two
caps on my chimney (on the fireplace and furnace crowns), which I had
him do. He though the smoke backup was probably caused by blowing
winds, and said the caps may help that problem. He gauged the
clearance and height of the chimney, and said it was up to code and
that probably wasn't the cause of the smoke backup.

Now here's the real issue: During the course of the inspection, he
noted that the crown on the chimney was crumbling (which I knew about
already). He also noted that there were gaps between the chimney flue
and the firebox, where the box narrows into the chimney. The gaps are
not holes, but it's clear there is some masonry which is either rough,
or crumbling.

The chimney sweep (also a fireman for a local FD) made it sound as if
this was a potentially severe problem, and recommended that I not use
the fireplace until getting it fixed. Of course, he had a solution
ready to go: to use some product called "Smoketite" to seal the gaps.
Cost $500.

I hate getting inspections and repairs from the same people, as the
potential for abuse and fraud is too great. Does anyone know if this
truly is a problem or, better yet, if the repair he's suggesting is
worth the $500. Being the holidays, cash is very tight ... but I
really enjoy my fires this time of year.

Any insight appreciated !

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elvindeath
 
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Guess I wasn't aware of all of these problems before but, yes, I would
very much prefer to burn wood (call me traditional). With the few
fires I build per year (10 or so), I enjoy the ambience of the wood
much more. I'd rather just seal the fireplace up as opposed to burning
a "fake" fire.

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Karl
 
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"elvindeath" wrote in message
ups.com...
Guess I wasn't aware of all of these problems before but, yes, I would
very much prefer to burn wood (call me traditional). With the few
fires I build per year (10 or so), I enjoy the ambience of the wood
much more. I'd rather just seal the fireplace up as opposed to burning
a "fake" fire.


Good for you. People toss around factoids on the Internet with no
substantiation all the time. You simply can't alter your life for each of
these claims. Enjoy your wood fire.



  #5   Report Post  
John A. Weeks III
 
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In article ,
"Karl" wrote:

"elvindeath" wrote in message
ups.com...
Guess I wasn't aware of all of these problems before but, yes, I would
very much prefer to burn wood (call me traditional). With the few
fires I build per year (10 or so), I enjoy the ambience of the wood
much more. I'd rather just seal the fireplace up as opposed to burning
a "fake" fire.


Good for you. People toss around factoids on the Internet with no
substantiation all the time. You simply can't alter your life for each of
these claims. Enjoy your wood fire.


When you know something does real damage to your body and others,
wouldn't you be insane not to make an adjustment? Have you never
seen the effects of acid rain in the mountains in places like
Pennsylvania, or seen a person with breathing problems struggle
to catch his/her next breath? We only have one atmosphere on this
planet, and if we mess it up, we are out of options. The air
is something that we should take care of above all else since
everyone has to breath to live. That is why people should not
use cheap 2-stroke lawn mowers and why charcoal fires should be
banned in favor of gas.

-john-

--
================================================== ====================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications
http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ====================


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John A. Weeks III
 
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In article . com,
"elvindeath" wrote:

Guess I wasn't aware of all of these problems before but, yes, I would
very much prefer to burn wood (call me traditional). With the few
fires I build per year (10 or so), I enjoy the ambience of the wood
much more. I'd rather just seal the fireplace up as opposed to burning
a "fake" fire.


I can assure you that there is nothing fake about a gas fire.
If you don't agree, just put you hand in one, and see how long
you can hold it there. You will find that you get burned just
as badly from gas as from wood.

Add in the fact that gas is not stinky like wood, gas does
not have random bubbles that splatter pitch into your room,
nor does gas have cinders that start forest fires, nor does
it burn your house down from accumulation of pitch in the
chimney, nor does gas leave a lot of embers to clean up,
or smoke to damage your living room. What it does give is
a nice pretty fire that starts quickly, gives off heat much
more efficiently, and burns cheaply.

If you think a gas fireplace is not pretty, then you haven't
seen the modern ones. They look just like wood burning.
Go check one out, not that you have to buy one, but to get
up to date on what the options are.

-john-

--
================================================== ====================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications
http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ====================
  #7   Report Post  
Charles H. Buchholtz
 
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John A. Weeks III ) wrote:

: If you think a gas fireplace is not pretty, then you haven't
: seen the modern ones. They look just like wood burning.
: Go check one out, not that you have to buy one, but to get
: up to date on what the options are.

So, can I select the logs to fit together with just the right gaps for
a good draw, watch them as they settle, add wood as the logs burn into
embers, and have the satisfaction of building a "one match" fire from
the assortment of wood and kindling available? Can I teach children
how to build a fire, the way I was taught when I was a child?

For me, a gas fire is just as pretty as a wood fire, in the way that
watching a video of people walking through the woods is just as
satisfying as going back-packing. It may look the same, but you
aren't *doing* anything. You just turn it on.

Now, I agree with you that wood fireplaces pollute, and so we should
give them up because it's a skill that's no longer necessary or
feasible in today's world. But please don't say that a gas fireplace
is just as pretty as a wood fireplace; it just indicates that you
don't understand the real enjoyment that people get out of building a
fire, and keeping these old skills alive.

For me, I'd rather limit myself to one fire a year, than get a gas
fireplace and never be able to build a fire.

--- Chip
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D. Gerasimatos
 
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In article ,
John A. Weeks III wrote:

When you know something does real damage to your body and others,
wouldn't you be insane not to make an adjustment? Have you never
seen the effects of acid rain in the mountains in places like
Pennsylvania, or seen a person with breathing problems struggle
to catch his/her next breath? We only have one atmosphere on this
planet, and if we mess it up, we are out of options. The air
is something that we should take care of above all else since
everyone has to breath to live. That is why people should not
use cheap 2-stroke lawn mowers and why charcoal fires should be
banned in favor of gas.



With all due apologies, you are just a bit extreme.


Dimitri

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James Nipper
 
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John, knock it off !!!!!!!!!! It is NONE of your business that the
poster wants to use his fireplace !

Give him a break, he just asked a question about the integrity of his
fireplace. He did not ask for lectures from an environmental socialist nut
who likes to tell others how to use THEIR property !! We have enough Al
Gores in this world.


These whackos of the world can always find a way to tell us how to run our
lives, and how to use our property. Just where do you get this crap, from
France ?????

To the original poster........... did this smoke start just after building
a fire, or sometime later ?


--James--


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elvindeath
 
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Hi James and thanks for focusing on the question asked. While I do
appreciate the random "discussions" that erupt among interesting people
of all viewpoints on the internet, there is indeed a question on the
table regarding fireplace safety and the need (or efficacy) of sealing
the "rough" patch of mortar in the firebox. In answer to your query,
the smoke blew out shortly (1 - 3 minutes) after lighting the fire.
The fire was lit after "heating'" the flue by burning approximately 5
rolled newspapers and holding them above the prepared fire.

Not to "fan the flames" so to speak, but as far as the environmental
concerns voiced regarding lighting a fire, I'm sure any gaseous
emissions from the 5-10 small fires I build a year is a pittance in the
grand scheme of things compared to the enormous forest fires which
erupt in California (and other western states) on a bi-annual basis
thanks primarily to their environmentally unsound practice of banning
logging, resulting in overgrown forests which fuel uncontrollable
burns.

Yes, its true - wood fires are "unnecessary". So too are gas fires.
Or artifical incense. Or Christmas trees. Or driving our cars. Or
wasting energy and natural resources constructing snow boards. Or
using animal hides to make leather belts and shoes. Or a million other
things. If I was interested in debating that, I would have posted the
message to alt.altruistic.babble - not misc.consumers.house.



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James Nipper
 
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Yes, yes, agreed with all your comments.

On the "safety" issues, my recommendation is to get a 2nd opinion from a
fireplace expert.


But, I suspect the smoke still may be the result of your chimney flue not
being fully warmed yet. Until the flue is fully warmed, it will not draw
efficiently, and may smoke. I am **very** doubtful that burning the
newspapers would be enough to warm the flue enough for a good draft.

You might want to try this: Light a fire........... if it starts smoking,
try to open a window (or door) near the fireplace, to allow for more air
filtration. The smoke should go away as soon as the fireplace is fed
enough oxygen. After about 5-10 minutes of a strong burn, close the door or
window. You may have to experiment with the times , and how much to open
the window, but I think that if you will allow your flue to fully warm,
your smoke problem may just go up in smoke........... hee hee heee heeee..

Good Luck, and let us know !!!!


--James---


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D. Gerasimatos
 
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In article ,
John A. Weeks III wrote:

I was taught how to milk a cow and shovel pig **** when I
was a kid. That doesn't mean that we have to maintain
those facilities in our houses. You can still go outside
or head to a campground and teach your kids to build a fire.

The bottom line is that wood fireplaces cause a quarter
million fires each year and kills hundreds of people,
representing about 25% of all residential fire damage.
The sad thing is that it is totally avoidable--just don't
light a wood fire in your house. It can and does kill a
lot of people.



So do Christmas trees and swimming pools. We are going to live in fear of
our fireplaces?!


Dimitri

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Geezer From The Freezer
 
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"D. Gerasimatos" wrote:
With all due apologies, you are just a bit extreme.

Dimitri


I don't think he is at all. You think of the 100 or so years cars, plains and
other fossil
fueled transport/eletricity companies have been running and the damage caused in
that
relatively short time!
  #15   Report Post  
Jonathan Kamens
 
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"John A. Weeks III" writes:
The bottom line is that wood fireplaces cause a quarter
million fires each year and kills hundreds of people,
representing about 25% of all residential fire damage.


Can you document these statistics?

The report that I found on the US Fire Administration Web site
does not seem to support them, although for some reason some
of the figures are missing from the report so it's hard to
draw any hard and fast conclusions from it.

The sad thing is that it is totally avoidable--just don't
light a wood fire in your house.


Or make your fireplace safe and follow fire safety rules!


  #16   Report Post  
Jonathan Kamens
 
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Geezer From The Freezer writes:
"D. Gerasimatos" wrote:
With all due apologies, you are just a bit extreme.

Dimitri


I don't think he is at all. You think of the 100 or so years cars, plains and
other fossil
fueled transport/eletricity companies have been running and the damage caused in
that
relatively short time!


You're proving the other guy's point. The sources of
pollution you mention create, literally, many orders of
magnitude more pollution than house fires. All the house
fires in the world don't cause a noticeable increase in world
pollution.
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