|
Toaster Problem
I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them
will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Thanks Eric |
Most cheap toasters have only one temperature sensor, and it is in the
vicinity of only one slot in the toaster. If you put the toast in a slot that doesn't have the temperature sensor, the toaster will quit almost immediately because the temperature sensor relies on the bread to absorb some of the heat...No bread, no absorbtion. Look on the top of the toaster there should be a mark telling you which slot to use for single slices. -Chuck Eric Mackie wrote: I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Thanks Eric |
I am always toasting two pieces of bread so that can't be the problem. By
the way, it was three different brands of toaster that I tried. Thanks Eric "Chuck Harris" wrote in message ... Most cheap toasters have only one temperature sensor, and it is in the vicinity of only one slot in the toaster. If you put the toast in a slot that doesn't have the temperature sensor, the toaster will quit almost immediately because the temperature sensor relies on the bread to absorb some of the heat...No bread, no absorbtion. Look on the top of the toaster there should be a mark telling you which slot to use for single slices. -Chuck Eric Mackie wrote: I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Thanks Eric |
Eric:
TAKE the toaster to a friend's or relative's home and try it there.... if it then works OK you maybe should have the power company or an electrician come to your home to check things out. -- Best Regards, Daniel Sofie Electronics Supply & Repair - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - "Eric Mackie" wrote in message news:ln6Td.361$TB.23@edtnps84... I am always toasting two pieces of bread so that can't be the problem. By the way, it was three different brands of toaster that I tried. Thanks Eric "Chuck Harris" wrote in message ... Most cheap toasters have only one temperature sensor, and it is in the vicinity of only one slot in the toaster. If you put the toast in a slot that doesn't have the temperature sensor, the toaster will quit almost immediately because the temperature sensor relies on the bread to absorb some of the heat...No bread, no absorbtion. Look on the top of the toaster there should be a mark telling you which slot to use for single slices. -Chuck Eric Mackie wrote: I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Thanks Eric |
If you are having trouble with 3 different brands of toaster, than either
you are toasting wierd bread, or you aren't getting 120V to the toaster. The most likely answer is you have a bad neutral connection at the pole pig transformer, or meter, or your service panel. Turn on all the lights in the house, and see if some of them get brighter when the toaster is on. -Chuck Eric Mackie wrote: I am always toasting two pieces of bread so that can't be the problem. By the way, it was three different brands of toaster that I tried. Thanks Eric "Chuck Harris" wrote in message ... |
"Eric Mackie" wrote in message news:BN5Td.353$TB.104@edtnps84... I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Look underneath. There's often a master adjustment. N |
"Eric Mackie" wrote in message news:BN5Td.353$TB.104@edtnps84... I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Thanks Eric Crappy toasters? Have you tried a different model? I've had good experience with the ones using an electronic control as they time the toast rather than work off the heating of a bimetallic strip. You could also get a toaster oven with a mechanical timer, they work well too though they take up a bit more counter space. |
"Eric Mackie" wrote in message news:ln6Td.361$TB.23@edtnps84... I am always toasting two pieces of bread so that can't be the problem. By the way, it was three different brands of toaster that I tried. Thanks Eric If you have or know someone who has a multimeter, have them test the line voltage at the outlet when the toaster is on, if it's off by more than +/- 10v of 120v then something is wrong. |
"Ross Herbert" wrote in message ... On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:04:23 -0500, Chuck Harris wrote: If you are having trouble with 3 different brands of toaster, than either you are toasting wierd bread, or you aren't getting 120V to the toaster. The most likely answer is you have a bad neutral connection at the pole pig transformer, or meter, or your service panel. Turn on all the lights in the house, and see if some of them get brighter when the toaster is on. -Chuck If there was any joint with significant contact resistance then the lamps would get dimmer when the toaster was switched on. ie. greater voltage drop across the high resistance joint due to increased current demand thus less voltage across lamps. Not if the joint is the neutral at or before the panel, then the two sides end up in series, apply more load to one side and the voltage drops while pushing *up* the voltage on the other side. |
On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:34:41 GMT "Eric Mackie"
wrote: I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? Have you tried the LIGHTEST setting? The labeling might be confusing. - ----------------------------------------------- Jim Adney Madison, WI 53711 USA ----------------------------------------------- |
Jim Adney wrote: On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:34:41 GMT "Eric Mackie" wrote: I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? Have you tried the LIGHTEST setting? The labeling might be confusing. Hi... One more quick possibility if I may? Not possible that he's toasting fresh "still warm from the bakery" bread, is he? I ask only because that takes much, much longer to toast... Take care. Ken |
Put some bread in the toaster, make it toast, and take an AC voltage reading
at the AC outlet where it is plugged in. This will tell you right away, if the voltage from the utility supplier is correct. If it is correct, you should take back the toaster, and get another brand. I had one model of toaster that was the worse one I ever had. I had it changed 3 times, and was never satisfied. Finally, I changed it for a much more expensive one where I paid the difference. It has been flawless since then. The first toaster was the Delonghi. This one was the biggest piece of crap I ever had. The engineers who designed this toaster, should be strung up. But, their toaster ovens are excellent. The engineers who designed their toaster ovens must not know the ones that designed the Delonghi bread toasters. The one I ended up with was the Kitchenaid. This one was about 7 times the price, but it is 10 times the quality, and performance. I had to pay a big difference for it. If this was not going to work out, I was going to buy the Hobart. -- Jerry G. ====== "Eric Mackie" wrote in message news:BN5Td.353$TB.104@edtnps84... I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Thanks Eric |
Ross Herbert wrote:
Perhaps I am missing something here. If the OP has "his own transformer" which I assume is single phase (MEN ?), then where does the "both sides ending up in series" come from? In the OP's situation as I read it there would be only 2 or 3 wires carrying 120 Vac from the transformer secondary (L & N plus E if required) to his distribution board. If there was high resistance in the N wire or the A wire anywhere between the transformer secondary and the toaster then there would be a voltage drop at this high resistance point and any lamps connected would dim when the toaster was switched on. Of course, since I am in Australia where the domestic supply is 240Vac (single phase) MEN that's how this symptom would manifest itself. Perhaps I am not reading the situation as it would be where the OP (and yourself) are located. Yes, you are missing something. In the USA, we use 120V for normal domestic service. The standard arrangement is to use a 240V center tapped transformer with the center tap being the "neutral", or return lead for the 120V loads. POLE TRANSFORMER HOUSE +------------line-----------+ | | 120V LOAD A | | +-------+--- neutral--------+ | | | 120V --- LOAD B | /// | +------------line-----------+ Imagine what happens if the wire between the center tap of the transformer (marked neutral) is removed. If LOAD A, and LOAD B are equal, everything looks ok, but if LOAD A grows bigger, by let's say, a 1500W toaster, the system will become unbalanced, and the voltage on LOAD A will decrease, and the voltage on LOAD B will have to increase. -Chuck |
"Ross Herbert" wrote in message Perhaps I am missing something here. If the OP has "his own transformer" which I assume is single phase (MEN ?), then where does the "both sides ending up in series" come from? Ross think of it this way. A typical North American service is 'three wire' from the transformer outside, often pole mounted. Our service which is typical has a three wire triplex from the service pole to the metal service mast/conduit on its way to the meter mounted on the outside of the house. Consider the middle or centre wire is zero or neutral. Typically white. Note 1. One outer wire is (sort of) plus 115 volts, this is say red. Leg A. The other outer wire is (sort of) minus 115 volts, it is say black. Leg B. I say 'sort of' because this is of course AC at 60 Hz; but use plus/minus to illustrate; OK? Leg A and Leg B are the two 'ends' of a single phase 230 volt winding of the electric company step down 'distribution' transformer. Although they are sometimes mistakenly called 'phases'! The 230 volt winding is centre tapped and this is the zero reference point or neutral. So between Leg A an Leg B there is 230 volts; (with neither wire at zero or neutral), we use this for heavy appliances such as water heaters, cooking stoves etc. maybe a welder in a home workshop, my bench saw has a 230 volt motor for example etc. These 230 volt circuits are connected through two pole breakers. I also have a 230 volt outlet above the work bench for the occasional use of anything 230 volt! There is 115 between the red and neutral and 115 between black and neutral. Typically the other house circuits, 115 volt lighting, convenience outlets etc. are evenly distributed between and served through single pole breakers. We do not seem to use 'Ring Mains' as they do in the UK! Appliance plugs do not contain fuses. Individual (radial) lighting circuits typically #14 AWG at 15 amps, outlet radial circuits either #AWG at 20 amps or #14 AWG at 15 amps. Ground wires within the residence are either bare wire within the cable sheath or green. Note 1. The neutral is grounded 'once' at the main panel where it enters the house and depending on the jurisdiction there are various bonding requirements to other utilities such as water pipes etc. Personally I think it's good system and while 115 volt does result in higher amperages for some plug in devices those that do use any large amount of wattage, such as an electric kettle, toaster or a fridge are used intermittently. Any help? |
"Terry" wrote in message .. . .... Personally I think it's good system and while 115 volt does result in higher amperages for some plug in devices those that do use any large amount of wattage, such as an electric kettle, toaster or a fridge are used intermittently. If they had it to do over again I'm sure they'd pick a voltage from 220 - 240 volts. In most countries that's the only voltage. In the US/Canada there are so many voltages used, often in the same building, it's bewildering. N |
NSM wrote:
"Terry" wrote in message .. . ... Personally I think it's good system and while 115 volt does result in higher amperages for some plug in devices those that do use any large amount of wattage, such as an electric kettle, toaster or a fridge are used intermittently. If they had it to do over again I'm sure they'd pick a voltage from 220 - 240 volts. In most countries that's the only voltage. In the US/Canada there are so many voltages used, often in the same building, it's bewildering. No, the US wouldn't go to 240V. It is too dangerous. A good part of the reason we have stuck with a system that has at most 120V to earth ground, is safety. The usual human's skin resistance is high enough so that 120V won't allow enough current to pass through the body to cause anything more than discomfort. At 240V, 50/60 Hz AC, death is vastly more likely. This death risk is to a large part the reason the European safety agencies are so strict. We don't need to be *that* careful here in the US. OBTW, The US and Canadian houses have only 2 voltages allowed: 120V, and 240V. That isn't "so many". In light industry, and commercial, two other voltages come up as a result of the 3 phase power: If you have 3 phase "Y" power with 120V legs to neutral, you also get 208V between any pair of legs. If you have 3 phase "Y" power with 240V between any two pairs of legs, you also get 138V to neutral which is often used for overhead lighting in office buildings and factories. Heavy industry has a host of other voltages both here in the US, and in Europe. -Chuck |
"Chuck Harris" wrote in message ... No, the US wouldn't go to 240V. It is too dangerous. Safer that 120 if you do it right. A good part of the reason we have stuck with a system that has at most 120V to earth ground, is safety. The usual human's skin resistance is high enough so that 120V won't allow enough current to pass through the body to cause anything more than discomfort. At 240V, 50/60 Hz AC, death is vastly more likely. Couldn't disagree more. It's all about grounding. This death risk is to a large part the reason the European safety agencies are so strict. We don't need to be *that* careful here in the US. I can tell G! OBTW, The US and Canadian houses have only 2 voltages allowed: 120V, and 240V. That isn't "so many". Plus 208. In light industry, and commercial, two other voltages come up as a result of the 3 phase power: If you have 3 phase "Y" power with 120V legs to neutral, you also get 208V between any pair of legs. If you have 3 phase "Y" power with 240V between any two pairs of legs, you also get 138V to neutral which is often used for overhead lighting in office buildings and factories. Down under we use 230/400 only. For truly huge motors in mills etc, we use 3 phase 11 kV direct in. Here, you have 120, 208, 220, 440, 600, ... hell, I can't remember them all. Heavy industry has a host of other voltages both here in the US, and in Europe. Can't speak for Europe, but I believe they have streamlined their systems. 230 Volts AC is the new international standard - same as New Zealand. N |
"Ross Herbert" wrote in message ... Thanks for the clear explanation. I was not aware that a centre tapped txfmr was used to derive two 115V feeds for the domestic supply. It is a neat way of running both 115V and 230V appliances from the one power source. I suppose that appliances using 230V are hardwired from their CB's or use a different socket outlet for corded 230V items. They have different plugs for each appliance on 208/240. One for a dryer, one for a range. Other things are direct wired. BTW, they also don't use pole fuses which is why all the dope growers just bypass the meter. .... Our domestic appliance plugs are 3 pin un-fused and they are a bare minimum design much like the US plug but with different pin shape and orientation. It's called the "Colonial Plug". It's the same as one style of US plug for 240 V. I have always been impressed by the UK fused plugs which are far more rugged and practical in my opinion... IME they tend to burn a little easier, but YMMV. N |
"Chuck Harris" wrote in message ... If you are having trouble with 3 different brands of toaster, than either you are toasting wierd bread, or you aren't getting 120V to the toaster. The most likely answer is you have a bad neutral connection at the pole pig transformer, or meter, or your service panel. Turn on all the lights in the house, and see if some of them get brighter when the toaster is on. -Chuck Chuck Harris is correct. I have seen this happen. Retired Electric Utility employee. W W Eric Mackie wrote: I am always toasting two pieces of bread so that can't be the problem. By the way, it was three different brands of toaster that I tried. Thanks Eric "Chuck Harris" wrote in message ... |
"Ross Herbert" wrote in message ... .... In retrospect it seems that the UK fused plug can become a source of heat generation, particularly where the fuse clips are loose or incorrectly tensioned or become corroded... I've seen past problems with those solid brass pins. Everything needs to be perfect for good contact. The ANZ style has a little more flexibility and is safer IMO. N |
"Warren Weber" wrote in message ... Chuck Harris is correct. I have seen this happen. Retired Electric Utility employee. W W Ever seen what happens when they reverse the hot and the neutral? N |
Thanks to all the people that replied to my posting.
I have a multi-meter so I tried taking voltage readings with it while turning on the toaster. I didn't see any significant change in voltage. The two brands of toaster that I am currently trying are a KitchenAid and a Krupps. I thought the suggestion to try using the toaster at a friends house was a good one, so I will try this next. I wonder if I get a so called electronic toaster, if that might be a solution to my problem? Thanks Eric "Jerry G." wrote in message ... Put some bread in the toaster, make it toast, and take an AC voltage reading at the AC outlet where it is plugged in. This will tell you right away, if the voltage from the utility supplier is correct. If it is correct, you should take back the toaster, and get another brand. I had one model of toaster that was the worse one I ever had. I had it changed 3 times, and was never satisfied. Finally, I changed it for a much more expensive one where I paid the difference. It has been flawless since then. The first toaster was the Delonghi. This one was the biggest piece of crap I ever had. The engineers who designed this toaster, should be strung up. But, their toaster ovens are excellent. The engineers who designed their toaster ovens must not know the ones that designed the Delonghi bread toasters. The one I ended up with was the Kitchenaid. This one was about 7 times the price, but it is 10 times the quality, and performance. I had to pay a big difference for it. If this was not going to work out, I was going to buy the Hobart. -- Jerry G. ====== "Eric Mackie" wrote in message news:BN5Td.353$TB.104@edtnps84... I have bought three toasters (and taken two of them back) and all of them will not toast properly. I set them on the darkest setting and the toast pops up barely browned at all. Does anyone have any idea what the problem could be? I live in the country and have my own transformer on the pole outside my house if that makes any difference. Thanks Eric |
Ross Herbert wrote:
The usual human's skin resistance is high enough so that 120V won't allow enough current to pass through the body to cause anything more than discomfort. At 240V, 50/60 Hz AC, death is vastly more likely. Potentially, (no pun intended) there appears to be greater risk of electrocution with 230/240V compared to 120V, but the actual circumstances of any situation will have a large bearing on whether a death is more likely with the higher voltage. Of course! In practice, and I don't have the statistics to prove it, I doubt very much whether the incidence of electrocution resulting in death is higher in all the countries such as UK/Europe, NZ or Australia using 230V/240V when compared to the US where 115/230V is used. I've run into data on this time and time again. There is a large body of data on electrical safety, and electrocution risks. Ranging from dangers of different capacitor sizes to AC and DC electrocution risks. It boils down to this. At 120V, the maximum current that can pass through the core of the body with dry skin resistance is somewhat lower than the amount of current required to cause the heart to go into fatal irregular rhythms. At somewhere around 180V, the current just exceeds that which the heart can tolerate and by the time you get to 240V, it always exceeds that which the heart can tolerate. (assuming cross heart current paths) As you climb up in voltage to the 400V range, you start to find the current throws the victim from the contact, or burns away whatever makes contact. You also find that the heart is so overwhelmed with the current that it just flat out stops until the current is removed, and then it tends to restart with normal rhythm. As a result the risk of death drops, but not enough so that one would recommend being careless. Just as an aside, in the US, I have worked with numerous electricians, and have done a large amount of electrical work myself. I have never met an electrician who would turn the power off for a routine outlet or switch change on 120V circuits. Most, it seems would rather just replace the switch, or outlet, than to spend the time trying to find the service panel, and the correct breaker to shut down the branch circuit. Do you see alot of that in 240V countries? NOPE! They know they will die if they behave that way. This death risk is to a large part the reason the European safety agencies are so strict. We don't need to be *that* careful here in the US. Does this imply that because US uses lower voltage that standards can afford to be lower? Once skin resistance is overcome, even by 120V, a helluva lot of current can flow through the body. In these cases it makes little difference whether it is 120V or 240V doing the pushing. The US standards *are* lower. We can afford to be, as there is no circumstance where you can connect to 240V to earth ground. In the world 240V systems, one side of the 240V line is earth grounded, so any contact with a hot lead is going to potentially result in 240V passing through the body. Taken to a logical extreme, the body core is very low resistance, all you need is several volts connected subcutaneously to cause a fatal current flow through the heart. As I understand it, people have electrocuted themselves with 12V car batteries, but it requires a particular streak of bad luck to do so. (bad skin punctures on both hands, etc...) OBTW, The US and Canadian houses have only 2 voltages allowed: 120V, and 240V. That isn't "so many". In light industry, and commercial, two other voltages come up as a result of the 3 phase power: If you have 3 phase "Y" power with 120V legs to neutral, you also get 208V between any pair of legs. If you have 3 phase "Y" power with 240V between any two pairs of legs, you also get 138V to neutral which is often used for overhead lighting in office buildings and factories. Australian 3 phase system is Star Neutral and the phase - phase voltage is nominally 415V with phase - Neutral being 240V. Which is bad because any contact between the hot wire and ground gives you 240V of potential to overcome your skin resistance. One industry which would possibly produce a high rate of potentially fatal electrocutions resulting in death would be the entertainment (eg. rock bands etc) where equipment is continually being moved around from venue to venue. I don't know of any electrocution deaths in this industry recently in Australia and possibly that is because of the high standards applied to such equipment. For example here is one portable power distribution system for lighting which is used by professional bands and it runs from 3 phase (415V star) http://www.jands.com.au/jandsweb/lig...hub_hub24.html If 240V (1 ph) is considered to be "too dangerous" then what do you think of the hazard presented when using 415V? Industrial power systems are vastly more dangerous than domestic systems. Crane Trolleys and other such systems found in factories have exposed HV rails in the ceiling area. In theory, only trained workers are supposed to come anywhere near these hazards. In practice, sometimes trained workers do stupid things. -Chuck I think we've strayed too far from toasters for this thread to continue. |
Eric Mackie wrote:
Thanks to all the people that replied to my posting. I have a multi-meter so I tried taking voltage readings with it while turning on the toaster. I didn't see any significant change in voltage. The two brands of toaster that I am currently trying are a KitchenAid and a Krupps. I thought the suggestion to try using the toaster at a friends house was a good one, so I will try this next. I wonder if I get a so called electronic toaster, if that might be a solution to my problem? Thanks Eric If the voltage at the outlet stays nominally at 120V, than there is either an operator error, or you have run into a bad string of luck with toasters (pretty likely these days, actually) Mechanical toasters have worked just fine for years and years. If you can find one that is made right, it should work for you too. The Electronic toasters are just the next stage in the evolution of the cheaper toaster.... By cheaper, I mean for the manufacturer, not necessarily for the consumer. -Chuck |
"Chuck Harris" wrote in message ... .... Just as an aside, in the US, I have worked with numerous electricians, and have done a large amount of electrical work myself. I have never met an electrician who would turn the power off for a routine outlet or switch change on 120V circuits. Most, it seems would rather just replace the switch, or outlet, than to spend the time trying to find the service panel, and the correct breaker to shut down the branch circuit. Do you see a lot of that in 240V countries? NOPE! They know they will die if they behave that way. Nonsense. We did it all the time. Try standing on a ladder outside the house and splicing new conduit wires to the city's incoming power leads. Now do it 60+ feet in the air. You will be cautious, but it can be done. It's a matter of careful concentration, not fear. A stack of dry newspaper is a wonderful insulator. N |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:47 PM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 DIYbanter