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| Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
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Plug Wiring Reversed?
I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement
outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? |
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#2
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If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? Swap black and white at both ends. This involves working on your breaker panel, which is dangerous. I recommend hiring an electrician. If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? He'll only be wrong if he mixed up his results after making measurements. Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? That's what I'd do. And don't let the erroneous situation persist. |
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#4
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my dad can wire recpts backwards
seems addicted to it. his simple method works 1- gotta use a plastic box 2- and if something trips the breaker cut off its ground prong "DanG" wrote in message news:Jc%_c.26744$Ka6.13647@okepread03... It sounds like you need to buy the gizmo. If the wiring was crossed anywhere you have the potential for a "back fed" neutral. If the color code was followed meticulously through the entire circuit you will not have a problem. Sounds like some home wiring went on at some time. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Keep the whole world singing . . . . DanG (remove the sevens) "Niel" wrote in message om... I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? |
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#5
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(Niel) writes:
I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? Spend a couple bucks and get an outlet tester. Then, when you confirm that they are still bad. It's possible that the outlet you fixed was upstream of one or both of the other miswired ones and all is not well. If not, it's possible that the outlets that test reversed are fed from upstream outlets whic are miswired for the wiring feeding those outlets. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive traffic on Repairfaq.org. Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is ignored. To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites. |
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#6
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[This followup was posted to sci.electronics.repair and a copy was sent to
the cited author.] In article , says... I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? Just buy one of those cheap things you plug into an outlet. It has 3 neons in it that can quickly find common wiring errors. Some versions also have a button to create a leakage that should trigger a GFI outlet or circuit breaker to trip. They are only a few bucks and well worth it. I've found reverse wired outlets in apartments I've lived in. Reverse wiring will not affect many basic items with non-polarized plugs, but could create a hazard for items with polarized plugs or grounded plugs that assume hot is on the narrow blade. Lamps are now wired with polarized plugs so that the neutral is wired to the shell of the bulb socket, and the hot to the center. -- If there is a no_junk in my address, please REMOVE it before replying! All junk mail senders will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law!! http://home.att.net/~andyross |
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#7
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I had an inspector report that all of the outlets in my house were reverse
wired. It turned out that in fact they were three-wire outlets with no ground wire. The house was built back before ground outlets were standard, so they are all wired with two wires. Someone later replaced all the original two-wire outlets with three-wire ones. Although this creates a false sense of safety in that there is no protective ground, it is apparently legal because you can't get two-wire outlets anymore. An electrician I consulted said it would be too costly to put in modern 3-wire wiring because of all the demolition - the old wiring is stapled inside the walls and can't just be pulled out as the new wire is pulled in. So I had him put in GFCI outlets and breakers where needed for safety (bathrooms and kitchen) and let the rest go. -- jhhaynes at earthlink dot net |
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#8
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Niel wrote:
I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? Yes, get the tester or a simple meter, if you know how ot use it. Switching one set of wires, may have corrected all the rest down stream, or may not, so you really need to check them all again. -- Joseph E. Meehan 26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math |
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#9
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"Jim Haynes" wrote in message ink.net... I had an inspector report that all of the outlets in my house were reverse wired. It turned out that in fact they were three-wire outlets with no ground wire. The house was built back before ground outlets were standard, so they are all wired with two wires. Someone later replaced all the original two-wire outlets with three-wire ones. Although this creates a false sense of safety in that there is no protective ground, it is apparently legal because you can't get two-wire outlets anymore. An electrician I consulted said it would be too costly to put in modern 3-wire wiring because of all the demolition - the old wiring is stapled inside the walls and can't just be pulled out as the new wire is pulled in. So I had him put in GFCI outlets and breakers where needed for safety (bathrooms and kitchen) and let the rest go. -- Yes you can buy 2 wire outlets and no it's *NOT* legal to install 3 wire outlets on a non-grounded circuit. |
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#10
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Yes, get the tester or a simple meter, if you know how ot use it. Switching one set of wires, may have corrected all the rest down stream, or may not, so you really need to check them all again. And if you don't know how to use it please don't be messing with this stuff, call an electrician and let them take care of it for you. |
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#11
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"Jim Haynes" wrote in message ink.net... I had an inspector report that all of the outlets in my house were reverse wired. It turned out that in fact they were three-wire outlets with no ground wire. The house was built back before ground outlets were standard, so they are all wired with two wires. Someone later replaced all the original two-wire outlets with three-wire ones. Although this creates a false sense of safety in that there is no protective ground, it is apparently legal because you can't get two-wire outlets anymore. An electrician I consulted said it would be too costly to put in modern 3-wire wiring because of all the demolition - the old wiring is stapled inside the walls and can't just be pulled out as the new wire is pulled in. So I had him put in GFCI outlets and breakers where needed for safety (bathrooms and kitchen) and let the rest go. Yes; it is legal to have a 3-wire outlet with 2-wire input *if* it's a GFCI. |
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#12
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Niel wrote:
I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? --------------- Danger is Hot, Black, and Brass. Make it so. To find which wire is Hot, measure it to a solid ground like a water pipe. Neutral is Dead, White, and Silver, like the bare Safety Ground. Put a 200 VAC voltmeter, or DMM set to that range, from Hot to Neutral, this should show 120VAC. Then from Hot to Ground, you should again see 120 VAC. The hot should be 120VAC to EITHER of them separately! If not, then Hot is not connected to the "hot"!!! Try neutral to both each separately, see if it is BOTH 120VAC to ground and also the black. If so then the neutral and hot are switched and should be switched back at the bus. Of course, use insulated probes, rubber gloves if you are dim-witted, and switch off the breaker when you change things. I take no responsibility for your stupidity or your death. -Steve -- -Steve Walz ftp://ftp.armory.com/pub/user/rstevew Electronics Site!! 1000's of Files and Dirs!! With Schematics Galore!! http://www.armory.com/~rstevew or http://www.armory.com/~rstevew/Public |
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#13
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#14
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#15
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In article 0H2%c.5096$5Y6.1028@trnddc07,
James Sweet wrote: Yes you can buy 2 wire outlets and no it's *NOT* legal to install 3 wire outlets on a non-grounded circuit. As someone else said, it is legal if they are GFCI outlets. Dimitri |
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#16
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"D. Gerasimatos" wrote in message ... In article 0H2%c.5096$5Y6.1028@trnddc07, James Sweet wrote: Yes you can buy 2 wire outlets and no it's *NOT* legal to install 3 wire outlets on a non-grounded circuit. As someone else said, it is legal if they are GFCI outlets. But how many of those installed in the real world are on GFCI? I've lost count the number of times I've seen someone install 3 wire receptacles in non grounded houses, a lot of times the houses don't even have a GFCI at all. Certainly adviseable to add, though not everything will work right on them. I've seen a lot of computers and a few microwave ovens that would trip them regularly. |
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#17
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"Niel" wrote in message
om... I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? I'm speaking strictly based on Australian wiring regulations. I don't know how they apply your way. Here, you should get a licenced electrician to check out all your wiring. It is possible that it was originally wired up by someone unlicenced. If your house catches fire as a result of faulty wiring and there is a possibility that it was wired up illegally, you may have problems claiming insurance. Henry Australia |
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#18
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"bumtracks" wrote in message news:Oq%_c.2382$Q44.260@trnddc09... my dad can wire recpts backwards seems addicted to it. his simple method works 1- gotta use a plastic box 2- and if something trips the breaker cut off its ground prong My father used coathanger wire for fuses. I think that's rated at about 500 amps.... Henry Australia |
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#19
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"James Sweet" writes:
"D. Gerasimatos" wrote in message ... In article 0H2%c.5096$5Y6.1028@trnddc07, James Sweet wrote: Yes you can buy 2 wire outlets and no it's *NOT* legal to install 3 wire outlets on a non-grounded circuit. As someone else said, it is legal if they are GFCI outlets. But how many of those installed in the real world are on GFCI? I've lost count the number of times I've seen someone install 3 wire receptacles in non grounded houses, a lot of times the houses don't even have a GFCI at all. Certainly adviseable to add, though not everything will work right on them. I've seen a lot of computers and a few microwave ovens that would trip them regularly. Part of the problem is that it's not that easy to find 2 wire outlets at your local hardware store. Our local large chain hardware store probably has 16 varieties of duplex outlets, all 3 prong, and no 2 prong types. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive traffic on Repairfaq.org. Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is ignored. To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites. |
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#20
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On 6 Sep 2004 07:45:42 -0700, Niel hath writ:
I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? I would do that. Probably the two "suspicious"outlets that you are concerned about were daisy-chained from one or more of the badly wired outlets that were upstream of these two. They are now properly (probably) wired. Your local hardware store sells the "idiot-lite" sensor that you mentioned and it would be a Good Idea to have one around. Jonesy -- | Marvin L Jones | jonz | W3DHJ | linux | Gunnison, Colorado | @ | Jonesy | OS/2 __ | 7,703' -- 2,345m | config.com | DM68mn SK |
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#21
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Yes you can buy 2 wire outlets and no it's *NOT* legal to install 3 wire outlets on a non-grounded circuit. As someone else said, it is legal if they are GFCI outlets. *IF* they are also labelled "no equipment ground". |
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#22
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In article ,
says... "James Sweet" writes: "D. Gerasimatos" wrote in message ... In article 0H2%c.5096$5Y6.1028@trnddc07, James Sweet wrote: Yes you can buy 2 wire outlets and no it's *NOT* legal to install 3 wire outlets on a non-grounded circuit. As someone else said, it is legal if they are GFCI outlets. But how many of those installed in the real world are on GFCI? I've lost count the number of times I've seen someone install 3 wire receptacles in non grounded houses, a lot of times the houses don't even have a GFCI at all. Certainly adviseable to add, though not everything will work right on them. I've seen a lot of computers and a few microwave ovens that would trip them regularly. Part of the problem is that it's not that easy to find 2 wire outlets at your local hardware store. Our local large chain hardware store probably has 16 varieties of duplex outlets, all 3 prong, and no 2 prong types. My local Home Depot has 2-wire outlets. -- If there is a no_junk in my address, please REMOVE it before replying! All junk mail senders will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law!! http://home.att.net/~andyross |
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#23
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Andrew Rossmann wrote:
snip Part of the problem is that it's not that easy to find 2 wire outlets at your local hardware store. Our local large chain hardware store probably has 16 varieties of duplex outlets, all 3 prong, and no 2 prong types. My local Home Depot has 2-wire outlets. Local where? In any case, I'm glad they're showing back up. I don't think I've seen them anywhere in decades. I think people just started putting in the grounding outlets (even 'electricicians') until the NEC or someone started a fuss over it.... jak |
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#24
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Allodoxaphobia wrote:
On 6 Sep 2004 07:45:42 -0700, Niel hath writ: I just bought a house and the inspector tagged four of six basement outlets as hot/neutral reversed. I open the first two, see the problem, and fix it (one of two blacks was going to silver and one of two whites was going to brass). However, the other two "bad" outlets are already wired correctly (white to silver/black to brass). Plus, these two outlets have one set of wires (white/black/ground) instead of two sets, which may not be a problem, but could be a clue. Supposedly, if I switch the wires, the plugs won't be reversed anymore. But that would put white on brass and black on silver. Maybe the electrician got the white and black wrong at the head end, wherever that is. So switching the two at the plugs will be the right thing to do. If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? I would do that. Probably the two "suspicious"outlets that you are concerned about were daisy-chained from one or more of the badly wired outlets that were upstream of these two. They are now properly (probably) wired. Of course if they screwed up one on the chain they may have screwed up more, so fixing one might fix several and/or screw up others. Our boy need to by the $3.00 tester and check all the outlets in his home. Your local hardware store sells the "idiot-lite" sensor that you mentioned and it would be a Good Idea to have one around. Jonesy -- Joseph E. Meehan 26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math |
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#25
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"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... "James Sweet" writes: "D. Gerasimatos" wrote in message ... In article 0H2%c.5096$5Y6.1028@trnddc07, James Sweet wrote: Yes you can buy 2 wire outlets and no it's *NOT* legal to install 3 wire outlets on a non-grounded circuit. As someone else said, it is legal if they are GFCI outlets. But how many of those installed in the real world are on GFCI? I've lost count the number of times I've seen someone install 3 wire receptacles in non grounded houses, a lot of times the houses don't even have a GFCI at all. Certainly adviseable to add, though not everything will work right on them. I've seen a lot of computers and a few microwave ovens that would trip them regularly. Part of the problem is that it's not that easy to find 2 wire outlets at your local hardware store. Our local large chain hardware store probably has 16 varieties of duplex outlets, all 3 prong, and no 2 prong types. Home Depot stocks 2 wire outlets in both almond and brown, saw them there just the other day. |
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#27
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"James Sweet" writes:
Home Depot stocks 2 wire outlets in both almond and brown, saw them there just the other day. I said "large hardware store" or something like that.  Not everyonelives near a Home Depot! --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive traffic on Repairfaq.org. Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is ignored. To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites. |
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#28
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"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... "James Sweet" writes: Home Depot stocks 2 wire outlets in both almond and brown, saw them there just the other day. I said "large hardware store" or something like that. Not everyonelives near a Home Depot! There was a time when people said, "not everyone lives near a Starbucks." Just wait. |
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#29
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In article ,
says... "James Sweet" writes: Home Depot stocks 2 wire outlets in both almond and brown, saw them there just the other day. I said "large hardware store" or something like that. Not everyonelives near a Home Depot! I think I've seen them in some local Ace and True Value hardware stores. I've even seen those tiny plugs/switches (Despard?) that let you put 3 things in a standard box. -- If there is a no_junk in my address, please REMOVE it before replying! All junk mail senders will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law!! http://home.att.net/~andyross |
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#30
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"Michael A. Covington" wrote in message ... If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? Swap black and white at both ends. This involves working on your breaker panel, which is dangerous. I recommend hiring an electrician. If the inspector was wrong, how could that be, as he was right about two other plugs in the same room? He'll only be wrong if he mixed up his results after making measurements. Or do I need to spend a couple of bucks on a sensor to check for myself whether the inspector was right? That's what I'd do. And don't let the erroneous situation persist. I doubt the wiring in the panel is wrong, more likely an outlet upstream is backwards. |
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#31
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"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... "James Sweet" writes: Home Depot stocks 2 wire outlets in both almond and brown, saw them there just the other day. I said "large hardware store" or something like that. Not everyonelives near a Home Depot! Well last I checked they had them in McLendon's as well, it's a small (though admittedly very well stocked) local hardware store. Can't say I've ever really looked for the things, just seen them around. |
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#32
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In article _4P%c.8355$vI2.634@trnddc02,
James Sweet wrote: "Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... I said "large hardware store" or something like that. Not everyonelives near a Home Depot! Well last I checked they had them in McLendon's as well, it's a small (though admittedly very well stocked) local hardware store. Can't say I've ever really looked for the things, just seen them around. Go to an electrical supply. They will have more selection than Home Depot does. I don't know why the obsession with Home Depot. Dimitri |
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#33
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"D. Gerasimatos" wrote in message ... In article _4P%c.8355$vI2.634@trnddc02, James Sweet wrote: "Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... I said "large hardware store" or something like that. Not everyonelives near a Home Depot! Well last I checked they had them in McLendon's as well, it's a small (though admittedly very well stocked) local hardware store. Can't say I've ever really looked for the things, just seen them around. Go to an electrical supply. They will have more selection than Home Depot does. I don't know why the obsession with Home Depot. Obsession? Well I'm not sure it's an obsession, but I do like them. They're everywhere (including less than 5 miles from both my house and my work), have a decent selection, good prices, and they're a one stop shop for home improvement. I'm not sure where the nearest electrical supply shop is, would probably have to drive all the way to Seattle. |
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#34
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On Thu, 09 Sep 2004 03:12:08 GMT, "James Sweet"
wrote: "D. Gerasimatos" wrote in message ... In article _4P%c.8355$vI2.634@trnddc02, James Sweet wrote: "Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... I said "large hardware store" or something like that. Not everyonelives near a Home Depot! Well last I checked they had them in McLendon's as well, it's a small (though admittedly very well stocked) local hardware store. Can't say I've ever really looked for the things, just seen them around. Go to an electrical supply. They will have more selection than Home Depot does. I don't know why the obsession with Home Depot. Obsession? Well I'm not sure it's an obsession, but I do like them. They're everywhere (including less than 5 miles from both my house and my work), have a decent selection, good prices, and they're a one stop shop for home improvement. I'm not sure where the nearest electrical supply shop is, would probably have to drive all the way to Seattle. Home Depot suxs bigtime. |
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#35
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"Michael A. Covington" wrote in message ... If the inspector was right, what is wrong with the wiring and how do I fix it? Swap black and white at both ends. This involves working on your breaker panel, which is dangerous. I recommend hiring an electrician. That depends on how the breaker box is wired. Most, if not all modern breaker boxes have the main breakers and the breakers for the individual circuits in the same box. Since this is presumably an old house, that may not be the case. It may have the main breakers or cartridge fuses in a separate box, and there may be an external lever to power down the whole house. If that's the case, the breakers can be switched off one by one and the main power can be switched off. At that point, there is no power coming into the breaker box. |
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#36
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Why ... what makes them suck?
They have reasonable prices. I don't think they have "experts" that work there but not everyone needs an expert to buy what they need for a home renovation. The selection they have is limited ... but that's why their cheap ... they don't have to stock a larger selection so they can have larger volumes on the stuff they do stock. They have a reasonable return policy .. almost anything you don't use can be brought back. Since there are so many of them ... there is usually one in the neighborhood ... so they are convenient. Why is it that you think they suck? Mike "gothika" wrote in message ... On Thu, 09 Sep 2004 03:12:08 GMT, "James Sweet" wrote: "D. Gerasimatos" wrote in message ... In article _4P%c.8355$vI2.634@trnddc02, James Sweet wrote: "Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... I said "large hardware store" or something like that. Noteveryone lives near a Home Depot! Well last I checked they had them in McLendon's as well, it's a small (though admittedly very well stocked) local hardware store. Can't say I've ever really looked for the things, just seen them around. Go to an electrical supply. They will have more selection than Home Depot does. I don't know why the obsession with Home Depot. Obsession? Well I'm not sure it's an obsession, but I do like them. They're everywhere (including less than 5 miles from both my house and my work), have a decent selection, good prices, and they're a one stop shop for home improvement. I'm not sure where the nearest electrical supply shop is, would probably have to drive all the way to Seattle. Home Depot suxs bigtime. |
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#37
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In article ,
Mike Lewis wrote: Why ... what makes them suck? They have reasonable prices. I don't think they have "experts" that work there but not everyone needs an expert to buy what they need for a home renovation. The selection they have is limited ... but that's why their cheap ... they don't have to stock a larger selection so they can have larger volumes on the stuff they do stock. They have a reasonable return policy .. almost anything you don't use can be brought back. Since there are so many of them ... there is usually one in the neighborhood ... so they are convenient. Why is it that you think they suck? They drive competitors out of business, which is fine in itself unless you happen to need to talk to an expert or find a specialty item. The difference between a good hardware store or store that supplies the trades and Home Depot is huge, but most people don't know the difference. Everyone just knows Home Depot (or Lowe's). It's like buying everything you own at Wal-Mart or Target. It can be done, but I'm not sure you'd want to. I generally try to avoid Home Depot and give my business to the places that stock hard-to-find items and employ guys who actually give correct advice. Prices are higher, but that's what happens when one stocks specialty items that don't turn over often and pays his employees a living wage. Dimitri |
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#38
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On Thu, 9 Sep 2004 14:39:11 -0400, someone wrote:
Why is it that you think they suck? I would have to drive past two lumber yards, four hardware stores, three electrical supply and at least on plumbing supply, to reach a Home Depot. I see where HD rents trucks for something like $19/hr for people to take stuff home in. If I call my local lumber yard, they will deliver for no extra charge, and have it out to me usually by the next day, and sometimes its been the same day. I tell them where I want it, and when I get home it is stacked there. I expect that the price is probably a little higher than HD to begin with, but not enough to concern me given the level of service (I also have an account at the local place, and they bill me at the end of the month, Net 30.) HD can be good for the semi-clueless, who know only to buy generic stuff by price, who need to see it in the aisles because they don't know to ask for it from a counterman, and who are basically looking for generic items at generic prices. Personally I hate the whole big-box crowded experience, even the parking lot is a zoo. Its not worth the few percent savings to go through the hassle when I can just go up to the counter (or call) my local yard, tell them who I am, and tell them what I want and where to leave it. I will admit that sometimes HD has a deal - one of my employees found a power tool that he felt was equivalent to what I had authorized him to buy for us, for MUCH less at HD so he got it there; for a volume item on "special" yes they might have it cheaper. But generally I do not look forward to a trip to HD and would rather buy locally (the HD is maybe 23 miles from my house). -v. |
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