I have a used Dell Inspiron 5558 laptop, which didn't come with an OEM
power supply. I picked up a 65W "universal" type for it off Amazon, and
it's showing some weird behavior.

First problem is that it often refuses to charge the battery when
connected to line power. Maybe 1 out of 10 times I've plugged it in the
battery charges, the other times the charging LED remains off and the
charging indicator on the screen remains at 0%.

It sometimes has difficulty starting up from line power at my home as
well; you have to hit the power button a couple times to get it to power
on instead of coming up for a few seconds then immediately shutting
down. However, it seems to always work fine off the local Starbuck's
wall power. Still doesn't charge properly, though.

The BIOS reports some incidences of "Unknown AC adapter detected!" but
not all the time.

Before I run out and make sure to pick up an OEM supply, is there any
way to ensure this is certainly a problem with the adapter and not the PC?

Maybe a BIOS update is required?

"bitrex" wrote in message
...
I have a used Dell Inspiron 5558 laptop, which didn't come with an OEM
power supply. I picked up a 65W "universal" type for it off Amazon, and
it's showing some weird behavior.

First problem is that it often refuses to charge the battery when
connected to line power. Maybe 1 out of 10 times I've plugged it in the
battery charges, the other times the charging LED remains off and the
charging indicator on the screen remains at 0%.

My first thought is an ID ROM chip so it won't work with a "foreign" power
brick - but that should be consistent, either it works or it don't, not
maybe sometimes.

bitrex wrote:

I have a used Dell Inspiron 5558 laptop, which didn't come with an OEM
power supply. I picked up a 65W "universal" type for it off Amazon, and
it's showing some weird behavior.

I'm not surprised.

Dell laptop power supplies have a 3rd "sense" wire (a pin in the centre
of the coaxial barrel) which allows the laptop to identify whether a
genuine Dell charger is being used, and without one it is likely to run
at low CPU speed, and refuse to charge the battery.

Look on ebay for an appropriate PA-series, what model laptop do you have?

Andy Burns wrote:

bitrex wrote:

I have a usedDell Inspiron 5558

what model laptop do you have?

Duh!

Looks like you need a PA-4E power supply ...

On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 16:06:13 -0400, bitrex
wrote:

Before I run out and make sure to pick up an OEM supply, is there any
way to ensure this is certainly a problem with the adapter and not the PC?

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

From your description, I would guess(tm) your replacement charger is
generating some noise. The laptop charge controller is rather picky
as to what voltage it's being fed. Too little voltage or noise, and
it will power the laptop, but not charge the battery. I'm not sure
what it will do with too much voltage. I buy these replacement power
supplies from various eBay vendors in lots of 10 and resell them to
customers. I've had a few problems, but in general, they work. Spend
the $11 and see what happens. If a new charger doesn't fix the
problem, then the problem is in the laptop and someone will need to
dive in and fix it.

Note that if this machine is a lemon and out of warranty, a
motherboard transplant is possible but expensive for the i7 version:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=Dell+Inspiron+15+5558+motherboard
Note that swapping motherboards often breaks software licenses and
registrations so save this as a last resort.

Also, my sense of smell tells me that running your Dell Inspiron 15
5558 without the battery is a bad idea. A good charger should be able
to run the laptop without a battery, but I don't want to find out what
might happen if you try it with a potentially defective charger. Don't
try it.

Maybe a BIOS update is required?

You should always stay up to date with the BIOS. Yes, you can find
horror stories on the internet about failed updates, bricked laptops,
and features that no longer work correctly. Those are rare and can be
handled by with various BIOS recovery tricks. I had some bios
failures maybe 10 or more years ago, but not since. Do it.



--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 22:16:31 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Dell laptop power supplies have a 3rd "sense" wire (a pin in the centre
of the coaxial barrel) which allows the laptop to identify whether a
genuine Dell charger is being used, and without one it is likely to run
at low CPU speed, and refuse to charge the battery.

The power plug on the Dell Inspiron 15 5558 does have a 3rd wire.
Here's the replacement (clone) charger. Here's the connector:
http://www.cdnclouds.net/p/cde390e7778c9e9bbc74-433100c529497552c56006a41824fb24.r16.cf2.rackcdn.c om/6b8fdeb23c4011e698f22631369794a1_14.jpg
The usual problem is that the 3rd wire breaks inside the plug. The
plug cannot be disassembled or easily replaced, so I have to replace
the cord. At the current selling price, it's not worth the effort.

I haven't had any laptop reject clone chargers yet. Mostly they check
for charger capacity. If I plug a 45 watt charger into a laptop that
wants a 65 watt charger, the charger will run the laptop, but not
charge the battery. Sometimes, I see a "wrong charger" message appear
on some screens, but not always.

Look on ebay for an appropriate PA-series, what model laptop do you have?


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:30:20 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

Ooops. I don't like stright power plugs because the center pin wire
tends to break inside the plug. A right angle plug is easier on the
connectors and uses less desk space for the cord:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231849537436

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 03/18/2017 09:30 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 16:06:13 -0400, bitrex
wrote:

Before I run out and make sure to pick up an OEM supply, is there any
way to ensure this is certainly a problem with the adapter and not the PC?

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

From your description, I would guess(tm) your replacement charger is
generating some noise. The laptop charge controller is rather picky
as to what voltage it's being fed. Too little voltage or noise, and
it will power the laptop, but not charge the battery. I'm not sure
what it will do with too much voltage. I buy these replacement power
supplies from various eBay vendors in lots of 10 and resell them to
customers. I've had a few problems, but in general, they work. Spend
the $11 and see what happens. If a new charger doesn't fix the
problem, then the problem is in the laptop and someone will need to
dive in and fix it.

Note that if this machine is a lemon and out of warranty, a
motherboard transplant is possible but expensive for the i7 version:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=Dell+Inspiron+15+5558+motherboard
Note that swapping motherboards often breaks software licenses and
registrations so save this as a last resort.

Also, my sense of smell tells me that running your Dell Inspiron 15
5558 without the battery is a bad idea. A good charger should be able
to run the laptop without a battery, but I don't want to find out what
might happen if you try it with a potentially defective charger. Don't
try it.

Maybe a BIOS update is required?

You should always stay up to date with the BIOS. Yes, you can find
horror stories on the internet about failed updates, bricked laptops,
and features that no longer work correctly. Those are rare and can be
handled by with various BIOS recovery tricks. I had some bios
failures maybe 10 or more years ago, but not since. Do it.


Thanks much for the advice, I'll give one of the eBay clone chargers a try!

On 03/18/2017 09:44 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:30:20 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

Ooops. I don't like stright power plugs because the center pin wire
tends to break inside the plug. A right angle plug is easier on the
connectors and uses less desk space for the cord:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231849537436


Wow, that's a good price.

Have you peeked inside the brick by any chance? I saw a scary site a
while back that had teardowns of some Chinese-made replacement power
adapters that were all just repackaged e-waste with some wires bodged on
inside...

On 03/18/2017 09:44 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:30:20 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

Ooops. I don't like stright power plugs because the center pin wire
tends to break inside the plug. A right angle plug is easier on the
connectors and uses less desk space for the cord:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231849537436


With the right-angle connectors the shield wire tends to break at the
joint... :-(

On Saturday, March 18, 2017 at 4:06:17 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
I have a used Dell Inspiron 5558 laptop, which didn't come with an OEM
power supply. I picked up a 65W "universal" type for it off Amazon, and
it's showing some weird behavior.

First problem is that it often refuses to charge the battery when
connected to line power. Maybe 1 out of 10 times I've plugged it in the
battery charges, the other times the charging LED remains off and the
charging indicator on the screen remains at 0%.

It sometimes has difficulty starting up from line power at my home as
well; you have to hit the power button a couple times to get it to power
on instead of coming up for a few seconds then immediately shutting
down. However, it seems to always work fine off the local Starbuck's
wall power. Still doesn't charge properly, though.

The BIOS reports some incidences of "Unknown AC adapter detected!" but
not all the time.

Before I run out and make sure to pick up an OEM supply, is there any
way to ensure this is certainly a problem with the adapter and not the PC?

Maybe a BIOS update is required?

Sometimes a firmware update will fix a "plugged in, not charging" condition (it did on my Dell Studio).

The problem is that the Dell won't allow a firmware upgrade unless the battery is partially charged lest it get AC interuptus bricking the main.

There is a technique to force the computer to run the bios flash (might be as easy as putting a /force at the end of the command line.

On Wed, 22 Mar 2017 13:55:34 -0400, bitrex
wrote:

On 03/18/2017 09:44 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:30:20 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

Ooops. I don't like stright power plugs because the center pin wire
tends to break inside the plug. A right angle plug is easier on the
connectors and uses less desk space for the cord:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231849537436

With the right-angle connectors the shield wire tends to break at the
joint... :-(

That's less likely than with the straight in connector, where the tiny
center wire tends to break when you bend or flex the cord. That
usually happens when the power connector is in back of the laptop, and
one shoves the laptop into the wall. The cord hits the wall, bends to
a sharp 90 degree angle, stretches the center wired, and eventually
breaks it.

The straight in connector is also longer than the right angle
connector. If the cord is pulled in the wrong direction, the
connector will bend and eventually break the jack. The longer lever
arm produced by the straight in plug does more damage than the shorter
right angle plug.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Wed, 22 Mar 2017 13:54:02 -0400, bitrex
wrote:

On 03/18/2017 09:44 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:30:20 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

Ooops. I don't like stright power plugs because the center pin wire
tends to break inside the plug. A right angle plug is easier on the
connectors and uses less desk space for the cord:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231849537436

Wow, that's a good price.

Yep. I can't even ship an empty box for that price.

Have you peeked inside the brick by any chance?

Nope. The only power supply bricks that I tear apart are the ones
that have failed and where I think I have a chance at fixing. Most of
the bricks are glued or solvent welded together making disassembly
somewhat destructive. I have looked at various other brick power
supplied and found the full range of quality from really good, to
absolute crap. I don't know where this vendors bricks fit but can say
I've bought a few bricks from him without any surprises or failures.

If you want photos of the guts, I can probably supply something as I
vaguely recall tossing some in my "to be recycled" bin. No schematic
so this might be limited to quality of construction.

I saw a scary site a
while back that had teardowns of some Chinese-made replacement power
adapters that were all just repackaged e-waste with some wires bodged on
inside...

Like this fake Dell PA-10 brick?
http://www.electricstuff.co.uk/acadapter.html
Some of the stuff I see that has failed looks like this. No input
protection, filtering, or isolation. Undersize filter caps,
inadequate heat sink, and no isolation between input and output
sections. I can't say that the stuff I've been buying on eBay is in
this class because so far I have not needed to tear one apart and
analyze the design.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 03/23/2017 04:36 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Wed, 22 Mar 2017 13:54:02 -0400, bitrex
wrote:

On 03/18/2017 09:44 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:30:20 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

Yes, but it's easier to just buy a replacement charger:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272573072644

Ooops. I don't like stright power plugs because the center pin wire
tends to break inside the plug. A right angle plug is easier on the
connectors and uses less desk space for the cord:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231849537436

Wow, that's a good price.

Yep. I can't even ship an empty box for that price.


Thanks again for the tip, Jeff, the replacement adapter came today and
is charging the laptop and seems to be working great. :-)

On 03/18/2017 04:06 PM, bitrex wrote:
I have a used Dell Inspiron 5558 laptop, which didn't come with an OEM
power supply. I picked up a 65W "universal" type for it off Amazon, and
it's showing some weird behavior.

First problem is that it often refuses to charge the battery when
connected to line power. Maybe 1 out of 10 times I've plugged it in the
battery charges, the other times the charging LED remains off and the
charging indicator on the screen remains at 0%.

It sometimes has difficulty starting up from line power at my home as
well; you have to hit the power button a couple times to get it to power
on instead of coming up for a few seconds then immediately shutting
down. However, it seems to always work fine off the local Starbuck's
wall power. Still doesn't charge properly, though.

The BIOS reports some incidences of "Unknown AC adapter detected!" but
not all the time.

Before I run out and make sure to pick up an OEM supply, is there any
way to ensure this is certainly a problem with the adapter and not the PC?

Maybe a BIOS update is required?

So here's the final solution. The new power adapter powered the laptop
consistently, however it only charged the battery once. Then it refused
to charge again.

Updating the BIOS to the latest version fixed that problem as well, so
now everything is working fine. I had to use the "hack" method though,
as of course I didn't realize there was a problem remaining until the
battery had fully discharged, and the Windows update tool requires the
battery to be above 10% to operate, as "ohger1" mentioned.

For future reference, you get Dell Diagnostic Deployment Package (DDDP)
he

https://www.dell.com/support/article/us/en/19/SLN143196/how-to-create-a-bootable-usb-flash-drive-using-dell-diagnostic-deployment-package--dddp-?lang=EN

and also the latest BIOS update executable. Follow the instructions to
make a bootable USB flash drive with the proper DOS startup files.

Hit F12 on startup and switch the boot mode from "UEFI" to "Legacy."
Restart and select the USB flash drive to boot from and a DOS prompt
like "Diag C:\" should come up.

The BIOS update file will show up with the usual "~1" at the end to
represent an extended filename. On mine it was "INSPIR~1.EXE". Type
"INSPIR~1.EXE /forceit" (hidden option) to force a BIOS update while on
AC power with a dead battery.

After the BIOS is flashed shut down the computer, remove the battery and
hold down the power switch for about 20 seconds. Reboot, switch the boot
mode back to "UEFI" and boot into Windows and the charging light should
come on indicating the battery is charging properly. Yay!