Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems.

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  #1   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes from.

I only get this in hot weather I think, patricularly humid weather,
opening a window and letting cold air in seems to stop/reduce
the noise.

Any ideas, would brushing away the 'dust' help? (Actually
some of the dust seems to have been 'burnt away by the arcing).

Sorry if the techinical terms are not very technical, and spelling is
bad (in a hurry).

--
half_pint.


  #2   Report Post  
David
 
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Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

To fix it properly at this point, a NEW hv anode cap needs attached to the
wire, ALL the carbon trails need carefully cleaned off the glass, then the
new cap needs sealed to the tube using special hv corona dope or hv silicon.

David

"half_pint" wrote in message
...
I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes from.

I only get this in hot weather I think, patricularly humid weather,
opening a window and letting cold air in seems to stop/reduce
the noise.

Any ideas, would brushing away the 'dust' help? (Actually
some of the dust seems to have been 'burnt away by the arcing).

Sorry if the techinical terms are not very technical, and spelling is
bad (in a hurry).

--
half_pint.




  #3   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

Thanks for that, it's an old TV and probably not worth spending
too much on (or electrocuting myself).
I am not too sure what cause the arcing as it seems to arcing to it
self, I am now thinking it is just acring into the damp air as it only
seems to happen on on hot humid summer days (we don't get much
of that in the UK) . Reading a bit about it it seems sharp edges will
make it worse so I assume cleaning off the black points carbon stuff
will help (tends to drop down into the rest of the TV though).

Actually thinking more about it it seems I have a mini thunder storm
going on.(except in reverse?).
Incidently we receently did have a lot of thunder locally (Nottingham UK).
apparently there were 7,000 strikes in the area, out of 10,000 in the
country.
So probably not worth doing any more than a good clean up of
the 'crap'.
Maybe my TV was responsible for the spate of thunder storms in
the area? (I best keep quite about that before insurance companies
start chasing me!!).
But thanks again, I have a better understanding of what is going on now.


"David" wrote in message
...
To fix it properly at this point, a NEW hv anode cap needs attached to the
wire, ALL the carbon trails need carefully cleaned off the glass, then the
new cap needs sealed to the tube using special hv corona dope or hv

silicon.

David

"half_pint" wrote in message
...
I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes

from.

I only get this in hot weather I think, patricularly humid weather,
opening a window and letting cold air in seems to stop/reduce
the noise.

Any ideas, would brushing away the 'dust' help? (Actually
some of the dust seems to have been 'burnt away by the arcing).

Sorry if the techinical terms are not very technical, and spelling is
bad (in a hurry).

--
half_pint.






  #4   Report Post  
Sam Goldwasser
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

"half_pint" writes:

Thanks for that.
As I am basically a cautious coward I don't intend going near
it with except with a long plastic or wooden handeled impliment.

The TV cost about 200 when I bought it well over 5 year ago
so I doubt calling out a TV tech would be cost effective.

However having said that my father brought in a similar aged
but more expensive TV in for repair, the picture was bigger
than the screen so to speak, and wider at the top and bottom.
It was clearly more noticable when you used teletext but
on a normal broadcast you would hardly notice it unless
there was important info (text etc..) at the corners of the screen.
Actually these pseudo widescreen broadcasts probably looked
aweful on it (well more aweful than usual (widescreen is my
pet hate)). By aweful I mean **** (in the US doesn't aweful mean
good?). Actually it was probably the WS broadcasts which
caused him to get it repaired.
Anyway the repair man did a great job for 50 and the pic is
perfect now, as good as new.

The problem only occurs on very humid days so I can live with
it, as that is only a handful of days a year.


The problem with ignoring it is that there may come a final arc-snap
and then the set will be dead. I would recommend cleaning at least.

See the FAQs for SAFETY info.

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
| Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html

Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is ignored.
To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites.


  #5   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

Thanks for that.
As I am basically a cautious coward I don't intend going near
it with except with a long plastic or wooden handeled impliment.

The TV cost about 200 when I bought it well over 5 year ago
so I doubt calling out a TV tech would be cost effective.

However having said that my father brought in a similar aged
but more expensive TV in for repair, the picture was bigger
than the screen so to speak, and wider at the top and bottom.
It was clearly more noticable when you used teletext but
on a normal broadcast you would hardly notice it unless
there was important info (text etc..) at the corners of the screen.
Actually these pseudo widescreen broadcasts probably looked
aweful on it (well more aweful than usual (widescreen is my
pet hate)). By aweful I mean **** (in the US doesn't aweful mean
good?). Actually it was probably the WS broadcasts which
caused him to get it repaired.
Anyway the repair man did a great job for 50 and the pic is
perfect now, as good as new.

The problem only occurs on very humid days so I can live with
it, as that is only a handful of days a year.

I am actually qualified in electronics, althoug I have no real practical
experience of repairs and I am fairly convinced it is not a major problem.

Acually the electrical arcing is quite pretty to watch if you turn the
lights off, its often a better show than the stuff on the other side
of the tube, especially if it is widescreen!!!!!!!

What do you guys think of WS anyway? I think it is ****e and a step
backwards (I can scientifically prove it is a poorer format!), mind you
I expect it keeps you guys who work in the industry in a job, so unbiased
opinons are perhaps unlikey!!!.

cheeers 1/2 pint.





"Jerry Greenberg" wrote in message
om...
You should call in a professional TV tech to service this for you. The
anode cap, and anode area of the tube may need proper cleaning. The
anode connection from the wire to the contact under the anode-cup may
need to be re-spliced and soldered.

If the proper remidy does not work, it is possible the the tube may
have a problem, and is starting to have some type of problem. Problems
with the anode connection in the tube are very rare.

There is a lot of high voltage there, even when the set is shut off
and unplugged from the AC outlet. This is an extremely dangerous area
to mess with!

Get a TV tech in to fix this for you.

Jerry G.
========


"half_pint" wrote in message

...
I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes

from.

I only get this in hot weather I think, patricularly humid weather,
opening a window and letting cold air in seems to stop/reduce
the noise.

Any ideas, would brushing away the 'dust' help? (Actually
some of the dust seems to have been 'burnt away by the arcing).

Sorry if the techinical terms are not very technical, and spelling is
bad (in a hurry).





  #6   Report Post  
LASERandDVDfan
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

Well I plan doing that although if all the black stuff is conducting I might
end up doing more damage than good unless i am careful.


The voltages that run a picture tube is typically at the kilovolt range. On
average, a tube requires around 25,000 to 30,000 volts to power it, and that
voltage is generated by the flyback transformer.
Remember, electrical transformers can be made to step up or step down
electrical voltage. Flyback transformers are designed to upstep power up to
several thousand volts to properly drive a cathode ray picture tube.

Anyways, with that much voltage is a lot of potential for arcing to the nearest
ground, so proper and effective insulation for the anode cap, flyback line, and
flyback casing is essential. If the insulation is faulty or substandard, then
you will have an arc problem during operation. The final arc-snap that's
mentioned happens when the final arc uses the air as a bridge to ground through
the insulation towards a critical part on any of the circuit boards, destroying
it and causing more damage to the TV, possibly disabling it completely and
creating a new problem in the process.

If you've wondered why the inside of a picture tube must be a perfect vaccum,
this is why. Any air that's inside the picture tube will act as a bridge for
high voltage electricity and will make the anode feed arc to the nearest ground
inside the picture tube instead of properly powering it.

This kind of problem really requires proper servicing to correct it reliably
and safely.
The set should not be used ever again until the problem is corrected. -
Reinhart
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half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message
...
"half_pint" writes:

Thanks for that.
As I am basically a cautious coward I don't intend going near
it with except with a long plastic or wooden handeled impliment.

The TV cost about 200 when I bought it well over 5 year ago
so I doubt calling out a TV tech would be cost effective.

However having said that my father brought in a similar aged
but more expensive TV in for repair, the picture was bigger
than the screen so to speak, and wider at the top and bottom.
It was clearly more noticable when you used teletext but
on a normal broadcast you would hardly notice it unless
there was important info (text etc..) at the corners of the screen.
Actually these pseudo widescreen broadcasts probably looked
aweful on it (well more aweful than usual (widescreen is my
pet hate)). By aweful I mean **** (in the US doesn't aweful mean
good?). Actually it was probably the WS broadcasts which
caused him to get it repaired.
Anyway the repair man did a great job for 50 and the pic is
perfect now, as good as new.

The problem only occurs on very humid days so I can live with
it, as that is only a handful of days a year.


The problem with ignoring it is that there may come a final arc-snap
and then the set will be dead. I would recommend cleaning at least.



Well I plan doing that although if all the black stuff is conducting I might
end up doing more damage than good unless i am careful.
I doubt it will every arc enough to do any real damage though, and it
was quite a sight to see. Unfortunately the weather is dryer now and the
show is probably over untill next year.

I will have to make do with 'Big Brother' and the like untill them :O|




See the FAQs for SAFETY info.

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
| Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html

Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is

ignored.
To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites.




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Sam Goldwasser
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

"half_pint" writes:

"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message
...
"half_pint" writes:

Thanks for that.
As I am basically a cautious coward I don't intend going near
it with except with a long plastic or wooden handeled impliment.

The TV cost about 200 when I bought it well over 5 year ago
so I doubt calling out a TV tech would be cost effective.

However having said that my father brought in a similar aged
but more expensive TV in for repair, the picture was bigger
than the screen so to speak, and wider at the top and bottom.
It was clearly more noticable when you used teletext but
on a normal broadcast you would hardly notice it unless
there was important info (text etc..) at the corners of the screen.
Actually these pseudo widescreen broadcasts probably looked
aweful on it (well more aweful than usual (widescreen is my
pet hate)). By aweful I mean **** (in the US doesn't aweful mean
good?). Actually it was probably the WS broadcasts which
caused him to get it repaired.
Anyway the repair man did a great job for 50 and the pic is
perfect now, as good as new.

The problem only occurs on very humid days so I can live with
it, as that is only a handful of days a year.


The problem with ignoring it is that there may come a final arc-snap
and then the set will be dead. I would recommend cleaning at least.


Well I plan doing that although if all the black stuff is conducting I might
end up doing more damage than good unless i am careful.
I doubt it will every arc enough to do any real damage though, and it
was quite a sight to see. Unfortunately the weather is dryer now and the
show is probably over untill next year.

I will have to make do with 'Big Brother' and the like untill them :O|


If you are referring to the HV connector to the CRT (the thing that looks
like a suction cup), there should be an area immediately surrounding it
and under it that is not coated with anything - just glass. It should
be clean. DON'T attempt to scrape the coating further away off the
tube - that's needed!

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
| Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html

Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is ignored.
To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites.


  #9   Report Post  
Asimov
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

"Jason D." bravely wrote to "All" (26 Jul 04 06:09:35)
--- on the heady topic of " TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise,
arcing."

JD From: (Jason D.)

JD On 25 Jul 2004 04:18:56 GMT,
(LASERandDVDfan)
JD wrote:

Well I plan doing that although if all the black stuff is conducting I might
end up doing more damage than good unless i am careful.


JD Huh uh, no no...See what others has explained and one thing they
JD didn't bother to say that I'm adding to this. More on this below.


The voltages that run a picture tube is typically at the kilovolt range. On
average, a tube requires around 25,000 to 30,000 volts to power it, and that
voltage is generated by the flyback transformer.
Remember, electrical transformers can be made to step up or step down
electrical voltage. Flyback transformers are designed to upstep power up to
several thousand volts to properly drive a cathode ray picture tube.

Anyways, with that much voltage is a lot of potential for arcing to the

nearest
ground, so proper and effective insulation for the anode cap, flyback line,

and
flyback casing is essential. If the insulation is faulty or substandard, then
you will have an arc problem during operation. The final arc-snap that's
mentioned happens when the final arc uses the air as a bridge to ground

through
the insulation towards a critical part on any of the circuit boards,

destroying
it and causing more damage to the TV, possibly disabling it completely and
creating a new problem in the process.

If you've wondered why the inside of a picture tube must be a perfect vaccum,
this is why. Any air that's inside the picture tube will act as a bridge for
high voltage electricity and will make the anode feed arc to the nearest

ground
inside the picture tube instead of properly powering it.

This kind of problem really requires proper servicing to correct it reliably
and safely.
The set should not be used ever again until the problem is corrected. -
Reinhart


JD Right.

JD The thing they didn't tell you over time with arcing and hissing, etc.
JD The arc is very hot temps (this reason arcs looks bluish molecules it
JD get excited are is very HOT to glow blue) and will carbonize the paths
JD arc takes and will finally stay this way (snap snap snap! Pow! POP! TV
JD dies.) and may take a part out or overload the flyback and kill it or
JD burn out the HOT. Seen this happen *many* times. Often the final
JD kill happened so fast that you hardly blink and utter "huh?".

JD Get it fixed while it's good! :-)


I second that. Just wanted to add that the blue arcs produce ozone,
which is a molecular form of oxygen containing 3 atoms instead of the
usual 2. The extra oxygen atom causes the molecule to be unstable and
the ozone gas very reactive. Ozone is thus extremely corrosive, and
damaging to organic things, i.e. plastic insulation. When inhaled
ozone is extrememly damaging to the lungs by directly attacking the
thin lining of the tiny sacs where air is exchanged with the blood.
Ozone is associated with the electric smell that is sometimes noticed
when a thunderstorm comes or in electrical sparking. In summary,
operating a defective TV which generates ozone into the atmosphere of
an enclosed room is not a very wise decision.

A*s*i*m*o*v

.... You mean 15" sparks are SUPPOSED to come out of this thing?!?

  #10   Report Post  
James Sweet
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"half_pint" wrote in message
...
I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes from.


That's fairly common, you need to remove the anode cap (the suction cup
thing) clean the tube well, then smear the rubber with some dielectric
grease you can get at any autoparts store. You need to discharge the tube
first, just connect a wire to a screwdriver, and connect the other end to
the metal ground strap around the back of the tube then poke the screwdriver
under the cap, you might hear a small static electricity zap, then pull up
the lip of the suction cup and you'll see how to disconnect it. Discharge
the little button where it plugs in any time before you touch it as it'll
sometimes build up a bit of residiual charge.




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half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.



I second that. Just wanted to add that the blue arcs produce ozone,
which is a molecular form of oxygen containing 3 atoms instead of the
usual 2. The extra oxygen atom causes the molecule to be unstable and
the ozone gas very reactive. Ozone is thus extremely corrosive, and
damaging to organic things, i.e. plastic insulation. When inhaled
ozone is extrememly damaging to the lungs by directly attacking the
thin lining of the tiny sacs where air is exchanged with the blood.
Ozone is associated with the electric smell that is sometimes noticed
when a thunderstorm comes or in electrical sparking. In summary,
operating a defective TV which generates ozone into the atmosphere of
an enclosed room is not a very wise decision.


Well that may be a more compelling reason to get it fixed, or
dump it and get a new one. I doubt it is cost effective to have
someone repair it.
I would probably have replacedit were it not for the fact that
the shops I visited contained almost exclusively widescreen
sets (Which I detest). Maybe I will go for a large second
hand standard 'proper' TV.
Actually though something does appear to have affected the
inside of the plastic back casing of the TV making it sticky
particularly around the area near the anode cap. I presume
this has been caused by ozone.
I took the back off to let more air get in, I think maybe I should
put it back on tho keep the ozone in.
Anyway humidity is 82% at the moment and the tude is fizzling
away quite merrily.(sounds like there is a wasp in there!!).
Also as I smoke 20 a day maybe all that tar will protect my
lungs from the ozone? Smoking may also have something to
do with the black sticky stuff on the plastic, or it may be
plastic attacked by ozone. I wouldn't say I can particularly
smell ozone in the room, certaintly not as much as during
a thundersorm anyway but it is more of a concern than my
TV packing up anyway.

However I will have a go at cleaming the cap up a bit when
I am feeking braver, apparently the voltages are less dangerous
than they sound but I will not be taking any chances.
Apparently a bit of insulating tape might come in handy.
Beats me why these caps are metal anyway, I assume they are,
it would seem to be more sennsible to make them plactic coated.

Also is the back of the tube glass or metalic? I assume it is
glass but I and not 100%

Actually the noise has been a bit louder, and I checked
the humidity, its up to 88%.

Actually the noise was beginning to annoy me so I through
caution to the wind and stuck a couple layers of
sticky insulating tape over the offending area, result:- silence.
Or near silence anyway, I will do a proper clean up on it
tomorrow.

Well that has saved me 50 for the time being anyway,
humidity still 88%.



A*s*i*m*o*v

... You mean 15" sparks are SUPPOSED to come out of this thing?!?



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half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"James Sweet" wrote in message
news:GdTMc.184411$XM6.177046@attbi_s53...

"half_pint" wrote in message
...
I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes

from.


That's fairly common, you need to remove the anode cap


How do I do that? Just pull it off?
Is it rubber or metal, I thought it was metal, maybe it
is rubber, (rubber sounds more sensible.

(the suction cup
thing) clean the tube well, then smear the rubber with some dielectric
grease you can get at any autoparts store. You need to discharge the tube
first, just connect a wire to a screwdriver, and connect the other end to
the metal ground strap around the back of the tube


I am not sure I can find an obvious ground, there is very little metal
visable.
The four corners where the tube attatches to the case seem to have wires
attatched to then, I assume these would be earth?
There is very little other metal to be seem.

then poke the screwdriver
under the cap, you might hear a small static electricity zap, then pull up
the lip of the suction cup and you'll see how to disconnect it. Discharge
the little button where it plugs in any time before you touch it as it'll
sometimes build up a bit of residiual charge.


I have done a tempory job with some sticky insulation tape,
taking care not to touch anything ht. I will try a doing
a proper job later.


Thanks.




  #13   Report Post  
James Sweet
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.



There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes

from.


That's fairly common, you need to remove the anode cap


How do I do that? Just pull it off?
Is it rubber or metal, I thought it was metal, maybe it
is rubber, (rubber sounds more sensible.


It's rubber, underneath is a metal clip that clips into a little metal pot
cast in the glass of the tube. Once you lift the edge it'll be obvious how
to remove it.


(the suction cup
thing) clean the tube well, then smear the rubber with some dielectric
grease you can get at any autoparts store. You need to discharge the

tube
first, just connect a wire to a screwdriver, and connect the other end

to
the metal ground strap around the back of the tube


I am not sure I can find an obvious ground, there is very little metal
visable.
The four corners where the tube attatches to the case seem to have wires
attatched to then, I assume these would be earth?
There is very little other metal to be seem.



The back of the tube is coated with a dark gray conductive coating, there
should be some sort of ground contact that connects to that, often there's a
metal strap around the back of the tube.


  #14   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"James Sweet" wrote in message
news:aDVMc.28085$eM2.1834@attbi_s51...


There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit

of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes

from.


That's fairly common, you need to remove the anode cap


How do I do that? Just pull it off?
Is it rubber or metal, I thought it was metal, maybe it
is rubber, (rubber sounds more sensible.


It's rubber,


So it *should* be safe to touch???????
The 'light show' is on the outside of this rubber cap (iits all covered
in black dust though).

I am a little puzzeled, if the tube is earthed, and the outside of the
cap is high tension.........if the two meet.....boom..(or zap).
Is this the final arc zap mentioned earlier in the thread?

And why is the outside of the cap high tension, is it because of the
black stuff or is the cap perished?


I think I assumed (wrongly) the outside of the cap was ment to be HT.

I am a little more worried now.




underneath is a metal clip that clips into a little metal pot
cast in the glass of the tube. Once you lift the edge it'll be obvious how
to remove it.





(the suction cup
thing) clean the tube well, then smear the rubber with some dielectric
grease you can get at any autoparts store. You need to discharge the

tube
first, just connect a wire to a screwdriver, and connect the other end

to
the metal ground strap around the back of the tube


I am not sure I can find an obvious ground, there is very little metal
visable.
The four corners where the tube attatches to the case seem to have wires
attatched to then, I assume these would be earth?
There is very little other metal to be seem.



The back of the tube is coated with a dark gray conductive coating, there
should be some sort of ground contact that connects to that, often there's

a
metal strap around the back of the tube.



Yes I can see a braided metal strap held round the tube by wires which
appear to connecte to the afore mentioned corners, it helped when I
used a decent light to see with.


Thanks again


  #15   Report Post  
Sam Goldwasser
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

"half_pint" writes:

"James Sweet" wrote in message
news:aDVMc.28085$eM2.1834@attbi_s51...


There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit

of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes
from.


That's fairly common, you need to remove the anode cap

How do I do that? Just pull it off?
Is it rubber or metal, I thought it was metal, maybe it
is rubber, (rubber sounds more sensible.


It's rubber,


So it *should* be safe to touch???????


In principle the rubber cap should be safe to touch but as you have
observed, with all the dust, there is high voltage on it!

The 'light show' is on the outside of this rubber cap (iits all covered
in black dust though).


That should not be there.

I am a little puzzeled, if the tube is earthed, and the outside of the
cap is high tension.........if the two meet.....boom..(or zap).
Is this the final arc zap mentioned earlier in the thread?


Yes.

And why is the outside of the cap high tension, is it because of the
black stuff or is the cap perished?


Because it is contaminated underneath as well.

I think I assumed (wrongly) the outside of the cap was ment to be HT.


Nope.

I am a little more worried now.


No need to be worried, but you should do as has been suggested here
and not use the TV until then.

If you have any doubts about your ability to do it, then have a repair
shop clean it. Shouldn't be expensive now. Only if you wait for the
final ZAP!

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
| Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html

Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is ignored.
To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites.




  #16   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

Thanks I think I am beginning to understand things a lot more
clearly now.

I noticed there was another bigger concentric circle on the tube
bigger than the cap (it looked to me like a bigger cap
had been used in the past and that it had left a cleaner
circular region when it was removed). I now realise (assuming
I am correct) that this is a region which is not painted with a conductive
coating (at ground porential) to reduce the chances of a nasty
arc from HT to ground. (I will sleep a lot better now).
It is covered in dirt so I will give it a good clean (one of the
jobs I am putting of untill tomorrow (I have a long list of them )).

Thanks a lot, it has been a bit of an education for me!!

I doubt I will do a professional job though, just enough to
feel safe, well at least not untill I can get my hands
on the correct 'stuff'.
I will probably be getting a new main TV set soon anyway.

cheers half_pint


"Jason D." wrote in message
...

And why is the outside of the cap high tension, is it because of the
black stuff or is the cap perished?


Unplug the tv and discharge the high voltage as instructed. Clean the
rubber cap and around it to see damage better. You will find very
tiny pinhole or a arc track (by the carbonization) in that rubber or
under that rubber that HV managed to work itself out and go zzzzt
noise. Then remove cup by getting both sides of cup up and squeezing
the clip with screwdriver to get one barb over the anode cavity lip
then another barb will be easier to come free.

The rubber cup (cap) is replaceable. We sometimes have to do this for
any reasons. Ask for one from used pull especially one from recent
RCA. A good tech shop should keep leftover new stuff like I do
especially when I'm replacing flyback transformer and the HV lead and
cup is susplus and keep extras in a box. This has a metal dished cup
clamping on the wire by rubber tension. Work the little disc out and
pull the wire out. And cut the old one off the HV wire if you have
enough length otherwise get old cup apart (cutting the rubber) if
there's not enough excess length to this HV lead. You want the bare
wire enough for the metal clip. The rest of insulation should be all
the way into the new cup. Lube with silicone dielectric grease to
make pushing wire into new cup easier.
Then put the metal disk same way in and work it in. Want the lip of
rubber to get over that disk, holding it in therefore clamping that
bare wire.

Also clean the new cup and lead, Clean CRT area out to 2" radius from
that anode cavity. 99% alochol is good for this clean up. Put bit of
silicone dielectric grease on that CRT around the anode cavity where
the new cup will contact (just a ring of thin layer will do). Use
washed hands, one handed holding bent back to let you hook one side of
barbs and one clean dull small flat screwdriver in other hand to get
other barb into hole and push it in. Both barbs should be hooked
under that anode cavity. Let go of rubber and massage it to seal
properly. Go carefully.

The HV lead from the flyback transformer is non-removeable.

Cheers,

Wizard



I think I assumed (wrongly) the outside of the cap was ment to be HT.

I am a little more worried now.




underneath is a metal clip that clips into a little metal pot
cast in the glass of the tube. Once you lift the edge it'll be obvious

how
to remove it.





(the suction cup
thing) clean the tube well, then smear the rubber with some

dielectric
grease you can get at any autoparts store. You need to discharge

the
tube
first, just connect a wire to a screwdriver, and connect the other

end
to
the metal ground strap around the back of the tube

I am not sure I can find an obvious ground, there is very little

metal
visable.
The four corners where the tube attatches to the case seem to have

wires
attatched to then, I assume these would be earth?
There is very little other metal to be seem.


The back of the tube is coated with a dark gray conductive coating,

there
should be some sort of ground contact that connects to that, often

there's
a
metal strap around the back of the tube.



Yes I can see a braided metal strap held round the tube by wires which
appear to connecte to the afore mentioned corners, it helped when I
used a decent light to see with.


Thanks again





  #17   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message
...
"half_pint" writes:

"James Sweet" wrote in message
news:aDVMc.28085$eM2.1834@attbi_s51...


There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair

bit
of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker

type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose

comes
from.


That's fairly common, you need to remove the anode cap

How do I do that? Just pull it off?
Is it rubber or metal, I thought it was metal, maybe it
is rubber, (rubber sounds more sensible.

It's rubber,


So it *should* be safe to touch???????


In principle the rubber cap should be safe to touch but as you have
observed, with all the dust, there is high voltage on it!

The 'light show' is on the outside of this rubber cap (iits all covered
in black dust though).


That should not be there.

I am a little puzzeled, if the tube is earthed, and the outside of the
cap is high tension.........if the two meet.....boom..(or zap).
Is this the final arc zap mentioned earlier in the thread?


Yes.

And why is the outside of the cap high tension, is it because of the
black stuff or is the cap perished?


Because it is contaminated underneath as well.



I am not too sure where the ht on the cap comes from.


I think I assumed (wrongly) the outside of the cap was ment to be HT.


Nope.

I am a little more worried now.


No need to be worried, but you should do as has been suggested here
and not use the TV until then.


What no TV!!!!


If you have any doubts about your ability to do it, then have a repair
shop clean it. Shouldn't be expensive now. Only if you wait for the
final ZAP!



I had been meaning to replace the TV with a bigger one and use it
as a spare portable.

If it does go pop I would perfer to spend any repair money on a
new portable (I can get one for less than 60) and buy a new main
set too. This set also has a few other niggling problems.
It sometimes needs tuning adjusting when I switch channels, particularly
when its temperature is changing, and the remote has a dodgy button
plus the battery connections are dodgy, great picture apart from that
though. Although the black bar at the top on pseudo widescreen
broadcasts does appear slightly larger on one side. I believe
twisting some coils somewhere might fix that but I am not sure
if I am up to doing that.

I will not leave it on unattended though.

Mind you, I can only put it on standby, unless I unplug it and
lose all the stations. The on-off switch on the main set doesnt
appear to work! (nasty combination eh?). I think standby
switches off the HT though so I should be ok.

thanks anyway.


--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Home Page: http://www.repairfaq.org/
Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
| Mirror Site Info: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html

Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header is

ignored.
To contact me, please use the feedback form on the S.E.R FAQ Web sites.




  #18   Report Post  
Asimov
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

"half_pint" bravely wrote to "All" (25 Jul 04 20:29:45)
--- on the heady topic of " TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise,
arcing."

ha From: "half_pint"
ha Actually though something does appear to have affected the
ha inside of the plastic back casing of the TV making it sticky
ha particularly around the area near the anode cap. I presume
ha this has been caused by ozone.
ha I took the back off to let more air get in, I think maybe I should
ha put it back on tho keep the ozone in.
ha Anyway humidity is 82% at the moment and the tude is fizzling
ha away quite merrily.(sounds like there is a wasp in there!!).
ha Also as I smoke 20 a day maybe all that tar will protect my
ha lungs from the ozone? Smoking may also have something to
ha do with the black sticky stuff on the plastic, or it may be
ha plastic attacked by ozone. I wouldn't say I can particularly
ha smell ozone in the room, certaintly not as much as during
ha a thundersorm anyway but it is more of a concern than my
ha TV packing up anyway.

I agree. I don't think you can smell ozone if you smoke 20 coffin
nails a day. I also agree the goo inside you TV is very likely tar.
The oily combustion products from the burning tobacco tend to condense
on every surface they land on. It gives everything in the room a nice
yellow film just like on your fingers.

If I bring say a clock radio from your room into a non-smoker's house
it will reek of tobacco smell to them for months. You don't even
notice it because you are desensitized in being saturated by it 24/7.
But it's a longshot that the tar in your lungs acts as a protection
against ozone. Don't count on it.

I smoked 2 packs a day for over 20 years but finally gave it up after
discovering a couple of shadows in my lung xrays. It has now been over
20 years since I last smoked and a clean bill of health. It wasn't as
hard to quit as my smoker friends made it seem.


ha However I will have a go at cleaming the cap up a bit when
ha I am feeking braver, apparently the voltages are less dangerous
ha than they sound but I will not be taking any chances.
ha Apparently a bit of insulating tape might come in handy.
ha Beats me why these caps are metal anyway, I assume they are,
ha it would seem to be more sennsible to make them plactic coated.

ha Also is the back of the tube glass or metalic? I assume it is
ha glass but I and not 100%

ha Actually the noise has been a bit louder, and I checked
ha the humidity, its up to 88%.

ha Actually the noise was beginning to annoy me so I through
ha caution to the wind and stuck a couple layers of
ha sticky insulating tape over the offending area, result:- silence.
ha Or near silence anyway, I will do a proper clean up on it
ha tomorrow.

ha Well that has saved me #50 for the time being anyway,
ha humidity still 88%.

Alcohol is a good cleaning solution for this purpose. Try and get the
99% variety at the pharmacy. After the glass and cup are clean,
inspect the HV cup for damage such as carbonization. Any trace of a
track means it should be replaced. Then smear HV dielectric or spark
plug grease all over the inside of the cup before reconnecting it to
the CRT dimple. This will keep the air from getting under the cap and
causing short circuiting to ground. Some folk use hv rtv, or ordinary
car axle grease or engine oil but all that just seems too messy.

A*s*i*m*o*v

.... High Voltage Electronics: Life's a glitch, then you fry.

  #19   Report Post  
Jason D.
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

On 25 Jul 2004 04:18:56 GMT, (LASERandDVDfan)
wrote:

Well I plan doing that although if all the black stuff is conducting I might
end up doing more damage than good unless i am careful.


Huh uh, no no...See what others has explained and one thing they
didn't bother to say that I'm adding to this. More on this below.


The voltages that run a picture tube is typically at the kilovolt range. On
average, a tube requires around 25,000 to 30,000 volts to power it, and that
voltage is generated by the flyback transformer.
Remember, electrical transformers can be made to step up or step down
electrical voltage. Flyback transformers are designed to upstep power up to
several thousand volts to properly drive a cathode ray picture tube.

Anyways, with that much voltage is a lot of potential for arcing to the nearest
ground, so proper and effective insulation for the anode cap, flyback line, and
flyback casing is essential. If the insulation is faulty or substandard, then
you will have an arc problem during operation. The final arc-snap that's
mentioned happens when the final arc uses the air as a bridge to ground through
the insulation towards a critical part on any of the circuit boards, destroying
it and causing more damage to the TV, possibly disabling it completely and
creating a new problem in the process.

If you've wondered why the inside of a picture tube must be a perfect vaccum,
this is why. Any air that's inside the picture tube will act as a bridge for
high voltage electricity and will make the anode feed arc to the nearest ground
inside the picture tube instead of properly powering it.

This kind of problem really requires proper servicing to correct it reliably
and safely.
The set should not be used ever again until the problem is corrected. -
Reinhart


Right.

The thing they didn't tell you over time with arcing and hissing, etc.
The arc is very hot temps (this reason arcs looks bluish molecules it
get excited are is very HOT to glow blue) and will carbonize the paths
arc takes and will finally stay this way (snap snap snap! Pow! POP! TV
dies.) and may take a part out or overload the flyback and kill it or
burn out the HOT. Seen this happen *many* times. Often the final
kill happened so fast that you hardly blink and utter "huh?".

Get it fixed while it's good! :-)

Cheers,

Wizard
  #20   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"Asimov" wrote in message
...
"half_pint" bravely wrote to "All" (25 Jul 04 20:29:45)
--- on the heady topic of " TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling

noise,
arcing."

ha From: "half_pint"
ha Actually though something does appear to have affected the
ha inside of the plastic back casing of the TV making it sticky
ha particularly around the area near the anode cap. I presume
ha this has been caused by ozone.
ha I took the back off to let more air get in, I think maybe I should
ha put it back on tho keep the ozone in.
ha Anyway humidity is 82% at the moment and the tude is fizzling
ha away quite merrily.(sounds like there is a wasp in there!!).
ha Also as I smoke 20 a day maybe all that tar will protect my
ha lungs from the ozone? Smoking may also have something to
ha do with the black sticky stuff on the plastic, or it may be
ha plastic attacked by ozone. I wouldn't say I can particularly
ha smell ozone in the room, certaintly not as much as during
ha a thundersorm anyway but it is more of a concern than my
ha TV packing up anyway.

I agree. I don't think you can smell ozone if you smoke 20 coffin
nails a day. I also agree the goo inside you TV is very likely tar.
The oily combustion products from the burning tobacco tend to condense
on every surface they land on. It gives everything in the room a nice
yellow film just like on your fingers.

If I bring say a clock radio from your room into a non-smoker's house
it will reek of tobacco smell to them for months.


And whats wrong with tobacco smell? Its a far nicer smell than many
of the other odours in people houses, food, cheap perfume, body
odour and worse.
How to you manage when someone farts in a lift? Sounds like
a cardiac arrest is on the cards.

You don't even
notice it because you are desensitized in being saturated by it 24/7.
But it's a longshot that the tar in your lungs acts as a protection
against ozone. Don't count on it.


Sounds reasonable to me, after all if they are coated with tar, the
ozone will react with the tar not me.

I noticed me a smoke was much better able to cope with a CS
gas attack than the coughing an spluttering non-smokers. It was
just a bit of fog to me.



I smoked 2 packs a day for over 20 years


I think former smokers are less tolerant of smokers than those
who never smoked.

but finally gave it up after
discovering a couple of shadows in my lung xrays.


Which were probably completelt unrelated to smoking.

It has now been over
20 years since I last smoked and a clean bill of health. It wasn't as
hard to quit as my smoker friends made it seem.



It is a lot easier for some than others, depending on a lot of factors.

You say it was easy to quit yet you didn't quit untill you got a
"quit or die" message it seems.


On a (ciggarette?) lighter note my TV was crackling quite a bit when
I switched it on, it also had a high pitched 'tone' from it.
Both seem to have died down now though (tone gone totally),
not meant to be as humid either (64%)



ha However I will have a go at cleaming the cap up a bit when
ha I am feeking braver, apparently the voltages are less dangerous
ha than they sound but I will not be taking any chances.
ha Apparently a bit of insulating tape might come in handy.
ha Beats me why these caps are metal anyway, I assume they are,
ha it would seem to be more sennsible to make them plactic coated.

ha Also is the back of the tube glass or metalic? I assume it is
ha glass but I and not 100%

ha Actually the noise has been a bit louder, and I checked
ha the humidity, its up to 88%.

ha Actually the noise was beginning to annoy me so I through
ha caution to the wind and stuck a couple layers of
ha sticky insulating tape over the offending area, result:- silence.
ha Or near silence anyway, I will do a proper clean up on it
ha tomorrow.

ha Well that has saved me #50 for the time being anyway,
ha humidity still 88%.

Alcohol is a good cleaning solution for this purpose. Try and get the
99% variety at the pharmacy. After the glass and cup are clean,
inspect the HV cup for damage such as carbonization. Any trace of a
track means it should be replaced. Then smear HV dielectric or spark
plug grease all over the inside of the cup before reconnecting it to
the CRT dimple. This will keep the air from getting under the cap and
causing short circuiting to ground. Some folk use hv rtv, or ordinary
car axle grease or engine oil but all that just seems too messy.

A*s*i*m*o*v

... High Voltage Electronics: Life's a glitch, then you fry.





  #21   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"b" wrote in message
m...
"half_pint" wrote in message

)
Mind you, I can only put it on standby, unless I unplug it and
lose all the stations. The on-off switch on the main set doesnt
appear to work! (nasty combination eh?). I think standby
switches off the HT though so I should be ok.


This is another inexpensive fix. replace backup battery on main board
which enables settings to be stored.


I don't think it has a battery, but it may keep the settings for a while,
I forget.

As for the dodgy remote, keep
your original (slightly faulty) in a safe place for occasional (but
impoortant) things like, say, the menu and tuning, but for day to day
use (changing vol, channels etc) use a cheapo universal one (round
here you can get them for about 5 euros!).


Sounds like a good idea if i can find one compatible (which i shjould)
will also be handy when I lose the other remote.

As regards the HT crackling, take the advice that has been given you
and don't use the set


What no TV - not a chance!!!
I just hope it goes when the shops are open so I can get that
cheap portable I had my eye on!

until it has been done properly. Simple as that!

B



  #22   Report Post  
Jason D.
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


And why is the outside of the cap high tension, is it because of the
black stuff or is the cap perished?


Unplug the tv and discharge the high voltage as instructed. Clean the
rubber cap and around it to see damage better. You will find very
tiny pinhole or a arc track (by the carbonization) in that rubber or
under that rubber that HV managed to work itself out and go zzzzt
noise. Then remove cup by getting both sides of cup up and squeezing
the clip with screwdriver to get one barb over the anode cavity lip
then another barb will be easier to come free.

The rubber cup (cap) is replaceable. We sometimes have to do this for
any reasons. Ask for one from used pull especially one from recent
RCA. A good tech shop should keep leftover new stuff like I do
especially when I'm replacing flyback transformer and the HV lead and
cup is susplus and keep extras in a box. This has a metal dished cup
clamping on the wire by rubber tension. Work the little disc out and
pull the wire out. And cut the old one off the HV wire if you have
enough length otherwise get old cup apart (cutting the rubber) if
there's not enough excess length to this HV lead. You want the bare
wire enough for the metal clip. The rest of insulation should be all
the way into the new cup. Lube with silicone dielectric grease to
make pushing wire into new cup easier.
Then put the metal disk same way in and work it in. Want the lip of
rubber to get over that disk, holding it in therefore clamping that
bare wire.

Also clean the new cup and lead, Clean CRT area out to 2" radius from
that anode cavity. 99% alochol is good for this clean up. Put bit of
silicone dielectric grease on that CRT around the anode cavity where
the new cup will contact (just a ring of thin layer will do). Use
washed hands, one handed holding bent back to let you hook one side of
barbs and one clean dull small flat screwdriver in other hand to get
other barb into hole and push it in. Both barbs should be hooked
under that anode cavity. Let go of rubber and massage it to seal
properly. Go carefully.

The HV lead from the flyback transformer is non-removeable.

Cheers,

Wizard



I think I assumed (wrongly) the outside of the cap was ment to be HT.

I am a little more worried now.




underneath is a metal clip that clips into a little metal pot
cast in the glass of the tube. Once you lift the edge it'll be obvious how
to remove it.





(the suction cup
thing) clean the tube well, then smear the rubber with some dielectric
grease you can get at any autoparts store. You need to discharge the

tube
first, just connect a wire to a screwdriver, and connect the other end

to
the metal ground strap around the back of the tube

I am not sure I can find an obvious ground, there is very little metal
visable.
The four corners where the tube attatches to the case seem to have wires
attatched to then, I assume these would be earth?
There is very little other metal to be seem.



The back of the tube is coated with a dark gray conductive coating, there
should be some sort of ground contact that connects to that, often there's

a
metal strap around the back of the tube.



Yes I can see a braided metal strap held round the tube by wires which
appear to connecte to the afore mentioned corners, it helped when I
used a decent light to see with.


Thanks again



  #23   Report Post  
Asimov
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

"half_pint" bravely wrote to "All" (26 Jul 04 19:48:04)
--- on the heady topic of " TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise,
arcing."

ha From: "half_pint"

ha "Asimov" wrote in
ha message ...
"half_pint" bravely wrote to "All" (25 Jul 04 20:29:45)
--- on the heady topic of " TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling
noise, arcing."

If I bring say a clock radio from your room into a non-smoker's house
it will reek of tobacco smell to them for months.


ha And whats wrong with tobacco smell? Its a far nicer smell than many
ha of the other odours in people houses, food, cheap perfume, body
ha odour and worse.

Most non-smokers find "that" residual cigarette smoke smell quite
annoying but in their defense most also like the aroma of a nice pipe
or a great stokey. Can't say I blame them since cigarette tobacco is
highly processed and tampered with, as we all have now learned.


ha How to you manage when someone farts in a lift? Sounds like
ha a cardiac arrest is on the cards.

You don't even
notice it because you are desensitized in being saturated by it 24/7.
But it's a longshot that the tar in your lungs acts as a protection
against ozone. Don't count on it.


ha Sounds reasonable to me, after all if they are coated with tar, the
ha ozone will react with the tar not me.

On the contrary, tar might just as likely weaken the lung's natural
immunity to many pollutants that a non-smoker may deal with well.
Sometimes things that may seem reasonable are in fact the opposite.


ha I noticed me a smoke was much better able to cope with a CS
ha gas attack than the coughing an spluttering non-smokers. It was
ha just a bit of fog to me.

Perhaps your resistance to it just meant a higher tolerance to pain
due to the lung desensitization but perhaps not a higher tolerance to
damage. Recall your very first attempt at smoking likely left you in a
fit of hacking and now you don't notice any irritation when inhaling.
Except of course every morning when you awake you need to cough out
half a lung before you light up or maybe both together. I remember.


I smoked 2 packs a day for over 20 years


ha I think former smokers are less tolerant of smokers than those
ha who never smoked.

I think smokers assume ex-smokers are less tolerant of them. I think
ex-smokers are more positive about the benefits of not smoking and
smokers consider this harping or gloating. In contrast smokers are
more self-destructive and hyper-defensive about their nicotine
addiction. It's very similar to a drug addict that will do anything to
get their fix. You won't win this argument! ;-)


but finally gave it up after
discovering a couple of shadows in my lung xrays.


ha Which were probably completelt unrelated to smoking.

Are you a qualified oncologist or was that just a haunch?


It has now been over
20 years since I last smoked and a clean bill of health. It wasn't as
hard to quit as my smoker friends made it seem.



ha It is a lot easier for some than others, depending on a lot of
ha factors.
ha You say it was easy to quit yet you didn't quit untill you got a
ha "quit or die" message it seems.

True but I had quit before that for about a year but got back to
smoking because of my friends when drinking or whatever occasion.
People don't really consider the highly addictive nature of nicotine.
I once heard a psychotropic drug expert state in studies of heroin
addicts who smoked that when given a choice they would rather go
without the heroin than without the nicotine. This clearly hints at
just how strong the nicotine addiction can be for some. But it isn't
equally as strong for everybody as there are degrees of vulnerability.


ha On a (ciggarette?) lighter note my TV was crackling quite a bit when
ha I switched it on, it also had a high pitched 'tone' from it.
ha Both seem to have died down now though (tone gone totally),
ha not meant to be as humid either (64%)

No doubt, humid air will conduct electricity better than dry air. I
don't care about the whining TV. TV's are cheap. It is the ozone you
should worry about, it tends to damage other things in the room
besides your lungs.

A*s*i*m*o*v


.... I know flyback, ultor, and 47 other dangerous words.

  #24   Report Post  
L. Fiar
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

"half_pint" wrote...

Well that may be a more compelling reason to get it fixed, or
dump it and get a new one. I doubt it is cost effective to have
someone repair it.
I would probably have replacedit were it not for the fact that
the shops I visited contained almost exclusively widescreen
sets (Which I detest). Maybe I will go for a large second
hand standard 'proper' TV.


How big do you want?
If you have a Co-Op near you, they seem to be selling TVs and combos at a
reasonable price. My local electrical stores cannot compete with Co-Op on
price.



  #25   Report Post  
bloggs
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.

you may also notice an odour/smell from the back?
when the high voltage burns the air it produces ozone....

dust is attracted to eht & dust attracts & moisture can cause eht
leakage...

i would just try cleaning/dusting around the crt hv lead (no cleaning
liquids just a non conductive duster etc.

we used to 'seal' leaks using silicone..this may only mask the problem?
if you take to back off the tv and turn it on provided the room is
dark...you might be able to see the eht leak?

just remember the fault could be from an excess of eht!
BEWARE!

good luck!
"half_pint" wrote in message
...
I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes from.

I only get this in hot weather I think, patricularly humid weather,
opening a window and letting cold air in seems to stop/reduce
the noise.

Any ideas, would brushing away the 'dust' help? (Actually
some of the dust seems to have been 'burnt away by the arcing).

Sorry if the techinical terms are not very technical, and spelling is
bad (in a hurry).

--
half_pint.






  #26   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"bloggs" wrote in message
...
you may also notice an odour/smell from the back?
when the high voltage burns the air it produces ozone....

Not really, I smoke and I don't think there is much ozone


dust is attracted to eht & dust attracts & moisture can cause eht
leakage...

i would just try cleaning/dusting around the crt hv lead (no cleaning
liquids just a non conductive duster etc.


Smoke makes the dust sticky!!

we used to 'seal' leaks using silicone..this may only mask the problem?
if you take to back off the tv and turn it on provided the room is
dark...you might be able to see the eht leak?


Yes I could see it, tiny blue lights, looked pretty, link
a minnitued thunder storm.


just remember the fault could be from an excess of eht!
BEWARE!


Yes I was also thinking that!! And I wondered if 'fixing' it
might make it worse, by allowing the ht to discharge into
the air I may be safer!!
I put some tape over it which helped, but sometimes I
get a high pitched 'whistle' now.




good luck!
"half_pint" wrote in message
...
I have a TV which has the above problem.
The picture and sound are fine, prefect however
I get the above noise from the back of the tube (sometimes).

The noise originates from where the big high tension cable
attaches to the tube, on the back near the top (not the
thin neck but the big dome 'bit'.

There is like a big round 'sucker' (plunger shaped thing)
where it atttaches to the tube, this has a lot of (well a fair bit of)
black 'dust' on. I can see some blue 'arcing' on the 'sucker type'
thing which the cable is attached too. this is where the niose comes

from.

I only get this in hot weather I think, patricularly humid weather,
opening a window and letting cold air in seems to stop/reduce
the noise.

Any ideas, would brushing away the 'dust' help? (Actually
some of the dust seems to have been 'burnt away by the arcing).

Sorry if the techinical terms are not very technical, and spelling is
bad (in a hurry).

--
half_pint.






  #27   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"Asimov" wrote in message
...
"half_pint" bravely wrote to "All" (26 Jul 04 19:48:04)
--- on the heady topic of " TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling

noise,
arcing."

ha From: "half_pint"

ha "Asimov" wrote in
ha message ...
"half_pint" bravely wrote to "All" (25 Jul 04 20:29:45)
--- on the heady topic of " TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling
noise, arcing."

If I bring say a clock radio from your room into a non-smoker's house
it will reek of tobacco smell to them for months.


ha And whats wrong with tobacco smell? Its a far nicer smell than many
ha of the other odours in people houses, food, cheap perfume, body
ha odour and worse.

Most non-smokers find "that" residual cigarette smoke smell quite
annoying but in their defense most also like the aroma of a nice pipe
or a great stokey. Can't say I blame them since cigarette tobacco is
highly processed and tampered with, as we all have now learned.


ha How to you manage when someone farts in a lift? Sounds like
ha a cardiac arrest is on the cards.

You don't even
notice it because you are desensitized in being saturated by it 24/7.
But it's a longshot that the tar in your lungs acts as a protection
against ozone. Don't count on it.


ha Sounds reasonable to me, after all if they are coated with tar, the
ha ozone will react with the tar not me.

On the contrary, tar might just as likely weaken the lung's natural
immunity to many pollutants that a non-smoker may deal with well.
Sometimes things that may seem reasonable are in fact the opposite.



I am of the opinion that non-smokers tend to take more time off
work with colds etc (so my boss told me anyway, but being a smoker
himself maybe he was biased).
I also find asthma and hey fever suffers tend to non-smokers.


ha I noticed me a smoke was much better able to cope with a CS
ha gas attack than the coughing an spluttering non-smokers. It was
ha just a bit of fog to me.

Perhaps your resistance to it just meant a higher tolerance to pain
due to the lung desensitization but perhaps not a higher tolerance to
damage. Recall your very first attempt at smoking likely left you in a
fit of hacking and now you don't notice any irritation when inhaling.
Except of course every morning when you awake you need to cough out
half a lung before you light up or maybe both together. I remember.


I don't cough up anything in the morning, and I don;t start the day with
a cigarette, at least not untill after breakfast with a cup of tea.


I smoked 2 packs a day for over 20 years


ha I think former smokers are less tolerant of smokers than those
ha who never smoked.

I think smokers assume ex-smokers are less tolerant of them. I think
ex-smokers are more positive about the benefits of not smoking and
smokers consider this harping or gloating. In contrast smokers are
more self-destructive and hyper-defensive about their nicotine
addiction. It's very similar to a drug addict that will do anything to
get their fix. You won't win this argument! ;-)


Personally I think a lot of ex-smokers are jealous especially when
the waft of nicoteen starts the craving in their brain again.



but finally gave it up after
discovering a couple of shadows in my lung xrays.


ha Which were probably completelt unrelated to smoking.

Are you a qualified oncologist or was that just a haunch?



Well non-smokers also have health problems too and there is
nothing to suggest smoking was a cause. If it was the big C
quiting smoking would have made sod all difference anyway,
in my opinon, the horse has already bolted.



It has now been over
20 years since I last smoked and a clean bill of health. It wasn't as
hard to quit as my smoker friends made it seem.



ha It is a lot easier for some than others, depending on a lot of
ha factors.
ha You say it was easy to quit yet you didn't quit untill you got a
ha "quit or die" message it seems.

True but I had quit before that for about a year but got back to
smoking because of my friends when drinking or whatever occasion.
People don't really consider the highly addictive nature of nicotine.
I once heard a psychotropic drug expert state in studies of heroin
addicts who smoked that when given a choice they would rather go
without the heroin than without the nicotine. This clearly hints at
just how strong the nicotine addiction can be for some. But it isn't
equally as strong for everybody as there are degrees of vulnerability.



Agreed about the addictive nature of tobacco.

I did much to my surprise, quit for a full week once (never managed
a single day before) all was going fine untill I went out for a drink at
the weekend with friends in a pub with smokers in. I just caved in,
even though prior to that after the first couple of day, it was much
easier than I had imagined.

I had found that I would get cravings but I found that the craving
would go away again quite quickly, rather than persist, once I
realised this it was fairly easy quitting, untill that fate full night
when I bought a pack.
Unfortunately I didn't smoke them all so there were still some left
the next morning!!
You know the rest, I have never stopped since.

Making the decision to stop is acctually the hardest part. Then you need
a mechanism for coping with things like going out for a drink (which
unfortunately I didn't have).



ha On a (ciggarette?) lighter note my TV was crackling quite a bit when
ha I switched it on, it also had a high pitched 'tone' from it.
ha Both seem to have died down now though (tone gone totally),
ha not meant to be as humid either (64%)

No doubt, humid air will conduct electricity better than dry air. I
don't care about the whining TV. TV's are cheap. It is the ozone you
should worry about, it tends to damage other things in the room
besides your lungs.


I don't think there is much ozone, after all I can smell the ozone from
a thunder storm, but not from my TV, even when I am in the house.


A*s*i*m*o*v


... I know flyback, ultor, and 47 other dangerous words.



  #28   Report Post  
half_pint
 
Posts: n/a
Default TV tube, hissing, fizzling crackling noise, arcing.


"b" wrote in message
om...
"half_pint" wrote in message



I don't think it has a battery, but it may keep the settings for a

while,
I forget.


99% of sets have a battery or cap for memory. If it keeps the settings
for only a while then it clearly needs replacing.That's all there is
to it.


Well I have had a good look and there is no battery so I can't
replace it. It must be one of the other 1%, it was very cheap set.


(snip)
As regards the HT crackling, take the advice that has been given you
and don't use the set


What no TV - not a chance!!!
I just hope it goes when the shops are open so I can get that
cheap portable I had my eye on!


If you don't want to take the advice then don't bother posting to
usenet. we don't say these things for the good of our health you know,
it is to SAVE YOU MONEY (and avoid the possible risks with high
voltage arcing). If you want to simply ditch your existing set and buy
another then go on and do it. Why the hell do you waste our time
asking us to help solve your problems then ignoring the responses?


I do appreciate the advice that has been given, but it is advice not an
order.

In my opinion it is not dangerous to use the set and basically it has been
fine for several days now. I don't particularly see how buying a new set
or having it repaired professionally will save me money, it won't.

The advice given and a bit of googling was enough for me to make
a repair which is 'good enough for me', and I thank everyone who has
replied most sincerely.

Learning a bit more about the problem was just as rewarding as finding
a solution which suits me.

If my sets explodes I will let you know, if I die of ozone posioning I
doubt I will get the chance.


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