Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.


Not good.





Gareth.

On 04/03/2016 20:07, Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has
become stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the
Combi.


Not good.





Gareth.







Or is it like the more common problem of tips , 2.5/3.5mm jacks stuck in
headphone sockets, due to lack of strong metal these days in the neck
part, preceeding the tip, to resist normal contact forces?

"N_Cook" wrote in message ...

On 04/03/2016 20:07, Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has
become stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the
Combi.


Not good.





Gareth.







Or is it like the more common problem of tips , 2.5/3.5mm jacks stuck in
headphone sockets, due to lack of strong metal these days in the neck
part, preceeding the tip, to resist normal contact forces?





No, I have first hand experience of putting more than one of these cheap
jacks into more than one Neutrik Combi and them getting stuck, after
removing 3 that had got stuck via a customer.

On another occasion a Focusrite pre-amp had a tip stuck in the socket.
There is a small hole in the back of the Combi where you can insert a tool
to push out the jack, but there was no way it was going to budge without
damage.




Gareth.

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.




I think you missed the point.


The Neutrik Combi works fine usually.

Cheap jack plugs don't usually get stuck in any sort of jack socket.

Except there are increasing numbers now of cheap jacks that ONLY get stuck
in a Neutrik Combi socket.



Gareth.

On 14/03/2016 23:50, Gareth Magennis wrote:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work
just fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or
the jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.




I think you missed the point.


The Neutrik Combi works fine usually.

Cheap jack plugs don't usually get stuck in any sort of jack socket.

Except there are increasing numbers now of cheap jacks that ONLY get
stuck in a Neutrik Combi socket.



Gareth.


Is the tip connector,in the Neutrik, transverse to the axis of the jack
or parallel to the jack axis?

On 14/03/2016 23:50, Gareth Magennis wrote:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work
just fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or
the jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.




I think you missed the point.


The Neutrik Combi works fine usually.

Cheap jack plugs don't usually get stuck in any sort of jack socket.

Except there are increasing numbers now of cheap jacks that ONLY get
stuck in a Neutrik Combi socket.



Gareth.


This reminds me, last week , another example of wrecked phono sockets on
a powered speaker.
People buy nice gold coloured , gold plated , connectors on blingey
leads and pay over the odds for them. But the phono jacks are crap, the
ground connector is a solid ring, no axial cuts to them, so they jam or
even friction weld to any socket attched to , at some point when
temperature or something is just right

"N_Cook" wrote in message ...

On 14/03/2016 23:50, Gareth Magennis wrote:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work
just fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or
the jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.




I think you missed the point.


The Neutrik Combi works fine usually.

Cheap jack plugs don't usually get stuck in any sort of jack socket.

Except there are increasing numbers now of cheap jacks that ONLY get
stuck in a Neutrik Combi socket.



Gareth.


Is the tip connector,in the Neutrik, transverse to the axis of the jack
or parallel to the jack axis?






I haven't studied the reasons why these get stuck, other than to observe the
jacks that do seem to have a more triangular tip than usual. (i.e. sharper
angles at the base)




I seem to remember reading somewhere that there actually isn't any sort of
International "standard" for 1/4 inch jack plug design.

Is this (still) true?

Gareth.

Gareth Magennis wrote:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.




I think you missed the point.


The Neutrik Combi works fine usually.

Cheap jack plugs don't usually get stuck in any sort of jack socket.

Except there are increasing numbers now of cheap jacks that ONLY get stuck
in a Neutrik Combi socket.

This is my point. Do-all devics are compromises and clearly this product
sort of sucks, or hasn't been tested at all. Either way it still sucks,
apparently.

I use some neutrik connectors and for single purpose use they're very well
made so I'm a bit surprised by this problem.

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.




I think you missed the point.


The Neutrik Combi works fine usually.

Cheap jack plugs don't usually get stuck in any sort of jack socket.

Except there are increasing numbers now of cheap jacks that ONLY get stuck
in a Neutrik Combi socket.

This is my point. Do-all devics are compromises and clearly this product
sort of sucks, or hasn't been tested at all. Either way it still sucks,
apparently.

I use some neutrik connectors and for single purpose use they're very well
made so I'm a bit surprised by this problem.




It is not at all clear whether the problem lies with the Neutrik Combi, or
the possibly badly designed/made cheap jack plug.

Probably it is a combination of both, being, as I currently believe, there
is no standard for jack plug/socket dimensions or tip profiles.



Gareth.

On 15/03/2016 22:39, Gareth Magennis wrote:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message ...

Gareth Magennis wrote:
Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has
become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as
usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.

It's not surprising combination connectors sort of suck in practice. That
jack looks about on par with a chinese travel plug adapter.




I think you missed the point.


The Neutrik Combi works fine usually.

Cheap jack plugs don't usually get stuck in any sort of jack socket.

Except there are increasing numbers now of cheap jacks that ONLY get
stuck
in a Neutrik Combi socket.

This is my point. Do-all devics are compromises and clearly this product
sort of sucks, or hasn't been tested at all. Either way it still sucks,
apparently.

I use some neutrik connectors and for single purpose use they're very well
made so I'm a bit surprised by this problem.




It is not at all clear whether the problem lies with the Neutrik Combi,
or the possibly badly designed/made cheap jack plug.

Probably it is a combination of both, being, as I currently believe,
there is no standard for jack plug/socket dimensions or tip profiles.



Gareth.






Maybe there is a type of jack that is marketed as less likely to pull
out of sockets, when gyrating about on stage or something. I'd have
thought the H&S argument was to have them less likely to pull over a
speaker stack, but who knows.

On Tue, 15 Mar 2016 09:11:28 -0000, "Gareth Magennis"
wrote:



"N_Cook" wrote in message ...

On 14/03/2016 23:50, Gareth Magennis wrote:
snip

I haven't studied the reasons why these get stuck, other than to observe the
jacks that do seem to have a more triangular tip than usual. (i.e. sharper
angles at the base)




I seem to remember reading somewhere that there actually isn't any sort of
International "standard" for 1/4 inch jack plug design.

Is this (still) true?

EIA-453 describes the plug hardware. Was never adopted by ANSI. IEC
standards for similar hardware specifies the metric versions.

RL

On Fri, 4 Mar 2016 20:07:16 -0000, "Gareth Magennis"
wrote:

Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.


Not good.

Most likely due to poor quality control in plug mfr. 'Normally' you'd
expect to see the broken tip connector still attached to the central
conductor, which holds the whole shebang together with a single swage
in the wire connection area. It's a single piece. You shouldn't be
able to break this into two pieces with manual extraction forces. A
'grabby' socket terminal would distort and crumple first.

Equipment vendors will often add an advisory in their users manual to
use only parts complying to the standards, or mention specific mfrs
brand types. Sockets are not manufactured to deal with this type of
failure.

This is a simple plug and socket.

European standard is IEC60603-11.

You might mention the brand name or source of the broken part, so that
others can avoid it, rather than running down Neutrix. The latter are
exhorbitantly priced, but they work.

RL

"legg" wrote in message news
On Fri, 4 Mar 2016 20:07:16 -0000, "Gareth Magennis"
wrote:

Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.


Not good.

Most likely due to poor quality control in plug mfr. 'Normally' you'd
expect to see the broken tip connector still attached to the central
conductor, which holds the whole shebang together with a single swage
in the wire connection area. It's a single piece. You shouldn't be
able to break this into two pieces with manual extraction forces. A
'grabby' socket terminal would distort and crumple first.

Equipment vendors will often add an advisory in their users manual to
use only parts complying to the standards, or mention specific mfrs
brand types. Sockets are not manufactured to deal with this type of
failure.

This is a simple plug and socket.

European standard is IEC60603-11.

You might mention the brand name or source of the broken part, so that
others can avoid it, rather than running down Neutrix. The latter are
exhorbitantly priced, but they work.

RL




That's the problem though, these cheap jacks are unbranded ****e, poorly
made.
I am not trying to run down Neutrik, I know how good their products are, I
personally don't use any other brand.


Problem also is, these cheap jacks make Neutrik look like the sole problem
since they don't get stuck elsewhere.



Gareth.

In article , N_Cook wrote:

This reminds me, last week , another example of wrecked phono sockets on
a powered speaker.
People buy nice gold coloured , gold plated , connectors on blingey
leads and pay over the odds for them. But the phono jacks are crap, the
ground connector is a solid ring, no axial cuts to them, so they jam ...

High friction level + meaty connector body + fat "oxygen free" triple-
plaited silver-loaded wire.

Great combination. Requires lots of insertion force AND provides lots
of angular pull once in ... leading to the phono sockets breaking
free of the PCB.

Money well spent.

--
--------------------------------------+------------------------------------
Mike Brown: mjb[-at-]signal11.org.uk | http://www.signal11.org.uk

On Wed, 16 Mar 2016 18:34:37 -0000, "Gareth Magennis"
wrote:



"legg" wrote in message news
On Fri, 4 Mar 2016 20:07:16 -0000, "Gareth Magennis"
wrote:

Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.


Not good.

Most likely due to poor quality control in plug mfr. 'Normally' you'd
expect to see the broken tip connector still attached to the central
conductor, which holds the whole shebang together with a single swage
in the wire connection area. It's a single piece. You shouldn't be
able to break this into two pieces with manual extraction forces. A
'grabby' socket terminal would distort and crumple first.

Equipment vendors will often add an advisory in their users manual to
use only parts complying to the standards, or mention specific mfrs
brand types. Sockets are not manufactured to deal with this type of
failure.

This is a simple plug and socket.

European standard is IEC60603-11.

You might mention the brand name or source of the broken part, so that
others can avoid it, rather than running down Neutrix. The latter are
exhorbitantly priced, but they work.

RL




That's the problem though, these cheap jacks are unbranded ****e, poorly
made.
I am not trying to run down Neutrik, I know how good their products are, I
personally don't use any other brand.


Problem also is, these cheap jacks make Neutrik look like the sole problem
since they don't get stuck elsewhere.



Gareth.

Bite each one to test, before paying?

Better than getting bitten.

RL

This issue with 'cheap' vs neutrik:

You should all be aware, by now, that these connectors are all made
in China - that difference in price is solely a distribution and sales
issue - that quality is either demonstrated or not by the product
itself - associated by trade brand name.

Therefor; there's no point in complaining about the quality of a part
without identifying its brand name or mfr. Without this info, the
warning is meaningless, because price is no longer a valid identifier.

As an example, recent Neutrik connector types, not commonly stocked
domestically, were ordered at $25 a pop and delivered from Shuersi
Inc in Nanjing. Not cheap, good quality, reputable brand name from
China.

Expecting these things to be manufactured by gnomes in Luxembourg is
pure fantasy.

RL


On Wed, 16 Mar 2016 18:34:37 -0000, "Gareth Magennis"
wrote:


"legg" wrote in message news
On Fri, 4 Mar 2016 20:07:16 -0000, "Gareth Magennis"
wrote:

Hmm, this might be a problem.

Have come across a couple of cases now where a cheap jack plug has become
stuck in a Neutrik combi socket.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/combo-i-series/


It looks like the cheap jack plug tips are not quite as rounded as usual.
This means that they get stuck fast in the Combi, though they work just
fine
in other jack sockets.


If you force them out, the tip of the jack will just not get past the
connector, but instead will just take it with it and destroy it, or the
jack
tip becomes separated from it's body and is left embedded in the Combi.


Not good.

Most likely due to poor quality control in plug mfr. 'Normally' you'd
expect to see the broken tip connector still attached to the central
conductor, which holds the whole shebang together with a single swage
in the wire connection area. It's a single piece. You shouldn't be
able to break this into two pieces with manual extraction forces. A
'grabby' socket terminal would distort and crumple first.

Equipment vendors will often add an advisory in their users manual to
use only parts complying to the standards, or mention specific mfrs
brand types. Sockets are not manufactured to deal with this type of
failure.

This is a simple plug and socket.

European standard is IEC60603-11.

You might mention the brand name or source of the broken part, so that
others can avoid it, rather than running down Neutrix. The latter are
exhorbitantly priced, but they work.

RL




That's the problem though, these cheap jacks are unbranded ****e, poorly
made.
I am not trying to run down Neutrik, I know how good their products are, I
personally don't use any other brand.


Problem also is, these cheap jacks make Neutrik look like the sole problem
since they don't get stuck elsewhere.



Gareth.