Dishwasher problems
 

I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate, (buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor. I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again. I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand really sucks... Thanks, Lenny

Dishwasher problems
 

wrote in message
...
I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that
has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer
type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to
wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate,
(buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then
running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what
sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this
was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and
then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never
turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the
impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to
investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor.
I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a
scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this
point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the
motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer
any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set
the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal
wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each
instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck
impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason
for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy
soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of
the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I
then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the
door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying
that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that
the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from
somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a
couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again.
I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled
anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload
has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize
that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a
pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used
it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but
it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual
for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand
really sucks... Thanks, Lenny

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I had that once and it turned out to be a small piece of broken glass that
was jamming the pump. It was very hard to find.

Dishwasher problems
 

On Monday, June 29, 2015 at 12:30:02 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate, (buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor. I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again. I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand really sucks... Thanks, Lenny

I forgot to mention that the motor impeller now turns freely. Lenny

Dishwasher problems
 

wrote:

I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate, (buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor. I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again. I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand really sucks... Thanks, Lenny

Have you looked on the Sears parts site?

http://www.searspartsdirect.com/part...t/user-manuals

Dishwasher problems
 

On Mon, 29 Jun 2015 09:29:59 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool)
(...)
Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from somewhere
in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a couple of seconds,
and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again. I should mention as
well that throughout all of this I've never smelled anything burning, which
is hopefully a good thing.

Are you sure that whatever was stuck was in the pump rather than in
the motor? Offhand, it sounds like a cracked brush. Actually, I'm
not even sure if the 665.1661591 motor uses brushes. I couldn't find
any details on the motor. However, if it's really old, it probably
uses brushes.

Turn off the lights and fire it up in the dark. You should be able to
see where the arcing is coming from.

When it was working, did it take forever to drain? If so, the drain
pump is probably full of debris and junk. That seems to be the most
common "failure".

Incidentally, I've only fixed 5 dishwashers so far. Every time I've
tried to be clever and just fix the problem, I end up taking it apart
and putting it back together at least three times. To many things can
go wrong. The last two dishwashers I fixed, I insisted that I tear it
apart, and replace everything that MIGHT have failed or look like they
will soon fail. I only had to work on those once. I don't use my
Frigidaire much, but it's at least 40+ years old and has been
"rebuilt" twice so far.


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Dishwasher problems
 

On Monday, June 29, 2015 at 12:30:02 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate, (buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor. I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again. I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand really sucks... Thanks, Lenny

I thought these were induction motors. I didn't think about brushes. From the ones I've seen at the dump they don't seem to be rated very high in HP. The motor in mine from what I can recall seemed to have about a million wires on it. No, draining is no problem, when it drains that is.. I did also read something about that drain clog issue on another site but I don't think that's a problem here. That's good idea about turning off the lights Jeff. I'll try that tonight. Lenny

Dishwasher problems
 

Dishwasher problems
 

On Monday, June 29, 2015 at 12:30:02 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate, (buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor. I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again. I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand really sucks... Thanks, Lenny

That's right but that's because the motor is not running. Lenny

Dishwasher problems
 

On Monday, June 29, 2015 at 11:08:32 AM UTC-7, wrote:

I thought these were induction motors. I didn't think about brushes.

Usually, the dishwasher motor runs forward to agitate and spray inside the
box, then the same motor runs backward to empty the water out. So, they
usually are reversed by swapping the brush connections.
Examine the motor carefully: if it gets wet, that can cause your difficulties
(and it would mean a seal needs replacement).

Dishwasher problems
 

wrote in message
...

I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that
has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer
type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to
wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate,
(buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then
running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what
sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this
was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and
then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never
turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the
impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to
investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor.
I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a
scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this
point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the
motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer
any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set
the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal
wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each
instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck
impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason
for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy
soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of
the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I
then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the
door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying
that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that
the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from
somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a
couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again.
I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled
anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload
has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize
that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a
pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used
it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but
it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual
for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand
really sucks... Thanks, Lenny


Given the age of the machine it would be good practice to strip the motor
and replace the shaft seal. The fault should be apparent when you can
examine and test the motor.

Dishwasher problems
 

On Monday, June 29, 2015 at 12:30:02 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I have an old Kenmore model 665.1661591 (made by whirlpool) dishwasher that has been acting up for several weeks now. This is an old mechanical timer type of machine with no electronics.

The problems started when I'd load it up, close the door, turn the knob to wash, and at that point you would hear the fill valve solenoid activate, (buzzing noise, the machine would fill, and instead of the motor then running as well, there would be a hum for about 2 seconds followed by what sounded like a "Klixon" overload tripping. After about 40 seconds or so this was followed by another click, (the overload resetting I'm assuming), and then you could repeat the sequence again. The motor however would never turn.

I remover the bottom sprayer and the top of the pump and found that the impeller was jammed. I would have removed the impeller at this point to investigate further but I wasn't able to do that without removing the motor. I don't know what was in there but turning the impeller by hand produced a scraping noise, until whatever was in there was finally driven out. At this point I proceeded very carefully. I closed the door, and made sure that the motor would run, and then opened it and ascertained that there was no longer any obstruction. I then replaced the top of the pump, closed the door, set the timer to wash and then the motor started up and the unit ran a normal wash cycle.

Over the next few weeks this problem repeated two more times. In each instance I was able to again remove the top of the pump and get the stuck impeller freed and "fix" the problem. Seeing as how I'd never found a reason for the gritty stuff that was doing this I just figured that this was grainy soap powder that was collecting in between the impeller and the bottom of the machine and it would eventually completely work it's way out.

The other day I started the machine, listened as it filled, confirmed that I then heard the motor run and left it to finish. When we later opened the door the unit was full of water, the second soap drawer was open, signifying that the machine went through a complete cycle, however it was apparent that the motor had quit somewhere in between.

Now when I try to run it there is an arcing type of noise coming from somewhere in the machine, accompanied by the room lights flickering for a couple of seconds, and then what sounds like the Klixon tripping out again. I should mention as well that throughout all of this I've never smelled anything burning, which is hopefully a good thing.

Perhaps this is wishful thinking but what is the chance that the overload has been repeatedly stressed to the point where it has now failed? I realize that it could also be an arcing door switch or a timer contact as well.

These things always had a little service manual for the repair man in a pouch inside the door. I know that originally it did have one because I used it many years ago to diagnose a bad door switch, however I looked for it but it's missing. Does anyone have any ideas, tips or access to a service manual for this unit by any chance? I had forgotten how much washing dishes by hand really sucks... Thanks, Lenny

Last night I pulled the access panel at the bottom in the front and with the room lights out turned the timer to on. There was a brief shower of sparks that came from the left rear of the machine followed by the familiar click.So it seems that what I've been hearing apparently isn't a thermal protector for the motor after all because it's not mounted on the motor. And the "click" afterwards rather than just being an arcing connection suggests some kind of toasted circuit breaker. Hopefully it's just that. I'm going to pull the washer out today and have a better look.

I'm going to guess that I installed this machine between 1997 and 2000. It's a Kenmore "Ultrawash", equivalent to some similar no electronics Whirlpool model. In fact at the time I think that it was if not the last, then one of the last no electronics models available. That was what sold me on it.

Let me see what this looks like once I get it out. I think that I should be able to manually fill it and work on it out on the deck. I'll let you guys know. Lenny

Dishwasher problems
 

Dishwasher problems
 

Baron wrote:



The drain pump and the wash pump are two separate motors !

Captain Video said this one had no electronics, and a mechanical timer. So,
it has to be SERIOUSLY old! All the old ones had a single motor/pump that
was reversed to do both functions. Even our much newer one with electronic
controls only has one pump/motor assembly.

Jon

Dishwasher problems
 

Dishwasher problems
 

Hi Jon,

Jon Elson prodded the keyboard with:

Baron wrote:



The drain pump and the wash pump are two separate motors !

Captain Video said this one had no electronics, and a mechanical
timer. So, it has to be SERIOUSLY old! All the old ones had a
single motor/pump that was reversed to do both functions. Even our
much newer one with electronic controls only has one pump/motor
assembly.

Jon

Ours is a Philips "Wirlpool" dishwasher, UK made, it has a separate
drain pump. The main motor is a two pole induction one.

The only one that I've ever seen with a single motor would have been
30 years old or more, and that had a weird rubber flap valve with a
peg on it that was moved in one direction or the other by the
impellor blades themselves. The valve opened the drain port when
pushed one way and blocked it off when pushed the other.

The problem with this arangement was that if debris held the flap away
from the drain port, was that the machine would very slowly empty
itself.

--
Best Regards:
Baron.