Speakers and wire length
 

Phil, you are reading what you want to see, not what I actually wrote.

Speakers and wire length
 

On Thu, 3 Apr 2014 07:40:28 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:


It was /never/ defined that way.

The bel is the logarithm (to the base 10) of a power ratio.
Decibels are ten times that.

Errm, 1/10_th surely.

Speakers and wire length
 

"Bill Gill is a Dill "

The original work on which the system was based was done
by seeing what was the smallest increase in sound level that
could be detected by the human ear.

** ********.


quote (from Wikipedia)
The decibel originates from methods used to quantify reductions in
audio levels in telephone circuits. These losses were originally
measured in units of Miles of Standard Cable (MSC), where 1 MSC
corresponded to the loss of power over a 1 mile (approximately 1.6 km)
length of standard telephone cable at a frequency of 5000 radians per
second (795.8 Hz), and roughly matched the smallest attenuation
detectable to the average listener.

** ****s up your mad idea.



..... Phil

Speakers and wire length
 

"Black Iccy" wrote in message
...

The bel is the logarithm (to the base 10) of a power ratio.
Decibels are ten times that.

Errm, 1/10_th surely.

Nope. There are ten decibels in one bel.

Speakers and wire length
 

On 4/3/2014 9:25 PM, gregz wrote:
Bill Gill wrote:
On 4/2/2014 8:38 AM, Phil Allison wrote:
"Bill Gill"

It takes ten times the power to seem twice as loud.

Ten times the power is 10 dB, that is 10 times as loud.

** ********.

Most would say it was 2 or maybe 3 times as loud.


Twice as loud would be 3 dB.


** ******** again.

+3dB is only slightly louder.

+1dB is almost unnoticeable.


.... Phil


In one respect you are right +1 dB is just detectable. That is
how it was originally defined. +3dB is twice the power. To my
mind that is twice as loud. +10 dB is 10 times the power. Again
that would be 10 times as loud. Check the math. The calculation
is 10 * log(10) P2/P1.

Bill

Twice as loud should be twice the voltage. Forget power.

Greg

Yes twice as loud would be twice the voltage, but
I was talking power, not voltage. Power and voltage are
closely related. You just have to be sure which one you
are talking about. Since I specifically said that I was
talking power then I am correct. As far as that goes the
voltage ratio in dB is twice the power ratio. That is,
the calculation is 20*log(10)v1/v2, instead of 10*log(10)p1/p2.

Bill

Bill Gill is a Fool
 

"Bill Gill"


** You anencephalic ?

If not - you are doing a spectacular impersonation of one.

Demented chimpanzees have more insight.





..... Phil

Speakers and wire length
 

"Bill Gill" wrote in message ...

The transmission unit (TU) was devised by engineers of the Bell
Telephone Laboratories in the 1920s to replace the MSC. 1 TU
was defined as ten times the base-10 logarithm of the ratio of
measured power to a reference power level.[5] The definitions
were conveniently chosen such that 1 TU approximately equaled
1 MSC (specifically, 1.056 TU = 1 MSC).

This is possible, but it sounds like retroactive justification.

Bill Gill is a Fool
 

On 04/04/2014 06:26 AM, Phil Allison wrote:
"Bill Gill"


** You anencephalic ?

If not - you are doing a spectacular impersonation of one.

Demented chimpanzees have more insight.





.... Phil





I have an in-law named Bill Gill. My daughter's cousin. Austin.

Speakers and wire length
 

On Fri, 4 Apr 2014 05:43:35 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:

The bel is the logarithm (to the base 10) of a power ratio.
Decibels are ten times that.

Errm, 1/10_th surely.

Nope. There are ten decibels in one bel.


My point stands. A decibel is 1/10 of a bel.
That's what I said before. It's NOT what you wrote.

Speakers and wire length
 

On Friday, April 4, 2014 11:01:48 PM UTC-7, Black Iccy wrote:
On Fri, 4 Apr 2014 05:43:35 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"

wrote:



The bel is the logarithm (to the base 10) of a power ratio.

Decibels are ten times that.



Errm, 1/10_th surely.



Nope. There are ten decibels in one bel.





My point stands. A decibel is 1/10 of a bel.

That's what I said before. It's NOT what you wrote.

So, to end this miserable tirade, you Both are saying there are Ten Decibels per Bel, eh...

FUNNY how conversation on Usenet works. . .

Or Not...

Speakers and wire length
 

"Black Iccy"
"William Sommerwerck"


The bel is the logarithm (to the base 10) of a power ratio.
Decibels are ten times that.

Errm, 1/10_th surely.

Nope. There are ten decibels in one bel.


My point stands.


** It falls, like any of your pedantic tripe.


A decibel is 1/10 of a bel.
That's what I said before. It's NOT what you wrote.

** There is an obvious understood word at the end of Bill's remark.

That word is "number".

"Decibels are 10 times that NUMBER".

Given that the "log" of 10 is 1, a power ratio of 10 is 10 decibels or 1
Bell.



..... Phil

Speakers and wire length
 

"Black Iccy" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 4 Apr 2014 05:43:35 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:

The bel is the logarithm (to the base 10) of a power
ratio. Decibels are ten times that.

Errm, 1/10_th surely.

Nope. There are ten decibels in one bel.

My point stands. A decibel is 1/10 of a bel.
That's what I said before. It's NOT what you wrote.

In a rare show of magnanimity, Professor Marvel accepts the criticism.

What I meant to say was that "Decibels are obtained by multiplying bels by
ten." What I wrote was ambiguous.

You caught me on one my pet peeves. Ever seen an FM tuner with the dial
labeled "x 1MHz"? The displayed number is actually the frequency /divided/ by
1MHz.

Bill Gill is a Fool
 

On 4/4/2014 8:26 AM, Phil Allison wrote:
"Bill Gill"


** You anencephalic ?

If not - you are doing a spectacular impersonation of one.

Demented chimpanzees have more insight.





.... Phil




I didn't realize we were in the 2nd grade. Thanks for your
implied agreement with what I said.

Bill

Bill Gill is a Fool
 

"Bill Gill"
Phil Allison wrote:
"Bill Gill"


** You anencephalic ?

If not - you are doing a spectacular impersonation of one.

Demented chimpanzees have more insight.


I didn't realize we were in the 2nd grade.


** You are **** brain - not me.

You need a hand grenade shoved up you ****ing ass.





.... Phil




Thanks for your
implied agreement with what I said.

Bill

Speakers and wire length
 

On 04/05/2014 06:14 AM, William Sommerwerck wrote:
"Black Iccy" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 4 Apr 2014 05:43:35 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:

The bel is the logarithm (to the base 10) of a power
ratio. Decibels are ten times that.

Errm, 1/10_th surely.

Nope. There are ten decibels in one bel.

My point stands. A decibel is 1/10 of a bel.
That's what I said before. It's NOT what you wrote.

In a rare show of magnanimity, Professor Marvel accepts the criticism.

What I meant to say was that "Decibels are obtained by multiplying bels
by ten." What I wrote was ambiguous.

You caught me on one my pet peeves. Ever seen an FM tuner with the dial
labeled "x 1MHz"? The displayed number is actually the frequency
/divided/ by 1MHz.

I like a chart which shows a a range of dB v Voltage at 50 Ohms for
Radio, 8, 4 Ohms for speakers. Hang it up over my bench.

Speakers and wire length
 

On Sat, 5 Apr 2014 06:14:49 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:

In a rare show of magnanimity, Professor Marvel accepts the criticism.

Oh that's alright.
I knew what you meant, just that the wording was ... well...
I just HAD to. Phil is defending you too. Nice one Phil -)

You caught me on one my pet peeves. Ever seen an FM tuner with the dial
labeled "x 1MHz"? The displayed number is actually the frequency /divided/ by
1MHz.

Frayed knot.

Speakers and wire length
 

How is Iccy pronounced? Issy? Icky?

Bill Gill is a Fool
 

On 4/5/2014 8:36 AM, Phil Allison wrote:
"Bill Gill"
Phil Allison wrote:
"Bill Gill"


** You anencephalic ?

If not - you are doing a spectacular impersonation of one.

Demented chimpanzees have more insight.


I didn't realize we were in the 2nd grade.


** You are **** brain - not me.

You need a hand grenade shoved up you ****ing ass.





... Phil




Thanks for your
implied agreement with what I said.

Bill


I don't know. Do you think you can find anybody who would
do that for you? It sounds like an awfully messy way to kill
somebody.

Bill

Speakers and wire length
 

"William Sommer****** = Fool"


You caught me on one my pet peeves. Ever seen an FM tuner with the dial
labeled "x 1MHz"? The displayed number is actually the frequency /divided/
by 1MHz.

** " x 1MHz" = " multiply by 1 MHz "

IOW it is an instruction to the user, not a description.

Same goes for the Ohms ranges on all analogue multimeters.

X1, X10, X100, X1K etc.

Instructions of how to get the value in ohms from the display.

ONLY a completely autistic ****wit like you would not get that immediately.



..... Phil