Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems.

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Old April 14th 13, 08:22 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

On Friday, April 12, 2013 2:40:52 AM UTC-4, Wild_Bill wrote:
I believe Jeff is steering you in the right direction. Worn brushes and

weakened brush springs can lead to intermittent/no contact between the

brushes and the commutator bars.

With something softer than a hammer head (block of wood for example) tap on

the left side, then the right side of the drill motor housing near the top,

tryinng to power the drill after each side is tapped.

If this method results in the motor running, it's liely that the brushes and

springs may need replaced, but cleaning the brush holders may allow

sufficient brush contact.. but the parts may still be required for a proper

repair.



When removing brushes, it's a good practice to keep them apart so they can

be put back in the holder they came out of.. and also to scratch a small

mark on a long side of the brush to indicate the top or end of the motor so

they can be put back in the correct orientation.



Aside from loose connections or brush problems, it appears as though the

motor is turned on/off by a relay on the circuit board. A click noise mat be

noticeable when the start-stop buttons are pressed.

Checking for correct operation of the relay can be performed a couple of

different ways.. definitely check it with the power cord unplugged if you

aren't familiar with working on powered equipment.

If the relay doesn't appear to be reacting to the start-stop buttons, it may

be faulty. If you can desolder the relay to remove it from the board, it can

be checked out-of-circuit with an ohm meter and small power supply or

magnet.



For testing with power applied, only if one is experienced and familiar with

safe testing methods.. using a 120V light bulb instead of the motor,

connected to the circuit board motor leads would allow the relay check to be

performed without the additional concern regarding rotating parts during

testing.



--

Cheers,

WB

.............





wrote in message

...

I have a Hougen Magnetic Drill that is not working.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...pse1f7add1.jpg



The Magnet itself seems to work, but the drill portion doesn't. Not counting

when it turned on a couple of times two days ago, making me think that there

was a possible intermittent break somewhere in the connections.



I opened it up and tinkered with the safety switch adjustment screw, but

that wasn't the problem.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...psf865d83a.jpg



The safety switch is located on the bottom of the drill. The bottom of the

drill must be flat against the metal surface in order for the drill to power

on. (See the two buttons at the bottom):

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps3e32a032.jpg



The third button in the center is I believe also a safety switch that will

cut power to the motor if the drill's magnetic base drifts as much as 1/2".



I assumed that there is nothing wrong with the AC cord because the magnet

portion works, so using my Fluke 79III multimeter on the Ohm setting I

tested the start and the stop buttons. There was activity on the

Multimeter's display screen when I press either, so I assume that there is

no break, at least as far as where those leads connect to the circuit board.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps3495c450.jpg



Would it be plausible to re-flow the solder on the circuit board in case

there is a cold solder joint somewhere?



I can't travel several hours round trip to spend $65 an hour at an

authorized repair location, so any advice on how to proceed would be

appreciated.



Thanks.



Darren Harris

Staten Island, New York.


I did replace the brushes in the same holders they came out of, but *may* have put one or both back in upside down from how they came out.

Also,I only use my multimeters for the basics and don't really know their functions in depth. So I can only note whether or not the display changes and the number read-outs. But not necessarily what they mean unless I'm just measuring AC or DC voltage or something like that.

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

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Old April 14th 13, 08:24 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Help: Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

On Friday, April 12, 2013 8:35:04 AM UTC-4, Michael Terrell wrote:
wrote:



I have a Hougen Magnetic Drill that is not working.


http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...pse1f7add1.jpg



The Magnet itself seems to work, but the drill portion doesn't. Not counting when it turned on a couple of times two days ago, making me think that there was a possible intermittent break somewhere in the connections.




I opened it up and tinkered with the safety switch adjustment screw, but that wasn't the problem.


http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...psf865d83a.jpg




The safety switch is located on the bottom of the drill. The bottom of the drill must be flat against the metal surface in order for the drill to power on. (See the two buttons at the bottom):


http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps3e32a032.jpg




The third button in the center is I believe also a safety switch that will cut power to the motor if the drill's magnetic base drifts as much as 1/2".




I assumed that there is nothing wrong with the AC cord because the magnet portion works, so using my Fluke 79III multimeter on the Ohm setting I tested the start and the stop buttons. There was activity on the Multimeter's display screen when I press either, so I assume that there is no break, at least as far as where those leads connect to the circuit board.


http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps3495c450.jpg




Would it be plausible to re-flow the solder on the circuit board in case there is a cold solder joint somewhere?




I can't travel several hours round trip to spend $65 an hour at an authorized repair location, so any advice on how to proceed would be appreciated.




Thanks.




Darren Harris


Staten Island, New York.






Have you asked on news:rec.crafts.metalworking where there are a

number of people who own these tools?


Yes. And I didn't receive a single response, which is why I posted here. :-)

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
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Old April 15th 13, 04:31 AM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Help: Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

On Sun, 14 Apr 2013 12:17:03 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

Here are the Manuals for my model:
http://www.hougen.com/downloads/10904.pdf
http://www.hougen.com/downloads/misc...structions.pdf
http://www.hougen.com/downloads/misc...aded_spind.pdf


(...)

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps466ba0d6.jpg
How do I know they are still good? (The rectangular brushes are about 1/2" x 5/8" x 3/16").


They look good, except for the left brush, which looks a little
chipped. Shake out the debris from the motor, and put the brushes
back exactly the way they came out. Then, put an ohms guesser between
the brush contacts. Leave the insulating caps off, compress the
springs with the ohms guesser probes, and measure the resistance. I
don't know exactly what resistance to expect, but my guess is
somewhere between 2 and 5 ohms. (I can measure a similar drill
tomorrow if you want). What I'm looking for is a resistance that is
much higher than the 2-5 ohms, which would indicate an open in the
rotor or stator windings.

Anyway, I put the drill back together and while progressively manipulating
the safety switch adjustment between power up tries I got to the point
where the drill would turn on, which it wouldn't do before.


Progress, I guess. Now you have an intermittent drill, instead of a
repaired drill. You should spend the time finding the culprit. The
cracked edge of the brush is an important clue. If the broken piece
somehow got wedged between the brush and the commutator, that would
produce a no motor run situation. Look for a corresponding gouge in
the commutator and clean all the junk out of the motor with an air
hose. Watch out not to get anything wedged between the outside of the
rotor and the stator. If there's some magnetized junk in there, make
a cardboard shim and push it out.

So I'm still at a loss as to what the problem was. I probably didn't
re-insert the brushes *exactly* the way I took them out and was
wondering if that might be the reason it is working now.


I'm about 80% sure that it's somehow related to the brushed. If you
put them back differently from where they were extracted, you run the
risk of either gouging the commutator, or wearing down the brushes
prematurely.

What other procedures should I undertake before I start re-flowing
solder on the control PCB? (Since I have to sell the drill I want
to be sure it is working properly).


Take digital photos so that you can put the mess of wires back
together.

Important: Looking at the age, my guess(tm) is that it's Lead-Tin
60/40 solder, and not the RoHS crap. Try a small piece of Lead-Tin on
a solder pad. If it turns dull gray and rough looking, it's the wrong
solder. It should be fairly smooth, shiny, and of course, strong when
done.

I can't tell for sure from the photos or manuals, but there appears to
be a relay in the circuit. If so, the contacts should be inspected
and possibly burnished. If severely pitted, replace the relay.

Can anyone tell me where I can find new brushes?


Google for "hougen 17621 carbon brush set"
http://etoolinc.com/p10267/Hougen-17621-BRUSH,-CARBON-%28PAIR%29/product_info.html
Please verify that the 17621 is the correct brush set for your drill.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
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Old April 15th 13, 07:06 AM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

The picture of the brush/spring assemblies shows that they appear to be
normal.. although the length of the original/new brushes is unknown.

When putting the brushes back in the holders, if there was adequate length
that caused some slight contact pressure (spring sticking out when brush is
fully inserted), then the brushes should be long enough to operate the
motor.

Dust and debris in and around the brush holders should be removed as a
standard practice when servicing motors.

The brush on the left in the picture appears to have been arcing, probably
on the trailing edge.
If the brush/commutator contact area is visible from the outside, see if
there is a lot more arcing at one brush than there is at the other.

Since the brushes may not be installed in their original positions now, by
viewing the normal rotational direction of the armature (by running the
motor or by turning the tool's spindle in the proper direction) it should be
possible to remount that chipped brush in it's original position with the
dark/chipped edge as the trailing edge.

Brushes in power tools don't usually contact the commutator at precisely 90
degrees, so the concave area is normally off-center on the brush (since the
brushes tend to drift in the direction of rotation). That may help finding
the original position of the brushes.

I've seen motor troubleshooting web pages showing brush defect pictures,
arcing illustrations and corresponding faults, but can't seem to find a
decent one now.
Maybe someone else has a saved location they could recommend.

There are numerous problems that are indicated by excessive brush arcing,
chipping/erosion or pitting. Several faults can only be confirmed by a motor
repair shop or a knowlegeable tech with a motor growler and other test
equipment.

It may be worthwhile to closely examine the board soldering with good light
and a magnifier, and touch-up/reflow any cracked or abnormal looking joints.
I regularly use lead solder to reflow lead-free solder because it produces
reliable connections.

I'm not a manufacturer, distributor or exporter and I have composed a sworn
statement stating that I will not eat or snort any of my electronic gear.
Let the recycler sort it out.

--
Cheers,
WB
..............


wrote in message
...

I did replace the brushes in the same holders they came out of, but *may*
have put one or both back in upside down from how they came out.

Also,I only use my multimeters for the basics and don't really know their
functions in depth. So I can only note whether or not the display changes
and the number read-outs. But not necessarily what they mean unless I'm just
measuring AC or DC voltage or something like that.

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

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Old May 2nd 13, 05:29 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Help: Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

On Sunday, April 14, 2013 3:24:19 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Friday, April 12, 2013 8:35:04 AM UTC-4, Michael Terrell wrote: wrote: I have a Hougen Magnetic Drill that is not working. http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...pse1f7add1.jpg The Magnet itself seems to work, but the drill portion doesn't. Not counting when it turned on a couple of times two days ago, making me think that there was a possible intermittent break somewhere in the connections. I opened it up and tinkered with the safety switch adjustment screw, but that wasn't the problem. http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...psf865d83a.jpg The safety switch is located on the bottom of the drill. The bottom of the drill must be flat against the metal surface in order for the drill to power on. (See the two buttons at the bottom): http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps3e32a032.jpg The third button in the center is I believe also a safety switch that will cut power to the motor if the drill's magnetic base drifts as much as 1/2". I assumed that there is nothing wrong with the AC cord because the magnet portion works, so using my Fluke 79III multimeter on the Ohm setting I tested the start and the stop buttons. There was activity on the Multimeter's display screen when I press either, so I assume that there is no break, at least as far as where those leads connect to the circuit board. http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps3495c450.jpg Would it be plausible to re-flow the solder on the circuit board in case there is a cold solder joint somewhere? I can't travel several hours round trip to spend $65 an hour at an authorized repair location, so any advice on how to proceed would be appreciated. Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Have you asked on news:rec.crafts.metalworking where there are a number of people who own these tools? Yes. And I didn't receive a single response, which is why I posted here. :-) Darren Harris Staten Island, New York.


I turned it on and wacked it a few times with a rubber mallet over the course of a week and it worked every time.

So I guess it is ok for now. At least I'll know what to do the next time something like this happens.

Thanks a lot.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.


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Old May 2nd 13, 10:50 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Help: Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

On 5/2/2013 9:29 AM, wrote:
On Sunday, April 14, 2013 3:24:19 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Friday, April 12, 2013 8:35:04 AM UTC-4, Michael Terrell wrote:
wrote: I have a Hougen Magnetic Drill that is not working. http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Tools/Hougen3_zpse1f7add1.jpg The Magnet itself seems to work, but the drill portion doesn't. Not counting when it turned on a couple of times two days ago, making me think that there was a possible intermittent break somewhere in the connections. I opened it up and tinkered with the safety switch adjustment screw, but that wasn't the problem. http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Tools/HougenSafetySwitchAdjustmentScrew_zpsf865d83a.jpg The safety switch is located on the bottom of the drill. The bottom of the drill must be flat against the metal surface in order for the drill to power on. (See the two buttons at the bottom): http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/St
atenislander/Tools/HougenBottom-SafetySwitch_zps3e32a032.jpg The third button in the center is I believe also a safety switch that will cut power to the motor if the drill's magnetic base drifts as much as 1/2". I assumed that there is nothing wrong with the AC cord because the magnet portion works, so using my Fluke 79III multimeter on the Ohm setting I tested the start and the stop buttons. There was activity on the Multimeter's display screen when I press either, so I assume that there is no break, at least as far as where those leads connect to the circuit board. http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Tools/HougenStart-StopConnectors_zps3495c450.jpg Would it be plausible to re-flow the solder on the circuit board in case there is a cold solder joint somewhere? I can't travel several hours round trip to spend $65 an hour at an authorized repair location, so any advice on how to proceed wou
ld be appreciated. Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Have you asked on news:rec.crafts.metalworking where there are a number of people who own these tools? Yes. And I didn't receive a single response, which is why I posted here. :-) Darren Harris Staten Island, New York.

I turned it on and wacked it a few times with a rubber mallet over the course of a week and it worked every time.

So I guess it is ok for now. At least I'll know what to do the next time something like this happens.

Thanks a lot.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

Classic symptom of brushes sticking in their holders. May be brushes
worn so much they jam in the holders.

Paul
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Old May 4th 13, 01:39 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Help: Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

Heheh.. sometimes referred to as Percussive Maintenance.

--
Cheers,
WB
..............


wrote in message news:f1b6add7-a815-4642-9d30-

I turned it on and wacked it a few times with a rubber mallet over the
course of a week and it worked every time.

So I guess it is ok for now. At least I'll know what to do the next time
something like this happens.

Thanks a lot.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

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Old May 4th 13, 08:46 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Help: Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 8:39:06 AM UTC-4, Wild_Bill wrote:
Heheh.. sometimes referred to as Percussive Maintenance.


Well, what I meant was that wacking it with the rubber mallet didn't make it *stop* working. It has worked perfectly since I put the brushes back in.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
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Old January 27th 19, 05:54 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
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Default Help: Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

Just joined in never too late.
1) check brushes ,blow out top of motor through
Cover plate at the top turning motor with hand
Sand brushes with light sand paper
2) If Magnet comes on then you have Power to circuit board. Unplug remove power. Remove 4 screws from cover plate where power cord comes in. Unplug black and white wires going to motor. Hook power directly to black and white wires. Motor will run if not there’s a short on the top cord or the field cord is burnt. But then you would smell burnt wires. So check for short
But before you do that the black and white wired you unplug from circuit board put you tester on AC voltage and hook up press green to start assuming power is on. MAKE YOUR CIRCUIT BOARD IS INSULATED (not touching metal) circuit board can short. when you press the green start you wound get 120 volts which means your circuit board is good if not getting any power there then board is bad. I don’t do boards so I cant say. Board is around $125. Thanks for letting me post my 2 cent wort
Please feel free to cal
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Old February 11th 19, 03:19 AM
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Default Help Hougen Magnetic Drill Problem

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