Another rant
 

Here's a question about a situation perhaps many of us have faced.
With the blocks of dead time experienced in this business of late I
find that I have opportunities to write this sort of drivel. Maybe
I'll try to have it published, hah! As I'm sure you all know these
days they all ask two questions. "Do you do home service" and "what
will the job cost"? And naturally especially over the phone it's tough
to predict. It could be a connector, a bad cable or an intermittent
component or sometimes, God only knows what.

Many jobs around here are in rural areas, so I usually will tell them
that the service call is 65.00 and the time I spend in the house is
billed at 60.00 an hour in fifteen minute increments. (I usually won't
spend more than 45 minutes trying to troubleshoot a problem in the
home, unless I'm absolutely certain as to what it is and have no doubt
that I will be able to fix it there). Up front I also add that I may
rarely be able to fix a serious problem on a home call and add that
often times the set may have to go to the shop. I also let them know
that, (with two bad rotator cuffs and back problems), I won't be
taking their 50 inch plasma set off the wall nor will I be moving
their projo either. They would have to bring it to me. Basically in a
nut shell I try to make them understand that on a home call I may not
be able to fix something serious, that really should be done in the
shop. And these days most of the time on a projection, tube or DLP
they don't want to spend a lot of money anyway. But to be very clear
with the exception of flat screens(which I can do on the dining room
table if I really had to) in all honesty I don't even have room for a
huge DLP or projo elephant in the paltry corner of my basement I call
my shop either. So although I rarely get calls on them anymore I let
them know that I won't have those come in and so they do understand
that if it's not fixable in the home it usually won't get fixed. I try
to be up front and as as forthcoming with this as I can.

So the dilemma is maybe I'll be able to fix this set in the home, but
if I can't and it has to go to the shop, I'm not taking it. And maybe
the girl who called me can't move it without help either. And that's
assuming she would even want to proceed with the extra expense of
moving the set and whatever the repair might turn out to be anyway.
What I've been finding, and based on past experience is she probably
won't want to spend the money to have this done.

So at this point I've spent 30 -45 minutes in the home and determined
that this dog's barking. Now is it unjustified of me to expect to be
paid for going out and trying to see if it's something simple knowing
full well if it's not I'm going to walk away from it?

I went on a projection call the other day. "fuzzy picture". I took one
look at it and it had coolant contamination written all over it. I
gave the guy a price and of course they want to know what else could
it need. I won't lie to them. It's an old set and who knows whats
going to happen a week afterwards? So it was a fifty mile trip and
65.00 but it was a nice ride, and the coffee was good.

Fifteen years ago the local Yellow Pages was full of TV repair shops.
Except for me there are now two other guys still involved in
television within 50 miles. One is 85 and rarely opens the store. And
even if he did it looks like a page right out of 1950. The other guy
is about the same age and does some sales I guess but little else. So
for all intents and purposes, for the time being anyway, (and I don't
see any young guys lining up to be TV repairmen) it's me, and I've
been told only me. If not for the commercial work we would really be
scratching.

I wonder how some of you guys also in the consumer electronics repair
business have handled these sort of things?
Lenny

Another rant
 

On Jul 20, 6:51*am, klem kedidelhopper
wrote:
Here's a question about a situation perhaps many of us have faced.
With the blocks of dead time experienced in this business of late I
find that I have opportunities to write this sort of drivel. Maybe
I'll try to have it published, hah! As I'm sure you all know these
days they all ask two questions. "Do you do home service" and "what
will the job cost"? And naturally especially over the phone it's tough
to predict. It could be a connector, a bad cable or an intermittent
component or sometimes, God only knows what.

Many jobs around here are in rural areas, so I usually will tell them
that the service call is 65.00 and the time I spend in the house is
billed at 60.00 an hour in fifteen minute increments. (I usually won't
spend more than 45 minutes trying to troubleshoot a problem in the
home, unless I'm absolutely certain as to what it is and have no doubt
that I will be able to fix it there). Up front I also add that I may
rarely be able to fix a serious problem on a home call and add that
often times the set may have to go to the shop. I also let them know
that, (with two bad rotator cuffs and back problems), *I won't be
taking their 50 inch plasma set off the wall nor will I be moving
their projo either. They would have to bring it to me. Basically in a
nut shell I try to make them understand that on a home call I may not
be able to fix something serious, that really should be done in the
shop. And these days most of the time on a projection, tube or DLP
they don't want to spend a lot of money anyway. But to be very clear
with the exception of flat screens(which I can do on the dining room
table if I really had to) in all honesty I don't even have room for a
huge DLP or projo elephant in the paltry corner of my basement I call
my shop either. So although I rarely get calls on them anymore I let
them know that I won't have those come in *and so they do understand
that if it's not fixable in the home it usually won't get fixed. I try
to be up front and as as forthcoming with this as I can.

So the dilemma is maybe I'll be able to fix this set in the home, but
if I can't and it has to go to the shop, I'm not taking it. And maybe
the girl who called me can't move it without help either. And that's
assuming she would even want to proceed with the extra expense of
moving the set and whatever the repair might turn out to be anyway.
What I've been finding, and based on past experience is she probably
won't want to spend the money to have this done.

So at this point I've spent 30 -45 minutes in the home and determined
that this dog's barking. Now is it unjustified of me to expect to be
paid for going out and trying to see if it's something simple knowing
full well if it's not I'm going to walk away from it?

I went on a projection call the other day. "fuzzy picture". I took one
look at it and it had coolant contamination written all over it. I
gave the guy a price and of course they want to know what else could
it need. I won't lie to them. It's an old set and who knows whats
going to happen a week afterwards? So it was a fifty mile trip and
65.00 but it was a nice ride, and the coffee was good.

Fifteen years ago the local Yellow Pages was full of TV repair shops.
Except for me there are now two other guys still involved in
television within 50 miles. One is 85 and rarely opens the store. And
even if he did it looks like a page right out of 1950. The other guy
is about the same age and does some sales I guess but little else. So
for all intents and purposes, for the time being anyway, (and I don't
see any young guys lining up *to be TV repairmen) *it's me, and I've
been told only me. If not for the commercial work we would really be
scratching.

I wonder how some of you guys also in the consumer electronics repair
business have handled these sort of things?
Lenny

Allegory, I work with companies, not residents. I always offer
'training' a resident technically competent individual to accomplish
whatever they're trying to do. Win-win, because they get it done, have
a resident expert, and I still make some coins. Plus, satisfaction of
a bit of tutorial.

So that would mean you'd offer to walk someone technically competent
that they have there through the series of diagnostic steps you'd take
if you were there. Might be able to determine whether fixable, or
not. Take about the same amount of time as talking them to death on
the telephone. If fixable, go ahead and quote, if not let them know
the total cost and let them realize it is 'unfixable' and they'd
better go buy another.. All without deciding for them, keeps them
feeling in control and happy. You might even run across some youthful
prodigy that wants to learn [like an apprentice], so you can then send
HIM/HER out on these treks.

Another rant
 

snip


Fifteen years ago the local Yellow Pages was full of TV repair shops.
Except for me there are now two other guys still involved in
television within 50 miles. One is 85 and rarely opens the store. And
even if he did it looks like a page right out of 1950. The other guy
is about the same age and does some sales I guess but little else. So
for all intents and purposes, for the time being anyway, (and I don't
see any young guys lining up to be TV repairmen) it's me, and I've
been told only me. If not for the commercial work we would really be
scratching.

I wonder how some of you guys also in the consumer electronics repair
business have handled these sort of things?
Lenny

Most electrical / electronic stores do not employ any kind of service
technician these days, because there's simply not enough work to justify it.
Enter me. I hire myself out to multiple stores as a self-employed tech. I
have fixed charges per equipment type, which allows the store to quote to
their customer with a high degree of certainty. For sure, it's a 'some you
win, some you lose' situation when you are working on fixed prices, but
overall, I win, and so does the store. Also, I don't get involved with
holding accounts with manufacturers for parts. I let the store do that. I
just tell them what part is needed when it's not a simple resistor or
transistor or whatever, and it's then up to them to liaise with their
customer about any extra costs. If it's all agreed, they get the part, and I
fit it. That allows them to mark up the part cost as well, if that's what
they want to do. If the customer decides not to go ahead, then I still get
my fixed exam and admin charge, which comes out of the deposit that all of
the stores charge.

It's win all round for me really, as I have a steady supply of work (most of
the time anyway) from multiple sources. I don't have to get involved with
the public and their shenanigans, and I don't have to do field calls. The
stores are happy because they don't have to employ anyone that might be idle
half the time, and they still make a good wedge for themselves, for merely
'fronting' me.

Arfa

Another rant
 

On Jul 20, 7:40*pm, "Arfa Daily" wrote:
snip



Fifteen years ago the local Yellow Pages was full of TV repair shops.
Except for me there are now two other guys still involved in
television within 50 miles. One is 85 and rarely opens the store. And
even if he did it looks like a page right out of 1950. The other guy
is about the same age and does some sales I guess but little else. So
for all intents and purposes, for the time being anyway, (and I don't
see any young guys lining up *to be TV repairmen) *it's me, and I've
been told only me. If not for the commercial work we would really be
scratching.

I wonder how some of you guys also in the consumer electronics repair
business have handled these sort of things?
Lenny

Most electrical / electronic stores do not employ any kind of service
technician these days, because there's simply not enough work to justify it.
Enter me. I hire myself out to multiple stores as a self-employed tech. I
have fixed charges per equipment type, which allows the store to quote to
their customer with a high degree of certainty. For sure, it's a 'some you
win, some you lose' situation when you are working on fixed prices, but
overall, I win, and so does the store. Also, I don't get involved with
holding accounts with manufacturers for parts. I let the store do that. I
just tell them what part is needed when it's not a simple resistor or
transistor or whatever, and it's then up to them to liaise with their
customer about any extra costs. If it's all agreed, they get the part, and I
fit it. That allows them to mark up the part cost as well, if that's what
they want to do. If the customer decides not to go ahead, then I still get
my fixed exam and admin charge, which comes out of the deposit that all of
the stores charge.

It's win all round for me really, as I have a steady supply of work (most of
the time anyway) from multiple sources. I don't have to get involved with
the public and their shenanigans, and I don't have to do field calls. The
stores are happy because they don't have to employ anyone that might be idle
half the time, and they still make a good wedge for themselves, for merely
'fronting' me.

Arfa
Hi Arfa
I spoke to another guy on a different group who also does a "flat
rate" sort of thing. I guess if you really feel confident in the long
run that you will prevail on most jobs then I suppose I could see it.

I charge 50.00 for a TV diagnostic fee. It's 25.00 for receiver,s
VCR's, (don't see too many of those anymore), and small stuff like DVD
players etc. (I don't know what that would equate to in British
pounds). In the case of TV sets, 50.00 covers my looking at the set
and giving an estimate. However when a TV set is dropped off at my
shop, (house), I collect 100.00 up front. I explain before they bring
it in that the additional 50.00 will cover the disposal fee if the set
is abandoned. (Because in this country it's getting to the point where
you almost can't throw anything away anymore without paying someone to
do it). However if the set is repaired the entire 100.00, (or if the
job is less then what ever portion is necessary) will be applied to
the repair. If the set is not repairable or if the customer declines
the estimate and picks up their set then 50.00 will be returned.
Although I do get some calls from outraged freeloaders who expect you
to work for nothing, most people find this policy agreeable.

But lets say you get a set in and diagnose a bad power supply. So do
you have the store obtain the part for you? And if so then what
happens if you ultimately determine that in fact it wasn't the power
supply but a secondary circuit that was putting the supply into shut
down? If something like this were to happen, who winds up eating the
power supply? Lenny

Another rant
 

"klem kedidelhopper" wrote in message
...
On Jul 20, 7:40 pm, "Arfa Daily" wrote:
snip



Fifteen years ago the local Yellow Pages was full of TV repair shops.
Except for me there are now two other guys still involved in
television within 50 miles. One is 85 and rarely opens the store. And
even if he did it looks like a page right out of 1950. The other guy
is about the same age and does some sales I guess but little else. So
for all intents and purposes, for the time being anyway, (and I don't
see any young guys lining up to be TV repairmen) it's me, and I've
been told only me. If not for the commercial work we would really be
scratching.

I wonder how some of you guys also in the consumer electronics repair
business have handled these sort of things?
Lenny

Most electrical / electronic stores do not employ any kind of service
technician these days, because there's simply not enough work to justify
it.
Enter me. I hire myself out to multiple stores as a self-employed tech. I
have fixed charges per equipment type, which allows the store to quote to
their customer with a high degree of certainty. For sure, it's a 'some
you
win, some you lose' situation when you are working on fixed prices, but
overall, I win, and so does the store. Also, I don't get involved with
holding accounts with manufacturers for parts. I let the store do that. I
just tell them what part is needed when it's not a simple resistor or
transistor or whatever, and it's then up to them to liaise with their
customer about any extra costs. If it's all agreed, they get the part,
and I
fit it. That allows them to mark up the part cost as well, if that's what
they want to do. If the customer decides not to go ahead, then I still
get
my fixed exam and admin charge, which comes out of the deposit that all
of
the stores charge.

It's win all round for me really, as I have a steady supply of work (most
of
the time anyway) from multiple sources. I don't have to get involved with
the public and their shenanigans, and I don't have to do field calls. The
stores are happy because they don't have to employ anyone that might be
idle
half the time, and they still make a good wedge for themselves, for
merely
'fronting' me.

Arfa
Hi Arfa
I spoke to another guy on a different group who also does a "flat
rate" sort of thing. I guess if you really feel confident in the long
run that you will prevail on most jobs then I suppose I could see it.

I charge 50.00 for a TV diagnostic fee. It's 25.00 for receiver,s
VCR's, (don't see too many of those anymore), and small stuff like DVD
players etc. (I don't know what that would equate to in British
pounds). In the case of TV sets, 50.00 covers my looking at the set
and giving an estimate.

50 USD is around 35 UKP. That's a pretty similar rate to what a customer
would be charged here.

However when a TV set is dropped off at my
shop, (house), I collect 100.00 up front. I explain before they bring
it in that the additional 50.00 will cover the disposal fee if the set
is abandoned. (Because in this country it's getting to the point where
you almost can't throw anything away anymore without paying someone to
do it).

It's been that way here for a while now. My local tip will no longer take
polystyrene in any form, or black bin bags because they can't see what's in
them - even though it's likely to be just domestic general waste like food
packaging, that sort of thing. They have a bin for absolutely everything
now, and as soon as you open the back of your wagon, you are descended upon
by the tip stasi (or 'recycling advisors' as they like to be called) to
check on what exactly you are trying to get rid of, and to make sure that
you walk it all from one end of the facility to the other, to put it in what
they consider to be the right skip. They do, however, take defunct
electronic goods for free, as long as it doesn't look like you are a
commercial operation.


However if the set is repaired the entire 100.00, (or if the
job is less then what ever portion is necessary) will be applied to
the repair. If the set is not repairable or if the customer declines
the estimate and picks up their set then 50.00 will be returned.
Although I do get some calls from outraged freeloaders who expect you
to work for nothing, most people find this policy agreeable.


It's a pretty similar arrangement to how the stores that I do work for go
about it, and generally, their customers understand why the charges are
being made, and are accepting of them.



But lets say you get a set in and diagnose a bad power supply. So do
you have the store obtain the part for you?

Yes

And if so then what
happens if you ultimately determine that in fact it wasn't the power
supply but a secondary circuit that was putting the supply into shut
down?


I would hope that in general, I can bring enough experience and diagnostic
skill to the table to avoid such situations ...


If something like this were to happen, who winds up eating the
power supply? Lenny


In reality, none of us is perfect, and of course, it does occasionally
happen that way. I am in the somewhat fortunate position of having worked
with almost all of these stores for 15 years or more, so am good friends
with the owners and their staff. So when such a situation arises, they fully
understand and appreciate the difficulties that may have led up to it, and
we normally come to an 'arrangement' that suits us both. Usually, this will
involve them putting the wrongly diagnosed item 'into stock' for either use
at some future point, or disposal on eBay, and me waiving part or all of my
charges, depending on whether the item ultimately does get a correct
diagnosis, and does earn some money. Even if it finally doesn't get fixed,
the store still has the non-returnable deposit that they took from the
customer up front, and this will go some way to mitigating any losses from a
wrongly ordered part. Sometimes, we agree to just 'split the difference', so
we both lose out a bit - "some ya win, some ya lose ..."

I have to say though, that it is pretty rare to get into this situation, but
I could see how it might not suit everyone to work on this sort of basis,
and how it relies to a great degree on mutual trust between me and the
stores - in that I am not going to put them in the situation often, and on
the odd occasion that I do, they will be objective about it, and not crucify
me for getting it wrong.

Arfa

Another rant
 

On Jul 21, 9:26*pm, "Arfa Daily" wrote:
"klem kedidelhopper" wrote in message

...









On Jul 20, 7:40 pm, "Arfa Daily" wrote:
snip

Fifteen years ago the local Yellow Pages was full of TV repair shops..
Except for me there are now two other guys still involved in
television within 50 miles. One is 85 and rarely opens the store. And
even if he did it looks like a page right out of 1950. The other guy
is about the same age and does some sales I guess but little else. So
for all intents and purposes, for the time being anyway, (and I don't
see any young guys lining up *to be TV repairmen) *it's me, and I've
been told only me. If not for the commercial work we would really be
scratching.

I wonder how some of you guys also in the consumer electronics repair
business have handled these sort of things?
Lenny

Most electrical / electronic stores do not employ any kind of service
technician these days, because there's simply not enough work to justify
it.
Enter me. I hire myself out to multiple stores as a self-employed tech.. I
have fixed charges per equipment type, which allows the store to quote to
their customer with a high degree of certainty. For sure, it's a 'some
you
win, some you lose' situation when you are working on fixed prices, but
overall, I win, and so does the store. Also, I don't get involved with
holding accounts with manufacturers for parts. I let the store do that.. I
just tell them what part is needed when it's not a simple resistor or
transistor or whatever, and it's then up to them to liaise with their
customer about any extra costs. If it's all agreed, they get the part,
and I
fit it. That allows them to mark up the part cost as well, if that's what
they want to do. If the customer decides not to go ahead, then I still
get
my fixed exam and admin charge, which comes out of the deposit that all
of
the stores charge.

It's win all round for me really, as I have a steady supply of work (most
of
the time anyway) from multiple sources. I don't have to get involved with
the public and their shenanigans, and I don't have to do field calls. The
stores are happy because they don't have to employ anyone that might be
idle
half the time, and they still make a good wedge for themselves, for
merely
'fronting' me.

Arfa
Hi Arfa
I spoke to another guy on a different group who also does a "flat
rate" sort of thing. I guess if you really feel confident in the long
run that you will prevail on most jobs then I suppose I could see it.

I charge 50.00 for a TV diagnostic fee. It's 25.00 for receiver,s
VCR's, (don't see too many of those anymore), and small stuff like DVD
players etc. (I don't know what that would equate to in British
pounds). In the case of TV sets, 50.00 covers my looking at the set
and giving an estimate.

50 USD is around 35 UKP. That's a pretty similar rate to what a customer
would be charged here.

*However when a TV set is dropped off at my

shop, (house), I collect 100.00 up front. I explain before they bring
it in that the additional 50.00 will cover the disposal fee if the set
is abandoned. (Because in this country it's getting to the point where
you almost can't throw anything away anymore without paying someone to
do it).

It's been that way here for a while now. My local tip will no longer take
polystyrene in any form, or black bin bags because they can't see what's in
them - even though it's likely to be just domestic general waste like food
packaging, that sort of thing. They have a bin for absolutely everything
now, and as soon as you open the back of your wagon, you are descended upon
by the tip stasi (or 'recycling advisors' as they like to be called) to
check on what exactly you are trying to get rid of, and to make sure that
you walk it all from one end of the facility to the other, to put it in what
they consider to be the right skip. They do, however, take defunct
electronic goods for free, as long as it doesn't look like you are a
commercial operation.

However if the set is repaired the entire 100.00, (or if the

job is less then what ever portion is necessary) will be applied to
the repair. If the set is not repairable or if the customer declines
the estimate and picks up their set then 50.00 will be returned.
Although I do get some calls from outraged freeloaders who expect you
to work for nothing, most people find this policy agreeable.

It's a pretty similar arrangement to how the stores that I do work for go
about it, and generally, their customers understand why the charges are
being made, and are accepting of them.



But lets say you get a set in and diagnose a bad power supply. So do
you have the store obtain the part for you?

Yes

*And if so then what

happens if you ultimately determine that in fact it wasn't the power
supply but a secondary circuit that was putting the supply into shut
down?

I would hope that in general, I can bring enough experience and diagnostic
skill to the table to avoid such situations ...

*If something like this were to happen, who winds up eating the

power supply? Lenny

In reality, none of us is perfect, and of course, it does occasionally
happen that way. I am in the somewhat fortunate position of having worked
with almost all of these stores for 15 years or more, so am good friends
with the owners and their staff. So when such a situation arises, they fully
understand and appreciate the difficulties that may have led up to it, and
we normally come to an 'arrangement' that suits us both. Usually, this will
involve them putting the wrongly diagnosed item 'into stock' for either use
at some future point, or disposal on eBay, and me waiving part or all of my
charges, depending on whether the item ultimately does get a correct
diagnosis, and does earn some money. Even if it finally doesn't get fixed,
the store still has the non-returnable deposit that they took from the
customer up front, and this will go some way to mitigating any losses from a
wrongly ordered part. Sometimes, we agree to just 'split the difference', so
we both lose out a bit - "some ya win, some ya lose ..."

I have to say though, that it is pretty rare to get into this situation, but
I could see how it might not suit everyone to work on this sort of basis,
and how it relies to a great degree on mutual trust between me and the
stores - in that I am not going to put them in the situation often, and on
the odd occasion that I do, they will be objective about it, and not crucify
me for getting it wrong.

Arfa

It's nice that you have that kind of relationship with the people you
work for. I do warranty work for Sanyo but no local stores.
Essentially the local stores are Best Buy or Sears. Best buy has their
own service team called "The Geek Squad". I don;t know What Sears
does. Mom and pop stores find it hard to compete with them so it kind
of leaves the little guy out in the cold/. Lenny