[N_Cook]

Used by Fender guitar amp company and used eyelets for soldering component
leads into. What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad? I
think of it as whale-hide but its probably something like linoleum ,
compressed linseed etc rather than paper-fibre and lacquer as under x30
veiwing there is no sign of fibrous material

[Michael A. Terrell]

N_Cook wrote:

Used by Fender guitar amp company and used eyelets for soldering component
leads into. What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad? I
think of it as whale-hide but its probably something like linoleum ,
compressed linseed etc rather than paper-fibre and lacquer as under x30
veiwing there is no sign of fibrous material.


Phenolic.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

[N_Cook]

Michael A. Terrell wrote in message
...

N_Cook wrote:

Used by Fender guitar amp company and used eyelets for soldering
component
leads into. What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad? I
think of it as whale-hide but its probably something like linoleum ,
compressed linseed etc rather than paper-fibre and lacquer as under x30
veiwing there is no sign of fibrous material.


Phenolic.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.


So is it dyed phenolic? I only ever see brown phenolic material and more
rigid, for the thickness, than this Fender stuff. Next time I come across
some of it I'll burn a sample - unmistakable smell if phenolic.

[N_Cook]

This is what the board looks like and as it is used, colour is correct
http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lb...ao1_r1_250.jpg
Will quite readily bend when cold , say .5 inch displacement over a 2 inch
run although something like 1/8 inch thick

[Jeffrey Angus[_2_]]

On 10/5/2011 10:39 AM, N_Cook wrote:
This is what the board looks like and as it is used, colour is correct
http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lb...ao1_r1_250.jpg
Will quite readily bend when cold , say .5 inch displacement over a 2 inch
run although something like 1/8 inch thick


I believe what you're referring to is called "fish paper".
A heavy, stiff grey/black cardboard.

Phenolic was between orange and brown, considerably stiffer
and would crack if bent. Commonly used at the time for those
tag strips. Having rows of turret terminals down both sides.

A lot of "That turned out to be a bad idea" techniques were
attempted in the late '50s through the early '70s to eliminate
point to point chassis wiring.

Not all items, and especially "consumer" items were designed
with the idea "This should last forever". That as many items
built as far back as the '20s are still serviceable is more
by accident and over engineering that by conscience design.

Jeff


--
"Everything from Crackers to Coffins"

[spamtrap1888]

On Oct 5, 6:40*am, "N_Cook" wrote:
Used by Fender guitar amp company and used eyelets for soldering component
leads into. What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad? I
think of it as whale-hide but its probably something like linoleum ,
compressed linseed etc rather than paper-fibre and lacquer as under x30
veiwing there is no sign of fibrous material

What color is it and how thick is it?

Circuit boards in general "go bad" because they absorb moisture, they
fail mechanically because of stress from soldered parts or the weight
of soldered parts, they become covered with conductive filth, or they
arc-track because of sustained high voltages.

[JeffM]

N_Cook wrote:
http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lb...ao1_r1_250.jpg

That's too small and too poorly lit to be very useful.
An image 300% the size would have been better.

something like 1/8 inch thick

Jeffrey Angus wrote:
I believe what you're referring to is called "fish paper".
A heavy, stiff grey/black cardboard.

That's the closest thing that matches the description,
but the thickest stuff I've seen is nowhere near 0.125".
http://google.com/search?tbs=dfn:1&q=fish-paper

As spamtrap alluded to,
without some kind of coating, this stuff sucks up moisture.

[Phil Allison[_2_]]

"Michael A. Turd"

Nutcase Kook

Used by Fender guitar amp company and used eyelets for soldering
component
leads into. What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad? I
think of it as whale-hide but its probably something like linoleum ,
compressed linseed etc rather than paper-fibre and lacquer as under x30
veiwing there is no sign of fibrous material.


Phenolic.


** Brrrrraaaapp WRONG !!



..... Phil

[Phil Allison[_2_]]

"spamtrap1888"

Used by Fender guitar amp company and used eyelets for soldering component
leads into. What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad?

What color is it and how thick is it?


** Grey, about 0.5mm thick.


Circuit boards in general "go bad" because they absorb moisture,


** This stuff is a moisture absorber - something well known to Fender and
others who used it.

Sooo, they hot impregnated it with wax !!!

The KOOK has failed to mention this crucial fact.

The hot wax treatment is not 100% effective and if the item is left in damp
storage for a long time, moisture gets into the material. Re-heating and
melting the wax has no good effect.

The material is like stiff cardboard and was used as SECONDARY electrical
insulation in transformers, ie to separate windings from the core.

Such transformers were vacuum impregnated in varnish after manufacture which
made the grey material insulate OK.


.... Phil

[Michael A. Terrell]

Phil Allison wrote:

Turd


Is it your lunch time already, Phyllis?


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

[Mike Tomlinson]

En el artículo , N_Cook
escribió:

What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad?

Paxolin?

--
(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

[Wild_Bill]

Searching "vulcanized fiber board" will reveal many suppliers of this
cellulose material.

http://www.emipapers.com/electrical-insulation.html

I've recently seen a couple of US sources where this VFB material can be
purchased.. Stew Mac for making guitar pickups or other items, and Antique
Electronic Supply for using as general insulating material.

The VFB material has long been used for making switches, terminal boards and
numerous applications where Bakelite or other materials had previously been
used.

VFB is typically die-cut to shape and holes are generally punched during the
same operation.

A different, flexible material is "insulating cambric" which can be sheet
material or tubing.. often amber in color, and often placed between
terminals and surrounding parts.

There are basically no perfect insulators, only some that are better than
others, and most importantly in recent decades, some that are cheaper than
others.

--
Cheers,
WB
..............


"N_Cook" wrote in message
...
Used by Fender guitar amp company and used eyelets for soldering component
leads into. What was the material made of and how/why does it go bad? I
think of it as whale-hide but its probably something like linoleum ,
compressed linseed etc rather than paper-fibre and lacquer as under x30
veiwing there is no sign of fibrous material

[spamtrap1888]

On Oct 6, 10:53*am, "Wild_Bill" wrote:
Searching "vulcanized fiber board" will reveal many suppliers of this
cellulose material.

http://www.emipapers.com/electrical-insulation.html

I've recently seen a couple of US sources where this VFB material can be
purchased.. Stew Mac for making guitar pickups or other items, and Antique
Electronic Supply for using as general insulating material.

I see AES sells tag and turret boards made of more reasonable looking
material. Search he

http://www.tubesandmore.com/