** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it is
still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used had
gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across nearby
tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and associated
transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same glue
was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes copper) and had
to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER going
to wake up ??



...... Phil

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 10:59:58 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:

** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it is
still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

Is that hot melt glue or something else?
Hot melt should, umm... melt, not burn.

--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

"Jeff Liebermann"


Is that hot melt glue or something else?

** So you do no repair work at all ?



..... Phil

On 8/30/2011 8:28 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
Is that hot melt glue or something else?
Hot melt should, umm... melt, not burn.

No, this crap looks like 3M weather strip adhesive.
Sometimes it looks like it's applied sparingly, other times
it looks like it was put on with a caulking gun.

Jeff


--
"Everything from Crackers to Coffins"

"Jeffrey Angus"

No, this crap looks like 3M weather strip adhesive.
Sometimes it looks like it's applied sparingly, other times
it looks like it was put on with a caulking gun.


** I've always wanted to know just WFT it really is !!

At first impression, it looks like ordinary contact adhesive - but it is
quick setting and dries to a hard surface. With time and heat it become tan
coloured and brittle. Then it goes toast brown and becomes corrosive and
conductive.

If coating the pins of an op-amp, the leakage current causes DC offsets and
crackling noises.

If coating small diodes and resistors etc - it will slowly eat the leads
right off.

If coating PCB tracks with hundreds of volts between them, the conduction
heats the glue directly until there is an explosion.

IME , a local ambient temp of about 55C is enough to set it off on its
pathway to hell.



..... Phil

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 11:34:43 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:

"Jeff Liebermann"

Is that hot melt glue or something else?

** So you do no repair work at all ?

Just answer the question. I've seen plenty of hot melt glue being
used. It comes in clear, yellow, and brown. I've never noticed
anything else. Maybe it's a pro-audio only thing? I don't do any
pro-audio as what little audio repair work I do usually doesn't
involve incinerated parts and carbonized yellow glue.

--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

On 8/30/2011 8:50 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
** I've always wanted to know just WFT it really is !!

It's probably related to that crap rubber they love to use
for drive belts and such that turns to extremely sticky goo
that's next to impossible to clean off of everything it
touches.

Jeff

--
"Everything from Crackers to Coffins"

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 11:50:53 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:

** I've always wanted to know just WFT it really is !!

This description seems to fit:
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/482344777/One_component_solvent_resistant_flame_retardant.ht ml
"One component solvent resistant flame-retardant waterproof yellow
fixing adhesive glue for electronic components"

Note the photos. Is that it? I'll do some more Googling later. Gotta
seperate my customers from their money.


--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

"Jeff Liebermann"

Is that hot melt glue or something else?

** So you do no repair work at all ?

Just answer the question.


** You are not a repair tech, or you would have seen it many times.

Always Asian made gear, from about the 1980s onwards.

TV sets, VCRs, SMPSs anything where the maker felt it was a good idea to
glue things to the PCB.

Do a Google search on this NG under " yellow glue".



...... Phil

On Tue, 30 Aug 2011 18:56:39 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 11:50:53 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:

** I've always wanted to know just WFT it really is !!

This description seems to fit:
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/482344777/One_component_solvent_resistant_flame_retardant.ht ml
"One component solvent resistant flame-retardant waterproof yellow
fixing adhesive glue for electronic components"

Note the photos. Is that it? I'll do some more Googling later. Gotta
seperate my customers from their money.

Mo
http://www.aliexpress.com/store/906248/210638773-439369255/accept-sample-order-wholesale-flame-retardant-yellow-adhesive-free-shipping-for-you.html
The page says it's an "acrylic".

--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

On 8/30/2011 8:56 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
"One component solvent resistant flame-retardant waterproof yellow
fixing adhesive glue for electronic components"

Odd, I read this: "Usage: Construction, Fiber & Garment, Footwear "

Jeff, but yeah, that sure looks like it.
Some of the stuff looks almost porous.

Jeff

--
"Everything from Crackers to Coffins"

"Jeff Liebermann"

** I've always wanted to know just WFT it really is !!

This description seems to fit:

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/482344777/One_component_solvent_resistant_flame_retardant.ht ml

"One component solvent resistant flame-retardant waterproof yellow
fixing adhesive glue for electronic components"

Note the photos. Is that it?


** Sure as heck looks like the vile stuff.

But the stuff has been in use for decades, firstly with Taiwanese made gear.

The specs quoted do not mention aging or the effects of temperature - so the
marketing is dishonest.

BTW:

the pics show the glue in its liquid state, when dry the surface is quite
dull.

To me, the pics are cringe worthy.

Like looking at pics of child abuse.



..... Phil

On Tue, 30 Aug 2011 21:04:46 -0500, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:

On 8/30/2011 8:56 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
"One component solvent resistant flame-retardant waterproof yellow
fixing adhesive glue for electronic components"

Odd, I read this: "Usage: Construction, Fiber & Garment, Footwear "

Sure. Haven't you seen PCB shoes and underwear?
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/discoblog/2010/04/07/circuit-board-chic-motherboards-recycled-into-shoes-and-boxers/
http://boingboing.net/2010/04/06/circuit-board-shoes.html
http://www.zazzle.com/circuit_board_shoes-167287736986690214
http://www.xactstudios.com/pcbcreations/
http://www.zazzle.com/computer_circuit_board_shoes-167535214684590497
https://plus.google.com/103033413691031223989/posts/Kq6qgFDULaj

Jeff, but yeah, that sure looks like it.
Some of the stuff looks almost porous.

Agressive hardener action causing gas bubbles. It's acrylic, but I'm
not familiar with the chemistry. I'll dig it out, later...

--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

"Phil Allison" wrote in message
...

** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it
is still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used had
gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across nearby
tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and associated
transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same
glue was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes copper)
and had to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
going to wake up ??



..... Phil





I had an M1 with exactly the same problem. Conductive gak all over the
place, very messy, but fortunately didn't blow anything up.



Gareth.

Jeff Liebermann wrote in message
...
On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 11:50:53 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:

** I've always wanted to know just WFT it really is !!

This description seems to fit:

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/48...vent_resistant
_flame_retardant.html
"One component solvent resistant flame-retardant waterproof yellow
fixing adhesive glue for electronic components"

Note the photos. Is that it? I'll do some more Googling later. Gotta
seperate my customers from their money.


--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS



That "Japanese" brown gloop made a comeback also, from my trepair briefs

Sherwood RD6106 tuner amp, may 2000 from front panel moulding
I though that hygroscopic brown glue stuff went out in the 70s. Used to
secure 12.288M crystal for the digital interface processor YSS912C-F , was
around its
pin and had rusted through at the epoxy bond.

If the brown hard-glue is the same as the yellow stuff. Is the progress to
destruction that it becomes hygroscopic going from yellow to brown and so
becomes conductive for CMOSSy sort of stuff but if HV around then conducts
enough to then carbonise and become ever more conductive?

Phil Allison wrote:

"Jeff Liebermann"

Is that hot melt glue or something else?

** So you do no repair work at all ?

Just answer the question.


** You are not a repair tech, or you would have seen it many times.

Always Asian made gear, from about the 1980s onwards.

TV sets, VCRs, SMPSs anything where the maker felt it was a good idea to
glue things to the PCB.

Do a Google search on this NG under " yellow glue".

that stuff is pure ****.

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 10:59:58 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:


** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it is
still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used had
gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across nearby
tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and associated
transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same glue
was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes copper) and had
to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER going
to wake up ??



..... Phil




The rumor among techs in the U.S. when this stuff first showed up was
it was originally manufactured by Sony and it was known as "Sony
glue". Don't know if there was any truth to this or not. As Phil
said, it was in widespread use, for example: Mitsubishi televisions,
Adcom preamps and tuners, Yamaha receivers, Extron products and many
others which I can't recall off the top of my head. Chuck

"N_Cook" wrote in message
...
If the brown hard-glue is the same as the yellow stuff. Is the progress to
destruction that it becomes hygroscopic going from yellow to brown and so
becomes conductive for CMOSSy sort of stuff but if HV around then conducts
enough to then carbonise and become ever more conductive?



The brown brittle stuff I scraped off the M1 PCB was around the low voltage
audio pre-amp and Power Amp IC.
It was conductive enough to render the circuit useless, no HV necessary.



Gareth.

"Gareth Magennis" wrote in
:



"Phil Allison" wrote in message
...

** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but
it is still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian
made equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the
parts involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor (
M1 Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the
damn Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the
glue used had gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and
arced across nearby tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its
drive IC and associated transistors, high speed diodes and even the
AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The
same glue was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it
corrodes copper) and had to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
going to wake up ??



..... Phil


the manufacturers probably don't get the products back(due to their age)
for failure analysis,and thus are unaware it happens.
No "closed-loop action process".

OR,it's planned "obsolesence".
or both. ;-)




I had an M1 with exactly the same problem. Conductive gak all over
the place, very messy, but fortunately didn't blow anything up.



Gareth.





--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 10:59:58 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:

** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away -
but it is still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian
made equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the
parts involved get hot.

Is that hot melt glue or something else?
Hot melt should, umm... melt, not burn.

**No. It is a type of contact adhesive. It is still in widespread use, for
reasons I don't understand. Some, more enlightened manufacturers, use a
silicon type glue, which has a much higher burning temperature.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

In article , says...
Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
going
to wake up ??

As long as it lasts through the warranty, they don't care.

--
If there is a no_junk in my address, please REMOVE it before replying!
All junk mail senders will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the
law!!
http://home.comcast.net/~andyross

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 10:59:58 +1000, Phil Allison wrote:

** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it
is still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used
had gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across
nearby tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and
associated transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge
rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same
glue was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes
copper) and had to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
going to wake up ??



..... Phil

Yup been there in the past 30 some years. Lots of Chinese VCR SMPS. I
reckon that crap is a moisture trap that eventually leads to the demise
of chokes, coils etc..



--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse

"Alien"

It's not a 'moisture trap',

The glue gets carbonized due to excessive heat in the electrical
components, which makes the glue more conductive and more corrosive
(ie: it chemically changes the glue).

This causes havoc due to shorts (because it's conductive) and open
circuits (because it corrodes away circuit traces and component
leads).

** Correct.

The worst problems are always with gear that runs 24/7.

No chance for moisture ingress there.



..... Phil

Another miscreant is some formulation of conformal coating that over 20 or
30 years breaks down to an oil, either itself corrosive or hygroscopic and
then corrosive

On Thu, 01 Sep 2011 14:33:42 +1000, Phil Allison wrote:


"Alien"

It's not a 'moisture trap',

The glue gets carbonized due to excessive heat in the electrical
components, which makes the glue more conductive and more corrosive
(ie: it chemically changes the glue).

This causes havoc due to shorts (because it's conductive) and open
circuits (because it corrodes away circuit traces and component leads).

** Correct.

The worst problems are always with gear that runs 24/7.

No chance for moisture ingress there.

Just because gear runs 24/7 does not exempt the possibility of moisture
intrusion. Ask a marine electronics tech and get back to me. Bar that,
operating electronics in high humidity 24/7 holds no guarantee that it is
not exempt to moisture. Read the ****ing manual for the operating
extremes if you doubt me.



--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse

"Meat Plow = **** Head "
Phil Allison wrote:


"Alien"

It's not a 'moisture trap',

The glue gets carbonized due to excessive heat in the electrical
components, which makes the glue more conductive and more corrosive
(ie: it chemically changes the glue).

This causes havoc due to shorts (because it's conductive) and open
circuits (because it corrodes away circuit traces and component leads).

** Correct.

The worst problems are always with gear that runs 24/7.

No chance for moisture ingress there.

Just because gear runs 24/7 does not exempt the possibility of moisture
intrusion.


** It does when the yellow glue areas are all permanently hot.

Try following the thread - ****wit.



..... Phil

On Fri, 02 Sep 2011 08:29:00 +1000, Phil Allison wrote:


"Meat Plow = **** Head "
Phil Allison wrote:


"Alien"

It's not a 'moisture trap',

The glue gets carbonized due to excessive heat in the electrical
components, which makes the glue more conductive and more corrosive
(ie: it chemically changes the glue).

This causes havoc due to shorts (because it's conductive) and open
circuits (because it corrodes away circuit traces and component
leads).

** Correct.

The worst problems are always with gear that runs 24/7.

No chance for moisture ingress there.

Just because gear runs 24/7 does not exempt the possibility of moisture
intrusion.


** It does when the yellow glue areas are all permanently hot.

Try following the thread - ****wit.

Try not snipping the thread, ****wit.



--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse

On Aug 30, 8:59*pm, "Phil Allison" wrote:
** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it is
still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. *All the glue used had
gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across nearby
tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and associated
transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same glue
was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes copper) and had
to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs *NEVER *going
to wake up ??

..... *Phil

Sony had a problem with this glue on broadcast video recorders years
ago. Their tech bulletin blamed "CHLOROPRENE GLUE". One current mfr
data sheet shows a reduction in resistance from 10^13 to 10^8 after
500 hours at 100C. Unfortunately, the resistance just keeps dropping
after that.

dewar wrote in message
...
On Aug 30, 8:59 pm, "Phil Allison" wrote:
** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it
is
still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used had
gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across nearby
tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and associated
transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same
glue
was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes copper) and
had
to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER going
to wake up ??

..... Phil

Sony had a problem with this glue on broadcast video recorders years
ago. Their tech bulletin blamed "CHLOROPRENE GLUE". One current mfr
data sheet shows a reduction in resistance from 10^13 to 10^8 after
500 hours at 100C. Unfortunately, the resistance just keeps dropping
after that.

+++++

Presumably equivalent degrading in something like 1000 hours at 80 degrees
or 2000 at 60 degrees etc
Would you have a URL for that , I can only find flattering product info out
there

probably
http://www.sonycid.jp/en/products/mc4/sc121.html

5-2.Stability of insulation resistance

Test Piece condition

* [Comb-shaped electrode JIS Z3197]
* [Conductor space 1.27mm]
* [Measured after charging with 500 V for 1 min]

Results
Initially 1.0 x 1013

1.0 x 1011 after 100°C 250 hrs
1.0 x 108 after 500 hrs

2.0 x 1012 after 40°C 90% 96 hrs
4.0 x 1011 after 250 hrs
3.0 x 1011 after 500 hrs

But nothing flagged-up about further degradation, a later page?

I assume 90 percent is relative humidity.
I'd like to see the tabulated accelerated aging effect after 500 hours at
both 80 and 60 degree C and 90 percent RH

Am 07.09.2011 22:42, schrieb dewar:
On Aug 30, 8:59 pm, "Phil wrote:
** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it is
still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used had
gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across nearby
tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and associated
transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same glue
was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes copper) and had
to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER going
to wake up ??

..... Phil

Sony had a problem with this glue on broadcast video recorders years
ago. Their tech bulletin blamed "CHLOROPRENE GLUE". One current mfr
data sheet shows a reduction in resistance from 10^13 to 10^8 after
500 hours at 100C. Unfortunately, the resistance just keeps dropping
after that.


I'm thinking that outgassing electrolytes from the
Elytics also do a further degeneration of that glue.
Seen some discoloring and very low impedance in the goop around some
Elytics even in cases where the temp was not high...


Jorgen
dj0du

"Lund-Nielsen, Jorgen" wrote in
:

Am 07.09.2011 22:42, schrieb dewar:
On Aug 30, 8:59 pm, "Phil wrote:
** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away -
but it is still with us.

Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian
made equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the
parts involved get hot.

The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor (
M1 Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of
the damn Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All
the glue used had gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil
and arced across nearby tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET,
its drive IC and associated transistors, high speed diodes and even
the AC bridge rectifier diodes.

The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The
same glue was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it
corrodes copper) and had to be laboriously scraped off.

Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
going to wake up ??

..... Phil

Sony had a problem with this glue on broadcast video recorders years
ago. Their tech bulletin blamed "CHLOROPRENE GLUE". One current mfr
data sheet shows a reduction in resistance from 10^13 to 10^8 after
500 hours at 100C. Unfortunately, the resistance just keeps dropping
after that.


I'm thinking that outgassing electrolytes from the
Elytics also do a further degeneration of that glue.
Seen some discoloring and very low impedance in the goop around some
Elytics even in cases where the temp was not high...


Jorgen
dj0du





should electrolytic caps BE outgassing under normal operation?
I don't think so.
maybe it enhances the glue's degradation after the cap begins to
fail,making the problem worse,leading to charring of the PCB.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

On Aug 30, 6:57*pm, "Phil Allison" wrote:
"Jeff Liebermann"



Is that hot melt glue or something else?

** So you do no repair work at all ?

Just answer the question.

** You are not a repair tech, or you would have seen it many times.

Always Asian made gear, from about the 1980s onwards.

TV sets, VCRs, SMPSs anything where the maker felt it was a good idea to
glue things to the PCB.

Do a Google search on this NG under *" yellow glue".


At the hourly rates Americans charge it's cheaper to replace that
stuff than to have it repaired.

"spamtrap1888"

At the hourly rates Americans charge it's cheaper to replace that
stuff than to have it repaired.

** Bull****.

On 9/10/2011 4:18 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
"spamtrap1888"

At the hourly rates Americans charge it's cheaper to replace that
stuff than to have it repaired.

** Bull****.

Perhaps, but where's the break even point on a $19.95 DVD player
from Wal-Mart?

Jeff


--
"Everything from Crackers to Coffins"

"Jeffrey Angus"
Phil Allison wrote:
"spamtrap1888"

At the hourly rates Americans charge it's cheaper to replace that
stuff than to have it repaired.

** Bull****.

Perhaps, but where's the break even point on a $19.95 DVD player
from Wal-Mart?


** The latest example seen of yellow glue damage is with a dB Tech line
array box worth $4000 to replace.

Picking examples to suit your prejudices is ****wit logic.



..... Phil

Phil Allison wrote:

"Jeffrey Angus"
Phil Allison wrote:
"spamtrap1888"

At the hourly rates Americans charge it's cheaper to replace that
stuff than to have it repaired.

** Bull****.

Perhaps, but where's the break even point on a $19.95 DVD player
from Wal-Mart?

** The latest example seen of yellow glue damage is with a dB Tech line
array box worth $4000 to replace.

Picking examples to suit your prejudices is ****wit logic.


Yet you continue to do it. If everything that needed repaired was
worth, there would still be plenty of repair shops in the United States.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

On Sat, 10 Sep 2011 16:26:16 -0500, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:

Perhaps, but where's the break even point on a $19.95 DVD player
from Wal-Mart?

That depends on the warranty period. If it's a 90 day warranty, then
the break point (or point where it breaks) is 91 days.

However, the original point is generally correct. It is often cheaper
to replace than to repair. About 20 years ago, my rule of thumb was
that customers are willing to pay 10-25% of the purchase price on
repairs before they buy a new device. With $600 computers being the
commodity price, I can charge between $60 and $150 for a repair before
they begin to complain. At $75/hr, I can't even open the box and look
inside for $60, but $150 might work for simple (software) repairs that
I don't have to warranty. If new PC's were $3,000, I could make
money, but not at commodity prices. This is not the road to riches.

Phil's $4000 whatever device is well worth repairing. However, if the
replacement costs $19.95, forget about repairing.

I recently sent a laptop to China for motherboard repair. Unlike US
repair shops, I did NOT have to remove the motherboard. Cost me $40
in shipping both ways, and $80 for parts and labor. Total time was
about a month. I charged the customer $200. This should offer a clue
where we're heading.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558