Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Oh, my definitely a bozo no no there.....

So what do you do?
(Some answers giving below are tongue in cheek
for the humor impaired.)

Act like nothing happened?

Congratulate them on their tastes?

Wipe the drive with something like bcwipe and
give it back to them?

Spin up the drive separately and bang it against
the desk repeatedly until you knock a head loose?

Make copies for yourself?

Hand it over to the local police?

Give it back to the customer and turn them in
after a few weeks?

Charge the customer extra and demand payment to
keep quiet?

The two things that bother me the most are the
police have a terrible track record on anonymous
and the lawyers like to claim that YOU put it
there.

So, what to do?

Jeff

On 1/6/2011 10:58 AM, Jeffrey Angus wrote:
Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Ah, well that's your *first* mistake! :-(

Oh, my definitely a bozo no no there.....

So what do you do?
(Some answers giving below are tongue in cheek
for the humor impaired.)

Act like nothing happened?

Congratulate them on their tastes?

Wipe the drive with something like bcwipe and
give it back to them?

Spin up the drive separately and bang it against
the desk repeatedly until you knock a head loose?

Make copies for yourself?

Hand it over to the local police?

Give it back to the customer and turn them in
after a few weeks?

Charge the customer extra and demand payment to
keep quiet?

The two things that bother me the most are the
police have a terrible track record on anonymous
and the lawyers like to claim that YOU put it
there.

So, what to do?

Of course, that depends on what you found.

Pix of "him" (?) spanking his neighbor's wife? shrug

Pix of "him" pouring cement over Jimmy Hoffa's body...?

To get *it* into the hands of police, you have
already given up any chance of anonymity -- even if
you shipped it to them in an unmarked envelope.

"Hey, I came in to pick up my laptop... What do
you *mean* 'you don't have it'? Where did it go???"

There was a girl named Pandora who made a similar
mistake (except it was a *jar*, in her case)...

Jeffrey Angus wrote:
Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Oh, my definitely a bozo no no there.....

So what do you do?
(Some answers giving below are tongue in cheek
for the humor impaired.)

Act like nothing happened?

if you can't resist snooping, try to make up for being nosey by keeping
your mouth shut. Unless their files are corrupt, it's not your job to
snoop, judge then tattle if you don't like what you found.

"Jeffrey Angus" wrote in message
. ..
Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Isn't that an nvasion of privacy? Did you have a search warrant?
Do you open yourself up to a lawsuit?

Advice I one got from an attorney. You never want to be in the witness box.
And you don't know the ansewer until the judge tells you.

On 1/6/2011 1:00 PM, Charlie wrote:
"Jeffrey wrote in message
. ..
Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Isn't that an nvasion of privacy?

Well, "it depends"... if you deliberately went snooping
around, yes. OTOH, if you happen to open something in
the course of repairing/verifying the machine's operation,
you can justifiably claim innocence.

E.g., I routinely am called on by friends/neighbors
to fix broken laptops. Usually, it's a software issue.
Regardless, I often end up having to image the disk
or do other triage to try to salvage as much of their
"stuff" as is possible. Almost always, this requires
looking at the "stuff" (is this something they downloaded
and can potentially re-download? or, is it something they
created that can't be replicated -- like photos, email, etc.).

I *always* come across something that the owner would
rather not let others know about. Especially kids not
wanting their parents to know what they do when Mom/Dad
aren't watching.

To date, I have never even *flinched* when handing the
repaired laptop back to the owner. Even if they *know*
I may have seen their tax returns, bank statements,
"private photos", personal correspondence, etc. It's
just not "professional" and definitely not what a "friend"
would do.

OTOH, had I found a photo of one of the neighbor *kids*
engaging in some outrageous behavior, you can bet I would
approach *them* about it -- even if they were minors.

Did you have a search warrant?

I don't think the police are bound by that if the materials
come to them from a "third party". I.e. *you* may be subject
to civil (even criminal?) prosecution but I don't think
that taints the authorities' use of the materials.

Do you open yourself up to a lawsuit?

Probably. Especially if you can demonstrate financial
losses as a result of those actions (reputation, loss
of employment opportunity, etc.)

In some situations, you might also open yourself up
to criminal prosecution as an accomplice after the
fact.

Advice I one got from an attorney. You never want to be in the witness box.
And you don't know the ansewer until the judge tells you.

Best advice is not to go looking for things -- as you have
no control over what you might *find*! E.g., you *don't*
want to know where Hoffa is buried...

Charlie wrote:

"Jeffrey Angus" wrote in message
. ..
Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Isn't that an nvasion of privacy? Did you have a search warrant?
Do you open yourself up to a lawsuit?

Advice I one got from an attorney. You never want to be in the witness box.
And you don't know the ansewer until the judge tells you.

this is good advice.

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 21:06:55 +0000, Cydrome Leader wrote:

Charlie wrote:

"Jeffrey Angus" wrote in message
. ..
Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics and knock a little sense
back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the pictures folder to see what
their kinks are.

Isn't that an nvasion of privacy? Did you have a search warrant? Do
you open yourself up to a lawsuit?

Advice I one got from an attorney. You never want to be in the witness
box. And you don't know the ansewer until the judge tells you.

this is good advice.

Let's say the computer is returned with no mention of contraband. Down
the road the owner is arrested, computer seized and contraband found.
Owner says he has no knowledge of the contraband and that he had it
repaired not long ago and the contraband must have been placed their by
the repair person. You are served taken in to be questioned. Do you now
lie about having knowledge about the contraband? What if you are called
to testify? Do you purger yourself and deny knowledge?

Just some food for thought.



--
Live Fast, Die Young and Leave a Pretty Corpse

D Yuniskis wrote:
On 1/6/2011 10:58 AM, Jeffrey Angus wrote:

Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.


Ah, well that's your *first* mistake! :-(

Oh, my definitely a bozo no no there.....

So what do you do?
(Some answers giving below are tongue in cheek
for the humor impaired.)

Act like nothing happened?

Congratulate them on their tastes?

Wipe the drive with something like bcwipe and
give it back to them?

Spin up the drive separately and bang it against
the desk repeatedly until you knock a head loose?

Make copies for yourself?

Hand it over to the local police?

Give it back to the customer and turn them in
after a few weeks?

Charge the customer extra and demand payment to
keep quiet?

The two things that bother me the most are the
police have a terrible track record on anonymous
and the lawyers like to claim that YOU put it
there.

So, what to do?


Of course, that depends on what you found.

Pix of "him" (?) spanking his neighbor's wife? shrug

Pix of "him" pouring cement over Jimmy Hoffa's body...?

To get *it* into the hands of police, you have
already given up any chance of anonymity -- even if
you shipped it to them in an unmarked envelope.

"Hey, I came in to pick up my laptop... What do
you *mean* 'you don't have it'? Where did it go???"

There was a girl named Pandora who made a similar
mistake (except it was a *jar*, in her case)...

I remembered that it was her *box*. G

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10e12 furlongs per fortnight.

D Yuniskis wrote:
There was a girl named Pandora who made a similar
mistake (except it was a *jar*, in her case)...

jeff_wisnia wrote:

I remembered that it was her *box*. G

It was a jar. According to the wikipedia, it was mistranslated (around
500 years ago) as box and that has stuck in some places.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandora%27s_box

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson N3OWJ/4X1GM
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to misquote it.

On 1/6/2011 2:28 PM, jeff_wisnia wrote:
D Yuniskis wrote:
There was a girl named Pandora who made a similar
mistake (except it was a *jar*, in her case)...

I remembered that it was her *box*. G

Actually, that is a mistranslation. It was, in fact, *jar*

On 1/6/2011 2:44 PM, Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
D Yuniskis wrote:
There was a girl named Pandora who made a similar
mistake (except it was a *jar*, in her case)...

jeff_wisnia wrote:

I remembered that it was her *box*.G

It was a jar. According to the wikipedia, it was mistranslated (around
500 years ago) as box and that has stuck in some places.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandora%27s_box

Ah! I forget how many little bits of tid wikipedia hordes!

In my case, Greek friends set me (and a few teachers)
straight on this decades ago (along with "pea" vs. "pie",
"mee" vs. "mew", etc.)

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 15:53:47 -0600, Jeffrey Angus wrote:

On 1/6/2011 3:23 PM, Meat Plow wrote:
Owner says he has no knowledge of the contraband and that he had it
repaired not long ago and the contra- band must have been placed their
by the repair person.

Glad to see you paid attention to the original posting.

I tend to lose my ability to focus when posts are long and ambiguous.
Next time just get to the ****ing point. And my arguments are still valid
but also involve morality and honesty. Obvious you know nothing about
either since you were snooping.



--
Live Fast, Die Young and Leave a Pretty Corpse

Unfortunately, with the current state of affairs these
days, it makes it almost mandatory for you to check any
media for illegal material and report it.




Who the **** gave you these powers?



Bottom line, you are a Snooper. You are invading peoples' privacy, and thus
behaving totally unethically.

"D Yuniskis" wrote in message
...
On 1/6/2011 2:28 PM, jeff_wisnia wrote:
D Yuniskis wrote:
There was a girl named Pandora who made a similar
mistake (except it was a *jar*, in her case)...

I remembered that it was her *box*. G

Actually, that is a mistranslation. It was, in fact, *jar*

But it's only funny if the word is "box" ... :-)

Arfa

On Thu, 6 Jan 2011 15:00:29 -0500, "Charlie"
wrote:


"Jeffrey Angus" wrote in message
...
Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Isn't that an nvasion of privacy? Did you have a search warrant?

FWIW, search warrants don't relate to private parties, only the
government. They don't give search warrants to private parties, not
even private detectives. Only to government law enforement persons.
Like DY said.

"Invasion of privacy" is a term that can apply lots of places but only
a few of them are illegal or tortious.

However the OP says he was nosy and snooping. If he says that
elsewhere or used his real name here, he's weakened his defense a lot.

Do you open yourself up to a lawsuit?

Advice I one got from an attorney. You never want to be in the witness box.
And you don't know the ansewer until the judge tells you.

OTOH, how can a customer be so stupid he takes the
computer in if it contains anything illegal?

In this case, the machine wouldn't boot.

If one has material one does not wish others to see -- legal or illegal --
it should be stored on an external drive. One can then hand the computer to
a serviceman without worry.

Though the temptation to snoop can be overwhelming, an ethical serviceman
will resist the temptation at all times. No one expects him to "play
police", and no reasonable person would condemn him for not prying, even in
cases of child molestation or murder.

It's NOT his business to spy on his neighbors and report unacceptable
behavior. The Constitution protects our privacy, and though that protection
doesn't generally apply to snooping by neighbors, an ethical person will
respect that protection.

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 15:53:47 -0600, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:

(...)

Googling, I found a good start on a computer repair code of ethics.
http://www.darn-computer.com/Ethics.htm
I think I've broken all ten rules. As I recall, the original ten
commandments were only a subset of about 600 assorted ammendments,
rules, and regulations that arrived later, so there's plenty of room
for creativity.

A good start would be the gold (plated) rule. Do unto the customer as
you would have them do unto you. If you give your computer to me for
repair, I don't think you would be very happy if I gave it back to you
in pieces.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 15:53:47 -0600, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:
Oh and to the other Jeff, thanks for the consult,
you're check's in the mail.

Ummm.... are you billing this customer for your time looking at his
photos? (Just curious).



--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 1/7/2011 6:22 PM, Matthew Fries wrote:
I remember several years ago, something similar happened to Pete
Townshend of "The Who".

Uh-huh, Community service. Right. If it had been any of us,
we'd still be in prison.

BTW: to keep this on topic... What was the problem with the laptop
that made it not boot?

Actually the topic is ethical question.
But since you asked, video driver for a web cam. wrong
one, crashed the machine on boot.

And while I originally posted "tongue in cheek" about
snooping, the original problem was the web cam driver.
When I brought up the correct one to make sure it
worked, I took a picture, and it dropped it into the
"Bozo no no" zone where I went to check that it worked
properly.

Jeff

Arfa Daily wrote:
a friend of mine who does computer service[...]
says that there are download dates and so on,

I can't imagine what the "and so on" could possibly be.
Sounds like nonsense to me.

deeply embedded in the files,

"Touch" utilities have been around since the dawn of computing
and can alter the file dates at will.

The repair person having possession of the computer
queers the chain of custody.
If I was on a jury hearing this, I'd consider the whole case suspect.

he says that in all the years that he's been doing it,
he has never seen a machine come in for repair, with CP on it.

Yet another unethical snooper.

JeffM wrote:
"Touch" utilities have been around since the dawn of computing
and can alter the file dates at will.

Anyone who can use a search engine can find a bootable disk image/USB stick
image of disk utilites that let you read all sorts of disks, in all sorts
of condition. They allow you to look at files without setting access flags
and dates, etc.

Someone mentioned using Acronis True Image to image a disk, that leaves
no records and then if you were to make the image onto a permanent medium,
such as a DVD, you can then make a copy of the file off of the image and no
record is made on the image of the access.


The repair person having possession of the computer
queers the chain of custody.
If I was on a jury hearing this, I'd consider the whole case suspect.

What chain of custody? This is not an episode of CSI, my giving you a computer
to fix, and having a recipt for the the computer or a repair is not a chain
of custody. It's evidence that you had it and I did not. Evidence is not
proof and it's certainly not any evidence that once I gave it to you, you kept
control of it.

Yet another unethical snooper.

That I agree.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson N3OWJ/4X1GM
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to misquote it.

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 11:58:21 -0600, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:

I remember several years ago, something similar happened to Pete
Townshend of "The Who". He brought his computer into a shop for
service and the tech squealed on him because there was some child
abuse photos on there.

FWIW. That was the store manager trying to take advantage of free
publicity when it was realised who the owner was !

--
Best Regards:
Baron.

On Sun, 09 Jan 2011 08:41:08 -0700, The Peeler
wrote:

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 11:58:21 -0600, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:

Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"
...

So, what to do?

Jeff

The customer may have bought the laptop used on eBay or elsewhere and
may be totally unaware of its contents.

That has nothting to do with the problem and what to do.

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 11:58:21 -0600, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:

Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"

So you do the usual amount of diagnostics
and knock a little sense back into the machine.

Being nosy of course, you check out the
pictures folder to see what their kinks are.

Oh, my definitely a bozo no no there.....

So what do you do?
(Some answers giving below are tongue in cheek
for the humor impaired.)

Act like nothing happened?

Congratulate them on their tastes?

Wipe the drive with something like bcwipe and
give it back to them?

Spin up the drive separately and bang it against
the desk repeatedly until you knock a head loose?

Make copies for yourself?

Hand it over to the local police?

Give it back to the customer and turn them in
after a few weeks?

Charge the customer extra and demand payment to
keep quiet?

The two things that bother me the most are the
police have a terrible track record on anonymous
and the lawyers like to claim that YOU put it
there.

So, what to do?

Jeff

The customer may have bought the laptop used on eBay or elsewhere and
may be totally unaware of its contents.

On Sun, 09 Jan 2011 09:50:24 -0500, PeterD wrote:

On Sun, 09 Jan 2011 08:41:08 -0700, The Peeler
wrote:

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 11:58:21 -0600, Jeffrey Angus
wrote:

Customer brings in a lap top. "Won't boot"
...

So, what to do?

Jeff

The customer may have bought the laptop used on eBay or elsewhere and
may be totally unaware of its contents.

That has nothting to do with the problem and what to do.

It certainly does. He may have great difficulty proving his
innocence.

On Sat, 08 Jan 2011 09:13:44 -0500 PeterD wrote in
Message id: :


Current law enforcement in the USA no longer works that way. You are
required to prove your are innocent or else you are considered guilty.
[...]
The assumption will be that you are guilty in most
locations.

Troll status confirmed.

On Mon, 10 Jan 2011 05:52:57 -0500, JW wrote:

On Sat, 08 Jan 2011 09:13:44 -0500 PeterD wrote in
Message id: :


Current law enforcement in the USA no longer works that way. You are
required to prove your are innocent or else you are considered guilty.
[...]
The assumption will be that you are guilty in most
locations.

Troll status confirmed.

You're admitting you are a troll? Or that the entire thread was a
troll (which is likely)? Claiming I'm a troll? g Or is it that if
someone posts something you don't agree with a troller?

On Mon, 10 Jan 2011 08:34:19 -0500 PeterD wrote in
Message id: :

On Mon, 10 Jan 2011 05:52:57 -0500, JW wrote:

On Sat, 08 Jan 2011 09:13:44 -0500 PeterD wrote in
Message id: :


Current law enforcement in the USA no longer works that way. You are
required to prove your are innocent or else you are considered guilty.
[...]
The assumption will be that you are guilty in most
locations.

Troll status confirmed.

You're admitting you are a troll?

No.

Or that the entire thread was a
troll (which is likely)?

No.

Claiming I'm a troll? g

Yes.

Or is it that if
someone posts something you don't agree with a troller?

No.

On Mon, 10 Jan 2011 09:42:23 -0500, JW wrote:

...

You're admitting you are a troll?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Or that the entire thread was a
troll (which is likely)?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Claiming I'm a troll? g

Yes.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Or is it that if
someone posts something you don't agree with a troller?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.

Wow, totally wrong... Why am I not surprised?

On Tue, 11 Jan 2011 08:39:46 -0500 PeterD wrote in
Message id: :

On Mon, 10 Jan 2011 09:42:23 -0500, JW wrote:

...

You're admitting you are a troll?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Or that the entire thread was a
troll (which is likely)?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Claiming I'm a troll? g

Yes.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Or is it that if
someone posts something you don't agree with a troller?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.

Wow, totally wrong... Why am I not surprised?


Troll-O-Meter

0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10

*----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+-----*
.^.
/ | \
|

Not very subtle. Try harder next time.

On Tue, 11 Jan 2011 08:57:14 -0500, JW wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jan 2011 08:39:46 -0500 PeterD wrote in
Message id: :

On Mon, 10 Jan 2011 09:42:23 -0500, JW wrote:

...

You're admitting you are a troll?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Or that the entire thread was a
troll (which is likely)?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Claiming I'm a troll? g

Yes.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.


Or is it that if
someone posts something you don't agree with a troller?

No.

Wrong on that point, troll boy.

Wow, totally wrong... Why am I not surprised?


Troll-O-Meter

0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10

*----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+-----*
.^.
/ | \
|

Not very subtle. Try harder next time.

I got one too, and put your posts on it, and got: