Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems.

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Default Charging a laptop battery without the laptop?

Hi,

I have a Dell laptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains and charge the battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I could
charge the battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin
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wrote:
Hi,

I have a Dell laptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains and charge the battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I could
charge the battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin


While it may be a 'common fault', are you sure that the supply you are
using is a genuine Dell supply? I only ask because other companies sell
a supply that looks very much like the Dell original, uses the same
input and output cords and even has a representation of the Dell logo
molded into the face....but is NOT a Dell supply, and will NOT charge my
Dell laptops.

*It will run them, but not charge the battery.*

Closer examination reveals that it's really not much like a genuine
supply. It's much lighter in weight. The quality of the cabling is
markedly inferior. It doesn't have the rubber cable retainer strap.
There is no Dell information on the info sticker. It says at the top,
'Replacement AC Adaptor' and gives a few specs. At the bottom it says
'Made in China'.

I got it with a Dell laptop from Craigslist. The original owner
complained the battery wouldn't charge. Connection to a genuine Dell
supply fixed that problem.

jak
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Default Charging a laptop battery without the laptop?

On 2 Dec, 19:20, jakdedert wrote:

While it may be a 'common fault', are you sure that the supply you are
using is a genuine Dell supply? *I only ask because other companies sell
a supply that looks very much like the Dell original, uses the same
input and output cords and even has a representation of the Dell logo
molded into the face....but is NOT a Dell supply, and will NOT charge my
Dell laptops.

*It will run them, but not charge the battery.*

Closer examination reveals that it's really not much like a genuine
supply. *It's much lighter in weight. *The quality of the cabling is
markedly inferior. *It doesn't have the rubber cable retainer strap.
There is no Dell information on the info sticker. *It says at the top,
'Replacement AC Adaptor' and gives a few specs. *At the bottom it says
'Made in China'.

I got it with a Dell laptop from Craigslist. *The original owner
complained the battery wouldn't charge. *Connection to a genuine Dell
supply fixed that problem.

jak


Thanks for the idea Jak, but the charger is definitely OK. It came
with the laptop from Dell, and has worked perfectly for the last two
years. The fault has only developed recently, and not only will the
charger now not charge the battery, it will not power the laptop at
all. This is apparently a motherboard problem and has nothing to do
with the charger itself. However, the laptop will run fine from a
charged battery. Hence my need to charge the battery some other way.
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Default Charging a laptop battery without the laptop?

That is too convoluted and time consuming and not worth the effot,
charging a laptop battery without the laptop.
Do you tote?
cuhulin



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Default Charging a laptop battery without the laptop?

wrote:
On 2 Dec, 19:20, jakdedert wrote:

While it may be a 'common fault', are you sure that the supply you are
using is a genuine Dell supply? I only ask because other companies sell
a supply that looks very much like the Dell original, uses the same
input and output cords and even has a representation of the Dell logo
molded into the face....but is NOT a Dell supply, and will NOT charge my
Dell laptops.

*It will run them, but not charge the battery.*

Closer examination reveals that it's really not much like a genuine
supply. It's much lighter in weight. The quality of the cabling is
markedly inferior. It doesn't have the rubber cable retainer strap.
There is no Dell information on the info sticker. It says at the top,
'Replacement AC Adaptor' and gives a few specs. At the bottom it says
'Made in China'.

I got it with a Dell laptop from Craigslist. The original owner
complained the battery wouldn't charge. Connection to a genuine Dell
supply fixed that problem.

jak


Thanks for the idea Jak, but the charger is definitely OK. It came
with the laptop from Dell, and has worked perfectly for the last two
years. The fault has only developed recently, and not only will the
charger now not charge the battery, it will not power the laptop at
all. This is apparently a motherboard problem and has nothing to do
with the charger itself. However, the laptop will run fine from a
charged battery. Hence my need to charge the battery some other way.


You're probably on the right track, but it might be worth the trouble
to--at least--borrow another ps just for confirmation. Some Dells are
pretty sensitive to having the correct supply. That might also
translate to being sensitive to the condition of even genuine Dell
bricks. I've had a couple of those fail on me, although not in the same
fashion as you describe.

Otherwise, the advice on resoldering the ps jack sounds like a go....

Also, post the model #. If you did before, I missed it; but it's your
best chance at finding spares or specific information.

jak
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Default Charging a laptop battery without the laptop?

Thanks for all replies. The laptop is a Dell XPS M1210.

The reason I've come to the conclusion that the problem is more
serious than the power supply or a loose power jack is a few postings
around the net such as these:
http://getsatisfaction.com/dell/topi...t_r ecognized
It's a problem which a few people have and no one seems to have found
an easy solution by just soldering on a new jack. The advice from Dell
(according to those posts) seems to be that a new motherboard is
needed.

Michael, thanks in particular for your offer to post information about
circuit diagrams and software concerning charging batteries. Frankly
that sounds like it's going to go way over my head and be beyond my
minimal understanding. I guess I was hoping someone would tell me that
I could just put 12v DC across pins 3 and 5 for two hours and charge
it and keep the laptop working that way. It sounds like I was being a
little naive, so I thing it may be a trip to the repair shop and a new
motherboard (or maybe just a new laptop!).

Cheers!

Martin
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Default Charging a laptop battery without the laptop?

Adrian C wrote:

With what you have, and a meter - I'd start making continuity tests.


BTW Replacement jack socket in ebay (UK) #190269916134 Less than 5!

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On Wed, 03 Dec 2008 15:09:36 +0000, Adrian C
wrote:

Adrian C wrote:

With what you have, and a meter - I'd start making continuity tests.


BTW Replacement jack socket in ebay (UK) #190269916134 Less than 5!


This may not apply to this model, but I've seen a lot of older Dell
laptops with cracked solder connections on a surface mount inductor
near the power jack. It's close enough to the power jack to receive
stress from flexing. The connections usually don't look that bad
under casual inspection. I would re-solder everything near the power
jack.
Andy Cuffe


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Default Charging a laptop battery without the laptop?


wrote in message
...
Hi,

I have a Dell laptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains and charge the battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I could
charge the battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin


Do you have a port replicator?
I own a Dell Inspiron 8500 and it only charges the battery if the AC adapter
is plugged into the port replicator which is then attached to the bottom of
the laptop. I have confirmed that the adapter is good and the problem is
not the DC jack on the motherboard. I now always have it tethered to the
port replicator for charging.


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wrote in message
...
Hi,

I have a Dell laptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains and charge the battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I could
charge the battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin



Charging lithium-ion batteries is fairly complex. Only two of the 8
contacts are used to power the laptop, but many more are used during
charging in order to monitor individual cells. It is definite not
just finding the right two wires. Good luck. I hate it when a
complex thing is rendered useless by a simple problem.



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On 2 Dec, 19:37, wrote:
Hi,

I have a Dell laptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains and charge the battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I could
charge the battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin


I don't know about Dells, but for Lenovos you can buy standalone
battery chargers. Have a look on eBay.

Another Bay alternative is to buy a dead "spares or repairs" machine
with a different fault. Even if it won't boot, it will hopefully
charge a battery.

Chris


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On Dec 2, 12:37*pm, wrote:
Hi,

I have aDelllaptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains andchargethe battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I couldchargethe battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin


when you find out let me know
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wrote:
On Dec 2, 12:37 pm, wrote:
Hi,

I have aDelllaptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains andchargethe battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I couldchargethe battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin


when you find out let me know


IMM, the OP has not thoroughly diagnosed the problem. His internet
research could very well be valid; but without real-world testing, it's
still only opinion. To date, he has not indicated whether he has tested
the power supply. In fact, he stated that it categorically could 'not'
be the problem (although that answer was in response to a different
query, regarding aftermarket supplies which are known to produce nearly
the same symptoms).

Since most recent Dells use the either the PA 12 (65 watt, original
equipment for his unit), or the PA 10 (90 watt) supplies, it's pretty
easy to find someone with a known-good supply to sub. In fact, the PA
10 is also a substitute for the any laptop supplied with a PA 12, making
it even easier to find a sub. IMO, this is good policy from Dell. I
wish other makers followed this model of not tying their supplies to a
particular unit.

Given that this is least expensive possible solution--as well as the
cheapest/easiest--I urge the OP to at least explore the possibility.
Try your supply on a known-good laptop; or try a known-good supply on
yours. If it turns out to not be the case, obviously he'll have to
explore others.

jak
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rebel wrote:
Based on experience I'd still lean towards the mobo being the problem, but doing
the PSU test certainly will identify the problem area.


Hope so :-)

Doing a little research, the extra pin connector is for a Dallas 1-Wire
serial id chip that Dell have built into their own manufactured power
supplies, to limit their customers to only purchasing them and not a
compatible.

If it is the PSU at fault, further googling suggests that replacement
supplies from Dell are actually not that horrendously expensive (e.g.
33 inc delivery for UK)

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On Thu, 04 Dec 2008 09:07:40 -0600, jakdedert wrote:

IMM, the OP has not thoroughly diagnosed the problem. His internet
research could very well be valid; but without real-world testing, it's
still only opinion. To date, he has not indicated whether he has tested
the power supply. In fact, he stated that it categorically could 'not'
be the problem (although that answer was in response to a different
query, regarding aftermarket supplies which are known to produce nearly
the same symptoms).

Since most recent Dells use the either the PA 12 (65 watt, original
equipment for his unit), or the PA 10 (90 watt) supplies, it's pretty
easy to find someone with a known-good supply to sub. In fact, the PA
10 is also a substitute for the any laptop supplied with a PA 12, making
it even easier to find a sub. IMO, this is good policy from Dell. I
wish other makers followed this model of not tying their supplies to a
particular unit.

Given that this is least expensive possible solution--as well as the
cheapest/easiest--I urge the OP to at least explore the possibility.
Try your supply on a known-good laptop; or try a known-good supply on
yours. If it turns out to not be the case, obviously he'll have to
explore others.


Agree. We were in Vegas back in October and had left our Dell PA10 behind on
the west coast. Found a laptop repair place and (with Vostro under arm) we
verified that the new PA10 they had was 100% kosher before buying it. Any
reputable outlet selling the genuine PA10 would do the same, so the O/P should
have reasonable opportunity to check out whether in fcat his PSU is U/S.

Based on experience I'd still lean towards the mobo being the problem, but doing
the PSU test certainly will identify the problem area.
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On Tue, 02 Dec 2008 19:20:29 -0000, jakdedert wrote:

wrote:
Hi,

I have a Dell laptop which has developed a fault. It doesn't recognise
its own power supply. A bit of internet research reveals that this is
a common fault on this particular model, and it's a fault with the
motherboard, so an expensive repair. At the moment for me the fault is
intermittent. Sometimes the power supply is recognised and the thing
will run happily from the mains and charge the battery, sometimes it
isn't and it runs from the battery. Pretty soon a time will come when
the battery goes flat, the power supply won't be recognised at all and
it will be screwed unless I replace the motherboard.

To get to the point I could easily keep the PC running if I could
charge the battery without it being in the laptop. Anyone know what my
chances are? The battery has eight pins. I presume it has some
circuitry inside which means it's not as easy as guessing the right
two pins and putting a current across them.

Cheers!

Martin


While it may be a 'common fault', are you sure that the supply you are
using is a genuine Dell supply? I only ask because other companies sell
a supply that looks very much like the Dell original, uses the same
input and output cords and even has a representation of the Dell logo
molded into the face....but is NOT a Dell supply, and will NOT charge my
Dell laptops.

*It will run them, but not charge the battery.*

Closer examination reveals that it's really not much like a genuine
supply. It's much lighter in weight. The quality of the cabling is
markedly inferior. It doesn't have the rubber cable retainer strap.
There is no Dell information on the info sticker. It says at the top,
'Replacement AC Adaptor' and gives a few specs. At the bottom it says
'Made in China'.

I got it with a Dell laptop from Craigslist. The original owner
complained the battery wouldn't charge. Connection to a genuine Dell
supply fixed that problem.


I've bought loads of Latitude D600/D610/D620/D630 chargers from Ebay, and they've all worked fine. They look like genuine ones and work fine. The only one that did not work in a D610 or later (the D600 didn't do the check) was a Trust universal charger from Maplin. It did as you said above, with a message to that effect.

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